Guild Wars 2

any major buff is because they excel at WvW. Sadly they are a victim of their own strength, if there was a way to give it power without gutting their WvW potential then we would finally see fulfilled the long-range mage-archetype nuker……. at last.

From shooting pea in sPvP to an actual glass cannon, like they were intended to be.

My suggestion: Make AoE damage divide among targets, the more people the less damage, consequently, in a 1v1 or 2v2 scenery the damage is INCREDIBLY increased (to the point it is actually worth going 30/30/0//0/10)

Or

Make Fire and Air traits just as good as water/arcana, there is no real reason to go any other way when these two make up for the low hit points and armor and actually have good synergy/good traits.

Fortus.6175:

any major buff is because they excel at WvW. Sadly they are a victim or their own strength, if there was a way to give it power without gutting their WvW potential then we would finally see fulfilled the long-range mage-archetype nuker……. at last.

From shooting pea in sPvP to an actual glass cannon, like they were intended to be.

My suggestion: Make AoE damage divide among targets, the more people the less damage, consequently, in a 1v1 or 2v2 scenery the damage is INCREDIBLY increased (to the point it is actually worth going 30/30/0//0/10)

Or

Make Fire and Air traits just as good as water/arcana, there is no real reason to go any other way when these two make up for the low hit points and armor and actually have good synergy/good traits.

I see two options here:

First, ANet could make fire/air/earth traits 4x better to compensate for the 1/4 time we get to use them or second, ANet could make fire/air/earth traits affect other attunements.

The trait that is +10% damage while attuned to fire could become “Fire’s power increases the damage of all your attacks by 10%” or “Deal +40% damage while attuned to fire”

Granted the 40% may be a little excessive, but yeah…you get the idea. Power them up or spread them around, they’re not worth the points as it stands now.

I’ve been exclusively playing a staff elementalist in WvW since release of the game with a 30/30/0/10/0 build and a 80 to 20 ratio of offensive and defensively orientated gear.

The fundamental problem with staff in my experience is not that AoE would be too weak or too powerful. The fundamental problem is that the single target spells are too unreliable which often forces me to throw my AoE at a single player if I actually want to have a chance at killing him. It is pretty ridiculous that I have a higher chance at succeeding at a 1v1 if I cast Meteor Shower rather than using any of my single target spells.

So the question is why is that the case? There are three problems with the single target spells:

a) Perpetual miss after target change: the first spell that you cast AFTER you have changed target from A to B or reacquired a target that you’ve had targeted a short time ago will always miss. Every single time. Without exception. I.e. I have a guy to my left targeted, now I switch my target to the guy to my right. Now I cast Fireball: guess where the Fireball is flying – to the guy to my left…

This is also one of the reasons why fighting a thief can be extremely frustrating. Every time he goes into stealth I lose him as my target. Once he comes back and once I have required him as my target, the first single target spell that I cast at him will miss him.

Sometimes even the second and the third cast after target acquisition misses.

b) Too slow projectile flight speed. It is easy for an enemy to dodge my projectiles or outrun them because they fly so slow. This combined with the fact that casting single target spells tends to take 1 to 2 seconds means that it is very easy for my enemy to ensure that he will rarely ever get hit.

c) Projectiles don’t pierce. As soon as a Ranger’s pet decides to run between me and the Ranger – I can’t hit him anymore. Same with Necro pets or any other kind of NPC/pets.

Weakening the AoE that staff elementalists have is not the right answer. The right answer is to fix the single target spells. The AoE is currently the only reliable way that I have to actually hit my target. So if you want to see me throw less AoE around then make it actually possible to kill someone by using my single target spells.

Just to make it clear: the problem with the single target spells is not the amount of damage they cause – this part is fine – the problem is that they are too unreliable at hitting.

Simplicity.7208:

Fortus.6175:

any major buff is because they excel at WvW. Sadly they are a victim or their own strength, if there was a way to give it power without gutting their WvW potential then we would finally see fulfilled the long-range mage-archetype nuker……. at last.

From shooting pea in sPvP to an actual glass cannon, like they were intended to be.

My suggestion: Make AoE damage divide among targets, the more people the less damage, consequently, in a 1v1 or 2v2 scenery the damage is INCREDIBLY increased (to the point it is actually worth going 30/30/0//0/10)

Or

Make Fire and Air traits just as good as water/arcana, there is no real reason to go any other way when these two make up for the low hit points and armor and actually have good synergy/good traits.

I see two options here:

First, ANet could make fire/air/earth traits 4x better to compensate for the 1/4 time we get to use them or second, ANet could make fire/air/earth traits affect other attunements.

The trait that is +10% damage while attuned to fire could become “Fire’s power increases the damage of all your attacks by 10%” or “Deal +40% damage while attuned to fire”

Granted the 40% may be a little excessive, but yeah…you get the idea. Power them up or spread them around, they’re not worth the points as it stands now.

The point of the Lingering Elements minor trait (Arcana 15) is that it extends the “X effect while Y element” to other attunements. In theory, you could get all 3 of those, start casting a high-damage spell like churning earth, and flip through fire and air to get a total of +30% damage.

Whether a build with 10/20/20/0/15 as the base is a good idea is another question, probably answered by “no”, but…

Regardless, those few traits are fine if used with Arcana 15. Some traits need a little reshuffling between elements to make builds more diverse, still.

As for the whole staff issue, we’ve got a couple compound problems.

1) “AoE is too strong”
2) Staff AoE attacks never fully connect

As a primarily PvE player, I want to see staff get damage added to Frozen Ground and Static Field. However… those two are fairly reliable at snaring players in some form in WvW. A WvW player would love to see Ice Spike and Eruption become easier to land, but then they might be too strong.

I’m not sure if there’s any one solution. WvW is supposed to function with PvE mechanics, including the mobs, so a skill split between WvW and PvE probably wouldn’t happen. However, the two have more or less opposed balance needs for certain classes. =/

Dingle.2743:

The point of the Lingering Elements minor trait (Arcana 15) is that it extends the “X effect while Y element” to other attunements. In theory, you could get all 3 of those, start casting a high-damage spell like churning earth, and flip through fire and air to get a total of +30% damage.

This trait has never worked like that and has been in the long outdated bug thread for a long time. Nobody knows if that’s intentional behavior or an actual bug. In fact, the only one I think that works with this trait is after you leave water attunement, soothing mist reapplies itself once more.

I doubt a boost in damage output will ever make the staff a viable PvP weapon. It is simply too slow to ever be viable.

There is no problem with that though, the staff is fine as it is. It simply isn’t a 1v1 weapon and it doesn’t need to be one.

Why can’t weapons be good for different roles?

Staff is excellent for aoe damage, support, control and works well when lots of enemies are together.

Why do you want to take away it’s main strength? So it can be like D/D? Different weapon sets, different ways of using them.

Staff could use some slight buffs, but its core mechanics don’t need to be changed . Just get over the fact that it’s not a good 1v1 weapon.

If all traits that only worked in one attunement, had effects for other attunements, that’d be pretty amazing.

Fire’s embrace granting an aura matching the signet’s element for example…
One with Air granting a building buff based on each attunement…

No, the main issue is that you’re trying to duel with a group support weapon.

As long as a weapon has combo fields, it will have to be weakened for 1v1 because in group play, combo fields become exponentially stronger.

Having said that, I feel that the key to making the staff balanced for both large battles and duelling lies in the auto attacks. They can be buffed relatively safely without overpowering the aoe aspect of the weapon.

ThiBash.5634:

No, the main issue is that you’re trying to duel with a group support weapon.

As long as a weapon has combo fields, it will have to be weakened for 1v1 because in group play, combo fields become exponentially stronger.

Having said that, I feel that the key to making the staff balanced for both large battles and duelling lies in the auto attacks. They can be buffed relatively safely without overpowering the aoe aspect of the weapon.

I’d go as far as saying the problem with staff is that it’s only a group support weapon, and that’s all we get from using it. Every other class has access to weapon swaps (or in engineer’s case a selection of kits, each with different focuses) which allow them to proerly adapt to situations.

ANet has give elementalists “the most versatility” in total weapon skills, and then made all 4 sets on a given weapon effective for an identical single purpose. Warriors have a list of well-defined weapons they can mix and match to suit their needs, but we’re locked into the same 4 attunement sets with a single weapon… and in staff’s case every single attunement is “Long-range, easy to avoid AoE skills with subpar damage for 1v1 opponents, with a weak 1v1 auto-attack we don’t intend you to use very often”

Staff elementalists simply have no option to switch to a 1v1 skillset when appropriate, unlike: every other profession in the game. That’s why we feel so bad in 1v1 compared to other professions. Unlike them, once we’re in combat we don’t have the option to change.

I also don’t think buffing the autoattacks is the best option. We’re touted as one of the most versatile classes in the game; reducing us to “press 1 and keep the opponent on camera because we’re most effective that way” would suck. Staff needs a few dedicated 1v1 skills, but the autoattacks shouldn’t be more appropriate than any other skill for raw damage. The special effects on Stoning and Water Blast are more indicative of what Staff’s autoattacks should all do (ex: Fireball: chance on hit to AoE might on allies, Chain Lightning: Bounce to allies for swiftness, or give enemies vuln)

I think its best that the auto’s be retooled to really fit with what ever the main theme of the attunement’s kit, and that they should always be a good source of damage, regardless of their secondary functions. Ideally, you should want to use them because they contribute meaningful damage AND provide a secondary function, like most if not ALL other autoattacks in the game.

This is because even if I’m a full damage traited and geared berserker style staff user, I never have a reason to use Water Blast. Sure, its an ok skill if you specialize in healing power, but for the very least an auto-attack should be universally “ok” for any spec.

With the highest damage build possible in the entire game (my build focusing on damage amplification of potentially over 110%), its hard to get water blast to crit for more than 1k, while the auto-attacks on the first two swings of conjured lightning are hitting for 6 to 7k in similar situations, with the final being able to hit for 11k+ depending on vulnerability stacks. Very different weapons, but the sheer distance between them is just terrible.

If fireball is considered our “base line” auto damage, then the other abilities with a bit more utility (water blast + stoning) should be about 80% of FB’s damage, and the easier to land, more aoe focused or potentially higher dps option if 2 opponents next to each other should be Chain Lighting at maybe 60 to 70% of FB’s damage.

Currently, spamming fireball with lavafount is actually one of the highest damage ranged weapon combos in the entire game for sheer dps, so no help is needed there really, its a niche weapon set that rewards locking down a foes mobility or denying a location with LF. Add in Meteor Shower and this only gets better.

The problem is the other 3 attunements dont just do “less” damage, they do practically no damage compared to Fire. Ice Spike is nice, for sure, but Lightning Surge and Eruption’s direct damage reeaaaally could use some scaling buffs, particularly for how big their cast times are.

Eruption is already perfect for Condi builds, and its my favorite skill in the game for that, but a bit of direct damage option would be nice too, as it would reward swapping attunements while still able to deal some raw damage (less than fire but not abysmal) while applying control skills and Weakness for a while.

Basically what im getting at is that the damage options on the staff need to be present on each weapon set if you truly want “raw damage” elementalists to feel like they have true flexibility with the staff. If water blast did 80% of fireballs dps, then i could justify using it to help heal my allies slightly while i continue to deal damage, but it wouldnt aoe foes, which is fireball’s biggest selling point. If stoning did reasonable damage, i also could see myself stacking a bit of weakness on a boss for a bit while i wait for Fire attunement to come back up, particularly if a boss is landing consistant heavy hits on the group like Lupus does at times.

Currently, its a losing battle for me to swap and stay in any other attunement that ISNT fire on a berserker elementalist. Instead I only cherry pick a few utilitarian and control skills from each attunement then rush back to fire as quickly as possible.

Swiftwynd.1685:

I think its best that the auto’s be retooled to really fit with what ever the main theme of the attunement’s kit, and that they should always be a good source of damage, regardless of their secondary functions. Ideally, you should want to use them because they contribute meaningful damage AND provide a secondary function, like most if not ALL other autoattacks in the game.

This is because even if I’m a full damage traited and geared berserker style staff user, I never have a reason to use Water Blast. Sure, its an ok skill if you specialize in healing power, but for the very least an auto-attack should be universally “ok” for any spec.

With the highest damage build possible in the entire game (my build focusing on damage amplification of potentially over 110%), its hard to get water blast to crit for more than 1k, while the auto-attacks on the first two swings of conjured lightning are hitting for 6 to 7k in similar situations, with the final being able to hit for 11k+ depending on vulnerability stacks. Very different weapons, but the sheer distance between them is just terrible.

If fireball is considered our “base line” auto damage, then the other abilities with a bit more utility (water blast + stoning) should be about 80% of FB’s damage, and the easier to land, more aoe focused or potentially higher dps option if 2 opponents next to each other should be Chain Lighting at maybe 60 to 70% of FB’s damage.

Currently, spamming fireball with lavafount is actually one of the highest damage ranged weapon combos in the entire game for sheer dps, so no help is needed there really, its a niche weapon set that rewards locking down a foes mobility or denying a location with LF. Add in Meteor Shower and this only gets better.

The problem is the other 3 attunements dont just do “less” damage, they do practically no damage compared to Fire. Ice Spike is nice, for sure, but Lightning Surge and Eruption’s direct damage reeaaaally could use some scaling buffs, particularly for how big their cast times are.

Eruption is already perfect for Condi builds, and its my favorite skill in the game for that, but a bit of direct damage option would be nice too, as it would reward swapping attunements while still able to deal some raw damage (less than fire but not abysmal) while applying control skills and Weakness for a while.

Basically what im getting at is that the damage options on the staff need to be present on each weapon set if you truly want “raw damage” elementalists to feel like they have true flexibility with the staff. If water blast did 80% of fireballs dps, then i could justify using it to help heal my allies slightly while i continue to deal damage, but it wouldnt aoe foes, which is fireball’s biggest selling point. If stoning did reasonable damage, i also could see myself stacking a bit of weakness on a boss for a bit while i wait for Fire attunement to come back up, particularly if a boss is landing consistant heavy hits on the group like Lupus does at times.

Currently, its a losing battle for me to swap and stay in any other attunement that ISNT fire on a berserker elementalist. Instead I only cherry pick a few utilitarian and control skills from each attunement then rush back to fire as quickly as possible.

dude….THIS ^
Unlike ALL profession we dont have the chance to “switch” from group to 1v1 at moment’s need!

also, how the heck do you get 6k-7k with lighting?! I can never get past 1.5-2k with full zerker set(exotic) and all accesorys zerker (ascended and exotic) and 5 stacks of mights and a couple of vulnerability!

Fortus.6175:

also, how the heck do you get 6k-7k with lighting?! I can never get past 1.5-2k with full zerker set(exotic) and all accesorys zerker (ascended and exotic) and 5 stacks of mights and a couple of vulnerability!

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/81706-ouch-my-everything-the-80-potential-amplified-damage-build-with-sustain-support-and-control/

Its a build focused on damage amplification.

Damage Increase effects are multiplicative, so they become stronger the more you mix together.

You mix Piercing Shards trait (20% while in Water Attunement, effects Conjured Weapons too!) Vital Strikes (10%) Ember’s Might (5%) Burning Rage (5%), Bolt to the Heart (20%) and Sup. Sigil of Force (5%) and Sup. Scholar Runes (10%) and Bountiful Power (2% per boon).

All of these combined with mostly berserker gear (i use cavalier’s for my accessories and the all-stats ascended amulet, with Ruby jewles slotted into the cavalier’s) results in some vicious damage.

For full damage, you need to be above 90% health, with vulnerability and burning on the foe from your allies, and you get 25 might from external sources. Never had a 25 vulnerability + 25 might spike damage set up yet but it would be vicious. Once foes go below 33% it increases even further thanks to bolt to the heart

Swiftwynd.1685:

Fortus.6175:

also, how the heck do you get 6k-7k with lighting?! I can never get past 1.5-2k with full zerker set(exotic) and all accesorys zerker (ascended and exotic) and 5 stacks of mights and a couple of vulnerability!

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/81706-ouch-my-everything-the-80-potential-amplified-damage-build-with-sustain-support-and-control/

Its a build focused on damage amplification.

Damage Increase effects are multiplicative, so they become stronger the more you mix together.

You mix Piercing Shards trait (20% while in Water Attunement, effects Conjured Weapons too!) Vital Strikes (10%) Ember’s Might (5%) Burning Rage (5%), Bolt to the Heart (20%) and Sup. Sigil of Force (5%) and Sup. Scholar Runes (10%) and Bountiful Power (2% per boon).

All of these combined with mostly berserker gear (i use cavalier’s for my accessories and the all-stats ascended amulet, with Ruby jewles slotted into the cavalier’s) results in some vicious damage.

For full damage, you need to be above 90% health, with vulnerability and burning on the foe from your allies, and you get 25 might from external sources. Never had a 25 vulnerability + 25 might spike damage set up yet but it would be vicious. Once foes go below 33% it increases even further thanks to bolt to the heart

Im well aware of all that and as matter of fact I do use all that, coupled with ascended gear and max stats armor/weapons, yet I have NEVER reached 6-7k of damage with lighting #1 so im calling shenanigans on it until proven otherwise. But of course, 25 might stacks and 25 vuln stacks it will hit ahrd, but i can guarantee you that even then it would not be optimal, because with that much damage added any profession would be almost insta destroying anything in its path…

Anyways, Staff needs help, no going around it, either fix it or give us an statement saying as to why not, so many cant be wrong, when staff is only good for WvW raids then you know you have done wrong somewhere….. and lack of suggestions isnt, because this forum is FULL of them (a couple of my own too)

Fortus.6175:

Swiftwynd.1685:

Fortus.6175:

also, how the heck do you get 6k-7k with lighting?! I can never get past 1.5-2k with full zerker set(exotic) and all accesorys zerker (ascended and exotic) and 5 stacks of mights and a couple of vulnerability!

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/81706-ouch-my-everything-the-80-potential-amplified-damage-build-with-sustain-support-and-control/

Its a build focused on damage amplification.

Damage Increase effects are multiplicative, so they become stronger the more you mix together.

You mix Piercing Shards trait (20% while in Water Attunement, effects Conjured Weapons too!) Vital Strikes (10%) Ember’s Might (5%) Burning Rage (5%), Bolt to the Heart (20%) and Sup. Sigil of Force (5%) and Sup. Scholar Runes (10%) and Bountiful Power (2% per boon).

All of these combined with mostly berserker gear (i use cavalier’s for my accessories and the all-stats ascended amulet, with Ruby jewles slotted into the cavalier’s) results in some vicious damage.

For full damage, you need to be above 90% health, with vulnerability and burning on the foe from your allies, and you get 25 might from external sources. Never had a 25 vulnerability + 25 might spike damage set up yet but it would be vicious. Once foes go below 33% it increases even further thanks to bolt to the heart

Im well aware of all that and as matter of fact I do use all that, coupled with ascended gear and max stats armor/weapons, yet I have NEVER reached 6-7k of damage with lighting #1 so im calling shenanigans on it until proven otherwise. But of course, 25 might stacks and 25 vuln stacks it will hit ahrd, but i can guarantee you that even then it would not be optimal, because with that much damage added any profession would be almost insta destroying anything in its path…

Anyways, Staff needs help, no going around it, either fix it or give us an statement saying as to why not, so many cant be wrong, when staff is only good for WvW raids then you know you have done wrong somewhere….. and lack of suggestions isnt, because this forum is FULL of them (a couple of my own too)

25 Might Stacks is VERY common and painfully easy to maintain in coordinated groups and most PUG Arah / Fractal groups. 2 guardians, keeping up fire fields with your constant Blasts, or other various might-stacking options make this a VERY reasonable possibility.

I’ve never had the idea “25 might + 25 vulnerability” situation yet, but when that happens I’ll post the numbers.

But yea, 6 to 7k first hits and 12 to 13k third hits ARE a common thing for me in a decent Arah group!

EDIT:

OH I GET IT :O Did you think I meant lightning on the staff, not the lightning hammer?

Because those are Conjure Lightning’s autoattack damage, not staffs (which blows sadly even for a ranged weapon).

Swiftwynd.1685:

Fortus.6175:

Swiftwynd.1685:

Fortus.6175:

also, how the heck do you get 6k-7k with lighting?! I can never get past 1.5-2k with full zerker set(exotic) and all accesorys zerker (ascended and exotic) and 5 stacks of mights and a couple of vulnerability!

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/81706-ouch-my-everything-the-80-potential-amplified-damage-build-with-sustain-support-and-control/

Its a build focused on damage amplification.

Damage Increase effects are multiplicative, so they become stronger the more you mix together.

You mix Piercing Shards trait (20% while in Water Attunement, effects Conjured Weapons too!) Vital Strikes (10%) Ember’s Might (5%) Burning Rage (5%), Bolt to the Heart (20%) and Sup. Sigil of Force (5%) and Sup. Scholar Runes (10%) and Bountiful Power (2% per boon).

All of these combined with mostly berserker gear (i use cavalier’s for my accessories and the all-stats ascended amulet, with Ruby jewles slotted into the cavalier’s) results in some vicious damage.

For full damage, you need to be above 90% health, with vulnerability and burning on the foe from your allies, and you get 25 might from external sources. Never had a 25 vulnerability + 25 might spike damage set up yet but it would be vicious. Once foes go below 33% it increases even further thanks to bolt to the heart

Im well aware of all that and as matter of fact I do use all that, coupled with ascended gear and max stats armor/weapons, yet I have NEVER reached 6-7k of damage with lighting #1 so im calling shenanigans on it until proven otherwise. But of course, 25 might stacks and 25 vuln stacks it will hit ahrd, but i can guarantee you that even then it would not be optimal, because with that much damage added any profession would be almost insta destroying anything in its path…

Anyways, Staff needs help, no going around it, either fix it or give us an statement saying as to why not, so many cant be wrong, when staff is only good for WvW raids then you know you have done wrong somewhere….. and lack of suggestions isnt, because this forum is FULL of them (a couple of my own too)

25 Might Stacks is VERY common and painfully easy to maintain in coordinated groups and most PUG Arah / Fractal groups. 2 guardians, keeping up fire fields with your constant Blasts, or other various might-stacking options make this a VERY reasonable possibility.

I’ve never had the idea “25 might + 25 vulnerability” situation yet, but when that happens I’ll post the numbers.

But yea, 6 to 7k first hits and 12 to 13k third hits ARE a common thing for me in a decent Arah group!

EDIT:

OH I GET IT :O Did you think I meant lightning on the staff, not the lightning hammer?

Because those are Conjure Lightning’s autoattack damage, not staffs (which blows sadly even for a ranged weapon).

oh yah then sorry, but yeah, the hammer hurts, but once again, as a squishy, if you go into the front line melee, you will blow, and Im saying this because by having 25 might and 25 vuln stacks that means there is more than 5 people there, yu will blow faster than ou can say KABO-

Fortus.6175:

Swiftwynd.1685:

Fortus.6175:

Swiftwynd.1685:

Fortus.6175:

also, how the heck do you get 6k-7k with lighting?! I can never get past 1.5-2k with full zerker set(exotic) and all accesorys zerker (ascended and exotic) and 5 stacks of mights and a couple of vulnerability!

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/81706-ouch-my-everything-the-80-potential-amplified-damage-build-with-sustain-support-and-control/

Its a build focused on damage amplification.

Damage Increase effects are multiplicative, so they become stronger the more you mix together.

You mix Piercing Shards trait (20% while in Water Attunement, effects Conjured Weapons too!) Vital Strikes (10%) Ember’s Might (5%) Burning Rage (5%), Bolt to the Heart (20%) and Sup. Sigil of Force (5%) and Sup. Scholar Runes (10%) and Bountiful Power (2% per boon).

All of these combined with mostly berserker gear (i use cavalier’s for my accessories and the all-stats ascended amulet, with Ruby jewles slotted into the cavalier’s) results in some vicious damage.

For full damage, you need to be above 90% health, with vulnerability and burning on the foe from your allies, and you get 25 might from external sources. Never had a 25 vulnerability + 25 might spike damage set up yet but it would be vicious. Once foes go below 33% it increases even further thanks to bolt to the heart

Im well aware of all that and as matter of fact I do use all that, coupled with ascended gear and max stats armor/weapons, yet I have NEVER reached 6-7k of damage with lighting #1 so im calling shenanigans on it until proven otherwise. But of course, 25 might stacks and 25 vuln stacks it will hit ahrd, but i can guarantee you that even then it would not be optimal, because with that much damage added any profession would be almost insta destroying anything in its path…

Anyways, Staff needs help, no going around it, either fix it or give us an statement saying as to why not, so many cant be wrong, when staff is only good for WvW raids then you know you have done wrong somewhere….. and lack of suggestions isnt, because this forum is FULL of them (a couple of my own too)

25 Might Stacks is VERY common and painfully easy to maintain in coordinated groups and most PUG Arah / Fractal groups. 2 guardians, keeping up fire fields with your constant Blasts, or other various might-stacking options make this a VERY reasonable possibility.

I’ve never had the idea “25 might + 25 vulnerability” situation yet, but when that happens I’ll post the numbers.

But yea, 6 to 7k first hits and 12 to 13k third hits ARE a common thing for me in a decent Arah group!

EDIT:

OH I GET IT :O Did you think I meant lightning on the staff, not the lightning hammer?

Because those are Conjure Lightning’s autoattack damage, not staffs (which blows sadly even for a ranged weapon).

oh yah then sorry, but yeah, the hammer hurts, but once again, as a squishy, if you go into the front line melee, you will blow, and Im saying this because by having 25 might and 25 vuln stacks that means there is more than 5 people there, yu will blow faster than ou can say KABO-

Well, yes and no in Dungeons. Its one of those “once you get good enough, rarely should you ever get hit” kind of deals. I’m still not quite good enough, which is why i have a smidgen of toughness, but once I have fractals and arah completely down, I should be fine for full beserker in my accessories.

Fortus.6175:

any major buff is because they excel at WvW. Sadly they are a victim of their own strength, if there was a way to give it power without gutting their WvW potential then we would finally see fulfilled the long-range mage-archetype nuker……. at last.

From shooting pea in sPvP to an actual glass cannon, like they were intended to be.

My suggestion: Make AoE damage divide among targets, the more people the less damage, consequently, in a 1v1 or 2v2 scenery the damage is INCREDIBLY increased (to the point it is actually worth going 30/30/0//0/10)

Or

Make Fire and Air traits just as good as water/arcana, there is no real reason to go any other way when these two make up for the low hit points and armor and actually have good synergy/good traits.

WvW is a better judge of overall balance than sPVP. sPVP is a very very specific form or combat catering to only select builds. WvW shows the power and potential of every build. It’s that simple I’m afraid.

You can never fully balance classes based on extremely small area control, it has to be a variety of situations.

On the bright side they do have separate rule sets. It’s possible staff could be buffed in sPVP only.

Aside i fully agree on “never connect” issue
I want to add that staff ele that should be the best aoe profession is instead quite bad comparing to mesmers and necros in www.

ANd they don t even need to go zerker to do much more than us.

So no AoE are not an issue…if some profession can go almost tankish with impunity and we cannot compare even going zerker.

Korval.2197:

I’ve been exclusively playing a staff elementalist in WvW since release of the game with a 30/30/0/10/0 build and a 80 to 20 ratio of offensive and defensively orientated gear.

The fundamental problem with staff in my experience is not that AoE would be too weak or too powerful. The fundamental problem is that the single target spells are too unreliable which often forces me to throw my AoE at a single player if I actually want to have a chance at killing him. It is pretty ridiculous that I have a higher chance at succeeding at a 1v1 if I cast Meteor Shower rather than using any of my single target spells.

So the question is why is that the case? There are three problems with the single target spells:

a) Perpetual miss after target change: the first spell that you cast AFTER you have changed target from A to B or reacquired a target that you’ve had targeted a short time ago will always miss. Every single time. Without exception. I.e. I have a guy to my left targeted, now I switch my target to the guy to my right. Now I cast Fireball: guess where the Fireball is flying – to the guy to my left…

This is also one of the reasons why fighting a thief can be extremely frustrating. Every time he goes into stealth I lose him as my target. Once he comes back and once I have required him as my target, the first single target spell that I cast at him will miss him.

Sometimes even the second and the third cast after target acquisition misses.

b) Too slow projectile flight speed. It is easy for an enemy to dodge my projectiles or outrun them because they fly so slow. This combined with the fact that casting single target spells tends to take 1 to 2 seconds means that it is very easy for my enemy to ensure that he will rarely ever get hit.

c) Projectiles don’t pierce. As soon as a Ranger’s pet decides to run between me and the Ranger – I can’t hit him anymore. Same with Necro pets or any other kind of NPC/pets.

Weakening the AoE that staff elementalists have is not the right answer. The right answer is to fix the single target spells. The AoE is currently the only reliable way that I have to actually hit my target. So if you want to see me throw less AoE around then make it actually possible to kill someone by using my single target spells.

Just to make it clear: the problem with the single target spells is not the amount of damage they cause – this part is fine – the problem is that they are too unreliable at hitting.

God kitten I am so glad to see another person calling ArenaNet out for nerfing the only viable method for a class to operate rather than improving its other features to encourage their use. If people are all using one build/skill, it’s because the class is underpowered, not overpowered. Nerfing them is not the answer!!

Ralathar.7236:

WvW is a better judge of overall balance than sPVP. sPVP is a very very specific form or combat catering to only select builds. WvW shows the power and potential of every build. It’s that simple I’m afraid.

I would make the argument that because spvp is within a controlled environment where there is not any gear or level disparity at all, we can see both the good and lacking parts of a certain build. Plus, spvp is getting even more types of objectives with the likes of Temple of the Silent Storm and Spirit Watch.

How is WvW not a very specific form of combat? Instead of taking and holding points, you’re taking and holding towers and keeps (i.e. points with a structure) with a zerg (or maybe zerg busting) where the individual’s build makes less of a difference than the guy in charge, coordination, and the overall size of the zerg. If you’re not doing any of that, then you’re likely roaming and doing PvE against some guards at a supply camp, PvD (player vs door), or looking to just kill some people at the scale of combat that is the same as spvp except there is gear and level disparity.

There’s hardly anything in wvw I would say offers more variety other than a zerg vs zerg, or differentiates combat. WvW may not cater to selecting from a pool of builds, but I think the main reason would be because an individual’s build hardly makes a difference within the zerg. A build differentiates itself more in small scale fights. Play a pure glass cannon staff ele in wvw, and then in spvp; it’s completely different because there isn’t a sea of people to hide behind. You also won’t be hitting 4k fireballs or meteors for a quarter of someone’s health.

Adastra.9821:

Ralathar.7236:

WvW is a better judge of overall balance than sPVP. sPVP is a very very specific form or combat catering to only select builds. WvW shows the power and potential of every build. It’s that simple I’m afraid.

I would make the argument that because spvp is within a controlled environment where there is not any gear or level disparity at all, we can see both the good and lacking parts of a certain build. Plus, spvp is getting even more types of objectives with the likes of Temple of the Silent Storm and Spirit Watch.

How is WvW not a very specific form of combat? Instead of taking and holding points, you’re taking and holding towers and keeps (i.e. points with a structure) with a zerg (or maybe zerg busting) where the individual’s build makes less of a difference than the guy in charge, coordination, and the overall size of the zerg. If you’re not doing any of that, then you’re likely roaming and doing PvE against some guards at a supply camp, PvD (player vs door), or looking to just kill some people at the scale of combat that is the same as spvp except there is gear and level disparity.

There’s hardly anything in wvw I would say offers more variety other than a zerg vs zerg, or differentiates combat. WvW may not cater to selecting from a pool of builds, but I think the main reason would be because an individual’s build hardly makes a difference within the zerg. A build differentiates itself more in small scale fights. Play a pure glass cannon staff ele in wvw, and then in spvp; it’s completely different because there isn’t a sea of people to hide behind. You also won’t be hitting 4k fireballs or meteors for a quarter of someone’s health.

Gear/level disparity meaning whatever effectiveness you might have is slightly less or slightly greater depending on your opponent. This vs sPVP where a multitude of builds simply will not work at all and get crushed due to the design of the battleground.

You obviously don’t know too much about WvW. It has point control, open field, small scale, and large scale. Basically everything. Builds and individuals can indeed matter greatly even in large battles. In fact it there is the potential for your contribution to matter little or the potential for your contribution to matter far more than it would in a 1 vs 1 because you can actually change the course of an entire fight if you play well.

There are also builds that differentiate themselves more in large scale fights and ones that differentiate themselves more in small scale fights.

You do not understand WvW very well. I’ll ask that you not try and define it based on your lack of knowledge.

LordByron.8369:

Aside i fully agree on “never connect” issue
I want to add that staff ele that should be the best aoe profession is instead quite bad comparing to mesmers and necros in www.

ANd they don t even need to go zerker to do much more than us.

So no AoE are not an issue…if some profession can go almost tankish with impunity and we cannot compare even going zerker.

If you think that Ele is not the best AOE profession you haven’t seen a good Ele. Capable of slaughtering zergs and siege alike while laying down great support and flexible to any situation.

Ralathar.7236:

LordByron.8369:

Aside i fully agree on “never connect” issue
I want to add that staff ele that should be the best aoe profession is instead quite bad comparing to mesmers and necros in www.

ANd they don t even need to go zerker to do much more than us.

So no AoE are not an issue…if some profession can go almost tankish with impunity and we cannot compare even going zerker.

If you think that Ele is not the best AOE profession you haven’t seen a good Ele. Capable of slaughtering zergs and siege alike while laying down great support and flexible to any situation.

Or maybe you didn t see worthy opponent with the ability to dodge…or simply walk away…….

Btw you can simply click www forum….its not that far…look at that post about confusion…..

Now you know wich are best aoe professions…not to even compare mesmer support with ele for decency….

Ralathar.7236:

Gear/level disparity meaning whatever effectiveness you might have is slightly less or slightly greater depending on your opponent. This vs sPVP where a multitude of builds simply will not work at all and get crushed due to the design of the battleground.

For the reason underlined alone, spvp is a better comparator for a specific build because everyone has access to the exact same gear. There is no “depending on your opponent”. Only the build and player(s) determine the outcome. You’re also misunderstanding something here. I never said anything about comparing every build imaginable.

Ralathar.7236:

It has point control, open field, small scale, and large scale. Basically everything. Builds and individuals can indeed matter greatly even in large battles. In fact it there is the potential for your contribution to matter little or the potential for your contribution to matter far more than it would in a 1 vs 1 because you can actually change the course of an entire fight if you play well.

There are also builds that differentiate themselves more in large scale fights and ones that differentiate themselves more in small scale fights.

You do not understand WvW very well. I’ll ask that you not try and define it based on your lack of knowledge.

Ignoring that remark because I do in fact play all aspects of the game even though I’m not a WvW veteran, what does WvW offer in addition other than large scale battles? Indeed, the zerg is going to get overrun because you weren’t there… No, the individual matters very little in comparison to the collective power of the zerg. Making a 30v30 into a 31v30 would not decide the outcome of the battle. The collective power of two similarly sized zergs are, on average, equal. A single person running a specific build won’t make a noticeable difference.

Let’s say that wvw does offer a whole lot more in terms of combat (I know it’s at least equal so you can stop going on about that how I don’t understand wvw) without taking into account the averaging of a zerg’s power. The idea that the environment which has more variables to balance around giving a better balance overview is ridiculous.

Consider a system where the variables are binary (true/false). With n variables, there are 2^n possible combinations. Adding a single variable will double the complexity. That is, the complexity of the system grows exponentially with every variable. Now instead of a binary outcome, the variables can take on a spectrum of different outcomes and you have a balancing nightmare. The developers have even stated somewhere in the forums a few months ago that the maps alone were a nightmare to create. You can’t easily balance classes based on a variety of situations while you can actually balance, at least more easily with fewer resources, “extremely small area control”. WvW works fine with mostly PvE balance. In fact, it would work just fine with spvp balance (people would still be unhappy about nerfs regardless), but that can’t happen because it’s linked with your PvE character. If I were in management, I wouldn’t throw extra resources at a problem that hardly exists.

There are reasons why Anet doesn’t balance WvW separate from PvE and I believe this is one of the them, and another being the collective power of a zerg overshadows the individual. Normally, only severely game-changing things such as the portal nerf would be balanced specifically for wvw. While Jsharp did say there will be more splitting of skills to better balance the various areas of the game, I don’t think PvE and WvW are going to be separated any time soon because of the resources needed but with small returns.

Adastra.9821:

For the reason underlined alone, spvp is a better comparator for a specific build because everyone has access to the exact same gear. There is no “depending on your opponent”. Only the build and player(s) determine the outcome. You’re also misunderstanding something here. I never said anything about comparing every build imaginable.

In fairness seeing what a build can do in a variety of situations is actually better than controlled environment catered only to a specific area. How does it perform open field, closed field, point control, large numbers, small numbers, when at a disadvantage, when at an advantage, etc.

For instance some builds are very good when on even terms, but you get rolled when you are at a disadvantage. Others largely mitigate the disadvantage as part of the build.

sPVP vs WvW is like comparing cars in a race on the drag strip vs Indianapolis. Sweet, you can take off quickly and quickly reach a top speed, but can you do that while cornering and after hours of punishment?

Just like a car is not just acceleration and top speed a build is not just the limited aspects of sPVP.

Adastra.9821:

Ignoring that remark because I do in fact play all aspects of the game even though I’m not a WvW veteran, what does WvW offer in addition other than large scale battles? Indeed, the zerg is going to get overrun because you weren’t there… No, the individual matters very little in comparison to the collective power of the zerg. Making a 30v30 into a 31v30 would not decide the outcome of the battle. The collective power of two similarly sized zergs are, on average, equal. A single person running a specific build won’t make a noticeable difference.

Let’s say that wvw does offer a whole lot more in terms of combat (I know it’s at least equal so you can stop going on about that how I don’t understand wvw) without taking into account the averaging of a zerg’s power. The idea that the environment which has more variables to balance around giving a better balance overview is ridiculous.

Consider a system where the variables are binary (true/false). With n variables, there are 2^n possible combinations. Adding a single variable will double the complexity. That is, the complexity of the system grows exponentially with every variable. Now instead of a binary outcome, the variables can take on a spectrum of different outcomes and you have a balancing nightmare. The developers have even stated somewhere in the forums a few months ago that the maps alone were a nightmare to create. You can’t easily balance classes based on a variety of situations while you can actually balance, at least more easily with fewer resources, “extremely small area control”. WvW works fine with mostly PvE balance. In fact, it would work just fine with spvp balance (people would still be unhappy about nerfs regardless), but that can’t happen because it’s linked with your PvE character. If I were in management, I wouldn’t throw extra resources at a problem that hardly exists.

There are reasons why Anet doesn’t balance WvW separate from PvE and I believe this is one of the them, and another being the collective power of a zerg overshadows the individual. Normally, only severely game-changing things such as the portal nerf would be balanced specifically for wvw. While Jsharp did say there will be more splitting of skills to better balance the various areas of the game, I don’t think PvE and WvW are going to be separated any time soon because of the resources needed but with small returns.

I’ve played hundreds upon hundreds of hours of WvW and I hail from Dark Age of Camelot. This is my life blood and what I am extremely familiar with.

You can theory craft in the laboratory world of your imagination all you want based on your limited experience. The fact is that the reality is much different. Individual players can indeed make big differences in fights. Individual builds can indeed be very important. Again, I ask you to leave alone what you do not properly understand. Any experienced WvW player knows exactly how wrong you are even if you do not.

I dunno about whether they will split PVE and WvW. On one hand I see your point, but on the other hand WvW has been far far FAR more popular than they expected.