Guild Wars 2

terrordrone.1875:

Definitely not FIFO. They can say it’s FIFO all they want, but I’ve had guild mates enter the bg before me even though I started queuing 15 minutes before them.

I would agree with this too. This was while we were still on DH I remember queuing up and getting through in maybe 5 minutes while people in the guild were saying they’d been in the queue for 45+ minutes at that point.

It very well may be a FIFO system, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t broke as kitten. So to me it seems like there are several issues going on. One is new, the other, not so much.

fellyn.5083:

terrordrone.1875:

Definitely not FIFO. They can say it’s FIFO all they want, but I’ve had guild mates enter the bg before me even though I started queuing 15 minutes before them.

I would agree with this too. This was while we were still on DH I remember queuing up and getting through in maybe 5 minutes while people in the guild were saying they’d been in the queue for 45+ minutes at that point.

It very well may be a FIFO system, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t broke as kitten.

FIFO (First-in-First-Out) queue by its nature means people who queue first, get in first. This is not such a structure. The funny thing is a queue is a basic programming 101 structure. How did ANet mess this up?

boneduste.4023:

fellyn.5083:

terrordrone.1875:

Definitely not FIFO. They can say it’s FIFO all they want, but I’ve had guild mates enter the bg before me even though I started queuing 15 minutes before them.

I would agree with this too. This was while we were still on DH I remember queuing up and getting through in maybe 5 minutes while people in the guild were saying they’d been in the queue for 45+ minutes at that point.

It very well may be a FIFO system, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t broke as kitten.

FIFO (First-in-First-Out) queue by its nature means people who queue first, get in first. This is not such a structure. The funny thing is a queue is a basic programming 101 structure. How did ANet mess this up?

I understand that. And Anet claims the queue is FIFO. But like I said, that doesn’t mean it’s not bugged in some way where people are getting stuck in their position.

Maybe changing maps while in the queue has something to do with it? No one really knows because we can’t actually see how many people are in the queue, our position in the queue, and average and estimated wait time.

Anet really needs to let us see those things and I think it would go a long way towards curbing complaints about queues if there really are no issues with them outside of to many players trying to get into the same place.

you mean WvW will be based on skill again not based on an unbalanced numeric handicap. You mean matchups will actually have parity and allow more servers to be competitive? You mean you are being penalized for constantly bandwagoning? Best change Anet could have ever done to the game, now there are 24 real skill oriented matchups where servers will not get railroaded by being hopelessly outnumbered.

The the population cap has been too high in all t4 and below servers for months. WvW was inherently broken as the maps were meant to hold far more than those participating and the reality was outside of your own BL and Eternal most maps were never even in play and it facilitated turtling in your own BL and fully upgraded BLs sieged to the hilt with very little turnover removing fluidity and crushing morale particularly by Saturday-Sunday afternoon. Now it will actually be a 3v3 on the other servers. More importantly, night capping will no longer be as brutal and as exacerbated as it was. The servers were so imbalanced it made for static matchups for months will little change. The constant xferring led to breakdowns in the glicks as it took weeks sometimes over a month for servers to fight in their rightful bracket. I think any real pvpers/strategy game players will finally take WvW seriously. Ceteris Paribus, if numbers are equal again, the differentiator is communication, tactics, strategy, leadership. It, really sets an awesome tone for the coming patches and changes. If you are upset you cant massive overload against smaller servers to CRUSH THEM +695 then transfer. The game was meant for the other 80% of the playerbase to enjoy playing not just the greedy brats who like to play Monopoly by stealing from the bank and want to win at all costs instead of honorably on their own merit. What is the purpose of winning if it based on an arbitrary metric. This is the most pure and competitive WvW has been. You are fighting in the first fair matchup since the game population dropped off from September. Revel in the challenge. Adapt, truly earn the title of best server based on your merit.

Ivano.2604:

Cactus.2710:

Wintuo.1356:

Not to restate this but some of you are missing the point, what we’re really concerned with is the actual number of WvW is not balanced per server. Yes a lot of people are trying to get in, but why is there a queue if within the map the max population doesnt exist. For instance people who only own a supply camp or being spawn camped, they see max 10-20 ppl around them, do you really think 90+ ppl are off hiding and avoiding being killed by the bloodthirsty server thats fielding 80ish ppl? All we are asking for is that the refresh rate, or whatever issue thats causing the max pop from being able to get into the map to contribute to be fixed, its clearly a technical issue, stop whining about max pop servers, even max pop should have the right to have their total allowed players inside a map. When a tier 1 server tells you they have about 20 on a map, honestly you should believe them, because they got there knowing who’s on a map and where, you dont get to hold your own on numbers alone at that level its tactics involving knowing your own server and the enemies.

^Bumped for intelligence that is clearly lacking in other posts blaming server transfers for the problem.

Even tho it makes sense, if queues related issues are not in relation with server population, answer me to this question:

Why FoW (low population server) has NO queue, ever?

Most probably “truth” stands in the middle, as usual…

PS Do not blame ANET for having to counter a mass migration as we have seen, migration mostly due to the “I ll be the first in rank, or well at least I ll be there where leeching is guaranteed” attitude. You pick first bus to Tier 1, you ll get there or at least some will, other will have to keep running behind that Bus it seems ^^

I never said it was totally independent of server population. Higher population servers would almost certainly have a higher number of players that were being mishandled by the queue, and since the max player capacity is fixed (supposedly at 166) on any particular map the higher population servers would probably see more of a problem. The problem wouldn’t necessarily track server population precisely, though, since the number of players coming and going could easily vary from server to server and by day of the week. What I have said was that the number of players in the queue doesn’t appear to be equal to the number who want in minus 166.

How do you bug a FIFO queue lol… it is so simple it is not possible to be bugged(or if it is it should be fixed in like 2 mins)

the game is asking for a diaspora. Do what is best for your guild and the community.

Churros.7196:

How do you bug a FIFO queue lol… it is so simple it is not possible to be bugged(or if it is it should be fixed in like 2 mins)

THANK YOU!!!!

Grimaldi.8532:

you mean WvW will be based on skill again not based on an unbalanced numeric handicap. You mean matchups will actually have parity and allow more servers to be competitive? You mean you are being penalized for constantly bandwagoning? Best change Anet could have ever done to the game, now there are 24 real skill oriented matchups where servers will not get railroaded by being hopelessly outnumbered.

Silly person. That isn’t likely to happen for a very long time, if at all. Just look at the projected matchups for next week( http://mos.millenium.org/matchups#NA ), and then do your best to imagine what the following week’s matchups will look like after the monumental blowouts that await us all.

Also keep in mind that the ANet’s version of the Glicko-2 system tends to trap servers in a tier if the matches in that tier are reasonably balanced … even if those three servers are much stronger than the servers in the tiers above them. So if a different server eventually drops down or moves up into that tier, the chances for another blowout are high. Stability in population does not assure stability in rankings.

tl;dr You don’t know what the kitten you’re talking about.

So, lets say “Tnx” for ANet for tottaly ruined WvW.
Its seem this is not bug, but conscious decision.

So Anet did their Job very Well. They just want to force u buy Gems on Gem shop with Real Money to Transfer on lower Populated Server.
I Read in another Thread that they answer on French Forum that this is NOT a Bug.
Another Slap in the Face for all WvW Players.
Its All about the Money in that kittening Business
And all that stuff (Player scaling) without any announcement before the Patch.

they should have done it first then announced paid xfers so people could reform elsewhere. Happens

Cactus.2710:

So is stupidity. You need to read the post from Drok four spots above you.

You’re right, it is stupid to suppose that hundreds/thousands of new players transferring to the top servers would massively increase queue times. What was I thinking?

I’m just thankful that Stormbluff Isle isn’t experiencing this “bug”.

I don’t understand this. I sat in queue for two hours and there was 40 people TOPS in the EB map on JQ side.

enLight.1695:

Cactus.2710:

So is stupidity. You need to read the post from Drok four spots above you.

You’re right, it is stupid to suppose that hundreds/thousands of new players transferring to the top servers would massively increase queue times. What was I thinking?

I’m just thankful that Stormbluff Isle isn’t experiencing this “bug”.

The issue is not that everything is working great and people are just unhappy to wait in queues.

There are three issues.

1. Queues are being formed when actual players on the server are below what the cap is supposed to be. ie, if the cap is 166, queues are forming when there are 40 people on the map.

2. The queue is bugged. It is supposed to be a FIFO queue….instead it’s a lottery. You queue up, you have no idea when you will get in. Two people queueing at the same time will see 1 person get in in 30 seconds, and the other still waiting around 60 minutes later. People who queue after you can get in before you. This is not how queues work.

3. There is no indicator of your place in the queue. You queue up, you wait with no idea if it will be 5 mins or 5 hours. Any sort of regularly updated indicator (“You are queued for Eternal Battleground and are 25th in line”) would be appreciated.

All of you going “Derrrr….you’re just mad cause you have to wait” should be quiet since you do not understand the actual reasons for the frustration.

enLight.1695:

Cactus.2710:

So is stupidity. You need to read the post from Drok four spots above you.

You’re right, it is stupid to suppose that hundreds/thousands of new players transferring to the top servers would massively increase queue times. What was I thinking?

Yes, it is stupid of you to ignore the dozens (probably hundreds) of posts here explaining that long queues don’t equate to having lots of people on the map. I mean seriously … try to actually think about the evidence at hand. Players sit in long queues only to find two or three dozen server mates ANYWHERE on the map. Players routinely report wildly different wait times even when they try to join at the same time as other guild members.

For the record … I’ve been on the same server since launch and I’m just as opposed to mass transfers as everyone else. I just know better than to blame an obvious bug solely on that. When all this eventually shakes out you will know it as well.

1. Queues are being formed when actual players on the server are below what the cap is supposed to be. ie, if the cap is 166, queues are forming when there are 40 people on the map.

^

this is whats happening.. we aint getting nearly the population cap into the maps anymore. doing headcounts, asking everyone to do a /map 1 and count them, repeatedly get us in the 30-40 range as the max.. this is after repeated atempts to count our players.

and there is a 3h+ queue to the map for (and 5 mins for some…)

Lots of players jumped ship to join Kain, because derrrp, they have to be on the ‘winning’ server.

My sympathies go out to the ‘natives’ who found their server flooded with bads who contribute nothing more than increasing their queue times. As for the players who jumped ship to a “better” server who now find themselves waiting in queue for hours, you have only yourselves to blame

Even on T1 the queue times have been far, far longer than they were last week when all the actual mass transferring took place. Something is either technically wrong or anet is hoping to sell more gems when poor casual players are forced to transfer to low pop servers so they can play at all.

zen.6091:

Anet is hoping to sell more gems when poor casual players are forced to transfer to low pop servers so they can play at all.

That would easily make them zero money and kill WvW. They aren’t that stupid. This is clearly a bug, and you can get a lot of people on a map, it just takes a lot of patience by those stuck in multi-hour nonsense queues.

Vena.8436:

zen.6091:

Anet is hoping to sell more gems when poor casual players are forced to transfer to low pop servers so they can play at all.

That would easily make them zero money and kill WvW. They aren’t that stupid. This is clearly a bug, and you can get a lot of people on a map, it just takes a lot of patience by those stuck in multi-hour nonsense queues.

Milking another $20 from some players before they quit wouldn’t be so terrible. I agree it’s not likely, but when there’s no communication from anet, it leaves the door open for any sort of wild speculation.

FA had a queue for a map where we had the outmanned buff.

Clearly nothing broken here. No sir, “looks reasonable” to me.

Edit: Correction: misheard teamspeak. TC had a queue for a map where they had the outmanned buff. Still clearly nothing broken.

zen.6091:

Milking another $20 from some players before they quit wouldn’t be so terrible. I agree it’s not likely, but when there’s no communication from anet, it leaves the door open for any sort of wild speculation.

It’s utterly counter productive and they wouldn’t make a dime. The people who are most affected are guilds, they would not move. They would break and quit. More over its clearly bugged, its not working as intended, and you can get many people on a map.

The cap hasn’t been changed, the queues are just bugged out to hell and back.

And there’s no communication because there offices are closed. Dun dun dun.

It’s way more fun when you let conspiracy theories play out for at least a page before shooting them full of holes.

At any rate, the technical problem is pretty disappointing after resetting the rankings, and will an have effect (perhaps a huge effect) on post-reset placements.

Where is the Anet response to this? How can it take so long for them to reply to their community? I just don’t get it…

Ooh, conspiracy theories are fun. I’ve got one.

Clearly a movement called OccupyWvWvW has decided to protest… they’re not really sure what they’re protesting. 100+ pve/spvp players from each server have banded together to stand around in the jumping puzzle during primetime and have drum circles and not take showers. No one ever goes up there during primetime, so it’s possible, right?

edit: sorry, 400+, 100+ per map, not total

I love how everyone has started QQing about queues after leaving the lower tier servers in mass to find a spot on the higher – full in regards to WvW servers.
You decided to go with the zergs you have to deal with the queues get over it.

I love how everyone has started QQing about queues after leaving the lower tier servers in mass to find a spot on the higher – full in regards to WvW servers.
You decided to go with the zergs you have to deal with the queues get over it.

Darkstorn.5423:

I love how everyone has started QQing about queues after leaving the lower tier servers in mass to find a spot on the higher – full in regards to WvW servers.
You decided to go with the zergs you have to deal with the queues get over it.

It isn’t the fact people are on higher tier servers. There are queues when the map has half of the players that it “should”. People assume the higher tiers are all “zerging”. Ask any server with a high population that’s gone up against a Tier 1-2 server with equal numbers and ask them what they saw. There is an incredible amount of micro and macro that goes into succeeding in WvW and if they reduced the map caps for players, that skill level necessary increases exponentially. For some servers, it may be because they got a ton of transfers, but for others complaining about this and they never had queue problems before and didn’t get mass transfers, how do you explain that? Servers don’t just go from having no queues after friday night, pick up a couple guilds, and all of the sudden they are in queue for 2 hours. ANet did something to the players caps on the map or the patch kittened up the queue and ANet is not admitting to it. We can tell they have a problem, it would be nice if they cared to humor the community and look into it instead of shrugging us off saying “the numbers look reasonable”. I’M LOOKING AT YOU HABIB.

I blame jQQ. Definitely all their fault. Habib is making them ruin the day they tried to take over HIS WvWvW.. muhahahaha

When a queue isn’t really a queue, is it any surprise that the limit … isn’t really the limit?

How many gems have you purchased?

Not saying anything is fact. There are games out there that reward buyers. Folks who have spent money on their product… be it subs or ‘other’ purchases.

I recently needed to recover my account. I didn’t have order code, game code, or anything; but I could prove I had spent $200 on the game… and I was playing the next day.

It’s F2P folks… if you are a feeloader- managed to get by without spending a dime… hell, I think you deserve to rot in queue for hours.

Dhar.6392:

How many gems have you purchased?

Not saying anything is fact. There are games out there that reward buyers. Folks who have spent money on their product… be it subs or ‘other’ purchases.

I recently needed to recover my account. I didn’t have order code, game code, or anything; but I could prove I had spent $200 on the game… and I was playing the next day.

It’s F2P folks… if you are a feeloader- managed to get by without spending a dime… hell, I think you deserve to rot in queue for hours.

I think this post deserves a lolwut.jpg. I don’t think you understand what this thread is about.

fellyn.5083:

I think this post deserves a lolwut.jpg. I don’t think you understand what this thread is about.

It’s about folks waiting for hours w/o a word from Devs about where they stand in line.

No?

I’m suggesting that there are factors that Devs don’t want to make obvious… like how much you have spent… that go into that ‘number’… that directly affect your queue time.

If you are after something else… please straighten me out.

Dhar.6392:

fellyn.5083:

I think this post deserves a lolwut.jpg. I don’t think you understand what this thread is about.

It’s about folks waiting for hours w/o a word from Devs about where they stand in line.

No?

I’m suggesting that there are factors that Devs don’t want to make obvious… like how much you have spent… that go into that ‘number’… that directly affect your queue time.

If you are after something else… please straighten me out.

It helps to read more than just the title of the thread. People are wanting to know why they are being stuck in a queue when there is seemingly not even half the people in a map than there used to be in weeks past.

And then there is the fact that you think buying gems give you some sort of hidden priority over people who haven’t.. which I’m not sure what you base that theory on because you have no way of knowing who has bought gems and who hasn’t.

fellyn.5083:

It helps to read more than just the title of the thread. People are wanting to know why they are being stuck in a queue when there is seemingly not even half the people in a map than there used to be in weeks past.

And then there is the fact that you think buying gems give you some sort of hidden priority over people who haven’t.. which I’m not sure what you base that theory on because you have no way of knowing who has bought gems and who hasn’t.

How do you ‘know’ who is in the map and who isn’t? Guild by Guild is fine, but I have never heard of a list or site that shows ‘everyone’ that is in Wv3 in a real-time… if there is such a thing… do share.

I base my theory on experience and common sense. For a F2P game… who is more likely to have priority? Those who have put money into it… or those who haven’t? You’d have to get Devs to admit who has spent on gems and who hasn’t… which should happen before you get players to admit what they have spent. Good luck proving me wrong.

Dhar.6392:

fellyn.5083:

It helps to read more than just the title of the thread. People are wanting to know why they are being stuck in a queue when there is seemingly not even half the people in a map than there used to be in weeks past.

And then there is the fact that you think buying gems give you some sort of hidden priority over people who haven’t.. which I’m not sure what you base that theory on because you have no way of knowing who has bought gems and who hasn’t.

How do you ‘know’ who is in the map and who isn’t? Guild by Guild is fine, but I have never heard of a list or site that shows ‘everyone’ that is in Wv3 in a real-time… if there is such a thing… do share.

I base my theory on experience and common sense. For a F2P game… who is more likely to have priority? Those who have put money into it… or those who haven’t?

Except for this isn’t a F2P game. I remember paying money to have access to it. The correct term is B2P or buy to play.

There have been about 6 or 7 threads made on the issue in the last day since the rest. Go read one of them.

Symantec’s… B2P/F2P… yes, we all bought the game to play… but those who bought gems… have put more into the game than those who haven’t.

Core argument still exists. You have not provided any evidence that my proof is wrong.

Dhar.6392:

Symantec’s… B2P/F2P… yes, we all bought the game to play… but those who bought gems… have put more into the game than those who haven’t.

Core argument still exists. You have not provided any evidence that my proof is wrong.

Shouldn’t you be the one providing the proof your theory is correct? Not the other way around? Since you’re the one who brought it up.

I will say this though, if you were right then wouldn’t this issue have presented itself sooner than in the last 24 hours? Which is when all the threads on the issue started appearing?

Dhar.6392:

Symantec’s… B2P/F2P… yes, we all bought the game to play… but those who bought gems… have put more into the game than those who haven’t.

Core argument still exists. You have not provided any evidence that my proof is wrong.

lol

That’s not how it works. You brought up your theory…what do you have to support it?

This is my theory, yes A-net did something to mess up the queues… I however think it was intentional. Here is my reasoning, with all the culling issues and them realizing their helper patch for culling is failing so miserably that less than 10% of the posting players are happy with maybe they gave us something else to kitten about that can be more easily explained away . If this were the case they could always revert whatever they did before to get some “love” from community and buy themselves more time on the culling issue they obviously have no idea on.. yay conspiracy rant /off .;p

The issue is the Que .. the problem is that when people don’t know what’s happening, they start guessing and in some cases, they get paranoid.

This is an MMO ….. WvW is about group tactics … No? Please give the ‘Bandwagon’ arguments a rest, this game is all about Zergs and strategy. It was completely predictable that, if Anet announce they’re going to change the scoring system and charge for moving server, guilds would be forced to make choices. WvW is evolving and that is the whole point.

The caps on player numbers are causing problems, as we are not clear how that really works. Reset is the most popular time to play anyway and this week pulled in more players because of the new match-ups. Add to that a bugged FIFO system and you got problems and this many posts on one subject … proves it.

The promised patch this month now becomes critical, the guilds and players need to be able to get on to the map together to play this game, in large numbers. We need to know how many players can be on each map and how long its going to take to group up …. and we need to be able to see each other … but that’s another subject.

Thank you AN for a kittenty f0cking weekend with long queues and the usual kitten culling.

Think I might give WvW a rest. I wait for hours in queue. When I get in I get major lag and can’t use my skills because of the lag. And to top it off I can’t see anyone until there are suddenly 100 right in front of me. These problems were not great before the patch, but now they have become so much worse that WvW is unplayable for me.

I have already went from nothing but wvw to wvw/pve money making/ queue sitting… if it continues I may just find another game to split time with. Maybe a few months down the line all the current devs will get serious about keeping us in the loop and fixing things .

What’s funny is that most of the servers that are complaining are the same ones that had organized “black outs” so they can get more people onto the server to WvW. Did everyone forget that most of the WvW players took an absence from WvW to go and get their ascended armor or went off to play another game while WvW wasn’t fun? They heard changes were coming, so they came back to try it out.

All I have to say is, you brought this on yourself and now deal with it. The lower tiers are dealing with it (SBI, HoD, ET, etc) with the mass exodus of guilds/players. They are the ones having fun, sitting back having popcorn, and drinking some rum and cokes, laughing their tales off at you guys that are complaining about long queue’s.

Guild’s that thought: “Hey lets go to these top tier servers, it will be more fun, exciting, and have better competition”, you thought wrong. You should have been thinking: “How can we make us as a community/guild better than we are now?” Lower tiers are a lot less zergy, you use more tactics, and the other servers keep you honest. Coming from SBI, I have seen the high tier pain of queue times from the early days to the mass exodus of guilds there. That’s why when we (as a guild) made a decision to move off of SBI (before free transfers were up and WvW points reset were announced), we made the decision to go to a lower tier server like Darkhaven. While SBI will always be called home (because of the community there), we have a new summer home on Darkhaven to WvW on with very little queue times(Friday/Sat night).

toffin.5032:

What’s funny is that most of the servers that are complaining are the same ones that had organized “black outs” so they can get more people onto the server to WvW. Did everyone forget that most of the WvW players took an absence from WvW to go and get their ascended armor or went off to play another game while WvW wasn’t fun? They heard changes were coming, so they came back to try it out.

All I have to say is, you brought this on yourself and now deal with it. The lower tiers are dealing with it (SBI, HoD, ET, etc) with the mass exodus of guilds/players. They are the ones having fun, sitting back having popcorn, and drinking some rum and cokes, laughing their tales off at you guys that are complaining about long queue’s.

Guild’s that thought: “Hey lets go to these top tier servers, it will be more fun, exciting, and have better competition”, you thought wrong. You should have been thinking: “How can we make us as a community/guild better than we are now?” Lower tiers are a lot less zergy, you use more tactics, and the other servers keep you honest. Coming from SBI, I have seen the high tier pain of queue times from the early days to the mass exodus of guilds there. That’s why when we (as a guild) made a decision to move off of SBI (before free transfers were up and WvW points reset were announced), we made the decision to go to a lower tier server like Darkhaven. While SBI will always be called home (because of the community there), we have a new summer home on Darkhaven to WvW on with very little queue times(Friday/Sat night).

Self righteous poster doesn’t even bother to understand the actual issue.

It’s not the fact that there are queues. There are three issues.

1. Map limits are not working correctly. Queues are forming well below the normal cap. Map capacity limits seem erratic and inconsistent. Queues no longer seem to form at the 166 limit, but in many cases at populations far below that (60 to 80 at times).

2. The supposed FIFO queue does not work on a FIFO basis….it seems to work on some lottery ticket system.

3. There is no way to know your approximate wait time. You queue up and have no idea if you are 5th in line or 500th.

Most people would be fine with a queue that formed at the correct time, worked properly and gave some indication of moving up in line.

But your self righteous “you brought it on yourself” post was fun, too. Thanks for contributing to the community.

There’s an easy fix to this issue. Cough up some gems and go back to your original server.

On Dragonbrand just now we had a que in DB borderlands and yet Kain owned 80% of map. No I know that Kain is not so uber that they can take and hold most map with even numbers as Dragonbrand. Infact when Que let me in 45mins later people in chat have said they have only been like 10-15 in the BG, So I left DB bg and tried get back in another Que. Something is severely wrong with que system

Boomstin.3460:

There’s an easy fix to this issue. Cough up some gems and go back to your original server.

This has nothing to do with population of servers. DB has a Que running and only 10-15 people in a BG with Que. It is a bug in their Que system. And people like you parroting same thing over and over just gives Anet false sense that issue is not urgent.