GS / Staff tpvp users

GS / Staff tpvp users

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Posted by: Ezzyz.6045

Ezzyz.6045

Just wondering the reasoning behind these being used in tpvp still?

Convince me the superiority of staff/x or whatever that blackwater build is to sc/torch + sw/p which not only deals more frontloaded damage with increased survivability / escapes, but also does higher flat out condition damage.

I’d entertain an argument for GS, but just because I’m interested in the reasoning.

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Posted by: Xyonon.3987

Xyonon.3987

Using a staff grants you permanently chaos armor wich is very very strong in PvP. Also, noone will fight you in a chaos storm and if they do, they normaly die. There aren’t so many big numbers, but chill destroys rotations, poison prevents a good amount of heal, dazes everywhere. I see the staff in PvP, especially with safekill due “2” and blink. You can start finishing someone, 2 away, blink back again in the end to kill him.

Staff is also excellent for might stacking due interruption:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ahon_4l8ixY#t=558

Ziggs Ironeye – Engineer | Madame Le Blanc – Mesmer | Mentor (PvE) | EU
“Mentoring engineers / mesmers and showing you what you can do with your fantastic class!
Just pm me for my advice! Always eager to help!”

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Posted by: Ezzyz.6045

Ezzyz.6045

Using a staff grants you permanently chaos armor wich is very very strong in PvP. Also, noone will fight you in a chaos storm and if they do, they normaly die. There aren’t so many big numbers, but chill destroys rotations, poison prevents a good amount of heal, dazes everywhere. I see the staff in PvP, especially with safekill due “2” and blink. You can start finishing someone, 2 away, blink back again in the end to kill him.

Staff is also excellent for might stacking due interruption:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ahon_4l8ixY#t=558

You can save 2 skills that later people will argue are escapes for 1 f4 for safestomping. The thread was for Tpvp, not hotjoin or solo queue. Nobody stands in the chaos field or near it. Sword however will immobilize the target long enough for the duelist to shoot through a field as you are coming out of stealth on the opener.

If you’re using the staff, I’d assume sc/t offhand? With the current state of the game, BF is invaluable as ever in addition to a superior immo, cc (pistol 5), phantasm, boon stripping etc.

In a team fight do you want the guy auto casting in his own chaos storm for small amounts of damage who will get trained into the ground the moment after blinking. or the one who will be in the group stacking more confusion bleeds etc than staff/x could, while simultaneously bursting them down?

Edit: Another thought. Who stands to take more damage? The staff opener or the following: Decoy→duelist+feedback→leap→bf→prestige. Feel free to throw in a mass invis, null field mage sc 3 etc as you see fit.

(edited by Ezzyz.6045)

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Posted by: Xyonon.3987

Xyonon.3987

I can’t talk from my expiriences sorry :P I’ve just seen that video of fighting pretty good with a staff and you asked for something like that. I don’t play PvP myself, I’m more into PvE ^^ Sorry if I missed you :s

Ziggs Ironeye – Engineer | Madame Le Blanc – Mesmer | Mentor (PvE) | EU
“Mentoring engineers / mesmers and showing you what you can do with your fantastic class!
Just pm me for my advice! Always eager to help!”

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Posted by: Nuka Cola.8520

Nuka Cola.8520

Its all i use in spvp since launch. Phase Retreat too good for pvp and illusions are more spammable on GS for ranged and close range shatters. With staff you have awesome combat mobility and defense. With GS you have great ranged dps, combine the two and its a pure winner.

Fact: every Thief tells you to “l2p” when the subject is to nerf stealth.

(edited by Nuka Cola.8520)

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Posted by: Teutos.8620

Teutos.8620

I’d recommend to watch helseth on twitch.tv/guildwars2pvptv there you can see the full power of the gs/staff shatter build.

Condition damage vs direct damage[
The Mesmer is one of the professions which a lot of players love to play, and therefore tested out a lot of builds in the tpvp environment. I’m definitely not playing at the same level as helseth, but I’m not ranked so bad, and have a lot of Mesmer TPvP experience myself since launch. And I’ll tell you something: Condition Mesmer is not viable. He is not viable with bountiful interrupt and not viable with runes of perplexity (which do not exist in spvp anyways). Why should I stack confusion and hope that they remain on the target and that he will spam his attacks, when I can simply deal the same amount of damage or higher with direct damage?
There are some builds which sounds pretty cool like the ‘clone death build’ of the ‘blackwater build’ but they are not viable in tpvp, it’s on the same level as the signet or mantra mesmer. Some nice tricks, but overall far weaker.

Weapon choice
Why staff and gs? Good combination of damage and survival ability. You don’t want to stay in melee range too long, otherwise it gets you killed.
Ofc combinations like Sword+Torch can work too.
Btw: GS/Staff is played with ‘Illusionary Elasticity’ for the additional burst from ‘Mirror Blade’ and additional constant damage from ‘Winds of Chaos’. Nowadays everybody knows how a ‘Illusionary Leap’ ‘Blurred Frenzy’ ‘Mirror Images’ ‘Mind Wrack’-Combination looks like, and will most likely counter it. Ofc it can work too, if the team composition is burst focused, but you don’t see that very often.

I think words can’t convince you anyways,. just test it out, and post your experience!

EU – Multiple times #1 SoloQ pre Dec 2014 (pure MMR based ladder)
Primoridal (S1) & Exalted (S2) & Illustrious (S3) Legend

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Posted by: Dawdler.8521

Dawdler.8521

Since the Mesmer isnt viable in tPvP to begin with, it feels a little pointless to try to argue it…

But personally, I find the dedicated GS/staff build the most fun. Easy trait focus (GS trait, staff trait, then whatever). I use it with direct damage on a knights/valkyrie mix. Its high pace burst action aimed at keeping constant pressure. People that anticipate a condition build go down in seconds, lol.

I have tried just about every combo there is and like above, I dont think condition is viable for Mesmer. In the time a condi Mesmer has done their lets-stack-15-confusion-stacks-OMG-combo on the enemy (they cleansed it a second after), a direct damage build would have taken half their life and had them on the run. I also find it far, far more effective in terms of actual team support. If two players are engaged in a duel you will literally swoop in and knock the enemy out of his socks. Condition builds never pack that kind of pressure, at least on a Mesmer since its all RNG.

To sum up – its fun. What, you expected another answer? If we wanted to win we’d all play Guardians.

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Posted by: Helios.3598

Helios.3598

It’s a possibility for an interrupt build. The damage output is low though which usually means you need to go with zerker amulet. Doing so without much evasion or stealth makes you liability at midpoint.

mesmer of Blackgate
http://intothemists.com/

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Posted by: Chaos Archangel.5071

Chaos Archangel.5071

I rock Sword+Sword/Staff in a lockdown build and I don’t think I’ll be able to go back to anything else. Staff’s defense is just too good. Chaos Storm will either push someone off a point, lock them down with 6 debilitating conditions, or offer me cover for rezzes (when combined with Chaos Armor)

quoted from this thread

THE BUILD
Traits & Skills

Sword / Sword* – Staff*
Ether Feast / Decoy / Null Field /Mantra of Distraction / Mass Invisibility*
30/20/20/0/0
or 30/30/10/0/0 (for Greatsword)
Domination: II, VII, XII Dueling: IV, X Chaos: V, VIII
Berserker Gear – Runes of the Mesmer
2x Superior Sigil Paralysis (Sword) – Superior Sigil of Hydromancy/Fire/Energy/Doom

.

With this setup I can chain daze/stun someone out of a fight(while building vuln while they’re locked), shutdown enemy boons, clone deaths stack vuln/weakness, 2Ethereal fields (team with chaos armor = blinded/crippled enemies.), while having mobility, defense, and hitting like a truck.

I’m curious to compare what a lockdown Mes can bring to a team compared to CC War.

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Posted by: Xaylin.1860

Xaylin.1860

You can save 2 skills that later people will argue are escapes for 1 f4 for safestomping. The thread was for Tpvp, not hotjoin or solo queue. Nobody stands in the chaos field or near it. Sword however will immobilize the target long enough for the duelist to shoot through a field as you are coming out of stealth on the opener.

Got to disagree. Just cast the Chaos Storm onto the capture point. They WILL stand inside the storm. Or their point will be decaptured. The only place where this doesn’t work is the graveyard.

You also do not need to immobilize so the duelist can shoot through a field. Just be smart with your field placement. And don’t use the combo on someone with full endurance. The sword immobilize is dodged quite often so you’d better not rely on it.

If you’re using the staff, I’d assume sc/t offhand? With the current state of the game, BF is invaluable as ever in addition to a superior immo, cc (pistol 5), phantasm, boon stripping etc.

I am running a sw/sw and staff POWER build. The staff is the second strongest weapon in close range combats. Even in power builds. GS only outperforms the staff on max range and maybe in the phantasm department. However, the staff offers way better utility. You do not take a staff for dealing condition damage. It is a defensive weapon.

In a team fight do you want the guy auto casting in his own chaos storm for small amounts of damage who will get trained into the ground the moment after blinking. or the one who will be in the group stacking more confusion bleeds etc than staff/x could, while simultaneously bursting them down?

Everyone can be trained when the stunbreakers or mobility skills are down. Sword might delay it because of blurred frenzy. But scepter… certainly not more helpful than phase retreat and chaos armor.

Edit: Another thought. Who stands to take more damage? The staff opener or the following: Decoy->duelist+feedback->leap->bf->prestige. Feel free to throw in a mass invis, null field mage sc 3 etc as you see fit.

Jeez… that chain is so wrong…

You’d better not use ANY invisibility skill before casting feedback. And you’d better cast prestige before leaping so you can actually burst.

Not sure which chain you call “staff opener”. Besides that you are comparing two weapon sets (x/p and sw/t) with one weapon (staff). Going Chaos Storm, iDuellist, Leap, Blurred Frenzy (staff and sw/p) will result in an equally high damage output.

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Posted by: benOTK.4961

benOTK.4961

I rotate through different builds pretty often but I do enjoy playing a GS/Staff build.

The main reason I play it is because I enjoy both weapons. I didn’t really think it would be that effective, but it actually fares pretty well.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fgAQJARWlwzKqHTzmGZ9IiJF9GyR6RrpapWJF42FC-ToAg0CnIkSJlTKjUSpsSNgY9B

It’s more or less a defensive power phantasm build, with decent shatter damage that is used mainly for a quick burst, while phantasms are more for sustained damage.

It’s great for 1v1, providing sustained/burst damage, as well as the survivability that staff brings. I’m also capable of holding points 1v2 for a good amount of time. The trick is not to phase retreat or blink off of point.

It’s also great for team fights with the aoe it provides through zerker and chaos storm, plus all the boons/conditions that staff can generate.

I usually run with moa morph because I find it the most useful in SoloQ. Most people are zerging around and I find that mass invis and timewarp go to waste most of the time. Plus moa morph is pretty easy to land (especially in teamfights), despite what a lot of people say.

To sum it up though, it’s just an enjoyable and effective build to play.

NA: Jove Ralis – Sea of Sorrows