Guild Wars 2

Both elite specializations will focus on group support.

Tempest is primarily melee range, because the overloads will only damage enemies very close to you.

Herald is ‘equally good for back line support’.

Additionally, the article stresses that the class is very high risk high reward. Unfortunately the tempest does not yet have the ‘high reward’ that we were hoping out of the overloads.

Thoughts? (Article for reference: http://massivelyop.com/2015/08/12/exclusive-guild-wars-2-revenant-elite-spec-is-the-herald/)

Seems like Revenant is going to be the Auramancer we were hoping for. Sigh…

I’m pretty much jealous of every other professions elite skills at this point. It seems only the elementalist is destined to get get kittenty elites. It wouldn’t be that bad if we didn’t get rushed mechanics that has no synergy with most of our weapons and the way the class functions on top of it.

“Facet of Elements and Elemental Blast” Sounds like the elite we were supposed to get, but was instead given to the Revenant as a utility.

May very well change main class at this point. Revenant, reaper and chronomancer seems good substitutes.

Valentinus.3412:

Seems like Revenant is going to be the Auramancer we were hoping for. Sigh…

Speak for yourself. I never wanted an Auramancer as my elite spec; something that could have been made more viable without using up all the new stuff(combine Elemental Bastion and Powerful Auras and give other lines more Aura traits, as right now, there’s only 1 real Aura trait in EACH of the main 4 lines…).

Instead, I wanted more of a Thief-Mage type thing. Something that didn’t rely on Stealth, but could be this hard-to-pin-down glass cannon, or maybe something that encouraged more attunement camping with appropriate mechanics to make it more skillful. However, we got a support spec that can barely support…seriously, all these new traits and the only somewhat worthwhile support is Elemental Bastion. Sure, the Shouts apply AoE Auras, but they completely undermine Powerful Auras. Tempest is just a mess.

Malchior.5732:

Valentinus.3412:

Seems like Revenant is going to be the Auramancer we were hoping for. Sigh…

Speak for yourself. I never wanted an Auramancer as my elite spec; something that could have been made more viable without using up all the new stuff(combine Elemental Bastion and Powerful Auras and give other lines more Aura traits, as right now, there’s only 1 real Aura trait in EACH of the main 4 lines…).

Instead, I wanted more of a Thief-Mage type thing. Something that didn’t rely on Stealth, but could be this hard-to-pin-down glass cannon, or maybe something that encouraged more attunement camping with appropriate mechanics to make it more skillful. However, we got a support spec that can barely support…seriously, all these new traits and the only somewhat worthwhile support is Elemental Bastion. Sure, the Shouts apply AoE Auras, but they completely undermine Powerful Auras. Tempest is just a mess.

I agree. We already had auromancer. Was really hoping for the Mage/Thief combo that you mentioned. Oh well, maybe for the next elite.

Powerful Aura lost a bit of its flavour cuz of aura sharing shouts. We have auras traits in many lines, so we can’t utilize to 100% that spreaded thingy. Heal from auras is definitely something what should be in water line. imo .

Herald is good concept, utilizing facets of glint and that sixth facet that works if speced into herald w/o need to choose glint legendary stance.

I’m waiting for tempest tweaks, massive changes:)

You guys are bugging beyond belief if you think this is better than tempest. I admit overloads are nowhere near what they should be, but tempest even now would fold this nonsense in half. Bah nvm I don’t know why I bother

Azure.8670:

You guys are bugging beyond belief if you think this is better than tempest. I admit overloads are nowhere near what they should be, but tempest even now would fold this nonsense in half. Bah nvm I don’t know why I bother

Herald is a better upgrade for Revenant with regards to group healing, than Tempest is for Elementalist. Ele may be inherently a better class than Revenant at this point, but Herald is at least usable and useful for what it is broadcast to do.

Wash the pain away!!!!

Xillllix.3485:

I’m pretty much jealous of every other professions elite skills at this point. It seems only the elementalist is destined to get get kittenty elites.

Don’t worry the class killer is working on 1 or 2 of the other classes as well so they are bound to have poor elites as well.

person A did reaper and chrono, both pretty good elite specs, person B did tempest and dragonhunter, both elite specs that could be better. i will laugh if thief elite spec turns out as plain as the other two. glad person A is currently working on warrior’s elite spec too.

The Great Al.2546:

I agree. We already had auromancer. Was really hoping for the Mage/Thief combo that you mentioned. Oh well, maybe for the next elite.

I simply can’t fathom why the devs seems so unwilling to touch old ele skills, traits and of course elites.

Powerful Auras totally should have the heal on auras, not the tempest line. And the frost aura proc too maybe (a bit nerfed). The vigor on water attune is a water trait too, and the protection buff seems extremely uninspired and wrong for tempest line too.

Also, shouts giving auras makes taking away auras on signets rather cruel.

And of course, Tornado basically needs a complete rework since they removed the damage buff to meteor shower which was basically it’s only use.

Mesmers and Necros got rather huge reworks to some of their traitlines, weapon and utility skills and of course Guardians got their elites completely reworked too.

But all they really did for eles was changing the burning on stuff.

It really shows now that ele is the first class designed in beta, especially on the way how the class basically stops to function without traits, while others are much more self-dependent without traits.

A lot of classes have must-have traits and/or utilities in PVP, but we’re really the only class that’s totally forced into 2 traitlines and 3 specific utilities and a specific heal to actually function in pvp/wvw.

Herald sounds like it lacks stab or aoe stun brakes (something only tempest will have atm).

Jski.6180:

Herald sounds like it lacks stab or aoe stun brakes (something only tempest will have atm).

AoE Stun Breaks are kinda worthless anyway and Tempest doesn’t have Stab either.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

I simply can’t fathom why the devs seems so unwilling to touch old ele skills, traits and of course elites.

I can’t fathom how they haven’t nerfed ele’s burn application yet.

Malchior.5732:

Jski.6180:

Herald sounds like it lacks stab or aoe stun brakes (something only tempest will have atm).

AoE Stun Breaks are kinda worthless anyway and Tempest doesn’t have Stab either.

AoE + fire wh 4 and i guess passive AoE. herald and revnet over all seems to lack good on the fly stab they have more passive stab that is low stack and not that great aoe. I was more talking about pure aoe stun breaks though wh and the one shout (they are not worthless if you save your melee from poping there own stun brakes its not going to stop a full hard cc bomb but it will counter early stun engages. Having 1 tempest d/wh in a melee group i think will push them back into the old stab of cant stop melee at all.

Jski.6180:

Herald sounds like it lacks stab or aoe stun brakes (something only tempest will have atm).

Guardian has it since launch. Besides, stability is much stronger than stun breakes.

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Herald sounds like it lacks stab or aoe stun brakes (something only tempest will have atm).

Guardian has it since launch. Besides, stability is much stronger than stun breakes.

Pre stab is stronger but often is on a longer cd tempest stun brake cd is 10 sec with wh. The ideal is to use the wh stun brake for smaller more offten stuns when stab is down or when your trying to save the stab effects. It makes stab rotation a bit easier in that guardian do not need to self stun brake with there aoe stabs when the team dose not need the stab.

I read this a lot in different topic so just to clarify:

Warhorn WON’T breakstun for you if you have imbued melody!!!
Why ?
How can you cast a non instant spell (aka spell with a cast time) when you’re stunned ?
Unless the trait periodically make WH’s skill cast time to 0, you wont be able to cast them and then, won’t be able to breakstun.
It’s a pure mate-support trait
and that’s one of the many reason why this trait sucks

Herald seems like i would make a decent point bunker in pvp. The traits will ultimately define if it has a role in wvw.

Mattmatt.4962:

I read this a lot in different topic so just to clarify:

Warhorn WON’T breakstun for you if you have imbued melody!!!
Why ?
How can you cast a non instant spell (aka spell with a cast time) when you’re stunned ?
Unless the trait periodically make WH’s skill cast time to 0, you wont be able to cast them and then, won’t be able to breakstun.
It’s a pure mate-support trait
and that’s one of the many reason why this trait sucks

Well ya its not made to be self support its made for pt support it may also hit a true 5 ppl and not just 4 + your self. Tempest has a number of self stun brakes to combo with added “free” stun brakes for your pt. You will stun brake your pt and you will stun brake ppl on your side with out you knowing in wvw or bigger then 5 man pts.

Jski.6180:

Well ya its not made to be self support its made for pt support it may also hit a true 5 ppl and not just 4 + your self. Tempest has a number of self stun brakes to combo with added “free” stun brakes for your pt. You will stun brake your pt and you will stun brake ppl on your side with out you knowing in wvw or bigger then 5 man pts.

Tempest has 2 stun breakers and one of them isn’t controllable. If you, as a tempest, are positioned in the front line, how are you expecting to stun breaks other people if you yourself might be stunned too frequently?

Mattmatt.4962:

How can you cast a non instant spell (aka spell with a cast time) when you’re stunned ?

Same way as you stun break with Rite of the Great Dwarf: you cast the skill while the rest of your skills are disabled, and when it finishes its stun break makes you able to use the rest of your skills.

Adrian Guardian.9480:

Same way as you stun break with Rite of the Great Dwarf: you cast the skill while the rest of your skills are disabled, and when it finishes its stun break makes you able to use the rest of your skills.

Rite of the Great Dwarf is a stunbreaker, warhorn skills, when traited, stun break allies, not yourself.

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Well ya its not made to be self support its made for pt support it may also hit a true 5 ppl and not just 4 + your self. Tempest has a number of self stun brakes to combo with added “free” stun brakes for your pt. You will stun brake your pt and you will stun brake ppl on your side with out you knowing in wvw or bigger then 5 man pts.

Tempest has 2 stun breakers and one of them isn’t controllable. If you, as a tempest, are positioned in the front line, how are you expecting to stun breaks other people if you yourself might be stunned too frequently?

Tempest has up to 6 with 3 passive and 3 utility skills.

Jski.6180:

Tempest has up to 6 with 3 passive and 3 utility skills.

Then looks like this spec can’t hold on his own.

Adrian Guardian.9480:

Mattmatt.4962:

How can you cast a non instant spell (aka spell with a cast time) when you’re stunned ?

Same way as you stun break with Rite of the Great Dwarf: you cast the skill while the rest of your skills are disabled, and when it finishes its stun break makes you able to use the rest of your skills.

So you meant to tell me that a stun breaker with half a sec activation time is reliable ?
Do you know that with human reaction time added, you’re near 1sec cast time … oh wait, 80% of stun last 1sec …..
And i’m still freaking not sure about the fact you can cast them while stunned

Herald has no condi cleanse AT ALL, ele can aoe heal conditions while sleeping, as guardian.

Kidel.2057:

Herald has no condi cleanse AT ALL, ele can aoe heal conditions while sleeping, as guardian.

Tempest has only one condition removal and that is an overload which means it’s kitten.

you can spec into water for full support and you heal conditions with applied regen.
Do do a similar thing on Herald you need Ventari (lol)

Kidel.2057:

you can spec into water for full support and you heal conditions with applied regen.
Do do a similar thing on Herald you need Ventari (lol)

as you see water isn’t tempest, 2condi removed from water overload and it is it,
water is another line, as well troopers runes are runes. Personaly I don’t know if we need or not more condi removal on tempest, but you have a tendency to throw as much as you can to show tempest as op, to make devs to not do any value changes for it.

“Crystal Hibernation: This one is all about personal defence and is a great save-me button for those sticky near-death situations. A crystal energy shield prevents damage after this skill has been channelled, and it also quickly tops up your health pool. Your character gains a defiance bar when this skill is used, and the risk of using it will need to be considered carefully.”

all i say is think overloads should gain this… even if its trait.. persoanlly should make aura share baseline for weapon skills, move heal on aura to water add this, hopefully just make it baseline but aslong as they add it i’d be happy

Kidel.2057:

you can spec into water for full support and you heal conditions with applied regen.
Do do a similar thing on Herald you need Ventari (lol)

You do realise speccing into water is the same as speccing into salvation and picking up ventari, don’t you?

Legends on their own, without corresponding specs are pretty much idiotic thing to pick. I cannot imagine picking 3 specialisations and only 1 legend that would be amongst those specialisations. That would be akin to picking up e.g. greatsword trait and not using it.

Basically, your arguments have no merit yet you continually try to force your baseless opinion that somehow tempest is already strong when the general opinion is that it’s the worst elite spec.

If you don’t like your dragonhunter, you can notice the pattern that both it and tempest are pretty much a step back and both of them were designed mostly by one guy.

Mattmatt.4962:

Adrian Guardian.9480:

Mattmatt.4962:

How can you cast a non instant spell (aka spell with a cast time) when you’re stunned ?

Same way as you stun break with Rite of the Great Dwarf: you cast the skill while the rest of your skills are disabled, and when it finishes its stun break makes you able to use the rest of your skills.

So you meant to tell me that a stun breaker with half a sec activation time is reliable ?
Do you know that with human reaction time added, you’re near 1sec cast time … oh wait, 80% of stun last 1sec …..
And i’m still freaking not sure about the fact you can cast them while stunned

I didn’t try warhorn enough, can’t say. Rite sure wasn’t, you generally got interrupted a second time or bursted down a second time during its old 2+s cast.

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Tempest has up to 6 with 3 passive and 3 utility skills.

Then looks like this spec can’t hold on his own.

Are you suggesting that a spec is only the new skills it brings? Because a full shout reaper is not good a full trap DH is not good maybe a full well cron could work but your still way better off using mez skill. Over all its got to be one of the most silly argument to be made.

Jski.6180:

Are you suggesting that a spec is only the new skills it brings? Because a full shout reaper is not good a full trap DH is not good maybe a full well cron could work but your still way better off using mez skill. Over all its got to be one of the most silly argument to be made.

It’s silly because you misunderstood it. Tempest can’t hold on its own because it has absolutely 0 close range defense which it needs in order to successfully overload its attunements. DH with traps or reaper or shouts might not be optimal but they are viable and are able to utilise their mechanics to their fullest. Tempest cannot because it doesn’t allow to complete overloads on its own. It gives us new mechanic which needs the base profession support for it to be utilised properly. That’s a kitten up in a design on an extreme scale.

Adrian Guardian.9480:

Mattmatt.4962:

Adrian Guardian.9480:

Mattmatt.4962:

How can you cast a non instant spell (aka spell with a cast time) when you’re stunned ?

Same way as you stun break with Rite of the Great Dwarf: you cast the skill while the rest of your skills are disabled, and when it finishes its stun break makes you able to use the rest of your skills.

So you meant to tell me that a stun breaker with half a sec activation time is reliable ?
Do you know that with human reaction time added, you’re near 1sec cast time … oh wait, 80% of stun last 1sec …..
And i’m still freaking not sure about the fact you can cast them while stunned

I didn’t try warhorn enough, can’t say. Rite sure wasn’t, you generally got interrupted a second time or bursted down a second time during its old 2+s cast.

Are you guys talking about Imbued Melodies? Because I tested it just in case: it’s only for allies.

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Are you suggesting that a spec is only the new skills it brings? Because a full shout reaper is not good a full trap DH is not good maybe a full well cron could work but your still way better off using mez skill. Over all its got to be one of the most silly argument to be made.

It’s silly because you misunderstood it. Tempest can’t hold on its own because it has absolutely 0 close range defense which it needs in order to successfully overload its attunements. DH with traps or reaper or shouts might not be optimal but they are viable and are able to utilise their mechanics to their fullest. Tempest cannot because it doesn’t allow to complete overloads on its own. It gives us new mechanic which needs the base profession support for it to be utilised properly. That’s a kitten up in a design on an extreme scale.

AoE arcain shield even LF to a point (old chrn bomb ideal but with overlodes.) Still a profoundly bad point to make (if the class dose not get any thing new even if it has old skills that cover what you need its a weak class).

Jski.6180:

AoE arcain shield even LF to a point (old chrn bomb ideal but with overlodes.) Still a profoundly bad point to make (if the class dose not get any thing new even if it has old skills that cover what you need its a weak class).

I’m not sure why are you clinging to the base profession’s skills. I’ve said that tempest cannot utilise its new mechanic on its own and you just basically admitted it. Finally, thank you.

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

AoE arcain shield even LF to a point (old chrn bomb ideal but with overlodes.) Still a profoundly bad point to make (if the class dose not get any thing new even if it has old skills that cover what you need its a weak class).

I’m not sure why are you clinging to the base profession’s skills. I’ve said that tempest cannot utilise its new mechanic on its own and you just basically admitted it. Finally, thank you.

Non of the new spec can stand on there own they are still very defined by there base spec.

What your saying is true tempest cant overlode with out being an ele becuse tempest is getting atuments from the ele spec lol.

Jski.6180:

Non of the new spec can stand on there own they are still very defined by there base spec.

What your saying is true tempest cant overlode with out being an ele becuse tempest is getting atuments from the ele spec lol.

I’m wasting my breath here…

For the last time, tempest cannot utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to stability which he doesn’t get on its own.

Can chronomancer use f5 without using any base skill or trait from other lines?
Can dragonhunter use f1-f3?
Can reaper use his new shroud skills?

Yes, they can. Can tempest use an overload successfully without getting stability in any challenging environment like PvP or high level fractals? No.

I’m trying to treat you seriously but spending so much time to explain the same thing doesn’t fill me with hope for any further discussion.

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Non of the new spec can stand on there own they are still very defined by there base spec.

What your saying is true tempest cant overlode with out being an ele becuse tempest is getting atuments from the ele spec lol.

I’m wasting my breath here…

For the last time, tempest cannot utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to stability which he doesn’t get on its own.

Can chronomancer use f5 without using any base skill or trait from other lines?
Can dragonhunter use f1-f3?
Can reaper use his new shroud skills?

Yes, they can. Can tempest use an overload successfully without getting stability in any challenging environment like PvP or high level fractals? No.

I’m trying to treat you seriously but spending so much time to explain the same thing doesn’t fill me with hope for any further discussion.

Tempest cant utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to atuments which he doesn’t get on its own.

Jski.6180:

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Non of the new spec can stand on there own they are still very defined by there base spec.

What your saying is true tempest cant overlode with out being an ele becuse tempest is getting atuments from the ele spec lol.

I’m wasting my breath here…

For the last time, tempest cannot utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to stability which he doesn’t get on its own.

Can chronomancer use f5 without using any base skill or trait from other lines?
Can dragonhunter use f1-f3?
Can reaper use his new shroud skills?

Yes, they can. Can tempest use an overload successfully without getting stability in any challenging environment like PvP or high level fractals? No.

I’m trying to treat you seriously but spending so much time to explain the same thing doesn’t fill me with hope for any further discussion.

Tempest cant utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to atuments which he doesn’t get on its own.

That…doesn’t change what he said. You’re just grasping at straws here.

Malchior.5732:

Jski.6180:

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Non of the new spec can stand on there own they are still very defined by there base spec.

What your saying is true tempest cant overlode with out being an ele becuse tempest is getting atuments from the ele spec lol.

I’m wasting my breath here…

For the last time, tempest cannot utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to stability which he doesn’t get on its own.

Can chronomancer use f5 without using any base skill or trait from other lines?
Can dragonhunter use f1-f3?
Can reaper use his new shroud skills?

Yes, they can. Can tempest use an overload successfully without getting stability in any challenging environment like PvP or high level fractals? No.

I’m trying to treat you seriously but spending so much time to explain the same thing doesn’t fill me with hope for any further discussion.

Tempest cant utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to atuments which he doesn’t get on its own.

That…doesn’t change what he said. You’re just grasping at straws here.

That the ele class gives all the effects tempest needs and to just give tempest the same effects over is mostly a waist of skills spaces?

Jski.6180:

Malchior.5732:

Jski.6180:

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Non of the new spec can stand on there own they are still very defined by there base spec.

What your saying is true tempest cant overlode with out being an ele becuse tempest is getting atuments from the ele spec lol.

I’m wasting my breath here…

For the last time, tempest cannot utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to stability which he doesn’t get on its own.

Can chronomancer use f5 without using any base skill or trait from other lines?
Can dragonhunter use f1-f3?
Can reaper use his new shroud skills?

Yes, they can. Can tempest use an overload successfully without getting stability in any challenging environment like PvP or high level fractals? No.

I’m trying to treat you seriously but spending so much time to explain the same thing doesn’t fill me with hope for any further discussion.

Tempest cant utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to atuments which he doesn’t get on its own.

That…doesn’t change what he said. You’re just grasping at straws here.

That the ele class gives all the effects tempest needs and to just give tempest the same effects over is mostly a waist of skills spaces?

At this point you must be agreeing that Overloads are a waste, ha!

Malchior.5732:

Jski.6180:

Malchior.5732:

Jski.6180:

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Non of the new spec can stand on there own they are still very defined by there base spec.

What your saying is true tempest cant overlode with out being an ele becuse tempest is getting atuments from the ele spec lol.

I’m wasting my breath here…

For the last time, tempest cannot utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to stability which he doesn’t get on its own.

Can chronomancer use f5 without using any base skill or trait from other lines?
Can dragonhunter use f1-f3?
Can reaper use his new shroud skills?

Yes, they can. Can tempest use an overload successfully without getting stability in any challenging environment like PvP or high level fractals? No.

I’m trying to treat you seriously but spending so much time to explain the same thing doesn’t fill me with hope for any further discussion.

Tempest cant utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to atuments which he doesn’t get on its own.

That…doesn’t change what he said. You’re just grasping at straws here.

That the ele class gives all the effects tempest needs and to just give tempest the same effects over is mostly a waist of skills spaces?

At this point you must be agreeing that Overloads are a waste, ha!

They are skills that you have a chose to use or not to use they could use a buff but they are not going away. Work with it or move on.

I think overloads are workable as a core tool and i would like to have them over not having them.

Jski.6180:

Tempest cant utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to atuments which he doesn’t get on its own.

I’m saying “A can’t work” and you respond with “But B doesn’t work anyway”. Even examples were not enough. :^)

Malchior.5732:

At this point you must be agreeing that Overloads are a waste, ha!

Circular reasoning, my favourite.

rotten.9753:

Jski.6180:

Tempest cant utilise his mechanic (overloads) without an access to atuments which he doesn’t get on its own.

I’m saying “A can’t work” and you respond with “But B doesn’t work anyway”. Even examples were not enough. :^)

Then move on… you seem to given up and its not getting a new core effect at this point in the game your simply waiting your time. I simply disagree with your point of view.

Jski.6180:

Then move on… you seem to given up and its not getting a new core effect at this point in the game your simply waiting your time. I simply disagree with your point of view.

Then I’ll wait my time.