Guild Wars 2

RabbitUp.8294:

This is my main class. Flaming is blowing holes to your non-existing argument?

If this is your main class and you are unaware of guardian being as a support may I ask what spec do you play at all, condi?
Guess you need to learn more about your main.

Adrenalin.5719:

wvw does not matter at all tho, lol

raiding matters

lol. Please go back to the MMOs that fulfill your die-hard raiding fantasies.

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

Adrenalin.5719:

wvw does not matter at all tho, lol

raiding matters

Guardians does not raid. We watch how other specs raid,. Thats our good spot.

But I thought guardians are best support..

We are best support but with lack of dps and heal.

So best at what?

Stability bot.
“support” lol

LetoII.3782:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

Adrenalin.5719:

wvw does not matter at all tho, lol

raiding matters

Guardians does not raid. We watch how other specs raid,. Thats our good spot.

But I thought guardians are best support..

We are best support but with lack of dps and heal.

So best at what?

Stability bot.
“support” lol

protection bot
too bad no one really needs protection lol

Adrenalin.5719:

LetoII.3782:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

Adrenalin.5719:

wvw does not matter at all tho, lol

raiding matters

Guardians does not raid. We watch how other specs raid,. Thats our good spot.

But I thought guardians are best support..

We are best support but with lack of dps and heal.

So best at what?

Stability bot.
“support” lol

protection bot
too bad no one really needs protection lol

Protection is vastly useful, on my ele I can get close to 100% protection uptime and survive zerg vs zerg at melee range.

Adrenalin.5719:

LetoII.3782:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

Adrenalin.5719:

wvw does not matter at all tho, lol

raiding matters

Guardians does not raid. We watch how other specs raid,. Thats our good spot.

But I thought guardians are best support..

We are best support but with lack of dps and heal.

So best at what?

Stability bot.
“support” lol

protection bot
too bad no one really needs protection lol

And if they need it, druid can summon Stone Spirit. Having a hammer guardian for protection when it does as much damage as a PS is a joke.

morrolan.9608:

Adrenalin.5719:

LetoII.3782:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

Adrenalin.5719:

wvw does not matter at all tho, lol

raiding matters

Guardians does not raid. We watch how other specs raid,. Thats our good spot.

But I thought guardians are best support..

We are best support but with lack of dps and heal.

So best at what?

Stability bot.
“support” lol

protection bot
too bad no one really needs protection lol

Protection is vastly useful, on my ele I can get close to 100% protection uptime and survive zerg vs zerg at melee range.

I’m talking about raiding where you don’t need a Guard for protection because protection is either not needed or covered by other better classes just fine.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6qyzlc/firebrand_stuff/

Pretty good thread on the subreddit.

Syktek.7912:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6qyzlc/firebrand_stuff/

Pretty good thread on the subreddit.

Well, now I know why WP didn’t bother.
Karl McLain needs to go.

Adrenalin.5719:

morrolan.9608:

Adrenalin.5719:

LetoII.3782:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

Adrenalin.5719:

wvw does not matter at all tho, lol

raiding matters

Guardians does not raid. We watch how other specs raid,. Thats our good spot.

But I thought guardians are best support..

We are best support but with lack of dps and heal.

So best at what?

Stability bot.
“support” lol

protection bot
too bad no one really needs protection lol

Protection is vastly useful, on my ele I can get close to 100% protection uptime and survive zerg vs zerg at melee range.

I’m talking about raiding where you don’t need a Guard for protection because protection is either not needed or covered by other better classes just fine.

And what? You think raids are the only important part of the game?

morrolan.9608:

Adrenalin.5719:

morrolan.9608:

Adrenalin.5719:

LetoII.3782:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

RabbitUp.8294:

Ragnarox.9601:

Adrenalin.5719:

wvw does not matter at all tho, lol

raiding matters

Guardians does not raid. We watch how other specs raid,. Thats our good spot.

But I thought guardians are best support..

We are best support but with lack of dps and heal.

So best at what?

Stability bot.
“support” lol

protection bot
too bad no one really needs protection lol

Protection is vastly useful, on my ele I can get close to 100% protection uptime and survive zerg vs zerg at melee range.

I’m talking about raiding where you don’t need a Guard for protection because protection is either not needed or covered by other better classes just fine.

And what? You think raids are the only important part of the game?

Well I think hes right, chrono and druid can do much better support and heal than firebrand. Firebrand is shout 2.0. Lazy and garbage design compared to other specs. I dont see it being used in pvp cause of casting times and virtue cd and not even in wvw cause of same things. They hyped us tomes=kits but in reality they are not kits at all. Disappointed.

LetoII.3782:

Syktek.7912:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6qyzlc/firebrand_stuff/

Pretty good thread on the subreddit.

Well, now I know why WP didn’t bother.
Karl McLain needs to go.

No!!!
Don’t tell me firebrand la designed by Karl…
Guardian has been butchered already once and the only thing guardian is good at now is vanilla guard on wvw.
You see the only class that keeps being meta only on one game mode….and in vanilla

If it is confirmed it is him I will not pay the expansion

Kicast.1459:

LetoII.3782:

Syktek.7912:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6qyzlc/firebrand_stuff/

Pretty good thread on the subreddit.

Well, now I know why WP didn’t bother.
Karl McLain needs to go.

No!!!
Don’t tell me firebrand la designed by Karl…
Guardian has been butchered already once and the only thing guardian is good at now is vanilla guard on wvw.
You see the only class that keeps being meta only on one game mode….and in vanilla

If it is confirmed it is him I will not pay the expansion

He is thats why this is again most borring and lazy spec in this expansion which dont give anything new and fresh in pof. Quickness bots with 90 and 60 sec virtues cd.(NOT KITS)

Even I’m disappointed, and seeing tomes again was literally the only reason I kept playing.

Ragnarox.9601:

Kicast.1459:

LetoII.3782:

Syktek.7912:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6qyzlc/firebrand_stuff/

Pretty good thread on the subreddit.

Well, now I know why WP didn’t bother.
Karl McLain needs to go.

No!!!
Don’t tell me firebrand la designed by Karl…
Guardian has been butchered already once and the only thing guardian is good at now is vanilla guard on wvw.
You see the only class that keeps being meta only on one game mode….and in vanilla

If it is confirmed it is him I will not pay the expansion

He is thats why this is again most borring and lazy spec in this expansion which dont give anything new and fresh in pof. Quickness bots with 90 and 60 sec virtues cd.(NOT KITS)

Wow, if the tomes aren’t kits then the skills needs massive buffs or else this is going to suck anywhere, seriously who wants to play a class with such long CDs? Way to ruin the fun…

Playing a Guardian, who is ment to be a Support, Tank Protection Claas and u Flame because u got no dps specc. Classic

Andwari.2978:

Playing a Guardian, who is ment to be a Support, Tank Protection Claas and u Flame because u got no dps specc. Classic

tank only bad players and mobs :]

Andwari.2978:

Playing a Guardian, who is ment to be a Support, Tank Protection Claas and u Flame because u got no dps specc. Classic

I dont see any tanks being competitive in high fractals, raids, wvw and pvp. So whats the point of this spec? Pve tanking world boss cause its fun??

firebrand is all about woooosh and smooooosh effects… nothing more….

Aeolus.3615:

firebrand is all about woooosh and smooooosh effects… nothing more….

Ive seen some ppl call it Firetrash on reddit

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

Am I the only one that is stoked that TOMES ARE BACK?

Definitely not alone there =D

Andwari.2978:

Playing a Guardian, who is ment to be a Support, Tank Protection Claas and u Flame because u got no dps specc. Classic

The Firebrand isn’t a tank. It’s basically the core guardian powercreep edition and doesn’t actually offer any new way to play the class.

I wanted it to be support as much as the next person, but not a similar but identical version of core guardians.

http://imgur.com/a/KBwBS

this are all the skills of firebrand.

Axe is excellent condi weapon but thats it orrr..
Tomes have cd’s like vritues plus when you go into some tome you have also cd’s of inner skills.
Cast times are bad all 3/4 that can be interrupted.

But I dont understand one thing…

F skills does look like kits but maybe you can go into them wherever you like but you would not have stunbreak and stability at F3 if you used it once. (Thats a really good thing if its true).
F2 heals are not that good.
F3 looks promising
F1 are condition very heavy oriented

Mantras does not look good especially heal one..it should heal more..at least 2400.

Elite needs some whoa effect to be better than RF.

The elite is 3 stun breaks

I think it will replace RF

Ragnarox.9601:

F skills does look like kits but maybe you can go into them wherever you like but you would not have stunbreak and stability at F3 if you used it once. (Thats a really good thing if its true).

Nope, they definitely have cooldowns.

Fashion Mage.3712:

Ragnarox.9601:

F skills does look like kits but maybe you can go into them wherever you like but you would not have stunbreak and stability at F3 if you used it once. (Thats a really good thing if its true).

Nope, they definitely have cooldowns.

That sucks then. I won’t use it. They are not kits then.

Adrenalin.5719:

A meta in an MMO just means that the balance is terrible, that is all, and that it needs fixing.

While I certainly agree that balance in GW2 is bad, this game’s meta culture is beyond ridiculous and that’s, first and foremost, a community thing. I’ve played games with harder raids (which isn’t really difficult, since GW2 raid difficulty is a joke) where people cared much, much less about meta, FOTM or whatever else it was called.

With regard to the new spec, looks interesting. I’ll reserve judgement till I’ve seen (and ideally played) more of it.

Honestly last time karl listened to this sub forum’s raging we got a dh that was so overpowered that it has been nerfed every patch since. I still remember the dh nuke memes. Hopefully the devs get very selective this time with who they listen to lest we get more powercreep.

It is ridiculous that people here are requesting the new tomes act as kits when these tomes can give area wide stunbreak, stability, projectile reflect, condi removal, healing, burning, and resistance. Engi kits come nowhere near the power that these tomes have and being able to switch back and forth between defense, healing and dps with tomes would not be balanced. A more reasonable request is to lower the cooldown on tome of courage to at least 40-50 sec.

Kuya.6495:

Honestly last time karl listened to this sub forum’s raging we got a dh that was so overpowered that it has been nerfed every patch since. I still remember the dh nuke memes. Hopefully the devs get very selective this time with who they listen to lest we get more powercreep.

It is ridiculous that people here are requesting the new tomes act as kits when these tomes can give area wide stunbreak, stability, projectile reflect, condi removal, healing, burning, and resistance. Engi kits come nowhere near the power that these tomes have and being able to switch back and forth between defense, healing and dps with tomes would not be balanced. A more reasonable request is to lower the cooldown on tome of courage to at least 40-50 sec.

Did you ever see or played DH pre hot? It was pure garbage, ppl were raging with a reason. Than it was buffed but traps were OP for casuals so they nerfed it every patch.

Saddly Firebrand is even worse than prehot DH, you will see it in 2 weeks when ppl try to test it in pvp and wvw.

Engie kits are very good, did you played it, they give block, heal, condi dmg and its quite usefull. Firebrand kits are 90 sec cd which is abysmal cd. Dont forget mantras are 300 range also and almost all skills are 3/4 cast time. Very bad if you actually want to support someone in big fights cause of so many movements and interrupts.

ppl are saying its fun, well hell yeah it would be fun to farm Firebrands when the expansion starts, pls dont be salty then and cry for a buffs it will be too late then.

What I would to see is like engie kits with skills on big cd’s rather than big cd tomes with skills on 6-15sec cd.

They might work in PvP as a condition build, but any real support guardian build in PvP that isn’t tanky will never work in close range. The DH is more tanky just with shield of courage and support builds for DH still don’t pop up frequently.

Kuya.6495:

It is ridiculous that people here are requesting the new tomes act as kits when these tomes can give area wide stunbreak, stability, projectile reflect, condi removal, healing, burning, and resistance. Engi kits come nowhere near the power that these tomes have and being able to switch back and forth between defense, healing and dps with tomes would not be balanced. A more reasonable request is to lower the cooldown on tome of courage to at least 40-50 sec.

I don’t personally care about them having cooldowns, but I’m not remotely satisfied with the shouts skills that they offer. Tomes went from the reason I played this game to the reason I’m likely going to quit. Can’t believe I waited two years just to see my favourite skills get butchered.

Ragnarox.9601:

Kuya.6495:

Honestly last time karl listened to this sub forum’s raging we got a dh that was so overpowered that it has been nerfed every patch since. I still remember the dh nuke memes. Hopefully the devs get very selective this time with who they listen to lest we get more powercreep.

It is ridiculous that people here are requesting the new tomes act as kits when these tomes can give area wide stunbreak, stability, projectile reflect, condi removal, healing, burning, and resistance. Engi kits come nowhere near the power that these tomes have and being able to switch back and forth between defense, healing and dps with tomes would not be balanced. A more reasonable request is to lower the cooldown on tome of courage to at least 40-50 sec.

Did you ever see or played DH pre hot? It was pure garbage, ppl were raging with a reason. Than it was buffed but traps were OP for casuals so they nerfed it every patch.

Saddly Firebrand is even worse than prehot DH, you will see it in 2 weeks when ppl try to test it in pvp and wvw.

Engie kits are very good, did you played it, they give block, heal, condi dmg and its quite usefull. Firebrand kits are 90 sec cd which is abysmal cd. Dont forget mantras are 300 range also and almost all skills are 3/4 cast time. Very bad if you actually want to support someone in big fights cause of so many movements and interrupts.

ppl are saying its fun, well hell yeah it would be fun to farm Firebrands when the expansion starts, pls dont be salty then and cry for a buffs it will be too late then.

What I would to see is like engie kits with skills on big cd’s rather than big cd tomes with skills on 6-15sec cd.

Man, if 90 sec cd makes you so salty just take virtues, jesus.

And no, it won’t be too late if firebrand sucks on release. you know because they do balance patches more than once a year. please stop with the hysteria.

Fashion Mage.3712:

They might work in PvP as a condition build, but any real support guardian build in PvP that isn’t tanky will never work in close range. The DH is more tanky just with shield of courage and support builds for DH still don’t pop up frequently.

Kuya.6495:

It is ridiculous that people here are requesting the new tomes act as kits when these tomes can give area wide stunbreak, stability, projectile reflect, condi removal, healing, burning, and resistance. Engi kits come nowhere near the power that these tomes have and being able to switch back and forth between defense, healing and dps with tomes would not be balanced. A more reasonable request is to lower the cooldown on tome of courage to at least 40-50 sec.

I don’t personally care about them having cooldowns, but I’m not remotely satisfied with the shouts skills that they offer. Tomes went from the reason I played this game to the reason I’m likely going to quit. Can’t believe I waited two years just to see my favourite skills get butchered.

You kept playing for two years because you were expecting to see tome skills come back in the specific way you wanted them to?

Guys, really?

Kuya.6495:

Man, if 90 sec cd makes you so salty just take virtues, jesus.

And no, it won’t be too late if firebrand sucks on release. you know because they do balance patches more than once a year. please stop with the hysteria.

Balance patch goes pre expansion and next maybe in march….Virtues are also 72s cd.
Ill just wait for salty and crying comments after 2 weeks and pvp wvw testing. No point of arguing with ppl who praised pre HoT DH.

So ill join the hype, firebrand is fluffy visually stunning, they are so fun fun fun. cant wait to use tomes and sing songs of love in the battlefield.

Kuya.6495:

You kept playing for two years because you were expecting to see tome skills come back in the specific way you wanted them to?

Guys, really?

“Hurr durr you’re crazy, tomes were obviously going to become shouts!”. Please don’t pretend that assuming tomes were going to be tomes was an unreasonable assumption. I know most of the community are clowns and white knights but come on.

Fashion Mage.3712:

Kuya.6495:

You kept playing for two years because you were expecting to see tome skills come back in the specific way you wanted them to?

Guys, really?

“Hurr durr you’re crazy, tomes were obviously going to become shouts!”. Please don’t pretend that assuming tomes were going to be tomes was an unreasonable assumption. I know most of the community are clowns and white knights but come on.

I am not saying that it was obvious tomes were going to become shouts.

I am saying that waiting for two years for them to bring back tomes into the game and then quitting when it doesn’t look like how you wanted them to is the craziest thing I’ve heard today.

Kuya.6495:

I am not saying that it was obvious tomes were going to become shouts.

I am saying that waiting for two years for them to bring back tomes into the game and then quitting when it doesn’t look like how you wanted them to is the craziest thing I’ve heard today.

Tomes were one of the few real instances of full long-range support in a game filled to the brim with 600 range point-blank AoE support. As someone who likes caster supports (like monks, who were also removed), it’s insulting to see a such a rare form of support in this game just removed and then turned into more shouts two years later. Honestly I should’ve quit two years ago the moment they were removed, because in retrospect that was a clear indicator of the direction they were going in with support in this game.

I wanted something back in that I really liked, and it wasn’t put back in, and it’ll never be put in now because the “tome” label was taken. The way I want to play isn’t an option so I don’t want to continue playing anymore. Doesn’t seem like that should be crazy or hard to understand for most people.

I just hope there’s also a good amount of balancing on core classes and previous elite specs, because this one feels really limited.
It looks like it could work on WvW (where Guardian seems already OK ) and raids (where Guardian needs help, but it’s as easy to solve as tweaking a few numbers here and there), but feels quite useless for small scale PvP (where the class also needs a little help, even if it looks like a monster at lower skill levels).

Why do people expect balancing in an expansion, especially since it didn’t happen the last time. We get FREE balancing patches for that; why would you want to pay for that?

Kuya.6495:

Ragnarox.9601:

Kuya.6495:

Honestly last time karl listened to this sub forum’s raging we got a dh that was so overpowered that it has been nerfed every patch since. I still remember the dh nuke memes. Hopefully the devs get very selective this time with who they listen to lest we get more powercreep.

It is ridiculous that people here are requesting the new tomes act as kits when these tomes can give area wide stunbreak, stability, projectile reflect, condi removal, healing, burning, and resistance. Engi kits come nowhere near the power that these tomes have and being able to switch back and forth between defense, healing and dps with tomes would not be balanced. A more reasonable request is to lower the cooldown on tome of courage to at least 40-50 sec.

Did you ever see or played DH pre hot? It was pure garbage, ppl were raging with a reason. Than it was buffed but traps were OP for casuals so they nerfed it every patch.

Saddly Firebrand is even worse than prehot DH, you will see it in 2 weeks when ppl try to test it in pvp and wvw.

Engie kits are very good, did you played it, they give block, heal, condi dmg and its quite usefull. Firebrand kits are 90 sec cd which is abysmal cd. Dont forget mantras are 300 range also and almost all skills are 3/4 cast time. Very bad if you actually want to support someone in big fights cause of so many movements and interrupts.

ppl are saying its fun, well hell yeah it would be fun to farm Firebrands when the expansion starts, pls dont be salty then and cry for a buffs it will be too late then.

What I would to see is like engie kits with skills on big cd’s rather than big cd tomes with skills on 6-15sec cd.

Man, if 90 sec cd makes you so salty just take virtues, jesus.

And no, it won’t be too late if firebrand sucks on release. you know because they do balance patches more than once a year. please stop with the hysteria.

Right, just 2-4 months of curb stomping
Seems reasonable

I blessed the rains down in Africa, but even then they couldn’t wash away all the salt in this thread.

Fashion Mage.3712:

Tomes were one of the few real instances of full long-range support in a game filled to the brim with 600 range point-blank AoE support. As someone who likes caster supports (like monks, who were also removed), it’s insulting to see a such a rare form of support in this game just removed and then turned into more shouts two years later.

How are the Tome skills like shouts?

morrolan.9608:

Fashion Mage.3712:

Tomes were one of the few real instances of full long-range support in a game filled to the brim with 600 range point-blank AoE support. As someone who likes caster supports (like monks, who were also removed), it’s insulting to see a such a rare form of support in this game just removed and then turned into more shouts two years later.

How are the Tome skills like shouts?

I think the better question is how are they not like shouts. They’re both just 600 range point-blank AoE support with a few exceptions in tomes.

There’s only one 600 range PBAoE skill per tome.

And some of them, particularly tome of justice are a combination of targeted and aoe and cc offensive skills with emphasis on burning. As far as i know, we have no shouts that do damage, are targeted, or cc.

RabbitUp.8294:

There’s only one 600 range PBAoE skill per tome.

Ah yes, a lot of the skills actually have way less range. Much better, thanks for pointing that out.

As someone who mainly plays pvp and wvw, I’m disappointed based on what I’ve seen so far.

• All tome skills have cast times. Tome skills need to be charged by hitting the enemy, can only be used so many times (pages), the individual skills have cooldowns AND the tomes themselves have long cooldowns? No thanks.

• Tome of Justice has next to no options for support or power-based builds. It’s practically a waste of space for them. I suppose it could be swapped into/out of quickly for some quickness.

• Very poor mobility: This is literally going to be the least mobile of the next 9 elite specs, comparable to base necro. No leaps, no teleports, no mobility related skill, no access to superspeed, paltry amount of swiftness (which doesn’t make up for lack of aforementioned skill types) and only a little access to some soft CC on a long cooldown (immob on mantras, bit of cripple on axe 2).

• Personal sustain looks to be abysmal: Since everything has a cast time, you are very susceptible being rendered useless, even in your desired role as support for the team. You may have more stability, but if you get locked down (a spellbreaker warrior with boonstripping + thief on you) you’re pretty much done for. While it’s true that FB will gain increased access to aegis and perhaps 2-3 instant aoe blinds using that one mantra, these aren’t going to do much for you when you’re the focus of 2-3 players.

• Tome animations are a let-down. This has been mentioned before. We need to have tomes hovering in front of us, not holographic pages that we don’t even really interact with. Each of the three tomes could be animated slightly differently (Justice = dancing blue flames, Resolve = a lighter glowing blue aura, Courage = a vivid shine emanating from the pages).

I can see FB possibly being useful in wvw zerg fights with aoe quickness application and nice support skills on f2 and f3 tomes but not replacing AH due to its cast times required for key tome skills. I don’t see it being very useful in pvp due to lack of sustain and ability to peel from a fight.

Arcaedus.7290:

• Personal sustain looks to be abysmal: Since everything has a cast time, you are very susceptible being rendered useless, even in your desired role as support for the team. You may have more stability, but if you get locked down (a spellbreaker warrior with boonstripping + thief on you) you’re pretty much done for. While it’s true that FB will gain increased access to aegis and perhaps 2-3 instant aoe blinds using that one mantra, these aren’t going to do much for you when you’re the focus of 2-3 players.

It’s almost like being a glass support in close range without mobility is a terrible idea in any game mode where your opponent has a brain (PvP).

Kicast.1459:

LetoII.3782:

Syktek.7912:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6qyzlc/firebrand_stuff/

Pretty good thread on the subreddit.

Well, now I know why WP didn’t bother.
Karl McLain needs to go.

No!!!
Don’t tell me firebrand la designed by Karl…

I find it unbelievable that with balance being in such a bad state that the head of the balance team can afford the time to design an elite spec. The balance team clearly doesn’t have the resources to do their job properly yet they’re also working on the xpac.

morrolan.9608:

Kicast.1459:

LetoII.3782:

Syktek.7912:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/6qyzlc/firebrand_stuff/

Pretty good thread on the subreddit.

Well, now I know why WP didn’t bother.
Karl McLain needs to go.

No!!!
Don’t tell me firebrand la designed by Karl…

I find it unbelievable that with balance being in such a bad state that the head of the balance team can afford the time to design an elite spec. The balance team clearly doesn’t have the resources to do their job properly yet they’re also working on the xpac.

Or it’s a failure in reasoning to think that your version of balance is what Anet is targeting with their own balancing efforts.

Personally I’d promote him to head of the shiny floors team