Guild Wars 2

Wolfric.9380:

Flat -20% condi duration would propably the easiest thing to implement …..

That’s not really condition ‘removal’ though.

Most likely it’s either gonna be ‘remove condition(s) when applying protection[/stability]’ or a cheap ‘cleanse X conditions every Y seconds’.

Since they discovered that idea of ‘normalizing’ traits, numbers for the latter option might as well be X = 1 and Y = 10, because I guess for ANet it would seem appropiate to ‘normalize’ an ele grandmaster trait to the powerlevel of other professions adept traits after they already started ‘normalizing’ ele major traits to the powerlevel of other professions minor traits.

I can’t see a reason why Ele does not get resistance.

’Provides Resistance for 3s every time you switch to Earth Attunement ’

Will cleansing fire be the new Diamond skin?

3s resistance on swap will be garbage. A cleanse does not fit earth. Well it can be something like cleanse on protection but this would be powerful. cleanse on stability would be weak / very build specific and i would never use it. I do not use DS currently. It must be something i take to counter especially condi reaper or its out for me.

This would be great:
You are imune to chill. Nothing more …

Wolfric.9380:

3s resistance on swap will be garbage. A cleanse does not fit earth. Well it can be something like cleanse on protection but this would be powerful. cleanse on stability would be weak / very build specific and i would never use it. I do not use DS currently. It must be something i take to counter especially condi reaper or its out for me.

This would be great:
You are imune to chill. Nothing more …

It will be a cleanse/removal effect, they already explicitly stated that. No more immunity/avoidance. This of course means you can forget about the new effect ‘countering’ condi reaper and the likes, as pure condition builds easily overwhelm even multiple cleanses.

I would love for a strong condi removal option in Earth, if only to finally free myself from taking Water for once.

Glenstorm.4059:

I would love for a strong condi removal option in Earth, if only to finally free myself from taking Water for once.

Exactly my opinion, I don’t have water on my build and I don’t want to go to the days back that I have to.

Considering the Resistance spam of the Revenant, I have no idea why earth attunement could not have it also.

Remove 1 condition every 5 seconds while affected by Protection.

Diamond skin – each tick of a damaging condition gives you 1 second of resistance (1 sec ICD).

hue

Sunshine.5014:

That would be fun haha. 2v2 Ele + Reaper will be so imba.

Ele with any class in a 2v2 is kind of op already becuse the game nor ele is made for 1v1 set up. If it was then most skill would be singil target and not aoe aimed. Effect that ele has that is self only are out of places for the ele class and realy out of places for every class in GW2 (unless you can make an effect aoe in a set up such as aoe on auras).

So i think diamond skin will be an hp % effect that removes condition from you and your team may be lower hp = more remove or high hp = more remove i am not sure witch way they will go with it. But images an ever 10 sec condition remove but on an aoe would be nice all though not GM strong maybe 2 ever 10 sec at an set hp.

Dristig.9678:

Remove 1 condition every 5 seconds while affected by Protection.

What about every time you apply protection you remove a condition earth overlord would be godly. That with aura protection i could see a earth water tempest ele become the end all be all condition counter.

What about a more team-oriented diamond skin?

Periodically remove conditions from you and your allies.
While attuned to earth, the effect is increased

interval: every 12 seconds (10 seconds in earth)
numbers of conditions cured per target: 2 (3 in earth)
number of targets: 5 (8 in earth)
range: 700 (1000 in earth)

I hope it’s at least something fitting or comparable to the strength that DS offers now. Somehow.

I honestly don’t agree with changing it at all. It’s really not that hard to bring an ele down to 90% of their health.

But since we know it is coming… I sure hope it’s something that lives up to the legacy. Some kind of removal + resistance uptime combo could be nice I guess.

Diamond skin: Each skill you use while attuned to earth removes a condition.

Ulion.5476:

The new diamond skin will probably be something like remove some conditions every 5sec when above 90%.

And as long as we convince all the other classes to stop using conditions that do damage, this will be the most awesome thing ever.

But barring that, it’s a bit problematic when the majority of conditions quite easily keep the class with the smallest pool of health below 90%

People that are complaining about this change need to understand that it is less about it being OP and more about it being mechanically dumb. It doesn’t interact well with other Sigils or Procs or Runes or anything really. Flat immunity is uninteresting.

imo an easy change would be to change it from immunity to duration reduction (50%?), then improve the bracket from 90% to 75% to account for the difficulty of maintaining 90%hp.

Easy fix, still a good skill, and is not god vs condi anymore.

and if you decided to use a melandru rune you could achieve 75% duration reduction

I love how so many are saying “this is down to noobs QQing” however

On the Majority Most top tier players stated DS was a bullkitten trait, and one of the most Overpowered Mechanics in the game currently, it isn’t noobs at all complaining on this ability, majority of noobs think your actually hacking because ur taking 0 condi damage and they don’t understand the Actual trait exists.

its top tier players who are Calling DS out not new players or Unexperienced/Unskilled players at all.

It dose not seem to bad and maybe more usefully for melee ele then the old DS becuse it lets it have an effect vs players who are not condition dmg aimed. So you can start getting long chill effects to simply drop off or even fear (i do not think it will effect daze).

posthumecaver.6473:

I can’t see a reason why Ele does not get resistance.

’Provides Resistance for 3s every time you switch to Earth Attunement ’

Apparently ele can only ever have prot/might/swiftness/regen, all other boons are taboo, even for ele elite specs…

Jski.6180:

It dose not seem to bad and maybe more usefully for melee ele then the old DS becuse it lets it have an effect vs players who are not condition dmg aimed. So you can start getting long chill effects to simply drop off or even fear (i do not think it will effect daze).

Daze isn’t a condition, so no. Taunt on the other hand…

Aidenwolf.5964:

Immune over 90% health was never a problem until these scrubs min / maxed in PvP and Condi builds stopped bringing burst to crack DS.

This is not true. Nothing changed about what necro ran. It was still either carrion or rabid. The thing that changed was the fact that eles actually started running DS. Before not many did, it wasn’t needed at all. Now ele needs it to survive and people complain because by default it’s a badly designed trait. Pretty simple, really.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Jski.6180:

It dose not seem to bad and maybe more usefully for melee ele then the old DS becuse it lets it have an effect vs players who are not condition dmg aimed. So you can start getting long chill effects to simply drop off or even fear (i do not think it will effect daze).

Daze isn’t a condition, so no. Taunt on the other hand…

O ya i forgot about taunt.
I am thinking for wvw air earth tempest d/d or d/f (still want to see what they are doing to foces) is going to become a real melee class for a zerg.

Considering that diamond skin is Preeettty much useless at this point with that change. reasoning: Power builds dont need or rule around condis and Condi builds will apply more than 1condi/sec even as “steady”. Also whilst having 2-3condis on you and some raw dmg, it will drop you very quickly under 75% and make it fully useless as well. It just wont ever work, its not a “buff” as some say, its just made near 100% useless. The old diamond skin should’ve never been a thing, but sadly its the sole trait that kept ele viable in tpvp tho, imagine or try some teamfights without diamondskin or try some 1v1’s on point with anything condi related.

watch it be stronger than old DS and get ele nerfed again even with cele amulet gone

To everyone who thinks that the new DS will be stronger than the old one, please, come explain to me why you think so.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Can-someone-explain-to-me/first#post5928783

Edit: can’t believe I need to say this, but yea, you actually need to read the OP in that post, because I already gave a lot of arguments in there.

It was a stupid trait from the start – OP versus condi specs and close to useless everywhere else.

scerevisiae.1972:

It was a stupid trait from the start – OP versus condi specs and close to useless everywhere else.

About what i been trying to say i think the new DS being harder to brake will make it more useful vs the non condi builds that have some chill etc.. to keep the ele in places or to simply make it so the ele can never get in ranges to do any thing.

I am thinking air earth tempest d/d or d/f (i hope we get info on the foces update soon) will be good in the melee group.

Still think to be honest, that the new one is in a worse worse spot than even the 90% treshold, reasoning: Any condi class will apply more than 1condi/1sec… which then easilly pushes it under 75% and its useless. And a power build just brings us instantly under, and doesnt even need the cleanses. Its just awful.

I know it’s already changed, but I’ll throw it out there anyway.

Perhaps the trait should try to differentiate between damaging conditions and controlling conditions? They both play different roles.

If Diamond skin granted an immunity (or significant reduction) to control conditions instead of damaging conditions, then it is equally useful against Condi and Power based builds (Though maybe more in favor of Condi because that means less cover conditions).

Of course, the HP threshold would have to be significantly lower (than 90%).

This thought may require too many checks per second (and may be too strong?), but what if it were: ‘Diamond skin reduces the duration of controlling effects/conditions proportionate to your remaining HP’

100% HP = immunity
90% HP = 10% duration
50% HP = 50% duration
20% HP = 80% duration, etc.

Diamond skin is like ‘safe zone’ for soft cc above 90%. Immune was needed, maybe preventing from application was too much.

Now stop,drop and roll nor geomancer’s training nor lucid singularity(if you have hot:tempest) aren’t any help.

In new ds. basicaly you wait 1s to have that chill imo or cripple removed, but maybe it won’t remove it? when you wait and think about that your one step closer to die.

Any DS change imo should look like: gain immunity to conditions effects (that doesn’t mean its prevent from application), when we have that immunity? idk if hp treshold is the best.

I would probably don’t change ds. at all.

A flat chill imunity without HP border. Nothing more. Its very specific but i guess great.

Wolfric.9380:

A flat chill imunity without HP border. Nothing more. Its very specific but i guess great.

Would also deal with fear quite well … kinda preffer the new DS over the old one, of course in the past we just didn’t worried about clearing condition, instead keeping our life high, now we kinda need to adapt to deal with condi bombs… Cleansing fire, ether renewal?

Hmm…so if you take the new DS and Gale Song and you get Feared, will both traits proc? :/

Glenstorm.4059:

Hmm…so if you take the new DS and Gale Song and you get Feared, will both traits proc? :/

Yup, nice combo! … 40s cooldown tho

kuritsutian.2987:

Glenstorm.4059:

Hmm…so if you take the new DS and Gale Song and you get Feared, will both traits proc? :/

Yup, nice combo! … 40s cooldown tho

Thing is, Gale Song with its ICD will be wasted if both traits proc at at the same time, assuming the only condi on you is Fear.

Glenstorm.4059:

kuritsutian.2987:

Glenstorm.4059:

Hmm…so if you take the new DS and Gale Song and you get Feared, will both traits proc? :/

Yup, nice combo! … 40s cooldown tho

Thing is, Gale Song with its ICD will be wasted if both traits proc at at the same time, assuming the only condi on you is Fear.

That is assuming that DS will be off cooldown. In reality you’ll have conditions on you most likely anyways so if fear gets applied it will get cleansed with Gale Song. It’s not like you’ll be condition free all the time now.

MyPuppy.8970:

Diamond skin: Each skill you use while attuned to earth removes a condition.

Endorse

Glenstorm.4059:

kuritsutian.2987:

Glenstorm.4059:

Hmm…so if you take the new DS and Gale Song and you get Feared, will both traits proc? :/

Yup, nice combo! … 40s cooldown tho

Thing is, Gale Song with its ICD will be wasted if both traits proc at at the same time, assuming the only condi on you is Fear.

Gale Song gets wasted all the time anyway. If you have stability and get hit with a disable, it still triggers.

+1 This would fit and be active.

Laraley.7695:

Glenstorm.4059:

kuritsutian.2987:

Glenstorm.4059:

Hmm…so if you take the new DS and Gale Song and you get Feared, will both traits proc? :/

Yup, nice combo! … 40s cooldown tho

Thing is, Gale Song with its ICD will be wasted if both traits proc at at the same time, assuming the only condi on you is Fear.

That is assuming that Gale Song will be off cooldown. In reality you’ll have conditions on you most likely anyways so if fear gets applied it will get cleansed with DS. It’s not like you’ll be condition free all the time now.

I think you mean’t the other way around… (fixed it)

Been runing this week without Diamond skill (on quick join tho) testing alternative methods to deal with conditions outside of water trait while paying extra attention to the kind of conditions I am getting and can say that with the new DS you’ll be free of conditions most of the time except while in the heat of a battle …most attacks come with passive vonditions such as vulnerability, weakness, cripple… those will be dealt with easily, some apply two at a time (traited?) and some apply on pulse… those are kinda fine if you have passive removals… problem comes as stated before with condi bombs during the heat of battle, switching to water on this battles to deal with them hinders the damage output greatly only prolonging the fight having to rely on your team (non existent in quick joins xD ) … so in short the new DS can be great if paired with an effective way to deal with several condis at a time out of water trait … ether renewal will be probably the heal of choice in this iteration, kinda driving the ele a bit away from the usual xxx/support role, specially now that auras got nerfed a bit and water trait will be optional.

kuritsutian.2987:

Laraley.7695:

Glenstorm.4059:

kuritsutian.2987:

Glenstorm.4059:

Hmm…so if you take the new DS and Gale Song and you get Feared, will both traits proc? :/

Yup, nice combo! … 40s cooldown tho

Thing is, Gale Song with its ICD will be wasted if both traits proc at at the same time, assuming the only condi on you is Fear.

That is assuming that Gale Song will be off cooldown. In reality you’ll have conditions on you most likely anyways so if fear gets applied it will get cleansed with DS. It’s not like you’ll be condition free all the time now.

I think you mean’t the other way around… (fixed it)

No, I didn’t. It’s pretty simple. You’ll have several conditions on you which will be periodically removed, but also applied. So DS will most likely never be off cooldown to cleanse fear applied to you unless it’s just some random fear with no follow up.

Ele Of Yo.6253:

Still think to be honest, that the new one is in a worse worse spot than even the 90% treshold, reasoning: Any condi class will apply more than 1condi/1sec… which then easilly pushes it under 75% and its useless. And a power build just brings us instantly under, and doesnt even need the cleanses. Its just awful.

The thing is 75% is easy to spring back to for ele that is the key 90% is nearly impossible in combat but 75% is about 3 healing skills. That the ideal behind ele and light armor classes in GW2.

Laraley.7695:

kuritsutian.2987:

Laraley.7695:

Glenstorm.4059:

kuritsutian.2987:

Glenstorm.4059:

Hmm…so if you take the new DS and Gale Song and you get Feared, will both traits proc? :/

Yup, nice combo! … 40s cooldown tho

Thing is, Gale Song with its ICD will be wasted if both traits proc at at the same time, assuming the only condi on you is Fear.

That is assuming that Gale Song will be off cooldown. In reality you’ll have conditions on you most likely anyways so if fear gets applied it will get cleansed with DS. It’s not like you’ll be condition free all the time now.

I think you mean’t the other way around… (fixed it)

No, I didn’t. It’s pretty simple. You’ll have several conditions on you which will be periodically removed, but also applied. So DS will most likely never be off cooldown to cleanse fear applied to you unless it’s just some random fear with no follow up.

But DS cooldown is 1 sec, being out of Diamond Skill CD is kinda a strange concept, due to how cleanse works (last applied cleansed first) I think then you meant that the problem comes when fear is covered by several conditions in less than a second. Only way to do that I see is by corrupting stability with “Corrupt boon” (Well of corruption is kinda countered by new DS) …but yeah in that case the 1 second of fear will at most interrupt us. (effective overload counter)

kuritsutian.2987:

Laraley.7695:

kuritsutian.2987:

Laraley.7695:

Glenstorm.4059:

kuritsutian.2987:

Glenstorm.4059:

Hmm…so if you take the new DS and Gale Song and you get Feared, will both traits proc? :/

Yup, nice combo! … 40s cooldown tho

Thing is, Gale Song with its ICD will be wasted if both traits proc at at the same time, assuming the only condi on you is Fear.

That is assuming that Gale Song will be off cooldown. In reality you’ll have conditions on you most likely anyways so if fear gets applied it will get cleansed with DS. It’s not like you’ll be condition free all the time now.

I think you mean’t the other way around… (fixed it)

No, I didn’t. It’s pretty simple. You’ll have several conditions on you which will be periodically removed, but also applied. So DS will most likely never be off cooldown to cleanse fear applied to you unless it’s just some random fear with no follow up.

But DS cooldown is 1 sec, being out of Diamond Skill CD is kinda a strange concept, due to how cleanse works (last applied cleansed first) I think then you meant that the problem comes when fear is covered by several conditions in less than a second. Only way to do that I see is by corrupting stability with “Corrupt boon” (Well of corruption is kinda countered by new DS) …but yeah in that case the 1 second of fear will at most interrupt us. (effective overload counter)

That the thing you got to be able to counter the effect in one way or another other then simply putting it on cd or removing its effect. Its the reason why DS now is such a problem (and why other classes who can make endless resistances are getting nerfed hard). If you cant dodges big condition effects that are many different condition then you should be punished that IS the type of game GW2 is. If the person is only apply 1 or 2 condition types at a time on you then DS will stop most of the effect.

There should be nothing in the game that say you cant do this to me any more at all times. Most effects like that should be on long cd and short duration. Or your simply making the game more passive and you simply do not need dodging and aiming effects in a game like that (stander mmorpg combat vs action combat).

It’s funny how the necro we used to counter the most (AOE condi bomb) will be maybe the only one that the new DS alone will be uneffective to deal with.

Careful what you wish for. =)

I though about something: condition transfer and condition copying would have counters like:
- cleans,
- when sb transfer/copying condi to you effect proc on you or enemy.
Firstly cleans don’t justice it becouse your conditions or conditions of your allies are used in enemy’s hands, they make it double edge blade.
Secondly the effect when sb transfer could be resistance or copy/transfer to somebody.
Resistance – they don’t seem to want to give it to us. Copy/transfer doesn’t suit to us thematicaly, so probably we wouldn’t see it too. Other effect would never justify it, make it counter propely, that is why is suggest:
Diamond Skin rework into: Only Unique Elements Pass – prevents application of condtions that are transfered/copied to you. *(No other requirements, no hp/cd/attunement borders).

Imo sheep safe and wolfs content.

kuritsutian.2987:

It’s funny how the necro we used to counter the most (AOE condi bomb) will be maybe the only one that the new DS alone will be uneffective to deal with.

Careful what you wish for. =)

Yeah, pretty much.

Basically with the change full on condi necros are gonna give us a hard time with their condi bombs, whereas before we were effectively immune to them.

For everyone else dealing in conditions? The change isn’t so bad, maybe even a buff VS opponents that can’t apply heavy conditions nearly as rapidly.

Still feel like it’ll be pretty rough in a team fight, but combined with other condi removal and the ammy change in PvP (and you know teammates who might even be useful), the meta may be shifting away from condis in general with the exception of necros.

They’re taking away our hard counter, yes, but a fairly skilled ele won’t be an easy kill for a condi build. I believe we still stand a chance.

It won’t be one sided, eles banned from pvp like everyone makes it out to be.

Will the new Diamond Skin stop the might of Shatterstone?