Guild Wars 2

This is a heads up to anyone startin a guardian for WvWvW or currently playing one. I hope u get good advice from this thread before u dedicate your self to this class. Be ready to die first and have the lowest chance of survival than almost any class. Your dmg will never be too low your support is awsome but u cant run away. EVER! Yes im beeing dramatic but yes most of the time u’ll die and unless u can accept this (i cant) try a different class.

So after playing guardian since release and spending 100+ gold on different setups trying to find a working build i have decided to shelve it and wait for change if it ever happens. Im also willing to bet theres a “most death in wvwvw” statistic for classes and it has a guardian at the top lol.

What made me do it after 4 months? The lack of stuff other almost every other class has: ESCAPE SKILLS!!!

I’v rolled in full knights, beserkers, power toughness vit, cleric, carrion, vit healing condition dmg, tried mixing this and that, all possible traits, iv had up to 3.5k armor without protection up. 3k armor and 20k hp! -65% condition duration, every rune and sigil in game tested like earths speed inflitration, toughness based vit based u name it. Beeing melee with meditations or AH healing, staying at staff or scepter range. I was even norn and used snowleopard to try my luck and get away sometimes. Spammed sanctuary and wall of reflection. Didnt help. Nothing helped! I was always on the ground watching my team run away if needed.

I could not get away to save my life with any of that in WvWvW.

Heres some situations.

Solo:
if i dont manage to kill fast enough person just gets away. Kites me to their sz or tower lol. I rarely lost 1vs1 unless i was fighting a class with quickness. Wich shud be deleted or given to every class cuz its way too imba.

Duo:
If the other person is not a guardian they will get away once i hit the floor.

5man group with various classes:
Me always first target and first to die. Why? Im always present there to be targeted. Once i go melee to dps im the closest target. Im always visible i dont have hide or range or clones or pets or whatever. Once focused i just melt. No mather how much tank i had on. Every other class i had with me escapes even if they’re in full beserker. You prolly know by now how other classes escape and kite so i wont go into that. Just to let u know as a guardian u cant. So be ready to tell your friends: “Save your selfs” allot! lol

20vs20 or any number:
Same here. If the enemy manages to break us and rush us im dead. The rest flee easly. Eles ride the lightning, thiefs hide, mesmers hide and distract, warriors pop imunity and just dash away… and so on. Us guardians? on the floor. “Save your selfs”

50+vs any number:
Same thing. Dead guardian. Other classes weeee gone. “Save your selfs”

Now why is it like this? We got overnerfed in wvwvw. Prolly cause of sPvP in the betas.
Our health was higher dunno how much higher then but people complained and we got lowest hp nerf from what i read. A melee class with a caster hp!!

Flashing blade didnt need target in beta. It was ground target. This can help alooot to get away. Just look at eles teleport and thiefs shortbow.
We need a dash skill or a ground target skill that ports us to get some distance like most classes can. Or hell give us a short stealth with looooong cd. Just somethin to help us escape liek everyone else. Otherwise we will remain repair paying meatshields.

There is no doubt in my mind i’ve tried enough and after so much time and practice and money im done. Please dont bring player skill up cause theres plenty. I know this class inside out after 4 months.

Now im off to make an elementalist that tanks better, gets away better, has better support, better dodge, 3 skills to gain distance, 98%!!!! imunity to chilled, immobilize and cripple. Does same dmg but more range. Wish i did it from the start before burning time and money.

Thanks for reading ^^

Hmm retreat and purging flames has never failed me. As far as distance you have judges intervention that can warp onto ledges lol….Not to mention the leap from great sword. And if distance is still a issue go sword and shield and use the swords dash that can also teleport. You can also negate like 10 straight attacks with guardian elite combos.

Silentstorm.7531:

Hmm retreat and purging flames has never failed me. As far as distance you have judges intervention that can warp onto ledges lol….Not to mention the leap from great sword. And if distance is still a issue go sword and shield and use the swords dash that can also teleport. You can also negate like 10 straight attacks with guardian elite combos.

I said i tried everything possible! Every skill available to guardian.
You dont think i tried the most obvious methods lol? If it worked so well i wouldnt be here writing this.

What good is retreat and purging flames when conditions are reapplied within seconds? So i get rooted or imobilized or stunned. I clean all that and then what? It will get applied again within a second! Im not a thief or mesmer to remove focus from me or have a fast gtfo skill like ele. I even had -65% less condition duration on me to take a chunk off of those conditions that imobilize you after purging fails. Helps a few more seconds but its not enough im still last in line of escape and first to die to 5 ppl. While i clearly see in the distance my sides eles, thiefs mesmers warriors and so on gettin the hell out!

Judges intervention needs a target. By the time you turn cam and select a target you are dead. There isnt always a mob available. Its not stealth or clones dude. Its not dash with gs while beeing imune to dmg.

Leap from greatsword is 600 range lol. Theres 1200 range skills with imobilze effects. Yep leap is pro.

Flashing blade also needs a target. Its a worse version of JI. The problem is both skills need a target. It didnt need one in betas and i cant for teh love of god figure out why it was changed.

Negating attacks with Renevable Focus will not get me farther than 5 steps. So i live 5 more sec if traited lol pro escape im still visible targeted and ppl reaply stuns roots and what not on me.

Any more suggestions?

Outside of Thieves and Eles, if you get caught in the middle of an enemy group, you shouldn’t expect to get away unless you’re built very defensively. I don’t play a bunker, but I have no problem getting away from group encounters as a GS/Sword+Focus guardian with no “escape” skills on my utility bar except for Judge’s or Retreat. Renewed Focus does help to some degree. You just can’t run forever if you were already inside the group.

tome of courage save your kitten while escaping.

Rune of soldier, 3 shouts on skill bar, Renewed focus, altruistic healing and you are set. did I die in zergs? yes. Did i escape impossible situations? yes. You can use all 3 virtues twice (once before renewed focus, and once after), they all give healing due to altruistic healing. Two shouts give protectoin AND regeneration at same time. Use greatsword leap of faith to get out of range. Time shouts when they immobalize you to remove it (rune of the soldier, full set).

Sounds like it’s your teams fault that you can’t escape because they leave you behind? I have no problem escaping, but I rather fight till the end because it is funner. If you’ve spent so much on different types of gear, a repair bill isn’t your biggest issue. If you fail to get away using snow-leopard then that is your fault for being bad.

I understand your frustration as it took me w while to find the build that works, IMO your entire post is incorrect here watch this……

The guardian has absurd tankyness and self healing if you build for it, but they do suffer from relatively poor mobility. Its a tradeoff I’m willing to accept because I like to be able to take hits.

Very nice video!
For vs ranger part, I think if you use torch as off-hand instead shield, it won’t take you that long to get him down.

StugLyfe.2134:

I understand your frustration as it took me w while to find the build that works, IMO your entire post is incorrect here watch this……

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRqCbSrNaWg

Torch is too easy to dodge, most guardians only use a s sceptor/shield for walls but IMO this setup is why I never loose 1v1 or 2v1 fights. Torch is fine but it goes better with a 1h sword meditaion build imo. You will never land torch on a good pvp’r for more then 2 ticks.

As far as mobility goes the only classes that can escape me are Thief and Elementist, the rest i can run down with my perma swiftness, GS skills and Scepter imobilize or Shield KB/AOE

Other professions need mobility to survive — we don’t. Sure, we can’t chase-down enemies, or run away very well, but that’s not terribly important (to me, at least) for objectives in WvW. If they’re running, then we’ve succeeded in a task; if I need to run, instead, then we’ve probably failed overall.

Perhaps it’s an issue with how you approach combat as a Guardian? I enjoy providing support, and delaying or distracting the enemy as much as possible —- and I don’t go down easily under most circumstances. I rush, fall-back for cool-downs when necessary, and repeat. The only moment I consider absolute retreat is when my inevitable death would serve no purpose, or when my survival would better benefit the group.

I’ve never seen another profession manage this on the battlefield — at least not to the same degree. If others have stories to tell otherwise, however, I’d enjoy the read (if I check this again).

Personally, as a Guardian I only have trouble escaping if I am outplayed.
I run Scepter/Focus and Hammer, don’t usually switch to anything else, ever.

H3 has a bind, though you need to be facing your enemy to use it. It’s helpful if you can see the need to escape early.
H5 is a wall that your enemies will have to run around if they want to chase you.
Scepter 3 is a bind that you can cast on the move as long as you have line of sight. I can’t count the number of times I have use auto target while trucking away from a group and used Scepter 3 on an invader that I can’t even see on my screen.
Focus 4 is a blind, can’t remember if I am able to cast this behind me like S3, but a miss is a miss.

This is where things get fun, if you have scepter you have 5-6 aegises at your disposal. Your virtue of courage passive blocks one attack. Pop Focus 5, blocks the next three incoming attacks (within the time limit of course). “Retreat” ulility skill gives you another Aegis plus a speed boost. Finally you have the virtue active which blocks ANOTHER attack. Dont’ forget the Elite “renewed focus” which grants you 3 seconds of invulerability on the move, and recharges your virtues giving you ANOTHER 1-2 aegis.

For utility slots, slot in “Stand Your ground” which gives you five seconds of stability, and “Save Yourselves” which grants you a butt ton of boons and is also a stun breaker.

All this plus Virtue of Resolve and Signet of Resolve for healing, I personally rarely have no problem escaping.

Edit: Sure, I don’t do much damage, but the Guardian doesn’t do enough burst damage anyhow to spec for damage in WvW IMO. I usually make my focus following groups of people around, then lock down enemies and let the spike damage/DPSers take them down.

I rely on a similar set of shouts, but have been using “Hold the Line” over “Retreat”. I greatly miss the extra speed-boost (still have Staff though), but I believe the (group) damage-reduction and healing provides a higher benefit. If I’m getting hit by 4-5+ — which is often — then one block won’t help me as much. ;P

LordGustoff.3752:

Personally, as a Guardian I only have trouble escaping if I am outplayed.
I run Scepter and Hammer, don’t usually switch to anything else, ever.

H3 has a bind, though you need to be facing your enemy to use it. It’s helpful if you can see the need to escape early.
H5 is a wall that your enemies will have to run around if they want to chase you.
Scepter 3 is a bind that you can cast on the move as long as you have line of sight. I can’t count the number of times I have use auto target while trucking away from a group and used Scepter 3 on an invader that I can’t even see on my screen.
Scepter 4 is a blind, can’t remember if I am able to cast this behind me like S3, but a miss is a miss.

This is where things get fun, if you have scepter you have 5-6 aegises at your disposal. Your virtue of courage passive blocks one attack. Pop S5, blocks the next three incoming attacks (within the time limit of course). “Retreat” ulility skill gives you another Aegis plus a speed boost. Finally you have the virtue active which blocks ANOTHER attack. Dont’ forget the Elite “renewed focus” which grants you 3 seconds of invulerability on the move, and recharges your virtues giving you ANOTHER 1-2 aegis.

For utility slots, slot in “Stand Your ground” which gives you five seconds of stability, and “Save Yourselves” which grants you a butt ton of boons and is also a stun breaker.

All this plus Virtue of Resolve and Signet of Resolve for healing, I personally rarely have no problem escaping.

Edit: Sure, I don’t do much damage, but the Guardian doesn’t do enough burst damage anyhow to spec for damage in WvW IMO. I usually make my focus following groups of people around, then lock down enemies and let the spike damage/DPSers take them down.

Scepter has no 4 and 5. What offhand are you using?

BladeBraverBureba.1052:

LordGustoff.3752:

Personally, as a Guardian I only have trouble escaping if I am outplayed.
I run Scepter and Hammer, don’t usually switch to anything else, ever.

H3 has a bind, though you need to be facing your enemy to use it. It’s helpful if you can see the need to escape early.
H5 is a wall that your enemies will have to run around if they want to chase you.
Scepter 3 is a bind that you can cast on the move as long as you have line of sight. I can’t count the number of times I have use auto target while trucking away from a group and used Scepter 3 on an invader that I can’t even see on my screen.
Scepter 4 is a blind, can’t remember if I am able to cast this behind me like S3, but a miss is a miss.

This is where things get fun, if you have scepter you have 5-6 aegises at your disposal. Your virtue of courage passive blocks one attack. Pop S5, blocks the next three incoming attacks (within the time limit of course). “Retreat” ulility skill gives you another Aegis plus a speed boost. Finally you have the virtue active which blocks ANOTHER attack. Dont’ forget the Elite “renewed focus” which grants you 3 seconds of invulerability on the move, and recharges your virtues giving you ANOTHER 1-2 aegis.

For utility slots, slot in “Stand Your ground” which gives you five seconds of stability, and “Save Yourselves” which grants you a butt ton of boons and is also a stun breaker.

All this plus Virtue of Resolve and Signet of Resolve for healing, I personally rarely have no problem escaping.

Edit: Sure, I don’t do much damage, but the Guardian doesn’t do enough burst damage anyhow to spec for damage in WvW IMO. I usually make my focus following groups of people around, then lock down enemies and let the spike damage/DPSers take them down.

Scepter has no 4 and 5. What offhand are you using?

Whoops, I am using a Focus for my offhand. Better go fix that.

I dont know where people are getting this myth that guardian is sturdy tanky blabla lol. I can make any class in gw2 a tier or two above our survivabilty. Maybe its cause we are forced to build survivability and cant enjoy a full dps build like many other classes. Try beserker set on a guardian and someone else and youll see a difference instantly. We are just forced to compensate with gear and traits for the lack of escape. So we can live a sec longer and maybe just maybe get away. Well maybe doesnt count.
There is not a single skill in the guardian arsenal that can compare to clones, hide, ride lightning, mist form, groundtarget teleport, real damage imunity, dashing, triple health bars, and the simplest of all: real range weapons so u aint upfront first to be targeted.

CRabbit:
Tome of courage? lol does it make u immune to conditions and stunns? No. I tested it a while ago and no it doesnt make escaping any easier. We can heal all we want it just prolongs death nothing else.

Christos de Soufre:
Dont have to even be inside a group. Once targeted we have the hardest time of gettin the hell off their menu unlike mesmer or thief who can just remove that aggro.

Phoebe Ascension:
We can cure all those conditons all day long. Iv used all u suggested and the conditions are just gettin reapplied. We dont have enough hp or tank to react to all that in time. I can purge everything off me with shout and then what. Iv made it a few more meters but everythings on cd.

cannons:
Totaly agree it might be the best thing lol altho i havent done it yet xD

Archer:
Its not the teams fault the game mechanics allow most of them to gtfo while we are deprived of that.
Once ppl start backing off which is a human reaction to danger their focus is off the pushing forward and that means dead guardian since we cant retreat as well.
I dont fail to escape once i manage to transform to snowleopard and hide. Once im stealth im 1600 range away and this clearly shows we lack those skills race wise and class wise too since only norn has it. But since it has a cast time it gets interupted most of teh time while everyone is smackin me so i go down.

StugLyfe
That video doesnt show me anything lol sorry man. You fought a ranger whos in as bad shape as we are in the development when it comes to escape. You fought an elementalist who could have at any time kited you with his skills but chose to stay and fight. Most of them didnt wanna run but had a choice numerous times. I could go on disecting your video and i honestly dont see anything impressive in it. You even died to a zerg while some other class would get away wich just proves my point more. Nice music tho I’ve achived crazier stuff than your whole video (downed 5 ppl at once, broke a 50man zerg alone multiple times and lived and so on) but it doesnt cut it in the long run. Mechanics>me

One video can not picture a solution to what iv experienced in 4 months. I leveld the guardian in wvwvw from 20 to 80 for peets sake. I’v got close to 9k kills playin 2-3 hours a day and been in t1 and t2 servers since release. Its not some low population low skill pve servers we talkin bout here. In the end i got fed up of dieing and watchin others escape easly cause some developer decided we shud be like a turtle. I felt like if i was on a different class i would not now be on teh floor. I’v played my friends thief, elementalist and warrior to know what they are capable of. Unbelievably easy to survive situations where a guardian is doomed. I suggest you either watch or try out other classes in wvwv and see whats up.

LordGustoff.3752:

BladeBraverBureba.1052:

LordGustoff.3752:

Personally, as a Guardian I only have trouble escaping if I am outplayed.
I run Scepter and Hammer, don’t usually switch to anything else, ever.

H3 has a bind, though you need to be facing your enemy to use it. It’s helpful if you can see the need to escape early.
H5 is a wall that your enemies will have to run around if they want to chase you.
Scepter 3 is a bind that you can cast on the move as long as you have line of sight. I can’t count the number of times I have use auto target while trucking away from a group and used Scepter 3 on an invader that I can’t even see on my screen.
Scepter 4 is a blind, can’t remember if I am able to cast this behind me like S3, but a miss is a miss.

This is where things get fun, if you have scepter you have 5-6 aegises at your disposal. Your virtue of courage passive blocks one attack. Pop S5, blocks the next three incoming attacks (within the time limit of course). “Retreat” ulility skill gives you another Aegis plus a speed boost. Finally you have the virtue active which blocks ANOTHER attack. Dont’ forget the Elite “renewed focus” which grants you 3 seconds of invulerability on the move, and recharges your virtues giving you ANOTHER 1-2 aegis.

For utility slots, slot in “Stand Your ground” which gives you five seconds of stability, and “Save Yourselves” which grants you a butt ton of boons and is also a stun breaker.

All this plus Virtue of Resolve and Signet of Resolve for healing, I personally rarely have no problem escaping.

Edit: Sure, I don’t do much damage, but the Guardian doesn’t do enough burst damage anyhow to spec for damage in WvW IMO. I usually make my focus following groups of people around, then lock down enemies and let the spike damage/DPSers take them down.

Scepter has no 4 and 5. What offhand are you using?

Whoops, I am using a Focus for my offhand. Better go fix that.

If it’s blind like he states he’s using scepter/focus lol no wonder he is having issues. This isn’t a class issues it’s a player skill/knowledge issue. I am going to just say now if you had a hard time with Guardian you will fail much harder at Elementist or just end up being a Staff ele, which is fine but don’t say it’s not a skill/knowledge issue when it obviously is.

StugLyfe.2134:

LordGustoff.3752:

BladeBraverBureba.1052:

LordGustoff.3752:

Personally, as a Guardian I only have trouble escaping if I am outplayed.
I run Scepter and Hammer, don’t usually switch to anything else, ever.

H3 has a bind, though you need to be facing your enemy to use it. It’s helpful if you can see the need to escape early.
H5 is a wall that your enemies will have to run around if they want to chase you.
Scepter 3 is a bind that you can cast on the move as long as you have line of sight. I can’t count the number of times I have use auto target while trucking away from a group and used Scepter 3 on an invader that I can’t even see on my screen.
Scepter 4 is a blind, can’t remember if I am able to cast this behind me like S3, but a miss is a miss.

This is where things get fun, if you have scepter you have 5-6 aegises at your disposal. Your virtue of courage passive blocks one attack. Pop S5, blocks the next three incoming attacks (within the time limit of course). “Retreat” ulility skill gives you another Aegis plus a speed boost. Finally you have the virtue active which blocks ANOTHER attack. Dont’ forget the Elite “renewed focus” which grants you 3 seconds of invulerability on the move, and recharges your virtues giving you ANOTHER 1-2 aegis.

For utility slots, slot in “Stand Your ground” which gives you five seconds of stability, and “Save Yourselves” which grants you a butt ton of boons and is also a stun breaker.

All this plus Virtue of Resolve and Signet of Resolve for healing, I personally rarely have no problem escaping.

Edit: Sure, I don’t do much damage, but the Guardian doesn’t do enough burst damage anyhow to spec for damage in WvW IMO. I usually make my focus following groups of people around, then lock down enemies and let the spike damage/DPSers take them down.

Scepter has no 4 and 5. What offhand are you using?

Whoops, I am using a Focus for my offhand. Better go fix that.

If it’s blind like he states he’s using scepter/focus lol no wonder he is having issues. This isn’t a class issues it’s a player skill/knowledge issue. I am going to just say now if you had a hard time with Guardian you will fail much harder at Elementist or just end up being a Staff ele, which is fine but don’t say it’s not a skill/knowledge issue when it obviously is.

Its not me saying that. Reread thread please. Oh and fyi im survining way better on a lvl 14 ele now in situations where i would hit the floor on guardian lol.

Here ill quote a dude from another thread since i tend to rant and do walls of texts. He put it very shortly and to the point. Took me 4 months to accept this fact:

“Here is the root of all issues w/ Guardian:
- You have to spec 0/0/30/15/0 for any kind of survivability.
Reason being, Survivability is our ‘Escape’: A poor one at that becasue the reality is it just prolongs death unless you’re fighting near a keep/tower to run into.
The point is this: Other classes inherently have escape mechinicsm in thier weapon skills or attached to thier weapon skills.
This could be in the form of Stealth, Blinks, Slows/Roots/Imob, Charges, Invulnerables etc.
The key to these is the majority of other classes ~do not have to have an enemy targeted to use this abilities~.
You truely need to be the Agressor with the Guardian. Even with the Scepter (which is bad, but not as bad when you start using in within 600r), you need to be in thier face, not at 900+.
The class does not do good/great (it does ok, i guess) with Full Zerker Gear/Jewelry and any for of x/x/0/0/x build. Glass Cannon build = Dead on Sight. There is ZERO escaping and outside of killing all.”

I don’t know why you had to write this in the Guardian forums lol. If you wanted to roll an ele just write it on their threads about how fun/good it is. This doesn’t add value to the Guardian forums what so ever. Also, no offense, but the utilities are there to manage yourself in WvW both on the 1v1 side and zerg side. Escaping / Catching up has been a debate for Guardians for awhile and its really up to player skill, the potential is there, it’s just a lot stricter for us; if you want to have a class that’s fits you better, then good for you. But trying to shrug things off and arguing back isn’t going to doing anything. It doesn’t seem to me like you want any advice at all and there are sooo many situations to consider when you post these claims. I’ve done WvW several times and have yet to run into these problems. And the conditions you say they reapply over and over…Are you fighting an army? Or are you talking about 1 person. Cause against other classes, they do NOT have as much access to blind/aegis as us which in fact can cancel out condition proc. Let alone the 2 dodges we have, and if you would take some advice from the Guardian forums, the usefulness of Shelter (infinite block for 2-3 secs) and renewed focus; only move that makes you invulnerable to my knowledge.

Edit: and to your problem of escape. Learning how to escape with a Guardian is a skill in itself. We don’t have many options, I’ll give you that, but it’s possible. No need to hate on Guardians given that survivability isn’t based solely on being able to escape. Hopefully you’d be able to fight your ground most of the time.

Its just a heads up to new or current guardians. Something to think about. So yea i thought it shud be in the Guardian forum.

And yea u’re right there is no advice to hear. I’v tested everything like i said. I just cant mimic survivability of the majority of classes no mather what i tried. I based my expectations on the “no holy trinity” as in all classes can perform same but i guess it aint so. You say its allot stricter for us. Why guardian of all the classes -.-

Ofcourse iv fought an army with an army on my side. T1 and T2 are liek that. I can roam in a group too. Same end if teh kitten hits teh fan.

Are you telling me i should settle for mediocrity and pray for luck most of the time cause of a class choice in a game that states it shud be even? How bout i tell you we are overnerfed in wvwvw. Theres proof to this statement as sword flashing blade like i said had ground target before and we had more base hp.
This is why ppl complain bout warriors and thiefs. They havent done a thing to their survivability since beta. This is why i hear daily that D/D elementalist is teh only way to play the class. Cause it can survive!

I know you do not want to here it but you are not doing it right. No matter what class you play you will feel this strain until you figure it out. Mabey the classes play style just isn’t you or your spec/gear setup is messed up or you’re not using the right food etc. Anyway If you would post details of your spec/gear it would help, a Stat pic would also help.

V/R m8 but i will stick by what I said before if you’re strggling with guardian you are going through your pc out the window playing an ele.

Why are you making me repeat my self? You seem to be missing my point completely or are inexperienced with situations iv been in. Or my walls of text are too big and not clear enough and i lack words to explain all iv been through.

There is no gear or stats or build to post. Iv spent over 100g++ (hell if not 200g now i think about it wich is sad) with every type of gear for a good period of time. As in i have owned every heavy armor and trinkets you can equip as a guardian with every rune and sigil known to man. With every posible combo of stats from gear and traits and skills and weapons. Nothing can mimic other classes survival skills.

Iv had 2500-3500 armor, 11-25k hp, 2k to 4500 attack, 4% to 100+% crit rate, 0 to 120% crit dmg, from 0 to up to 2000 condition dmg in various mixes or all out on one stat. As in full knights or a mix of knights valkirie or a mix of bezerker valkierie and so on. Prolly burned 10 gold just reseting my traits lol. Iv also tested every food thats worth testing. Even the 100% downstate food thinkin well maybe this will help since i know ill be downed haha.

Iv seen and tested every posible mix but no nothin gives me escape.

I’v had good results with valkirie for semi tanky good dmg, i’v had good resaults with power toughness vit sets super tank but lower dmg. Iv had best experience with rune of melandru and rune of hoelbrak for 20 to 25% less condition duration and -40% condition duration food so i dont get immobilized for 5-10 seconds when cd’s are all on. Rune of earth was also pretty nice too.

After all the playstyles iv come to the conclusion we lack hp wich got nerfed from what it was originally planed and we lack a blink or a teleport that doesnt require a target.

Both of these “fixes” or “un-nerfs” would make me not be here regretting wasting time on this class and instead getting the hell out of danger like all other classes. I’v witnessed these situations too many times where my friends or other ppl would get away and i always die cause of my battle presence as a guardian.

My message to all guardians is i do love this class to death as it shines in allot of parts of the game but be ready to die allot more than everyone else no mather what you try your death statistic will be high. I dont care bout your skill lvl you cant fight game mechanics.

Oh and iv played a lvl 80 ele with the right setup and its a mile different in survivability than a guardian. Same stats, better range and unstopable movement. Also played thief and warrior but didnt like the style, loved the survivability tho.

Why are you so fixated on escaping? To me that seems to be the underlying problem. With a guardian you have to be creative with escaping. Unless your enemy can remove conditions, use stability and run like the wind

p.s: you speak as if what you say is objective… your opinion is subjective. be open to what people have to say, otherwise you’re being closed minded (being egotistical is very negative)

Is this thread some sort of a joke played on all Guardians?
The only class that I can allow myself to go all out in zergs and OP calls it “worst”????

First, clearly you’re so fixated on playing one style at a time without changing util’s / weapons sets depending on the given situation.
Plus, it appears you are lacking the ability to read the flow of battle and awareness to your surroundings.

And I’ll elaborate….
Your whole post already shoots itself in the foot by combining the words “flee” + "
Guardian" at the same context.
In 1v1 you don’t flee, you stay and there shouldn’t be any class that can bring you down if you prepared yourself beforehand with the right weapons and utils (requires practice, I normally change my weapons based on the terrain rather than class involved)
In zergs you take both your GS and hammer and unleash everything smack in the middle of it, I won’t even get to what skills use first and last. If you can’t figure out that much from the very few options we have then you shouldn’t play Guardian to begin with.
You can dominate a whole zerg with WoR and spirit shield (untraited!!!!)
“Stand your ground” makes sure you don’t get screwed with CC.
Can carry “Save yourselves” if you feel like staying for a while in there.
As was mentioned before – Altruistic healing along with popping all the virtues + RF elite will provide you another great escape towards your own zerg.

But seriously, above all I’d rather play a class that is very hard to take down and deal great damage at the same time.
I don’t like to say this but it sounds like a strong case of a person that was given the gear and tools, and expecting them to do the work for him.

Do learn how to use them as well.

I am done trying to help you i looked up your posts and all are negative. You are not a good player and never will be because you know it all and no amount of gold can will change that m8. IMO you are very clueless about our class. I think Gw2 is just not your game.

You are grossly exaggerating and putting all of your focus on the downsides of the Guardian class and ignore any good point made against your view.

Each class has strengths, weaknesses and general purposes and each particular build further defines the type of character you’re playing. Guardians are very strong in a supporting role while being very durable and dealing meaningful damage. The downside to this is it’s rather limited mobility and lack of high burst.

The problem you seem to be having is not being able to get out of already lost battles and/or fighting big zergs with inferior numbers. Maybe you need to choose your battles more wisely and/or group with different people. It’s probably also a good idea to change your philosophy of the class, the Guardian is not a one man army that can do everything all of the other classes can do. None of the other classes can do that either, you’ll only be disappointed if you will try to play like that. There is no ‘holy trinity’ in this game but there are very defined roles that classes can fulfill, whether that is roaming, bursting, utility (healing/supporting/controlling), front line fighting and so on, I found the Guardian to be most useful with their group utility, front line control and durability. A D/D Elementalist is clearly more of a roamer type of character for example. While there are a lot of similarities in their role, they have completely different approaches to try and achieve that.

I think we play on the same server (Seafarer’s Rest) and I spoken with you briefly this afternoon, but I do not have the same problems you are having. You need to change your view and attitude because it’s all negative and you will only feel bad and frustrated if you go on like this. Perhaps the Guardian isn’t your class, roll something else but don’t blame it on the class being bad, but on the way you want to play the game and the Guardian not being able to fulfill that role.

Get off. Guardians are bloody OP in WvW atm. You seriously need a nerf. Theives don’t scare me, mesmers don’t scare me. Only guardians. Somehow you guys with some certain build can burst me down fsater than any theif. And With all the guardians innate survivability you can’t be killed either. Stop whining about guardians. You guys are OP atm. Enjoy it.

First off, if you have issues with a class, trying to tell everyone how horrible the class is and to not play it is not the right thing to do. Just because you personally do not like the playstyle of the class does not mean someone else would not enjoy it. Reroll another class and move on if guardian is not your cup of tea and keep the complaining to something constructive.

Second, why would you ever try to to run as a guardian in the first place. Guardians get most of their survivability through attacking not by fleeing like a thief or ele has to do. It is a completely different style of play. It is also one that does encourage gorilla tactics when facing zergs. Guardians have very good survivability over a certain amount of time, once that time is up, (generally if you have exhausted your virtue use/elite skills) you do what you need to to get out of harms way, which is generally running into the middle of your zerg. If someone follows then they will most likely die, so mission accomplished. If you are overextending into the enemy zerg you are going to die regardless of what class you are, as there are limitations on every ability, even those of mesmers, thieves and eles.

It honestly sounds like you expected an OP class with extreme mobility, extreme damage, and extreme survivability all in one, which just does not happen in this game. you have to sacrifice one or two of those to achieve the other, or balance them so you have decent mobility, decent survivability, and decent damage but not a god of all three.

I read the thread for about 10 seconds:

My conclusion: It’s not the class, it’s the player. OP, find a class that works for your playstyle because Guardian doesn’t. Don’t expect to play any class, mold it to how you like to play and be successful. That last statement is true for any MMO with a class-based character development system. Make a sign and put it on your desk.

And this is totally why im a glass cannon guardian in WvW….
Well as glass cannon as a guardian can get anyway…..

Since were pure meelee dps, we end up taking most of the fire most of the time.

The trick is to have enough damage to waltz into the zerg and be able to deal a significant amount of damage in a short timeframe before you get focuse fired.

Compare with a more tanky set up which does half the damage i do.

With burst build i prob need 3-4 seconds inside a zerg to do something significant.
With tanky builds i need twice the amount of time to do the same thing.

3-4 seconds in a zerg = most people havent tabbed you out yet due to the element of surprise.. ( Judges intervention works wonders, there is no counter to it you blink in instantly, with the element of surprise, you would probably have finished your job before your opponents have reacted.)

if your a more tanky build you will likely need 6-8 seconds to do the same damage. And it gives too much time for your target and the zerg to react to you. Your target will heal up, and the zerg will have targetted you out by now. And that extra tankiness isnt going to save you when 10 people are shooting at you really. As youve explained in your post.

While i do not advocate more offensive builds over tanky builds in WvW. Tanky builds seems to favor larger more coordinated groups for backup and support for it to be effective. It should be pretty great when you have multiple meelee charging in at the same time to divert the attention which is where tanky builds will more likely shine.

For me and what is likely the situation of the OP. You are probably charging into the zerg solo. And this is where an offensive build shines.

Sometimes the old saying is true.

Offense is the best defense.

Like my motto with thieves. Dead thieves do no damage. You mitigate more thief damage by killing him more than any amount of toughness.

The same works against the zerg.

By killing my target in 3-4 seconds instead of 8 seconds. I dont need to suffer from the extra 4 seconds of concentrated fire from 10 people. Arguably im probably more survivable than a tanky person because i expose myself to open fire from 10 people much less than them.

Its pretty much blink in > kill someone in 5 seconds > get out before everyone knows what happened > profit

The problem with melee classes is there’s too many ranged classes. That’s it really. The two real melee classes are Guardian and Warrior. They get caught in the middle while the range lines move back and forth trying to damage the other line and kill the hapless melee in the middle without being killed themselves.

That’s why melee have such a low survival rate. They should have made more melee classes to fight the melee battle instead of plink plinking at a distance.

I don’t know I have a fairly easy time escaping with a guardian myself if I want to.

Mostly it just comes down to a high amount of vitality and toughness (yet I can still deal a decent amount of damage), along with survival skills such as condition removal, swiftness, invulnerability, the blocking healing skill, warding and wall of reflection.

Once you have to run, the greatsword skill Leap of Faith gives you a nice headstart on your opposition, as long as you don’t target the enemy with it. After hitting switfness and a couple of other skills they have no real chance of catching up.

Today I beat a group 4 on 1 because they simply could not get me down. I enjoy the fights too much to usually run away though but I’ve never had any broken equipment running with a guardian. It’s just too survivable when used correctly.

Icarius.2189:

The problem with melee classes is there’s too many ranged classes. That’s it really. The two real melee classes are Guardian and Warrior. They get caught in the middle while the range lines move back and forth trying to damage the other line and kill the hapless melee in the middle without being killed themselves.

That’s why melee have such a low survival rate. They should have made more melee classes to fight the melee battle instead of plink plinking at a distance.

Can’t do WvW without WoR or Spirit Shield.
I do wonder how Warriors survive though the ranged spam while fleeing or inside a zerg.

I suppose a good recap of this entire thing is..

OP: I am unable to play the Guardian class with its top tier gear because I spent monies on it. I have more fun on my low level Elementalist.

OP: I spent 100+ gold switching out armor, weapons, accessories. I was not aware of a PVP function in GW2 that allows trait switching and equipment stat swapping for free.

OP: I’ve tried to press the buttons on my keyboard many times to survive. But I am unable. I tried all of the buttons. All of them.

OP: I want all of the newer generation Guardians to know this, to save themselves the agony of defeat if they lack proper skill but have a good amount of money.

Only guys that get it somewhat is Icarius and Icc lol. I like your agressive approach Icc and i did love full on dmg of guardians with teh correct items altho its sad we cant get away as easy as other classes.

The rest of you are on about 1vs1 and other stuff wich is not even connected to what i’ve said so far. Please read more carefully and slowly or dont read at all.

Where have i said i have issues of escaping in 1v1? Where have i said i want to escape from a 1v1. Hell i dont need to escape from a 1v1 cause people run from me or i die trying if the person has more skill than me. In that case im ok with death. Its anoying that ppl can easly kite away but what ever its 1v1. They run i win.

I am however not ok from dieng to mechanics and lack of escape skills in a class that obviously needs one. I expect it to have since all other classes can escape in very effective ways.

Horheristo and mrauls
why should we not be able to flee like the rest of them? Just cause we’re melee at times we are not cannon fodder! Why are you so freakin OK with death lol?? If others have it easier getting away dont you ask your self: where is my right of escape? I sure do when i see 4 members of my party get away from 10 enemies while i say “save your selfs” and hit the floor -.-

Bash
Lemme quote you:
“It honestly sounds like you expected an OP class with extreme mobility, extreme damage, and extreme survivability all in one, which just does not happen in this game.”
Ever seen what thiefs do? They are exaccly what u said. But ya thats ok. Balanced.

A melee based thief or warrior can rush in a split second and down a person fininsh and gtfo while 50 enemies around have no clue what happend. Elementalist can dance around 50 ppl and get away, Mesmer pops clones kills someone with clones and pops hide and vanishes. Warrior can carry gs or hammer and switch to range at any time.
They get 0 battle focus on them due to mechanics and do their stuff and get away. Necro has fear has 3 freakin healthbars to kite away with and huge range to not even be in the dangerzone at all. Rangers aswell can deal dmg from afar.

Guardian aint lacking in dmg or aoe cc or what not. Its godlike realy its what made me fall in love with the class.
It lacks range and a panic button while every other class gets that from the headstart. That is called " a lack of something that others have plenty" not “the OP is playing the class wrong” lol I want the same choices for Guardian that every other class has.

Nalar
Ya im on seafarers and u prolly saw my rage text in Map chat lol. I’ll quote what you said there to be clear: "The problem you seem to be having is not being able to get out of already lost battles and/or fighting big zergs with inferior numbers. "
This is pretty much a big problem as in these exact situations other classes around me get away. Even killin 2-3 and then poof gone. While my choice is either stand back and watch and support or go in push then say goodnight. See the problem? Fair? I think not.
I live the push when a team is sufficient enough to support my push and follow but since the majority is ranged classes they just stand there and watch me burn. Thank god seafarers so organized and ballsy i can expect backup more than any other server i’ve been on.

I dont think ill be dissapointed playing other classes cause iv played other classes and seen other classes be played this way. Im not makin stuff up i’ve witnessed these situations on numerous occasions. Im not theorycrafting i know how this stuff works since iv tested it on friends accounts.

I built my guardian as a healer and a tank, Im always the last gal standing amongst my friends. Mace+shield+shouts=ftw

It’s not that we don’t get it bro but that we don’t get players that refuse to l2p. No class can 1v1 me, hell most can’t 2v1 me period except for a very geared and very good Pistol/dagger thief … that’s the only class that even makes me think. I feel very usefull in groups because i swap my traits out and weps to be more effective. I carry 6 weps when I WvW, 2 sets of jewels etc. If you can’t get that it isn’t the game it’s the player then GL with any other class because we wil be reading " Stopped playing ele in WVW. This is why" in a month.

We have no survivability? im running 0/5/30/30/5 build and I don’t even have a proper set of tanky gear (mixture of power condition and toughness) and I can EASILY last atleast 10+ seconds thanks to AH/focused/blocks and the blinds from justice. Also as a tankish support we aren’t ment to deal TONS of damage we are ment to be the frontline for the squishies to deal the damage. You obviously don’t understand how our class is supposed to work

Mesmers and thieves don’t get away when near me, binding blades into a ring of warding or a signet lockdown promises they die. If people around the person don’t recognize the thief that just owned their friend it isn’t the fault of the class, its the fault of the person controlling the class. and if you are asking for get out of jail free mechanics we honestly have alot.

5 point trait in the vitality line gives us vigor on crit, ensuring we have tons of dodge rolls, renewed focus makes us immune for 3 seconds, and also refreshes aegis which auto blocks an attack and allows you to block another. judges intervention can be used on any acceptable target, which includes critters. there is also ring of warding and line of warding to block off hallways to stop people from getting to you.

As i said before, you seem to want everything built into the gaurdian class but that is unrealistic. If a thief gets caught, they die. if a mesmer gets caught, they die. If a guardian gets caught they are not going to get blown up like other classes and still have a fighting chance. (assuming you aren’t a glass cannon spec)

you are right OP guardians are lame, you should try Necro or the new Mesmer1.4

(jump on these professions forums and see the difference between threads; mesmer and necros are filled with complains and bugged traits their list of bugged traits is a shame for ANet, and now look the guardian one… .see the difference?)

way to ruin your point op about 1v1 dominance. whine more if you always win, tho i doubt it. Anet should allow duels then we could see this guy and all the classes in action.

Hostility.4961:

Only guys that get it somewhat is Icarius and Icc lol. I like your agressive approach Icc and i did love full on dmg of guardians with teh correct items altho its sad we cant get away as easy as other classes.

My point exactely, you ignore the good points being made and you are all negative.

I wish you the best of luck in finding a different class and I hope you will adjust your attitude and way of seeying things and stop being so kitten negative. Move on, you’re just looking for confirmation that it is not you but the class you’re playing and that’s not the case

I never have a problem doing WvW as a Guardian. Better yet: I love it
I usually take 1-10 folks down before going down myself on average.

My ONLY problem:
In the large zergs where everyone is doing mass AoE damage? I can’t get close enough to use my Greatsword; yet how to counter it? Staff + Scepter, Talisman. I Switch to a more supporting role. Stopping enemies from retreating and keeping my allies alive is more important to me then making a “Kill”. Once i blast my Empower inbetween our zerg? It might only heal 2k damage. Multiply that for multiple players and suddenly the skill is very nice to use. If I feel like dealing some damage? Switch to Scepter, Talisman combo and fire away.

Also setting up Ballista’s and arrow carts in the back gives us a better defensive position and will allow you to still make these “Kills”. Then again I doubt any class will survive long in the middle of an enemy Zerg; Guardian will even outlast most classes if you ever find yourself in the middle of this situation.

It’s WvW not “Every man for himself”. WvW requires teamwork. I consider myself to be the first to step in to battle and the last to get out. If I need to sacrifice myself to let even 1 teammate escape the enemy zerg it’s worth it, that does not mean that I won’t go down fighting however. I will drag every enemy with me and as many I can. Ofcourse I will get away if I can if death can be avoided. I will first make sure that my teammates are safe. Sometimes this means doing a “Gandalf”(Line of Warding) with my staff blocking off Corridors (Shouting “You shall NOT pass!” in my mind)

Once the numbers of the enemies are a bit less I switch to a “hit and run” tactic with my Greatsword using my staff as secondary for the extra speed boost on the “run” part (Heal up, and get back into combat). Using whirling wrath, binding blade and Purging Flames will do tons of damage if you have a couple of enemies around you. Once you’re in an enemy group as a guardian you’ll notice the enemy spreads out as nobody ever wants to take damage (E.g. Survive). Making them spread out makes the enemy more vulnerable as a group and thus let my teammates pick them off 1 by 1 until there are none left.

Due to this strategy I’ve made some great friends in WvW whom will protect me and I will protect them the best I can. The other day we were in the tunnels at the dredges and held off a 50+ Zerg with 10 man! Once our zerg arrived from the back we had a classic “Hammer and Anvil” strategy set up and smashed the enemy zerg into our tiny anvil.

You need to see WvW as a whole. Sorry to say this OP but Guardians are natural leaders. Once people see us jumping into the fray with weapons drawn; teammates will follow and assist(I’m not talking about suicide situations, although I have even survived quite a few of those).

Your post (if anything) will be an example to new Guardians how not to play the class. You are a sad example of a Guardian thinking that “New or different Gear” will make you a better(Skilled) player. I highly suggest you play a different class which might suit your needs and playstyle better. Just reading your post makes me shake my head.

Luckily this post also proves that there are plenty of other Guardians whom do know how to play our class. I look forward to seeing these people in WvW even though we are likely not to be on the same server. It will be an epic battle to be remembered. Fellow Guardians, I tip my helmet to thee

so, you stopped playing a Guardian in WvW because you can’t escape a fight? And you’re bragging on this thread and saying that people should stop playing Guardians because YOU can’t escape a fight?

This thread should be closed, like right now ^^

or maybe it’s a joke, I don’t know….

Well at first i was playing a offence guardian build and i would die often. Really starting to hate the guardian. But then i switched my role to keeping the Commander alive (like a personal guard). And my god. Yeah i don’t have big damaging numbers like others but i m alway’s the last one standing on my feet.
Even fighting against a Thief and veteran i will win the fight with 80% of my hp pool.

And the fun you can have with a guardian in WvWvW is amazing. Trait so you can ground target wall of reflection. Find the enemy guardian, Put wall of reflection in front of him and his teammates will think is that wall of reflection from there guardian, roll back and enjoy the high numbers you see

This is a plain rant of someone who’s not happy on his guardian toon. No one can can say to anyone what to do and what not to do. This is a game full of discoveries. It’s up to the player if he wants to play a melee like a guardian or not. Just because you can’t escape from a fight solo to 20man zerg doesn’t mean to tell anyone that guardian is a fail class and no one should start a guardian clas. Players have their own preference. If you think that your 4 months of studying and still you can’t improve your guardian doesn’t mean you fail. Remember this is just a game and you can do whatever you want as long as you have time and gold. Just my honest opinion on the topic.

Never had trouble retreating/being mobile as a guardian in WvW. Been playing mine since release. Sounds like OP is just bad; there’s nothing wrong with being bad but please don’t steer others away from playing guardian because you are.