Guild Wars 2

Daecollo.9578:

I hatedkitten however I absolutely loved the lore around it. It deserved a better story and the Fae-Sylvari and the Courts deserve a better story. Did you ever STOP AND READ the dialogue they have in that story?

And have you seen everything in the new path?
How do you know that said lore is lost?

lordkrall.7241:

Daecollo.9578:

I hatedkitten however I absolutely loved the lore around it. It deserved a better story and the Fae-Sylvari and the Courts deserve a better story. Did you ever STOP AND READ the dialogue they have in that story?

And have you seen everything in the new path?
How do you know that said lore is lost?

Because Scarlet ruins every piece of lore she touches.

Durzlla.6295:

They could fix that easily, just have webs go up around the door when she agros, then she’d be still pretty easy, but not ridiculously so.

I have actually never been able to fight her inside her room because people always want to exploit and I don’t want to be that guy. So I have no idea how easy it would be. -.-

lordkrall.7241:

So, we have had months of people complaining about F-U, now they do something to address that issue.
And now people suddenly seems to think that F-U was the most awesome and perfect path ever.

ArenaNet really can’t win.
If they don’t change stuff people complain that the world is not changing and stuff is bad, boring and don’t get fixed.
If they do change stuff people complain that they fix stuff and that the bad, boring and unfixed stuff was good as it was.

Uh… as most people should realize the people HAPPY with the content tend to remain pretty silent, we had F-U for our enjoyment so we didn’t really have to say anything about it, i thought it needed a tweak here and there to make it easier for more groups to do it, essentially just put the kittening cap back on how many spiders can be spawned… because once you get to 15 groups of spiders… yeah… good luck clearing that, just restart the instance.

Now that F-U is being taken away all the people who enjoyed it are up in arms.. hell there’d probably be more people here but a lot of people probably don’t know the news yet!

TAFU is perfectly fine.

There are only 2 issues:
-adds should despawn after wipe
-it’s a pugbuster. Thus a lot of crying.

That’s it.

Lucky.9421:

Durzlla.6295:

They could fix that easily, just have webs go up around the door when she agros, then she’d be still pretty easy, but not ridiculously so.

I have actually never been able to fight her inside her room because people always want to exploit and I don’t want to be that guy. So I have no idea how easy it would be. -.-

I’m ALWAYS that guy lol, i will not exploit instances, granted i make that blatantly obvious when i recruit pugs for groups, so they know well before we get into the instance that i’m not skipping or exploiting anything xD.

The best way to describe the fight is like fighting on Skyhammer, if you watch your positioning it wont be that bad, if you stand wherever you want she’s going to push and pull you into so many spider eggs lol…

AndrewSX.3794:

TAFU is perfectly fine.

There are only 2 issues:
-adds should despawn after wipe
-it’s a pugbuster. Thus a lot of crying.

That’s it.

If the bolded section were the case i’d be ok with there being no cap on spider spawns.

Path1 / “Top/Left” Fyonna? … the one with all the Petrify spam Recluses?
Heh, Too easy as long as you have 2 guardians chain spamming stability boons…

…Too hard if you have any other mix of classes that are generally considered unwanted in dungeons = necro/ranger/engie/etc… …or classes that just make it progressively HARDER the more of them there b/c they’re really redundant: Ele/Thief/Necro

Before Anet even THINKS of adding more dungeon paths or tweaking the ones that we already have, they need to do something about the total lack of group-Might buffing & Stability+Reflect options for most classes that aren’t Guardian/Warrior/Mes

(They also need to stop adding content that kills ranger Pets instantly)

I don’t like any of TA to be honest. F/U was probably the worst of the 3 (debatable). It’s replacement content. Not really sure how I feel about that. I’d rather them add new content. Most feedback from that path was that players hated it. I don’t think it will be missed much.

ilr.9675:

Too easy as long as you have 2 guardians chain spamming stability boons…

…Too hard if you have any other mix of classes that are generally considered unwanted in dungeons = necro/ranger/engie/etc… …or ones that just make it progressively HARDER the more of them there b/c they’re really redundant: Ele/Thief/Necro

Reflect skills but yeah your point is still valid.

Guardian/Mes/Wars is the best combo for this.

What a shame I’m still miles behind completing all dungeon paths. Looks like I lose out on this one.

players are only up in arms because something is being removed. Doesn’t matter what it is, and they would still be “up in arms”

No you don’t lose out. It replaces it.

Durzlla.6295:

AndrewSX.3794:

TAFU is perfectly fine.

There are only 2 issues:
-adds should despawn after wipe
-it’s a pugbuster. Thus a lot of crying.

That’s it.

If the bolded section were the case i’d be ok with there being no cap on spider spawns.

There is no cap cause you’re supposed to dodge the summoning skill, or take down the tree before they overcome you.

Which in both cases, makes it a pugbuster.

Thus, the tears.

The not- despawing IS a issue, but fixing that would have fixed the whole path.

Lucky.9421:

ilr.9675:

Too easy as long as you have 2 guardians chain spamming stability boons…

…Too hard if you have any other mix of classes that are generally considered unwanted in dungeons = necro/ranger/engie/etc… …or ones that just make it progressively HARDER the more of them there b/c they’re really redundant: Ele/Thief/Necro

Reflect skills but yeah your point is still valid.

Guardian/Mes/Wars is the best combo for this.

yah i know i edited to try and cover the NEW™ holy trinity there…
(Might stacking / Stabil / Reflect)

The reason people hated F/U was because the final boss was too hard. They could have simply changed that.

It almost seems they are removing it to spite all those who complained. Kind of like what a child would do.

It doesn’t matter if some people personally hate TA F/U or love it that’s not the issue the fact that they are willing to do this with one path in one dungeon means that they may remove other paths in different dungeons in the future. This is not cool.

Is adding a whole new 4th path really that hard to do? The correct answer is no, it’s not.

@ilr to quote the great comedian Eddie Izzard. “I’m covered in bees. AHHHH”

@Faowri, you’ll still be able to obtain dungeon completion, you simply will have to do the new dungeon path instead of forward/up, granted you will still miss out on the forward/up path content… which i realize now is probably what you were refering to.

I hated this path, could never get it done and it was an all or nothing path (if you screwed up initially on last boss, GL)

Nuking this path is good. Maybe I can finally get my Dungeon Master.

I lose out on a path that was there before, and now isn’t. No warning of it, and no real reason that the content had to be removed, aside from I’m guessing it’s cheaper to reuse an existing dungeon path than to build a new one.

I’m not opposed to changes in content that actually develop the world, but this a) doesn’t really develop anything, and b) is Scarlet, therefore I hate it already.

EDIT: To clarify further, it’s not the achievement I care about. I’m more story-driven, so it grieves me more to not be able to see that aspect of it. Guess I’ll catch a youtube vid at some point instead.

KOPPER.1458:

players are only up in arms because something is being removed. Doesn’t matter what it is, and they would still be “up in arms”

^ this this this

Or pretty much anything Anet does, there will be someone to whine for the sake of whining.

Give everybody 10g upon dungeon completion, someone will whine.
Give a precursor at end of personal story, someone will whine.
Introduce new WvW maps, someone will whine.

Doesn’t matter if it’s good overall. Any minute negative detail will be exposed by the forumites and overblown.

So many people here are missing why people complained about this path. It’s because the final boss didn’t reset properly.

This does not mean the entire path needed to be removed.

If it was the path with the one shot bees then this is terrible news. Otherwise the other paths are terrible so i don’t really care.

colesy.8490:

So many people here are missing why people complained about this path. It’s because the final boss didn’t reset properly.

This does not mean the entire path needed to be removed.

Oh?
I am quite certain we saw quite a bit of complaining about the dungeon even before the change that stopped the boss from resetting.

So, TA-Forward Up had some issues. Some people didn’t like it. Some did. But now it will be gone. Forever.

#1: TA-Forward-Up’s PROBLEM
I played it, and it’s punishing. for the most part, that’s fine. Good even. The real problem with the path was how the final boss would not properly reset. The path was made BAD because of a BUG (spiders not despawning, making the fight increasingly difficult when it is failed one or more times).

#2: THE IMPLICATIONS
If Anet’s solution to buggy content is to REMOVE it, I see terrible things coming for some much loved parts of GW2. That aspect alone is worrisome at best. One could argue it was similar to TA/FF, but it still had a unique storyline. Is this the end of the world thatkittenwas removed? Nope. Do we deserve an official response from Anet explaining their logic behind it and if they plan to do more of this? Yes. Very yes.

#3: THE BIGGER QUESTION
It has been brought up in posts, and I agree; there is a problem with the living story’s model. Actually several. Most importantly, the fact that the living story can NEVER touch Zhaitan or ‘fixed’ parts of the GW2 storyline. It also can NEVER be 100% permanent besides ‘aftermaths’, otherwise it’s not exactly a time-based story telling. We can’t fight other dragons, because in the world’s lore, Zhaitan has become a Schrodinger’s Cat, both alive and dead, forever. The TA rework comes into play here because it doesn’t change the world, it tweaks it. It arbitrarily removes a path, to make room for another. Moreover, I think people are a little antsy because this makes Scarlet a more or less permanent fixture in the world, so how could we kill her? Ever? And most of all, she has no connections to Elona, Cantha, the Dragons, or any greater plot. Her plot is this random new thing that has cropped up.

#4: CONCLUSION
These are just my thoughts. I love the idea of the living story, but it feels kitten right now. I want them to take a firm stance: is Personal Story separate or linked with the living world? How are they going to handle bigger stories? Because Living story doesn’t seem up to the task. I am getting burnt out on hype, and wanting what everyone else does; I want to see permanent changes to the world which build on it, which just add when possible, and only subtract when absolutely necessary. I want to see the wealth of lore and characters already available come together, and most of all I want to feel like a true hero; one in a thousand, not one OF a thousand. I want to believe the living story can do this, and the Queen’s Jubilee was an amazing step. I wish Anet would come out and SAY ‘Some of these patches will be small. Some will be really big! Expect it to be that way!’, because now they keep glossing it over like every patch is revolutionary, but they aren’t. Some are just pretty good, and some are very temporary. But that’s it for my ramblings. For those who read, thank you, and I would love to hear your thoughts.

Dialogue that will be removed:

Morrigu: Rest well, my darling, Leurent. War led you to this place, and may peace finally embrace you as I once did.

Morrigu: I will mourn my lost love later. Ahead if Fyonna. And her children. Spiders. So horrible. All their legs, crawling all over me…

Morrigu: We will stop Fyonna. All I ask is that if I falter in battle, you stand by my side. Don’t leave me to them.

Fyonna: Oh, my children. There it is.

Fyonna: Now, don’t worry about your mother. I won’t be different. Just stronger.

Morrigu: Fyonna, Countess of Spiders, stand away from the tree. I cannot let you claim Faolain’s prize.

Fyonna: But my children sing to me. Listen.

Fyonna: They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family. As their mother, I have to grant them their wish.

Let’s wildy speculate on why they’re removing a path instead of simply adding one!

• They want to spite all those who bombed the forum with F/U posts.
• GW2 population is now so low that it can’t support one more dungeon as it would spread players out too much.
• Their code is so poor that they can’t change how many Explorable paths are in each dungeon.

Edited last one, as Arah has 4 Explorable modes.

so go play the path now. You have until patch tomorrow. And you’ve had a chance since launch.

KOPPER.1458:

so go play the path now. You have until patch tomorrow. And you’ve had a chance since launch.

Noooooooo, don’t do it! (lol)

Lord Kuru.3685:

Let’s wildy speculate on why they’re removing a path instead of simply adding one!

Their code is so poor that they can’t have more than 3 Explorable modes.

Oh?
I am quite sure they already have a dungeon with 4 Explorable Modes.

“Let’s wildy speculate on why they’re removing a path instead of simply adding one!”

A net hates fun and wanted to messy up your day.

Seems just as reasonable as anything else suggested.

Not able to at the moment, and wouldn’t rush to do it overnight if I could. Please don’t make the mistake of thinking I’m gutted by this. Just disappointed by what appears to be more bad communication and poor decision-making on content courtesy of the Living World.

Vol.5241:

I hated this path, could never get it done and it was an all or nothing path (if you screwed up initially on last boss, GL)

Nuking this path is good. Maybe I can finally get my Dungeon Master.

Imagine how easy it would have been to fix your problem by either getting better at the game and actually paying attention or to run in a decent group that can carry you or to buy a run off someone.

" carry you or to buy a run off someone." Both of these options seem like great fun in a game.

A big fail to consider also, is this REMOVES great lore and background about caithe and sylvari, and some nice cutscenes. This should not have happened Anet.

AndrewSX.3794:

Durzlla.6295:

AndrewSX.3794:

TAFU is perfectly fine.

There are only 2 issues:
-adds should despawn after wipe
-it’s a pugbuster. Thus a lot of crying.

That’s it.

If the bolded section were the case i’d be ok with there being no cap on spider spawns.

There is no cap cause you’re supposed to dodge the summoning skill, or take down the tree before they overcome you.

Which in both cases, makes it a pugbuster.

Thus, the tears.

The not- despawing IS a issue, but fixing that would have fixed the whole path.

Well there -was- a cap (so long as you stayed in the room, if everyone left the room the cap on the # of spawns reset), they removed it in the same patch that the spiders agroed when you hit her. But yeah, as i said as long as the spiders despawn i’m all for there being no cap, i’d actually encourage that because it makes it more skill based.

dreadicon.5840:

If Anet’s solution to buggy content is to REMOVE it, I see terrible things coming for some much loved parts of GW2.

O HAI… U MUST B NEW HEER ….. http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Smiter%27s_Boon_%28PvP%29

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

A big fail to consider also, is this REMOVES great lore and background about caithe and sylvari, and some nice cutscenes. This should not have happened Anet.

What makes people so sure that it will be removed?
How can we know that it is not simply added elsewhere?

well we know the path is removed. We do not know about the lore.

We know scarlet is getting in, and scarlet had nothing to do with the old path, i see few room left for the old lore implemented in this path still.

ilr.9675:

Path1 / “Top/Left” Fyonna? … the one with all the Petrify spam Recluses?
Heh, Too easy as long as you have 2 guardians chain spamming stability boons…

…Too hard if you have any other mix of classes that are generally considered unwanted in dungeons = necro/ranger/engie/etc… …or classes that just make it progressively HARDER the more of them there b/c they’re really redundant: Ele/Thief/Necro

Before Anet even THINKS of adding more dungeon paths or tweaking the ones that we already have, they need to do something about the total lack of group-Might buffing & Stability+Reflect options for most classes that aren’t Guardian/Warrior/Mes

(They also need to stop adding content that kills ranger Pets instantly)

I only play ranger and have had literally 0 issue with recluses ever… my group normally is a zerker burst guardian, me as a support oriented ranger, a venom thief, a glass warrior, and a pug.

KOPPER.1458:

" carry you or to buy a run off someone." Both of these options seem like great fun in a game.

If he wanted dungeon master badly enough he’d pay for it.

Instead, he thinks remotely challenging content should be removed because it forces you to use more than a single brain cell.

Durzlla.6295:

I only play ranger and have had literally 0 issue with recluses ever… my group normally is a zerker burst guardian, me as a support oriented ranger, a venom thief, a glass warrior, and a pug.

This tells us absolutely nothing about how you dealt with the immense amount of poison & Control Spam in that pop-up “land-mine” laden room…. please be more specific or include a video. Thanks…

colesy.8490:

Instead, he thinks remotely challenging content should be removed because it forces you to use more than a single brain cell.

Oh, I am rather sure people complained about how hard Aetherblade Retreat and Molten Alliance Facility were back when they were released, and it is the same team that have done this one. So don’t assume it will be easy or easier than the path it replaces. It is a lvl 80 path after all.

colesy.8490:

If he wanted dungeon master badly enough he’d pay for it.

Instead, he thinks remotely challenging content should be removed because it forces you to use more than a single brain cell.

Well Anet listened to overwhelming feedback and nuked it. So there.

Most explorable paths have really low production quality anyway, due to obviously being rushed at the end of the development cycle, and should be replaced.

AR, MF and, seemingly, TA look to be closer to the AAA level of production that GW2 deserves.

lordkrall is suggesting the lore could be else where. Perhaps not in the path but still in the world.

ilr.9675:

Durzlla.6295:

I only play ranger and have had literally 0 issue with recluses ever… my group normally is a zerker burst guardian, me as a support oriented ranger, a venom thief, a glass warrior, and a pug.

This tells us absolutely nothing about how you dealt with the immense amount of poison & Control Spam in that pop-up “land-mine” laden room…. please be more specific or include a video. Thanks…

Focus Recluses and healing spring + shake it off being OP? the most recluses you ever encounter is 3, guardian pulls them all together, warrior, guardian, and me blast them down with AoE. It’s pretty simple…

Not to mention that Me, the Warrior, and the Guardian are all PvPers so we take stun breakers into just about every situation.

Vol.5241:

KOPPER.1458:

players are only up in arms because something is being removed. Doesn’t matter what it is, and they would still be “up in arms”

^ this this this

Or pretty much anything Anet does, there will be someone to whine for the sake of whining.

Give everybody 10g upon dungeon completion, someone will whine.
Give a precursor at end of personal story, someone will whine.
Introduce new WvW maps, someone will whine.

Doesn’t matter if it’s good overall. Any minute negative detail will be exposed by the forumites and overblown.

Yes, everyone who complains about anything is a whiner. There are no legitimate arguments, this game is perfect. We all should sit silently and bow to our Anet lords. These “generalize everyone who complains” arguments are as tired and old as the people who whine all the day to begin with. Please stop.

Every MMO player should be up in arms about content REMOVAL. MMOs are built on the very aspect of tons of content with new stuff added in, NOT REPLACED. This sets a bad precedent, instead of improving/fixing existing content it gets replaced in a messy, retconned way to satisfy the current story line. I was under the impression that content from the base game would not be subject to just disappearing like the living story stuff, apparently I was wrong. I am especially worried if this is their way of revamping dungeons that they talk about previously. Make a dungeon for the living story and somehow force it into an existing “bad” path. This game is barely a year old and we are already taking content out, baffles my mind.

It’s not the recluses that do huge damage. It’s the little ones.

KOPPER.1458:

No you don’t lose out. It replaces it.

If all you care about is the achievement. If you care about experiencing all the content in the game, sucks to be anyone who doesn’t get it done by tomorrow.