Guild Wars 2

Dear Anet, I know people look to phantasm or shatter for a nerf, But they might not be the problem. The real problem may be their bleed stacking ability. Running a berserk ammy, mesmers are guranteed 10-15 stacks of bleeding from duelist and izerker. They already do enough damage without the bleeding. There is no problem with mesmer bleeding being effective with a shamans or rabid ammy. However, one class shouldn’t be able to deal raw damage and bleed at the same time. This gives them both raw dps and condi dps. something most classes can’t do effectively like a mesmer can. Phantasms and shater are fine the way they are, rather, a bleed fix is sure to even out the playing field without a nerf to shatter or phantasms. Maybe moving the trait would even fix the problem.

Dear Zelulose, I know people die to phantasm due the bleed stacking and raw dps, but the problem does not lie at the phantasm. The real problem is that people like you don’t know the ability ’’dodge’’ and forget to kill or run away from the phantasm so they wont do their attack again. If our class got barely any way to gain swiftness, condition removal or any way to deal damage without relying on clones with that build then Idk what the hell you’re QQing about. I’d suggest you to just move along to the thief forum and make at least 10 complaints there. Because, after all, thief is much more annoying on many ways than mesmer, don’t you think?

Man, walls of text are sure hard to read

So…you want to remove condi-mesmer from the game?

BlackDevil.9268:

Dear Zelulose, I know people die to phantasm due the bleed stacking and raw dps, but the problem does not lie at the phantasm. The real problem is that people like you don’t know the ability ’’dodge’’ and forget to kill or run away from the phantasm so they wont do their attack again. If our class got barely any way to gain swiftness, condition removal or any way to deal damage without relying on clones with that build then Idk what the hell you’re QQing about. I’d suggest you to just move along to the thief forum and make at least 10 complaints there. Because, after all, thief is much more annoying on many ways than mesmer, don’t you think?

Man, walls of text are sure hard to read

Killing a phantasm: Take retaliation damage when playing against phantasm mesmer.
Dodging is a bad argument. Dodging vs. phantasms is even worse. Try to dodge phantasms which attack like every 5-6s (staggering their attacks nicely), while the mesmer can also stun and immobilize you.
Not to mention that almost every ability/trait (clones apply cripple on death is an exception of this for no reason) can be dodged. Jep clearly, Shatter Stone (Ele Water Scepter #2) would be massively overpowered if it would become undodgeable.
How about adding a new Necro skill:

• Aim at your target. It will display a Skull over their head for 2s. Then the target will get downed / die if downed.

This is the Jade Maws skill in a nutshell. Since the necro version could also be dodge… balanced as it is dodgeable, right? Right?

If you talk about balance you compare the difference between two skills. If both skills can be dodged, then this is not a difference. It just… well make them skills.
Saying ability A is balanced because it can be dodged is equal to ability A is balanced because it is an ability.

But well, my mesmer is traited for condition clones anyway, so I could almost argue that my damage is indeed undodgeable ( try to dodge/avoid staff clones spamming auto follow Winds of Chaos on you xD ).

Iavra.8510:

So…you want to remove condi-mesmer from the game?

Actually your wrong, I want to help them. By moving the trait to a place where condi mesmers need it and berserk ammy mesmers won’t use it without condi traiting.

BlackDevil.9268:

Dear Zelulose, I know people die to phantasm due the bleed stacking and raw dps, but the problem does not lie at the phantasm. The real problem is that people like you don’t know the ability ’’dodge’’ and forget to kill or run away from the phantasm so they wont do their attack again. If our class got barely any way to gain swiftness, condition removal or any way to deal damage without relying on clones with that build then Idk what the hell you’re QQing about. I’d suggest you to just move along to the thief forum and make at least 10 complaints there. Because, after all, thief is much more annoying on many ways than mesmer, don’t you think?

Man, walls of text are sure hard to read

I understand the use for dodge. I tested a constant evade thief vs a mesmer and if I stopped dodging for less then a timed second I would get at least 3k damage and 5 stacks of bleeding. The damage is too broad for even 4 dodges in row, but i’m glad u brought up the dodge question. Phantasm damage is standard i’m speaking about moving a trait to a more condi based aria not nerfing it.

With all the Mesmer bugs and nerfs… we are lucky if the iZerker actually hits u… all you have to do for that guy is stand still and wow… you took 1k damage at the most… and one stack of bleed SO OP! I duelist is strong but it is one of our only strong phantasms in general… iWarden is easily dodgeable and he just stands there, Swordsman, Warlock and mage all do 1 attack per rotation so all you have to worry about from them is one stack of bleeding, iZerker once again is bugged so as long as you stand still… you will likely only get one stack of bleeding… therefore the only phantasm you need to worry about is iDuelist and one dodge negates half their damage and bleed stacks…

jportell.2197:

With all the Mesmer bugs and nerfs… we are lucky if the iZerker actually hits u… all you have to do for that guy is stand still and wow… you took 1k damage at the most… and one stack of bleed SO OP! I duelist is strong but it is one of our only strong phantasms in general… iWarden is easily dodgeable and he just stands there, Swordsman, Warlock and mage all do 1 attack per rotation so all you have to worry about from them is one stack of bleeding, iZerker once again is bugged so as long as you stand still… you will likely only get one stack of bleeding… therefore the only phantasm you need to worry about is iDuelist and one dodge negates half their damage and bleed stacks…

Its moving the trait not nerfing it. If the stacks of bleeding are not op you have nothing to worry about if it is moved. The trait wouldn’t vanish, rather, it would save condition mesmers 5 trait points

^This. I am okay with ANET balancing things that a majority of players may deem overpowered ONLY AFTER they address all the bugs and issues we have that hurt us more than any other class.

Jackums.3496:

Is there any aspect of the Mesmer that people aren’t crying over?

“Phantasms are too strong.”
“Moa Morph is over-powered.”
“Into the Void needs nerfing.”
“Clones are unfair.”
“Blurred Frenzy is too powerful.”

At this point I just assume that anyone complaining about a Mesmer is a bad player. The only complaint that our profession is getting right now that’s actually valid is the fact that phantasm builds are nigh unbeatable in a 1v1, which itself is justified considering they suck in group situations. Any spec that commits entirely to 1v1 should be powerful.

As for this topic, trying to fake good intentions by saying “instead of a shatter nerf, just do this” does not make you anymore credible. How about… instead of a shatter nerf, nerf nothing, because nothing is over-powered. Forum whiners are a minority of bad players that are hurt they lost to a Mesmer in pvp/wvw and want ANet to solve their problems of “L2P” for them so that they don’t have to put in the effort to do exactly that.

I’m not calling anyone a noob, but yes most complain about key mesmer mechanics that probably won’t get fixed. This change may stop their screaming while also benefiting condition builds without adding or deleting skills. All the screaming may be about different mesmer abilities but its really geared towards the damage of the phantasm mesmers that use pistol and the izerker. With a change possibly coming up to mesmers in the future, it seems that bleeding is the best place to to change without destroying the mesmer’s Game-play and damage all togather.

Moving the trait doesn’t solve anything. And there are 3 reasons:

- Moving this trait to 3d minor or become it a grandmaster duel trait won’t do anything. Because mesmers would redistribute the traits to get it. By the way, some phantasm builds already uses 30 points in duel, so in the end it will be the same as now.

- Moving this trait to illusions (most reasonable one) will make to move one of illusions to duel. And since most traits of illusions are based on shatters, it has no sense.

- Moving this trait to another rather than duel or illusions it’s even more nonsense. It is based on cond. damage and critical hits. Chaos and inspiration are discarded, since they are defensive lines. Domination traits are based on cc and doing more damage. It’s true that there are some traits about conditions, but they don’t depend on critical hits.

So if we want to be logical, Sharper images can only be in duel line.

Ansau.7326:

Moving the trait doesn’t solve anything. And there are 3 reasons:

- Moving this trait to 3d minor or become it a grandmaster duel trait won’t do anything. Because mesmers would redistribute the traits to get it. By the way, some phantasm builds already uses 30 points in duel, so in the end it will be the same as now.

- Moving this trait to illusions (most reasonable one) will make to move one of illusions to duel. And since most traits of illusions are based on shatters, it has no sense.

- Moving this trait to another rather than duel or illusions it’s even more nonsense. It is based on cond. damage and critical hits. Chaos and inspiration are discarded, since they are defensive lines. Domination traits are based on cc and doing more damage. It’s true that there are some traits about conditions, but they don’t depend on critical hits.

So if we want to be logical, Sharper images can only be in duel line.

You bring up a good point. I’ll look into this before responding.

Your right virtually every where you put it it can be used by phantasmal builds. The best bet is to move it to 25 in Illusions and swap it for Shattered strength. The only other option would be 25 in domination.However, placing it in domination would not help condition builds. It also could become a Major trait in illusions since illusions is condition damage but I would go with the first option. By doing this mesmers would have to spec for condi to get their bleeds and sacrifice power and critical damage, or give up defense for power/precision traits and bleeding.

Jackums.3496:

Is there any aspect of the Mesmer that people aren’t crying over?

“Phantasms are too strong.”
“Moa Morph is over-powered.”
“Into the Void needs nerfing.”
“Clones are unfair.”
“Blurred Frenzy is too powerful.”

At this point I just assume that anyone complaining about a Mesmer is a bad player. The only complaint that our profession is getting right now that’s actually valid is the fact that phantasm builds are nigh unbeatable in a 1v1, which itself is justified considering they suck in group situations. Any spec that commits entirely to 1v1 should be powerful.

As for this topic, trying to fake good intentions by saying “instead of a shatter nerf, just do this” does not make you anymore credible. How about… instead of a shatter nerf, nerf nothing, because nothing is over-powered. Forum whiners are a minority of bad players that are hurt they lost to a Mesmer in pvp/wvw and want ANet to solve their problems of “L2P” for them so that they don’t have to put in the effort to do exactly that.

I actually see mesmer players who don’t recognize that the class is horribly overpowered bad players.
I still love to play my mesmer, but I don’t have any illusion that the majority of kills done with it is more likely just because the class is freaking OP.

Yes, I definitely would say moving it to 25 in Illusion and swappign it for shattered strength would best benefit condition mesmer while preventing the phantasm mesmer from dodging for clones for a quick shatter and preventing them from using the power trait to increase phantasm damage. It would cause the mesmer to choose condition based damage or power based damage.

Phant build is only god tier 1v1 and for any level of competitive play it suffers to run more than one he says for the billionth time

Shatter mesmer is pretty balanced for what it can do.

Players complain about mesmers for a few reasons

Number 1 they don’t understand the class, they don’t know how to avoid damage that is meaningful or save their deny to midigate in coming damage that would otherwise put them down. <- solution? learn to play

Number 2 they are dueling a care about wining a 1v1 with a phant build.
First off no one cares about 1v1, only reason why people duel is to learn how to fight players better vs builds that are both viable within the meta and be able to fight things on a more even footing. If you try hard to fight a player who is speced to easy mode 1v1 win, like BM ranger and Phant, you are not going to have a good day. <- solution? Know they are much worse for team fights compared to whatever you may be running, and avoid them. Only engage with your team, and if he asks for a duel go into it knowing your going to lose majority of the time, or decline. Or just stop caring about 1v1?

Number 3
P0rtals/TW/Clones/other gimmicks
These are standard for people to QQ about, and for most of it I say “Cry Some More” Ooh Noos! I got turned into a bird, oh hey I’m back to normal kills the bad mesmer lol

Although clones will be a learning curve for some new players, and they really mess with people who tunnel vision, but practice overcomes that with time.

All in all you are wrong about the condi on the main damage sources, if you are losing to the bleeds on a shatter mesmer, your doing it wrong.

And if a phant is rolling you, even if they are heavy into condi, the phants Are still doing the biggest bulk, and situation of them being great 1v1 and crap team fight is still the main factor.

Zelulose.8695:

Your right virtually every where you put it it can be used by phantasmal builds. The best bet is to move it to 25 in Illusions and swap it for Shattered strength. The only other option would be 25 in domination.However, placing it in domination would not help condition builds. It also could become a Major trait in illusions since illusions is condition damage but I would go with the first option. By doing this mesmers would have to spec for condi to get their bleeds and sacrifice power and critical damage, or give up defense for power/precision traits and bleeding.

So you want shattered strength to be 15 into dueling? Where nothing is ever mentioned about shatters…..

If it were to be moved, you’d probably be putting it in over Shattered Strength in Illusions, moving Shattered Strength to the same spot in Dueling, shuffling the traits around in Illusions a bit, and switching Sharper Images to have an automatic bleed -no critical required – but with an internal CD for each Illusion.

…not that I think any of that should or would happen, but it seems a fairly reasonable change. Won’t absolutely decimate Phantasm builds, won’t touch the typical Shatter build, and should slightly buff certain Mantra and Condition builds, all of which are good things, at least IMO.

jportell.2197:

With all the Mesmer bugs and nerfs… we are lucky if the iZerker actually hits u… all you have to do for that guy is stand still and wow… you took 1k damage at the most… and one stack of bleed SO OP! I duelist is strong but it is one of our only strong phantasms in general… iWarden is easily dodgeable and he just stands there, Swordsman, Warlock and mage all do 1 attack per rotation so all you have to worry about from them is one stack of bleeding, iZerker once again is bugged so as long as you stand still… you will likely only get one stack of bleeding… therefore the only phantasm you need to worry about is iDuelist and one dodge negates half their damage and bleed stacks…

Yes… keep your kitten dirty hands off of my iduelist

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

Your right virtually every where you put it it can be used by phantasmal builds. The best bet is to move it to 25 in Illusions and swap it for Shattered strength. The only other option would be 25 in domination.However, placing it in domination would not help condition builds. It also could become a Major trait in illusions since illusions is condition damage but I would go with the first option. By doing this mesmers would have to spec for condi to get their bleeds and sacrifice power and critical damage, or give up defense for power/precision traits and bleeding.

So you want shattered strength to be 15 into dueling? Where nothing is ever mentioned about shatters…..

You make a good point. However, one may argue that it also doesn’t make sense that such a heavy condi skill should be placed in an aria where there is no condition duration or condition damage bonus. Its also a better move than removing a portion of phantasm damage.

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

Your right virtually every where you put it it can be used by phantasmal builds. The best bet is to move it to 25 in Illusions and swap it for Shattered strength. The only other option would be 25 in domination.However, placing it in domination would not help condition builds. It also could become a Major trait in illusions since illusions is condition damage but I would go with the first option. By doing this mesmers would have to spec for condi to get their bleeds and sacrifice power and critical damage, or give up defense for power/precision traits and bleeding.

So you want shattered strength to be 15 into dueling? Where nothing is ever mentioned about shatters…..

You make a good point. However, one may argue that it also doesn’t make sense that such a heavy condi skill should be placed in an aria where there is no condition duration or condition damage bonus. Its also a better move than removing a portion of phantasm damage.

But it is in a trait line that has to do with Crits since the tool tip says “Illusions bleed on Critical hits” I’d say that it is in the right spot.

I give you a good advise for fighting phantasm mesmers: Walk away. Those builds mostly got not a single source of swiftness and since mesmers also got no signet for +25% movement speed, they are basically only strong for as long as you stay near them.

I’m not a sPvP player but in WvW roaming, mobility is king and phantasm mesmers are severely lacking at this point.

I see a nerf coming with so many complaints thus far about phantasm damage. I was just proposing the idea to express that we can fix their damage without nerfing phantasms. While possibly helping the damage of other mesmer alternate builds

Zelulose.8695:

I see a nerf coming with so many complaints thus far about phantasm damage. I was just proposing the idea to express that we can fix their damage without nerfing phantasms. While possibly helping the damage of other mesmer alternate builds

Mesmers get nerfed or bugged every single kittening patch… phantasm Mesmer is strong dueling and that is it…nothing else they do is any good for a team

Zelulose.8695:

Dear Anet, I know people look to phantasm or shatter for a nerf, But they might not be the problem. The real problem may be their bleed stacking ability. Running a berserk ammy, mesmers are guranteed 10-15 stacks of bleeding from duelist and izerker. They already do enough damage without the bleeding. There is no problem with mesmer bleeding being effective with a shamans or rabid ammy. However, one class shouldn’t be able to deal raw damage and bleed at the same time. This gives them both raw dps and condi dps. something most classes can’t do effectively like a mesmer can. Phantasms and shater are fine the way they are, rather, a bleed fix is sure to even out the playing field without a nerf to shatter or phantasms. Maybe moving the trait would even fix the problem.

It’s not the mesmer it’s you. When you can’t kill a specific class it’s because you don’t know much about that class or the player is simply better. Honestly people who always complain when they lose like you are the people who BRING THE GAME BACKWARDS. Why? because you are asking for a nerf in order for you to beat this class cause you suck. Look at the elementalist due to people complaining non stop it has become into a broken useless class. Now asking for mesmer to get non stop nerf next will surely put people off. I’m tired of these nerfs here nerfs there don’t people realise that with constant changes IT RUINS THE GAME!

Kyla Jane.6138:

Zelulose.8695:

Dear Anet, I know people look to phantasm or shatter for a nerf, But they might not be the problem. The real problem may be their bleed stacking ability. Running a berserk ammy, mesmers are guranteed 10-15 stacks of bleeding from duelist and izerker. They already do enough damage without the bleeding. There is no problem with mesmer bleeding being effective with a shamans or rabid ammy. However, one class shouldn’t be able to deal raw damage and bleed at the same time. This gives them both raw dps and condi dps. something most classes can’t do effectively like a mesmer can. Phantasms and shater are fine the way they are, rather, a bleed fix is sure to even out the playing field without a nerf to shatter or phantasms. Maybe moving the trait would even fix the problem.

It’s not the mesmer it’s you. When you can’t kill a specific class it’s because you don’t know much about that class or the player is simply better. Honestly people who always complain when they lose like you are the people who BRING THE GAME BACKWARDS. Why? because you are asking for a nerf in order for you to beat this class cause you suck. Look at the elementalist due to people complaining non stop it has become into a broken useless class. Now asking for mesmer to get non stop nerf next will surely put people off. I’m tired of these nerfs here nerfs there don’t people realise that with constant changes IT RUINS THE GAME!

Lets not bash people. Try to explain why the phantasm build should or shouldn’t be fixed please. It quotes like this that prevent a possibly necessary fix from happening. Maybe I’m wrong, maybe I’m right but we will never know if we keep bashing each other’s play style.
I would like to hear other opinions on fixing the phantasm mesmer in a more agreeable way or hear more on why they should stay the way they are.

No-one should be having undue trouble vs a GS/sword-pistol mes. Without even considering the fact that GS currently has very heavily bugged damage, that weapon combo has NO survivability.

AoE and terrain cause huge amounts of trouble for phantasms and a phantasm build is basically only good in 1v1 play for that reason.

If you are having significant trouble vs Mesmer I would recommend playing the class to get a feel for it. sPvP provides the option to mess about with a maxed rank 80 of any class really easily. It’s great for getting a better perspective on class balance, because the reality is that all classes have some really solid builds.

Brew Pinch.5731:

No-one should be having undue trouble vs a GS/sword-pistol mes. Without even considering the fact that GS currently has very heavily bugged damage, that weapon combo has NO survivability.

AoE and terrain cause huge amounts of trouble for phantasms and a phantasm build is basically only good in 1v1 play for that reason.

If you are having significant trouble vs Mesmer I would recommend playing the class to get a feel for it. sPvP provides the option to mess about with a maxed rank 80 of any class really easily. It’s great for getting a better perspective on class balance, because the reality is that all classes have some really solid builds.

Well If you are absolutely sure mesmer is fine the way it is so be it. I recently found out something that makes phantasm practically invulnerable while keeping the damage extremely high and can say now that mesmer is my favorite class. If they don’t need a nerf then it is ok. I am happy with the classes as they are. I just would rather bleeds get fixed than my precious phantasms and I guarantee a future mesmer damage nerf is coming eventually.

WHEN THE kitten IS A MESMER NERF NOT INCOMING? Whether it is an intended nerf or not EVERY SINGLE GOD kitten PATCH SOMETHING WHITTLES AWAY AT THIS CLASS.

jportell.2197:

WHEN THE kitten IS A MESMER NERF NOT INCOMING? Whether it is an intended nerf or not EVERY SINGLE GOD kitten PATCH SOMETHING WHITTLES AWAY AT THIS CLASS.

Yet we still stand strong. Says something about our class, eh?

Esplen.3940:

jportell.2197:

WHEN THE kitten IS A MESMER NERF NOT INCOMING? Whether it is an intended nerf or not EVERY SINGLE GOD kitten PATCH SOMETHING WHITTLES AWAY AT THIS CLASS.

Yet we still stand strong. Says something about our class, eh?

Because we enjoy the way the class was designed… so every patch we are stuck seeing what we can “make work” and honestly if not for IOL and portal how many people actually think mesmers would be taken on to a tourney team? Thieves have better burst and mobility, eles have better sustain, guardians (everyone else really) can bunker better than us due to P. defender being hard to keep up and illusionary membrane being nerfed into oblivion. Necros, Engis, Rangers, thieves all have better condition damage specs… Where does that leave us? They are buffing weakness up soon so that it does a better job at dealing with super glassy builds… yet who has the best access to weakness? The super glassy builds… Mesmer only gets it through the random chaos storm or a random clone on death trait that is almost never taken.

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

I see a nerf coming with so many complaints thus far about phantasm damage. I was just proposing the idea to express that we can fix their damage without nerfing phantasms. While possibly helping the damage of other mesmer alternate builds

Mesmers get nerfed or bugged every single kittening patch… phantasm Mesmer is strong dueling and that is it…nothing else they do is any good for a team

My recent op mesmer is perfect for teams

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

^If its a phantasm build whats the point? it isn’t gonna do much in a team fight… and is gonna wipe the floor with pretty much any other build in the game. phtantasms are either the first thing down leaving the Mesmer SOL or it is only single target and then they get a stomp off and the Mesmer is twittling his thumbs for the next 10-15 seconds because both of his damage dealers are on CD.

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

^If its a phantasm build whats the point? it isn’t gonna do much in a team fight… phtantasms are either the first thing down leaving the Mesmer SOL or it is only single target and then they get a stomp off and the Mesmer is twittling his thumbs for the next 10-15 seconds because both of his damage dealers are on CD.

XD I’m not bashing anyone, I’m just saying this new build is pretty good XD It’s speced like phantasm but not exactly phantasm…

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

^If its a phantasm build whats the point? it isn’t gonna do much in a team fight… phtantasms are either the first thing down leaving the Mesmer SOL or it is only single target and then they get a stomp off and the Mesmer is twittling his thumbs for the next 10-15 seconds because both of his damage dealers are on CD.

XD I’m not bashing anyone, I’m just saying this new build is pretty good XD

My entire point at posting in this thread has nothing to do with bashing. it is saying that what you suggested is a flat out nerf… What the Mesmer needs right now for a healthy game is no more nerfs but all the infuriating bugs that get introduced every single patch to be addressed. Also any nerfs that do come about now are most likely going to be riddled with more bugs… Hence why I am adamantly against any more ridiculous and unnecessary nerfs to this freaking profession.

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

^If its a phantasm build whats the point? it isn’t gonna do much in a team fight… phtantasms are either the first thing down leaving the Mesmer SOL or it is only single target and then they get a stomp off and the Mesmer is twittling his thumbs for the next 10-15 seconds because both of his damage dealers are on CD.

XD I’m not bashing anyone, I’m just saying this new build is pretty good XD

My entire point at posting in this thread has nothing to do with bashing. it is saying that what you suggested is a flat out nerf… What the Mesmer needs right now for a healthy game is no more nerfs but all the infuriating bugs that get introduced every single patch to be addressed. Also any nerfs that do come about now are most likely going to be riddled with more bugs… Hence why I am adamantly against any more ridiculous and unnecessary nerfs to this freaking profession.

Calm down? This is becoming hostile )= and is why many necessary fixes don’t happen. Lay some more evidences like other classes that are defeating your mesmer. If mesmer already has problems with other classes then maybe they don’t need a fix. Although I never hear a mesmer complain about any classes only classes complaining about mesmer and thief.

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

^If its a phantasm build whats the point? it isn’t gonna do much in a team fight… phtantasms are either the first thing down leaving the Mesmer SOL or it is only single target and then they get a stomp off and the Mesmer is twittling his thumbs for the next 10-15 seconds because both of his damage dealers are on CD.

XD I’m not bashing anyone, I’m just saying this new build is pretty good XD

My entire point at posting in this thread has nothing to do with bashing. it is saying that what you suggested is a flat out nerf… What the Mesmer needs right now for a healthy game is no more nerfs but all the infuriating bugs that get introduced every single patch to be addressed. Also any nerfs that do come about now are most likely going to be riddled with more bugs… Hence why I am adamantly against any more ridiculous and unnecessary nerfs to this freaking profession.

Calm down? This is becoming hostile )=

I have this attitude because I see patch after patch where this road leads… Did you notice how they said in the betas and at release necros and warriors were unstoppable beasts… Did you notice (if you watched SOTG today) how jon sharp mentioned that mesmers had a very amazing shut down build that was nerfed for being too strong and now all those traits revolving around things like that are just sad? Small changes here and there eventually lead to a big broken useless class.

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

^If its a phantasm build whats the point? it isn’t gonna do much in a team fight… phtantasms are either the first thing down leaving the Mesmer SOL or it is only single target and then they get a stomp off and the Mesmer is twittling his thumbs for the next 10-15 seconds because both of his damage dealers are on CD.

XD I’m not bashing anyone, I’m just saying this new build is pretty good XD

My entire point at posting in this thread has nothing to do with bashing. it is saying that what you suggested is a flat out nerf… What the Mesmer needs right now for a healthy game is no more nerfs but all the infuriating bugs that get introduced every single patch to be addressed. Also any nerfs that do come about now are most likely going to be riddled with more bugs… Hence why I am adamantly against any more ridiculous and unnecessary nerfs to this freaking profession.

Calm down? This is becoming hostile )=

I have this attitude because I see patch after patch where this road leads… Did you notice how they said in the betas and at release necros and warriors were unstoppable beasts… Did you notice (if you watched SOTG today) how jon sharp mentioned that mesmers had a very amazing shut down build that was nerfed for being too strong and now all those traits revolving around things like that are just sad? Small changes here and there eventually lead to a big broken useless class.

Idk. I see 4 Viable alternate mesmer builds with only one weakness. Phantasm Berserker ammy dps from a good kiting/stealthing mesmer

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

^If its a phantasm build whats the point? it isn’t gonna do much in a team fight… phtantasms are either the first thing down leaving the Mesmer SOL or it is only single target and then they get a stomp off and the Mesmer is twittling his thumbs for the next 10-15 seconds because both of his damage dealers are on CD.

XD I’m not bashing anyone, I’m just saying this new build is pretty good XD

My entire point at posting in this thread has nothing to do with bashing. it is saying that what you suggested is a flat out nerf… What the Mesmer needs right now for a healthy game is no more nerfs but all the infuriating bugs that get introduced every single patch to be addressed. Also any nerfs that do come about now are most likely going to be riddled with more bugs… Hence why I am adamantly against any more ridiculous and unnecessary nerfs to this freaking profession.

Calm down? This is becoming hostile )=

I have this attitude because I see patch after patch where this road leads… Did you notice how they said in the betas and at release necros and warriors were unstoppable beasts… Did you notice (if you watched SOTG today) how jon sharp mentioned that mesmers had a very amazing shut down build that was nerfed for being too strong and now all those traits revolving around things like that are just sad? Small changes here and there eventually lead to a big broken useless class.

Idk. I see 4 Viable alternate mesmer builds with only one weakness. Phantasm Berserker ammy dps from a good kiting/stealthing mesmer

All Mesmer builds share one weakness… Conditions… And a phantasm berserker Mesmer brings unreliable DPS to the team. I say unreliable because any amount of AOE its a phantasm alive. And if all phantasms are dead then a phantasm Mesmer has no real alternative damage sources… also a phantasm zerker Mesmer that is kiting is not capping a node.

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

^If its a phantasm build whats the point? it isn’t gonna do much in a team fight… phtantasms are either the first thing down leaving the Mesmer SOL or it is only single target and then they get a stomp off and the Mesmer is twittling his thumbs for the next 10-15 seconds because both of his damage dealers are on CD.

XD I’m not bashing anyone, I’m just saying this new build is pretty good XD

My entire point at posting in this thread has nothing to do with bashing. it is saying that what you suggested is a flat out nerf… What the Mesmer needs right now for a healthy game is no more nerfs but all the infuriating bugs that get introduced every single patch to be addressed. Also any nerfs that do come about now are most likely going to be riddled with more bugs… Hence why I am adamantly against any more ridiculous and unnecessary nerfs to this freaking profession.

Calm down? This is becoming hostile )=

I have this attitude because I see patch after patch where this road leads… Did you notice how they said in the betas and at release necros and warriors were unstoppable beasts… Did you notice (if you watched SOTG today) how jon sharp mentioned that mesmers had a very amazing shut down build that was nerfed for being too strong and now all those traits revolving around things like that are just sad? Small changes here and there eventually lead to a big broken useless class.

Idk. I see 4 Viable alternate mesmer builds with only one weakness. Phantasm Berserker ammy dps from a good kiting/stealthing mesmer

All Mesmer builds share one weakness… Conditions… And a phantasm berserker Mesmer brings unreliable DPS to the team. I say unreliable because any amount of AOE its a phantasm alive. And if all phantasms are dead then a phantasm Mesmer has no real alternative damage sources… also a phantasm zerker Mesmer that is kiting is not capping a node.

The izerker is invulnerable when whirling the duelist has range. once their burst is threw shatter them the dps will do the team some good for aoe and a single target just pair up.

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

And what does it bring besides high single target damage? You said that you have a strong phantasm build? lemme guess it may not be completely right but its something along the lines of 10/20/0/25/5 with 10 points left to spend…. And if it is a proper phantasm build then it likely means you are using off hand pistol and off hand sword… Two strong single target damage only weapons….

No lol your just kidding me right? this new build is seriously awesome. You should duel me.

^If its a phantasm build whats the point? it isn’t gonna do much in a team fight… phtantasms are either the first thing down leaving the Mesmer SOL or it is only single target and then they get a stomp off and the Mesmer is twittling his thumbs for the next 10-15 seconds because both of his damage dealers are on CD.

XD I’m not bashing anyone, I’m just saying this new build is pretty good XD

My entire point at posting in this thread has nothing to do with bashing. it is saying that what you suggested is a flat out nerf… What the Mesmer needs right now for a healthy game is no more nerfs but all the infuriating bugs that get introduced every single patch to be addressed. Also any nerfs that do come about now are most likely going to be riddled with more bugs… Hence why I am adamantly against any more ridiculous and unnecessary nerfs to this freaking profession.

Calm down? This is becoming hostile )=

I have this attitude because I see patch after patch where this road leads… Did you notice how they said in the betas and at release necros and warriors were unstoppable beasts… Did you notice (if you watched SOTG today) how jon sharp mentioned that mesmers had a very amazing shut down build that was nerfed for being too strong and now all those traits revolving around things like that are just sad? Small changes here and there eventually lead to a big broken useless class.

Idk. I see 4 Viable alternate mesmer builds with only one weakness. Phantasm Berserker ammy dps from a good kiting/stealthing mesmer

All Mesmer builds share one weakness… Conditions… And a phantasm berserker Mesmer brings unreliable DPS to the team. I say unreliable because any amount of AOE its a phantasm alive. And if all phantasms are dead then a phantasm Mesmer has no real alternative damage sources… also a phantasm zerker Mesmer that is kiting is not capping a node.

The izerker is invulnerable when whirling the duelist has range. once their burst is threw shatter them the dps will do the team some good for aoe and a single target just pair up.

whether the izerker is invulnerable or not while whirling is inconsequential. Why because he may do a total of 1k damage! have you not seen the countless videos bug reports and screenshots showing this phantasm hitting like a wet noodle?

Zelulose.8695:

I recently found out something that makes phantasm practically invulnerable while keeping the damage extremely high and can say now that mesmer is my favorite class.

Great, well done.

Share it, prove your argument.

Mate, get over it. You just got steamrolled by mesmers probably and came here to QQ about it. If you really think it’s so kitten easy to play, then why not roll one yourself? Enough faceroll mesmers who think it’s so easy and then even get smashed by another faceroll 100b warrior. And, ofc, you go to the warrior forum then and qq about 100b being too strong.

Endless chain of noobs crying for nerfs. You’re one of them.

BlackDevil.9268:

Mate, get over it. You just got steamrolled by mesmers probably and came here to QQ about it. If you really think it’s so kitten easy to play, then why not roll one yourself? Enough faceroll mesmers who think it’s so easy and then even get smashed by another faceroll 100b warrior. And, ofc, you go to the warrior forum then and qq about 100b being too strong.

Endless chain of noobs crying for nerfs. You’re one of them.

Please refrain from name calling. Also I would not complain about a class as under-powered as Warriors. Furthermore, if you compare the warrior forums to mesmer forums, people ask for warrior buffs rather than nerfs and people complain about mesmer more frequently. Also, I currently run 4 mesmer builds. You can duel me on saturday from 9-12 pm eastern time if you must have proof of my experience or spectate a 5 vs 5 match I may join.

So I tested max toughness mesmer with heals and an idefender and he kills me before I really see him. Ask anet what to say to this video XD. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k99BKVpBxXQ

This is why people complain. Imagine what he does to GC thief or any other non tank.

Zelulose.8695:

So I tested max toughness mesmer with heals and an idefender and he kills me before I really see him. Ask anet what to say to this video XD. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k99BKVpBxXQ

This is why people complain Imagine what he does to GC thief or any other non tank.

Why didn’t you summon the defender at least on one of the phantasms or something… Half the damage taken away from you is still half the damage taken away from you. You started getting wrecked…. You used absolutely no stun break or decoy. No wonder you got locked down.
I just watched it again… You didn’t dodge his opener you did two random dodges at the opening of the fight. I have played with Pyro and he is dang good… Using this fight as a reason to justify Sharper Images being nerfed is asinine. You also had absolutely NO stun breaks in ur weapon sets AT ALL or in your utility skills…

I couldn’ t find him he was stealthed. I also dodge his opening.

Zelulose.8695:

jportell.2197:

Zelulose.8695:

Your right virtually every where you put it it can be used by phantasmal builds. The best bet is to move it to 25 in Illusions and swap it for Shattered strength. The only other option would be 25 in domination.However, placing it in domination would not help condition builds. It also could become a Major trait in illusions since illusions is condition damage but I would go with the first option. By doing this mesmers would have to spec for condi to get their bleeds and sacrifice power and critical damage, or give up defense for power/precision traits and bleeding.

So you want shattered strength to be 15 into dueling? Where nothing is ever mentioned about shatters…..

You make a good point. However, one may argue that it also doesn’t make sense that such a heavy condi skill should be placed in an aria where there is no condition duration or condition damage bonus. Its also a better move than removing a portion of phantasm damage.

It makes perfect sense. To bleed, your clones need high crit chance and the reason its in dueling… This trait is perfectly places and makes clones spamming Spacial Surge decent instead of 10000% worthless.