Guild Wars 2

I really don’t like the idea of putting pve story content into wvw. When I went for it, JQ was being annoying and camping the top of arena and dark room. They had a huge zerg (30+) just sitting there, killing anyone that tried to go through. It took until SoR organized a bigger zerg (40-50) to wipe JQ’s zerg for anyone not JQ to get through (props to SoR btw, only time I’ll ever cheer for you guys as BG!). And then things were fine for a while until SoR decided that they didn’t want anyone up top either and started wiping everyone from jp.

I left after that, because BG generally doesn’t care about jp unless our commander really wants siege. Which is sad whenever I want to run it, and find it camped by JQ.

It was the most annoying jp run I’ve ever done in a long while. Dark room was near impossible because JQ kept randomly shooting attacks and dropping marks, traps, and wells all over the place. You couldn’t do a lot of the jumps without swiftness while in combat, which isn’t always available depending on your class/setup. Not to mention the torch itself dealt damage if you tried to light a place up, meaning even if you didn’t want to fight/others didn’t want to fight, you were being put into combat regardless.

To be fair, I don’t think most of the players were actually trying to kill others. It was really only a couple. But if their target fought back, the rest of the zerg would kill em, making it an impossible to win situation.

So yeah, JQ camping jp as usual, dark room being more of a pain than usual, and top of the arena camped by massive zergs usually only seen in open field wvw. Not my idea of good story content.

This whole post is a perfect example of why having a good guild is crucial in this game. My guild did a guild run (8 of us) through this JP. Made it easy and grief-free. I will say, however, that we killed every red dot we came across while we made our way to the top. Nothing personal, just kinda the point of WvW. We didn’t camp the top or anything, just killed as we passed. <— that’s the proper way to kill people in the JP.

Camping an area is honestly just lame. It’s frowned upon in FPS games, and its frowned upon here.

It’s a terrible idea, and here’s why:

Anet is corralling PvEers into the one of the more difficult jumping puzzles…THE most grief-conducive area of the game. Many of these PvEers would struggle running this JP even if there were no PvP involved. But tacking on the fact that it’s going to be (already is) heavily camped by groups of people who know the puzzle inside and out and this is nothing but a case of lambs being led to slaughter.

Now I know a lot of players get their jollies griefing other players or scoring easy kills, but there’s simply no defending this. If you’re the type of person who likes beating down helpless victims, then live it up. Have the time of your life. But don’t pretend this is anything other than a massacre of the meek.

FYI

I added a note and link about the Mystic Fountains to the wiki Caching Out page, although you need to actually go to the Obsidian Sanctum page for their locations. I’ll try to get more detailed info to put it on the wiki.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Caching_Out

Draknar.5748:

This whole post is a perfect example of why having a good guild is crucial in this game. My guild did a guild run (8 of us) through this JP. Made it easy and grief-free. I will say, however, that we killed every red dot we came across while we made our way to the top. Nothing personal, just kinda the point of WvW. We didn’t camp the top or anything, just killed as we passed. <— that’s the proper way to kill people in the JP.

Camping an area is honestly just lame. It’s frowned upon in FPS games, and its frowned upon here.

Actually camping high ground (or supply rich, choke points etc.) is a valid tactic in most FPS games. You think a valid tactic that competition teams engage in is weak, but you think 8 versus 1 ganking in GW2 is legit. In FPS, teams are equal, there are counter measures for campers. There is no counter measure for 8 vs 1.

This achievement was the first thing to get me to go back to that jump puzzle since they nerfed it to being account bound. It was a refreshing experience.

ShAdY.7586:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

ShAdY.7586:

Obsidian Scantum Achievement made me report 20 people, at that point I stopped counting and I am still lieing on the ground, reporting everyone who lays a hand on my mates.

the only thing this will accomplish is getting yourself banned. reporting players for things that are not offences is a bannable offence.

This is the definition of Grieving, so its highly offensive.

They’re probably sad because all their friends died, let them grieve in peace.

If you want to be safe do the dungeon with your guardian with a hammer

SO kittenING BRILLIANT IDEA!.. I JUST WIPED BY THE CAMPING INVADERS BEFORE I CAN GET THE CACHE.

I’m both amazed and disgusted at how many people will +1 a rant that doesn’t make any sense.

No one is forcing you to get the cache in Obsidian Sanctum. Esplen already said want needs to be said:

Esplen.3940:

The monocle is from the story dungeon. The minipet is from completing 12/20 achievements.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

they are playing the game it is meant to be played.

I’d really love to speak to the Dev who intended the top of the well in Obsidian Sanctum to be camped by 20+ Germans on the basis “it’s meant to be played that way”. Is it really meant to be played that way, or are some people just total kittens wanting free kills wherever they can get them?

To me, The Obsidian Sanctum is meant to be somewhat more strategic than “get the biggest zerg you can, boys, then wait at the top of a high area to jump onto anyone trying to get up – it’ll be fun since it’s super hard for people to keep checking what’s above them whilst jumping around in circles on little boards”.

People can argue as much as they want that “you gotta expect PvP in WvW lol” but it simply doesn’t wash with me. I do expect PvP in WvW, but players using an event as an excuse to camp the one route through to it is somewhat unfair, and really really kitten of them. Imagine every time you went to mine Orichalcum five legendaries spawned and played golf with your face – would it be acceptable for me to say “it’s PvE bro, gotta expect mobs lol”. No, because it’s too extreme to be fair. I have no problem with PvP in the Sanctum, but even with a small group vs a zerg of 20, 30, 40+ people? Come on, we all know there’s nothing fair about that.

…and until a Dev comes online and states that it was ArenaNet’s intention for the dominant server to place massive impassable zergs at bottlenecks through that dungeon then I refuse to accept any argument from players supporting that view.

Charak.9761:

If you want to be safe do the dungeon with your guardian with a hammer

Unfortunately being outmanned by 20 Germans for every 1 Gandaran – a lil’ hammer makes no difference.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Xavori.3768:

2. Move the cache to the start of the jump puzzle. It’s not like Obsidian is actually that challenging. The only tricksy part is the dark room, and you kinda get the same experience in Sharky’s in LA. So it’s not like you’re really letting people that much off the hook.

Seriously? Not challenging? That is one of the harder and longer jumping puzzles in the game. Sure with practice everything gets easier, but the first time I had to do that JP, it took us forever.

But I do agree that putting the cache at the end of such a long JP makes the players extremely reliant on a kind opposing team. Fortunately that was the case with the German players on Aurora Glade last night. Everyone just left each other alone, so everyone could get the cache.

I’ve done all the jump puzzles. Trust me, Obsidian is in the easy category. and none of the jumps are all that tricky. Even the shortcut mentioned in another post isn’t all that tricky although it does require swiftness (the 25% signet buff just isn’t quite enough).

Sure, it’s a bit long, but compared with collecting energy orbs in Orr, Obsidian is much shorter.

Khyber.2693:

Did the achievement today, walked past a bunch of stormbluff isle people who let me pass and I got it. A lot of these people are decent human beings. Try it before crying please.

I have the achievement too. Only, I didn’t have the luxury of the bad guys letting me pass. I actually had to be sneaky and work for it.

Also, I had to walk ten miles to get to the jump puzzle. Through twenty feet deep snow. Uphill. Both ways.

Anyway, I suspect if those Stormbluff Isle peeps decided to make you their sugary marshmallow female dog, you might be thinking different about the appropriateness of sticking an achievement that has nothing to do with PvP in a PvP zone.

So…. let me get this straight. PvP happened in a PvP zone right?

As much as I hate JP’s in general and the fact that an achievement is tied to this (guessing it’s part of the meta or something from the posts here), it’s a PvP area meant for PvP.

So don’t complain about PvP happening where it should be happening.

I thought we only need 12/20 achievements to get the meta-achievement… no? Why do people complain about something that is completely optional for people who like this stuff?

So…. let me get this straight. PvP happened in a PvP zone right?

As much as I hate JP’s in general and the fact that an achievement is tied to this (guessing it’s part of the meta or something from the posts here), it’s a PvP area meant for PvP.

So don’t complain about PvP happening where it should be happening.

Did you even read the post immediately above yours? It eloquently and convincingly makes the case against this bullkitten camp-griefing practice being employed by so many complete kittens.

And yes, if you are participating in this as a griefer, you are a full-fledged kitten as far as I’m concerned. Deriving pleasure from causing other people misery makes you an epic failure as a human being.

@Euryon: ehm this zone is for fighting IN a jumping puzzle. If designers wouldn’t have wanted this, why would there be all those traps?

Euryon.9248:

So…. let me get this straight. PvP happened in a PvP zone right?

As much as I hate JP’s in general and the fact that an achievement is tied to this (guessing it’s part of the meta or something from the posts here), it’s a PvP area meant for PvP.

So don’t complain about PvP happening where it should be happening.

Did you even read the post immediately above yours? It eloquently and convincingly makes the case against this bullkitten camp-griefing practice being employed by so many complete kittens.

And yes, if you are participating in this as a griefer, you are a full-fledged kitten as far as I’m concerned. Deriving pleasure from causing other people misery makes you an epic failure as a human being.

Whether it is 100 vs 1, or 10 vs 10, it is a place for PvP. There is no such thing as griefing when it comes to killing your opponent.

There is no honor, no friends, no buddy system. They aren’t just going to go, “Oh there is only one of you while there is 10 of us? Sure you can pass by”. No. It’s PvP. Player versus Player. Survival of the fittest.

If you’re on a battlefield, and you have your entire army protecting your king, and one enemy walks up to the line, are you going to let them pass because you overwhelm him and it would be unfair to kill him? No. You will kill him regardless cause he is the enemy.

That’s how PvP works. I don’t care if there is only 1 of me and 100 of you. If you guys tear me apart, so be it. I signed up for PvP by entering a place for PvP. I expect to be killed by overwhelming odds or by one other player.

It’s PvP.

PvE and PvP don’t mix very well. I’d thought they’d know that by now.

- Dungeons in PvP where you have to take control of the dungeon to play it? Cool.
- Menial tasks setup to frustrate and reward non-fair play? Bad.

I agree with the OP. Why the hell would arenanet feel the need to include PvE content into WvW? No… It’s worse than that, It’s Obsidian Sanctum!

I’ve tried doing it and get killed by farmers which is extremely irritating. I run past any enemies I see and simply try to get to the end so I can get the Cache.

I’m really annoyed that there are people blocking progress in this achievement line. I understand many of you are saying “Just don’t do it” but I’m sorry to me that is unacceptable. I should have a choice to say which achievements I want and don’t want. But with this insane addition to the Cache, It takes that option away from me, as it’s not long a want or don’t want, it’s now “Want but Physically CAN’T!”

I myself aim to get all the achievements for living story, including the PvP, which I hate so very very much, but still I do it because the content is there for a limited time so I might as well take advantage of that.

All I’m going to say to you ANET is be prepared for a lot of complaints when the event is over and thousands of people were not able to get the Obsidian Sanctum Cache. Seriously you are signing your own redundancy here.

I’m not psychic but “I sense a large amount of rage quitters in the near future” (meaning in about 4-weeks).

I completed this achievement a little while ago, and I’m happy to say that (at least while I was in there) almost everyone (from Crystal Desert, Yak’s Bend, and Maguuma) was just hanging out and/or getting through the puzzle. At one point I was jumping alongside someone from Mag. I did see one brief skirmish along the way, but it was just three people, and my ranger did get killed just as he reached the aetherblade cache – but- I believe it was not intentional, as the pirates spawned and a couple of YB guys attacked them and caught me in the aoes. Shortly thereafter someone from my server came along and rezzed my guy, so I got the crappy loot (yay) and finished the puzzle.

So, /e salute the folks from all three servers.

PS: I am a firm believer in keeping PVP and PVE strictly separated. I think there should be no jumping puzzles or ‘kill x amount of whatevers’ or anything remotely PVE related in a PVP zone.

I totally agree with the topic title. Who exactly told you or inspired you to blend PvE with WvW in such way? And not just PvE, a TEMPORARY event that will not stay there forever. As if it was not enough I wasted 7 hours today to kill those dam**d Aetherblades, now I have to deal with any moronic german or polish or greek or whatever nationality while trying to complete an achievement, for a game content that actually started very nicely and players really loved it. The last two living story parts were extremely time-consuming, not enjoyable at their most part, and overly frustrating. You asked from us to smash so many pinatas, launch so many fireworks, kill 300 holographic minions (whilst anyone could just ruin your smooth progress by accidentally -or even purposely- run ahead of your casual route and activate the following holographic devices, leaving you stranded and waiting for them to respawn).

As a player, who actually has been with you since Guild Wars 2 was launched, I find this highly monotonous, frustrating, BORING and counter-productive. It is alright to require players to complete such achievements, but the numbers you are asking are a bit astronomical for the time casual players have in their hands to spend. And on top of it all, now lots of players are extremely frustrated with the Obsidian Sanctum jumping puzzle, as it will probably take them hours (if not days) to get it completed.

Please, try to put yourselves in a player’s position and ask these questions: “Do I really find this fun and joyful? Are the rewards worth my time?” I am pretty sure the majority of the players will give a negative answer to these.

Either remove that achievement or change the location of that Aetherblade Cache to a more accessible place, outside of WvW.

Naeleen.7601:

Either remove that achievement or change the location of that Aetherblade Cache to a more accessible place, outside of WvW.

Well i kind of agree, but rather than removing it out of WvW. Just put it in the center at the start of Obsidian Sanctum, where the 3 portals are. Sure this will cause a lot of fighting, however you don’t actually need to open the chest to get the achievement, you simply need to be within a certain range of it. I’d happily forsake the god awful loot for the sake of actually getting the achievement.

End of the day Aneta have already messed up, They will know now that they shouldn’t make this mistake again, but Shouldn’t go back on what they have done. Just edit it and keep it at the start of the JP.

Accessible and Easier results in happy players.

PvP in a PvP zone? It’s more likely than you think!

Sorry to the groups of 10 EB/DB people I wipe by myself in the jumping puzzle last night. See you again tonight.

Do you want not to be killed ? Run a thief.

Seriously…..

I cannot believe that ArenaNet would support such behavior… Griefing is completely uncalled for, and yet ArenaNet//NCSoft supports this type of behavior… Proof of it? Proof enough is that they have a jumping puzzle in WvW with traps that encourage the behavior….

Heaven forbid the jump puzzle that’s present in a PvP zone encourages PvP tactics.

Openworld PvP areas & Griefing go hand in hand.
Where have you been the last 15 years???

They support consensual PvP, which isn’t a toxic environment. Consensual PvP is engaged in by people who both agree to it.

If you do not wish to participate in consensual PvP, you don’t go into areas where it takes place. That would include the World vs. World battlefields and the Jumping Puzzles located therein. Shockingly, PvP occurs in PvP zones.

It’s not the end of the world if you don’t want to get these two Achievements for the Aetherblades content. If you fear consensual PvP you’re already going to miss out on all the other Achievements from the PvP and WvW tabs, and you’re already giving up on ever having a Legendary weapon due to the mapping of WvW zones and 500 Badges of Honour being needed. So knowing that, what harm is there in giving up two more?

It’s a PvP jumping puzzle, in a specially designated PvP area you have to intentionally go into, and with PvP rewards at the end that it’s in your best interest not only to get them for your team, but to prevent the other teams to get them… how is it griefing?

It’s a Jumping Puzzle… You go through the Jumping Puzzle to do one of two things… You either go through to complete the Puzzle, or you go through to grief other people who are only going through for Chest… If you are going through for the chest, then you have to deal with people who are griefing…

I play PvP, both sPvP and WvW… I go there consensually, and die when I die, and don’t cry about it. When I am introduced to an aspect of the game that is DESIGNED to grief other players, I call it out for what it is… A piece of content that is DESGINED to GRIEF players.

If killing people in the WvW jumping puzzles is griefing, then so is killing people in sPvP who are just peacefully trying to capture control points.

Drayven.6408:

It’s a Jumping Puzzle… You go through the Jumping Puzzle to do one of two things… You either go through to complete the Puzzle, or you go through to grief other people who are only going through for Chest… If you are going through for the chest, then you have to deal with people who are griefing…

I play PvP, both sPvP and WvW… I go there consensually, and die when I die, and don’t cry about it. When I am introduced to an aspect of the game that is DESIGNED to grief other players, I call it out for what it is… A piece of content that is DESGINED to GRIEF players.

This is the logical fallacy known as special pleading.

Shufflepants.9785:

If killing people in the WvW jumping puzzles is griefing, then so is killing people in sPvP who are just peacefully trying to capture control points.

Pretty much this. The objective is to open that chest, and in PvP people are welcome to thwart you from accomplishing that objective. Get over it.

Drayven.6408:

I play PvP, both sPvP and WvW… I go there consensually, and die when I die, and don’t cry about it.

Funny, since you’ve made a thread here that’s nothing but crying about it.

Again, this might just be an Achievement that you won’t have fun getting. So don’t try. Better to do the things you enjoy than to get upset trying things you won’t. If you’re not cut out for PvP, then you’re not cut out for PvP. No shame in that.

In a pve jp, there are monsters to fight
In a pvp jp, there are players to fight

Now please keep whining, it only encourages people to do it more.

locoman.1974:

It’s a PvP jumping puzzle, in a specially designated PvP area you have to intentionally go into, and with PvP rewards at the end that it’s in your best interest not only to get them for your team, but to prevent the other teams to get them… how is it griefing?

One might say the devs are the griefers here for tying a jumping puzzle in a PVP zone to an otherwise strictly PVE achievement.

You cannot compare people in sPvP with people attempting to do a Jumping Puzzle.

You do a Jumping Puzzle to have fun doing content other than PvE or PvP…

Capturing a Control Point in sPvP is part of the Objective for the Match… Capturing a Tower/Camp/Control Point in WvW is an objective for the PvP content…

A jumping puzzle -in- WvW is there for nothing more than simply griefing the players who want the tokens… Tokens which I personally intend to use to get armor and my legendary for my Guardian… Tokens for my Guardian’s Armor and the Gift of Battle are the ONLY reasons I do any form of PvP, but because I am FORCED to do them, I have to deal with people who enjoy griefing, in a puzzle designed to Grief other players…

With the amount of flames and trolling that is coming out of this towards me, it should be OBVIOUS what this content is designed for.

Drayven.6408:

It’s a Jumping Puzzle… You go through the Jumping Puzzle to do one of two things… You either go through to complete the Puzzle, or you go through to grief other people who are only going through for Chest… If you are going through for the chest, then you have to deal with people who are griefing…

I play PvP, both sPvP and WvW… I go there consensually, and die when I die, and don’t cry about it. When I am introduced to an aspect of the game that is DESIGNED to grief other players, I call it out for what it is… A piece of content that is DESGINED to GRIEF players.

It’s a PvP jumping puzzle… you go trough it to do one of two things, to get to the end to contribute to your team’s effort with the rewards (which include siege equipment, for example), or to prevent enemies from contributing to their team’s effort, and being a specially designated PvP JP in a specially PvP area, it’s not griefing if PvP happens, it’s actually expected. Would be like saying that a veteran mob is griefing you in PvE because it’s not letting you grab the skill point, or that a dungeon boss is griefing you because it doesn’t let you go any further.

It might be unfortunate for some (myself included, as I’m the worst ever player in PvP and I can prove it by getting killed by anyone..) that the achievement chest was placed in the PvP jumping puzzle, but the fact that it was makes it very clear that it isn’t supposed to be an easy achievement to obtain, and that mastery of different areas of the game (including PvP) is needed for it, and that it is NOT a PvE achievement, but a PvE and PvP one. After all, whoever you think is griefing you really has no way to know whether you’re going there just for the achievement or to get siege blueprints that might end up blowing up the wall of their keep for your server to capture, and doesn’t have to care either, if you’re there, whether you want it or not, you’re part of the war effort, and therefore a valid target.

You should come to Tarnished Coast. The other day we had 3 mesmers porting people to the top. It took me <5 minutes and I didn’t have to fight anyone.

You people will not change my opinion of this…. There is a difference between PvP’ing people and killing them, and griefing people… They should NOT have stuck a Jumping Puzzle in the WvW area, it’s as simple as that…. It is content designed to grief players who come there only for an achievement. PvE Players are FORCED to PvP… It’s a terrible setup, and only the people who agree with this are the same people who get their nut off on the idea of griefing other players like this Piece of Skritt content.

Yeah blackgate has mesmers helping out too. I’d like to thank the blackgate mesmers for helping me to get through and get this achievement so that I can now go back to my PvEing and ignoring the PvP aspect of this game completely.

I understand that I won’t be able to get every achievement in the game..but why is there an achievement for getting ALL of the caches as well as one for each individual cache? because this one is the hardest I left it till last, so doing it got me 2 achievements.

deviller.9135:

Do you want not to be killed ? Run a thief.

Seriously…..

So what you are suggesting is that to do the achievement we should all create a thief and level it up in a week just for the pleasure of being able to get a →PvE<- achievement?

I can only imagine what everyone else is thinking to that suggestion…

I love that this jumping puzzle is getting attention, and its great to fight there.
But having a cache required for 2 achievements is stupid. Moving the cache to the front of the puzzle would still alert people it was there without forcing PvE players to PvP. Better yet, just add another cache somewhere in PvE that gives you the second achievement aswell and keep the WvW cache up there for us who like the challenge.

Coopziana.1802:

deviller.9135:

Do you want not to be killed ? Run a thief.

Seriously…..

So what you are suggesting is that to do the achievement we should all create a thief and level it up in a week just for the pleasure of being able to get a ->PvE<- achievement?

I can only imagine what everyone else is thinking to that suggestion…

I don’t know, but the fact that they stuck the chest in a ->PvP<- jumping puzzle in a ->PvP<- area makes me think that the achievement is not a ->PvE<- one..

+1 to Anet for putting achievements for WvW players, i hope every patch has atleast 1-2 achievements that is located at the end of this JP or possibly the 3rd level of SM.

At this point the achievement points are inflated and a lot of bad players are ahead just because they have no life.

Drayven.6408:

You people will not change my opinion of this…. There is a difference between PvP’ing people and killing them, and griefing people… They should NOT have stuck a Jumping Puzzle in the WvW area, it’s as simple as that…. It is content designed to grief players who come there only for an achievement. PvE Players are FORCED to PvP… It’s a terrible setup, and only the people who agree with this are the same people who get their nut off on the idea of griefing other players like this Piece of Skritt content.

You don’t have to do the achievement. And I don’t even know where this puzzle is, and I won’t do it because I hate jumping puzzles, so not everyone who is fine with it is a griefer.

Piogre.2164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.
it is called playing the game as it is intended.

achievements are not entitlements.

The issue is that a large amount of PvE’ers etner attempting to get a PvE achievement. Knowing this, players will sit (having already finished the puzzle themselves) WILL SIT at the top of the arena or in other areas and ambush players. They don’t put in effort. They literally sit and farm people because they can’t get their badges in a fair fight, or perhaps just like to make other people’s lives miserable. If this is intended play, then Anet is more sadistic than I previously thought.

Heh… people who sit and farm aren’t really good pvper’s nor do they care its fun for them, this is a game. (They’ll probably agree with what i say up to a point. This might be it.) But i agree some what, especially when you don’t attack enemies and think it is a temporary peace time(lol) cause we both want chieve, until you wander into a pack of “Hey lets get em!!! yay! 15 on 1! that guy sucks!!! Muwahahahahhaha” players… lol children…. they have so much fun. and when peeps from your server start this guess what happens…..

If this is what anet wants… then i guess they know this is the result. But you don’t need this for the mini, its just chieve points. Part of the game is pvp- so it is included.

Although because “Daily PVP” is separate from the “Daily” so too should this achievement be.