Guild Wars 2

I love inspiration line except Healing Prism it is really underwhelming. I started wondering how we can improve it. It is my idea: “On interrupt heal yourself and allies” remove icd and leave the rest. I’m big fan of interrupt traits, they are skill based, and fun to use. IMO Healing Prism is one of the worts minors in current form.

They nerfed it too hard. They didn’t need an ICD, only a minimum amount to trigger the effect.

That would have stopped it healing allies for ridiculous numbers with health stealing food and vampiric aura.

Or just a % of healing.

That said, why is everyone’s answer to a balance problem to make yet another interrupt trait? -_-

I think the iCD only prevents using with mantras, which is not a bad idea considering that currently the inspiration line almost only works well with mantras (Restorative Mantras is our best outgoing healing source and Mender’s Purity works best with mantra of recovery). But I agree an even better solution would have been “you heal allies for 20% of your own healing”.

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Or just a % of healing.

This is literally all that needed to be done.

No. No more interrupt traits, these are terrible for PvE.

You do realize mesmer interrupts are on longish cooldowns besides the offhand sword offhand and don’t work on mobs with defiance bars, right?

MailMail.6534:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Or just a % of healing.

This is literally all that needed to be done.

Seriously, I need this trait to be good again.

Zenith.7301:

You do realize mesmer interrupts are on longish cooldowns besides the offhand sword offhand and don’t work on mobs with defiance bars, right?

Honestly, I’m virtually never without any way to interrupt something off cd.
Mesmers have interrupts falling out of their kitten , it doesn’t matter if a few are on a long cd.

EnRohbi.2187:

Zenith.7301:

You do realize mesmer interrupts are on longish cooldowns besides the offhand sword offhand and don’t work on mobs with defiance bars, right?

Honestly, I’m virtually never without any way to interrupt something off cd.
Mesmers have interrupts falling out of their kitten , it doesn’t matter if a few are on a long cd.

For pvp. For pve, interrupts are the worst.

Zenith.7301:

No. No more interrupt traits, these are terrible for PvE.

You do realize mesmer interrupts are on longish cooldowns besides the offhand sword offhand and don’t work on mobs with defiance bars, right?

People take damage in PvE? What do you even need healing for?

AlphatheWhite.9351:

EnRohbi.2187:

Zenith.7301:

You do realize mesmer interrupts are on longish cooldowns besides the offhand sword offhand and don’t work on mobs with defiance bars, right?

Honestly, I’m virtually never without any way to interrupt something off cd.
Mesmers have interrupts falling out of their kitten , it doesn’t matter if a few are on a long cd.

For pvp. For pve, interrupts are the worst.

I very intentionally did not argue that Interrupts are bad in PvE.
Does not change your access to interrupts.

I agree with %, but their solution to it was completely over the top. I just don’t see what they were thinking with the nerf in the first place. I understood the problem, but they seemed to not care about fixing it well at all.

Good news, interrupt will soon work (again) in PvE. You won’t really interrupt, but you will get your interrupt traits.

Silverkey.2078:

Good news, interrupt will soon work (again) in PvE. You won’t really interrupt, but you will get your interrupt traits.

Source?

/15char

keenlam.4753:

Silverkey.2078:

Good news, interrupt will soon work (again) in PvE. You won’t really interrupt, but you will get your interrupt traits.

Source?

/15char

Well I realize it’s actually more like me extrapolating on something:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Chronomancer-Changes-for-Next-BWE/first#post5383336

They want traits proccing on CC/condition to work despite the boss being immune to the said CC/conditions. He does not mention interrupt as such, but that seems like a logical conclusion (especially because if I understand well it used to work).

Silverkey.2078:

keenlam.4753:

Silverkey.2078:

Good news, interrupt will soon work (again) in PvE. You won’t really interrupt, but you will get your interrupt traits.

Source?

/15char

Well I realize it’s actually more like me extrapolating on something:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Chronomancer-Changes-for-Next-BWE/first#post5383336

They want traits proccing on CC/condition to work despite the boss being immune to the said CC/conditions. He does not mention interrupt as such, but that seems like a logical conclusion (especially because if I understand well it used to work).

He also said he’s not sure when it’ll ship or how much it’ll change before it does. Let me translate that statement:

It hasn’t actually been coded yet. It’s still in a conceptual form. Somebody has floated the idea that interrupts should probably work on defiant bosses, and other people agreed that that would be a good functionality to have. It hasn’t progressed significantly beyond that point, and we might not see it implemented for another year.

Don’t count on that being released any time in the reasonable future.

They didn’t nerf it completely. When you bandage yourself while downed the trait loses its internal cooldown, so while bandaging your nearby phantasms become immortal. That being said that is a bug. The trait should have an internal cooldown of 0 second, the heal should be nerfed to around 150+.05. And it should work with regeneration. This makes it similar to any of the other regen buffs in the game like from guardian or ele.

Daniel Handler.4816:

They didn’t nerf it completely. When you bandage yourself while downed the trait loses its internal cooldown, so while bandaging your nearby phantasms become immortal.

Now if only we could guarantee getting an iDefender right as we go down.

Daniel Handler.4816:

The trait should have an internal cooldown of 0 second, the heal should be nerfed to around 150+.05. And it should work with regeneration. This makes it similar to any of the other regen buffs in the game like from guardian or ele.

Except those regens work whether you’re healing or not. This is an active trait that depends on skill/trait use. If you have regen, sure your idea works, except…that’s quite complicated, isn’kitten Why not just let it be a %?

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

They didn’t nerf it completely. When you bandage yourself while downed the trait loses its internal cooldown, so while bandaging your nearby phantasms become immortal.

Now if only we could guarantee getting an iDefender right as we go down.

Daniel Handler.4816:

The trait should have an internal cooldown of 0 second, the heal should be nerfed to around 150+.05. And it should work with regeneration. This makes it similar to any of the other regen buffs in the game like from guardian or ele.

Except those regens work whether you’re healing or not. This is an active trait that depends on skill/trait use. If you have regen, sure your idea works, except…that’s quite complicated, isn’kitten Why not just let it be a %?

Percentages are hard. 20% of 12000 (3 mantra traited) is just 2400, almost the same as if you charge the mantra itself. But people are rarely going to blow throw all the mantra charges they have to produce an effect a guard can do in two dodges.

My intended version (one that activated on heals from allies as well) seems to be encroaching on the original. so to avoid the same problem I would actually combine the ideas.

30% of any healing received is given to allies. Effectively you are increasing the outgoing healing of everyone around you by 30%. So with regen +doylak + life steal you out heal 211 per second, which is roughly the same as a traited guardians virtue of resolve.

Daniel Handler.4816:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

They didn’t nerf it completely. When you bandage yourself while downed the trait loses its internal cooldown, so while bandaging your nearby phantasms become immortal.

Now if only we could guarantee getting an iDefender right as we go down.

Daniel Handler.4816:

The trait should have an internal cooldown of 0 second, the heal should be nerfed to around 150+.05. And it should work with regeneration. This makes it similar to any of the other regen buffs in the game like from guardian or ele.

Except those regens work whether you’re healing or not. This is an active trait that depends on skill/trait use. If you have regen, sure your idea works, except…that’s quite complicated, isn’kitten Why not just let it be a %?

Percentages are hard. 20% of 12000 (3 mantra traited) is just 2400, almost the same as if you charge the mantra itself. But people are rarely going to blow throw all the mantra charges they have to produce an effect a guard can do in two dodges.

I don’t think that’s a good way to look at it though. The trait isn’t supposed to be a primary healing mechanism, it’s supposed to be a relatively small supplemental heal that will compound into something significant over time if you’re producing a lot of healing output. In that respect, 2400 out of 3 mantra channels is a reasonable bonus. It’s increasing your total healing output by 20%, and that’s a measurable impact.

Fay.2357:

Daniel Handler.4816:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

They didn’t nerf it completely. When you bandage yourself while downed the trait loses its internal cooldown, so while bandaging your nearby phantasms become immortal.

Now if only we could guarantee getting an iDefender right as we go down.

Daniel Handler.4816:

The trait should have an internal cooldown of 0 second, the heal should be nerfed to around 150+.05. And it should work with regeneration. This makes it similar to any of the other regen buffs in the game like from guardian or ele.

Except those regens work whether you’re healing or not. This is an active trait that depends on skill/trait use. If you have regen, sure your idea works, except…that’s quite complicated, isn’kitten Why not just let it be a %?

Percentages are hard. 20% of 12000 (3 mantra traited) is just 2400, almost the same as if you charge the mantra itself. But people are rarely going to blow throw all the mantra charges they have to produce an effect a guard can do in two dodges.

I don’t think that’s a good way to look at it though. The trait isn’t supposed to be a primary healing mechanism, it’s supposed to be a relatively small supplemental heal that will compound into something significant over time if you’re producing a lot of healing output. In that respect, 2400 out of 3 mantra channels is a reasonable bonus. It’s increasing your total healing output by 20%, and that’s a measurable impact.

But you can’t produce a lot of healing output. You are taking it so that 2400+3000= 5400 every 15.75 (spamming recovery) seconds is around 340 health per second, + regen would be 400 health per second + 150 (mantra of pain) = ~550 health per second output. Including outside heal in the 20% would give you +143 when by that helpful guard to a total of 693. not too bad

Cleric guard. 144(empower spam) 134 (orb of light spam) +147 (signet of courage)148(guestimation they dodge every 11 seconds)+211 virtue of resolve = ~714 health per second output
-doesn’t waste utility or heal.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Zenith.7301:

No. No more interrupt traits, these are terrible for PvE.

You do realize mesmer interrupts are on longish cooldowns besides the offhand sword offhand and don’t work on mobs with defiance bars, right?

People take damage in PvE? What do you even need healing for?

You should try fractal 50 or the Verdant Brink beta mordrem. Casual AoE spam from mobs splashing everywhere for 6k+ hits a piece and unlike pvp these mobs don’t fold over/run away at the 15-20k hp damage line.

The Mordem snipers at Verdant Brink on a full reaper shroud necromancer take off the entire shroud and then some more HP in one charged shot.

Lol, yeah those snipers if they get you are a real pain, can kill and zerker player if you don’t realise you’re being targeted.

I do like it though, but I feel zerging trivialises the mechanics of the fights, would hope they buff them in scaling then tone it down as Verdent Brink becomes less populated.

As for healing prism, it is a minor and given what they did with the “adjustment” I don’t think they don’t intend it to compete with a cleric guardian. Having its ICD disappear would be nice as it enhances your support role nicely. If they also made iDefender better we could have a viable bunker spec.

Fay.2357:

Silverkey.2078:

keenlam.4753:

Silverkey.2078:

Good news, interrupt will soon work (again) in PvE. You won’t really interrupt, but you will get your interrupt traits.

Source?

/15char

Well I realize it’s actually more like me extrapolating on something:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Chronomancer-Changes-for-Next-BWE/first#post5383336

They want traits proccing on CC/condition to work despite the boss being immune to the said CC/conditions. He does not mention interrupt as such, but that seems like a logical conclusion (especially because if I understand well it used to work).

He also said he’s not sure when it’ll ship or how much it’ll change before it does. Let me translate that statement:

It hasn’t actually been coded yet. It’s still in a conceptual form. Somebody has floated the idea that interrupts should probably work on defiant bosses, and other people agreed that that would be a good functionality to have. It hasn’t progressed significantly beyond that point, and we might not see it implemented for another year.

Don’t count on that being released any time in the reasonable future.

I’d like to add,
There was a time that Interrupt traits DID proc through Defiant, until it apparently was unbalanced and needed to be patched out.

It was super easy to proc interrupts on Champs though, since it didn’t actually Interrupt them it just procced your trait. So a 3-illusion DIversion could proc it 4 times in about half a second while the Champ only actually preformed one action.

I hope they make interrupts affect the Defiant Bar on top of proccing their effects. Although maybe that’s already the case, didn’t do much PvE during the BWEs.

With regards to the multiproc problem, just give it an ICD.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Fay.2357:

I don’t think that’s a good way to look at it though. The trait isn’t supposed to be a primary healing mechanism, it’s supposed to be a relatively small supplemental heal that will compound into something significant over time if you’re producing a lot of healing output. In that respect, 2400 out of 3 mantra channels is a reasonable bonus. It’s increasing your total healing output by 20%, and that’s a measurable impact.

But you can’t produce a lot of healing output. You are taking it so that 2400+3000= 5400 every 15.75 (spamming recovery) seconds is around 340 health per second, + regen would be 400 health per second + 150 (mantra of pain) = ~550 health per second output. Including outside heal in the 20% would give you +143 when by that helpful guard to a total of 693. not too bad

Cleric guard. 144(empower spam) 134 (orb of light spam) +147 (signet of courage)148(guestimation they dodge every 11 seconds)+211 virtue of resolve = ~714 health per second output
-doesn’t waste utility or heal.

First: we are not supposed to beat a cleric guard. Cleric guard is amazing at direct support, but does not do anything to enemies. A cleric mesmer can do very high support (very close to cleric guardian) but still have some decent enemy debuff (blinds, boon removal, interrupts…).

Second, by having more than one mantra, you can get additional outgoing healing. In particular, mantra of pain can be spammed ridiculously easily.

I am currently playing a settler interrupt mesmer. The idea is to support through

• mantra healing + condition cleanse
• boonshare + stability on mantra for stomp/revive
• revive (rune of mercy)
• interrupts to debuff the enemy + gain might (to share)

And on average in optimal conditions (courtyard) I have as much outgoing healing and boons than my bunker guardian. But on top, I have additional debuff, interrupts etc… The only thing which makes mesmer a bit less optimal than guardian in direct support is that the healing is not necessarily available on demand. I cannot keep my mantras uncharged to give the healing when needed.

Embolism.8106:

I hope they make interrupts affect the Defiant Bar on top of proccing their effects. Although maybe that’s already the case, didn’t do much PvE during the BWEs.

With regards to the multiproc problem, just give it an ICD.

Their “solution” is already in place, mesmers just haven’t noticed.

Necromancers did. Chill doesn’t work on mobs with defiance bar, and neither does slow. Instead, they do a small contribution in decreasing the defiance bar upon application.

It’s a really, really bad solution that actually doesn’t fix anything. Especially since mobs with a defiant bar iron up the bar after being interrupted so they become entirely immune to defiance bar reducing effects for a while, which makes chill and slow useless again for that remainder.

Silverkey.2078:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Fay.2357:

I don’t think that’s a good way to look at it though. The trait isn’t supposed to be a primary healing mechanism, it’s supposed to be a relatively small supplemental heal that will compound into something significant over time if you’re producing a lot of healing output. In that respect, 2400 out of 3 mantra channels is a reasonable bonus. It’s increasing your total healing output by 20%, and that’s a measurable impact.

But you can’t produce a lot of healing output. You are taking it so that 2400+3000= 5400 every 15.75 (spamming recovery) seconds is around 340 health per second, + regen would be 400 health per second + 150 (mantra of pain) = ~550 health per second output. Including outside heal in the 20% would give you +143 when by that helpful guard to a total of 693. not too bad

Cleric guard. 144(empower spam) 134 (orb of light spam) +147 (signet of courage)148(guestimation they dodge every 11 seconds)+211 virtue of resolve = ~714 health per second output
-doesn’t waste utility or heal.

First: we are not supposed to beat a cleric guard. Cleric guard is amazing at direct support, but does not do anything to enemies. A cleric mesmer can do very high support (very close to cleric guardian) but still have some decent enemy debuff (blinds, boon removal, interrupts…).

Second, by having more than one mantra, you can get additional outgoing healing. In particular, mantra of pain can be spammed ridiculously easily.

I am currently playing a settler interrupt mesmer. The idea is to support through

• mantra healing + condition cleanse
• boonshare + stability on mantra for stomp/revive
• revive (rune of mercy)
• interrupts to debuff the enemy + gain might (to share)

And on average in optimal conditions (courtyard) I have as much outgoing healing and boons than my bunker guardian. But on top, I have additional debuff, interrupts etc… The only thing which makes mesmer a bit less optimal than guardian in direct support is that the healing is not necessarily available on demand. I cannot keep my mantras uncharged to give the healing when needed.

Gonna point out that in the pictures you link you don’t get top healing to others, only top healing to self, which is typical of mesmer. You also get top boons applied to self, which is also typical of mesmer. However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

Daniel Handler.4816:

However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

Or just make it 15% like the engi trait, yeesh.

Zenith.7301:

Embolism.8106:

I hope they make interrupts affect the Defiant Bar on top of proccing their effects. Although maybe that’s already the case, didn’t do much PvE during the BWEs.

With regards to the multiproc problem, just give it an ICD.

Their “solution” is already in place, mesmers just haven’t noticed.

Necromancers did. Chill doesn’t work on mobs with defiance bar, and neither does slow. Instead, they do a small contribution in decreasing the defiance bar upon application.

It’s a really, really bad solution that actually doesn’t fix anything. Especially since mobs with a defiant bar iron up the bar after being interrupted so they become entirely immune to defiance bar reducing effects for a while, which makes chill and slow useless again for that remainder.

Yeah I know control conditions/effects reduce the bar, I’m talking about actual interrupts reducing the bar further than it would if no interrupt took place.

I did play with Imagined Burden during the Beta and it seems like all the Cripples eat up defiant bars like candy.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Silverkey.2078:

First: we are not supposed to beat a cleric guard. Cleric guard is amazing at direct support, but does not do anything to enemies. A cleric mesmer can do very high support (very close to cleric guardian) but still have some decent enemy debuff (blinds, boon removal, interrupts…).

Second, by having more than one mantra, you can get additional outgoing healing. In particular, mantra of pain can be spammed ridiculously easily.

I am currently playing a settler interrupt mesmer. The idea is to support through

• mantra healing + condition cleanse
• boonshare + stability on mantra for stomp/revive
• revive (rune of mercy)
• interrupts to debuff the enemy + gain might (to share)

And on average in optimal conditions (courtyard) I have as much outgoing healing and boons than my bunker guardian. But on top, I have additional debuff, interrupts etc… The only thing which makes mesmer a bit less optimal than guardian in direct support is that the healing is not necessarily available on demand. I cannot keep my mantras uncharged to give the healing when needed.

Gonna point out that in the pictures you link you don’t get top healing to others, only top healing to self, which is typical of mesmer. You also get top boons applied to self, which is also typical of mesmer. However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

If I remember well I actually also got the healing to others and boon to others. When I play bunker guard or bunker mesmer, I usually get the whole thing

• most boons to self and allies
• most healing to self and allies
• most conditions removed from self and allies
• top revive players

mostly because people rarely play support in PUGs. My point was mostly to show that I get about the same output (as far as those stats show) with bunker guard and bunker mesmer. The main difference are:

• bunker guard is way easier
• surviving is more difficult as a mesmer with this build, because the recharging of the mantra is a sensitive time
• the support takes more time from me (most guardian dedicated-support is instant except empower, as a mesmer I spend half of my time loading the mantras :p ). This is compensated by somewhat higher damage output from conditions
• the debuffs capabilities is much higher (interrupts with chaotic interruption are very powerful in a support role)

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

Or just make it 15% like the engi trait, yeesh.

But that trait has a 5 ICD. The idea was for a trait without an ICD. Also the engineers despise that waste of a grandmaster.

Or, and this is out of the box thinking so bear with me, they could work out the maximum healing power you can have.

Then they take regen, vampiric aura, life steal food etc and work out the maximum that could give.

Make that maximum the minimum amount needed to trigger healing prism and remove the ICD. It will then work with mantra heals when you want, heals when you want, that heal on shatter trait I never use, essentially most active heals.

Pulse heals whenever you heal for over X amount. If healing is done less than X amount, it will count towards X amount until reached.

This allows usage of Vampiric Aura, Regen, Lifesteal Foods, and other things to proc it, but resets if and when it activates (even via healing skill).

Daniel Handler.4816:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

Or just make it 15% like the engi trait, yeesh.

But that trait has a 5 ICD. The idea was for a trait without an ICD. Also the engineers despise that waste of a grandmaster.

Since I didn’t mention using the ICD, and you’ve admitted that it’s garbage with it anyway, I really get the impression you’re being intentionally thick. What’s the deal, man?

Daniel Handler.4816:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

Or just make it 15% like the engi trait, yeesh.

But that trait has a 5 ICD. The idea was for a trait without an ICD. Also the engineers despise that waste of a grandmaster.

That’s it! Currently that trait is a major grandmaster trait, and due to its ICD it really sucks!

Healing Prism is a minor grandmaster trait just dont forget that.
It also gives us 0~300 additional healing power. Compared to Engineers Amplifier (also minor grandmaster), which gives 240 Healing Power while they have regeneration, it’s not that bad even without the trigger effect.
Currently the trigger effect gives us ~500 aoe hp per 10 seconds. To compare with another traits: Elementalists Soothing Mist which is a minor adept trait heals about 800 aoe hp per 10 seconds. Ok this is not a minor grandmaster but, still we kinda got a combination of those two effects. The healing has to be limited in some way.

But also 500 aoe healing feels a little bit too low to me. Could be like 800~1000 per 10 seconds. Maybe as a trade off we get less healing power of it, like 50 per default and 50 for each illusion allive.
They could decrease the ICD to ~5sec or incease the healing, which whould be an easy change.

The radius should be increased to 450~600, 300 is a little bit to low.

If this trait get to powerfull it has do be a major trait.

NeroBoron.7285:

Daniel Handler.4816:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

Or just make it 15% like the engi trait, yeesh.

But that trait has a 5 ICD. The idea was for a trait without an ICD. Also the engineers despise that waste of a grandmaster.

That’s it! Currently that trait is a major grandmaster trait, and due to its ICD it really sucks!

Healing Prism is a minor grandmaster trait just dont forget that.
It also gives us 0~300 additional healing power. Compared to Engineers Amplifier (also minor grandmaster), which gives 240 Healing Power while they have regeneration, it’s not that bad even without the trigger effect.
Currently the trigger effect gives us ~500 aoe hp per 10 seconds. To compare with another traits: Elementalists Soothing Mist which is a minor adept trait heals about 800 aoe hp per 10 seconds. Ok this is not a minor grandmaster but, still we kinda got a combination of those two effects. The healing has to be limited in some way.

But also 500 aoe healing feels a little bit too low to me. Could be like 800~1000 per 10 seconds. Maybe as a trade off we get less healing power of it, like 50 per default and 50 for each illusion allive.
They could decrease the ICD to ~5sec or incease the healing, which whould be an easy change.

The radius should be increased to 450~600, 300 is a little bit to low.

If this trait get to powerfull it has do be a major trait.

You forget the part where ele has a ton of built in healing into their weaponskills alone, and that every time they swap to earth attunement on a 10 sec cd they also give the group 5 seconds of prot, and on water 5 secs of regen.

Similarly the engineer’s most used heal, healing turret, provides the group with high uptimes of regen and the longest lasting water field in the game.

Don’t even compare mesmer support traits to ele or engi because the mesmer does not have the same built in utility on his weapons or heals as the ele/engi do.

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

Or just make it 15% like the engi trait, yeesh.

But that trait has a 5 ICD. The idea was for a trait without an ICD. Also the engineers despise that waste of a grandmaster.

Since I didn’t mention using the ICD, and you’ve admitted that it’s garbage with it anyway, I really get the impression you’re being intentionally thick. What’s the deal, man?

Or you are just being kitten rude. But since I won’t call you thick, I’ll just point out that sadly 15% without a cd is also still too much healing. “Yeesh”

Zenith.7301:

NeroBoron.7285:

Daniel Handler.4816:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

Or just make it 15% like the engi trait, yeesh.

But that trait has a 5 ICD. The idea was for a trait without an ICD. Also the engineers despise that waste of a grandmaster.

That’s it! Currently that trait is a major grandmaster trait, and due to its ICD it really sucks!

Healing Prism is a minor grandmaster trait just dont forget that.
It also gives us 0~300 additional healing power. Compared to Engineers Amplifier (also minor grandmaster), which gives 240 Healing Power while they have regeneration, it’s not that bad even without the trigger effect.
Currently the trigger effect gives us ~500 aoe hp per 10 seconds. To compare with another traits: Elementalists Soothing Mist which is a minor adept trait heals about 800 aoe hp per 10 seconds. Ok this is not a minor grandmaster but, still we kinda got a combination of those two effects. The healing has to be limited in some way.

But also 500 aoe healing feels a little bit too low to me. Could be like 800~1000 per 10 seconds. Maybe as a trade off we get less healing power of it, like 50 per default and 50 for each illusion allive.
They could decrease the ICD to ~5sec or incease the healing, which whould be an easy change.

The radius should be increased to 450~600, 300 is a little bit to low.

If this trait get to powerfull it has do be a major trait.

You forget the part where ele has a ton of built in healing into their weaponskills alone, and that every time they swap to earth attunement on a 10 sec cd they also give the group 5 seconds of prot, and on water 5 secs of regen.

Similarly the engineer’s most used heal, healing turret, provides the group with high uptimes of regen and the longest lasting water field in the game.

Don’t even compare mesmer support traits to ele or engi because the mesmer does not have the same built in utility on his weapons or heals as the ele/engi do.

Support is not limited to healing. I will compare them. Temporal enchanter, bountiful disillusionment, warden’s feedback, illusionary inspiration, mental defense, all provide noticeable support without resorting to healing. If you are into that restorative mantras + mantra of pain does an excellent job healing. Which is why we have our current issue that mesmer is currently extremely good at boon support, so adding more healing might, one push them over the hps limit of the more heal based classes, and two, be too much support.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Or you are just being kitten rude.

“Or”?
You went out of your way to nitpick on a comparison I made by way of pointing out a precedence, and in a way that wasn’t relevant to my suggestion, rather than making your real point (which apparently is that 15% is still too high). I presume this was because you realized I could just keep dropping the number until you’d be okay with it, or I pointed out that you were being ridiculous.
But worse, you not only nitpicked on the icd, you then went on to say that Engineers consider that trait to be “garbage”, which totally contradicts your point that 15% is high enough to warrant an icd.
My rudeness was proportional to what I perceived as possibly an intentional intransigence on your part, which is no less rude.

That said, I didn’t call you thick, I suggested you were maybe intentionally being thick. Mostly because I couldn’t imagine anyone making the response you did without being aware of what you were doing.

Daniel Handler.4816:

sadly 15% without a cd is also still too much healing.

1. Well, why didn’t you say so in the first place, instead of bringing the garbage icd from engineer into it?
2. Your proposal was for 150 healing (+ a percentage of healing power) every time you heal, which at 15% (and 0 healing power) would presume 1000 healing per heal. When was the last time you had a regen healing for 1000 per tick? (hint: never, it would take 6,960 healing power to do that). So your proposal is not just more complicated, but it’s dramatically more powerful than mine.

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Or you are just being kitten rude.

“Or”?
You went out of your way to nitpick on a comparison I made by way of pointing out a precedence, and in a way that wasn’t relevant to my suggestion, rather than making your real point (which apparently is that 15% is still too high). I presume this was because you realized I could just keep dropping the number until you’d be okay with it, or I pointed out that you were being ridiculous.
But worse, you not only nitpicked on the icd, you then went on to say that Engineers consider that trait to be “garbage”, which totally contradicts your point that 15% is high enough to warrant an icd.
My rudeness was proportional to what I perceived as possibly an intentional intransigence on your part, which is no less rude.

That said, I didn’t call you thick, I suggested you were maybe intentionally being thick. Mostly because I couldn’t imagine anyone making the response you did without being aware of what you were doing.

Daniel Handler.4816:

sadly 15% without a cd is also still too much healing.

1. Well, why didn’t you say so in the first place, instead of bringing the garbage icd from engineer into it?
2. Your proposal was for 150 healing (+ a percentage of healing power) every time you heal, which at 15% (and 0 healing power) would presume 1000 healing per heal. When was the last time you had a regen healing for 1000 per tick? (hint: never, it would take 6,960 healing power to do that). So your proposal is not just more complicated, but it’s dramatically more powerful than mine.

You respond to a comment where I say any percentage based trait is a bad idea. From that you should assume you could not drop the numbers until it was okay. But still you advocate to make something like the engineers. So I assumed you had to be advocating for something with an icd given that I had just implied any percentage without an icd is too much. There is no contradiction, removing an icd makes it to strong, keeping it makes it to weak. You have to balance between the healing output of cleric versus not, and it too difficult with percentage. And if you haven’t noticed I stopped advocating the 150 proposal some posts back. Also “yeesh” really?

Zenith.7301:

No. No more interrupt traits, these are terrible for PvE.

You do realize mesmer interrupts are on longish cooldowns besides the offhand sword offhand and don’t work on mobs with defiance bars, right?

This is a problem with the underlying mechanic of Defiance and/or the Breakbar. Something ArenaNet sorely needs to look into further. It’s not alright that a key mechanic (let’s face it, interrupts are a key mechanic to the Mesmer profession, and it has been since our Guild Wars days) is rendered useless, due to the fear of trivializing encounters when multiple sources of interrupts gets together to fight a boss in the open world. We need a way to trigger these traits, even if it doesn’t actually halt what the target is doing, that or, every single enemy with Defiance and/or the Breakbar, needs to have attacks that can be interrupted, e.g., auto-attacks. The Mesmer has way too many skills and traits revolving skilled play through interrupts for this to be neglected. They fixed Conditions (to an extent), now go fix Defiance/the Breakbar.

Zenith.7301:

NeroBoron.7285:

Daniel Handler.4816:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Daniel Handler.4816:

However your comment on normal healing output versus the proposed 20% makes me think it would be unwise to have it as a percentage increase as it would boost your output over guard and ele.

Or just make it 15% like the engi trait, yeesh.

But that trait has a 5 ICD. The idea was for a trait without an ICD. Also the engineers despise that waste of a grandmaster.

That’s it! Currently that trait is a major grandmaster trait, and due to its ICD it really sucks!

Healing Prism is a minor grandmaster trait just dont forget that.
It also gives us 0~300 additional healing power. Compared to Engineers Amplifier (also minor grandmaster), which gives 240 Healing Power while they have regeneration, it’s not that bad even without the trigger effect.
Currently the trigger effect gives us ~500 aoe hp per 10 seconds. To compare with another traits: Elementalists Soothing Mist which is a minor adept trait heals about 800 aoe hp per 10 seconds. Ok this is not a minor grandmaster but, still we kinda got a combination of those two effects. The healing has to be limited in some way.

But also 500 aoe healing feels a little bit too low to me. Could be like 800~1000 per 10 seconds. Maybe as a trade off we get less healing power of it, like 50 per default and 50 for each illusion allive.
They could decrease the ICD to ~5sec or incease the healing, which whould be an easy change.

The radius should be increased to 450~600, 300 is a little bit to low.

If this trait get to powerfull it has do be a major trait.

You forget the part where ele has a ton of built in healing into their weaponskills alone, and that every time they swap to earth attunement on a 10 sec cd they also give the group 5 seconds of prot, and on water 5 secs of regen.

Similarly the engineer’s most used heal, healing turret, provides the group with high uptimes of regen and the longest lasting water field in the game.

Don’t even compare mesmer support traits to ele or engi because the mesmer does not have the same built in utility on his weapons or heals as the ele/engi do.

So you want to compensate that by a single Minor trait?
That doesn’t work out, there should be more supportive options for your group. Among the classes the value of a trait tier should be the same. Also different classes work slightly different yes, so maybe a ele has more healing for your party then a mesmer. But just check out Well of Eternity which heals people in it for 3800hp at the end so we will get more healing support. Also the changes to Well of Precognition are looking promising.

A single healing rain from a staff ele provides far more healing than well of eternity due to it being a water field and the amount of blasts a meta group and the ele himself has access to.

And then there’s Geyser which also heals for a similar amount as well of eternity and is a water field as well. 2 water fields to be blasted for instant full health in a meta group from an ele.

The healing rain itself just applies regeneration. Which heals about 1500? If I remember correctly.
Geyser heals for about 2500.
(Both without blasts)
Yes mesmer doesn’t have a water field that people can blast, also eles don’t have access to every field both due to their class design. As mentioned other class other type of support. We can make our team invisible ele can’t, we can rip boons ele can’t… And so on.

Anyway…
/signout

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Or just a % of healing.

without cd ofc, yes.

as simple as that.

Xyonon.3987:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Or just a % of healing.

without cd ofc, yes.

as simple as that.

There is no percentage that is fair at both low and high healing power.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Xyonon.3987:

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Or just a % of healing.

without cd ofc, yes.

as simple as that.

There is no percentage that is fair at both low and high healing power.

As someone, I can’t recall who, recently demanded, “show me the math”.

Healing power is a problem itself, since there is no base healing power wich results into the current healing amounts. Every skill scales different with healing power wich makes healing power overall pretty underwhelming. That’s what anet seems to have figured out too, and so we see more and more percentage stuff in traits (since july 23.).

There is nothing more fair than like healing allies for 5% of your own heal per illusion. Before we talk about fairness between traits with healing power and traits without healing power, they have to rework healing power overall first.

Crazy idea for Healing Prism.

No longer heals allies. New effect: all healing you receive is also received by your illusions.