Guild Wars 2

EnRohbi.2187:

JonPeters.5630:

It has always had a delay, I am investigating if the delay somehow got changed. If someone has good raw data on the old damage of berserker vs the new damage that will also help me track down where that change came from and fix it.

Thanks,

Jon

I don’t have any data either, unfortunately, I don’t usually record my attack damages on the offchance they might end up bugged and the Devs need my help :P

And I don’t think the Delay on attack has been changed,
It feels exactly the same length it felt back when I was in early levels and had no traits to mitigate it.
I think people just became so accustomed to being able to use Phantasmal Fury to eliminate the delay that it became the norm for the class. I have met very, very few Mesmers (I can think of none) that didn’t use Phantasmal Fury for the delay decrease.

I dont use fury and I feel the delay gotten bigger(near 900hr on Mez, with no fury)

the simply way to fix it can be the not enemy-legated phantasm, so they can evoked as necro pet and don’t die after the enemy’s death..this is the only thing i can imagine to save the class..°°
thk jon 4 follow us and reply anyway..^^

EsLafiel.4517:

EnRohbi.2187:

JonPeters.5630:

It has always had a delay, I am investigating if the delay somehow got changed. If someone has good raw data on the old damage of berserker vs the new damage that will also help me track down where that change came from and fix it.

Thanks,

Jon

I don’t have any data either, unfortunately, I don’t usually record my attack damages on the offchance they might end up bugged and the Devs need my help :P

And I don’t think the Delay on attack has been changed,
It feels exactly the same length it felt back when I was in early levels and had no traits to mitigate it.
I think people just became so accustomed to being able to use Phantasmal Fury to eliminate the delay that it became the norm for the class. I have met very, very few Mesmers (I can think of none) that didn’t use Phantasmal Fury for the delay decrease.

I dont use fury and I feel the delay gotten bigger(near 900hr on Mez, with no fury)

Well, you would likely know better than I.
I had used Phantasmal Fury since about four or five days after Launch so it’s really been quite a while since I’ve used Phantasms without it.

According to an earlier post in this thread, Vengeful Images used to eliminate the delay before attacking too (Never used the trait), any chance you’d been using that before instead of Phantasmal Fury? :P

Madara.3126:

the simply way to fix it can be the not enemy-legated phantasm, so they can evoked as necro pet and don’t die after the enemy’s death..this is the only thing i can imagine to save the class..°°
thk jon 4 follow us and reply anyway..^^

You’d be quite sad if Phantasms did the same amount of damage (let alone the AI problems) of Necro minions.

EnRohbi.2187:

EsLafiel.4517:

EnRohbi.2187:

JonPeters.5630:

It has always had a delay, I am investigating if the delay somehow got changed. If someone has good raw data on the old damage of berserker vs the new damage that will also help me track down where that change came from and fix it.

Thanks,

Jon

I don’t have any data either, unfortunately, I don’t usually record my attack damages on the offchance they might end up bugged and the Devs need my help :P

And I don’t think the Delay on attack has been changed,
It feels exactly the same length it felt back when I was in early levels and had no traits to mitigate it.
I think people just became so accustomed to being able to use Phantasmal Fury to eliminate the delay that it became the norm for the class. I have met very, very few Mesmers (I can think of none) that didn’t use Phantasmal Fury for the delay decrease.

I dont use fury and I feel the delay gotten bigger(near 900hr on Mez, with no fury)

Well, you would likely know better than I.
I had used Phantasmal Fury since about four or five days after Launch so it’s really been quite a while since I’ve used Phantasms without it.

According to an earlier post in this thread, Vengeful Images used to eliminate the delay before attacking too (Never used the trait), any chance you’d been using that before instead of Phantasmal Fury? :P

tank build, so yes without caring much for that i got it auto for doing insp

JonPeters.5630:

It has always had a delay, I am investigating if the delay somehow got changed. If someone has good raw data on the old damage of berserker vs the new damage that will also help me track down where that change came from and fix it.

Thanks,

Jon

It did not have a delay prior to this patch if you had the phantasms have fury trait, it has been mentioned in this forum numerous times that people used that or the retaliation trait to stop the delay.

Problem is that the phantasm’s stand there and do nothing after summon, the berserker is worst effected by this because it is the cripple ability which now no longer works unless people stand still and let it hit them.

I really dont understand how you specifically only have the mesmers abilities be countered TWICE by normal evasion – You blind/block/Los/etc the mesmer and the skill fails, if you mis-time or fail to do so you get a 2nd chance afterwards while the phantasm is summoned and sits there doing sweet FA.

On the very first iBerserker I summoned to test its functionality: The coyote in the WvW borderlands moved out of range and the phantasm whirled from behind the tree and did not hit it at all.

On a subsequent test I noticed the delay in attack: about ~1 second. I’ve not seen a delay in attack as I’ve always given my phantasms fury via trait. This so-called delay since BWE2 has never existed for me until today.

You nerfed my spec. You nerfed it again, and finally you nerfed it into obsolescence. Meanwhile, I still get insta-killed by Thiefs who can’t be caught, and well-played D/D Elementalists are invincible.

After investing hundreds upon hundreds of hours into this class I quite literally feel betrayed. I’m not mad, I’m just disappointed I ever played this game and convinced my friends and family to play it.

I think it is becoming painfully obvious that the person or people who designed the original class and combat mechanics and wrote the code for it is / are no longer at the company.

The bugs in the last few patches that have been introduced smell of people trying to fix code that they don’t really understand.

Each release now they try to fix the fix from the previous release, and break it even more.

Thank you for your continued responses and help Jon!

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

Thiefs can still spam backstab in stealth while blinded or into your aegis/blocks/whatever and not get stealth removed. Why don’t I have multiple chances to evade other classes skills?

JonPeters.5630:

Now if only I could figure out the berserker dmg thing… Worst case scenario I will just try and readjust the numbers based on the new functionality but that is harder because I don’t have the old data. For what it is worth it was not the bladetrail change that messed with this because we locally reverted that and this berserker issue still persisted.

I was getting 400-600 first swing, 700-900 second swing, and 1200-1400 third swing. All three swings would always connect if there was 1 target or 10 targets. Sometimes they still all connect since the problem, and i get just that, but most of the time they seem to just whiff, nothing in the combat log or anything on the screen, its like it just doesnt even exist. You should just make the phantasm cast bladetrail then, or use something that works!!

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

^ THIS! 10.000x THIS! This is exactly what we’d like to see more of. I’m not even talking about the change itself, but about the communication. Jon, this thread was handled exactly as it should’ve been handled. More of this please. Even the grey post worked, where it said that the issue has been forwarded to the team.
Keep at it

rootnode.9546:

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

^ THIS! 10.000x THIS! This is exactly what we’d like to see more of. I’m not even talking about the change itself, but about the communication. Jon, this thread was handled exactly as it should’ve been handled. More of this please. Even the grey post worked, where it said that the issue has been forwarded to the team.
Keep at it

I absolutely agree. Thanks for talking to us and fixing the bug(s)! Btw, I assume the code does not allow for the delay to be even shorter, e.g. 0.1 seconds, right?

JonPeters.5630:

Now if only I could figure out the berserker dmg thing… Worst case scenario I will just try and readjust the numbers based on the new functionality but that is harder because I don’t have the old data. For what it is worth it was not the bladetrail change that messed with this because we locally reverted that and this berserker issue still persisted.

the problem with berserker damage isn’t that the damage itself is somehow lowered, it’s that the whirl used to hit atleast 3-4 times per pass, thus giving you the kinds of damage numbers you saw before, not to mention the 4 times to proc bleed, and extending cripple duration.

the problem now is that it hits only 1 time, if it doesnt just miss entirely. i think if you find out why it stops attacking after 1 attack in the whirl, you’ll solve your problem.

rootnode.9546:

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

^ THIS! 10.000x THIS! This is exactly what we’d like to see more of. I’m not even talking about the change itself, but about the communication. Jon, this thread was handled exactly as it should’ve been handled. More of this please. Even the grey post worked, where it said that the issue has been forwarded to the team.
Keep at it

Indeed the most frustrating thing about these issues was the feeling of you guys ignoring them (even if I’m sure you weren’t). Communication is key.

Thank you

JonPeters.5630:

Now if only I could figure out the berserker dmg thing… Worst case scenario I will just try and readjust the numbers based on the new functionality but that is harder because I don’t have the old data. For what it is worth it was not the bladetrail change that messed with this because we locally reverted that and this berserker issue still persisted.

What about the torch? Please make illusionary mage better, remove the channel time for The Prestige (burning triggers when you break stealth), and make the scepter better ;(

Thank you, Jon.

Kvitoq.9154:

rootnode.9546:

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

^ THIS! 10.000x THIS! This is exactly what we’d like to see more of. I’m not even talking about the change itself, but about the communication. Jon, this thread was handled exactly as it should’ve been handled. More of this please. Even the grey post worked, where it said that the issue has been forwarded to the team.
Keep at it

Indeed the most frustrating thing about these issues was the feeling of you guys ignoring them (even if I’m sure you weren’t). Communication is key.

Thank you

Just want to support the thought here too. People realize devs can’t always respond this quickly to concerns but when you do it really dramatically improves the mood of everyone involved. Even if a fix is going to be 10 days off it buys you a lot of good will when you come out and talk about the issue and what you want to do.

On the substantive issue, .25 seconds seems fine for a delay. Although it would be nice if you could find a way to make the phantasm immune to damage for that .25 seconds, at least in PVE, to avoid the problem of bosses one-shotting them before they get a chance to attack.

JonPeters.5630:

It has always had a delay, I am investigating if the delay somehow got changed. If someone has good raw data on the old damage of berserker vs the new damage that will also help me track down where that change came from and fix it.

Thanks,

Jon

It’s probably too much to call this “good raw data”, but my iBerserker used to crit for around 3k with me having roughly 3k attack power and a total of +30% crit dmg (not sure if that even matters). It did hit a single target more than once though. This damage is against Orr mobs mostly, since I farmed there for quite a while and thus have a relatively big amount of samples.

I don’t think iZerker damage has actually changed if it hits all of its attacks. I think to get the old numbers all you have to do is look at how much damage it does if it doesn’t whiff half of them like it does now.

JonPeters.5630:

Now if only I could figure out the berserker dmg thing… Worst case scenario I will just try and readjust the numbers based on the new functionality but that is harder because I don’t have the old data. For what it is worth it was not the bladetrail change that messed with this because we locally reverted that and this berserker issue still persisted.

Jon thank you for being engaged in our plight. For those of us that have been bordering on fanboism (or at least being accused of it ) the last few patches have really felt like we will be wiping egg off our faces for a while. We all knew that the LOS fix was coming and most of the community embraced it. The dodge/blind/invul “fix” felt as if we were being punished twice and moved us further from parity with other professions because of the nature of how zerkers work.

With the latest patch…well…you obviously have read our feedback.

It is very hard to swallow the perception that iZerker was somehow OP from a damage perspective even at pre-11/14. In comparison to other professions out there we are a slippery class that could deal some damage if set up properly. We could never roll over anyone like a Warrior or a Thief even in our “OP” state so please understand our issues here.

What would you want to see so that we can help you? I am sure there are plenty of mesmer vids out there that show that iZerk hit for 3.5-5k fairly consistently and it hit almost immediately. Something that many other professions do without the drawbacks that we have to deal with. How is that it was decided this was something that is any more of a “powerful attack” than numerous other ones from other professions that have not been touched?

I am not suggesting more nerfs to other professions. We don’t want pillow fighting professions wedged between Warriors and Thieves.

Here’s what I would do. Make the “sweep” that the iZerk does 50% of the the length it does now so it doesn’t end up so far out of range it just sits there. Make the Zerker swings activate almost instantly. Give it 3 swings, with the first one doing 70% of the damage total damage of the attack and always hitting. For example the Zerk would hit for 3.5k, 1k, 500 (not real numbers…just showing what I mean) If you want to give some sort of miss chance to the last 2 swings then I guess we can live with it but I would put forth that even in that state it’s not even close to the amount of damage being dished out consistently by other professions.

This would give us more consistent GS damage and allow us to at least compete again in WvW and dungeons without resorting to shatter specs that frankly are not on par with other “burst” professions despite what some people would have us all believe.

We don’t want LOS reverted. We can deal with blind, dodge, invul…yada…I guess…though thats a whole other conversation. But please help us do some decent damage when we jump through all the hoops and actually get a phantasm into play.

Thanks for working with us.

While this is certainly better news, please don’t tell us we have to wait to the 14th to see the delay change……

I have faith in you again.
See, that’s the kind of communication we need. Would be awesome to have your views on the changes you make too from time to time, you know, the thinking behind the changes.

Vendris.4201:

I think it is becoming painfully obvious that the person or people who designed the original class and combat mechanics and wrote the code for it is / are no longer at the company.

The bugs in the last few patches that have been introduced smell of people trying to fix code that they don’t really understand.

Each release now they try to fix the fix from the previous release, and break it even more.

This goes back to realese I think and it not limited to our class. It just seems like A-net has to less ppl for live support.

JonPeters.5630:

So studying it here empirically we think berserker is just missing and not less damage, but that duelist was actually impacted by the “bladetrail” bug fix. I will try and up the duelist damage and I will try and track down why berserker is not always hitting.

It’s worth pointing out that since the same patch that broke Zerker you also caused Illusions to become subject to avoidance twice. 40% of our weapon skills are now redundantly subject to LoS, Blind, etc.

Is this intended? The spirit of this change seemed to be to prevent summoning illusions from out of LoS, not to require two hits when we’re already externalizing our damage in an unreliable way.

JonPeters.5630:

So studying it here empirically we think berserker is just missing and not less damage, but that duelist was actually impacted by the “bladetrail” bug fix. I will try and up the duelist damage and I will try and track down why berserker is not always hitting.

Thank you for your time/work. And for your posts. I think it’s a very important – and rare thing – a communication like this.

That sounds right for iZerker. The damage doesn’t seem to have changed, it just hits less of its attacks than it used to. It doesn’t hit its attacks any more partially because of the delay but also because it seems to spawn in the wrong place. It seems like a fair proportion of the time it doesn’t line itself up right and that causes it to miss a lot of the attacks.

One way to fix iZerker might be to just make it hit 4 times per target it runs through, without making it a series of AOE attacks. I.e. turn it into something like a piercing version of the warrior longbow auto attack. Make it move along a line, and anything it passes over in the line gets hit 4x instantly, with no AOE.

I don’t use duelist so I don’t really know about that.

Thanks for the specific, detailed feedback, Jon!

It’s greatly appreciated, and restores my hope for my Mesmer.

JonPeters.5630:

So studying it here empirically we think berserker is just missing and not less damage, but that duelist was actually impacted by the “bladetrail” bug fix. I will try and up the duelist damage and I will try and track down why berserker is not always hitting.

Yes, exactly. Here is a video on youtube showing iBerserker before patches. It hits 4 times and stacks 4 bleeds, attacks almost instantly, and does over 4k with crits. (At 17 seconds in)

LaronX.8079:

This goes back to realese I think and it not limited to our class. It just seems like A-net has to less ppl for live support.

Which isn’t really surprising. It needs an ungodly amount of manpower to bust out a whole game in anything less than 1 DNF unit, but it takes a comparatively tiny team to support, bugfix and extend the game once done.

Ofc… they are unfamiliar with large parts of it

Carighan.6758:

LaronX.8079:

This goes back to realese I think and it not limited to our class. It just seems like A-net has to less ppl for live support.

Which isn’t really surprising. It needs an ungodly amount of manpower to bust out a whole game in anything less than 1 DNF unit, but it takes a comparatively tiny team to support, bugfix and extend the game once done.

Ofc… they are unfamiliar with large parts of it

I think the number a-net dropeed was 2. Which is to low even for that. Sure you don’t need a full dev team on that. But 2 guys that are supposed to cover, engine, mechanics and balancing sounds a bit low.

JonPeters.5630:

So studying it here empirically we think berserker is just missing and not less damage, but that duelist was actually impacted by the “bladetrail” bug fix. I will try and up the duelist damage and I will try and track down why berserker is not always hitting.

This is one of the first times we’ve gotten such excellent responses from a dev. Thank you so much for looking into this and being open with us about the problems. Not being kept in the dark and knowing something is being done or at least looked into is wonderful.

Thank you Jon for commenting on this. Greatly appreciated

JonPeters.5630:

It has always had a delay, I am investigating if the delay somehow got changed. If someone has good raw data on the old damage of berserker vs the new damage that will also help me track down where that change came from and fix it.

Thanks,

Jon

How are we suppose to have data when you did not build in a client side loggging. You know like every other MMO since forever.

JonPeters.5630:

Now if only I could figure out the berserker dmg thing… Worst case scenario I will just try and readjust the numbers based on the new functionality but that is harder because I don’t have the old data. For what it is worth it was not the bladetrail change that messed with this because we locally reverted that and this berserker issue still persisted.

Could it be a hitbox issue?

I know that when playing my Ele, if I use lighting whip on daggers and im to close to the target I will miss often until i back away and give it about 2 ft of room.
Or if you use firegrab and the target is moving to the your left or right, firegrab, even though your in range of it, will miss..

Just a thought, but it may be close to the same issue.

LaronX.8079:

Carighan.6758:

LaronX.8079:

This goes back to realese I think and it not limited to our class. It just seems like A-net has to less ppl for live support.

Which isn’t really surprising. It needs an ungodly amount of manpower to bust out a whole game in anything less than 1 DNF unit, but it takes a comparatively tiny team to support, bugfix and extend the game once done.

Ofc… they are unfamiliar with large parts of it

I think the number a-net dropeed was 2. Which is to low even for that. Sure you don’t need a full dev team on that. But 2 guys that are supposed to cover, engine, mechanics and balancing sounds a bit low.

Watch the SoTG interview..its not just 2 guys working on balance.

LaronX.8079:

I think the number a-net dropeed was 2. Which is to low even for that. Sure you don’t need a full dev team on that. But 2 guys that are supposed to cover, engine, mechanics and balancing sounds a bit low.

No they had 2 devs assigned to the specific issue that dev was talking about. Which sounds about right, my team assigns 1-3 to each specific ticket in Jira.

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

Wow this is great news!

Thank you again for taking the time to review these issues and adjust things as necessary.

JonPeters.5630:

So studying it here empirically we think berserker is just missing and not less damage, but that duelist was actually impacted by the “bladetrail” bug fix. I will try and up the duelist damage and I will try and track down why berserker is not always hitting.

This does appear to be the issue, its that with the initial whirling attack some of the hits in the flurry appear to be missing. I’ve had sporadic results with iZerker, sometimes it’ll only hit 1-2 times, at other times it’ll do the full amount.

From testing it today, I’ve also picked up that it’s more likely to miss the farther it is away from the target. If it’s standing right next to the target when it attacks, it’ll do the full amount. If its further away, it’ll miss a few of them (resulting in far less damage).

Again, thanks so much for looking into these issues

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

Thank you so much! I am sorry for doubting you.

Also thank you for keeping in contact with us about these issues, we are very much appreciative of the communication!

rootnode.9546:

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

^ THIS! 10.000x THIS! This is exactly what we’d like to see more of. I’m not even talking about the change itself, but about the communication. Jon, this thread was handled exactly as it should’ve been handled. More of this please. Even the grey post worked, where it said that the issue has been forwarded to the team.
Keep at it

AGREE 100.000×. this is the way i want arenanet comunicate with us (players). you can take your time correct bugs/etc but we need some comunication so we know you are working on it.

please continues this, you will get much more “love” from players.

Carighan.6758:

LaronX.8079:

I think the number a-net dropeed was 2. Which is to low even for that. Sure you don’t need a full dev team on that. But 2 guys that are supposed to cover, engine, mechanics and balancing sounds a bit low.

No they had 2 teams assigned to the specific issue that dev was talking about. Which sounds about right, my team assigns 1-3 to each specific ticket in Jira.

Oh then I just got that wrong.

Jon,
we gathered some berserker datas here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Overview-of-mesmer-bugs-after-patch/first

and here are some more: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Mesmer-Damage-Nerf/first

Oh, and of course here form the bug forum: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/iberserker-doing-significantly-less-damage/first

And if anyone thinks the berserker does too much damage in pvp, PLEASE split his functions for pve and pvp.
The berserker in pve is a good way to stay competitive in dynamic events, dungeons or in boss fights, where you have to do a lot of damage. It also is a nice aoe, since we don’t have that much. And that increases our loot to a decent amount, not as much as the other professions receive (I play everyone of them, so I am able to compare them), but it is okay with chaos storm and berserker.
So PLEASE make it viable for pve again.

Thanks! <3

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

Oh my god, I love you! It’s still slower than I’m used to, but it’s so much better now. Thank you for jumping on this right away! =D

rootnode.9546:

JonPeters.5630:

Ok so its sounds like you could counter the summon delay by having a subset of traits. So we fixed a bug that lets all those triats work together but that also makes them not able to exploit the delay anymore. Since it seems like they were working and mostly balanced without the delay I am going to go ahead and reduce the delay on this stuff to .25 seconds. I just tested it at 0 seconds and that breaks some other things so I think .25 is the best compromise.

^ THIS! 10.000x THIS! This is exactly what we’d like to see more of. I’m not even talking about the change itself, but about the communication. Jon, this thread was handled exactly as it should’ve been handled. More of this please. Even the grey post worked, where it said that the issue has been forwarded to the team.
Keep at it

I agree, this communication and also in other class forums is fantastic and much appreciated, thank you again. Keep it up.