Guild Wars 2

Yah when the BLC keys suddenly become much more valueable, to get the greatly appraised Aetherized weapons, it became clear who would win this.

And yet you are assuming that the majority of players actually read the patch notes.

Those that don’t will not really know about stuff like this and would most likely vote for Kiel since they know about her but have more or less never seen or heard of Evon.

It does feel as if Anet is baiting the playerbase to favor Evon. It’s part of the reason I’m going with Kiel. The favoritism is irritating.

VOTE FOR SUWASH!

I left WoW because of the favoritism of the Horde and the story was so Horde focused over the Alliance (unless you bought the books that tell a story that doesn’t even show up in the game). I really don’t wanna see the favoritism here. I’m voting Kiel!

More “potential” revenue.

lordkrall.7241:

And yet you are assuming that the majority of players actually read the patch notes.

Those that don’t will not really know about stuff like this and would most likely vote for Kiel since they know about her but have more or less never seen or heard of Evon.

I greatly disagree with this.

Those that don’t read the update notes will likely still know of the candidates’ promises and to those who don’t pay much attention would still think the fall of Abaddon is more enticing than the reactor – they would probably think along the lines of “we already see what happened with the reactor, so why have two of the same thing?” even though such thoughts would be wrong (as the fractal is about the build up, not the fallout). And there are those among them who would see Kiel as a glory-stealer for getting promoted after each story event, seeing her as little different from Kormir and Trahearne. While I hope those numbers are few, I doubt that they are.

It really feels like Anet has always intended for Evon to win, and they’re just favoring him to mask the concept of “player choice” being non-existent here.

WarriorOfAsgard.3705:

VOTE FOR SUWASH!

I would vote for Suwash if I could.

Kiel gets the shortsighted smartperson votes so everything seems in order here.

Thatta boy evon

SpeedFiend.4521:

Kiel gets the shortsighted smartperson votes so everything seems in order here.

So you’re saying Evon is getting all the farsighted dumbperson votes?

I hate Charrs, and I dont care about lower TP or WP costs, I’m voting for Evon becauase I want to see Gods again in GW.

So, basically because your choice seems to be losing (how you can know that before the actual vote and event is started) you think that ArenaNet is “intending for the other guy to win”

Would we have seen the same thread had it been the other way around I wonder?

Nick.6972:

I hate Charrs, and I dont care about lower TP or WP costs, I’m voting for Evon becauase I want to see Gods again in GW.

What gods? They’re just superpowered aliens from another planet.

Yes, I’d have made the same argument as Konig, irregardless of who *seems* to be the favored side. It’s unfair to take sides or promote one side over another when it’s supposed to be left to the players, *not* ArenaNet, to decide the outcome.

You misunderstand, lordkrall.

I don’t have a choice. I’m interested in both sides equally – the story aspect behind it. The lore of each fractal interests me equally. The rammifications of Evon winning and Kiel losing, or Kiel winning and Evon losing, interest me equally.

If anything, I’m probably more interested in Evon winning and Kiel losing, while more interested in the reactor fractal. In the end, it doesn’t matter to me which side wins or loses.

I think Anet may be intending for Evon to win either way because of how much more benefits there are to voting for Evon, because his promises and the updates made alongside the election are seemingly more geared to players based on past evidence. Players like new skins, and enjoy showing off new skins, as seen by the immense amount of people saying they go for the RNG despite hating how bad their chances are (and other things).

So again, I don’t have a “choice” so please don’t presume such. Honestly, I’m more likely to vote Evon if I had to chose one and no more or fewer.

i’m still voting for Kiel
with a picture like this:

how can you not vote for her

lordkrall.7241:

So, basically because your choice seems to be losing (how you can know that before the actual vote and event is started) you think that ArenaNet is “intending for the other guy to win”

Would we have seen the same thread had it been the other way around I wonder?

This is the case essentially.

Remember when people were thinking Kiel would win easily? The cries “OMG ANET WHY SO ONE SIDED, WHY HATE CHARR!?” were all over the place.

Celestina.2894:

lordkrall.7241:

So, basically because your choice seems to be losing (how you can know that before the actual vote and event is started) you think that ArenaNet is “intending for the other guy to win”

Would we have seen the same thread had it been the other way around I wonder?

This is the case essentially.

Remember when people were thinking Kiel would win easily? The cries “OMG ANET WHY SO ONE SIDED, WHY HATE CHARR!?” were all over the place.

No, I don’t remember that happening. It’s always been forumites going “Gnashblade is an easy win!” right from the start.

inazuma.7021:

Celestina.2894:

lordkrall.7241:

So, basically because your choice seems to be losing (how you can know that before the actual vote and event is started) you think that ArenaNet is “intending for the other guy to win”

Would we have seen the same thread had it been the other way around I wonder?

This is the case essentially.

Remember when people were thinking Kiel would win easily? The cries “OMG ANET WHY SO ONE SIDED, WHY HATE CHARR!?” were all over the place.

No, I don’t remember that happening. It’s always been forumites going “Gnashblade is an easy win!” right from the start.

You weren’t here when the rewards were originally leaked then.

I’ll be honest and say I’m lending my support to Gnashblade, but not for the Fall of Abaddon fractals research or the reduced Black Lion chest keys price. I just find a Charr who seems to be hiding something and possibly doesn’t have much story behind him other than his position within the Black Lion Trading Company to be considerably more interesting than miss Ellen “I’m a typical goody-goody two-shoes human soldier” Kiel.

Just my 2 cents on the matter.

If this is some swave, mass social experiment via fun new content I have to pay my respects to the development team that came up with this concept. The kinds of responses being made in the forums…the comments in chat, all either intentionally or unintentionally reflect our familiar democratic politics. I’m completely amused. +1 Anet. Comments feel like speculation from political pundits I always see on CNN. XD

As for the topic at hand, I wouldn’t be so sure that Evon is favored just because of the black lion keys. Many people are not interested in the aetherblade weapons, and there are still many supporters of Kiel in general. I wouldn’t assume that this will automatically go Evon’s way just yet.

Just to stir the pot a bit: Since we have no real way of knowing how many votes there will be, for all we know Anet will rig this election from the very start and our votes will count for nothing. So any perceived attempt to sway the public vote would be completely moot.

I doubt they would do that though, it would be much more fun to see what happens with the community while this plays out. I highly doubt it will be as divisive as some are suggesting as well. Or maybe it was their plot all along to turn our frustrations against one another in debate so that the community managers won’t have to look at so many complaints about the game. :shifty eyes: XD

Yeah and where is the “vote for kiel” sticky?
Evo gets one.
What is this rubbish.

I fail to see how a-net is favoring Evon.

The ingame offers ins’t clear enough (you have to go to each of them and select their second answer as their first letter doesn’t say much), which leaves the opinion on who should win (for most of the playerbase that aren’t visiting the internet all day, we’re just a small percentage here) on cinematics.

And cinematics so far are making everyone see Evon as the bad Shaddy character. Even when you speak with them, Kiel is already treating you like you’re on her side.

Cinematics are completly biased against Evon.

koanoke.8132:

Yeah and where is the “vote for kiel” sticky?
Evo gets one.
What is this rubbish.

You mean this sticky?
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/cutthroat/TeamKiel/first

I’m voting for the Abadon fractal, I mean Ebon,…. Evon..?…. the charr thing.

People were complaining lion chests weren’t worth while. So they added more stuff to them. Seems fair to me :p

Konig, I support most things you say, but this is borderline trollbait.

Are you blind? Of all people for this to come from I’m almost shocked.

The odds are HEAVILY in Kiel’s favour. Let me roll over a few things.

1. Waypoints: Kiel offers cheaper waypoints. This is something every player uses. This is something that your casual player (and keep in mind the primary player base is casual) will want.
2. Kiel as a character: Kiel is your typical good character. The players know her well, they’ve seen her a lot recently, she’s got Magnus behind her (another likeable character), she is portrayed as the ‘good guy’ of the situation. This is something the majority of players will associate with
3. Evon as a character: He’s generally seen as your typical villain and with that comes the natural desire for him to lose. He’s portrayed as having ‘bad morales’ and such. Most people will be hesitant to vote for him on this basis.
4. Thaumanova: Be honest with yourself. How much of the player base is actual GW1 vets that care about the lore to a mild extent? Maybe 10% Most of them don’t know, or don’t care, who Abaddon on. Thaumanova is your obvious go-to choice as they know it, it’s in game and they understand it.
5. Fractals: Do you understand that the player base for fractals is ridiculously small? At least at high levels, which are the players who actually care about it. The majority of players I encounter in-game (and I encounter a lot) don’t do fractals, don’t like fractals or simply don’t care.

Your argument is poor at best and I’m pretty sure you know it. Hell, the two cut-scenes we have of Evon set him out as a Villain. Objectively Kiel has a major upper hand and you know it. You are blatantly disregarding all facts and not taking into account who the actual player base is. They aren’t the seasoned Guild Wars 1 veterans who care enough about the lore to want to know more about the parentage of the Gods, where humanity came from, the origins of the Charr, what exactly the Great Dwarf is or even the contents of the Tome of Rubicon. The majority see:

Familiar character who is reducing waypoints. Thaumanova is something I understand. I guess I’ll vote for her.

Take the player-base into consideration. I honestly expect better from someone as invested into this universe as you.

I will personally voting for Evon as I’m someone who does high level fractals (48+) on a regular basis and believe the Fall of Abaddon will be a far, far more interesting and fun fractal, both mechanically and lore-wise. Though I understand the background of Thaumanova and it’s importance to the lore.

Edit: I took a look at the post time. To an extent I can see your perspective, but when you get in game you’ll understand what I mean. Enter the Candidate Trials. Kiel’s and Evon’s are as different as day and night with Kiel being the ‘good guy’ and Evon the ‘bad guy’. There’s quite a lot that, once you see the update, shows how much of an advantage Kiel is given. She’s literally been handed a free win with the way they’ve written this. Hell, your character sides with Kiel. Do the ‘story’ scene and then talk to her. She constantly uses ‘we’ and ‘us’ and the continue dialogue is more along the lines of siding with her. Evon’s is more of a “mmk dunno you. Talk to ya later m8’

I will however agree that they’re on unfair playing ground. The bonuses need to be in-game things. If it was say, reduction of the trading post tax, that would put it on a better playing field.

actually I’m not interested in BL keys…
I don’t really care about which fractal will be added…

wp costs isn’t for me reson neither…

I support Ellen Kiel because every characten on my account is that “good” one (also “noblish” ones – when there are character choiced dialogues dignitous one is coming up :P)
and every character from my account check those candidates – Ellen in their opinion (i’m old rp-player) is more suitable – and also she earned it better as for now.
Mine Asura engineer wasn’t in LA nor Southsun in the last event same Human thief and human guardian – so they didn’t helped her in any of this cases so no “credit stealing here” – last character – human ranger did take actions in both Southsun and dragonbash and in both situation agrees that Kiel was leading and he only followed her orders – in sky pirates of tyria he helped in hideout rush – but the same opinion as southsun – so still no credit stealing feeling there.

only thing I would thing about little support to evon are achievements :P

It was just payday for me, so I’ll be able to buy a lot of Evon Gnashblade Support Bundles.

Evon’s benefit helps ANET’s bottom line, where as Kiel’s reduces the effect of a gold sink.

I agree with Konig – ANET is stacking Evon – but to a certain player base. IF you buy keys – you will want to vote for Evon. IF you dont – you will want to vote for Kiel.

But lets take a look at why Evon is a more lucrative choice -

Assuming a 33% discount on keys: Each set of 5 will cost 150 less gems which now cost around 3 gold per 100 gem set. That’s a raw savings of 4.5 gold on a 5 key purchase.

Assuming a 33% discount on WP costs: I expend around 45 silver a day in normal play – I think others like me likewise would spend around 12 gold per month on WPs. The raw savings are around 4 gold for the entire month. If you do dungeons double the gold savings.

It would take just 5 keys to make Evon a better monetary choice, and 10 makes it better, where as Kiel just makes it cheaper to do things you already do and won’t change your plays tlye that much.

Konig’s point is that ANET can unfairly stack an election by offering an “unlimited” discount which requires almost no opportunity cost (in time) versus offering a “limited” discount which requires a person to sink more time in to do more things. Lets look at it this way – since when did WP costs prevent you from killing that one monster on the other side of the map? Even if you reached 0 copper WP costs are free, there’s really no reason to get reduced WP costs, its just icing on the cake.

Konig doesn’t get into the idea that financially ANET would want Evon instead as it
a) generates income via gem store
b) doesn’t limit a previously admitted gold sink
c) gets more GW1 players interested in GW2
But I went there.

And I think I want to vote for Kiel – but Evon’s benefits are just too good to pass up.

Since I have little interest in achievement points and couldn’t really care about the dungeon content (a new dungeon is a new dungeon), I’ll be treating this election like the real thing by not participating.

I think it was just an attempt to balance if they hadn’t done it would’ve been very much one sided we’ve seen kiel and worked with her. She is a human the most played race in GW2 while Evon is a char the least played race. Not to mention all the GW1 players who still hate charr for the events of GW1. And on top of all this Evon is the leader of the BLTC which many ppl have often said how much they hate. Without some kind of bribeing in his favor this wouldn’t even have been a race.

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Your tin foil hats need tuning because I’m hoping for Kiel. But I have a vested interest because my team will probably be working on the fractals. I had nothing to do with this content though.

The Cutthroat Politics team tried to make it as even as possible.

But Anthony. Colin says to vote for Evon. Shouldn’t that be enough for all the Devs to follow? And besides, if you don’t need to work on the Abbadon Fractal, that means extra time off. That would be a well deserved treat for a team that works so hard year round.

Only one thing:

Politics tatics everywhere. Starting for the OP.

I vote for Evon bc its charr.

Signed,
Charr warrior

Is it intended that both – Kiel and Evon – are promising a mini game rotation including the survival mini game(and not that other nice and fun mini game that Kiel is hosting at the moment – she should include this in her promise).

Would be more incentive to vote for Ellen Kiel if her promise included her game… and not the survival minigame.

I also think that the lower waypoint cost is not that interesting and I don’t care about fractals(and there’ll probably both but the one that wins will be first?).

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

We will not make both fractals.

alot of ppl are intrested in abaddon because some ppl did not play gw1

I have to be honest, I think I see what the Cutthroat Politics team was trying to do. Kiel is cast better in cut-scenes and has had previous character development. In contrast, Evon has the Abbadon fractal and key discounts (let’s face it, put to a poll on the fractal only Abbadon would win popular support because it is better known and has the word god in it). It seems like the team was going for a character verses coin type of contest.

Which would be an interesting race, if players couldn’t just buy votes. The problem there being, the people most likely to buy gems or who have vast quantities of gold are the most likely to have the disposable resources to buy keys. They are also the most likely to buy votes to influence the election. Many of them (since they see the opportunity to stockpile keys) will no doubt cast their lot behind Evon.

Given a one-vote per account system I think the race could be close. As it stands however, I expect the “gold” votes to mostly flow for Evon. Between that and the popularity of the Abaddon story, I think Kiel has a tough campaign ahead.

It is also an interesting choice to put these two particular fractals against each other. To be perfectly honest, I would have preferred to see Abaddon and the Reactor as the definite fractals and then have the Molten and Aetherblade ones up for voting. I thoroughly enjoyed the Molten Facility dungeon. In contrast, the Aetherblade dungeon was fun for the challenge but a huge train wreck in terms of design and interaction with the game’s classes.

From the list of four fractals, this vote is excluding one of the two I would most want to see in favour of a distant third (Molten) and even more distant fourth (Aetherblade)

Arathor.7419:

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

We will not make both fractals.

alot of ppl are intrested in abaddon because some ppl did not play gw1

this is not the fight with komier this is the fight with the 5 gods that throw abbadone into nightfall.

Lokheit.7943:

I fail to see how a-net is favoring Evon.

[…]

And cinematics so far are making everyone see Evon as the bad Shaddy character. Even when you speak with them, Kiel is already treating you like you’re on her side.

Cinematics are completly biased against Evon.

You know, audiences tend to favor the shady figures from my personal experience. I don’t see this as being biased against Evon at all. And Kiel treating you friendly is only due to personal history with her. She probably considers the PC an ally, regardless of the PC’s view on her.

Navzar.2938:

People were complaining lion chests weren’t worth while. So they added more stuff to them. Seems fair to me :p

I agree with the act. I disagree with the timing. It should have been done at the end of this content update, and announced after the voting, IMHO.

mexay.3902:

1. Waypoints: -snip-
2. Kiel as a character: Kiel is your typical good character. -snip- This is something the majority of players will associate with
3. Evon as a character: He’s generally seen as your typical villain and with that comes the natural desire for him to lose. -snip-
4. Thaumanova: Be honest with yourself. How much of the player base is actual GW1 vets that care about the lore to a mild extent? Maybe 10% Most of them don’t know, or don’t care, who Abaddon on. Thaumanova is your obvious go-to choice as they know it, it’s in game and they understand it.
5. Fractals: Do you understand that the player base for fractals is ridiculously small?

I’ll break this into groups.

The WP part I concur with.

The Kiel’s character I disagree with being something in Kiel’s favor. From what I’ve seen – and granted I have not seen everyone’s view – folks are viewing Kiel as someone who is, and I paraphrase, “taking credit for our actions like Kormir and Trahearne.”

Then on Kiel being portrayed as good and Evon as bad… I disagree on your opinion for how people will go to them. People prefer not “good characters over bad characters” but “interesting characters over dull characters” – yes, Kiel is shown as good, but she’s straightforward. Which to many makes her bland. Evon however is an enigma. And people LOVE enigmas. In terms of personality and character, the only bit Kiel has going for her is that she’s more known… and for some folks that’ll be a downpoint.

About Thaumanova – I think you’re underestimating those interested in GW1 lore. But you do have a point. However, it is also because people know of the Thaumanova, but yet of what I’ve seen, not enough to make them interested in it. Like I said in the OP, from what I’ve seen, most folks aren’t interested in Thaumanova and others are left confused for why such a thing can be put on par to the fall of an ancient god.

And about Fractal playerbase – there’s enough of a sizable amount to make it worth. And worse, since you can buy support tickets, the richer playerbase has a larger say. And who’re the richer playerbase. Fractal and other dungeon runners more often than not.

mexay.3902:

Your argument is poor at best and I’m pretty sure you know it. Hell, the two cut-scenes we have of Evon set him out as a Villain. Objectively Kiel has a major upper hand and you know it. You are blatantly disregarding all facts and not taking into account who the actual player base is. They aren’t the seasoned Guild Wars 1 veterans who care enough about the lore to want to know more about the parentage of the Gods, where humanity came from, the origins of the Charr, what exactly the Great Dwarf is or even the contents of the Tome of Rubicon.

You’re making a false presumption. I know the majority of the playerbase isn’t seasoned GW1 veterans (though I’d say more than 10%), and I know even fewer folks than that are interested in the ancient mysteries of lore. But that’s exactly why I think Abaddon’s fractal would win.

There are more people interested in epic rather than lore, and Thaumanova isn’t epic on the cover. That was my argument about fractal opinions. That’s what I’ve seen about the fractals. Those favoring Abaddon’s fractal is more interested in the epicness such a thing could bring, not the lore behind it.

Evon being made out to be a villain as I see it only makes him more likely to be voted for.

As to my argument being poor, funny you say that yet you agree with what I said!

-more in next post-

Arathor.7419:

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

We will not make both fractals.

alot of ppl are intrested in abaddon because some ppl did not play gw1

Go play it then, it’s like a couple of bucks now.

mexay.3902:

The majority see:

Familiar character who is reducing waypoints. Thaumanova is something I understand. I guess I’ll vote for her.

How I see it, the majority see:

Kiel stole my thunder, but Evon has intrigue behind him. Fighting a god would be EPIC! And I can get a better chance at that revolver skin!

This is just from what I’ve been reading. There are those who view it like you say, but I see more who’re “anti-Kormir 3.0” aka Kiel.

mexay.3902:

She’s literally been handed a free win with the way they’ve written this. Hell, your character sides with Kiel.

While not before writing the OP, I have gone in game and seen the cutscenes and dialogues. I disagree with that giving Kiel a win. And no, my character isn’t siding with Kiel. Kiel is siding with my character.

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Your tin foil hats need tuning because I’m hoping for Kiel. -snip-

The Cutthroat Politics team tried to make it as even as possible.

I think the fact that my thread title got changed proves my tinfoil hat fits enough.

I think the team didn’t do too grand of a job for various reasons, even some not said by myself already. Both sides have pros and cons, and folks view these pros and cons differently as one would expect, but from what I’ve seen of the playerbase, the majority view Kiel as having more cons and pros. But that’s just what I’ve seen.

But I’m glad that someone from Anet went and posted here. Gives me a warm and tingly feeling inside. <3

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

We will not make both fractals.

You should. If Kiel wins, I intend to organize a rally placed right in front of Evon.

If Evon wins, that rally will be in front of Kiel.

Definitely fixed to favor Evon. Welcome to the “Living Story”, where your ability to influence the world is just an illusion…

Very sad ANet… You earned some positive capital with the last update, then you find a way to blow it, again… sigh…

Yeh, there’ s a definite bias towards Evon right now. The rewards are simply unbalanced: you can choose between something that’s quite obscure or you know, the event where the mighiest god was chained to the crystal sea by the other 4. And now with those new weapon skins, the other reward of Evon is actually more useful that just 4 weeks of cheaper WP’s. Those weapon skins will stay forever once you have obtained one, and the reward given by Evon makes it easier to get it.

I just laugh at the statement that the rewards are even between the two. After I logged in, everyone was cramped around the Evon support box. There were only 2 people at the Kiel support box. Yes, real even. You should just start working on the reactor fractal after Abaddon one, then at least the people who had their hopes up for Kiel shouldn’t completely feel like utter fooled tools.

Vewen.8016:

After I logged in, everyone was cramped around the Evon support box. There were only 2 people at the Kiel support box. Yes, real even. You should just start working on the reactor fractal after Abaddon one, then at least the people who had their hopes up for Kiel shouldn’t completely feel like utter fooled tools.

Ha! I had a similiar thing when I got to the baskets, I want to vote Kiel but Abbadon fractal to me is far more interesting than the reactor, as a trend with politics in game and in real world, people flock to those that yield the most promising and interesting incentives, its definitely favoured towards Evon, the rewards are far out stripping Kiel’s.

I’d be surprised if Kiel did win overall and probably …ahem…fixed….ahem cough…. if she did…

Aw, come on, we already know how this will end! The supporters of the losing candidate will cry foul, complain the vote was rigged, and then have a mass sit-in in the Lion’s Arch fountain plaza. The Lionguard will move in, riots erupt, and we’ll have a mass PvP slaughter-fest that will deepen sectarian divisions between the player base.