Guild Wars 2

Engineer was billed as a class that was a mid-range fighter that could control the battlefield with Turrets and be impactful in “close in fights”.

For the most part, this statement by the developers has largely proven to be true. Engineer as a class becomes progressively more dangerous to fight the closer it comes, and much of its damage – both Power and Condition damage based – scales inversely with distance to target.

This is coupled with skills that can control range (Elixir Gun Acid Bomb, Rifle Jump Shot, Net Shot and Overcharged Shot, Shield Magnetic Inversion, FT Air Blast, BK Glue bomb and Big Ol’ Bomb, TK Magnet Pull and Box of Nails, Net Turret and Net Toolbelt) which allow the Engineer to control the opponent’s position to allow the optimal delivery of damage.

That being said, Engineer main hand weapons are still unworthy of being the go-to weapon and it is exceedingly rare to find a build in WvW that does not incorporate at least 1 kit. By enabling weapon-swap sigils and providing an extra 6 skills for the 1 utility slot, Kits overshadow many other utilities and in a way has superceded the Toolbelt as a class mechanic.

What is 6 cooldowns for Kits vs the 3 for Turrets and 2 for Gadgets? Opportunity cost doesn’t even begin to describe this disparity in utility, damage potential, and defensive potential.

I truly feel that this is an unfortunate state for the class to be in and whilst reworks of Turrets and Gadgets could do much to bring non-kit builds into “meta”, the easiest place to tackle this problem is in Main hand weapons.

Any discussion of damage should first look at this because as it turns out, Engineer Main hand weapons aren’t that bad – they’re just clunky

Rifle
The Rifle’s kit is for the most part dedicated to controlling range. It is the source of burst for many Power/Crit damage builds and for the most part it does this well.
Hip Shot at 1000 range provides steady DPS, and is actually superior to Warrior’s Rifle in that it pierces without trait. It has good base values but suffers from a lack of synergy with the rest of the kit
Net Shot is a powerful immobilising skillshot with 1000 range. Although easy to sidestep at long range, it is a threatening opener to Rifle burst at shorter ranges. I don’t have a problem with the skill as it’s well designed – it fits with the Kit and has counterplay.
Blunderbuss does monstrous damage with good reward for the risk of melee range. Its long cast time with windup animation allows for counterplay and its cooldown isn’t crippling. Alas, it suffers from a terrible hitbox.
Overcharged Shot is one of those skills with overloaded utility. It cleanses snares (Immobilise, cripple, chill), has instant cast, short cooldown, and inflicts Launch which is the most powerful stun in the game. Its scaling is pretty kitten decent for a kiting skill. However, it suffers from a long aftercast and short range, meaning that you get up at the same time as an opponent. This means it is merely a tool for resetting a fight, not an escape.
Jump Shot fulfils multiple criterion of being a gap closer, mini-escape, and burst opener. It fits well with the kit, and recent buffs to aftercast have finally made the gap closer component viable. The tooltip’s cast time is inaccurate as the skill has 1 second air time, not just the 0.25 activation. I do like the skill, but its speed is simply unacceptable for its 700 range. Elementalist’s Burning Speed is only 0.75 seconds to travel 600 range, whilst Warrior Savage Leap travels even farther: 900 range in 0.75 seconds. This is another area that should be looked at.

Now, this being said, I feel that Engineer Rifle is actually in a pretty good place, but, there are a few changes necessary to make it a true “Main Hand weapon”

First, it lacks sustained pressure once you actually get to close range. Second, whilst its long cast time skills are well designed to allow counter play, some rewards are insufficient for their range

It’s all well and good to control the opponent’s distance to you in 4 of the 5 skills, but the main skill for applying sustained pressure – Hip Shot auto attacks – does not scale with decreasing range. I feel that this is the most important change that will bring Rifle Engineers back from the Beta days.

Making the auto-attack scale in damage with decreasing range would also harmonise it with the rest of the kit. At long ranges, Hip Shot could be a threat – if you plinked away for a long time. But I believe thakittens 0.9 sec cast time including aftercast should be rewarded for being up close.

Hip Shot
Increasing Hip Shot’s damage by 10% at 600 range, then by another 10% at <130 range should be sufficient. Alternatively, make it stack 2xVulnerability on targets <300 range for 4 seconds. This would finally make Hip Shot something worthy to spam at close range rather than switching to bombs with its superior 1.25 scaling, 5x AOE limit at traited 180 radius, 120 untraited.

Blunderbuss
I would also propose normalising the Bleed Stacks that Blunderbuss inflicts at ranges beyond 100. Blunderbuss’s damage is not only halved at >100 range, its scaling is reduced by 0.6 to a mere 1, and Bleed stacks to a mere 1. This is too much punishment for a skill that has poor tracking. Normalising the bleed stacks to 4 at all ranges would again, make Rifle apply consistent pressure at shorter ranges after its burst.

Overcharged Shot
Those of you that use rifle will recognise that your character lays on the ground for far longer than is actually normally inflicted by Knockdown. This is due to Aftercast. Coupled with Overcharged Shots 400 range, this will place an opponent in Melee a mere 800 range from you, and an opponent at max range at 1000 – still well within the threat envelope of most Ranged weapons, and well within gap closer range for Melee weapons. As I mentioned earlier, this makes Overcharged shot only a fight reset, NOT an escape. I feel that reducing the Aftercast of Overcharged shot can do much to make it feel less clunky and actually give it potential as an escape tool.

Jump Shot
As I mentioned earlier, Jump Shot’s speed is simply excessive for the distance it travels. 0.25 seconds activation, +1 second travel time +aftercast makes this skill one of the slowest Leaps in the entire game. I feel that nothing less than a 0.75 second cast total casting time + minuscule aftercast is enough to justify its longer 20 second cooldown. Jump Shot’s GTAOE nature also ultimately constrains its range to the tooltip maximum without animation cancelling because you cannot abuse terrain unlike other leaps. Buffing its speed will do much to compensate this massive loss of flexibility if you do not run a kit.

Pistol
Before I even begin going through the skills of the Pistol I will first mention 1 overarchingly important thing: Pistol’s Bleed application and damage was crippled in the August 2012 patch. This will colour my commentary of Pistol Skills for the rest of my posts.

Explosive Shot
As soon as people discovered the hysterics that was Coated Bullets Pistol’s autoattack was nerfed into the ground for Bleed application. Bleed time was halved and damage nerfed by 12.5% from the 135 to the 118 that we see today. This is why we see +Condition Duration and/or Might Stacking builds like P/P HGH or Teldo’s Burning damage build – the nerf to both damage and condition application made using Pistol 1 outside of such builds a liability.
The patch also introduced crippling aftercast to Pistol 1 – Its activation time is now closer to 0.8 seconds as opposed to the 0.5 advertised on the tooltip. It now fires as slowly as a rifle but without any pressure potential outside of crit-proc condition builds.
For Pistol to even be considered worthy outside of something you weave in between Kit cooldowns, the aftercast must go. Doing so will finally allow pistols to stand on their own without Might stacking or Incendiary Powder.

Poison Dart Volley
This skill is interesting because it actually did little-to-no damage in Beta . It’s only in recent times that a damage component was added and increased . However, outside of triggering crit-procs, its actual intended purpose of Poison application utterly falls down at ranges beyond 300-400 depending on opponent movement.
The RNG cone pattern that the darts fire in has excessive spread for a skill that has 900 range. I find myself never even using its cooldown unless I can get within 300 range because I know I will not get a viable Poison application otherwise. It’s actually bad enough that it’s more reliable to use Sigil of Doom instead. This is a bad thing because again, it pushes Engineers towards Kits to be able to get that proc. Any skill that cannot stand on its own without Kits for Engineer is probably not worth using.

Static Shot
This skill is the only reason why Pistol Shield is viable. There, I said it. A potential 5 target Blind on an instant cast with Confusion on top is the only thing that makes Main Hand Pistol worth taking. With 2 out of the 3 Main Hand Pistol skills being utterly worthless, having a multiple target Blind redeems some of Pistol’s awfulness.
Its slower travel time with target tracking gives it counterplay (dodgeable) without making it over powered.
I have nothing bad to say for this skill. It is the only thing worth picking up Pistol for.

Blowtorch
Again, this is another skill that makes Pistol worth taking. 600 range potentially, but we all know that the real hurt comes with the <200 range, 6 second burn. This is a strong skill with good reward for getting in close and playing like Engineer is meant to be played – just outside of melee’s 130. Its small hitbox allows for counterplay, without a crippling cooldown.
That being said, I feel that increasing the cast time in return for widening its cone AOE is what will make it worth taking over Pistol/Shield. It will also silence the concerns of poor tracking. At 200 range, the spread is simply too small to hit more than 1 target and it is even harder to land than Fire Grab because at least with Fire Grab, you can set it up with CC or gap closers.

Glue Shot
One would think that landing Glue Shot would make it easier to hit Blowtorch, and you would be right, except that Glue Shot travels so kitten slowly. At 700 max range it is nigh impossible to land on an alert player, and even then, its speed is so slow that the dodge window for it is ludicrously big.
I am all for increasing its speed so that it is actually a viable threat and setup for Blowtorch.

Pistol/X is in a terrible place right now because there was little thought given to the rest of Pistol’s Kit when Pistol 1 was nerfed into the ground. Pistol-only builds that did not rely on Might Stacking relied upon its autoattack (should be obvious) to apply pressure with bleed stacks that built up over time.

Explosive Shot
Before the introduction of an aftercast that was basically doubling the cast time, Pistol 1 might have been still viable after the bleed application and damage nerf. Adding a hidden cooldown basically invalidates tooltip information and this is a bad thing. As it stands, there is nothing worthy left aside from Static Shot. The aftercast must go.

Poison Dart Volley
I wish I could like this skill for its intended purpose of Poison application. When I can actually apply poison more reliably at all ranges using Sigil of Doom this entire skill is invalidated outside of its pure damage component. Which is terrible anyway unless you Might Stack.
The Conal AOE must go. I would actually use Poison Dart Volley if it was similar to Volley – No spread – no tricks – just a channelled multi-hit skill that has counterplay by forcing dodges.

Static Shot
I have nothing against Static Shot.

Blowtorch
The conal AOE must be increased in radius to something similar to Fire Grab. I understand thakittens maximum range is 600 and inflicting AOE Burn for 2 seconds on potentially 5 targets would be easier with a radius buff. That being said, I believe that a majority of complaints about poor tracking would be solved more easily with a radius buff over, say, recoding Blowtorch’s animation.

Glue Shot
Glue Shot’s projectile speed is just shy of player’s default movement speed in combat, and that is not okay. For a 30 second cooldown it is exceedingly difficult to setup a condi-burst using Glue Shot and in fact I find it easier to simply use Glue Bomb. When a Kit easily supersedes a Main-hand weapon skill there is a problem here.
I understand that any AOE Immobilise requires some kind of delay for counterplay but the speed is simply not there.

Is the solution to the gadget / turret problem really to buff mainhand weapons? While I agree that they could receive usability buffs, I think that most engineers will just have a slightly better pistol or rifle, and continue to use a number of kits. By itself, this wouldn’t impact the problem that you mentioned: gadgets and turrets as a whole take up valuable utility slot space. Even if these utilities are passable or even good, kits are usually better, due simply to the fact that they have more skills. Even if you have a strong mainhand weaponset with synergistic skills, you’ll eventually use up its four cooldowns, then if you’re running non-kit utilities, you’ll be left with a couple of extremely situational skills to defend or attack with. The way gadgets and turrets are currently designed, I don’t see this path being a likely fix for engineer skill viability.

What I’ve mentioned so far is a situation caused by the lack of energy costs in this game. Because there is typically no cost to using skills other than their cooldowns, more cooldowns is almost always preferable to less. Instead, I think we should look at the skills themselves:

Turrets currently suffer from long cooldowns, being squishy, immobility, to ACCIDENTAL cleave and AoE, and nonexistent scaling for power/pre, limiting theoretical usage to tanky builds or condition builds. All of this on top of low damage is a bit of a slap in the face, especially when compared to the AI of other classes, such as the Necromancer MM build. The player is basically immune to conditions while their minions are up, the minions are mobile, and they deal more damage. Some traits can be slotted that cause minions to scale with the player’s stats. Having any of that would benefit turrets and improve viability.

Gadgets suffer mainly from overspecialization. I said earlier that more cooldowns are preferable to less; the rare exception is if there is some specialized utility required, such as the boon strip from mine field, the unblockable CC component of throw mine, or the mobility of rocket boots. To demonstrate the problem, most skills have a parallel skill in kits: Ram Head can be compared to Big Bomb, Rocket Boots can be compared to Acid Bomb, Ram Head may be faster cast without a tell, but Big Bomb is AoE, on top of offering four more skills beyond the launch effect. Rocket Boots is a strong mobility skill, recently buffed, but it still faces some competition from Acid Bomb, a shorter cooldown leap that doesn’t go as far and doesn’t cure conditions, but also offers four other skills as well as a stunbreaker. While these skills aren’t exactly the same, they demonstrate the general problem of more cooldowns typically being more useful overall.

I’ve talked about weak options for the engineer so far, but there is one thing I want to talk about. Elixirs.

Elixirs, on release, were mocked the same way turrets and gadgets are mocked today. They were RNG and typically had long cooldowns. They also suffered from the same opportunity cost that plague turrets and gadgets, in that they take up a valuable kit slot. However, the thing that made elixirs different, and actually, in the end, viable, was the fact that they had meaningful traits.

20% CDR and cleanse conditions on usage. After that, all elixirs needed was a small HGH buff to push an all-elixir build into viability.

Due to the precedent that the HGH elixirs build set, I would say that the first step to viability for gadgets and turrets is meaningful traits. Gadgets currently have only a 20% cdr trait, and turrets are pretty clunky and squishy even when double traited for survivability, and still deal low damage even with Rifled Turret Barrels and full condition damage. Their utility is lacking compared to kits, and turrets currently don’t offer much that other skills can’t.

I would say that meaningful traits are more important at this point than MH buffs for skill viability. Being able to trait a skill line is somewhat essential, it provides an element of unpredictability to a build as well optional upgrades that can be played without. For example, if you wanted to specialize in gadgets, all you would have to do is take all of the gadget traits. If you just wanted Rocket Boots for the mobility, you wouldn’t need to trait it. If you wanted to go all turrets you would do the same thing, pick up all the related turret traits.

tl;dr: Turret traits need to be vastly improved, Gadget skill line needs more traits, MH weapons could use numbers changes and quality-of-life buffs, but they aren’t in the dreadful situation that some of Engineer’s utilities are in right now.

Aegael.6938:

tl;dr: Turret traits need to be vastly improved, Gadget skill line needs more traits, MH weapons could use numbers changes and quality-of-life buffs, but they aren’t in the dreadful situation that some of Engineer’s utilities are in right now.

Whilst I concur with you that Turret Traits and Gadgets need more improvement, I still am of the opinion that as long as Main Hand weapon skills have these longstanding problems, Kit-less builds will be suffering more than they need to and as a result they will be less attractive given how much Kits offer the Engineer.

Let’s look at what a single Kit offers to the Engineer:
5 more cooldowns + 1 autoattack
Enables Weapon Swap (And voila, an entire line of Sigils opens up)
Enables animation cancelling and cast while channelling – Has improvement ramifications for Jump Shot, Poison Dart Volley and (now patched) Static Shield.
These bottom 2 features alone push Engineers to Kits – accessing a weapon Swap sigil is child’s play considering the plays you can open up.

For a Kit-less build to begin to be viable, you must make the weapon skillset more viable than it is now.

As I mentioned earlier into my posts, I feel that improving the Main hand weapon choices is the easiest thing that can be done right now. It is apparently trivial using Arenanet’s tech to prototype new skills and I feel that buffs to skills are simpler than something deeper like traits. One has to look no further than the Rifled Barrels fiasco where the old version of Rifle Jump Shot with its huge aftercast was reintroduced when traited.

As a beneficial side effect, non-kit builds are globally improved, whilst reworks of Turrets and Gadgets and introducing new traits would still only target specific subsets of skills.

On a side note, I did make a thread and I did contribute to a thread that Swagg made with regards to Turrets and Gadgets a while ago. I’ll try to find it because Swaggs thread in particular I feel had some pretty cool ideas.

Arena net dev’s are reading this right now and going “We need to nerf kits”. In all seriousness though I agree with the assessment, it’s nice to read a post that actually includes some thought on the forums. +1 to both you and Aegael for both bringing up very valid points and sound reasoning.

Aegael.6938:

tl;dr: Turret traits need to be vastly improved, Gadget skill line needs more traits, MH weapons could use numbers changes and quality-of-life buffs, but they aren’t in the dreadful situation that some of Engineer’s utilities are in right now.

So I mentioned earlier that I would endeavour to find the threads where I posted suggestions along with Swagg on how to improve Turrets and Gadgets. Even back then, my focus was largely on the skills rather than Traits, as I felt that trait changes were insufficient if the baseline skill was awful anyway.

This is Swaggs Thread

This is my turret suggestion thread. I start off with traits, but I feel that skill reworks are probably the way to go halfway through. This thread didn’t get a lot of traffic (none of my threads do) but I do feel it did have some effect.

Have a read through. Who knows? Maybe you’ll find me and Swagg’s brainstorming useful.

Solution-give engis hammers

dunnberry.2964:

Solution-give engis hammers

I want Crossbows.

We’ll be getting more weapons soon; their intention is reputed to be to give every class every weapon.

Other than that, I think many of the issues (at least dealing with Turrets) could be handled by, I don’t know…fixing the bugs. The fire rate bug (if it’s not intended, not that anybody seems halfway interested in bothering to tell us so), in particular, is holding turrets back.

Anymras.5729:

We’ll be getting more weapons soon; their intention is reputed to be to give every class every weapon.

Other than that, I think many of the issues (at least dealing with Turrets) could be handled by, I don’t know…fixing the bugs. The fire rate bug (if it’s not intended, not that anybody seems halfway interested in bothering to tell us so), in particular, is holding turrets back.

@dunnberry, @petespri;
Arenanet has already mentioned that they intend to give Engineers hammers at some point ; with more weapon options across all classes coming in the future as the game’s updates are pushed out. There have been no specific dates given, which is situation normal RE: Anet, but generally if they commit to something it does happen eventually.

I still stand by my belief that Engineer’s pre-existing weapons could do with some tweaks, however. If the new weapons come and they are great, that’s fantastic – yet another option for us to try out and a (hopefully) viable melee option to complement our ranged abilities.

That being said, pushing a new weapon out to us still does not redeem the fact that as a class our main hand weapons do have issues.

@Anymras;
I feel that any discussion of turrets should always make mention of the AI of turrets. Damage or fire rate mean nothing if the turret does not fire upon what the engineer is firing upon; or at destructible terrain when valid targets are in range.

However, I think that is better discussed in your thread rather than in mine.

I’ve actually never had that much complaint about the turrets focusing on what’s nearest to them, as opposed to what I’m firing at.

Now, them trying to fire through walls, or at destroyed objects, now those I’ve had issues with.

petespri.6548:

dunnberry.2964:

Solution-give engis hammers

I want Crossbows.

I want Repeating Crossbows.

bump because i feel this is very important topic

@ukuni: Thanks for the bump!

As I said before, pushing new weapons out to us, or introducing new traits, does not redeem the fact that the base weapon skills could do with some tweaks.

Now, onto the last main-hand weapon choice of the Engineer – the Shield.

The Shield is unique in that it is basically the only weapon in the entire game with 2 chaincasting skills . Ergo, you essentially have 4 skills for the price of only 2 on your skillbar.

Uniquely amongst Engineer skills also, the skills involve forethought before using. I really like the Engineer’s shield moreso than any other weapon set among any class because it is one of the few skills that have long cooldowns to punish spamming; and have unique tactical applications to certain situations. It is also relatively unique amongst weapon skills because their animations are visually distinct, which allows for counterplay. Let’s get into the skills of the shield, and why it is essentially the best offhand of any class.

Magnetic Shield
Magnetic shield is Shield 4 and the first in the Shield 4’s chaincasting skills. It roots the engineer for 3 seconds to provide Projectile reflection on a 30 second cooldown. The skill is distinctly animated and a fair cooldown – other weaponskill based reflects are on par with its cooldown.

That being said, it trades off 1 second longer duration (2 seconds for Magnetic Aura and Magnetic Wave) for immobility. In addition, non-projectile attacks like Necromancer Marks, Elementalist Dragon’s Tooth/Arc Lightning/Melee attacks still go through. In my experience and from watching other GW2 streamers that use Shield (Teldo being notable), Magnetic Shield is almost never used – it is instead immediately detonated for a Blast Finisher and PBAoE pushback. I think it’s sad that such a strong skill with good counterplay is largely ignored. On the other hand, it is very much necessary because the current state of PvP dictates that movement and dodging is king – sitting there taking blows is far inferior.

I think it’s a to worthy sacrifice to self-immobilise for such a strong duration, but I would still prefer the ability to kite and a shorter duration. I believe that adding the ability to move about – even at a reduced rate – would actually bring Magnetic Shield back into its intended niche. One should also remember that the counterplay for mobile projectile reflection – GTAoE like Necro Marks, all Melee skills, and non-projectile attacks like Elementalist Scepter, Mesmer GS, Necro Axe and so on – is actually strong enough to outcompete projectile reflection regardless.

Magnetic Inversion
The second skill in the chain, this skill is favoured far, far more over its initiator skill due to being a Blast finisher and a PBAoE knockback – both essential tools in the Engineer arsenal for general utility and kiting. I actually feel that this skill is too strong as it far outcompetes the initiator skill, Magnetic Shield. There is almost no reason to self-root for Magnetic Shield as it does no damage in itself, and standing still opens oneself up to GTAoE spam that will most likely lead swiftly to death.

Its animation is also very ambiguous. It actually shares animation (that of the expanding, transparent shockwave) with Elementalist Magnetic Wave . As such, Magnetic Inversion is very much favoured on maps like Skyhammer where such a non-telegraphed pushback is deadly for pushing foes off the cliff.
I would be in favour of making this animation (And Magnetic Wave along with it) more visually distinct. I would also like there to be at least some minor cast time (0.25sec) with a minor telegraph so that there is at least counterplay.
Up the damage to compensate, or add a 1 second Daze to emphasize its interrupt nature.

Now, onto the very last skill.
Static Shield
Static Shield (Shield 5) is one of the best blocks in the game. Even after the June 25 tweaking of the skill, it is still very, very strong in all formats, and it is actually strong enough on its own to discourage a player to cast the next skill in the chain. It has a justifiably long cooldown for its power, is visually distinct, and has counterplay – all prerequisites for having a strong, balanceable skill.

Activating Static Shield makes it block all ranged and melee attacks for 2 seconds. For the first 1.5 seconds, however, melee attackers striking the shield are stunned for 2 seconds. This has been changed from the previous iteration, which had the potential stun duration last for the full 2 second block, but which ended the block upon blocking a melee attack.

Recent tweaking of the skill no longer allows activating its channel to then cast other skills whilst in the Blocking state. I would actually argue that it is an overall buff because it is now stronger in 1vX, whilst being able to still attack while blocking was an oversight as no other class may do so whilst channelling blocks. The skill as it stands still punishes melee, and multi-hit ranged attackers may no longer still get attacks through with impunity because the blocking duration has been effectively extended.
I would say that Static Shield is now well balanced; however, the cooldown could be a little lower.

Throw Shield
Throw Shield is the next chaincasted skill in line. It is essentially a thrown AOE Daze in a line with 900 range. It has a very visible, distinct animation and is great for forcing dodges. It is notable in that it still travels the full distance and returns to daze again, which again, emphasizes Engineers being progressively more dangerous to fight as distance decreases.

With good tracking to compensate its slow projectile speed, Throw Shield is a skill with fair counterplay. However, I would recommend an increase in its speed as it is slow enough to be nigh unusable as a clutch Daze – rather, it is largely used to counter channelling skills. Increasing its speed would make it better akittens intended purpose of interrupting. I feel that the projectile is visible enough to allow counterplay.

One problem I have with the current iteration is that if you Throw Shield into an opponent who is in front of a wall, if it strikes the wall, the projectile is destroyed, and you lose the opportunity to double daze. This was a recent tweak in the June 25 patch to address concerns that it was possible to daze foes on the other side of a wall. Given Throw Shields already negligible damage, I feel this is excessive punishment.

I would like this band-aid fix reversed and the skill properly coded to begin its return flight upon striking a wall. Throw Shield is already so slow it may only be used as a channelling interrupt or predictive daze (read: spam if you have the CD in case opponent casts something nasty) – this tweak did not need to happen and nerfed a skill that already had strong counterplay.

If such a solution turns out to be impossible to code, instead have Throw Shield apply a custom condition that dazes the foe after 1 second if the shield is destroyed. If the shield is not destroyed, then the return daze is executed as normal and the custom condition falls off without triggering.

I also find it notable that all replies on this topic seem to address all other Engineer concerns – Turrets, Gadgets, Traits – aside from the topic of Main Hand weapon skill tweaks.

Could it be that we as Engineers have been so inured to the niche utility of weapons and have favoured Kits so much that we have forgotten that Weapon Skills exist? I find this to be a deplorable state of affairs.

Fair points by Aegael but I have to agree with OP. Very sensible analysis and solutions by MonMalthias.
Just improving the main-hands by these limited amounts, would be pretty effective in solving a surprising amount of the classes’ issues. tightening up primary weapons would allow some variety. I’ve been trying to find a place where I’m really comfortable with engineer and some of that is without having to use mostly kits. The problem is that the pitiful damage output and combo potential of the main-hands, forces kit use to make up the balance. I wouldn’t mind too much having a set-up with just one kit but as I get deeper into the game I seem to be forced to add more kits in to make up the shortfall.

Although new weapons might alleviate this if they’re better tweaked than rifle or pistol/x they’ll just create a new problem. Everyone who wants to cut back on kits will be forced to use the new weapon, while pistol/x and rifle gather dust.

No, OP is right, I think. Solve the main hand weapons we have, improve the class globally without overpowering it.

Projectile Speed and Hit Detection on Net Shot could use some looking at.

Holesale.2640:

Projectile Speed and Hit Detection on Net Shot could use some looking at.

@Holesale:
I actually think that there are no issues with the hitbox for Net Shot – it is very reliable even across rough terrain for the most part – which is something that Magnet Pull of the Toolkit cannot claim, or even Flame Blast from Flamethrower.

That being said, there is a fine line between OP and UP for skillshots in GW2 in terms of speed. There was a lot of controversy surrounding Illusionary Leap and Swap at first because of its instant cast and very fast projectile speed leading to big damage with Blurred Frenzy.

That being said, the rest of Rifle’s Kit is clunky and slow enough to maybe justify an increase in Net Shot’s speed; mainly because Rifle is no-where near as fast or elegant as Mesmer’s Sword burst combo. There is a great feeling of landing a manually led targeted Net Shot at beyond 600 range and increasing the projectile speed will be a useful buff to a mechanically challenging skill that also has counterplay.

Going through the Shield skills with their chaincasts has also given me an idea for other ways to improve Rifle. With Rifle being the premier long-range annoyance, short-range burst threat weapon, it could also be possible to add the sustained short-ranged pressure by making Rifle Net Shot have a casting chain:

Net Shot
Cast time Instant, Range 1000, Immobilise 2 seconds, Cooldown 10 seconds

Chains into

Reel it In
Cast time 0.75 sec, Range 1000. Cooldown 20 seconds
Pull yourself closer to your Immobilised target. Inflict 5 stacks of Vulnerability for 3 seconds. Combo Finisher: Leap.
This skill would essentially add yet another gap closer to the Rifle. A secondary gap closer would de-emphasise the use of Jump Shot as the primary closer and burst opener and instead open up the use of using both of Jump Shot’s damage components into burst.
This skill would essentially be a re-hash of Elementalist Dagger Earth 3 Magnetic Grasp but in itself do no damage. By adding a longer cooldown to the secondary cast, this powerful gap closer would warrant thinking before spamming it.
In addition, with the majority of damage of Jump Shot now backloaded onto the landing component, comboing Reel it In with the intention of escaping with Jump Shot would result in subpar damage and burning 2 relatively long weapon skill cooldowns.

As a side effect, adding Reel it In would semi-automate Blunderbuss, and could potentially mean that buffing Blunderbuss is ultimately un-necessary as you now have the perfect Blunderbuss burst setup.

I like that idea, its a skill that’s already in the game essentially so its not out of the realm of possibility.

Hopefully this will be looked at if they ever allow us to swap or upgrade weapon skills in the future because all of these ideas are great.

MonMalthias.4763:

I also find it notable that all replies on this topic seem to address all other Engineer concerns – Turrets, Gadgets, Traits – aside from the topic of Main Hand weapon skill tweaks.

Could it be that we as Engineers have been so inured to the niche utility of weapons and have favoured Kits so much that we have forgotten that Weapon Skills exist? I find this to be a deplorable state of affairs.

Well, our weapon skills are weaker on purpose since we can use kits (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/999247). Something that doesn’t even make sense, imho, since it is a forced penalty for something optional.
Anyway, i suppose people aren’t even bothering about them anymore.

Regarding Static Shield, instead, i have to digress. Imho, the tweak deprived him of a good part of its utility.
Before, when you blocked an enemy in melee range, the skill canceled and the enemy was stunned for 2s. By doing so, you had those 2s to act toward the enemy.
Now the skill doesn’t cancel, and the stun is reduced to 1s. But to do anything toward the enemy you still have to cancel it, thus removing the only advantage given by the tweak. In 1vs1 is a sure nerf.
But even assuming there are multiple enemies, you’re still unable to act while they’re stunned if you want to maintain the block. Basically, that stun is rendered for the most part useless and you’re just using a warrior’s shield stance with a lesser duration and 4/3 of the cooldown.

[/quote]Well, our weapon skills are weaker on purpose since we can use kits (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/999247). Something that doesn’t even make sense, imho, since it is a forced penalty for something optional.[/quote]

So, just a thought that may or may not have been brought up already. What if we had the choice of being able to weapon swap between pistol/x and rifle OR having kits. Give us, I don’t know, a Swiss Army knife type “weapon” that we could equip in the second weapon slot that would open up kits to be used in the utility bar. The penalty for equipping said SAK type weapon being a decrease in weapon skill damage for our other weapons (p/x, and rifle). If the kits aren’t equipped, and you’re able to equip both weapon sets, it would remove the penalty. I dunno. Just spitballing here.

@Digno
To be honest Engineer has been launched for too long without weapon swap – so much so that I honestly doubt a reversal in Arenanet’s stance. In addition, there are only 3 weapon choices – what choices are there to swap to? Keep in mind that if you have the same weapon in your off set, the cooldowns are shared for balance reasons.

@Manuhell
I find it laughable that Arenanet would say that the use of kits comes at the cost of main hand weapon skill damage. Engineer’s SD Rifle build has been 3-4 shotting people in PvP and WvW since it was popularised – so the damage isn’t lacking – the sustained pressure at close range is.

SD Made up for blowing all of our weapon skills on a single burst by adding that extra 4-5k (more with bounces) to be able to 1shot people when our burst was on cooldown. If Rifle is buffed in such a way as to give it that sustained pressure at close range, you would quickly see complaints rifle being bad disappear.

If you read my OP, you would have noted that at no point did I say that Engineer rifle lacked damage. And in fact, HAiMaiNelm’s video demonstrates that there is no shortage of burst coming from Engineer’s rifle. There is no lack of damage, but sustained damage once you get stuck in close range.

It is also of my opinion that P/X is still salvageable – given that the aftercast introduced after the nerfs to Pistol 1 – is removed. You will also note that most of my suggestions revolve around Quality of Life – making skills easier to land, and removing and/or minimising some excessively large punishments for being at the wrong range.

As for Shield 5’s nerfs in 1v1, I think it’s actually fine. The entire point of Shield 5 is to fulfil a similar role to Elementalist Shocking Aura – countering enemy setups for Melee burst, whilst setting up the opportunity for your own burst when opponents CC themselves on your shield.

It is also of note that nearly the entirety of Engineer’s burst potential is AOE. This buff to 1vX is less drastic than you think – although I wouldn’t have been averse to a reduction in CD given the loss in dueling potential.

As a final addition to my thoughts on Rifle lacking sustained pressure once close range is engaged, I have thought about turning Hip Shot into a skill chain:

Stage 1: Hip Shot:
Fire a shot from the hip. 0.75sec cast. 20% Projectile Finisher. Pierces targets. Same as before, nothing to see here.

Stage 2: Slug Shot
Fire a heavy slug out of the rifle. +10% damage at targets below 600 range. Inflicts 1 stack of Vulnerability. Inflicts 2 stacks of Vulnerability instead if target is below 600 range. 0.5 sec cast. 20% Projectile Finisher. Does not Pierce.

Stage 3: Canister round
Fire a buckshot filled canister round. +20% damage at targets below 200 range. 0.75 sec cast. Buckshot follows the Canister round to the target. Does not Pierce. Instead is a 20 degree cleave to a maximum of 3 targets in front of the Engineer. Canister round does reduced damage compared to Hip Shot with 1000 range, whilst buckshot only reaches 200 range to do the cleave. Inflicts 1 stack of Bleeding for 3 seconds if target is below 200 range.

Canister Round sounds like overloaded utility, but I believe that it is the keystone to making Rifle actually worth using over, say, Bombs, at close range.

Once again, the skill chain is intended to increase the Engineer’s damage output as range decreases. As a relatively slowly executing skill chain, its aim is to provide slow, steady pressure, whilst kiting and dodging can really punish your damage output as your chain will reset – so there is an element of danger to trying to auto opponents down.

If you read my OP, you would have noted that at no point did I say that Engineer rifle lacked damage. And in fact, HAiMaiNelm’s video demonstrates that there is no shortage of burst coming from Engineer’s rifle. There is no lack of damage, but sustained damage once you get stuck in close range.

Demonstrates nothing its WvW….damage is stupid.

Either PVE or SPVP is easier to judge from…specially SPVP.

Honestly, I dont think things are as bad as you say they are with weapons. No doubt some cast times, aftercasts, and dmg can all be adjusted better.

The big issue, in my book, is that kits add so much more utility and available skills that no one makes builds to support weapons.

On top of that, in the Firearms line, you have to pick up 3 traits just to increase range, decrease recharge, and add an effect (piercing:pistol, blind:rifle) that you loose a crap tone of utility.

If I were Anet, the first thing I would do to make kitless builds WORKABLE would be to clump pistol range, CD and piercing into a Master trait, and also rifle range, CD, and blinding. Then at least you would have some other traits that could focus on utility of the weapons themselves.

Just IMO, of course but Firearms is so bloated.

Also, plugging Crossbows combined with some Lightning Fields. Bring on the electric engineer!

MonMalthias.4763:

For the most part, this statement by the developers has largely proven to be true. Engineer as a class becomes progressively more dangerous to fight the closer it comes, and much of its damage – both Power and Condition damage based – scales inversely with distance to target.

So I had a thought with something like this. I don’t know where it could be used with pistols, but what about something like this with rifle. With it, Blunderbuss certainly follows that rule, about closer = more damage. But how about something to improve rifle in general by adding Torment to a skill? I mean, with that it’ll make not moving a bit more important to the target, which can be used to get closer.

Jump Shot: In addition to current setup, apply a stack of Torment [3 seconds] to target on landing.

Nightmare.8351:

Jump Shot: In addition to current setup, apply a stack of Torment [3 seconds] to target on landing.

I honestly think that Torment, being a DPS condition that scales with Condition damage and not power, is not the way to go. I’ll just quote Blood Red Arachnid from the Give Blowtorch Torment thread:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

So when I hear the suggestion to give engineers torment, the first question I ask is why. What problem does this solve? What does this attempt to balance? I know why necromancers, thieves, and even warriors in part were given torment: to provide additional condition damage not tied wholly to bleeding. Mesmers were given torment to buff the condition damage nature of the scepter, which had its direct damage removed. But engineers are already good on conditions.

If anything, torment on engineers would throw engineers off balance, since it gives players yet another unique condition they have to cleanse off alongside of poison, confusion, bleeding, burning, and vulnerability.

The thought that Engineers would require yet another DPS condi that only counters kiting is simply not the way to go. Yes, it would force enemy players to think twice about trying to kite away, but one has to remember that Torment only does double DPS when player is moving – blinks and shadowsteps are not affected – and those are the biggest problems a Rifle or Bomb engineer faces when trying to pull off their DPS, not simple kiting. I’ve Blunderbussed air more than a few times because a Mesmer has kitten good reflexes.

petespri.6548:

Honestly, I dont think things are as bad as you say they are with weapons. No doubt some cast times, aftercasts, and dmg can all be adjusted better.

The big issue, in my book, is that kits add so much more utility and available skills that no one makes builds to support weapons.

On top of that, in the Firearms line, you have to pick up 3 traits just to increase range, decrease recharge, and add an effect (piercing:pistol, blind:rifle) that you loose a crap tone of utility.

If I were Anet, the first thing I would do to make kitless builds WORKABLE would be to clump pistol range, CD and piercing into a Master trait, and also rifle range, CD, and blinding. Then at least you would have some other traits that could focus on utility of the weapons themselves.

Just IMO, of course but Firearms is so bloated.

@petespri:
I think that whilst Traits are part of the problem, a little QoL can go a long way. As I have mentioned, some rewards are simply insufficient for the risk, whilst some casts and aftercasts are poor enough to be objectively inferior to switching over to a Kit and using cooldowns from that instead.

That being said, I’ll start going through the Traits for our Weapons.

If you look back through my posting history you will notice that I have said in the past that I believe that out of all the trait lines, Firearms is probably one of the best lines for the Engineer. One qualifying statement I would like to add to that is that it’s only the best if only because it suffers from the least amount of bugs, and actually has synergy within its own line – something that Engineer severely lacks.

Firearms
The Firearms Trait line increases Precision by 10 points per point spent, and Condition Damage by 10 points per point spent. So immediately the thought that comes to mind is crit-proc conditions, and you’ll see a lot of those traits pop up in various lines of the Engineer, most infamously Incendiary Powder

Firstly, the Minor Traits:
Out of all the trait lines, Firearms probably has one of the strongest Minors for the Engineer class, and they also synergise, which is practically unknown in the Engineer trait lines.

Sharpshooter
30% chance to cause Bleeding for 3 seconds on critical hits.

It’s a solid enough trait. Half of a Sigil of Earth , is how I look at it. For 5 points into Firearms, it’s a weapon and utility agnostic global chance to proc bleed. Great for hybrid builds when you take into account the Grandmaster Minor trait.

Target the Weak
10% increased critical-hit chance against foes with less than 50% health.

Target the Weak is unusual in that it’s one of the very few %DPS increasing traits that trigger upon foes reaching a certain %health. It’s also RNG based, which doesn’t help the Engineer’s image of relying upon the RNG for success. In terms of hard numbers, Target the Weak is essentially a boost of 210 Precision against foes with less than half health. As %Critical Chance for Engineer mainly involves condi application rather than massive Critical Damage spikes, it’s more focused towards hybrid builds.

Target the Maimed
Target the Maimed is unique in that it actually has synergy with the rest of the Minor traits in the same tree. Sharpshooter procs bleed, which then gives a flat 5% boost to damage against a target. I would say that 5% is probably pretty weak given that the exact same mechanic is present in the Warrior with Attack of Opportunity – that boost is 10% instead of just 5. It’s a minor trait and it’s there. As for whether getting to GM with Firearms is worth it, I’ll continue in other posts.

Anyway, onto the Major Traits associated with the Engineer’s Weapon skills. I will exclude all Weapon Skill agnostic Traits such as Sitting Duck and the like but I may come back to them later.

I will preface this by first mentioning that I feel that the Firearms have a lot of bloat, and often the utility offered by Weapon Skill traits is superfluous.
It’s yet another reason why Main Hand weapons are often passed over.

Rifled Barrels
Improves rifle, pistol, harpoon gun, and elixir gun range.
This trait improves Engineer’s main hand weapons almost globally by giving them approximately 1/6 more range, although the increases sometimes differ from skill to skill. Overall it’s a relatively simple change, but the truth is that most Engineers simply don’t take it.
Why is this? The truth of the matter is that the Engineer already has an option for Long Range – Grenade Kit. And it is far superior in every way to Weapon skills – in condition application, in range (1500!), and in sustained damage (0.4*3 with trait just on the 1 skill).
Not only that, but it becomes progressively easier to land Grenades as range decreases, so your potential for damage goes up. GK supplants every single possible ranged choice Engineer could bring and does it better, which is why GK is so dominant in all modes of play.
As I see it, Rifled Barrels has no conceivable application. It sounds nice on paper to have a 1200 range Net Shot until you discover that it doesn’t track and it is actually impossible to combo your Immobilise into anything else – because all of Rifle’s other skills are short ranged.
Rifled Barrels did see use in the Beta with Coated Bullets , but that was before Pistol 1 was nerfed into the ground.

Hair Trigger
Rifle, pistol, and harpoon gun skills recharge 20% faster.
Hair Trigger offers decent enough utility for an Adept Trait – as GW2 is a game with no mana or energy, lower cooldowns is always good.
You will find this trait in almost every Rifle-centric or Pistol/Pistol build. It’s solid enough for its tier, but rather unimaginative. (It seems to be like this for a lot of GW2’s traits across classes. Especially Warrior.

Coated Bullets
Pistol shots pierce.
This trait used to be Grandmaster, and for good reason. Despite it only affecting Pistol 1 (Explosive shot) and Pistol 2 (Poison dart volley), Pistol 1 at the time before its nerfs applied Bleed essentially twice with this trait slotted – once for the piercing, and another time for the “explosion”. It also redeemed the utter uselessness of Poison dart volley, because at least if you missed, you could hit the 10 other dudes behind your primary target.
Then Pistol 1 was nerfed, and Coated Bullets lost its patina. The June 25 patch made it Master in deference to Pistol 1’s current status, but has done nothing to bring Coated Bullets back into meta.

Rifle Mod
Improves damage for the rifle and harpoon gun by 10%.
It seems that %damage bonus traits are always in Master tier, and this trait is no exception. Again, it finds use in nearly every single Rifle centric mod, is unimaginative, and I feel that the presence of the trait is a crutch that is holding Rifle back from producing decent numbers from its auto-attack.

Go for the Eyes
Critical hits with the rifle have a 50% chance to inflict blindness for 5 seconds. This effect cannot trigger more than once every 10 seconds.
This trait has essentially remained unchanged since Beta. It offers niche utility – fantastic! – at the cost of being a thrice-kitten ed crit-proc – awful! Engineer seems to be a particularly horrid offender when it comes to crit-procs and this is no exception. With the buffs to Blind, Go for the Eyes has been indirectly buffed. But the trait bloat of Firearms often squeezes this trait out – other traits are simply mathematically superior, and more reliable to boot.

Modified Ammunition
Damage is increased by 2% per condition on the target, when wielding a rifle or pistol .
A new Grandmaster Major trait introduced with the June 25 patch, this trait replaced the fall of Juggernaut into Master tier. It is essentially a re-hash of the Necromancer’s Target the Weak , except it takes a Major slot and is much, much more limited in scope.
Other similar traits in the same vein include Exposed Weakness and Radiant Power . Again, these are Grandmaster Minor traits and have a much broader scope. Modified Ammunition sounds like a good trait until you realise you could have Rifled Barrels, Rifle Mod, and Hair Trigger – and you would deal more damage, more often, more reliably. All in all a poorly thought out rehash.

Reinforced Shield
Gain 90 toughness while holding a shield and shield skills recharge 20% faster.
This is your standard re-hash of Shield traits from other classes, boosting Toughness and recharge. For Shield and its long cooldowns, this trait does find some use. However it largely only matters in Bunker builds where the shorter CD is essential. Otherwise, the untraited Shield skills are actually strong enough on their own.

petespri.6548:

dunnberry.2964:

Solution-give engis hammers

I want Crossbows.

But first, Whips.

Anyway, back onto the Traits for Engineer Weapon Skills.

Sharpshooter
As I mentioned before, it’s basically half of a Sigil of Earth. 30% Chance to proc Bleeding on critical hits fits in with the Firearms line being about critical-hit proc conditions, but I feel that if there’s one thing that GW2 is particularly heinous about, it’s passive, visually unscoutable, RNG based procs.

That’s just my opinion though. As it stands, I have little beef with the trait. But I feel that if possible, Engineer as a class must move away from RNG. It’s doesn’t add depth to the class, RNG really shouldn’t be a thing in PvP, and it’s just there to add ~50 DPS to Power Rifle or ~90+ DPS to Condition builds.

I would rather that the trait instead did the following:
Sharpshooter
Inflict 1 second of Bleeding on foes at less than 600 range.
I feel that in this way, Engineers are a lot more consistent. It would encourage Condition builds to get in close rather than spamming Grenades onto a point in PvP. It would be a Global Buff to Flamethrower because you now have Bleed to cover Burning, with bonus DPS. And it would add consistent pressure that the Rifle needs. Not much, but every little bit counts.

Rifled Barrels
I feel that for an Adept Trait, Rifled Barrels offers decent utility for P/P – and nothing else. There’s no synergy for getting in close with Rifle and a longer range auto-attack on either Pistol or Rifle is really suboptimal in nearly all cases. A QoL pass of Pistol 1 and 2 might make it passable, but what I’d really like is for a trait that actually rewards Engineer for getting into mid-range.

New Trait:
Modified Choke
Gain 5% extra damage and 10% Bleed Duration against targets within 600 range with Pistol, Rifle and Elixir Gun.
This is a slightly modified take on the Stone Splinters trait of the Elementalist. With both bonus damage and Bleed Duration, the original function of improving Pistol, Rifle and Elixir Gun is retained as all 3 weapons can cause Bleeding with either the Auto-attack, or proccing the Adept Minor Sharpshooter trait.

Hair Trigger
Engineer is relatively unique among classes in that they actually have 2 “Cooldown Reduction (CDR) Traits”;http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Recharge in the Adept tier – Fireforged Trigger also shares a Tier and similar utility.
Other CDR Traits associated with Weapon skills are also associated with extra damage, or extra utility as in Mesmer’s Focus CDR Trait also reflecting Projectiles. As a result, the majority of CDR Traits for Weapons are concentrated into the Master Tier.
The problem here is that by separating the CDR and Damage components of of Pistol or Rifle for Engineer, there exists the problem of bloat. 2 Major Trait slots (Even if both are Adept tier) are required where the pure efficiency of a single combined trait in the Master tier would be superior.

I feel that combining Hair Trigger and Rifle Mod would be a substantial buff to Engineer’s Weapon skills.
Hair Trigger
Now Master Tier. Merged with Rifle Mod. Rifle and Pistol Skills recharge 20% faster. Rifle skills deal 10% more damage. Gain 100 Condition Damage while wielding a Pistol.

Coated Bullets
I think that with the Pistol 1’s Bleed duration and damage nerf (And addition of aftercast, can’t forget that), Coated Bullets has become significantly less attractive. Moving it down to Master Tier was a good move with the June 25th patch.

That being said, Coated Bullets needs to do more than affect just 2/5 weapon skills. Even if a QoL pass was done for Pistol 1 (Explosive Shot) that removed or tempered the aftercast, Pistol 1 would still be less than ideal as an auto-attack.
So why not have Coated Bullets affect other Pistol Skills as well?

Coated Bullets
Pistol shots pierce. Blowtorch has an increased arc of fire. Glue Shot travels faster.

This change would make Coated Bullets worth taking besides the niche utility of being able to cause AOE Bleed and Poison. I myself think that AOE Condition application is a little out of control at the moment and whilst this change will likely bring Coated Bullets back into popularity and worsen the situation, I feel that as long as Pistol’s Condition application and duration stays the way it is , Pistol 1, 2 and 5 will be fine, even if given a QoL pass. A single stack of Bleed for 2 seconds is hardly groundbreaking.

Rifle Mod
As I mentioned earlier, I feel that Rifle Mod is best merged with Hair Trigger and left in the Master Tier. There is little point creating trait bloat on a class that already has clunky weapon skills.

Go for the Eyes
As I mentioned earlier, trait bloat often leads to Go for the Eyes not being taken. If Hair Trigger and Rifle Mod were merged, we may yet see its use. That being said, I dislike random crit-procs and I hope that the RNG situation for Engineer will be slowly changed over time to be more conditionally consistent. What I feel would be viable and useful would instead be:

Go for the Eyes
Blunderbuss, Overcharged Shot and Jump Shot apply Blind for 5 seconds.
I feel that this change would take away some of the RNG of the Engineer. At the same time, it emphasises the utility side of the Rifle for the Engineer. Being situated in the Master Tier, this would also force a sacrifice between damage and CDR and active defense for Rifle Engineers – as traits should be doing in the first place. It would also give Rifle Engineers some close range active defense – something that Pistol Shield users take for granted, but which should also exist as an option for Rifle.

Modified Ammunition
I mentioned before that Modified Ammunition was a poorly thought out rehash. As useful as it is in one-shot Static Discharge based builds running Sitting Duck, it doesn’t do anything build defining. GM Major Traits should define a build, not be yet another DPS increase.

I feel that Modified Ammunition should replace Target the Maimed as the GM Minor 25 point trait. This would bring it in line with Necromancer’s Target the Weak as a 25 point Minor. There is no place for a flat DPS trait in the GM Major Slot. It is lazy, does not define a build, and does not increase class depth for the 30 point investment.

New Trait:
Custom Hand Loads
Overcharge your Rifle’s performance. Alters functionality of skills 1-5.

Hip Shot is now a 600 range, 30 degree radius, 3 target cleave. Deals bonus 5% damage against targets at less than 200 range. No longer pierces.
Net Shot gains Chain skill:
Reel it In
Cast time 0.75 sec, Range 1000. Cooldown 20 seconds
Pull yourself closer to your Immobilised target. Inflict 5 stacks of Vulnerability for 3 seconds. Combo Finisher: Leap.
Blunderbuss now does full damage out to 400 range
Overcharged Shot has bonus 150 range.
Jump Shot has bonus 150 range and inflicts Cripple on landing.

These changes would accentuate the close-in, mid-range fighting that the Engineer is supposed to excel at. Altering Rifle 1 would also give Engineers an alternative to Bombs, whilst not replacing them as a useful auto-attack with a different application. Rifle 1 would become monstrous at close range and becomes the “melee” alternative for Engineer.

Pixelpumpkin.4608:

petespri.6548:

dunnberry.2964:

Solution-give engis hammers

I want Crossbows.

But first, Whips.

Chainsaw kit.

@Wolf, Pixelpumpkin, petespri:
I think you should probably make your own threads. I mean, I get that the title kind of implies that “new” weapons and kits should be part of the discussion, but come on.

At least contribute something that isn’t completely tangential. Thoughts? Comments? My suggestions are bad and I should feel bad? Give me something here instead of chainsaws.

Wolf.5816:

Pixelpumpkin.4608:

petespri.6548:

dunnberry.2964:

Solution-give engis hammers

I want Crossbows.

But first, Whips.

Chainsaw kit.

Chainsaw whips

@Penguin:
Touche, sir. Touche.

Very deeply thought-through suggestions. Im not sure how many of it would work out, even more so considering how buggy a simple number balance fix can make things around us poor engineers.

Im fully behind this though. After leveling and spending a good 4 months as a grenadier, i got tired of never even seeing my main weapons (and i also began to hate the hobo-sacks of the kits), so i was (or still am) trying to experiment with no kit builds.

I never found the will to use rifle after trying it on several occasions. It never lasted more than an hour before switching everything back to P/P or P/S. On pistol i use coated bullets of course. Never knew how powerful it was back in the days, i was just happy with it the first time an explosive shot went through 5 orrians stacked up together with glue shot.

Mostly regarding the #1 and #2 of pistol, i was thinking of just making them work as they are supposed to from the description.

Explosive Shot should count as an explosion, gaining benefits from the Explosives Traits that generally enhance explosions. It should also inflict bleed on the area of the explosion, not just the target itself, as it is stated in the tooltip.

Poison Dart Volley as you said is sort of redeemed with coated bullets, though only in group fights. I would still like to see it being focused on the target like unload though.

I completely agree about modified ammunition. It doesnt deserve the GM trait rank as Coated Bullets did (or would, if it worked with a better explosive shot)

@lakdav:
Thanks for the compliments!
As for Explosive Shot counting as an Explosion, I’m a little hesitant. Pistol’s kit is already the best condition spreading weapon in the game – having Steel Packed Powder proccing Vulnerability would give it yet another cover and support condition that could take up more cleansing capability of all classes.

Making Pistol 1 work with the Explosives traits would also make it run into the issue of proccing Shrapnel – and as much as I’d like Pistol 1 to be able to stack Bleed more capably, I think that Engineer as a class is already too dependant on passive RNG procs already. Removing the Aftercast of Pistol 1 will already be a substantial buff – 0.8sec / cast → 0.5sec / cast is a 37.5% buff to Pistol 1’s Power and Condition damage capability – and will allow Engineers just using Pistol 1 to take peak Bleeds stacked up to 4 before Condition Duration.

In a Condition build that also runs Incendiary Powder assuming that Pistol 1 worked with Explosives traits – that would allow Engineer to proc Burning and Bleeding, with Vulnerability to cover. That’s quite excessive considering only the auto-attack and not just a further 3-4 more conditions from the other Pistol skills.

Now that being said, it would be a little better if Pistol 1 had a little higher direct damage component (not in the explosion). Along with an Aftercast buff, slightly more direct damage may yet redeem it by making Pistol 1 at least somewhat of a minor threat as a hybrid weapon.

Im just going with what makes sense here, i dont run numbers as heavily as you do. I would think that Explosive shot deals damage from the power of its explosion and inflicts bleeding from the shrapnel propelled by this explosion. Guessing this just from the name and the function. So, for all intends and purposes, explosive shot not counting as an explosion makes little sense to me.

And delving a bit deeper into the number parts too. I would think a grandmaster minor trait enhancing an auto-attack with a single stack of the weakest condition would be fair enough. Even more so considering that it does enhance the Grenade Kit #1 (and all the other 5) skill, dishing out 2 or 3 vulnerability in a single throw. Also the Firearms Adept major trait Precise Sights already can give vulnerability with a 50% chance on criticals, but thats going back to the RNG.

The traits that would effect Explosive shot of it would count as an explosion:

Shrapnel(Adept): Makes sense by the name to me. Also could be an alternative choice to Incendiary Powder. More bleed with RNG but no cooldown or critical req, or the stable burn on criticals with cooldown?

Explosive Powder(Master): stable 10% damage increase to the Power/pure damage aspect of the skill. Other professions get so much more straightfoward +% traits to specific weapons. Just look at them. The entire weapon set, not just one skill out of the five.

Steel Packed Powder(Grandmaster, minor): Already spoken about. Given its place in the trait tree, the duration of the vulnerability, the alternatives to get vulnerability in any case, and how shamelessly it buffs grenades to high heavens in the first place, Pistol#1 having access to this traits effect would not be that much of a balance issue.

Finally a stable source vulnerability would make Modified ammunition get ever slightly more goodness our way without having to trait into Sitting Duck.