Guild Wars 2

Back in April, I completed all of W1 of SAB / all achievements. I thoroughly enjoyed it as it was a cool throwback in a modern game. The experience was pretty casual, and could be made ‘hardcore’ by gathering all the baubles, not dying, etc.

It would seem as if that has all changed. The whole of W2 and Tribulation Mode seem designed to be purposefully hard. Or rather, cheap. They turned a platformed inspired by legend of zelda and other old RPG games into…Battletoads? Memorize a bunch of things and call it good.

Mind you, I have not been past the rapids in world 2 or world 1 tribulation mode, however I really have no desire to either. Is this what any developer wants from content? SAB now boils down to this:

1. Buy infinite continue coin
2. Bash your head against every death possibility / read Dulfy
3. Die a lot anyway (tribulation mode)
4. Complete after hundreds of deaths and many hours
5. Call yourself ‘good’ and flash some weapon skins

Basically, if I want an unfair game to play I will go play one of the many better ones (see: Battletoads, Ninja Gaiden, I Wanna Be the Guy, Super Meat Boy, etc.). If I want a skin to flash I will just go grind out a legendary…

As a bit of an aside, for those who say the IFC is not necessary…have you completed all content without it? If you have, may I ask roughly how many deaths and how many hours you’ve put in?

Since the patch, W2 difficulty seems about right. Except that room with the boxes and the many dart traps. Who though it was a fun idea to hide some of those between two boxes, firing through a tiny gap XD

It’s challenging sure, but not that hard (speaking only for normal mode here)…even less so after the patch. While I do have the ICC now I did my initial Infantile/Normal runs without it, relying on coins I had stocked up. W2Z1 took around an hour initially with both W2Z2 and Z3 each taking a couple of hours. As far as lives expended…I was around 50 some odd coins when I started and got as low as 32 or so. After that though, the initial run of each area, you end up spending a lot less.

I’m permanently carrying 750 baubles and have now started to deposit them in my bank whenever I get out of SAB. I bought the ICC initially, but I realize it wasn’t at all necessary. 750 baubles represents 150 lives. You can max out on coins in a single tribulation mode level. Do you really die more than 150 times per level? If the answer is yes, I would recommend trying infantile or normal mode.

I don’t believe that you couldn’t get past the rapids, since those were nerfed extremely hard by the recent update. They’re a joke now.

Tribulation Mode is meant to be challenging. It doesn’t reward anything gamebreaking. You don’t even get a new skin, only a new color. Why do so many people complain on the forums until the challenging content gets removed from those it was made for. I liked it much better pre-nerf.

The rapids to me needs more routs for exploration.

Has it been ruined? No, not entirely. Is it as good as it was before? Well, that’d be subjective. They added a few good things, but added quite a bunch of bad things too. I still like the Super Adventure Box, but I feel that they need to cut down on the bad stuff so people can just play and enjoy it at the pace they want.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/sab-bts/My-thoughts-on-the-Super-Adventure-Box/first

Personally, I feel the original design has been lost. Is World 2 not fun at any point? No. But the original design of a fun and in my honest opinion casual experience has been set aside for a difficult and skill-based challenge. World 2 is a stark contrast to World 1. It requires a lot more skill, a lot better timing, and has no forgiving features whatsoever.

Do I look forward to World 3 now that the design has been changed? Sadly, no. I know what to expect from World 3, difficulty and skill-based wise, and it isn’t something I’m interested in.

And I think the GW2 developers will see a huge dip in participation for World 2.

Don’t listen to these negative nannies, based arena. SAB is awesome, quirky, challenging, merciless and innocent with a touch of fantastic music. When i first entered this i was just over the moon it was exactly what this game needed. All the content was doom and gloom every animal on the planet is hostile kill everything now we have a touch of pure joy eternal mind vibes!

matthewr.3980:

Personally, I feel the original design has been lost. Is World 2 not fun at any point? No. But the original design of a fun and in my honest opinion casual experience has been set aside for a difficult and skill-based challenge. World 2 is a stark contrast to World 1. It requires a lot more skill, a lot better timing, and has no forgiving features whatsoever.

Do I look forward to World 3 now that the design has been changed? Sadly, no. I know what to expect from World 3, difficulty and skill-based wise, and it isn’t something I’m interested in.

And I think the GW2 developers will see a huge dip in participation for World 2.

After trying to clear World 2, I agree with you on this. I’ll just stick to World 1.

Honestly I think the jump in difficulty between World 1 and World 2 is entirely appropriate for a game based on old-school platformers.

Look at the original Mario and Sonic games for example, the first level of both could be completed pretty much by holding down right and pressed A occasionally. But as soon as you’re beyond the first few levels you’ve suddenly got a lot more to deal with, traps, enemies you can’t jump on, power-ups you need to acquire and use at the correct moments, lava. If anything I think World 2 of SAB is more forgiving than the Marble Zone in Sonic coming right after Green Hills.

Danikat.8537:

Honestly I think the jump in difficulty between World 1 and World 2 is entirely appropriate for a game based on old-school platformers.

Look at the original Mario and Sonic games for example, the first level of both could be completed pretty much by holding down right and pressed A occasionally. But as soon as you’re beyond the first few levels you’ve suddenly got a lot more to deal with, traps, enemies you can’t jump on, power-ups you need to acquire and use at the correct moments, lava. If anything I think World 2 of SAB is more forgiving than the Marble Zone in Sonic coming right after Green Hills.

I never looked at it that way.

There are a lot of fun things in the SAB. Overall I’m enjoying it. But going through the gong pagoda’s dart traps was mostly frustrating, given that the ninjas are hard enough to beat in the open field. If they knock you into dart traps while being immune to your attacks, that’s just plain annoying.

And having to climb the pagoda several times in a row isn’t much fun either.

Wow. I actually like SAB post-patch. It feels more like an old school homage to me now.

Gotejjeken.1267:

Back in April, I completed all of W1 of SAB / all achievements. I thoroughly enjoyed it as it was a cool throwback in a modern game. The experience was pretty casual, and could be made ‘hardcore’ by gathering all the baubles, not dying, etc.

It would seem as if that has all changed. The whole of W2 and Tribulation Mode seem designed to be purposefully hard. Or rather, cheap. They turned a platformed inspired by legend of zelda and other old RPG games into…Battletoads? Memorize a bunch of things and call it good.

Mind you, I have not been past the rapids in world 2 or world 1 tribulation mode, however I really have no desire to either. Is this what any developer wants from content? SAB now boils down to this:

1. Buy infinite continue coin
2. Bash your head against every death possibility / read Dulfy
3. Die a lot anyway (tribulation mode)
4. Complete after hundreds of deaths and many hours
5. Call yourself ‘good’ and flash some weapon skins

Basically, if I want an unfair game to play I will go play one of the many better ones (see: Battletoads, Ninja Gaiden, I Wanna Be the Guy, Super Meat Boy, etc.). If I want a skin to flash I will just go grind out a legendary…

As a bit of an aside, for those who say the IFC is not necessary…have you completed all content without it? If you have, may I ask roughly how many deaths and how many hours you’ve put in?

Whole point is that those games you’ve quoted, they aren’t unfair they are just hellish hard.
In super meat boy you’ll never die because an invisible trap popped out/fake ground/crappy platforming/crappy camera.
In those you die because YOU, the player, deserved it. In tribulation mode you die 100 times, where just 10 are you actual fault… i am very disappointed by anet for this mode, as i said in my own “cry” topic hard means that takes skill to play, tribulation takes just patience and memorizing/reading guides.

Tribulation mode aside, SAB is great, i’m really having fun.

matthewr.3980:

Personally, I feel the original design has been lost. Is World 2 not fun at any point? No. But the original design of a fun and in my honest opinion casual experience has been set aside for a difficult and skill-based challenge. World 2 is a stark contrast to World 1. It requires a lot more skill, a lot better timing, and has no forgiving features whatsoever.

Do I look forward to World 3 now that the design has been changed? Sadly, no. I know what to expect from World 3, difficulty and skill-based wise, and it isn’t something I’m interested in.

And I think the GW2 developers will see a huge dip in participation for World 2.

Sadly, I agree with this. I loved the first incarnation of SAB and was beyond excited for its return, but I can’t say I’ve had much fun with this release.

It doesn’t help that I have literally spent over 7 hours total now trying to get bugged achievements and I’ve had it. It’s completely sucked what little fun there was completely out of SAB.

http://i.imgur.com/5X7cLya.jpg

Tribulation mode isnt really for those that want to fondly remember the platformers of old. Its an alternate mode styled after the platform hell variants of those older games. go look up and try out something like “cat mario” or “Unfair mario” if you want to see what tribulation mode was modeled after. That style of sadistic platformer isnt for everybody but some people enjoy them. If you or anybody else isnt into thakittens fine, it says nothing bad about you or your skill at the game, just stick to normal mode.

That’s what I do. I don’t complain about Tribulation Mode.

They need to go throw world 2 with the nerf hammer few times,we have Tribulation Mode so there is literally no need to have world 2 500%harder than world1…

I think the difficult is fine, but the length is ridiculous. Even in Infantile Mode, World 2 Zone 2 takes way too long.

Post-patch, there is nothing wrong with World 2.

Rapids as it was initially implemented was not good. Rapids after the “nerf” is right where it should be following World 1. The rest of World 2 isn’t that hard. Some of it is a bit tedious, and Zone 2 is annoying because of the sword assassins, but other than that it’s not that tough either.

The realy answer is, if someone likes it then it was a success.

I like it. I really enjoyed Tribulation Mode because I entered Tribulation Mode understanding what to expect and what it would be like. I knew that I would die repeatedly and why.

I’m not a fan of the Storm Wizards, but I’m certain it’s because I don’t understand a mechanic I’m supposed to be using after it reaches 50%. That’s where most of these “This isn’t good” threads go wrong. It isn’t that it isn’t good, it’s that you don’t like it, or don’t understand it. Rather than saying it’s not good just accept that maybe it’s not for you and move on. If you liked world one, play world one. It’s still there and it’s still fun.

Who are you trying to convince that you don’t HAVE to do TM because it has cheap mechanics and there is no actual skill or fun involved? Us or yourself? It’s true that you most likely need a infinite coin to do tribulation mode unless you want to grow old farming bubbles. Allthough it might be doable with normal coins now that there are guides out, it’s still can save you a major headache if you just get the infinite coin.

I for one really enjoyed TM. I also found it a shame that they nerfed w2z1, I enjoyed trying to race through that part as fast as I could without getting knocked down. Sure you have to know where to go and how to go there, but that’s just called a learning process. It’s how all games work and when you get punished hard for not knowing what to do (yet) or not being able to do it, it’s called difficulty.

This division you make between supposedly “mechanical difficulty” and “real difficulty” is imaginary. It’s still a testament of patience and persistence if you managed to finish world 2 TM. And why not skill? Is it not skill to learn how to adapat fast and perform a series of difficult, precise tasks in a row without failing? Don’t you think that people who are less good at this will have a harder time and will thus give up easier or not finish it?

I’ve been helping my friends get past world one and I can get even the worst of them through most of it, but some of them will (even with my guidance) not be able to complete world two without breaking their face on the wall. I’ve managed to go through w2z3 in a reasonable time my first try with a friend and since then I’ve been able to do the entire world rather fast in TM. I’m pleased and proud that I’m now a better ‘jumper’ than I was before and that I’m getting more yellow skins than the next one for being good at it. I’m sorry, but you can’t take that away from me.

I get my fun out of content like this or Liadri, I hate farming gold to get a legendary or ascended weapon and I’m not sure if I ever will do that. I stopped playing for 8 months and things like this drew me back in.

EDIT: I actually enjoyed doing half of the zones without a guide because I had to try and think my way out of seemingly impossible situations.

I like sab a lot! i had so much laugh in this mini game
i dont have a lot of time playing so i try to play as much as i can when i have the free time, i have done some repeats of trib in w1 for bubbles and only completed trib w2z1, might try z2 tonight

Ivonbeton.6814:

It’s how all games work and when you get punished hard for not knowing what to do (yet) or not being able to do it, it’s called difficulty.

This division you make between supposedly “mechanical difficulty” and “real difficulty” is imaginary.

It’s subjective, not imaginary. For example, to protect yourself from the absurd knockback physics, you can learn to conduct battles in more advantageous locations, and put your back to a wall. At this point, though, it certainly feels like you’re fighting the design more than you’re fighting the enemy, who is otherwise not so threatening.

Whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, people are able to perceive the causes of difficulty differently, because in fact the causes are different. You are seriously underestimating players if you think we can’t tell the difference between something that is hard because the enemies are hard and something that is hard because gameplay is broken.

This existed all along in World 1 also, but that content was, overall, easy enough that the bugs and other problems could be overlooked. That’s no longer the case in World 2, which uses any excuse to throw you off a cliff. Even Ninja Gaiden was not this blatant, and like all of the good classics, that game had a variety of powerful weapons that served to both balance the gameplay and add fun factor. Even Mario could spam fireballs.

It seems to me that this indie-driven interpretation of the genre is not so much trying to recreate the feel of the classics so much as they are trying to one-up each other in seeing who can distill the entirety of the gameplay experience into difficulty and nothing more. On the other hand you have modern games that do higher difficulty the right way, like Demon’s Souls or the perennial shmups whose gameplay principles have not changed in the last two decades – games that keep the fun factor high even as they turn up the difficulty. Instead of daring people to play the game just so they can say they finished it. Which is precisely the area where World 2 and TM have gone.

And why not skill? Is it not skill to learn how to adapat fast and perform a series of difficult, precise tasks in a row without failing? Don’t you think that people who are less good at this will have a harder time and will thus give up easier or not finish it?

Sure, but what you just described need not involve a game in any fashion. You could just as easily test your skills in basket weaving in such a way. When you are using video games as a medium, the expectation is for it to have solid gameplay mechanics first, and then worry about difficulty after.

I’m pleased and proud that I’m now a better ‘jumper’ than I was before and that I’m getting more yellow skins than the next one for being good at it. I’m sorry, but you can’t take that away from me.

And if we could take it away from you, would you still be playing?

Yeah, I think we can definitely say Josh Foreman and co. have definitely done the right thing with this latest patch. It’s easier obviously, but I always felt SAB was more of a parkour game play, with fast smooth-flowing running and jumping that awards you for successive jumps.

The die-if-you-do and die-if-you-dont game play kind of sucked.

There are a few mechanics that I still think need a little tailoring, such as instant-kill arrow darts (they should knock back + damage just to give you a chance of living at least) and I think the water geysers should be re-instated but perhaps with a synchronised and more forgiving time frame. As it is they are just odd platforms now. But to be honest, this patch has fully redeemed how I feel about SAB.

It’s a huge adventure now, but not one that deals in death heavily

I have 2 yellow skins and 5 green skins from trib mode and while I did buy an infinite continue coin and use it for world 1, I actually put it away for world 2 to see how it changed the content for me. I ran out of continue coins and started using baubles and bauble bubbles to buy more when I needed them and I can say for certain that the content is entirely doable without an infinite continue coin. I died a lot, to be sure, it was not easy, but considering you get 250+ baubles from completing a zone in Trib Mode you’ll never actually run out of continues if you are someone who enjoys the content enough to continue playing it. 250 baubles is a bauble bubble, which is 5 continue coins, which is 25 lives. If you find yourself in hell without a continue coind you can buy one for 50 baubles. When you are playing Trib Mode the bauble bubbles are really only good for spending on lives, since you need a total of 0 for the Trib Mode skins. I can do W1Z1 in less than 10 minutes and rarely need more than 1 continue coin.

World 2, and all the Trib Mode content is completely doable. Having a difficult time is intended. If you don’t enjoy the content, play some other part of GW2. I didn’t enjoy the farming content from Southsun, Jubilee, or Clockwork updates. They weren’t designed for players like me, SAB was though. I think it’s awesome that the releases cater to different player types that enjoy GW2.

With all that said though, I do agree that for World 2 out of 4 (or 5 judging by the map if you count what must be the end boss area) the less than intuitive geysers in 2-1 and the length of 2-2 were a little over the top. They geysers were completely fine having the strange knockdown behavior if they were used in a manner than graphically described the results so players knew the source of the knockdown, and the length of 2-2 would be better suited for world 3 or more likely 4.

Leablo.2651:

Ivonbeton.6814:

It’s how all games work and when you get punished hard for not knowing what to do (yet) or not being able to do it, it’s called difficulty.

This division you make between supposedly “mechanical difficulty” and “real difficulty” is imaginary.

It’s subjective, not imaginary. For example, to protect yourself from the absurd knockback physics, you can learn to conduct battles in more advantageous locations, and put your back to a wall. At this point, though, it certainly feels like you’re fighting the design more than you’re fighting the enemy, who is otherwise not so threatening.

Whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, people are able to perceive the causes of difficulty differently, because in fact the causes are different. You are seriously underestimating players if you think we can’t tell the difference between something that is hard because the enemies are hard and something that is hard because gameplay is broken.

This existed all along in World 1 also, but that content was, overall, easy enough that the bugs and other problems could be overlooked. That’s no longer the case in World 2, which uses any excuse to throw you off a cliff. Even Ninja Gaiden was not this blatant, and like all of the good classics, that game had a variety of powerful weapons that served to both balance the gameplay and add fun factor. Even Mario could spam fireballs.

It seems to me that this indie-driven interpretation of the genre is not so much trying to recreate the feel of the classics so much as they are trying to one-up each other in seeing who can distill the entirety of the gameplay experience into difficulty and nothing more. On the other hand you have modern games that do higher difficulty the right way, like Demon’s Souls or the perennial shmups whose gameplay principles have not changed in the last two decades – games that keep the fun factor high even as they turn up the difficulty. Instead of daring people to play the game just so they can say they finished it. Which is precisely the area where World 2 and TM have gone.

I am amused that throughout this entire LS content, I’ve gotten to read replies defending glitchy content as “retro gaming” and “real difficulty” by people who weren’t even alive or old enough to hold a controller yet when the golden age of NES was going on. If they were, they’d understand the games they keep referencing are the best of the NES library and games that had glitchy knockbacks and IWTBTG type deaths were the ones that ended up in the bargain bin and had their titles forgotten because they were that incredibly broken and not fun for the majority of gamers. Jeckyl and Hyde, Athena, Back to the Future, Wizard of Oz, Friday the 13th.. all games with broken and glitchy game play. Ever hear them mentioned as classics in the same high regard as Metroid or Mario? NO! Because the glitchy punishing game play and poorly designed levels weren’t fun!

I really agree with the quote of trying to “one up” each other and make indie games about soul crushing difficulty. Guys, this isn’t “retro” gaming, it’s really not. I see Ninja Gaiden brought up a lot. Well here’s the thing about that game – yes it had a high difficulty level… but it was also fun. Lately, it seems people make hacks and indie games just to create the “impossible” game. I’ve watched LP’s, these people aren’t having fun, they are beating the game to say they beat it and nothing else. Back in the NES era, these games would be tossed in the bargain bin and never heard from again. The average player wants a good degree of fun mixed in with the difficulty. I never finished Ninja Gaiden but I didn’t need to, Ninja Gaiden was fun to play. I’ll never finish TM and it’s not fun at all for me to play, I’m not missing out on a thing by skipping it either.

But seriously, as a gamer of 35+ years, I can tell when I’m fighting the game and when I’m fighting the game engine/design and a good designer always makes sure a player is only fighting the first one.

Danikat.8537:

Honestly I think the jump in difficulty between World 1 and World 2 is entirely appropriate for a game based on old-school platformers.

This.

/15charrs

Bought the infinite coin and by now I regret it. After no more than 2 runs on each zone in both normal and tribulation i’ve memorized the routes and now I hardly die enough times to make the coin worth it. I’m just glad there will be more worlds.

Now, do you people actually having trouble with each zone after the 1st time you play it? Or have you never completed it? I don’t like to think myself better and stuff, just more patient with tm, but if you’re having problems in normal mode you should seriously question your skills, especially after the patch fixing various bugs.

I know you’re all proud, but maybe you’re simply not good enough for what’s essentially just puzzle jumping. There’s no shame in that, go play pvp/pve/wvw or anything else.

I just don’t find tribulation mode concept to be fun at all. It’s a maze with a single route that you need to follow.

May have sounded cool and interesting on paper, but in practice it was a flop for me.

Groonz.7825:

I just don’t find tribulation mode concept to be fun at all. It’s a maze with a single route that you need to follow.

May have sounded cool and interesting on paper, but in practice it was a flop for me.

There’s actually not a single route to follow. I’ve watched several peoples youtube videos and so far none of them have taken the same route I did, in any world that I’ve watched.

IMHO, no, the SAB has not been ruined at all.

Post-bug fixes, I like world 2 fine. I’m really having fun in the rapids (frogger and all), I enjoy the QBerting in zone 3. Zone 2 is not my favourite but I appreciate that it contains puzzles to solve at all.

I’m super happy that I can focus on the levels themselves and don’t have to worry about getting insta-killed by glitches, bugs and latency all the time.

There is a lot to do. I’ve completed the upgrades and sectrets achievements last night. Next: bauble completion. All the while casually running world 1 for baubles and a chance at skins. And when I’m done with all that, tribulation mode awaits.

I am already looking forward to world 3 (caves! water level!!) even though I know the difficulty will be cranked up again.

I think that the new worlds are way too long. That’s it.

SAB is freaking awesome.

I have only been playing GW2 for 2~3 weeks now very recent purchase and I can safely say that SAB is way way better content than scarlet. Scarlet just felt like a farming chore that you HAD to do or you would fall behind in wealth.

I finished W2Z1 first day of release before the nerf its not impossible at all its actually fun but I do agree the jump in difficulty from W1Z3 to W2Z1 was a tad too much so that nerf was somewhat justified.

As for zones 2 and 3 in world 2 the complaint is that they were tediously long. Knowing that once you start one you cant turn off the game and leave without finishing it meant you had to commit to 1~2 hours every you start zone 2 or 3 that imo is not okay. They need to create a single save point smack in the middle of zones 2 and 3 in world 2 to allow people to go practice their daily routines :/.

Just my 2 cents really as for difficulty world 2 on normal was a very satisfying difficulty finishing a zone/puzzle was very very rewarding I can’t comment on TM since I didn’t start that yet but I will be starting it very soon

Heres a fun fact about “frustration and spend $$$ mode” I pixel compared specifically jumping into exact same spot 6 times. 1 continue basically. First 4 times I died… then i got rubberbanded and died and ONLY ONCE did I not simply not die at my 0th life I was able to walk all around that spot w/o falling into lava/rockets/anything else.

No its not challenging. Its a good business strategy to force perfectionists/achivement whores/really bored/in need of attention/etc to buy stuff from cash shop. But nothing past that.
Kind of like being forced into dailies if you want acended weapon. Why?
Do I look chinese to you people? Do you think my sole joy in life is mindlessly repeating the same thing thousands of times until I get blisters? Do you think I live in a closet and my mom has a no limit credit card? No actually my free time is limited… I actually have a job.

Groonz.7825:

I just don’t find tribulation mode concept to be fun at all. It’s a maze with a single route that you need to follow.

May have sounded cool and interesting on paper, but in practice it was a flop for me.

Then it wasn’t designed for you, which is ok. It was designed for me, who finds that sort of thing incredibly entertaining and worth doing over and over.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Groonz.7825:

I just don’t find tribulation mode concept to be fun at all. It’s a maze with a single route that you need to follow.

May have sounded cool and interesting on paper, but in practice it was a flop for me.

Then it wasn’t designed for you, which is ok. It was designed for me, who finds that sort of thing incredibly entertaining and worth doing over and over.

Mmos aren’t designed for you alone. Cupcake.

HiSaZuL.2843:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Groonz.7825:

I just don’t find tribulation mode concept to be fun at all. It’s a maze with a single route that you need to follow.

May have sounded cool and interesting on paper, but in practice it was a flop for me.

Then it wasn’t designed for you, which is ok. It was designed for me, who finds that sort of thing incredibly entertaining and worth doing over and over.

Mmos aren’t designed for you alone. Cupcake.

Well done. Thankfully that’s not what I said. But if you can’t follow along, that’s alright. I wasn’t talking to you.

HiSaZuL.2843:

Heres a fun fact about “frustration and spend $$$ mode” I pixel compared specifically jumping into exact same spot 6 times. 1 continue basically. First 4 times I died… then i got rubberbanded and died and ONLY ONCE did I not simply not die at my 0th life I was able to walk all around that spot w/o falling into lava/rockets/anything else.

No its not challenging. Its a good business strategy to force perfectionists/achivement whores/really bored/in need of attention/etc to buy stuff from cash shop. But nothing past that.
Kind of like being forced into dailies if you want acended weapon. Why?
Do I look chinese to you people? Do you think my sole joy in life is mindlessly repeating the same thing thousands of times until I get blisters? Do you think I live in a closet and my mom has a no limit credit card? No actually my free time is limited… I actually have a job.

I can tell by your user name that you’re a classy dude, and probably have a fair to high opinion of your abilities. But I’m sorry to say that the problems you had were not in the game, they were on your end. Rubberbanding is on your system, and simply failing to make the jump if on your skill. There isn’t a single jump in the game that can’t be made normally with the appropriate level of skill. It isn’t shameful if you lack it, but it is a bit to then complain about the system and the company and the game just because you fail.

Pfft great job on failing to read. And also good job on making some bizzare classification theory based on name?
I’m sorry but going by that you flaunting your characters in your every post is a much bigger indication of self importance.
I have not failed any jumps. I made exact same jump to exact same spot with diviation in no more then a few dozen pixels in 4 cases I died in 2 I did not. If you can’t grasp the point of that statement what does that say about your so called “skills”.
And on that topic this game has never required skills. Of any kind. The only people that talk about “skills” are those who need attention or to reaffirm their self imposed importance. I hate to break it to you but just because you think you have “skill” doesn’t actually make it so… imaginary concept or otherwise.

HiSaZuL.2843:

Pfft great job on failing to read. And also good job on making some bizzare classification theory based on name?
I’m sorry but going by that you flaunting your characters in your every post is a much bigger indication of self importance.
I have not failed any jumps. I made exact same jump to exact same spot with diviation in no more then a few dozen pixels in 4 cases I died in 2 I did not. If you can’t grasp the point of that statement what does that say about your so called “skills”.
And on that topic this game has never required skills. Of any kind. The only people that talk about “skills” are those who need attention or to reaffirm their self imposed importance. I hate to break it to you but just because you think you have “skill” doesn’t actually make it so… imaginary concept or otherwise.

Well I certainly lack skill where interpreting your posts is concerned because I have no idea what you’re talking about, pretty much from beginning to end. I don’t understand what you mean by “flaunting” my characters. I’m unclear on your concept of making pixel perfect jumps. It sounds like you just missed 4 times and lagged a 5th. I’m mostly unable to interpret your point, short of you don’t like it and you’re not Chinese.

You tell me that MMOs are not made for one person, but then you act like if they’re not made for you they’re not made right. Well, I hate to break it to you, but the same logic applies. It’s made for me, and I’m not the only person like me playing the game. So it hasn’t gone to waste. You don’t like it, fine, done play it, it wasn’t made for you in the first place.

Kal Spiro.9745:

HiSaZuL.2843:

Pfft great job on failing to read. And also good job on making some bizzare classification theory based on name?
I’m sorry but going by that you flaunting your characters in your every post is a much bigger indication of self importance.
I have not failed any jumps. I made exact same jump to exact same spot with diviation in no more then a few dozen pixels in 4 cases I died in 2 I did not. If you can’t grasp the point of that statement what does that say about your so called “skills”.
And on that topic this game has never required skills. Of any kind. The only people that talk about “skills” are those who need attention or to reaffirm their self imposed importance. I hate to break it to you but just because you think you have “skill” doesn’t actually make it so… imaginary concept or otherwise.

Well I certainly lack skill where interpreting your posts is concerned because I have no idea what you’re talking about, pretty much from beginning to end. I don’t understand what you mean by “flaunting” my characters. I’m unclear on your concept of making pixel perfect jumps. It sounds like you just missed 4 times and lagged a 5th. I’m mostly unable to interpret your point, short of you don’t like it and you’re not Chinese.

You are absolutely correct you do lack reading skill. Please elaborate how does one land in same spot die to rockets/lava or survive by not making a jump. Or hell at least elaborate how in your vocabulary landing equals not making a jump. I really want to hear that one.

Also… when ip of a last server that is registered to nc has a 92% packet loss… elaborate how that is a problem on my end. I also would like to hear that. I get no packet loss anywhere else on 25 servers before that one.
Hell I’m streaming movie… uploading a 2 gig photoshop render and none of those activities meet “lag”. Please do share your infinite tech knowledge so I may bask in its glory and fix “my end”.

You’re having syncing issues and lag. That’s why you die even though it appears you landed correctly because your client and the server disagree with your position. That’s also why you rubberband. The simple fact is, somewhere between you and the server is failing you. It has nothing to do with glitch game mechanics. I, and more than enough other people can attest to having never experienced those issues even once. If the game itself was glitchy that wouldn’t be possible. Everyone would have had to experience the problem at least once. If an entire subset of people have no idea what you’re talking about then the problem isn’t in the base game. It’s something that is happening between you and them.

As for streaming and uploading, that doesn’t have even half of the intricacies of a real time game. It also has protocols set up to compensate for lag that the game simply can’t account for, let alone accomplish.

Hope that helps.

Please educate yourself by opening tech support.
Protocols… you really want to try sounding more knowledgeable then you are? I’m sorry but this is no different then super-mega hdmi cable that costs 50 bucks and cheap one for 2 bucks example. Signal is digital it doesn’t matter if one is made of pure gold and the other from barely holding together copper wire. If it was analog… that would be a different story.
Same with this game… those “intricacies” you speak of do not exist. Everything is handled by a server if server has a packet loss its not issues of anything other then server.
Its impossible to not sink a landing position(getting rubberbanding on z coordinate up and down doesn’t affect your x/y coordinates). Yes lag fest would affect actual long jumping where you can’t under jump even a tiny amount. But jumping down… on same spot and either being shot by rockets/falling thru… or none of those happening has nothing to do with syncinking. Its pathetic excuse for coding and horrible collision boxes on invisible traps.
Even if I raged like a boss when I played contra… It was hard… but it did NOT have invisible maybe traps. Nor was it affected by outside factors such as being too cheap to have your servers work properly. Yes sure anet has no bloody say in it they don’t own them since they are registered to nc hell they don’t even own the ip rights for this title… fine I admit that much but you know what… its same as don’t like it don’t play it excuse. It wears off at some point. Same as racist excuse and holocaust excuse and any other excuse you make when you can’t put a proper argument to defend your claims.

showtime.9175:

I’m permanently carrying 750 baubles and have now started to deposit them in my bank whenever I get out of SAB. I bought the ICC initially, but I realize it wasn’t at all necessary. 750 baubles represents 150 lives. You can max out on coins in a single tribulation mode level. Do you really die more than 150 times per level? If the answer is yes, I would recommend trying infantile or normal mode.

I don’t believe that you couldn’t get past the rapids, since those were nerfed extremely hard by the recent update. They’re a joke now.

Tribulation Mode is meant to be challenging. It doesn’t reward anything gamebreaking. You don’t even get a new skin, only a new color. Why do so many people complain on the forums until the challenging content gets removed from those it was made for. I liked it much better pre-nerf.

Wait….you bought the ICC and are now PAYING for regular ones? Might I ask why you are jumping through inventory and merchant hoops when you already bought the keys to the store?

Also… when ip of a last server that is registered to nc has a 92% packet loss… elaborate how that is a problem on my end. I also would like to hear that. I get no packet loss anywhere else on 25 servers before that one.

That would be the fault of the route AFTER the NC server (granted….that would be NCs responsibility to get fixed). However, If you have 25 router hops between the server and you, there may be another issue here….have you investigated using another server world that has LESS connection hops? I have no idea where you are located, but English is obviously not your primary language (and your posts ARE very difficult to understand…..but you are doing an ok job of verbalizing your frustration). Your complaint about your specific lag issues are not actually relevant to the original discussion, however.

Thanks for the brunt of your obviously considerable knowledge. I’m not sure what you think you proved, but I am certain it isn’t what you intended.

It is obvious to anyone who actually does understand these things that you are suffering from lag more than anything else. Contra didn’t rely on a server for anything in the first place. The point of Tribulation Mode is invisible traps. No one brought up IP right nor server ownership, nor is it relevant to the conversation because of course ANet operates their servers. How does, don’t like it don’t play it wear off? It is the basis of all gameplay, and in some ways is the business model. You’re dangerously close to Godwin’s Law there, especially since that doesn’t make any sense here.

Brother Grimm.5176:

showtime.9175:

I’m permanently carrying 750 baubles and have now started to deposit them in my bank whenever I get out of SAB. I bought the ICC initially, but I realize it wasn’t at all necessary. 750 baubles represents 150 lives. You can max out on coins in a single tribulation mode level. Do you really die more than 150 times per level? If the answer is yes, I would recommend trying infantile or normal mode.

I don’t believe that you couldn’t get past the rapids, since those were nerfed extremely hard by the recent update. They’re a joke now.

Tribulation Mode is meant to be challenging. It doesn’t reward anything gamebreaking. You don’t even get a new skin, only a new color. Why do so many people complain on the forums until the challenging content gets removed from those it was made for. I liked it much better pre-nerf.

Wait….you bought the ICC and are now PAYING for regular ones? Might I ask why you are jumping through inventory and merchant hoops when you already bought the keys to the store?

I’m going with pride.

I’m phasing out my ICC as well. I’m really glad I bought it, I support SAB and it’s a way to indicate that, but I’m finding it wasn’t nearly as necessary as I had originally suspected. It’s just convenient.

SAB is awesome, but I do think its gone down hill, a lot. It used to be fun (world 1 is still kinda fun), but now with World 2 (even after the current changes), its not fun anymore. I really dislike World 2. My main problem is just the length of the zones. Would much prefer they split the zones up into more zones (at least cut each in half). Its not fun trying to get through such long zones.

I am proud to say that I finished all of World 2 yesterday without a guide <3 It was impossible for me before the patch, but all the bug fixes make it absolutely doable now. It took me several hours. Yes. I used the infinite coin. Yes. I got frustrated a lot. Yes. But I made it. And I am proud of it and glad it wasn’t easier, because if it was, I wouldn’t have a reason to be proud right now.

As for tribulation mode: there is no reason to make it easier, as long as there is one person that manages to finish it. It is MEANT to be super hard and not doable for a huge number of people. Not sure If I will be able to do World 2…World 1 I did and it was a lot of FUN!!!

The only issue I am having is the length of the zones in world 2 combined with crash issues – if your game crashes to no fault of your own you have to start all over and THAT truly annoys me.

No, SAB has not been ruined.

SAB is still great like it always was, but some casual players might find it less appealing due to slightly increased difficulty.