Guild Wars 2

What do you think (other than the AoE stunbreak, Rebound, and ability to increase boon duration) that Tempest does that Elementalist could not? Now that they can’t even copy boons except for might (which they could stack to 25 stacks as base Elementalist), what role does Tempest fill that base Elementalist couldn’t?

Can you tell me one thing that Tempest gets that would sell anyone on the idea of playing Tempest over Elementalist?

I don’t think “more auras” is an answer anyone would hear and go “Dear lord I really want to play Tempest now!”

At this point, I think it’s mainly just trying to create a substitution for arcane builds by providing a gameplay style that doesn’t depend on constantly swapping attunements, the imbued melodies rework is evidence of that.

The problem is that synergy and cooldown management between arcane and water is just too good, to the point where tempest won’t be a wise choice unless one or both those trees get heavily nerfed. It conflicts with classic ele design because it’s trying to promote less attunement swapping. If the overloads were actually good, and arcane traits weren’t, then I think it could actually work. With stability they’ll have a fighting chance, but still the cooldown for using them is too steep for the benefit they can bring.

At least for the coming weekend Tempest has a fast-resetting stunbreak that doesn’t eat a utility skill slot and pretty much invites people to CC you → close for the kill → get a face full of overload.

Karl McLain.5604:

Following up on the Stunbreak conversation: This is something we’ve talked about in the past and felt like it might just be way too strong. However, it still sounds like way too much fun to not try it out… so I’m going to change them over and we’ll see what that plays like in BWE3.
Please keep in mind that this will be a test and we may have to compensate for or remove it at some point in the future, if it’s too strong.

-Karl

nearlight.3064:

At this point, I think it’s mainly just trying to create a substitution for arcane builds by providing a gameplay style that doesn’t depend on constantly swapping attunements, the imbued melodies rework is evidence of that.

Yeah sure, but to me Tempest just feels like they added extra skills onto elementalist rather than actually made it, you know, DIFFERENT.

Mystletainn.6285:

nearlight.3064:

At this point, I think it’s mainly just trying to create a substitution for arcane builds by providing a gameplay style that doesn’t depend on constantly swapping attunements, the imbued melodies rework is evidence of that.

Yeah sure, but to me Tempest just feels like they added extra skills onto elementalist rather than actually made it, you know, DIFFERENT.

Well the core gameplay style is different. In the first two betas I couldn’t really get a build without arcane to work, while builds that did use arcane felt like they were too much of an immobile bunker.

I also feel like the complaints that elite specs should offer drastically different things to the class is a bit misplaced. The only specs that had gotten significantly different things in their elite spec were chronomancer and reaper, and those things were designed to give them ways to cover up their deficiencies. Chronomancer is getting an offhand that lets non stealth builds survive and wells that give it AoE damage (the thing they lacked the most) and ways to generate clones outside of dueling traits. Reaper is getting cleave, which necromancer was extremely deficient in, as well as scaling defenses (unholy martyr was the closet the base class really had). Theres DH too, with long ranged combat, but I’m not convinced its strong or worthwhile.

But none of the other elite specs got something really new or different. Berserker got more burn/condition output (which it has in lesser amounts on longbow), daredevil was basically an unnerfed version of prepatch acrobatics. And Tempest, while it is derivative of base elementalist roles, it attempts to do that while offering a playstyle that isn’t based on attunement swapping, and to me, thats as different as an elite spec can get.

nearlight.3064:

Mystletainn.6285:

nearlight.3064:

At this point, I think it’s mainly just trying to create a substitution for arcane builds by providing a gameplay style that doesn’t depend on constantly swapping attunements, the imbued melodies rework is evidence of that.

Yeah sure, but to me Tempest just feels like they added extra skills onto elementalist rather than actually made it, you know, DIFFERENT.

Well the core gameplay style is different. In the first two betas I couldn’t really get a build without arcane to work, while builds that did use arcane felt like they were too much of an immobile bunker.

I also feel like the complaints that elite specs should offer drastically different things to the class is a bit misplaced. The only specs that had gotten significantly different things in their elite spec were chronomancer and reaper, and those things were designed to give them ways to cover up their deficiencies. Chronomancer is getting an offhand that lets non stealth builds survive and wells that give it AoE damage (the thing they lacked the most) and ways to generate clones outside of dueling traits. Reaper is getting cleave, which necromancer was extremely deficient in, as well as scaling defenses (unholy martyr was the closet the base class really had). Theres DH too, with long ranged combat, but I’m not convinced its strong or worthwhile.

But none of the other elite specs got something really new or different. Berserker got more burn/condition output (which it has in lesser amounts on longbow), daredevil was basically an unnerfed version of prepatch acrobatics. And Tempest, while it is derivative of base elementalist roles, it attempts to do that while offering a playstyle that isn’t based on attunement swapping, and to me, thats as different as an elite spec can get.

Daredevil: Got better interrupts, got a build revolving around interrupts, got a build revolving around endurance, got access to a block and a finisher (EDIT: I mean their elite). They also got more access to more combo finishers which they severely lacked on pistol/pistol. They effectively have Mesmer’s Daze mantra + Powerblock on a single utility skill and have access to slow, a very powerful condition.

Berserker: Got access to taunts, got access to an “undying” trait, got access to burns which they didn’t have, got access to chaining burst skills back to back (EDIT: I mean reaching max adrenaline to burst for Cleansing Ire/Zerker power as well), got access to a ton of stunbreaks and an elite 3 second on demand stun. Also got access to a fire field which they only had on longbow. They got ranged options on all of their primal bursts. They got utility skills which granted them more movement, more reflects, etc. They can not only do condition damage more reliably, they can tank with the taunt built in and reflect projectiles for allies while also massively cc’ing enemies.

Dragonhunter: Got access to traps which included more aegis, reveal, etc. Has the ability to keep enemies in one location with both their elite trap and their longbow 5. They got access to near perma stab with a trait, they have access to a ton of consistent knockback (which they didn’t really have), got access to tons of cripple (which was something they severely lacked), got access to more projectile blocking, more gap closers on their f2, and they have a dps ranged weapon they didn’t have, not to mention a second shield which also blocks attacks in a direction allowing them to tank all damage for allies effectively on top of already have WoR. Also they have access to AoE vigor now. They can also spear an entire zerg or group of enemies with their f1 if they take radiance and massively burn people.

Herald: Massive support, I shouldn’t even have to talk about this one since I’m not experienced enough in Rev but it’s also pretty self explanatory. Shield blocks and heals as well.

What did you mean when they got “nothing new” or “different”? They have the ability to do things they could of never done! What does Tempest have? More of the same thing.

nearlight.3064:

Mystletainn.6285:

nearlight.3064:

At this point, I think it’s mainly just trying to create a substitution for arcane builds by providing a gameplay style that doesn’t depend on constantly swapping attunements, the imbued melodies rework is evidence of that.

Yeah sure, but to me Tempest just feels like they added extra skills onto elementalist rather than actually made it, you know, DIFFERENT.

Well the core gameplay style is different. In the first two betas I couldn’t really get a build without arcane to work, while builds that did use arcane felt like they were too much of an immobile bunker.

I also feel like the complaints that elite specs should offer drastically different things to the class is a bit misplaced. The only specs that had gotten significantly different things in their elite spec were chronomancer and reaper, and those things were designed to give them ways to cover up their deficiencies. Chronomancer is getting an offhand that lets non stealth builds survive and wells that give it AoE damage (the thing they lacked the most) and ways to generate clones outside of dueling traits. Reaper is getting cleave, which necromancer was extremely deficient in, as well as scaling defenses (unholy martyr was the closet the base class really had). Theres DH too, with long ranged combat, but I’m not convinced its strong or worthwhile.

But none of the other elite specs got something really new or different. Berserker got more burn/condition output (which it has in lesser amounts on longbow), daredevil was basically an unnerfed version of prepatch acrobatics. And Tempest, while it is derivative of base elementalist roles, it attempts to do that while offering a playstyle that isn’t based on attunement swapping, and to me, thats as different as an elite spec can get.

You can build a Daredevil around the enitre Pulminary Strike trait. You can build a ranged dps based around cripple and knockback to peel for your squishies or a melee bunker Dragonhunter that lays traps behind them to stop enemies from getting past. You can build a Warrior built around stunbreaking everything (and Berserker can do it better than base Warrior) or burn people in massive AoE or even make a glass cannon Berserker revolving around Endure Pain trait and the revival trait to allow a “blow load and be unable to die” or a build revolving around confusion on interrupt with the new Mace Burst skill doing confusion on top of the trait and the new interrupts provided by the new utiltiies. There are so many builds that these new elites provide in their trait line or amplify in other trait lines (and I’m not mentioning Reaper/Chronomancer because you already know how different they are.)

Look at Tempest. There already existed an Aura build and now your new build is about… Auras? I mean, if your build is running around Auras, you’d take Aurashare, but the same time shouts literally stomp on Aurashare because it provides AoE auras already. If it’s healing you want, well base Ele already does that too. Oh I know, it’s the amount of conditions it brings… except it only brings conditions that Ele already had. Other than the AoE stunbreak, Sand Squall and Heat Sync were the only things that felt unique (extending all boons by 2 seconds and sharing boons) at any given pont. Yeah, sure, Tempest can be an even more dedicated healer, but once again, that’s not something new that they got. Rebound is the most new thing they have but it doesn’t even feel like an Elementalist trait. “Oh you revive if you die. Why can an elementalist do this? We ran out of ideas.” What can you build, really, except for auras for Tempest? Overload traits are super selfish instead of supporty (not to mention you can’t take a single trait that affects overloads in any of the other trait lines other than maybe on-crit or bonus healing or boon duration) and shouts don’t do anything Ele already couldn’t do. If you wanted to make a “might on fire aura” build you could of literally just range Focus offhand + Aurashare + 3x conjure weapons (with one being Flame Axe) with Conjurer Trait to keep a near 100% uptime of Fire Auras and upkeep that might (EDIT: Flame Axe has a leap finisher for more Fire Aura). Base Ele could do it, and because the auras are so weak and kitten to begin with (other than Magnetic Aura really, everything only works when you take damage, meaning if you play smart and don’t take damage you’re wasting said auras) Tempest doesn’t actually bring anything more except for “more Magnetic Aura” at best.

I would of preferred to see an elite named Eye of the Storm here (and have EotS be renamed to something different). The idea would be:
Channel for 2~ seconds and make a ring of wind at 600 range around you which enemies cannot pass. At the end of the channel, grant allies shocking aura and knockback and damage enemies outside of the 600 range ring and leave behind. Allies outside of the ring are given 15s swiftness while those inside the ring are given 10s regeneration, 4s resistance, and 4s 2 stacks of stability.
(You know, as a tempest support your allies which an actual STORM where your allies get to stay in the eye of the storm (instead of EotS just being a stupid lightning bolt that would never hit in the eye of a real storm) and as the eye of a real storm is calm, it would grant stabi and resistance inside to symbolize the “peace” that is found at the eye of a storm.)

Mystletainn.6285:

nearlight.3064:

Mystletainn.6285:

nearlight.3064:

At this point, I think it’s mainly just trying to create a substitution for arcane builds by providing a gameplay style that doesn’t depend on constantly swapping attunements, the imbued melodies rework is evidence of that.

Yeah sure, but to me Tempest just feels like they added extra skills onto elementalist rather than actually made it, you know, DIFFERENT.

Well the core gameplay style is different. In the first two betas I couldn’t really get a build without arcane to work, while builds that did use arcane felt like they were too much of an immobile bunker.

I also feel like the complaints that elite specs should offer drastically different things to the class is a bit misplaced. The only specs that had gotten significantly different things in their elite spec were chronomancer and reaper, and those things were designed to give them ways to cover up their deficiencies. Chronomancer is getting an offhand that lets non stealth builds survive and wells that give it AoE damage (the thing they lacked the most) and ways to generate clones outside of dueling traits. Reaper is getting cleave, which necromancer was extremely deficient in, as well as scaling defenses (unholy martyr was the closet the base class really had). Theres DH too, with long ranged combat, but I’m not convinced its strong or worthwhile.

But none of the other elite specs got something really new or different. Berserker got more burn/condition output (which it has in lesser amounts on longbow), daredevil was basically an unnerfed version of prepatch acrobatics. And Tempest, while it is derivative of base elementalist roles, it attempts to do that while offering a playstyle that isn’t based on attunement swapping, and to me, thats as different as an elite spec can get.

Daredevil: Got better interrupts, got a build revolving around interrupts, got a build revolving around endurance, got access to a block and a finisher (EDIT: I mean their elite). They also got more access to more combo finishers which they severely lacked on pistol/pistol. They effectively have Mesmer’s Daze mantra + Powerblock on a single utility skill and have access to slow, a very powerful condition.

Berserker: Got access to taunts, got access to an “undying” trait, got access to burns which they didn’t have, got access to chaining burst skills back to back (EDIT: I mean reaching max adrenaline to burst for Cleansing Ire/Zerker power as well), got access to a ton of stunbreaks and an elite 3 second on demand stun. Also got access to a fire field which they only had on longbow. They got ranged options on all of their primal bursts. They got utility skills which granted them more movement, more reflects, etc. They can not only do condition damage more reliably, they can tank with the taunt built in and reflect projectiles for allies while also massively cc’ing enemies.

Dragonhunter: Got access to traps which included more aegis, reveal, etc. Has the ability to keep enemies in one location with both their elite trap and their longbow 5. They got access to near perma stab with a trait, they have access to a ton of consistent knockback (which they didn’t really have), got access to tons of cripple (which was something they severely lacked), got access to more projectile blocking, more gap closers on their f2, and they have a dps ranged weapon they didn’t have, not to mention a second shield which also blocks attacks in a direction allowing them to tank all damage for allies effectively on top of already have WoR. Also they have access to AoE vigor now. They can also spear an entire zerg or group of enemies with their f1 if they take radiance and massively burn people.

Herald: Massive support, I shouldn’t even have to talk about this one since I’m not experienced enough in Rev but it’s also pretty self explanatory. Shield blocks and heals as well.

What did you mean when they got “nothing new” or “different”? They have the ability to do things they could of never done! What does Tempest have? More of the same thing.

Well theres superspeed, stunbreak for allies, and a lot more group healing than before. There was also boon control in the fire warhorn skills, that was apparently too strong. And I don’t know why you can’t understand that Tempest is supposed to be a different playstyle that allows non-arcane builds to exist, its just not fully there yet. That is the defition of a DIFFERENT kittenING PLAYSTYLE.

And honestly because you and most of the people on this forum are so kitten over tempest not being completely OP like the rest of base elementalist, you have to realize that the dev’s are approaching tempest much more cautiously than the other elite specs, since elementalist isn’t horribly deficient in anyone thing that is integral to their meta status in all game modes unlike most of the other classes, so they have to be careful with the new things they add to it. I mean do you really think that adding taunt and slow and resistance in huge amounts to the the ele’s kit would be healthy for the game? Why do you think they’re nerfing heat sync/wildfire? Its because they’d rather not create more of a monster than what they’ve already created.

And as we all know that if they handle balancing ele the wrong way, it will completely fall apart because its dependent on a specific set of trait synergies to stay alive, and its been carried by the fact that boosts to both condition and direct damage are in fire (engi used to have this too, but anet gutted that) and both healing and condition management is in water with arcane and swap bonuses holding it all together. The devs will either reallocate the spread of what trait lines can do what like they did to gut cele engi, or they can limit the effectiveness of everything to the point that there is no hope.

And the reason that I bring this up is that I beleive that Tempest could save base ele after its been rebalanced in the next patch, and I honestly think they’re taking their time to prepare that, so that the 3 existing traitlines used in most pvp levels are brought down to tempest levels of efficiency.

Anyway, I’m tired and I’m getting ranty, so I’m going to decline to argument further for now, and I merely suggest that you try looking at Tempest in the larger scheme of the game, especially in regards to its viability being hinged on future balance.

Healing on auras is new, stronger self protection, now there seems to be a lighting attk for your pt, pAoE that move, water field on an off hand? and aoe super speed. All i can think of on-top of your aoe stun brakes and +2 sec boons after they are on ppl and the elite (you do know just becuse you say “other then” dose not mean they are off the table for countering your point.)

nearlight.3064:

Mystletainn.6285:

nearlight.3064:

Mystletainn.6285:

nearlight.3064:

At this point, I think it’s mainly just trying to create a substitution for arcane builds by providing a gameplay style that doesn’t depend on constantly swapping attunements, the imbued melodies rework is evidence of that.

Yeah sure, but to me Tempest just feels like they added extra skills onto elementalist rather than actually made it, you know, DIFFERENT.

Well the core gameplay style is different. In the first two betas I couldn’t really get a build without arcane to work, while builds that did use arcane felt like they were too much of an immobile bunker.

I also feel like the complaints that elite specs should offer drastically different things to the class is a bit misplaced. The only specs that had gotten significantly different things in their elite spec were chronomancer and reaper, and those things were designed to give them ways to cover up their deficiencies. Chronomancer is getting an offhand that lets non stealth builds survive and wells that give it AoE damage (the thing they lacked the most) and ways to generate clones outside of dueling traits. Reaper is getting cleave, which necromancer was extremely deficient in, as well as scaling defenses (unholy martyr was the closet the base class really had). Theres DH too, with long ranged combat, but I’m not convinced its strong or worthwhile.

But none of the other elite specs got something really new or different. Berserker got more burn/condition output (which it has in lesser amounts on longbow), daredevil was basically an unnerfed version of prepatch acrobatics. And Tempest, while it is derivative of base elementalist roles, it attempts to do that while offering a playstyle that isn’t based on attunement swapping, and to me, thats as different as an elite spec can get.

Daredevil: Got better interrupts, got a build revolving around interrupts, got a build revolving around endurance, got access to a block and a finisher (EDIT: I mean their elite). They also got more access to more combo finishers which they severely lacked on pistol/pistol. They effectively have Mesmer’s Daze mantra + Powerblock on a single utility skill and have access to slow, a very powerful condition.

Berserker: Got access to taunts, got access to an “undying” trait, got access to burns which they didn’t have, got access to chaining burst skills back to back (EDIT: I mean reaching max adrenaline to burst for Cleansing Ire/Zerker power as well), got access to a ton of stunbreaks and an elite 3 second on demand stun. Also got access to a fire field which they only had on longbow. They got ranged options on all of their primal bursts. They got utility skills which granted them more movement, more reflects, etc. They can not only do condition damage more reliably, they can tank with the taunt built in and reflect projectiles for allies while also massively cc’ing enemies.

Dragonhunter: Got access to traps which included more aegis, reveal, etc. Has the ability to keep enemies in one location with both their elite trap and their longbow 5. They got access to near perma stab with a trait, they have access to a ton of consistent knockback (which they didn’t really have), got access to tons of cripple (which was something they severely lacked), got access to more projectile blocking, more gap closers on their f2, and they have a dps ranged weapon they didn’t have, not to mention a second shield which also blocks attacks in a direction allowing them to tank all damage for allies effectively on top of already have WoR. Also they have access to AoE vigor now. They can also spear an entire zerg or group of enemies with their f1 if they take radiance and massively burn people.

Herald: Massive support, I shouldn’t even have to talk about this one since I’m not experienced enough in Rev but it’s also pretty self explanatory. Shield blocks and heals as well.

What did you mean when they got “nothing new” or “different”? They have the ability to do things they could of never done! What does Tempest have? More of the same thing.

And honestly because you and most of the people on this forum are so kitten over tempest not being completely OP like the rest of base elementalist,

You didn’t even read my post did you?
I specifically asked for Anet to tell me how they want to sell me on Tempest. I never asked them to make Tempest OP. I want them to make an actual dedicated support class that, I don’t know, SUPPORTS ALLIES.
Tempset does not have more healing than base elementalist. Water overload goes directly against water attunement, meaning if you swap out of water to support allies you lose out on soothing mist + swap into water heal + dodgeroll. You heal for more by choosing not to overload.
This is why I’m asking for them to make Tempest a dedicated support. You know what they are at the moment? DPS on Overload and Elementalist+ extra auras. The heal on applying aura is terrible, auras are terrible, and the fact Aurashare and shouts are both mandatory yet go against each other for Auramancer is terrible. I’d like for Elementalist to boon share (O WAIT THEY REMOVED IT) or to mitigate damage (O WAIT ARCANE HAS THAT WITH PROTECTION) or buff up allies in ways they couldn’t before (O LOOK REBOUND and that’s it really). I don’t WANT dps on Overload. I don’t WANT to have skills that kill people. I was promised a support by Anet, but I didn’t get one.

This class brings more healing, sure ok. It brings more auras, sure ok. But the problem is Tempest doesn’t do anything different really. It really just does more of the same thing. Like I said, I appreciate the AoE stunbreak (most of which was removed with the new Warhorn trait I might add). Auras rely on allies taking damage to do minimal effects (1 might and 1 second of burning is not worth taking a massive hit for). It requires your allies to actively take damage which might kill them to be of any use. As the squishiest class in the game, if you want your shocking aura to not be completely wasted, you have to take a hit from a boss and risk getting one-shot just so the aura could have some effect.

Now if Tempest had a trait that made auras do more supporty things that doesn’t require them getting damaged to proc, I would really enjoy it. It would mean that Auramancer Tempest really is a new level of support at that point. In fact, put this in the same trait line as Stability on Overload so you really have to dedicate to support. Fire aura on allies turn add burning onto any projectile finishers; all incoming chill effects on ally is reduced while fire aura is on. Frost aura on allies chills nearby enemies; all incoming burning duration only allies is reduced. Shocking aura on allies is now consumed upon taking a hit: ally blocks said attack and stuns enemies near the attacker in an AoE. If ending without taking a hit, shocking aura instead grants super speed to said ally. Magnetic Aura makes outgoing CC 20% more effective. I think this would make auras actually desirable in a support aspect and no Tempest in pvp would ever want it over stability on overload.

nearlight.3064:

And Tempest, while it is derivative of base elementalist roles, it attempts to do that while offering a playstyle that isn’t based on attunement swapping, and to me, thats as different as an elite spec can get.

the part about the playstyle being less about attunement swapping is tempest’s only saving grace. the real issue is its role of close range support completely overlaps with existing D/? specs.

Well Mystletainn, just don’t buy the expansion if Tempest was the only thing that you were hoping for. Like I said, it will only appeal to you if you hate arcane builds.

nearlight.3064:

Well Mystletainn, just don’t buy the expansion if Tempest was the only thing that you were hoping for. Like I said, it will only appeal to you if you hate arcane builds.

Not even, Air/Arcane/Tempest does enough damage while still having reasonable healing and protection uptime.

My problem like I said is Tempest should provide support, not damage. The fact all they do to fix “overload not good enough” problem is upping the damage more is stupid.

I would not care if taking Tempest literally meant halving base Ele’s dps if it meant actually getting support that meant something.

Honestly if they really wanted to make something new they could take a page out of almost every other Elite Spec’s book and give some meaningful changes to the base class mechanic. Just about anything would be better than the idea that you put forward for Tempest.

I know that adding something new to a class that does almost everything is hard, but that should have been the chance for the developers to get some inspiration and try to really think outside of the box. It’s almost as if ANet ran out of ideas for the Tempest and just decided to cop-out on it with this whole “overload” system. My only hope is that it’s not too late for some major changes. I just wish that ANet would have taken the community’s advice earlier on in development and tried something else.

Edit: Shouts are okay, just need a bit of reworking to fit the motif.

This question was asked multiple of times but the answer usually boils down to anet devs having no clue what makes ele tick so how could they design a decent elite specialisation? We have the same exact build since almost launch after so many iterations of balance.

Tempest line seems designed not to synergize with water traited and this is realy good design. When you don´t have soothing mist, water swap heal, then overlaoding water gets much more meaningful. Also the shouts now can help to heal without using water.
Water can add healing and if you focus on that you take both for warhorn and some shouts, but i think its more efficient to take water for classic healing/cantrips or tempest. The only thing is i am not shure shouts can substitute cantrips without being instant.

Wolfric.9380:

Tempest line seems designed not to synergize with water traited and this is realy good design. When you don´t have soothing mist, water swap heal, then overlaoding water gets much more meaningful. Also the shouts now can help to heal without using water.
Water can add healing and if you focus on that you take both for warhorn and some shouts, but i think its more efficient to take water for classic healing/cantrips or tempest. The only thing is i am not shure shouts can substitute cantrips without being instant.

From a real stand point what line synergize with other lines on ele? That just kind of how ele works if you want to use fire skills you go down the fire line getting cdr and more dmg in fire and strong effect when casting fire skills. There some cantrip things but ele’s utility effects are all over and your simply not going to see shouts + effect on any other lines of ele other then tempest the only line that can use it.

Ele as a base class is 2 things auras and element types (mind you that 4 different ones.) So you make a line give effects to aura or a set element. Most of the lines do that in one way or another even tempest line dose this. So in a lot of ways tempest line is a lot like the arcain line for ele having effects on all atuments (overloading auras) all though arcain line has swap boons and evasion effects. The thing is tempest line has aura effects healing on aura application where arcain line has nothing to realty do with auras (i guess there the reiv skill but that more on the lines of atument types then auras).

As for the utility your not going to see any existing lines have any thing to do with shots and your not going to see any new lines have any thing to do with the old utility. It simply would not fit. Why would say water give you the abitly to have reg on shout when you cant use shouts unless you have the tempest line? Why would you need to have effects on the tempest line to help cantrips when you already have a water line devoted to added cantrip effects?

So there is synergize but in the way of ele synergize as in auras and atuments the only real synergize system ele has.

The simple way to think of it is each atument line (fire water air and earth) are about that element mostly and something to do with auras (boons on auras or making auras).
Arcain line is about atument but all of them and nearly nothing to do with auras.

Tempest is less about atuments (auras on overloade and swap to water not sure about this one it dose not fit to me) and a good bit to do with auras mainly the healing on auras and shouts.

I enjoyed tempest the last beta. although I found myself playing it with staff. (fire field+fire tornado= lots of burns)

I do like that they added pulsing bleeds to earth’s overtune and the stability as well. I don’t know how well it’ll synergize with other things.

the problem is…Ele was already in a good place. They didn’t want to suddenly add something that made it so much better nobody would ever NOT play it.

That was a fear that they probably had with some other specializations.

Thankfully I’ve noticed on the base specializations I was actually able to kill the elites fairly easily because they do have a “you get THIS. but you lose THIS”

the tempest doesn’t have that. It’s just like…oh here, have this extra stuff, pick which traitline you want to replace.