Guild Wars 2

Don’t get me wrong, being a turret engineer I’m VERY happy that my babies are being improved, but I’ve been doing a lot more tPvP on my engi and I’m capable of completely shutting down a point from anything less than 3 people charging it because of my turrets…

So, why are they buffing them? Thoughts?

PS: I know turrets are immobile (they should be), but I never thought they were weak… Yet my friend told me in State of the Game they were going to be buffed…

Because they are not as worth as other utilities both in duration and toolbelt-related skill (except for rifle turret’s… which is so just because of its short CD and the fact it’s a workaround for the bugged targeting of static discharge), they’ll only be truly useful during their Overcharge.

Their AI is like the worst, they target invincible/dead objects now… that’s not very cool.

They are almost useless in 2+v1 fights for many, MANY reasons, which you probably realized by yourself already.

Also… they have REALLY long cooldowns and considering they are immobile they aren’t much of use in any PvE fight except if you find a good spot with “deployable turrets”.

Ah, yeah I really on PvP with my engi so my overcharges are always up when I need them, didn’t think about PvE at all…

I do agree the Toolbelts need some love though, but I didn’t think those were getting any love.

I don’t know that either, I do hope though… I was merely presuming the reason they are buffing, not that there’s much to presume, they need a serious buff, except for healing turret I think that one’s fine.

Rfreak.6591:

I don’t know that either, I do hope though… I was merely presuming the reason they are buffing, not that there’s much to presume, they need a serious buff, except for healing turret I think that one’s fine.

60 seconds cooldown on a single condition removal, that doesn’t even start the second you press the button… is not fine in my book.

Lower the overcharge cooldown, make it instant as well, and perhaps let it cleanse on an interval instead of just once.

I’m afraid they all need work, even the healing turret, which indeed seems like the best of them at the moment.

Everything about the Engineer in PVE needs to get buffed. PVE is a very large majority of the game, why are people so narrow minded (including devs) with spvp?

@wuffles, as I said i don’t play PvE on my engi, I assumed turrets worked well there since they work well in sPvP I guess they don’t though.

Durzlla.6295:

I’m capable of completely shutting down a point from anything less than 3 people charging it because of my turrets…

So what kind of superpowers are your turrets giving you? I feel like I’ve been ripped off, then. My rifle and rocket turrets aren’t forcing anyone to fight off points through their damage, my flame turret does redundant burning, and my thumper turret is easily ignored. Admittedly, my net turret is a monster for ensuring kills.

Durzlla.6295:

So, why are they buffing them? Thoughts?

1. Because fortunately Anet doesn’t suffer from delusions of grandeur regarding your own turret abilities, haha.

2. They are in no way, shape, or form better than elixirs or even kits in any teamfight, skirmish, or any imaginable scenario besides hiding behind a rock while your turrets plink.

3. Other than deployable turrets, the other 4 turret traits are completely useless.

They’re hardly completely useless and I don’t “force them off the point” I kill them and throw their body(s) off my point, I’m not a bunker by any means, I run with rabid gear and take advantage of turrets getting my condi damage.

Keep in mind I just plant myself down on a point, the only 2 turrets that are in the point circle are Rifle (that things expendable and useful for launching people of the point/ interrupting) and flame due to the short range, rocket stays a good distance away so it has 100% up time unless someone rushes it which has yet to happen.

Healing turret is used more for the burst heal + launch + water blast combo instead of the regen…

Idk how you think they’re worse than elixirs, if you’re moving around a lot sure, no argument, but if I’m planting my feet there’s no way they’re getting that point with anything less than 2 people (bunker/CC + Glass Canon can bone me if they play their cards right).

That being said I’d love my CDs to be reduced so I can actually be more mobile, but I doubt that’s happening…

PS: rifle and rocket turrets are made of paper and toothpicks, so unless you want to use them for the explosion/launch you shouldn’t put them close to the fray, they have 1.2k range after all.

As a fellow turret engineer, who used pretty much exclusively turrets from levels 5-80: Turrets need the improvements. At least in PvE, they fall flat compared to kits, and the only thing they have over Elixirs in a support capacity is that they’re A ) going to do the same thing all the time and B ) can cause direct damage.

Perhaps things are different in PvP, but I wouldn’t know. I do know that part of the reason I dislike kits is because they make things too easy compared to my turrets, especially from 80 on, due to a lack of scaling which is only recently being adjusted.

The two best traits for Turret-users (at least in my opinion) shouldn’t be ‘they blow up when they die’ and ‘you can throw them.’ The best use (again, in my opinion) of the Healing and Rifle turrets should definitely not be ‘fancy-looking grenade/landmine with secondary effects if you leave it laying around.’

You can pretend they’re perfectly fine as they are, and maybe they’re even alright in PvP, but for PvE engineers, they’re…bad. And this is coming from somebody who, on the rare occasion they play, still uses a full turret loadout.

I may try turrets in PvE just to see how they are because now I’m curious… I personally don’t take the turret placement trait, I buff up my pistol instead because I figured I shouldn’t rely 100% on my turrets since they’re certainly not going to last forever.

Chaith.8256:

Durzlla.6295:

I’m capable of completely shutting down a point from anything less than 3 people charging it because of my turrets…

So what kind of superpowers are your turrets giving you? I feel like I’ve been ripped off, then. My rifle and rocket turrets aren’t forcing anyone to fight off points through their damage, my flame turret does redundant burning, and my thumper turret is easily ignored. Admittedly, my net turret is a monster for ensuring kills.

Durzlla.6295:

So, why are they buffing them? Thoughts?

1. Because fortunately Anet doesn’t suffer from delusions of grandeur regarding your own turret abilities, haha.

2. They are in no way, shape, or form better than elixirs or even kits in any teamfight, skirmish, or any imaginable scenario besides hiding behind a rock while your turrets plink.

3. Other than deployable turrets, the other 4 turret traits are completely useless.

sorry..hold on. You think deployable turrets is the only good trait?

30% reduced damage to turrets is bad? No, one of their biggest beefs is survivability. this is a good trait.

Self regening is bad? No, not every build with turrets has the toolkit and they dont heal themselves…this allows me to not have to take em off cd to destroy them and replace them…could it be a bit better at healing? sure, but its not worthless.

long range and damage is bad? No, longer range and damage are always good, this is true in every turret.

Ability to do a 1200 damage ae nuke that pushes back is bad? No, while its not the best trait as it only benefits from a turret dieng, its not the worst either. Just means everytime i drop and detonate my healing turret i get a free ae/nuke/knockback…basicly i get a weaker throw mine for free, or in use with supply crate, you just added 3-4 ae nuke/knockbacks to this elite. Its not the most widely used trait, but its not useless if this is important to you.

Drop a turret in a short range infront of you instead of having to jump/walk over to where you want to put it is bad? No…but its also probably the lamest.

In what situation does this help you? This trait is rarer when it helps you vs when it doesnt help you. In most scenerios there is’nt an area to put the turret you couldnt have just reached by running over to or jumping up to. And the only turrets you dont want near the fight are rifle/rocket…meaning most turrets dont benefit at all from this trait. If anything its the lamest trait for turrets as it doesnt help them function better and is slimmest in its usefullness….even less useful than blowing them up for ae nuke/knockback.

Chaith.8256:

3. Other than deployable turrets, the other 4 turret traits are completely useless.

Durzlla.6295:

They’re hardly completely useless.

Guy, you are defending the use of traits that heal 10% hp every 10 seconds to turrets, and 30% damage reduction to turrets? In the same breath that you refer to them as expendable knockback sources (yes, you’re more correct in that assumption.)

On one side of the coin, there is no point to investing your character into saving your flame and rifle turrets that you place on point from shatters, churning earth, whirlwind, etc. Accept they will die unless it’s a rifle/rocket turret at range via deployable turrets. These traits just aren’t balanced properly, and they sorely need a rework.

On the other side of the coin, when thumper/rifle/flame/net turrets are used as knockback fodder, I just have to ask you… do you enjoy not having any kits/abilities to use during combat and generally doing 50% of your damage potential after your turrets pass away? Was the knockback worth it?

Durzlla.6295:

And I don’t “force them off the point” I kill them and throw their body(s) off my point, I’m not a bunker by any means, I run with rabid gear and take advantage of turrets getting my condi damage.

Okay, here is the actual build you want. It will make you kill enemies in teamfights and skirmishes much faster, give you 12 condition removals per minute, with 6 on demand, has no ‘downtime’ and is completely mobile.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQJAqalspSXnvSiF17ICoC5loHPGlNZfewWpFEC;ToAAzCqo+y8l4L7XuvkfN8YuA

While I have total faith that Engineers have the tools to make turrets ‘viable’ in extreme niche scenarios where as a non-bunker you won’t have to… roam. But the cold, hard, facts are that there are apex predator Engi builds that exist, leaving turret builds being sometimes viable but NEVER optimal under any circumstances.

Turrets should be optimal for point control / niche point guarding scenarios, and they’re not optimal for anything. That’s the frustration I, and most Engineers who aren’t surprised turrets are in line for buffs feel.

Zinwrath.2049:

Chaith.8256:

Durzlla.6295:

I’m capable of completely shutting down a point from anything less than 3 people charging it because of my turrets…

So what kind of superpowers are your turrets giving you? I feel like I’ve been ripped off, then. My rifle and rocket turrets aren’t forcing anyone to fight off points through their damage, my flame turret does redundant burning, and my thumper turret is easily ignored. Admittedly, my net turret is a monster for ensuring kills.

Durzlla.6295:

So, why are they buffing them? Thoughts?

1. Because fortunately Anet doesn’t suffer from delusions of grandeur regarding your own turret abilities, haha.

2. They are in no way, shape, or form better than elixirs or even kits in any teamfight, skirmish, or any imaginable scenario besides hiding behind a rock while your turrets plink.

3. Other than deployable turrets, the other 4 turret traits are completely useless.

sorry..hold on. You think deployable turrets is the only good trait?

30% reduced damage to turrets is bad? No, one of their biggest beefs is survivability. this is a good trait.

Self regening is bad? No, not every build with turrets has the toolkit and they dont heal themselves…this allows me to not have to take em off cd to destroy them and replace them…could it be a bit better at healing? sure, but its not worthless.

long range and damage is bad? No, longer range and damage are always good, this is true in every turret.

Ability to do a 1200 damage ae nuke that pushes back is bad? No, while its not the best trait as it only benefits from a turret dieng, its not the worst either. Just means everytime i drop and detonate my healing turret i get a free ae/nuke/knockback…basicly i get a weaker throw mine for free, or in use with supply crate, you just added 3-4 ae nuke/knockbacks to this elite. Its not the most widely used trait, but its not useless if this is important to you.

Drop a turret in a short range infront of you instead of having to jump/walk over to where you want to put it is bad? No…but its also probably the lamest.

In what situation does this help you? This trait is rarer when it helps you vs when it doesnt help you. In most scenerios there is’nt an area to put the turret you couldnt have just reached by running over to or jumping up to. And the only turrets you dont want near the fight are rifle/rocket…meaning most turrets dont benefit at all from this trait. If anything its the lamest trait for turrets as it doesnt help them function better and is slimmest in its usefullness….even less useful than blowing them up for ae nuke/knockback.

Turrets are still horrible even when completely traited.

From not scaling with our own stats, to not being able to critically hit, to their horrendously long cooldowns; Turrets are just inferior when you stack them up against other choices.

Zinwrath.2049:

Drop a turret in a short range infront of you instead of having to jump/walk over to where you want to put it is bad? No…but its also probably the lamest.

In what situation does this help you? This trait is rarer when it helps you vs when it doesnt help you. In most scenerios there isn;t an area to put the turret you couldnt have just reached by running over to or jumping up to. And the only turrets you dont want near the fight are rifle/rocket…meaning most turrets dont benefit at all from this trait. If anything its the lamest trait for turrets as it doesnt help them function better and is slimmest in its usefullness….even less useful than blowing them up for ae nuke/knockback.

Let me explain my (tPvP) position.
I’ve came to the conclusion that the only way I can justify turrets in my builds if I overcome the survivability problem, and they have 100% uptime. I also need to have spare traits for defensive options and either improvements to my mainhand weapon or 1 kit.

Metal plating trait, and self repairing traits try to overcome the survivability problem but ultimately don’t come close to succeeding, yet they eat 20 trait points in an unimpressive trait line. The best way I’ve found to overcome the survivability & uptime problem is anchoring turrets to the wall, out of reach – turrets such as net turrets, rifle, and most importantly rocket. There are walls/structures everywhere, all you need is any vertical surface – don’t underestimate this trait. I can easily solve the survivability and uptime problems with 1 low investment trait, and still have room in the build to trait a grenade kit, or defensive options. I feel turrets should supplement builds, not define them – even so, when their damage isn’t there, you are quite sub-par.

Unfortunately, you are correct in pointing out that this strategy doesn’t apply to close range turrets such as thumper, or flame. I feel thumper and flame turrets aren’t justifiable in any build in their current state. I’d be happy if that was not the case, though. Many professions have more than a few sub-par utilities.

Chaith.8256:

Chaith.8256:

3. Other than deployable turrets, the other 4 turret traits are completely useless.

Durzlla.6295:

They’re hardly completely useless.

Guy, you are defending the use of traits that heal 10% hp every 10 seconds to turrets, and 30% damage reduction to turrets? In the same breath that you refer to them as expendable knockback sources (yes, you’re more correct in that assumption.)

On one side of the coin, there is no point to investing your character into saving your flame and rifle turrets that you place on point from shatters, churning earth, whirlwind, etc. Accept they will die unless it’s a rifle/rocket turret at range via deployable turrets. These traits just aren’t balanced properly, and they sorely need a rework.

On the other side of the coin, when thumper/rifle/flame/net turrets are used as knockback fodder, I just have to ask you… do you enjoy not having any kits/abilities to use during combat and generally doing 50% of your damage potential after your turrets pass away? Was the knockback worth it?

Durzlla.6295:

And I don’t “force them off the point” I kill them and throw their body(s) off my point, I’m not a bunker by any means, I run with rabid gear and take advantage of turrets getting my condi damage.

Okay, here is the actual build you want. It will make you kill enemies in teamfights and skirmishes much faster, give you 12 condition removals per minute, with 6 on demand, has no ‘downtime’ and is completely mobile.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQJAqalspSXnvSiF17ICoC5loHPGlNZfewWpFEC;ToAAzCqo+y8l4L7XuvkfN8YuA

While I have total faith that Engineers have the tools to make turrets ‘viable’ in extreme niche scenarios where as a non-bunker you won’t have to… roam. But the cold, hard, facts are that there are apex predator Engi builds that exist, leaving turret builds being sometimes viable but NEVER optimal under any circumstances.

Turrets should be optimal for point control / niche point guarding scenarios, and they’re not optimal for anything. That’s the frustration I, and most Engineers who aren’t surprised turrets are in line for buffs feel.

Oh look!! The build of the Engis that keep dying to my turrets!! Well thank god the “apex predator” build can’t take out the build using “broken utilities” .

You clearly don’t understand the whole KB turrets thing btw, you take it to PUNISH PEOPLE for killing your turrets, the only exception is the healing turret. I said the rifle turret is expendable for one main reason, it has a 20s CD, if I need an on demand interrupt I can blow up the rifle turret, am I going to do that often? Hell no, why would I trash one of my damage sources if I don’t need to?

An please tell me where I said “turret builds are amazing for team fights and that what I want from my build!” Oh look, I didn’t, that’s because I use them to secure an area, I fight 1v1s up to 3v3s (normally 1v1s or 2v1s).

Durzlla.6295:

Oh look!! The build of the Engis that keep dying to my turrets!! Well thank god the “apex predator” build can’t take out the build using “broken utilities”.

This is where I remind you that you are running a condition based, low hp, low/no condition removal build. And you’re saying that it out-duels a high condition removal build with higher condition output (might stacks, geomancy sigil, & shrapnel grenade) & effective health (30pts in alchemy). If you win any duel vs. an HGH condi-nade engi, it’s because the player skill gap. I think some non-circumstantial, controlled testing is in order.

Durzlla.6295:

An please tell me where I said “turret builds are amazing for team fights and that what I want from my build!” Oh look, I didn’t, that’s because I use them to secure an area, I fight 1v1s up to 3v3s (normally 1v1s or 2v1s).

So when a teamfight happens on that area that you secured, you go to the back and bury your head in the sand along with your turrets, and repeatedly tell yourself that ‘this is not happening.’ lol. We’ve already established that you can’t roam or disengage.

You don’t consider this an issue, but I’m just throwing this out there – there are builds that can perform in teamfights and have even better 1v1, 2v1, 1v2 capabilities. Try broadening your horizons. Mobility and roaming potential does matter, even if you dismiss it because ’it’s not the goal of the build.’

Chaith.8256:

Durzlla.6295:

Oh look!! The build of the Engis that keep dying to my turrets!! Well thank god the “apex predator” build can’t take out the build using “broken utilities”.

This is where I remind you that you are running a condition based, low hp, low/no condition removal build. And you’re saying that it out-duels a high condition removal build with higher condition output (might stacks, geomancy sigil, & shrapnel grenade) & effective health (30pts in alchemy). If you win any duel vs. an HGH condi-nade engi, it’s because the player skill gap. I think some non-circumstantial, controlled testing is in order.

Durzlla.6295:

An please tell me where I said “turret builds are amazing for team fights and that what I want from my build!” Oh look, I didn’t, that’s because I use them to secure an area, I fight 1v1s up to 3v3s (normally 1v1s or 2v1s).

So when a teamfight happens on that area that you secured, you go to the back and bury your head in the sand along with your turrets, and repeatedly tell yourself that ‘this is not happening.’ lol. We’ve already established that you can’t roam or disengage.

You don’t consider this an issue, but I’m just throwing this out there – there are builds that can perform in teamfights and have even better 1v1, 2v1, 1v2 capabilities. Try broadening your horizons. Mobility and roaming potential does matter, even if you dismiss it because ’it’s not the goal of the build.’

I’m not saying it doesn’t matter, that’s just not -my- role, and you have to keep in mind that engi condi builds have low duration condis to begin with, and then when you pair them with my melandru runes… well they just fall off before they can be a threat.

As for when team fights happen on my point i’m not completely useless, the rocket turrets overcharge is an AoE, i have a shield for providing more control of my point, and then the flame turret can give a smoke field which is very useful for team fights.

Not to mention that dropping a supply crate containing 4 turrets (net, flame, rifle,healing + 9 bandages) tends to be pretty devastatingly helpful so much so that it’s not uncommon for my team to just yell at me to run over to a 4v3 (we have 3) and drop my supply kit and run back to my point. However, that’s more supply crate being amazing because all the turrets in it get buffed and become 4 ticking time bombs for the most part…

PS: My entire team is built around avoiding team fights when possible, can we team fight? Yes, but we try to just split apart and grab different objectives when the team fights break out and then either me (if it’s on my point) or our bunker necro hang back and keep them as busy as possible as we take the other locations.

Guise stop arguing with Chaith, he is number 1 esports engineer.

Let me ask you guys a question? What have YOU done for the engineer community?

It’s all fun and games until a mesmer strangles you too death with your own spine while watching anime on his second screen and his clones is having awkward conversations with your turrets.

all the things you sacrifice for it like say, weapon sets, condition removals, stunbreaks and get out of jail free cards and those small things makes it not worth it. Of course you may run a hybrid, and rocket, net and sometimes even healing turret can be surprisingly decent. Sometimes. There is no denying that the 20 sec cooldown for two KD’s added with decent damage for a turret (as in it actually tickles) or a followup stun on an imobilized enemy that just got faceplanted from your rocket turret is nice. But this is only as long as the turrets decide to remain loyal too you. That guy would be nice to imobilize? Too bad your net turret wasted its long cooldown attack on him when he wasn’t even in line of sight. He is a ranger, elementalist with glyph of ele, necro with flesh golem, spirit weapon guardian(rare nowadays) or got rune of the ogre and as such a pet? Hah guess your turrets will take bets on who can prioritize the worst (and the difference between you and them is that they do not waste their weapon sets for them, or essentially their primary mechanic (outside of the ranger who got it as his primary mechanic in the first place) and they are still mobile). Mesmer? Good luck, and enjoy being stomped by someone not caring a bit about the fly splashed against his window of clones.

They can be fun to troll people who didn’t know there where eight professions but its not a competive build. And the explosion on death has hilariously had aoe (as in he actually needs to attack your riffle turret with a sword or something (the graphical effect is huge, the actual effect not so much), and who would focus a riffle turret? As if it was a threat? If 1200 damage is a nuke then other professions seem to sneeze the tsar bomb with every breath.

Im not kitten, just passionate.

Anyways that might be part of why i feel kind of bad whenever i kill an engineer with turrets. As if killing an fellow engineer didn’t feel bad enough.

What was that? Thumper turret? Heh, i got bomb kit for that job, which gives me a big bomb as the toolbelt with the same cool down (less if you count the expected lifetime for a thumper turret on a point) a smokefield with pulsing blind similar to the flame turrets overcharge, a short recharging firefield, 5 stacks of aoe confusion and a aoe imbobilize/cripple.

The 30% damage reduction would be a great trait… IF the base hp and toughness would be better.
Currently it’s more like ‘30% of nothing is still nothing’ to exagerate a bit.

The selfhealing is too low, way too low.

Turret traits are pretty underwhelming, simply because the turret design is bad at the moment.

Turrets need lower cooldowns on most, and overcharges that work immediately.
As well as some toughness and hp…

Let’s see what the changes bring.
It could be worth it, or it could be a lot of talk for little real effect.
We’ll know soon enough.

Chaith.8256:

Zinwrath.2049:

Drop a turret in a short range infront of you instead of having to jump/walk over to where you want to put it is bad? No…but its also probably the lamest.

In what situation does this help you? This trait is rarer when it helps you vs when it doesnt help you. In most scenerios there isn;t an area to put the turret you couldnt have just reached by running over to or jumping up to. And the only turrets you dont want near the fight are rifle/rocket…meaning most turrets dont benefit at all from this trait. If anything its the lamest trait for turrets as it doesnt help them function better and is slimmest in its usefullness….even less useful than blowing them up for ae nuke/knockback.

Let me explain my (tPvP) position.
I’ve came to the conclusion that the only way I can justify turrets in my builds if I overcome the survivability problem, and they have 100% uptime. I also need to have spare traits for defensive options and either improvements to my mainhand weapon or 1 kit.

Metal plating trait, and self repairing traits try to overcome the survivability problem but ultimately don’t come close to succeeding, yet they eat 20 trait points in an unimpressive trait line. The best way I’ve found to overcome the survivability & uptime problem is anchoring turrets to the wall, out of reach – turrets such as net turrets, rifle, and most importantly rocket. There are walls/structures everywhere, all you need is any vertical surface – don’t underestimate this trait. I can easily solve the survivability and uptime problems with 1 low investment trait, and still have room in the build to trait a grenade kit, or defensive options. I feel turrets should supplement builds, not define them – even so, when their damage isn’t there, you are quite sub-par.

Unfortunately, you are correct in pointing out that this strategy doesn’t apply to close range turrets such as thumper, or flame. I feel thumper and flame turrets aren’t justifiable in any build in their current state. I’d be happy if that was not the case, though. Many professions have more than a few sub-par utilities.

Exactly. The trait is only mildly helpful to the weakest couple turrets (low hp) who can easily be taking out with a couple ranged attacks. Also there are not out of reach places on walls/structures “everywhere”. But i do see your point to why you like the trait. edit: and in most scenerios you can however…i keep forgetting it will weirdly let you stick them in walls.

I think the biggest problem with the traits in the invention line is not about the traits themselves being bad. Its about what they’re being used to strengthen being bad. Its healing/toughness tree…ideal stats you would want for bunkering down with some turret support. And the inventions line has very good traits, including refresh on your heal at 25% health. Perfect for staying alive on a point while your turrets rain fire on our foe. The problem is the sacrifice you must make, like you said theres other traits you feel you “need”.

We’re in the middle (like all professions) of a power shift. Abilties/traits that are deemed “must haves” have been/will be nerfed. Traits/abilities that are deemed “unusable” have been/will be buffed. I think the progressive buffs to turrets coming will most likely make the invention traits more desireable. Its a playstyle after all, and arenanet devs recognize that.

Funny to see someone argue with Chaith about tPvP turret utility.

I tend to trust one of our top engineer about that. :P

Anywya I was bored this week end and tried a 3 turret static discharge build.

Not that bad, actually better then expected.

But once your turret are on cooldown, you are pretty much death.

I didn’t have any kits except med kit. I didn’t have any CC breaker. I had one condition removal.

I felt really naked.

Kardiamond.6952:

Funny to see someone argue with Chaith about tPvP turret utility.

I tend to trust one of our top engineer about that. :P

Anywya I was bored this week end and tried a 3 turret static discharge build.

Not that bad, actually better then expected.

But once your turret are on cooldown, you are pretty much death.

I didn’t have any kits except med kit. I didn’t have any CC breaker. I had one condition removal.

I felt really naked.

Maybe it’s because I’m used to playing my ranger/MM (very new to me)/turret engi so I haven’t been spoiled by condi removal/stun break and have just learned to avoid them.

For example, “oh look that engi just popped elixir U? Dive behind the rifle turret!! He’s immune to condis and he will protect me from them!!”

The best cure for CCs and Condis is simply don’t be hit, which in most scenarios is more than possible.

@other people

As for fighting mesmers/pet profs the current meta either revolves around not using your pet much cough trap rangers cough or to kill it almost immediately (mesmers) so you can deal damage… So I don’t have much issues against them, and I haven’t had issues with my turrets attacking the wrong targets, but then again, I don’t use turrets with ridiculous recharges like net (well ok, I do when I supply drop, that’s one of the reasons I take Elite Supplies), flame and rifle shoot REALLY fast and if you set them up right they’ll agro on the players before they even get to the combat zone so the pets a non issue especially since they 1) have lower armor than the players making them less appetizing to the AI 2) in the current meta constantly are A) destroyed or swapped out to grant quickness to the owner or C) drag quite a bit behind the master and as such don’t get in agro range until its too late (Minion AI vs Turret AI, turrets win).

Kardiamond.6952:

Anywya I was bored this week end and tried a 3 turret static discharge build.

Not that bad, actually better then expected.

But once your turret are on cooldown, you are pretty much death.

I didn’t have any kits except med kit. I didn’t have any CC breaker. I had one condition removal.

I felt really naked.

Edit: I didn’t realize you said ‘all turret’ static discharge build, haha. That’s definitely what I would a #yolo build.

Rifle Turret, Utility Goggles & Toolkit, perhaps? You’ll get 3 ranged static discharge procs, and the toolkit so you can magnet -> pry bar -> overcharge shot -> unload discharge. Not to mention the block for added survivability.

I’m not saying static discharge builds are competitive, they’re really not. But if you’re tenacious enough you might find them close to viable. The naked feeling won’t really go away, though

Chaith.8256:

Kardiamond.6952:

Anywya I was bored this week end and tried a 3 turret static discharge build.

Not that bad, actually better then expected.

But once your turret are on cooldown, you are pretty much death.

I didn’t have any kits except med kit. I didn’t have any CC breaker. I had one condition removal.

I felt really naked.

Rifle Turret, Utility Goggles & Toolkit, perhaps? You’ll get 3 ranged static discharge procs, and the toolkit so you can magnet -> pry bar -> overcharge shot -> unload discharge. Not to mention the block for added survivability.

I’m not saying static discharge builds are competitive, they’re really not. But if you’re tenacious enough you might find them close to viable. The naked feeling won’t really go away, though

I disagree, they are quite viable if the build is appropriate. You can get a massive burst if you hit your chain correctly with anaylyze/magnet/prybar/rifle #4/netshot/throw wrench/jumpshot/rifle#3, if you don’t have your turret up you can have more damage with the surprise shot, if you do, it is shooting it the entire time, either way, more damage.

I think in a roundabout way we agreed with each other.

@Chaith

Yeah I know there are better static discharge build around, I was just experiencing double static discharge.

Plant all three turret.
immob ennemy in your turret.
explode turret and shoot 6 bolt of static discharge.

The burst is actually pretty good, but it’s so hard to set up perfectly, and you are stuck with nothing except your rifle after. And you have like versatility.

I used to be a static discharge with toolkit, googles/ram, rifle turret. Like you said, it’s not bad, but I feel like I’m a one trick pony.

@Galandor

If you can pull that combo, he deserve to die. Sadly this combo won’t work on most people. And if you don’t one shot the ennemy, you odn’t have much left.

I think this build is near-viable, but not yet there.

Kardiamond.6952:

@Chaith

Yeah I know there are better static discharge build around, I was just experiencing double static discharge.

Plant all three turret.
immob ennemy in your turret.
explode turret and shoot 6 bolt of static discharge.

That’s actually genius. Will your turret detonation fire a discharge at your target? Or just fizzle out on the ground.

Chaith.8256:

Kardiamond.6952:

@Chaith

Yeah I know there are better static discharge build around, I was just experiencing double static discharge.

Plant all three turret.
immob ennemy in your turret.
explode turret and shoot 6 bolt of static discharge.

That’s actually genius. Will your turret detonation fire a discharge at your target? Or just fizzle out on the ground.

If you have a target selected they shoot at them, otherwise they spray off into the sky or ground, I tried something similar but felt naked with all my turrets gone…

It will, but it won’t aim.

That’s why you need your ennemy to stand still.

It’s a fun build.

By the way, I didn’t think about it myself, someone posted some test about it previously. I don’t remember who.

Turrets will be buffed the next several patches before people start using them. Congrats on making turrets work for you, though. Not many have.

NevirSayDie.6235:

Turrets will be buffed the next several patches before people start using them. Congrats on making turrets work for you, though. Not many have.

Not gonna lie, I’m Psyched for the buffs to my turrets (despite thinking they don’t need them, but w/e I’ll take em!!) kinda curious what all they’ll do to em… I’d -love- them all to have close to a 20s CD (rocket at 45 or so instead of 60) so movement isn’t -as- brutal, but I don’t see that happening.

Durzlla.6295:

If you have a target selected they shoot at them, otherwise they spray off into the sky or ground.

Kardiamond.6952:

It will, but it won’t aim.

So it’s the same as other targeted toolbelt skills – those usually don’t require the target to be still, though.

galandor.1059:

Chaith.8256:

Kardiamond.6952:

Anywya I was bored this week end and tried a 3 turret static discharge build.

Not that bad, actually better then expected.

But once your turret are on cooldown, you are pretty much death.

I didn’t have any kits except med kit. I didn’t have any CC breaker. I had one condition removal.

I felt really naked.

Rifle Turret, Utility Goggles & Toolkit, perhaps? You’ll get 3 ranged static discharge procs, and the toolkit so you can magnet -> pry bar -> overcharge shot -> unload discharge. Not to mention the block for added survivability.

I’m not saying static discharge builds are competitive, they’re really not. But if you’re tenacious enough you might find them close to viable. The naked feeling won’t really go away, though

I disagree, they are quite viable if the build is appropriate. You can get a massive burst if you hit your chain correctly with anaylyze/magnet/prybar/rifle #4/netshot/throw wrench/jumpshot/rifle#3, if you don’t have your turret up you can have more damage with the surprise shot, if you do, it is shooting it the entire time, either way, more damage.

I think in a roundabout way we agreed with each other.

Don’t ever ever ever say something is viable. 100nades was gimmick viable every 30secs and look what they are doing to that..All it will take is one photoshopped picture of static shoot hitting for 10K

In WvW, I use Heal Turret and Net Turret, with Thumper Turret every once in awhile for the Shockwave Blast Finisher. Accelerant Packed Turrets as well.

Fixing Turrets…

Rifle Turret… make the Overcharge ability the Basic, then make the Overcharge a 3 Second Heavy Burst Mingun-style AoE Bullet Spray

Rocket Turret… Overcharge is the basic ability, and make the Overcharge a “Rocket Swarm”(there are three launch tubes. Why not make it an AoE? )

Net Turret… Overcharge should Net Multiple Opponents.

Thumper Turret…Basic should be the upcoming Cripple, as they say. Overcharged ability needs to fire off more often.

Heal Turret…Just make the Overcharge Condition Cleansing go off immediately. Lower CD as well.

Someone once mentioned that people need to be afraid when they walk up on Turrets. This will do wonders for “Area Denial”, or “Battlefield CC”.

Wish list, I know. But one can hope for the future!

Turrets as knockback fodder. Yep, that’s how you make them viable. They die sooo easily under some group’s AoE so why not exploit that fact? I WANT my turrets in a Supply Crate drop on that zerg to blow up in their face as a result of their AoE. But why should it be that way? That’s just a tactic developed as a result of general turret weakness. Let’s get some turret buffs and develop new tactics!

@ejiofor, I would be a very VERY happy person if those rifle and/or rocket turret changes happen…

Hey,

I currently play a turret Engineer 0/30/30/0/10 mostly with Net Turret, Flame Turret and Rocket Turret with a mix of Rabid/Apothicary and Undead Runes. And I have a lot of fun with it. While yes my personnal damage output with my Pistol/Shield is pretty low I can dish out some very nice AoE burning damage with my turrets and I get tons of controls with those.

I also play Charr, so I get the Charrzooka and my god, using the Flame Turret with this elite is devastating in PVE. Just use your smokescreen, use skill 4 to stun ennemies, leaping backward while stealthed, than unleash hellfire with skill 5 while they all try, blindly, to hit your Turret for a devastating synergy.

I think toughness is also a very important asset for a turret build, sinds it helps the Engineer to grab aggro and keep your turrets alive, also deploying turret is a must have. It is harder to play with that talent but when you are fighting big ennemies with nasty AoE it gives you the ability to tacticaly set your turret to safer areas while you are getting shot by the boss.

For condition removal I am pretty limited so I took a signet of Generosity on my main weapon to send back most of those pesky side effects back to my attackers. The cool things about it are the facts it scales with my own condition damage and it won’t occure if you don’t have any condition on you, so the first condition is almost always garanteed to be send back to your foe. And that only on a 10sec cooldown.

So yes maybe Turrets aren’t so OP compared to its Alchemy counterpart but to me, in my honest oppinion, it is the most tactical and fun build to play.

Anyone got some good turret gameplay? I’ve tried turrets in PvP and they are not doing anything for me tbh.. I traited fully into turrets and it would still do barely do anything for me. Only decent thing about them was the KB trait.. I’d love to see some turret gameplay that is actually effective.

Chaba.5410:

Turrets as knockback fodder. Yep, that’s how you make them viable. They die sooo easily under some group’s AoE so why not exploit that fact? I WANT my turrets in a Supply Crate drop on that zerg to blow up in their face as a result of their AoE. But why should it be that way? That’s just a tactic developed as a result of general turret weakness. Let’s get some turret buffs and develop new tactics!

I don’t -try- to get my turrets killed just as I don’t -try- to kill my rangers spirits or my necros minions but I take the trait to cause bad things when those happen nonetheless, I like people to be a little fearful of killing my turrets, because hey, a KB isn’t really something most people want to get hit by!

Ah, but once I started trying to get my turrets killed, it trained a lot of people to start fearing the turrets. Or at least start getting annoyed enough by them. I want the opponents to have to make a terrible choice. Destroy my turrets and get hurt or leave my turrets alone and get hurt. LOL!

(Opinion) I feel that simply allowing Turrets AI to “force target” on whatever opponents you have targeted would greatly improve The viability of Turret PvP. If no targets are selected they should just target nearest like how they function currently. Being able to focus fire particular targets with all your turrets would be a reasonable change.

Also allowing Detonate Turret Tool Belt skills to be usable in any condition. Whether you are invulnerable through Elixir S, or Downed. ( like Ranger’s pet abilities.) Being able to put your Healing Turret back on its Cool Down while in Elixer S is very important when your in a Neck and neck fight with a bunker Ele.

I think it could be interesting to tie your turrets attacks up when using “Ctrl + T” to focus an ennemy. This could immensely help any Turret Engineer builds, but this would also probably create a new issue in teams using team targeting.

The one person I know that actually thinks Ranger spirits are powerful is here to say that he thinks Eng turrets are powerful.

…somehow I’m not surprised.

Lol this thread is a joke. You beat HGH condition engineers with your 1 condition clear vs their 6 on demand? Interesting… Interesting… do tell us more fantastical stories…..

zaragoz.6351:

Lol this thread is a joke. You beat HGH condition engineers with your 1 condition clear vs their 6 on demand? Interesting… Interesting… do tell us more fantastical stories…..

HGH condition engineers deal condition damage… and that’s about it, i have raw damage as well raining in from my turrets, I also have 3-4 meat shields i can hide behind that are immune to conditions, yes IMMUNE, not to mention that engineers don’t deal with long duration conditions so the Melandru rune hurts their damage a good amount and sigils of nulification really hurt their damage and survivability due to their total boon reliance…

That and i’ve played that build for a WHILE before going to turrets so I kinda know all their little tricks and what to look for…

Oh yeah, I also have defensive abilities other than my turrets KD and blinding field/stealth combo…

@Dahkeus, actually i’ve said spirits are good, not powerful, as in they’re useable, they do their role well, but they need some love. I have said in god knows how many threads that they should just become constant pulsing buff spots (IE prot every second while the spirits alive) to warrant their low health, or boost their survivability/ make them scale off the ranger, so yeah… Turrets on the other hand -are- quite strong, but if Anet wants them to serve as “Area Denial” then yeah, they need to be buffed, I personally didn’t realize that’s what Anet wanted them to be used for, and as such they would need a buff.

zaragoz.6351:

Lol this thread is a joke. You beat HGH condition engineers with your 1 condition clear vs their 6 on demand? Interesting… Interesting… do tell us more fantastical stories…..

I’ve beat HGH nades engies with some pretty weird builds before. I’m not saying turrets are even close to usable, but HGH nades doesn’t have much control and only one stunbreak on a 48 second cooldown. So, if you kite well and/or have good cc, they’re not hard to 1v1 no matter how much condition removal you have.

NevirSayDie.6235:

zaragoz.6351:

Lol this thread is a joke. You beat HGH condition engineers with your 1 condition clear vs their 6 on demand? Interesting… Interesting… do tell us more fantastical stories…..

I’ve beat HGH nades engies with some pretty weird builds before. I’m not saying turrets are even close to usable, but HGH nades doesn’t have much control and only one stunbreak on a 48 second cooldown. So, if you kite well and/or have good cc, they’re not hard to 1v1 no matter how much condition removal you have.

CC i have… HT launch —-> rocket stun —-> another Launch —-> daze x2 —-> rifle turret launch (after tactical launching/positioning) —-> another launch + blind + stealth —--> most certainly dead by this point.

EDIT: I’m writing this now, keep in mind this isn’t something i’m going to do in any fight unless i ABSOLUTELY NEED TO, in which case i’ve only had to do it twice, both were in a GC + CC combo so i had to keep at least one of them CCed most of the right until a friend got around to help.

Durzlla.6295:

Keep in mind I just plant myself down on a point, the only 2 turrets that are in the point circle are Rifle (that things expendable and useful for launching people of the point/ interrupting).

I think that’s all well and good until you realize that the Flamethrower’s Air Blast and a Rifle’s Overcharged Shot both interrupt/launch people without investing 20 points in Explosives, and on shorter cooldowns.

For everything turrets do, there are just better options at the moment—except maybe Flame Turret’s Smoke field.

Phineas Poe.3018:

Durzlla.6295:

Keep in mind I just plant myself down on a point, the only 2 turrets that are in the point circle are Rifle (that things expendable and useful for launching people of the point/ interrupting).

I think that’s all well and good until you realize that the Flamethrower’s Air Blast and a Rifle’s Overcharged Shot both interrupt/launch people without investing 20 points in Explosives, and on shorter cooldowns.

For everything turrets do, there are just better options at the moment—except maybe Flame Turret’s Smoke field.

That’s all well and good but i don’t use my turrets to purposely interrupt people, it’s more to detaunt people from attacking my turrets, however if i absolutely need to CC chain to survive i’ll detonate all of them but Rocket Turret/Thumper turret (back when i did use that one, starting the patch i may start again) due to their CD. This also allows me to -not- lose my added armor by equipping a flamethrower, and doesn’t force me into using a rifle… not to mention i could use the rifle -with- the turret build as well as the flame thrower because losing 1 turret is hardly a downside to the build, i just use all 3 turrets because i see no real need not to.