Guild Wars 2

Dedlaw.9130:

As it stands WvW and JPs have as little to do with each other as dungeons and WvW have to do with each other. They should never have been mixed together

Well, then also tell the other guys that complain because they have to do the WvW JP that WvW is WvW. It can’t be compared to other PvE JPs. The other guy above always tried to explain it was PvE… while that JP is in a WvW area.

Nobody is forced to get that achievement. It is a PvP achievement. By placing the cache there it is a PvP achievement. You can’t just say it is a PvE achievement… PvE players are forced to go there.

It’s PvP. Just because if you go there at a time when it’s empty it is possible to do it without fighting others does not mean it is PvE.

Crab Toss I also could say: PvE… I just need to take the Crab and ran around and if others do not hit me it is PvE. Still it is PvP… and even with achievements based on luck like the Crabtacular – there you could also grief others… just by staying alive denying them the Crabtacular(where all others including you need to get steamrolled by the Karka).

Now did they nerf it? No! They even brought more stuff like that and even the WvW JP. I think it is intended and they will continue this way. It is okay since it is only 1 achievement. And nobody is forced to get it.

Don’t talk about carrots… they would need to nerf the dungeon for WvW players too if they nerfed the Cache achievement for PvE players.

There are a lot of players that play PvE Open World stuff and they are now forced into the dungeon when the other stuff(except the Flame and Frost dungeon… which was easy and NULL which was only 1 achievement and 1 fight) was possible solo.

If they nerf Blackout Cache(or stop placing achievements in WvW for the next living story content) then I want: 1 solo dungeon(like with Canach and NULL) and max 1 achivement with a explorable dungeon that can be for groups(and with huge rewads – don’t mind that since these can be bought and sold at TP).

But not 6 dungeon achievements like now… where 3 are supposed to be harder for the people that like hard stuff… and the other 3 should be possible… and then you go with random group and can’t even get the basic 3 achievements(killing bosses and /salute) cause you constantly die at the first boss – because it is harder with randoms.

This should be for permanent dungeons… where you can train as much as you want(or 1 achivement only and explor and the others in a solo dungeon – I don’t mind if the solo dungeon is hard… only looking for groups is a problem if if there are a lot of people that only die at the boss).

Luthan.5236:

Dedlaw.9130:

As it stands WvW and JPs have as little to do with each other as dungeons and WvW have to do with each other. They should never have been mixed together

Well, then also tell the other guys that complain because they have to do the WvW JP that WvW is WvW. It can’t be compared to other PvE JPs. The other guy above always tried to explain it was PvE… while that JP is in a WvW area.

Nobody is forced to get that achievement. It is a PvP achievement. By placing the cache there it is a PvP achievement. You can’t just say it is a PvE achievement… PvE players are forced to go there.

It’s PvP. Just because if you go there at a time when it’s empty it is possible to do it without fighting others does not mean it is PvE.

Crab Toss I also could say: PvE… I just need to take the Crab and ran around and if others do not hit me it is PvE. Still it is PvP… and even with achievements based on luck like the Crabtacular – there you could also grief others… just by staying alive denying them the Crabtacular(where all others including you need to get steamrolled by the Karka).

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not against the camping/ganking/whatever. As you say it IS WvW after all. Yes, I find it annoying, but so is being spiked by a thief. Annoyances come with the territory. What I’m kitten ed about is that Anet put the JP there in the first place, and as if that isn’t bad enough they now added a limited-time only piece of bait there.

finally got it done and that is an experience i don’t EVER want to repeat.

Calixtus.8617:

So what has The Mists and the Obsidian JP got to do with Aetherblade Sky Pirates?

Out of order putting this Cache in here.

Some people love PvP and WvW and don’t want to leave it.

Putting an achievement in there is a GOOD thing. Those folks can get one of the 12 they need without having to leave WvW. They still need to leave for the other 11 though.

And if you don’t like it, there are some 19 to 20, but you only need 12… so you can be like me, and get the mini-pet, without doing this one.

I started into it, and then decided against it. I’m not a PvPer, and I didn’t need that one, so I went and did another one instead.

But I really like that this was there for the PvPers. In future, they should make a list of “do x of these 3x achievements”, and then put 1.5x in PvE, and 1.5x in PvP/ WvW.
- So that the PvPers never have to leave their place at all. I’ve got one guildies (one of my co-GMs) who has one character that other than coming on dungeon runs never leaves WvW. I’ve known people who never leave WvW or the mists after character creation. The game is not just for me as a PvEer, but also for them.

Draknar.5748:

laharl.8435:

Draknar.5748:

This whole post is a perfect example of why having a good guild is crucial in this game. My guild did a guild run (8 of us) through this JP. Made it easy and grief-free. I will say, however, that we killed every red dot we came across while we made our way to the top. Nothing personal, just kinda the point of WvW. We didn’t camp the top or anything, just killed as we passed. <— that’s the proper way to kill people in the JP.

Camping an area is honestly just lame. It’s frowned upon in FPS games, and its frowned upon here.

Actually camping high ground (or supply rich, choke points etc.) is a valid tactic in most FPS games. You think a valid tactic that competition teams engage in is weak, but you think 8 versus 1 ganking in GW2 is legit. In FPS, teams are equal, there are counter measures for campers. There is no counter measure for 8 vs 1.

FPS is a team A versus team B where there is an actual tactical advantage like you said. You can actually win the match. And camping is frowned upon. Never said it wasn’t a viable strategy in FPS, just…an annoying one. I mean, sit in one spot and click mouse when you see someone walk by = lame (but effective).

The JP isn’t a match, it’s a JP. You don’t win anything from camping the top. You are just a griefer at that point.

Killing people on your way to the top is very different from camping the top and constantly killing anyone who comes by. If you are on the path up the JP and you see 8 red dots coming, get out of the way, hide, I don’t care. We won’t hunt you down, but if you are within attacking distance, you will be attacked. PvP does not need to include griefing.

Heck, if we notice we’ve killed a certain person a couple of times, we will consciously stop attacking them because we don’t want to be jack-kittens. If they have the tenacity to keep attempting that JP then who are we to just keep killing them. We prove nothing other than the fact we are kitten-holes if we do that, and trust me, I’ve definitely been on the end that keeps being killed.

When the same group of 3-4 kill you for the 6th time, you start to think “OK guys, it’s obvious you can kill me, can’t you just let me finish the JP and move on with my life?”

Oh the irony of thinking it’s legit to 8 vs 1 against non-combatants, but not legit to camp in an FPS, when teams are equal and a good team can easily overcome campers.

Not necessarily.

Anonymity tends to change the way people act, most notably enhancing boldness.

Even the most introvert, timid person has the potential to be troll or griever when hiding behind anonymity. The lack of repercussions gives them the confidence to act online in ways they wouldn’t in real life

While there is certainly some truth to this, if the only thing keeping people from being kittens in real life are the “repercussions” (jail time, getting beat up), then they are kittens. And if the person sitting at the computer derives pleasure from causing others annoyance or aggravation (or generating any negative emotion for that matter), then that person is an kitten. The things that give someone pleasure do not change 180 degrees just because that person sat down at a computer.

laharl.8435:

Draknar.5748:

laharl.8435:

Draknar.5748:

This whole post is a perfect example of why having a good guild is crucial in this game. My guild did a guild run (8 of us) through this JP. Made it easy and grief-free. I will say, however, that we killed every red dot we came across while we made our way to the top. Nothing personal, just kinda the point of WvW. We didn’t camp the top or anything, just killed as we passed. <— that’s the proper way to kill people in the JP.

Camping an area is honestly just lame. It’s frowned upon in FPS games, and its frowned upon here.

Actually camping high ground (or supply rich, choke points etc.) is a valid tactic in most FPS games. You think a valid tactic that competition teams engage in is weak, but you think 8 versus 1 ganking in GW2 is legit. In FPS, teams are equal, there are counter measures for campers. There is no counter measure for 8 vs 1.

FPS is a team A versus team B where there is an actual tactical advantage like you said. You can actually win the match. And camping is frowned upon. Never said it wasn’t a viable strategy in FPS, just…an annoying one. I mean, sit in one spot and click mouse when you see someone walk by = lame (but effective).

The JP isn’t a match, it’s a JP. You don’t win anything from camping the top. You are just a griefer at that point.

Killing people on your way to the top is very different from camping the top and constantly killing anyone who comes by. If you are on the path up the JP and you see 8 red dots coming, get out of the way, hide, I don’t care. We won’t hunt you down, but if you are within attacking distance, you will be attacked. PvP does not need to include griefing.

Heck, if we notice we’ve killed a certain person a couple of times, we will consciously stop attacking them because we don’t want to be jack-kittens. If they have the tenacity to keep attempting that JP then who are we to just keep killing them. We prove nothing other than the fact we are kitten-holes if we do that, and trust me, I’ve definitely been on the end that keeps being killed.

When the same group of 3-4 kill you for the 6th time, you start to think “OK guys, it’s obvious you can kill me, can’t you just let me finish the JP and move on with my life?”

Oh the irony of thinking it’s legit to 8 vs 1 against non-combatants, but not legit to camp in an FPS, when teams are equal and a good team can easily overcome campers.

What do you mean legit to 8v1? We aren’t running around hunting solos lol, we are trying to do a jumping puzzle in a WvWvW setting and kill as we go up. That is the whole point of having it in a WvWvW. It’s like getting kitten that you were rolled by 10 people while roaming open Borderlands or EB. You should kind of expect it. Camping in this particular situation is griefing.

I’m confident that you are playing dumb for the sake of argument if you are saying you don’t understand the difference between griefing and killing someone.

A good team can overcome campers. That’s 100% correct (hence my original post about getting a group together). My guild is the group that clears out the campers. They are almost always terrible players and people thank us when we give the all clear.

To address OP’s concerns, a solo person cannot get up there while a group is camping it. Period.

I know you were trying to make it seem ironic (please learn how to use that word) that I would think 8v1 is legit and not camping, but that’s a simplification of what I said and then taken out of context. With my group people don’t complain since we kill you and are on our way to finish our own business. Griefers/campers are there specifically to kill you and cause frustration over and over and laugh about it.

VERY different and I’m confident that intelligent people will see that. You obviously won’t.

To summarize: We delay completion of the JP (unless you just get out of the way, we don’t want to chase people down, we want to finish the JP like everyone else) griefers prevent completion.

I might also add that on plenty of occasions we don’t attack people at all. Generally if we are starting the JP and see a lot of our server peeps dead we will make the conscious decision to kill all red on the way up. If everyone seems to be peaceful and happy, why rock the boat.

If everyone could be mature and civilized about it, there would be less QQ on forums. But people like you try to justify the camping because, let’s face it, you genuinely enjoy doing it. You can picture them at their monitors swearing and pounding their fists on their keyboard and it gives you joy. You are the problem.

I believe it is not wrong of ANet to put an achievement in a WvW area – they are the programmers, it is their godly right.

I believe it is not wrong of players to camp in the WvW areas killing others and making an annoyance of themselves – its a free world.

However, I believe it is folly of ANet to turn a blind eye to this. Players camping there are not mindless sadists. They are there exploiting easy kills to advance their world ability points and realm avenger achievement. And its not just any harmless exploit – it is causing a lot grief to other players.

My suggestion to solve this issue is to reduce the requirements for Caching Out achievement to 6 instead of 7. Additionally, increasing the Blackout Cache (Obsidian Sanctum part) achievement rewards to 15 instead of 5. This then would satisfy the argument for PvE players remain in PvE world to get their achievement maxed and hardcore WvW could still get good achievement points while remaining in their WvW world. It also makes sense that a harder JP should be rewarded with more achievement points. Additionally, it also promotes the true spirit of JPs in WvW – team and co-operative play against other factions/worlds. And with teams sloughing it out, it would also discourage campers from exploiting easy kills.

I invite ANet to consider the suggestion and post their thoughts on this.

Considering that right now my server has 0 castles in EB, I feel like they should make the entrances to the JP be right at the entrance to EB. That way you don’t have to take up space and you don’t have to have a castle to do this…cause right now I wanted to do this with a friend of mine, but cannot because we don’t have a castle.

RyuDragnier.9476:

Considering that right now my server has 0 castles in EB, I feel like they should make the entrances to the JP be right at the entrance to EB. That way you don’t have to take up space and you don’t have to have a castle to do this…cause right now I wanted to do this with a friend of mine, but cannot because we don’t have a castle.

Before the server switch in WvW this had not occurred to me. I was in Obsidian Sanctum (again being camped by a different server this time) and the game crashed on me… Wonderful.

Logged back in and tried to go back to EB and… “Would you like to Queue?” great… So i’ve now been queuing for an hour and cannot get into EB to access Obsidian Sanctum. This in turn is Blocking progress.

Anet, I love you and everything, but you REALLY didn’t think this one through very well did you?

Time to put a stop to all this hate mail and just move the chest to the beginning of the jump puzzle… OR even just put it in the dark room as the title suggests. Come on, I’m actually really disappointed no-one from Anet has commented yet!

Your posting has been removed due to the following reasons: Please do not engage in personal attacks or character assassination against forum members. Posts that attack another member, single out a player for ridicule, or accuse someone of inappropriate in-game actions will be removed without notice.
You have recieved 1 Infraction Point.

Can someone explain, this infraction point was because of naming guild and server that was farming other people or because of following statement?

So much fun for such perverts

I was in the, “This is optional, don’t whine” camp, but then I realized that this achievement adds up to a meta achievement as well (caching out) meaning if you’ve gotten all of the other caches you need to do this one as well in order to get that over-arching cache achievement. When you’re dealing with the alternative of farming holo aetherblades or dungeon achievements that require an organized group, that meta achievement really begins to mean a lot.

Man is this beginning to get really frustrating. I went through the whole darn thing for the cache (I got all of the other caches, so getting this one would net me two achievements, making it something I REALLY want to do) only to get ganked and killed at the end by 10 or so players who were just camping the end of the puzzle to kill others and prevent them from getting the cache. They all started jumping up and down on my corpse and /laughed over and over again. It was adding insult to injury.

Now I’ve just had a really huge amount of time wasted, and with no checkpoints or anything to speak of my only option is to do the ENTIRE thing all over again, only for a chance to get murdered and laughed at again. Why is this PvP achievement bundled with all of the PvE achievements in order to get the meta achievement? I could totally understand if it were some bonus cache I could get for a bonus achievement, but requiring this one in order to get “Caching out” is frustrating.

On top of this, some other players are getting pretty frustrated as well. I’ve seen some of the most foul and horrible language in /say I’ve ever seen in the course of the game. Players typing four letter words in all caps and calling the enemy team some pretty unsightly things, even though they can’t be heard. It all adds up to a pretty hostile and frustrating atmosphere.

I think having this achievement is a good idea, but I definitely would have recommended selecting a jumping puzzle in which the possibility of griefing players /dancing and /laughing over my corpse wasn’t a possibility.

anet makes a living story achievement a wvw player might actually get…and most of pve looses there minds…

i know hard to imagine that anet might actually give something to wvw players but wow thanks now i might actually try and get something other then the fireworks one(got it because wvw shut down and i ran threw la at the right time i gess)

I have just completed the puzzle thanks to people on others servers on the same boat as me.

Basically if you select an enemy and open party, you can invite them to a party and communicate with them. We worked together to complete the puzzle and asked our servers not to attack the others. A Huge amount of people completed the Puzzle tonight and got the achievements thanks to those who simply wanted to get the job done.

I have to say I was super psyched when I got to the end, I was soooo happy. But it doesn’t change the fact that I still think it was a bad move by Anet and they should never do something like this ever again!

It’s anonymity both ways too.

You don’t know who they are, and they don’t know who you are. So they aren’t killing a name, they’re just killing random invaders, creating a further disconnect from responsibility. I guess it’s a good thing to stop flaming, but it also means they won’t get called out for being camping trolls either.

All I have to say is, whatever Dev had the bright idea to put a Living Story achievement buried into a WvW jumping puzzle was a truly evil mastermind.

I have an organized 12 player team within our guild, and we primarily do dungeon runs and WvW together. We all play together and can swap in and out of 5 man teams without messing up group comp or coordination. When we saw the Obsidian Sanctum cache on the achievement list, we grouped up, rolled through the puzzle and took control of the end point at the top of the Sanctum, and camped there for an hour. Why would we do such a terrible thing? We have 500 members in our guild, some of whom don’t do WvW or have never done the EB JP, or for whatever reason don’t have the means to get the achievement by themselves. We got about 40-50 guildies to the top of the JP, along with a number of other players on our server who were not in our guild. We probably killed about 10-15 people who made it to the top and attacked us, but there were also about another 20-30 players who came through during that time who had the good sense not to attack a large guild group, and we left them alone and let them finish. I know people camp the puzzle just to kill other players and be kittens about it, and I wouldn’t be surprised if the majority of the people camping are doing it just to kill people trying to finish, but not everyone camping there is trying to be an as*hole about it. We’re in the middle of a very tough match-up this week with Tarnished Coast and Fort Aspenwood. TC has been facerolling us for the past 7 days, and if we hadn’t camped the puzzle, a lot of people wouldn’t have been able to do it.

Tentonhammr.7849:

We’re in the middle of a very tough match-up this week with Tarnished Coast and Fort Aspenwood. TC has been facerolling us for the past 7 days, and if we hadn’t camped the puzzle, a lot of people wouldn’t have been able to do it.

I find this amusing as the biggest group I saw trolling and griefing the puzzle was from Kaineng. They didn’t stop until FA rolled though and killed them all. If you want to know why Kaineng was being killed a lot in Sanctum, that is why.

Thankfully the folks from Fort Aspenwood were kind enough to not kill everyone passing by and helped me to get it, despite being a TCer. My thanks to them.

Tentonhammr.7849:

I have an organized 12 player team within our guild, and we primarily do dungeon runs and WvW together. We all play together and can swap in and out of 5 man teams without messing up group comp or coordination. When we saw the Obsidian Sanctum cache on the achievement list, we grouped up, rolled through the puzzle and took control of the end point at the top of the Sanctum, and camped there for an hour. Why would we do such a terrible thing? We have 500 members in our guild, some of whom don’t do WvW or have never done the EB JP, or for whatever reason don’t have the means to get the achievement by themselves. We got about 40-50 guildies to the top of the JP, along with a number of other players on our server who were not in our guild. We probably killed about 10-15 people who made it to the top and attacked us, but there were also about another 20-30 players who came through during that time who had the good sense not to attack a large guild group, and we left them alone and let them finish. I know people camp the puzzle just to kill other players and be kittens about it, and I wouldn’t be surprised if the majority of the people camping are doing it just to kill people trying to finish, but not everyone camping there is trying to be an as*hole about it. We’re in the middle of a very tough match-up this week with Tarnished Coast and Fort Aspenwood. TC has been facerolling us for the past 7 days, and if we hadn’t camped the puzzle, a lot of people wouldn’t have been able to do it.

I have no problem with a guild going in and just making the place safe for their guildies. Or their server. But mostly what I’m seeing so far is just blatant griefing to prevent anyone from another server from making progress. I’m sure there’s probably people from my own server who aren’t entirely innocent about it either.

Of course, really I just blame ArenaNet for the ones who thought that this was a good idea. Making a WvW living story achievement is fine. Making that tie in to a larger achievement where the rest all just require PVE is not fine.

Pro tip. Run the puzzle during off hours; like nighttime, school hours, even dinnertime. Most likely kids wont be camping the puzzle for easy kills during those hours. Avoid doing it over the weekend and evening unless your ready to fight!

I don’t even know what to say other than this has made me very miserable.

I made peace with the fact that the three achievements from the dungeon I will never ever get, but now because of this ridiculous jumping puzzle I can’t even get the caches achievement.

I have never experienced this amount of frustration from a game before.

SynfulChaot.3169:

Tentonhammr.7849:

We’re in the middle of a very tough match-up this week with Tarnished Coast and Fort Aspenwood. TC has been facerolling us for the past 7 days, and if we hadn’t camped the puzzle, a lot of people wouldn’t have been able to do it.

I find this amusing as the biggest group I saw trolling and griefing the puzzle was from Kaineng. They didn’t stop until FA rolled though and killed them all. If you want to know why Kaineng was being killed a lot in Sanctum, that is why.

Thankfully the folks from Fort Aspenwood were kind enough to not kill everyone passing by and helped me to get it, despite being a TCer. My thanks to them.

Our campaign through the Sanctum was the day the patch came out. Our group is all officers and high ranking guild members and we actually gave instructions not to grief if we ported people up. I can assure you it wasn’t us. There has been, however, a little bit of frustration with the match-up this week, so perhaps there were some people on the Kaineng side who saw jp griefing as a way to get some revenge. Not my style, but I guess haters are gonna hate.

Tentonhammr.7849:

Our campaign through the Sanctum was the day the patch came out. Our group is all officers and high ranking guild members and we actually gave instructions not to grief if we ported people up. I can assure you it wasn’t us. There has been, however, a little bit of frustration with the match-up this week, so perhaps there were some people on the Kaineng side who saw jp griefing as a way to get some revenge. Not my style, but I guess haters are gonna hate.

Unless you’re part of the [Rats] guild, it was not yours.

SynfulChaot.3169:

Tentonhammr.7849:

Our campaign through the Sanctum was the day the patch came out. Our group is all officers and high ranking guild members and we actually gave instructions not to grief if we ported people up. I can assure you it wasn’t us. There has been, however, a little bit of frustration with the match-up this week, so perhaps there were some people on the Kaineng side who saw jp griefing as a way to get some revenge. Not my style, but I guess haters are gonna hate.

Unless you’re part of the [Rats] guild, it was not yours.

Lol I’ve never even heard of them. Either a very small guild or they keep a low profile.

Luthan.5236:

Well, then also tell the other guys that complain because they have to do the WvW JP that WvW is WvW. It can’t be compared to other PvE JPs. The other guy above always tried to explain it was PvE… while that JP is in a WvW area.

Nobody is forced to get that achievement. It is a PvP achievement. By placing the cache there it is a PvP achievement. You can’t just say it is a PvE achievement… PvE players are forced to go there.

It’s PvP. Just because if you go there at a time when it’s empty it is possible to do it without fighting others does not mean it is PvE.

Instead of picking apart your wall of text, and explaining yet again in detail, with examples, how wrong you are, I’ll make it simple this time.

Whoosh.

OmniPotentes.4817:

Pro tip. Run the puzzle during off hours; like nighttime, school hours, even dinnertime. Most likely kids wont be camping the puzzle for easy kills during those hours. Avoid doing it over the weekend and evening unless your ready to fight!

This would be true normally, but with summer vacation on, it’s a little less likely. But, still, it is the best option. I did mine during the wee-morning hours. So, you still have a valid point.

Ouch, all these horror stories.

Guess I was lucky. First time I went through the puzzle everyone just did their own thing. No one was really fighting each other or screwing each other up, and my only enemy was the puzzle itself.

Then again, I guess going on at a really off-hour helped.

Draknar.5748:

laharl.8435:

Draknar.5748:

laharl.8435:

Draknar.5748:

This whole post is a perfect example of why having a good guild is crucial in this game. My guild did a guild run (8 of us) through this JP. Made it easy and grief-free. I will say, however, that we killed every red dot we came across while we made our way to the top. Nothing personal, just kinda the point of WvW. We didn’t camp the top or anything, just killed as we passed. <— that’s the proper way to kill people in the JP.

Camping an area is honestly just lame. It’s frowned upon in FPS games, and its frowned upon here.

Actually camping high ground (or supply rich, choke points etc.) is a valid tactic in most FPS games. You think a valid tactic that competition teams engage in is weak, but you think 8 versus 1 ganking in GW2 is legit. In FPS, teams are equal, there are counter measures for campers. There is no counter measure for 8 vs 1.

FPS is a team A versus team B where there is an actual tactical advantage like you said. You can actually win the match. And camping is frowned upon. Never said it wasn’t a viable strategy in FPS, just…an annoying one. I mean, sit in one spot and click mouse when you see someone walk by = lame (but effective).

The JP isn’t a match, it’s a JP. You don’t win anything from camping the top. You are just a griefer at that point.

Killing people on your way to the top is very different from camping the top and constantly killing anyone who comes by. If you are on the path up the JP and you see 8 red dots coming, get out of the way, hide, I don’t care. We won’t hunt you down, but if you are within attacking distance, you will be attacked. PvP does not need to include griefing.

Heck, if we notice we’ve killed a certain person a couple of times, we will consciously stop attacking them because we don’t want to be jack-kittens. If they have the tenacity to keep attempting that JP then who are we to just keep killing them. We prove nothing other than the fact we are kitten-holes if we do that, and trust me, I’ve definitely been on the end that keeps being killed.

When the same group of 3-4 kill you for the 6th time, you start to think “OK guys, it’s obvious you can kill me, can’t you just let me finish the JP and move on with my life?”

Oh the irony of thinking it’s legit to 8 vs 1 against non-combatants, but not legit to camp in an FPS, when teams are equal and a good team can easily overcome campers.

snip

I wasn’t advocating camping the jp, if you’ve read any of my posts you’d know I am vehemently against it in this situation. I know I don’t want to be in that puzzle for hours trying to get the cache, I wouldn’t want to impose that punishment on others either. Some people do want to impede the progress of others, fine, it is a PvP area after all. But I still retain the right of thinking they’re kittens.

I personally don’t think killing everyone I pass in the jp is cool, many in this thread agree with me. You do think it is cool to kill them all, you have a bunch of people on your side too. I think you’re a kitten and you think I’m a carebear/crybaby, whatever. Just different opinions.

This JP is something I have never done before, so now I tried to get it for the Pirates event. It is no easy puzzle, but there are ways you can retry if you mess up a jump at each new stage. This is challenging, but not impossible.

But thanks to three morons from another opposing server, there is no way to get to the cache. They cowardly killed off every person emerging from that “menagerie area”.
This has to do nothing with PvP or that WvW is competitive. Its just a way of showing that you are total idiot. Sadly, I can’t post those guild tags or names to publicly humiliate them for their cowardice.
Killing off players in sight of the cache instead of denying them the access to the chest is even worse.

This complaint is also directed at Anet developers that put the event achievement in a zone that allows player kills. In the Developers Manifesto GuildWars 2 was about community, not stealing each others loot or experience, helping out each other. This is the complete opposite and was put there not accidentally, but by choice.
Shame on the person that made that decision to reward anti-social behaviour.

Eventide.3460:

I don’t even know what to say other than this has made me very miserable.

I made peace with the fact that the three achievements from the dungeon I will never ever get, but now because of this ridiculous jumping puzzle I can’t even get the caches achievement.

I have never experienced this amount of frustration from a game before.

This sums up the entire reason why ANet should never do this again. At no time should your customers ever feel this way about your product, which is suppose to entertain, much less because of the actions of other players.

Sad, but well said.

You just shut stop kittening whining. Just don’t to the achievement and gtfo out of this forums. Do I make 1000+++ posts about the dungeons in the other threads?

Nobody is forcing you do do the achievement…

but all you are doing is “omg whine whine whine whine whine I’m a hardcore PvE guy that does the hardest dungeon trololololol, I farm uber gear every day and have the strongest gear and 1000+gold but I get 1 shot in WvW – ArenaNet please only make PvE achievements as temporary achievements so I can get all the achievements and the WvW players are still forced to to the dungeons which is totally okay they are worth less than me”

That is kittened. As I said: If they removed WvW stuff from temporary monthly events they also should remove dungeons. Because I don’t like to do dungeons. I also paid for the game. Not only you “trololol I’m an uber PvE guy” guys paid.

I’m totally fine with the permanent dungeons… and you probably are fine with the other permanant WvW achievements(should we one day decide to to that stuff we could still do it).

The only problem is that this stuff now is temporary. That’s why everyone is whining. I can’t train for the dungeons for a few weeks… cause it will be gone soon…

So: No dungeons please. Solo instances are enough. If dungeons leave them permanently. Then you can remove the WvW stuff also.

But no: “Okay, nice PvE guy that pays 1000 of dollars for random boxes every day – we remove the Cache from WvW… but we sill leave the dungeons and others are forced to do them now – Pwned! we won’t wait until they are ready do do dungeons”.

obsidian sanctum is obviously meant for wvw ppl so if you are pve player you cannot have this achievement.

go away.

having a WvW jp part of TWO achievement is total bullkitten

it’s IMPOSSIBLE to do this if you’re in a high tier matchup, there are too many people killing each other.

Luthan.5236:

You just shut stop kittening whining. Just don’t to the achievement and gtfo out of this forums. Do I make 1000+++ posts about the dungeons in the other threads?

This is a Living World forum. A PvE forum, if you haven’t noticed. PvE people have every right to post there.

Astralporing.1957:

Luthan.5236:

You just shut stop kittening whining. Just don’t to the achievement and gtfo out of this forums. Do I make 1000+++ posts about the dungeons in the other threads?

This is a Living World forum. A PvE forum, if you haven’t noticed. PvE people have every right to post there.

But they should stop complaining that a WvW achievement is WvW… and trying to play with words saying “this is PvE”.

This:

obsidian sanctum is obviously meant for wvw ppl so if you are pve player you cannot have this achievement.

go away.

/signed

Everyone thinking different is wrong… and only playing with words because they don’t like to do WvW and want to get the achievement for free(and then complaining about others that want the dungeon to be nerfed because they dont’ like dungeons when complaining about Obsidian Sanctum is basically the same).

Astralporing.1957:

Luthan.5236:

You just shut stop kittening whining. Just don’t to the achievement and gtfo out of this forums. Do I make 1000+++ posts about the dungeons in the other threads?

This is a Living World forum. A PvE forum, if you haven’t noticed. PvE people have every right to post there.

WvW is part of the world, or hadn’t you noticed that when going for 100% world completion. I agree with the people that there is nothing wrong with the way the achievement is setup. The EB JP is build from the ground up to prevent other people from reaching the top. From traps, choke points to terrain advantage. It is build as a king of the hill type area. You control the top you control the puzzle and others have to knock you off.
This is NOT a PVE JP, you can not expect to go there and just breeze through. Even worse to expect a fair fight. Sure I’ll just wait until you finished that hard jump and get ready before I attack /sarcasm.
You want the achievement go organise your server to take the top from whoever is holding it. If you are not good enough than get better. You can get a whole army inside the dark area unseen if need be.
I spend months perfecting my skills in that JP. Why should the rest just be able to go up there without risk. Adapt or stop whining to be honest.

A non WvW player.

Although it is probably futile to explain to some posters here, I will make the effort.

The Obsidian Sanctum JP is NOT part of the WvW meta-game as WvW is played. Holding it does not earn you points needed to defeat the an opposing server. Therefore no world has an advantage at keeping it locked down for other players from other servers. The only reason would be to deny them access to WvW specific loot (badges, blueprints). If you think it is worth the cause, you can still set up a force at the end chest and lock down the access for players of an opposing world.

This thing is different though. The pirate cache is a bit away from the end chest. Killing people off when they emerge one by one from the menagerie area & across the dome (that’s where a team of three ganked me) is just a method of bullying players than came that far and exploiting the fact that you can pick them out one by one. This requires no skill in PvP. This is no tactical warfare in WvW. This is just a perfect spot to allow a handful of people to deny hundreds (potentially thousands) of people from two other servers a “Living World” achievement, which should be a fun event for all players.
If this would still be a cooperative game (no, it isn’t any more, developers have to take a look at their Manifesto video again), those players would let people get the cache and block access to the chest, making it clear that if you go further you will get killed.
As a few people a self centred and found a way to feel superior to others, this probably will not happen.

By neglecting the outcome of what will happen by putting the cache at this exact location, Arena.Net developers have either shown a complete misunderstanding of human behaviour, or have deliberately allowed a few morons to dictate the experience of the many. The later one could not be forgiven, as it shows a big disrespect to their customers.
For those, who are “completionists” or those who are after the Meta-Achievement, the Obsidian cache is a problem too. Not getting the JP means not getting the “complete cache” achievement, too. This means that you have no choice whether to play the dungeon or not. You have to complete it and you probably need to get an extra task achievement too. I am not sure how many non-hardcore-dungeon-runners really will go for that.

And before anyone can say: You don’t have to get the achievements or the Meta!
The Living Story updates were to supposed to fill the world with content, to make it feel alive and vibrant – to make it fun! Where is the fun in some of the decisions made for this part – especially if it is available for a limited time only?

Doesn’t your servers have the truce effect here? (no one attacks each other unless provoked?)

Cabpoint.5826:

Doesn’t your servers have the truce effect here? (no one attacks each other unless provoked?)

Problem is, you can discuss that and decide a truce. But it only requires two or three who don’t know and/or don’t care to ruin it for everybody else.

I salute Kaineng and Yak’s Bend for what happened yesterday night. Reset, and everybody was scrambling to get up to the top of Obsidian Sanctum for this cache. None of our 3 servers attacked each other, and we all managed to get it. That’s what I call being courteous to the other players in this mess.

Considering before that, EB had a team of 5 players (myself included) that wiped 8 DB spawncamping the JP just to free up the cache.

I don’t think I’ll be getting this one. Dragon ball was ok, sure there were those afkers to deal with, but this JP in WvW was just a horrible experience.

After a 30 min que and finally being able to get in. I find that the entrance is being camped by the Red server, 5 man full group, wait long enough and you have enough to push past them after a long fight. You get in about 20% and the Green server is also camping, where we get wiped. Back to start and there are 7+ Reds. People on your side leave and you can just go suicide and give them free bag as they dance on your dead body. At least I had the out manned buff as to not get armor damage.

Oh yeah, this was not fun… but at least I was able to get the meta another way.

Adding in my two cents. Stealthing through enemies to get to the end of the jumping puzzle is great fun, getting to the final room to find a 20 man ambush where one server is trolling the other two to prevent them getting the cache…

Is not fun.

Separate PvP and PvE distinctly, in that I mean that Dailies/Monthlies and Living Story Achievements should NEVER have PvP achievements in them.

There are already separate categories for those that enjoy PvP and they can do both, but don’t force those that want to do as much of the living story as possible to have to suffer through PvP encounters please.

I think this pretty much does it for me. I’m honestly not in much of a mood to play in general this weekend, but limited-time content is limited, so I went ahead and forced myself through the Goemm’s Lab one and was about to carry on. Then I look up the other achievements and find out about this…

I endured this crap around the time of release to get the JP achievement, and I’m not about to do it again. Truth be told, I really, really love this jumping puzzle outside of the PvP element and would have liked to see MORE of the game follow in its footsteps in that respect (The Dredgehaunt mini-dungeon is the only other thing that comes close). But the PvP is frustrating enough to just completely kill it for me, ruining what would have otherwise been my favourite area in the game. And I’m not going to bang my head against that wall again, especially since this stuff isn’t sticking around all that long and I’d HAVE to do it on their schedule…

Between this and the dungeon achievements, it’s just going to be a future of incomplete achievement tabs (I should mention that I loathe the notion of achievements in the first place, but OCD reigns supreme), so I think I’m out.

I really think they should do what I suggested they do with this JP. Since it’s technically out of WvW (as in you get no points for it), why not just make a portal that sends you to a PvE version of it in Lion’s Arch, without people having to fight each other or anything. I know that sounds stupid, but then we’ll have 2 versions of it, a PvE version, and a PvP (WvW) version.

Celebratty.1632:

You guys need to calm down.

While PvE players are giving reasonable answers, the ‘omgsopro’ PvP players are just insulting people and flaming. You people are the ones who say ‘lol who cares’ when some newbie excitedly proclaims he hit 80 on his first toon or has to one-up people every time they mention some achievement. I’m not giving my stance on the argument, but I will say I actively play WvW AND PvE. The name-calling is completely unnecessary and irrelevant.

If that’s what your PvP/WvW community is like then I am very sorry for you. I can’t, and won’t, speak for most people that PvP/WvW. I can speak for myself though and say that if someone said that I would congratulate them and encourage them to join WvW. That said, I don’t have any sympathy for carebears. Once you cross that line from scripted no brainer content into a world where opponents will think you are asking for what you get. Opponents will think, if you attack one and he can’t take you he won’t act like an npc. He will get some friends and they will come roll your kitten . Maybe he will employ a tactic you didn’t even know he could do (guardian teleports seem to always catch noobs by surprise).

There is a world of difference, and now PvE people get to see what it’s like playing in a place where opponents aren’t nice. That’s why the are carebears. They play in a place where the enemies are dumb, and not out for blood. I think we all realize it takes certain skills to be good at PvE. Carebear doesn’t mean they aren’t skilled at that, just that they come from a place of rainbows and sunshine. A place where they can walk 20 feet without getting a backstab, or portal bombed etc.

I can promise you though that the day PvE people stop getting rewarded based off my/my servers hard work, and gold spent in wvw I will drop it.

Just wanna give a shout-out to the SoR players willing to call a truce while we escorted a few carebears up OS.

I just tried it and all I wanted to do was get through the puzzle and get the cache and the chest. Didn’t want to bother anyone else and would have helped other people in other servers if it had been allowed with my portal, but I can’t. Yet I get into there and 10 players from Yaks [me] guild are just camping to kill.

Really explain to me what purpose it serves for 10 or so players to just camp and kill other players? Are you like closest sadist or something. I sure know if I met you in person I would not like you because you are the type to laugh at other peoples misery.

It also bothers me that ANet would even allow this and then put an achievement in it.

What Gorani said and said well. The mere fact that certain posters cannot support their point with naming calling and saying people are ‘whiners’ pretty much speaks for itself.

If nothing else, look at the example after example of the posters denied the achievement in this thread, not because they couldn’t do it, but because opposing players denied them completely. And not because there’s a gain in WvW for the jumping puzzle, but because . . . well, because of their own agendas.

Hopefully, developers who read this thread will realize that and make appropriate changes in the future.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Hopefully, developers who read this thread will realize that and make appropriate changes in the future.

Oh, they knew exactly what would happen. That’s why they did it.

Its an interesting place out where they could’ve to put a cache, I wouldnt say its the best idea to revive the puzzle with though. Theres a flora of traps usable by players but theyre never used which is kinda dissapointing if you expected them. Just not profitable is the problem. Rather then inserting a new incentive for completion they should’ve given traps a pay off. That or have some champ or the like pirates operating the traps.

This is what I done to get the achievement this time. Before going in, I told myself don’t take it Personal (which is what a lot of people do). You are gonna die many times anyway just Relax enjoy the puzzle, don’t worry about the campers, team up to take back chokes and use whatever means you got to go undetected, but always help your team so they can help you….In other words actively participate in the puzzle the way it was meant to be played.

I am on top tier world so it was a constant fight no matter what time of the day. I know how hard it is for guys that are on low pops cause I used to be on one too. My only suggestion for you guys is to try and go at a time when you know the enemy is sleeping.

Getting all bent out of shape is not helping you. Insanity = Doing the same thing and expecting different results. If you want to succeed and what you are trying is not getting results try changing your tactics. Give in to the idea that you are not just gonna run to the cache, try helping your team and working together, plan for it, and ask for all the help you can get.

There’s a very simple solution which a few people have already mentioned – require 6 out of 7 caches for the caching out meta achievement. Still a plenty hard achievement without the wvw JP, or whatever one JP it is you just can’t get through.