Jade Quarry
Scrapper Design Decisions and Intentions
Jade Quarry
Bump. Honestly I haven’t even heard a thing. In fact, I hardly remember any threads that have ever gotten an anet reply indicator. Hobosacs… Maybe 3-4 other threads. Ever. In the past several years. Am I looking in the wrong place?
Cubones Mother – 80 mes
Jade Quarry [Uhhh]
It has not been that long, and I imagine Irenio is busy with Druid stuff.
I would hold out ’til the end of the week before I worry too much.
Bump. Honestly I haven’t even heard a thing. In fact, I hardly remember any threads that have ever gotten an anet reply indicator. Hobosacs… Maybe 3-4 other threads. Ever. In the past several years. Am I looking in the wrong place?
It’s not unusual to see minimal-to-zero dev interaction in profession sub forums. However with HoT prep the devs have been doing a fantastic job interacting with each forum as the elite specs have come out, and not just simple yes or no type stuff they’ve given some real insight to the design process as I gave an example of above. I expect nothing less from Irenio.
My only hope is that it starts for us this week, I think waiting until after BWE3 to have meaningful discussion with the developers is a bad idea. Every elite spec thread I’ve had time to read across all professions has included significant changes, and multiple iterations through each BWE. We’re talking a lot more than just number tweaks here and there, there has been significant functionality iterations.
I don’t see a reason why Scrapper would not need the same amount of work and iterations on it, and rather than complaining about only having one BWE I would rather spend that time having open discussion with Irenio and improving the Scrapper before we get our hands on it. Stuff like overall design decisions and intentions that we can know for sure from what little we’ve seen, not stuff like DPS on the hammer.
Jade Quarry
… Cut for brevity
It’s not unusual to see minimal-to-zero dev interaction in profession sub forums. However with HoT prep the devs have been doing a fantastic job interacting with each forum as the elite specs have come out, and not just simple yes or no type stuff they’ve given some real insight to the design process as I gave an example of above. I expect nothing less from Irenio.
My only hope is that it starts for us this week, I think waiting until after BWE3 to have meaningful discussion with the developers is a bad idea. Every elite spec thread I’ve had time to read across all professions has included significant changes, and multiple iterations through each BWE. We’re talking a lot more than just number tweaks here and there, there has been significant functionality iterations.
I don’t see a reason why Scrapper would not need the same amount of work and iterations on it, and rather than complaining about only having one BWE I would rather spend that time having open discussion with Irenio and improving the Scrapper before we get our hands on it. Stuff like overall design decisions and intentions that we can know for sure from what little we’ve seen, not stuff like DPS on the hammer.
That’s true, although there has yet to be a single thread on Scrapper I could find, even in the dev notes forum. Do other progressions also get shared by devs? I feel like rangers and engis are some of the rarest professions currently in high-level play, they’re the last two being revealed for HoT, and both have the same primary dev?! How in the world is he supposed to do both? Unless, again, I’m missing something and all the other profession’s devs are also in charge of multiple professions. I guess I’m saying it feels to me like Ireneo is being placed in an exdraordinarily difficult job being in charge of two professions, and worse, the two professions that were scheduled the most aggressively with respect to HoT release. My spirits are further dampened by the fact that they may be the two professions needing the most work currently (I say maybe because I think necro is probably more deserving of “needs second most work, after ranger”).
Edit: I formally retract my dubious-ness, per lorddarkflare’s educational reply. Although that stands more to strengthen the point of this thread: feedbax naow! I’m sure druid reveal is stealing a time, but… we’re important too?
Cubones Mother – 80 mes
Jade Quarry [Uhhh]
(edited by Goosekilla.2796)
Pretty much all the other profession devs handle multiple classes.
Robert Gee is handling Chronomancer, Reaper, Berserker. I think Daredevil, Dragonhunter and Tempest have Karl.
id to see him around of course but history has shown the devs dont come out of their hidey holes till after the profession gets played by errybuddy a bit :/
head here to discuss wvw without fear of infractions
Pretty much all the other profession devs handle multiple classes.
Robert Gee is handling Chronomancer, Reaper, Berserker. I think Daredevil, Dragonhunter and Tempest have Karl.
This seems like poor resource management to me, like he should have been on 1 early profession and 1 late. At least say with Robert Gee his professions were all early and could go through a comprehensive testing process. I agree with the OP a dialogue has to start now.
Miranda Zero – Ele / Twitch Zero – Mes / Chargrin Soulboom – Engi
Aliera Zero – Guardian / Reaver Zero – Necro
Pretty much all the other profession devs handle multiple classes.
Robert Gee is handling Chronomancer, Reaper, Berserker. I think Daredevil, Dragonhunter and Tempest have Karl.
This seems like poor resource management to me, like he should have been on 1 early profession and 1 late. At least say with Robert Gee his professions were all early and could go through a comprehensive testing process. I agree with the OP a dialogue has to start now.
I think you have that backward. The completion of the classes seems to drive the reveals, not the other way around.
Pretty much all the other profession devs handle multiple classes.
Robert Gee is handling Chronomancer, Reaper, Berserker. I think Daredevil, Dragonhunter and Tempest have Karl.
This seems like poor resource management to me, like he should have been on 1 early profession and 1 late. At least say with Robert Gee his professions were all early and could go through a comprehensive testing process. I agree with the OP a dialogue has to start now.
I think you have that backward. The completion of the classes seems to drive the reveals, not the other way around.
OK but still an issue given the changes completed classes have gone through due to the BWEs. Scrapper and Druid are more likely to be bug ridden at HOT launch than other classes.
Miranda Zero – Ele / Twitch Zero – Mes / Chargrin Soulboom – Engi
Aliera Zero – Guardian / Reaver Zero – Necro
It would be great, if devs would talk with us, maybe some of us (including me) would better understand some decisions they made, and maybe some devs would use some usefull proposals from the community.
[Skol]
Pretty much all the other profession devs handle multiple classes.
Robert Gee is handling Chronomancer, Reaper, Berserker. I think Daredevil, Dragonhunter and Tempest have Karl.
This seems like poor resource management to me, like he should have been on 1 early profession and 1 late. At least say with Robert Gee his professions were all early and could go through a comprehensive testing process. I agree with the OP a dialogue has to start now.
I think you have that backward. The completion of the classes seems to drive the reveals, not the other way around.
OK but still an issue given the changes completed classes have gone through due to the BWEs. Scrapper and Druid are more likely to be bug ridden at HOT launch than other classes.
Yes indeed and since most people were expecting ranger to have the greatest mechanic overhaul, you’d think it would have the most testing time. Necro, ranger and Engineer, the three classes which need help the most by a wide margin and only necro got to the plate early to allow for tuning.
We’re almost at launch and Irenio couldn’t even show us the Function Gyro. Possibly the games weakest, least useful, most disappointing Elite base mechanic and it’s not even ina good enough state to show? If someone would at least come on and reassure us as to why any of this makes sense or why the Function wasn’t shown, that’d go a million miles to helping difuse the anger and disappointment on the forums.
Heck, just a quick note to let us know that they’re working on our worst, most useless traits in the core class and elite. Traits like Decisive Renown and Medical Dispersion Field. That’d be such a boost to morale.
It would be great, if devs would talk with us, maybe some of us (including me) would better understand some decisions they made, and maybe some devs would use some usefull proposals from the community.
The thing is, the devs don’t need to post in these threads to get feedback. There are dozens of threads with hundreds of ideas already up here based on the live stream preview. Anyone with a browser can read the posts here and try to find a few good ideas amidst the mountain of ill conceived ones.
You may want to know more about the design decisions that lead up to the current iteration of the scrapper, but providing a history lesson isn’t going to do anything to improve the class.
I’m sure as close as we are to release at this point that time is at a premium, and I’d prefer that Irenio was frantically implementing the few good ideas he sees here rather than posting a dramatic monologue for everyone to pick apart.
It would be great, if devs would talk with us, maybe some of us (including me) would better understand some decisions they made, and maybe some devs would use some usefull proposals from the community.
The thing is, the devs don’t need to post in these threads to get feedback. There are dozens of threads with hundreds of ideas already up here based on the live stream preview. Anyone with a browser can read the posts here and try to find a few good ideas amidst the mountain of ill conceived ones.
You may want to know more about the design decisions that lead up to the current iteration of the scrapper, but providing a history lesson isn’t going to do anything to improve the class.
I’m sure as close as we are to release at this point that time is at a premium, and I’d prefer that Irenio was frantically implementing the few good ideas he sees here rather than posting a dramatic monologue for everyone to pick apart.
I agree with you (“dramatic monologue” notwithstanding), but one thing I would really like to see is “hey guys we know you’re not so happy with A, we’re open to making X changes but we don’t really want to do Y type changes”.
This allows us to give him more valuable feedback about X, and stop wasting time and filling up the forums with Y changes.
Jade Quarry
I would really like to see is “hey guys we know you’re not so happy with A, we’re open to making X changes but we don’t really want to do Y type changes”.
This allows us to give him more valuable feedback about X, and stop wasting time and filling up the forums with Y changes.
I think everyone involved is aware that the first impressions of gyros hasn’t been very good.
I don’t think they’re focused on the core specs at this point, so I wouldn’t expect any news there. Do you want someone to come confirm that they acknowledge the complaints about gyros before anyone has had a chance to play with them?
Based on the other dev posts, it sounds like the BWE3 build is already locked, so they may as well wait for people to post informed feedback rather than responding to kneejerk reactions.
At least regarding medic gyro, there’s an aweful lot of math supporting the knee-jerk reactions. Kind of hard to imagine how that was thought to be something workable. I agree that it’ll be good to test everything, but if a move is so terrible that no one will slot it for more than 30 minutes of BWE3, then I think they’re not going to get very detailed feedback out of that.
Cubones Mother – 80 mes
Jade Quarry [Uhhh]