Guild Wars 2

First of all maybe it is just me and my personal experiences may come down to me being a medicore player.

The Topic:

From what i can see Ele’s are the top profession of any gametype.

In PvE they offer the biggest DPS in the game + soft and hard cc, amazing support lots of fields and lots of finishers. I mean its pretty hard to make an argument for filling the slots with anything non ele when you have a guard already.

In PvP the Celestial varriant can beat about any other class in 1v1 and shrug of conditions as well as direct damage while dealing great damage themselves. Zerker with focus offer allmost no counterplay because all the spells are instant casts with instant procs from fire/air sigill. Even then they get all of that from their weapons and can take all the defensive utility they want.

In WvW they are the main source of Damage and can lay waste to entire Zergs. As well as sustain their own with waterfields and harrass the enemy with static fields. They also make excelent roamers and scouts.

I get that elementalists are supposed to be able to do many things but right now they seem to be the best at everything.

They are also one of the squishiest classes and require a fair investment of time to learn to play properly.

I have yet to come across an MMORPG where the mage dps class wasn’t incredibly overpowered, or at the very least hugely overcompensated for being “squishy” (let’s see, massive heal spam potential, invulnerability, insane mobility, heal on spell cast, boons out the kitten, etc).

Ele’s strength comes from the sheer versatility of the attunement class mechanic, they are not jack of all trades, but master of them. A good elementalist can do pretty much everything

Artemis Thuras.8795:

They are also one of the squishiest classes and require a fair investment of time to learn to play properly.

Oh hell yeah, very difficult, especially in pve and in zerg wvw.

Difficulty can be subjective. For me my engi is easier to play than my necro even though my engi has 3 kits. This may be because i got used to having these tools and they do not confuse me anymore. Now the difficulty arises when debating what to do with the necro that does not even posess a tool to deal with most of these situations.

Anyway rather than the difficulty its more about the results.

Pride.1734:

In PvE they offer the biggest DPS in the game + soft and hard cc, amazing support lots of fields and lots of finishers. I mean its pretty hard to make an argument for filling the slots with anything non ele when you have a guard already.

Actually, there are plenty of arguments that could be made for filling slots only with eles. One of them is that most forms of support start to hit diminishing returns the moment you have more than one of the same class offering the same kind of support. Regen and Fury only stack in duration only and might caps out at 25 stacks and eles can already cap those boons out with relative ease, so what’s the point of having four eles in your party if three of the four are not really contributing anything in addition to what the first is giving your party already?

Buffs from warrior banners, on the other hand, do not actually count as boons and so apply separately. This means they are not hindered by boon stacking limitations and thus, get added as an extra bonus on top of the boons any other class, like eles, are already applying. Warriors can also offer other things that eles cannot like group revival with battle standard. To put it plainly, you’d benefit more from a warrior and an ele being mixed in your group than you would from simply having two eles. (Likewise, warrior banners also don’t stack with each other so the same argument could be said for having two warriors).

Eles also don’t give things like reflects or group stability, group quickness, or group stealth (que mesmers, guardians and thieves). Are they the strongest class right now? I’d say in some ways yes, but I still believe parties benefit more from having mixed classes than they would from being filled with multiples of the same class.

Ele’s strong point is versatility. They can fullfil support and dps role very effectively.
However they don’t have all the tricks required to survive a dungeon. Of course it’s possible to play 5 eles however more than 2 is redundant. Phalanx warrior and thieves give a lot of value to the party (talking dungeons).

Ele is one of celestial classes therefore they get a lot of hate from non skilled players. They are bursty but as every other profession/build you have to play around their abilities to win. I can see no problem with them in pvp, I don’t even like this profession but I don’t have more trouble with elementalists than I have with other professions (on the same player skill level).

WvW is a silly mode for me so I’m not going to discuss eles from this perspective.

tramwajarz.2369:

Ele’s strong point is versatility. They can fullfil support and dps role very effectively.

This.

To me, ele is similar to a jack-of-all-trades. I’ve encountered many times various ele builds and I admire their versatility (DPS/zerker, somehwhat water-field healers, very tanky constantly healing eles, hard to catch aka nike eles and the list could go on).

We’re all aware of the Ele and Engi’s capability of being a jack-of-all-trades. I think what the op is trying to get across is his concerns that the Ele out-shines all other professions due to having a vital role in literally every game mode meta out there, where as other professions will shine in some game modes and lack in others. Level of skill required is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion and let’s be honest, often over-exaggerated.

Pride.1734:

First of all maybe it is just me and my personal experiences may come down to me being a medicore player.

The Topic:

From what i can see Ele’s are the top profession of any gametype.

In PvE they offer the biggest DPS in the game + soft and hard cc, amazing support lots of fields and lots of finishers. I mean its pretty hard to make an argument for filling the slots with anything non ele when you have a guard already.

In PvP the Celestial varriant can beat about any other class in 1v1 and shrug of conditions as well as direct damage while dealing great damage themselves. Zerker with focus offer allmost no counterplay because all the spells are instant casts with instant procs from fire/air sigill. Even then they get all of that from their weapons and can take all the defensive utility they want.

In WvW they are the main source of Damage and can lay waste to entire Zergs. As well as sustain their own with waterfields and harrass the enemy with static fields. They also make excelent roamers and scouts.

I get that elementalists are supposed to be able to do many things but right now they seem to be the best at everything.

Have you played one? The ele’s have versatility, sure, but the effectiveness of that versatility is directly dependent on how squishy they are. They do get to do many things as a core feature of their class, but the other classes that have a focus on specific kinds of playstyles outperform the ele in their respective aspects.

For example, an ele has control, but not comparable to a warriors.

An ele has burst, but not comparable to a thief, Not to mention that attunements microbalance their effectiveness even further.

Shaogin.2679:

We’re all aware of the Ele and Engi’s capability of being a jack-of-all-trades. I think what the op is trying to get across is his concerns that the Ele out-shines all other professions due to having a vital role in literally every game mode meta out there, where as other professions will shine in some game modes and lack in others. Level of skill required is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion and let’s be honest, often over-exaggerated.

This is true only for necromancer. Every other profession is viable in every game mode.

I disagree with most of the assumptions you make. Eles can be good in a lot of situations, but some classes do it better…

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

We’re all aware of the Ele and Engi’s capability of being a jack-of-all-trades. I think what the op is trying to get across is his concerns that the Ele out-shines all other professions due to having a vital role in literally every game mode meta out there, where as other professions will shine in some game modes and lack in others. Level of skill required is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion and let’s be honest, often over-exaggerated.

This is true only for necromancer. Every other profession is viable in every game mode.

Viable sure. Vital to the meta, no. Can an Engineer play a role in a WvW zerg? Sure. Will he be as effective as an Elementalist? No. Just an example.

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

We’re all aware of the Ele and Engi’s capability of being a jack-of-all-trades. I think what the op is trying to get across is his concerns that the Ele out-shines all other professions due to having a vital role in literally every game mode meta out there, where as other professions will shine in some game modes and lack in others. Level of skill required is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion and let’s be honest, often over-exaggerated.

This is true only for necromancer. Every other profession is viable in every game mode.

Viable sure. Vital to the meta, no. Can an Engineer play a role in a WvW zerg? Sure. Will he be as effective as an Elementalist? No. Just an example.

Why can’t he be as effective? Engis are very similar to elementalists.

Ele is definitely a top class for each game type and undeniably the top class for dungeons, but I wouldn’t say they are the top class for pvp and wvw. Shoutbow warrior is arguably more useful for the team in pvp and guild groups in wvw run more guards than any other class (unless this has changed since the stability change…I haven’t played much wvw recently).

That said, all three of those classes are in the meta for each game mode. If you pick one of them, you’ll be safe playing them wherever you go. It would be nice if necro was more useful in dungeons and engi was more useful in wvw.

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

We’re all aware of the Ele and Engi’s capability of being a jack-of-all-trades. I think what the op is trying to get across is his concerns that the Ele out-shines all other professions due to having a vital role in literally every game mode meta out there, where as other professions will shine in some game modes and lack in others. Level of skill required is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion and let’s be honest, often over-exaggerated.

This is true only for necromancer. Every other profession is viable in every game mode.

Viable sure. Vital to the meta, no. Can an Engineer play a role in a WvW zerg? Sure. Will he be as effective as an Elementalist? No. Just an example.

Why can’t he be as effective? Engis are very similar to elementalists.

Similar, not the same. And not going into depth and off topic with that discussion. Just search the WvW forums for information on the GWEN meta that has existed for quite some time.

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

We’re all aware of the Ele and Engi’s capability of being a jack-of-all-trades. I think what the op is trying to get across is his concerns that the Ele out-shines all other professions due to having a vital role in literally every game mode meta out there, where as other professions will shine in some game modes and lack in others. Level of skill required is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion and let’s be honest, often over-exaggerated.

This is true only for necromancer. Every other profession is viable in every game mode.

Viable sure. Vital to the meta, no. Can an Engineer play a role in a WvW zerg? Sure. Will he be as effective as an Elementalist? No. Just an example.

Why can’t he be as effective? Engis are very similar to elementalists.

Similar, not the same. And not going into depth and off topic with that discussion. Just search the WvW forums for information on the GWEN meta that has existed for quite some time.

Gwen died when they changed stability/stab.

On topic Ele would be op if they had more blast finishers. Party composition for me in WvW still requires an Ele most of the time but they have to be protected by the rest of the party is things start getting ugly.

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

We’re all aware of the Ele and Engi’s capability of being a jack-of-all-trades. I think what the op is trying to get across is his concerns that the Ele out-shines all other professions due to having a vital role in literally every game mode meta out there, where as other professions will shine in some game modes and lack in others. Level of skill required is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion and let’s be honest, often over-exaggerated.

This is true only for necromancer. Every other profession is viable in every game mode.

Viable sure. Vital to the meta, no. Can an Engineer play a role in a WvW zerg? Sure. Will he be as effective as an Elementalist? No. Just an example.

Why can’t he be as effective? Engis are very similar to elementalists.

Similar, not the same. And not going into depth and off topic with that discussion. Just search the WvW forums for information on the GWEN meta that has existed for quite some time.

Gwen died when they changed stability/stab.

On topic Ele would be op if they had more blast finishers. Party composition for me in WvW still requires an Ele most of the time but they have to be protected by the rest of the party is things start getting ugly.

I’m aware of the change to the meta, but the information he needed is contained within discussions pertaining to that meta. And Ele still has a meta role in WvW zerg, so no changes there. Not sure if OP is intending to declare Eles as op either. He seems to just feel that it seems unbalanced that the Elementalist is the only profession that fills a vital role in every meta across all game modes. Though not sure why he brings this up, seeing as how he has contributed little to his own thread. >.<

Pride.1734:

In PvP the Celestial varriant can beat about any other class in 1v1 and shrug of conditions as well as direct damage while dealing great damage themselves. Zerker with focus offer allmost no counterplay because all the spells are instant casts with instant procs from fire/air sigill. Even then they get all of that from their weapons and can take all the defensive utility they want.

(1v1 Isn’t even important in a Team Game, but as someone who enjoys dueling let me humour you. )
I have no idea why people keep touting this nonsense. There are a fair number of specs and classes that can outdo them 1v1.

Any warrior worth his salt should be able to destroy you. The number of Ele’s I have laid waste to on my main is unbelivably high, and literally all you need is a zerker amulet. The damage and pressure you put out if played properly is way too high for an ele to take time ramping up damage in Cele. Don’t even get me started on shoutbow which can outlast and beat this spec at it’s own game.

As for the Scepter/Focus zerk build, I went into a duel arena just yesterday and beat a few of these using a zerker amulet and RAMPAGE of all the skills. They really aren’t that hard to fight, god knows how easy a good necromancer would find it.

It is just a buzzword now.

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

We’re all aware of the Ele and Engi’s capability of being a jack-of-all-trades. I think what the op is trying to get across is his concerns that the Ele out-shines all other professions due to having a vital role in literally every game mode meta out there, where as other professions will shine in some game modes and lack in others. Level of skill required is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion and let’s be honest, often over-exaggerated.

This is true only for necromancer. Every other profession is viable in every game mode.

Viable sure. Vital to the meta, no. Can an Engineer play a role in a WvW zerg? Sure. Will he be as effective as an Elementalist? No. Just an example.

Why can’t he be as effective? Engis are very similar to elementalists.

Similar, not the same. And not going into depth and off topic with that discussion. Just search the WvW forums for information on the GWEN meta that has existed for quite some time.

Of course they are not the same. Nor should they. What’s the point of professions if they would be the same? I agree that elementalists are good in many cases but they are not alpha and omega of this game.

Well, in PvE I agree Ele is the way to go for a good player. I’ve seen plenty of bad eles that die constantly, so there’s definitely a skill to it.

In PvP, I dunno, I can honestly say I don’t find them terribly OP. Avoid their burst and they are done for. Blocks, ret, dodges, invuln, usually if they blow their burst damage they drop quickly. Plus their AoE is extremely easy to avoid in PvP.

I am no theory crafter or anything but here are my thoughts:

Concerning PvE: While ele might have the best potential dps out there at the moment, I am sure that in many cases, in practice, other classes are more effective (especially for the non- hardcore players). For example, when taking or anticipating huge incoming damage, a warrior can activate his invulnerability or heal passively and keep attacking meanwhile. The ele has to stop attacking by going into mistform or into defensive attunements. I

Concerning sPvP: True, the ele is a great 1v1 class. However, depending on the weapon set and spec, there is huge outplay potential. For example, a thief can make the ele spam his cooldowns and shadowstep away immediately.
Secondly, the bursty builds can be focused pretty easily in teamfights, e.g. by medi guards.
And thirdly, also in sPvP, popping your defense reduces outgoing damage since you have to swap attunements.

Concerning WvW: Of course, eles provide massive AoE damage, support and utility. Focusing them is the way to go there, e.g. with a coordinated backline farming group.
Roaming on ele is fun, but since the lack of crit in celestial, I don’t think it is overpowered anymore. Players who know what they are doing will punish eles really bad and e.g. engis can spam you with more conditions than you can bear.

In my opinion the ele is not overpowered and not the strongest class in every aspect of the game. My personal favorites are:
- roaming (sPvP and WvW): meditation guard
- PvE: warrior (just because it’s a no-brainer) or guard (fail-safe for fractals)
- WvW zerg: staff ele

Having said all of this, a huge part of this discussion might become irrelevant sometime this year due to a specific event… THE HYPE TRAIN HAS NO BRAKES =)

I would like to say I am glad to see so many levelheaded replies to this as oppose to jumping on the “CLASS IS OP! HUDHUDHHUD” train.

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

tramwajarz.2369:

Shaogin.2679:

We’re all aware of the Ele and Engi’s capability of being a jack-of-all-trades. I think what the op is trying to get across is his concerns that the Ele out-shines all other professions due to having a vital role in literally every game mode meta out there, where as other professions will shine in some game modes and lack in others. Level of skill required is irrelevant for the purposes of this discussion and let’s be honest, often over-exaggerated.

This is true only for necromancer. Every other profession is viable in every game mode.

Viable sure. Vital to the meta, no. Can an Engineer play a role in a WvW zerg? Sure. Will he be as effective as an Elementalist? No. Just an example.

Why can’t he be as effective? Engis are very similar to elementalists.

Similar, not the same. And not going into depth and off topic with that discussion. Just search the WvW forums for information on the GWEN meta that has existed for quite some time.

Of course they are not the same. Nor should they. What’s the point of professions if they would be the same? I agree that elementalists are good in many cases but they are not alpha and omega of this game.

Never said they were the alpha and omega or anything of the sort. Please read comments thoroughly and stop creating random conclusions that deviate from the topic if you wish to contribute in any way here.

If you don’t understand the discussion, that’s ok. You’re not being forced to spout out random comments.

PistolWhip.2697:

I would like to say I am glad to see so many levelheaded replies to this as oppose to jumping on the “CLASS IS OP! HUDHUDHHUD” train.

Agreed. Really, I feel as though there aren’t any OP classes right now. The biggest issue is some classes under-performing in certain areas of the game. But with the expansion coming, I don’t think it is something worse discussing until after it’s release.

PistolWhip.2697:

I would like to say I am glad to see so many levelheaded replies to this as oppose to jumping on the “CLASS IS OP! HUDHUDHHUD” train.

Agreed. Really, I feel as though there aren’t any OP classes right now. The biggest issue is some classes under-performing in certain areas of the game. But with the expansion coming, I don’t think it is something worse discussing until after it’s release.

Honestly, I think a lot of the “WvW wipe whole zergs” thing is totally overstated. Any Ele that spends some time running against zergs will be the first to tell you that Retaliation makes that whole ‘wiping zergs’ thing completely untrue. Dropping a Meteor Storm on a zerg is pretty much suicide.

SPVP depends on the Ele and the opponent, but I can assure you that they can be outplayed by multiple professions. There is no ‘mash button and win’ build for Ele against every class. I promise. A terrormancer, DP thief, or Shoutbow can take an Ele down unless the player is just new or bad. This is how it should be. Rock meet Scissors and whatnot.

Necros need love though. That profession has suffered enough.

MeanCoffeeBean.2073:

Honestly, I think a lot of the “WvW wipe whole zergs” thing is totally overstated. Any Ele that spends some time running against zergs will be the first to tell you that Retaliation makes that whole ‘wiping zergs’ thing completely untrue. Dropping a Meteor Storm on a zerg is pretty much suicide.

SPVP depends on the Ele and the opponent, but I can assure you that they can be outplayed by multiple professions. There is no ‘mash button and win’ build for Ele against every class. I promise. A terrormancer, DP thief, or Shoutbow can take an Ele down unless the player is just new or bad. This is how it should be. Rock meet Scissors and whatnot.

Necros need love though. That profession has suffered enough.

lol. Yeah, Retaliation hurts, especially as a Flamethrower or Grenadier Engi. >.<

And of course the Ele isn’t top dog unbeatable in sPvP, but how many tPvP tourney teams do not bring at least 1 Ele? Not that Ele is op, just that the Ele is vital to the meta comp, and that is true for every game mode.

But like I said, none of this really matters, especially with the expansion coming.

Right now, I’d argue that Guardian, Ele and Warrior are all fine. Necro and Ranger need love (when haven’t they though?)

I don’t play Engi or Mesmer, so I’ve got no opinions on them.

Thieves, as always, should be tied up in a burlap sack, drowned, then fish the sack back out and burn it, just to be sure.

Celestial eles aren’t as powerful in pvp as people claim. Every single one of them I have faced on my condi mesmer has either died to me or won only because they held out long enough to get backup. They may be good against burst damage but they can’t handle sustained damage for long.

Maybe because I’m not high up in pvp but the eles that I go up against don’t seem all that great. I play one and do ok depending on the class I face but when I go against them I don’t seem to lose much.

serenke.4806:

Artemis Thuras.8795:

They are also one of the squishiest classes and require a fair investment of time to learn to play properly.

Oh hell yeah, very difficult, especially in pve and in zerg wvw.

This game isnt balanced for 1% of the player base.

Please go out and stand next to 2 zergs fighting now and when HoT is released and are going to remove all toughness and vitality form your traits. you’ll be standing there and get destroyed by 2 stray shots, and then a stealthed thief will finish you off. GG.

2 dodges will not save you. nor will armor of earh, mist form and lightning flash. generally ELE’s can do most dmg from range and are pirme targets, then necro’s who are ignored due to their stamina close to the zerg.

Draknar.5748:

Well, in PvE I agree Ele is the way to go for a good player. I’ve seen plenty of bad eles that die constantly, so there’s definitely a skill to it.

Thanks – I have no clue of my ele and I usually don’t die with her, she’s zerker in pve.
I was 1 vs 1 my friend, who plays D/D cele ele far longer than me, the other day and we quit of boredom after 15 mins as neither of us died/was hurt – and I really have no clue of that class. “Faceroll and call it skill”

rapthorne.7345:

I have yet to come across an MMORPG where the mage dps class wasn’t incredibly overpowered, or at the very least hugely overcompensated for being “squishy” (let’s see, massive heal spam potential, invulnerability, insane mobility, heal on spell cast, boons out the kitten, etc).

Ele’s strength comes from the sheer versatility of the attunement class mechanic, they are not jack of all trades, but master of them. A good elementalist can do pretty much everything

Wow…an ele wielding all weapons at once, with nearly all trait trees maxed! Awesome.

Try actually playing an Ele. In most of those roles, they die in one hit.

Jana.6831:

Draknar.5748:

Well, in PvE I agree Ele is the way to go for a good player. I’ve seen plenty of bad eles that die constantly, so there’s definitely a skill to it.

Thanks – I have no clue of my ele and I usually don’t die with her, she’s zerker in pve.
I was 1 vs 1 my friend, who plays D/D cele ele far longer than me, the other day and we quit of boredom after 15 mins as neither of us died/was hurt – and I really have no clue of that class. “Faceroll and call it skill”

You’ll actually find that all classes work like this in PvE if you have ever played an MMO before. When I say PvE I mean of course normal map exploration. It’s very difficult to die, especially if you duo with someone else. It will be a cakewalk everywhere.

If you want an added challenge, you guys could always try duo-ing dungeons. It can be done and is quite a bit harder than open world PvE.

The eles I referenced dying were exclusively in dungeon runs and high level fractals. Open world PvE you really shouldn’t die, like ever. Unless you are up against champions or something solo.

EDIT: For some reason I thought we were talking about PvE, I see now you said PvP with with your friend and neither of you died. Honestly, if you guys 1v1’d and nobody was taking damage or getting hurt, then I hate to say it but you both are likely not very good at playing Ele in PvP and I mean this in the least offensive way possible..

Hannelore.8153:

Try actually playing an Ele. In most of those roles, they die in one hit.

Don’t get hit

Jana.6831:

Draknar.5748:

Well, in PvE I agree Ele is the way to go for a good player. I’ve seen plenty of bad eles that die constantly, so there’s definitely a skill to it.

Thanks – I have no clue of my ele and I usually don’t die with her, she’s zerker in pve.
I was 1 vs 1 my friend, who plays D/D cele ele far longer than me, the other day and we quit of boredom after 15 mins as neither of us died/was hurt – and I really have no clue of that class. “Faceroll and call it skill”

One of the best things about being an Ele in PvE is by far the fact that you are welcome in any party. You are literally always an asset. I think there is only one or two situations where it is a waste of a party slot. I’d argue they are the kings of PvE.

EDIT:

Draknar.5748:

Jana.6831:

Draknar.5748:

Well, in PvE I agree Ele is the way to go for a good player. I’ve seen plenty of bad eles that die constantly, so there’s definitely a skill to it.

Thanks – I have no clue of my ele and I usually don’t die with her, she’s zerker in pve.
I was 1 vs 1 my friend, who plays D/D cele ele far longer than me, the other day and we quit of boredom after 15 mins as neither of us died/was hurt – and I really have no clue of that class. “Faceroll and call it skill”

You’ll actually find that all classes work like this in PvE if you have ever played an MMO before. When I say PvE I mean of course normal map exploration. It’s very difficult to die, especially if you duo with someone else. It will be a cakewalk everywhere.

If you want an added challenge, you guys could always try duo-ing dungeons. It can be done and is quite a bit harder than open world PvE.

The eles I referenced dying were exclusively in dungeon runs and high level fractals. Open world PvE you really shouldn’t die, like ever. Unless you are up against champions or something solo.

EDIT: For some reason I thought we were talking about PvE, I see now you said PvP with with your friend and neither of you died. Honestly, if you guys 1v1’d and nobody was taking damage or getting hurt, then I hate to say it but you both are likely not very good at playing Ele in PvP and I mean this in the least offensive way possible..

As someone who used to run Ele in high level fractals you do get basically one shotted if hit. A thing to remember though is every class does. +40 fractals have such high damage numbers that it will demolish your hp on any class unless you’re paying attention, which I think is part of the fun of it for many.

And in PvP, I don’t think its what is happening there. I mained Ele D/D for a long period of time, and one of the most telling things of the build is its ability to survive. Heck I’d go berserker with Hoelbrak runes because I didn’t need Cele most of the time with the protection on aura trait. If 2 Cele D/D’s 1v1 it requires one of them to be exceptionally bad for the fight to end, not the other way around. Heck even Cele Staff Ele vs D/D Cele. They are just very self-sustainable, but that is the nature of the build.

Please keep in mind that Elementalist itself isn’t strong. CELESTIAL Elementalist with Runes of Strength is strong. There is a difference.

Elementalist is strong itself, there is a difference between overpowered and strong my friend. Elementalist is an excellent class with or without Cele.

PistolWhip.2697:

Elementalist is strong itself, there is a difference between overpowered and strong my friend. Elementalist is an excellent class with or without Cele.

Yup; It’s other subpar professions that should be buffed to elementalist level of performance, not the other way around

Jana.6831:

Draknar.5748:

Well, in PvE I agree Ele is the way to go for a good player. I’ve seen plenty of bad eles that die constantly, so there’s definitely a skill to it.

Thanks – I have no clue of my ele and I usually don’t die with her, she’s zerker in pve.
I was 1 vs 1 my friend, who plays D/D cele ele far longer than me, the other day and we quit of boredom after 15 mins as neither of us died/was hurt – and I really have no clue of that class. “Faceroll and call it skill”

Try a zerker version with a staff and solo roam with it in WvW. I die regularly in WvW with my staff ele while roaming but I didn’t die a single time the whole night when I played my shatter mesmer. Not once (yeah stealth is in for a lot). And I got thousands more hours invested into my ele than in my mesmer… it all depend on what you are rolling and the context you are in. Of course a celestial d/d is awfully different!

Been playing lvl 80 engineer in dungeons/fractals and here are my observations in comparison to how ‘broken’ ele is:

-Higher burst damage from cycling through rifle, EG, FT, nades but sustained damage is poop outside of nade 111111111111 vuln stacking which gets boring
-Lack of offhand focus means no easy mode
-Feels more active with 3 kits
-Farm more lootbags in wvw with nades

That said I’ve yet to find or come up with a non nade/bomb build that doesn’t make me feel like GW2 is a game about if you don’t use this one build you are a scrub.

sorrychief.2563:

Been playing lvl 80 engineer in dungeons/fractals and here are my observations in comparison to how ‘broken’ ele is:

-Higher burst damage from cycling through rifle, EG, FT, nades but sustained damage is poop outside of nade 111111111111 vuln stacking which gets boring
-Lack of offhand focus means no easy mode
-Feels more active with 3 kits
-Farm more lootbags in wvw with nades

That said I’ve yet to find or come up with a non nade/bomb build that doesn’t make me feel like GW2 is a game about if you don’t use this one build you are a scrub.

lol wut?

Pride.1734:

Difficulty can be subjective. For me my engi is easier to play than my necro even though my engi has 3 kits. This may be because i got used to having these tools and they do not confuse me anymore.

Congratulations on disqualifying your own argument!

Shaogin.2679:

Similar, not the same. And not going into depth and off topic with that discussion. Just search the WvW forums for information on the GWEN meta that has existed for quite some time.

“Blanket statements means I win the argument and you can’t say anything back!”

Velimere.7685:

Pride.1734:

Difficulty can be subjective. For me my engi is easier to play than my necro even though my engi has 3 kits. This may be because i got used to having these tools and they do not confuse me anymore.

Congratulations on disqualifying your own argument!

Shaogin.2679:

Similar, not the same. And not going into depth and off topic with that discussion. Just search the WvW forums for information on the GWEN meta that has existed for quite some time.

“Blanket statements means I win the argument and you can’t say anything back!”

Did you read all of my comments or just pick the one in attempt to make a pointless argument that contributes nothing to this thread?

Pride.1734:

First of all maybe it is just me and my personal experiences may come down to me being a medicore player.

The Topic:

From what i can see Ele’s are the top profession of any gametype.

In PvE they offer the biggest DPS in the game + soft and hard cc, amazing support lots of fields and lots of finishers. I mean its pretty hard to make an argument for filling the slots with anything non ele when you have a guard already.

In PvP the Celestial varriant can beat about any other class in 1v1 and shrug of conditions as well as direct damage while dealing great damage themselves. Zerker with focus offer allmost no counterplay because all the spells are instant casts with instant procs from fire/air sigill. Even then they get all of that from their weapons and can take all the defensive utility they want.

In WvW they are the main source of Damage and can lay waste to entire Zergs. As well as sustain their own with waterfields and harrass the enemy with static fields. They also make excelent roamers and scouts.

I get that elementalists are supposed to be able to do many things but right now they seem to be the best at everything.

Arena Net appears to agree with you. In a few months the ele won’t be good at anything.

Fresh Air / Bolt to the heart nerf
Conjure Weapons nerf
Celestial Amulet nerf
Evasive Arcana / Elemental Attunement nerf.

Can we please stop with the hyperbole? This happens literally every patch that changes game mechanics. Elementalist is doomed! Anet is out of touch and doesn’t understand! My cat will now smell like a dog!

Look at why they’re doing things and just don’t flip out over nerfs when we don’t even know the final balance of anything. This is a more blue sky design preview, not a nails and tacks one. Look at the overall picture and not just the “nerfs” (fun fact, there were lots of buffs too).

Nageth.5648:

Can we please stop with the hyperbole? This happens literally every patch that changes game mechanics. Elementalist is doomed! Anet is out of touch and doesn’t understand! My cat will now smell like a dog!

Look at why they’re doing things and just don’t flip out over nerfs when we don’t even know the final balance of anything. This is a more blue sky design preview, not a nails and tacks one. Look at the overall picture and not just the “nerfs” (fun fact, there were lots of buffs too).

Actually, I don’t think I’ve ever complained about an upcoming patch like this before. I’ve haven’t seen such a concentrated group of nerfs targeted toward a single class all at one time before either.

So no. I’m not going to stop with the hyperbole. These changes are ridiculously bad and I don’t have a problem saying it.