Guild Wars 2

@Anet ,
Please tell me, why make the story dungeon a solo play experience?

Also the boss looks interesting but as far as i have seen and heard he’s nothing special…
You might want to give you’re bosses special attacks.. like in the flame and frost dungeon those were great.

love the look and feel of the content but would be nice if the main villian was different from every other boss mob around.

Single player dungeons aren’t dungeons. I’m really disappointed with the two new instances, they are short and the mechanics aren’t well designed.

The Molten Weapon Facility, now that was a dungeon. I was expecting some of similar quality, instead Arenanet catered to the people who complained about dungeons in the end no one wins.

Arenanet needs to decide what is a valid complaint and what isn’t.

Yes, there should be. I’m disappointed with all of the dungeons, they’re over long, buggy and the mechanics are badly designed.

Its not that there shouldn’t be single player dungeons, its that there shouldn’t be kittenty single player dungeons.

Single-player dungeons—————IF—————designed appropriately, are fine. However, in GW2, this criteria has NOT been met—————————in ANY instance!!! It’s NOT sufficient to “scale-down” a multi-player dungeon, and expect it to work “solo”———the same holds true for “solo dungeons” being scaled-up to multi-player—————-the mechanics and design are just too different to work.

I did all flame and frost missions and all my personal story missions with my boyfriend. We enjoy playing together. He wasn’t interested in the new part of the Living Story but we thought that we will at least do the story together. Nope.
It was highly criticized in Secret World – strictly single player instances should not exist because it prevents people from playing with their friends in an MMO. I’m deeply disappointed by this.

I haven’t played it yet, but are you not allowed to bring people in your party?

No. After the patch you can do the Story Mode only alone.

Niyo.5920:

No. After the patch you can do the Story Mode only alone.

Which is absolutely idiotic, because now I won’t be able to get my boyfriend to play GW2 with me because I know that he won’t go to do Canach alone and you need to do Canach to be allowed to do Null.
That means – no more living story for me and we’ll just have to stick with regular dungeons, unless I’ll get some free minute to do it alone.

So essentially it’s just a really poor design choice.

I agree. Very silly move on Anet’s part. I don’t play this game for single player.

I like how the personal story content was designed to be done by one player, but you could bring along friends if you wanted.

But THIS content designed for a single player doesnt allow that.

i agree, but i guess if it’s any consolation, it’s only a 1 room “dungeon” with a pretty simple fight inside, so, there’s not much there to experience anyway, whether alone or grouped. idk why they made a single player dungeon. i’m not powerfully against it or anything, i just don’t see the point. kinda how i felt when running a lot of my personal story quests, although at least you can drag people with you into those.

Before the patch, right when the letter was sent to everyone (2 hours ago), the instance Canach Lair was grouped like it shows SM/Exp in other dungeons AND you could kill Canach with a party.

After the patch – No party + Solo.

It seems like Anet changed their mind on the fly.

Given its duration and mechanics, i get the feeling it was hashed together at the last moment as a response to the complaints about the group nature of the F&F finale.

digiowl.9620:

Given its duration and mechanics, i get the feeling it was hashed together at the last moment as a response to the complaints about the group nature of the F&F finale.

Except it took more effort to make this single player only than it would have been to use the already coded Personal Story tech to allow party members in.

They took extra time to make this different (for the worse). It’s at best unneccesary and at worst a waste.

I agree with this. My guild got a group together right after the patch went live, and we were all very disappointed it would not let us do the dungeon together.

It’s fine if some people want to solo it but there should be the option to have a group.

It’s solo due to a handful of players on the forum who complained because they hated having to group up with people to enjoy content in this MMO.

Already posted this before, but prior to patch the dungeon had both SM/Exp grouped and you could take a party with you.

It was only about 5 minutes before the patch went live, that after it was divided and you couldn’t take party members to kill Canach

Ayrilana.1396:

It’s solo due to a handful of players on the forum who complained because they hated having to group up with people to enjoy content in this MMO.

but like I said in this game most instances are solo and group friendly. Almost all of your story is solo, but you can bring a friend if you like. I don’t mind that. But why are we not allowed to bring a friend to the new instance?

I think this whole situation is ridiculous. The way the F&F Dungeon was handled was PERFECT. The dungeon was fun, the story didn’t get in the way for people that didn’t care about it but it there for people who wanted it. The F&F Dungeon was also easy enough that anyone could do it.

The fact that they implemented this Single Player only ‘dungeon’ because of a vocal minority on the forums is just outrageous. This may sound harsh but if people want single player only story content, they should play a single player game, not an MMO.

Mirta.5029:

Ayrilana.1396:

It’s solo due to a handful of players on the forum who complained because they hated having to group up with people to enjoy content in this MMO.

but like I said in this game most instances are solo and group friendly. Almost all of your story is solo, but you can bring a friend if you like. I don’t mind that. But why are we not allowed to bring a friend to the new instance?

I think it’s rather silly. Before the patch, you DIDN’T have to bring a party to complete Canach. Although it HELPED.

After the patch, you aren’t even allowed to bring a party to complete Canach.

Seems like Anet didn’t want to think outside the box.

Sukor.1236:

I think this whole situation is ridiculous. The way the F&F Dungeon was handled was PERFECT. The dungeon was fun, the story didn’t get in the way for people that didn’t care about it but it there for people who wanted it. The F&F Dungeon was also easy enough that anyone could do it.

The fact that they implemented this Single Player only ‘dungeon’ because of a vocal minority on the forums is just outrageous. This may sound harsh but if people want single player only story content, they should play a single player game, not an MMO.

There are 3 kinds of multiplayer in GW2.

1. dungeons, 5 people stuck in a instance together for a hour or more depending on how well the team gels.

2. random gatherings around open world events for a random amount of time.

3. personal story instances, F&F instances, where one initiates and zero or more people can tag along.

What your so called “vocal minority” was looking for was more of 3. Instances where they could go it alone, or bring one or more friends depending on who was online at the time.

Meaning a middle ground between single player and 5 man band dungeons. More like a instanced world event than anything else.

Yeah. I also killed Canach with a party before update ^^

Why would you need a party to kill one man. In other dungeon there are lots of other mobs.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

Why would you need a party to kill one man. In other dungeon there are lots of other mobs.

Why does this “dungeon” only have 1 man in it? In other dungeons there are lots of other mobs.

Again, not fun. Can we bring back the F&F dungeon please?

It’s probably because when the F&F dungeon was added the forum was full of people complaining that they hate grouping for any reason and were annoyed that they had been able to solo all the previous content and then were forced into a group for the dungeon.

So they tried to do both – you do it once solo and then if you want to you can do it again in a group.

As usual Anets attempt to improve things has just proven that you can’t make everyone happy.

guess Anet can’t win, people complain when forced to make groups for living story stuff, then complain when you can do it by yourself now..

Danikat.8537:

It’s probably because when the F&F dungeon was added the forum was full of people complaining that they hate grouping for any reason and were annoyed that they had been able to solo all the previous content and then were forced into a group for the dungeon.

I want to know how many of those “I-wanna-solo” come here to complain that Canach is too difficult to kill.

:D

digiowl.9620:

Sukor.1236:

I think this whole situation is ridiculous. The way the F&F Dungeon was handled was PERFECT. The dungeon was fun, the story didn’t get in the way for people that didn’t care about it but it there for people who wanted it. The F&F Dungeon was also easy enough that anyone could do it.

The fact that they implemented this Single Player only ‘dungeon’ because of a vocal minority on the forums is just outrageous. This may sound harsh but if people want single player only story content, they should play a single player game, not an MMO.

There are 3 kinds of multiplayer in GW2.

1. dungeons, 5 people stuck in a instance together for a hour or more depending on how well the team gels.

2. random gatherings around open world events for a random amount of time.

3. personal story instances, F&F instances, where one initiates and zero or more people can tag along.

What your so called “vocal minority” was looking for was more of 3. Instances where they could go it alone, or bring one or more friends depending on who was online at the time.

Meaning a middle ground between single player and 5 man band dungeons. More like a instanced world event than anything else.

Actually there were a lot of people complaining about the F&F dungeon because apparently they hate and refuse to attempt being in a party of any kind for any reason. Several even said they refuse to join guilds because they don’t want to deal with other people.

The section is still available at the bottom of the forum so you can go and read the threads if you like.

I’m not saying they’re right or even have a valid point (although I’m not saying they don’t either) but a lot of them were asking for solo content, not optional party sizes.

Rainzar.6905:

guess Anet can’t win, people complain when forced to make groups for living story stuff, then complain when you can do it by yourself now..

She not complaining that you can do it by yourself, she having a issue with that there isn’t a option to bring a friend. While not a issue for me (through might be worrisome if they keep doing this), I can understand that some might want to bring in someone else with them, and since that you have stuff like personal story that like that, I don’t see why not for this either.

The solo instances of Braham and Rox were amazing. This one is just awful, with frustrating mechanics.
Knockdown after knockdown, etc.
Gimmicky quest item needed instead of using our own weapon skills.
Bleh.

I suspect the best option for future content would be to make it available for parties from 1-5 and make it scale to the number of players.

Of course people will complain about the scaling, either saying it’s too hard with one person, too easy with 5 or more likely both, but at least they’d be able to do it with their personal favourite number of players.

I want to play with my friends and I want to play my class and you’d think a dungeon would be more than a tunnel and a room. Definitely not a good design.

Danikat.8537:

I suspect the best option for future content would be to make it available for parties from 1-5 and make it scale to the number of players.

Of course people will complain about the scaling, either saying it’s too hard with one person, too easy with 5 or more likely both, but at least they’d be able to do it with their personal favourite number of players.

I agree with this option. Now that I know that instance for Canach is single player only, I will not be doing any of it.

I much prefer to do these with friends, even if only for two of us. I detest single player ONLY dungeon ideas and feel it gimps those who want to bring along friend(s).

The single player is one room with one boss, then you get the option to do a multiplayer explorable mode.

IMO saying you’re not going to do any of it because you have to kill 1 boss alone is like saying you won’t do AC with friends because you have to run across Ashford solo to meet them.

Danikat.8537:

The single player is one room with one boss, then you get the option to do a multiplayer explorable mode.

IMO saying you’re not going to do any of it because you have to kill 1 boss alone is like saying you won’t do AC with friends because you have to run across Ashford solo to meet them.

Agreed. I better not see anyone complain about missing out on achievements/lore after this chapter ends because they refused to be forced to solo this 10 minute(or however long it takes to finikitten) instance. They will eventually move on to complain about how they are being forced to group up for exploration mode just like F&F.

Rainzar.6905:

guess Anet can’t win, people complain when forced to make groups for living story stuff, then complain when you can do it by yourself now..

No, I’m complaining that I won’t be able to do it, not because I can’t do it solo, but because I only play with my boyfriend. All of the content we do together. We can’t do this one together, therefore we probably won’t do it, unless I’ll do it secretly while he sleeps.

Danikat.8537:

The single player is one room with one boss, then you get the option to do a multiplayer explorable mode.

IMO saying you’re not going to do any of it because you have to kill 1 boss alone is like saying you won’t do AC with friends because you have to run across Ashford solo to meet them.

and once again my problem is not that he is hard, but that I want to play with friends and I don’t have that precious alone time that I could use to do this.

Rainzar.6905:

guess Anet can’t win, people complain when forced to make groups for living story stuff, then complain when you can do it by yourself now..

Anet can’t win because they make stupid design decisions.

I’m glad ArenaNet listened to those of us who didn’t complete Flame & Frost due to the group dungeon.

Single player storylines should never require you to form a party to complete the content.

If you enjoy group dungeons, run the solo instance and unlock the 5 man.

That makes no sense. You say you have time to run the dungeon with your b/f, but no time to run it yourself? Those aren’t mutually exclusive things. You can both play the instance at the same time, but both be soloing it. Problem solved.

Danikat.8537:

The single player is one room with one boss, then you get the option to do a multiplayer explorable mode.

IMO saying you’re not going to do any of it because you have to kill 1 boss alone is like saying you won’t do AC with friends because you have to run across Ashford solo to meet them.

Sorry you feel that way. I have done solo runs with my story but did not really enjoy them. I don’t get why Anet did not just offer the option to do it solo instead of forcing it.

People seem to roll from one extreme to another. F&F was all no forced group content, SS is all no forced single player content. We could have both. Why gate off group content behind the wall of single player content? Just have both readily available. I have no problems with solo instances as long as there is an option to party, like in the personal story or an already available group version. You can easily please both group and solo crowds. There’s no reason to resort to extremes.

Mirta.5029:

Rainzar.6905:

guess Anet can’t win, people complain when forced to make groups for living story stuff, then complain when you can do it by yourself now..

No, I’m complaining that I won’t be able to do it, not because I can’t do it solo, but because I only play with my boyfriend. All of the content we do together. We can’t do this one together, therefore we probably won’t do it, unless I’ll do it secretly while he sleeps.

Danikat.8537:

The single player is one room with one boss, then you get the option to do a multiplayer explorable mode.

IMO saying you’re not going to do any of it because you have to kill 1 boss alone is like saying you won’t do AC with friends because you have to run across Ashford solo to meet them.

and once again my problem is not that he is hard, but that I want to play with friends and I don’t have that precious alone time that I could use to do this.

So make it a competition. You should both run it at the same time and see who clears it faster. The winner gets their choice of dinner or a movie or some other reward. Be creative.

wookiee.4631:

People seem to roll from one extreme to another. F&F was all no forced group content, SS is all no forced single player content. We could have both. Why gate off group content behind the wall of single player content? Just have both readily available. I have no problems with solo instances as long as there is an option to party, like in the personal story or an already available group version. You can easily please both group and solo crowds. There’s no reason to resort to extremes.

Exactly.!

Elbegast.6970:

I’m glad ArenaNet listened to those of us who didn’t complete Flame & Frost due to the group dungeon.

Single player storylines should never require you to form a party to complete the content.

If you enjoy group dungeons, run the solo instance and unlock the 5 man.

I enjoy running content with my wife and friends and guildmates.

Single player storylines should never require you to make your friends sit it out while you play, just like they should never require them to play with you to go forward.

I believe it has to do with difficulty scaling and boss mechanics. You can’t design a good solo boss the same way as a grouped boss.
Soloable bosses have to be made simple so that players can survive without being revived and the lack of group combos/healing. Scaling it up turns the boss into a rock that stands there for 10 minutes while you just burn him down.
Group bosses can be more complex and dangerous because you can rely on others to help. Scaling them down can work as long you have more than one person.
Designing the boss to act one way if there is one player and another if there is more than one is a waste of time. The soloable version would be probably easier to do and grouping up would only make it harder for the same reward.

EverythingXen.1835:

Elbegast.6970:

I’m glad ArenaNet listened to those of us who didn’t complete Flame & Frost due to the group dungeon.

Single player storylines should never require you to form a party to complete the content.

If you enjoy group dungeons, run the solo instance and unlock the 5 man.

I enjoy running content with my wife and friends and guildmates.

Single player storylines should never require you to make your friends sit it out while you play, just like they should never require them to play with you to go forward.

I agree with that but, until a better solution is implemented, I will take the ‘solo only’ content over forced grouping any day. At least the content is now accessible by everyone, despite the length of their friends list or guild affiliation.

kokocabana.8153:

That makes no sense. You say you have time to run the dungeon with your b/f, but no time to run it yourself? Those aren’t mutually exclusive things. You can both play the instance at the same time, but both be soloing it. Problem solved.

It was not about time, it was about them having some kind of understanding that they do things in the game together.

With F&F, ANet pulled what can be considered a bait and switch. Everything up to the final dungeon could be done solo or it could be done in any size groups. Come the final it was a 5 man band or forget about it.

This time round they are being more rigid about it. one instance if you want to go alone, another if you want the 5 man band. The option to go with a random size group is not there at all.

In my option the one thing that would, if not please then at least placate, everyone would be for everything to be doable by a group ranging from solo to 5 man band.

You can do this with personal story instances, you could do it with the F&F instances, why is it so kitten hard to pull off now?!

for a “MMORPG” where Single player only “dungeons” are involved i am lost in words, was looking forward doing Canach with my girlfriend and now we can’t do it together neither can i help her and she is struggeling with it and even now she don’t wanna do it anymore, and i am all by myself doing NULL now, thanks ANET you kitten ed of my girlfriend.

Here’s my opinion on this “single player” stuff…

1: Group dungeons almost always are more mechanically interesting because they require cooperation between multiple people. This also emphasizes the qualities one associates with an MMO.

2: Certain players do not wish to group up for these dungeons, so a story-based dungeon that a single player can enjoy to experience the living story by themselves is a good way to cater to people who want to experience a story without grouping up. This isn’t a bad thing, but here’s where the issue comes in…

3: In the future, I would avoid rewarding players in the solo instance with monetary gain or new possessions. Let the solo version of a dungeon be there only to enjoy the story if someone does not want to group up, and leave the dungeon-like rewards to the players who participate through the more difficult group variant of the dungeon.