Guild Wars 2

Seriously, this is coming from an Engineer doing WvW and SPvP.

1. There are no CDs between using shatters. There needs to be a CD between each shatter of 2 to 3 seconds minimum.
2. Clones and phantasms can be created at alarming rates allowing for massive explosion spam.
3. Explosions are a 360 degree damage spread at target allowing hardly any targetting, plus clones go right after enemy.
4. Many clones/phantasm ability spawn the illusion right on top of the target, even if LOS one can still be created and track down the target.
5. Confusion is the worst game mechanic I have ever seen in a MMO. Retaliation is fine, you can choose not to hit the target. But confusion forces you to do nothing in a game except remove boon (if you can) or take massive amounts of damage. I am aware engineers can also make a build using this but it’s much harder to apply and the duration is far too short. The stacks on confusion should go away as the target casts spells instead of waiting out duration. Confusion needs a major rework.
6. Portal… we all know it.
7. Best elites in game. Bubble quickness for whole team, turn target into something completely useless for 10 seconds. AoE stealth. Far Far outreaches most elite skills. No matter the CD, these are far too strong for what other classes have.

Put 3 mesmers on one side in an SPvP match that know how to play and they have so much burst/dmg/control that you cannot beat that team without an extreme amount of teamwork. No other class can boost so much.

You can begin your kitten flaming, but this class has been too powerful since launch and only made stronger. I would rather deal with the burst thieves.

Here I was in another thread complaining, that Mesmer needed some improvement and then I read this. I guess it looks real different from a different perspective. I do not believe that Mesmer really got too much. Take for example the Mass Invisibility. It is a 5 seconds invisibility with over 1 second cast time. And then I saw a thief the other day in WvW, who turned himself and his comrades invisible at an alarming rate and with only 1/4 second cast time and a lower cooldown.

But overthinking the whole thing and playing a little bit the thief myself, I figured out the limitations of the thief’s invisibility. I guess that is the same fighting a Mesmer. I saw so many ppl dodging my shatters and even my berserker. And also the 20 stacks confusion me and my friend applied to that one guy, were removed almost instantly (I admit, we should have seen that comming^^)

Confusion does already less dmg in sPvP. But personally I like the concept of that condition. It allows you to control the moves of your enemy or punish him for not “obeying”. This is similar to GW1, where the Mesmer could basically disable the usage of skills for other players. We could probably talk about the amount of dmg the confusion does, but from my point of view it doesn’t need a major overwork. The only thing is, that it is stronger in WvW compared to sPvP. So maybe one should work on that.

Overall I can read from your post that you have problems dealing with Mesmer. But I as a Mesmer have my own problems (and we’re back to the thief). But I rather try to beat the thief in it’s current state than demanding a nerve on them… People seem to expect, to be able to handle everything that someone throws at them, but that shouldn’t be the case, I believe. Every build and every class should have it’s weaknesses and most feared enemies…

I challenge you to play a mesmer for any amount of time. Go ahead, play a shatter mesmer a bit. Then come back and read what you wrote. I guarantee you’ll see it in another light.

The class is lacking so much right now. In SPvP only the shatter spec is even remotely viable, in WvW we are delegated to portal duty and pulling people from walls since we’re useless at anything else and in PvE we get outshined by every other class, be it solo farming or dungeons. The scepter needs a rework, clones don’t work as intended, some traits don’t work at all in some circumstances and bugs galore.

1. I’ll give you that.
2. How does massive explosion work when you have a cooldown on shatters and only 1 of them actually explodes?
3. Clones go right after the enemy which means that ANY smart player sees the clones running towards him and dodges. Or just kills them in 2 hits or 1 aoe.
4. We have the iWarden, utterly worthless and Illusionary Leap that only works when the stars align and has almost melee range. And that LOS thing is simply not true.
5. Confusion is our ONLY real dmg source outside burst. I play a cond mesmer and trust me even with my cond dmg confusion is lacking.
6. Nerfed to hell and back and still more nerfs in the pipeline. It will come to a point where there is no reason to bring a mesmer anywhere.
7. No. Just no.

Please, do your homework before coming here spewing nonesense.

dirtyshame.1863:

Seriously, this is coming from an Engineer doing WvW and SPvP.

From the engi perspective i agree with your post, but ALL classes are OP compared to engi right now

From a mesmers PoV:
Clones/shatter is fine, except the shattered strength is too OP right now. Blink, mirror images+2 on GS/staff, F3 then double dodge weapon swap sword 2, again 2 for immo, then F1 and you can nearly destory any class in melee before they even know what hit them.

5. Confusion is fine as it is.

6. Before i played a mesmer i thought that portal was fine and after i started playing mesmer i still think its fine.

7. yes mesmer got good elites, game breaking? no.

Illusions only feel endless if you don’t kill them fast enough. If you focus on getting rid of all illusions at the beginning of a fight (not necessarily killing them), leaving the Mesmer until last, you will have a much easier time on your hand. Both offensive and defensive tactics of the Mesmer rely on illusions. Shatter skills have cooldowns, and shatter effects can be dodged.

Confusion is just another control condition like Immobilize. You either keep fighting through the damage, or you stow your weapon and wait until the effect wears off.

Portal is a skill that I think all profession should have, in one way or another. It adds a lot to WvW.

I disagree that the Mesmers elite skills far exceeds other elite skills. The only thing overpowered about them is the 10 second durations, but that’s all. Most of the time Time Warp won’t even make a noticeable difference, and you can still deal damage as a moa. Mass Invisibility sucks now that it only affects five other players (Veil is much better).

dirtyshame.1863:

Seriously, this is coming from an Engineer doing WvW and SPvP.

1. There are no CDs between using shatters. There needs to be a CD between each shatter of 2 to 3 seconds minimum.
2. Clones and phantasms can be created at alarming rates allowing for massive explosion spam.
3. Explosions are a 360 degree damage spread at target allowing hardly any targetting, plus clones go right after enemy.
4. Many clones/phantasm ability spawn the illusion right on top of the target, even if LOS one can still be created and track down the target.
5. Confusion is the worst game mechanic I have ever seen in a MMO. Retaliation is fine, you can choose not to hit the target. But confusion forces you to do nothing in a game except remove boon (if you can) or take massive amounts of damage. I am aware engineers can also make a build using this but it’s much harder to apply and the duration is far too short. The stacks on confusion should go away as the target casts spells instead of waiting out duration. Confusion needs a major rework.
6. Portal… we all know it.
7. Best elites in game. Bubble quickness for whole team, turn target into something completely useless for 10 seconds. AoE stealth. Far Far outreaches most elite skills. No matter the CD, these are far too strong for what other classes have.

Put 3 mesmers on one side in an SPvP match that know how to play and they have so much burst/dmg/control that you cannot beat that team without an extreme amount of teamwork. No other class can boost so much.

You can begin your kitten flaming, but this class has been too powerful since launch and only made stronger. I would rather deal with the burst thieves.

Play one for a while. Then re-read your post. Work out the weaknesses, exploit those and win.

Seriously. Play one.

dirtyshame.1863:

Seriously, this is coming from an Engineer doing WvW and SPvP.

See, this is your problem. There’s nothing wrong with the mesmer. There is with engineers. And it’s this crying that leaves classes in shambles. Don’t mistake your own weakness for another class being OP. I’m really sorry for engineers, I shelved mine and I truly hope you’ll get the buffs you deserve and need.

You can easily tell when someone doesn’t play a Mesmer due to them thinking its all OP stuff with no effort… the skill level needed to play a Mesmer far exceeds that of most – if not all other class bar the D/D Ele bunker build.

We may be able to put out high damage in a few seconds, but usually once you’ve fired off your high burst as a Mesmer your left with very little else to cover your backside! We go down in a few hits, we have no real aoe’s to compensate if shatters had major cooldowns. What you see when you get hit by a mesmer is someone using everything they can muster to take you down as quickly as possible as we aren’t all bulky high def/high damage classes.

There doesn’t need to be cooldowns between shatters, using more than 1 in a row means we’re throwing out everything we have and leaving nothing in the bag, if we use them all and it doesn’t take a player down then chances are we’re going to die!

Of course Phantasms can spawn right on a target… most classes skills hit their target straight away, why should our skills wait around to die before they do anything? No phantasm should ever be able to get off more than 1 attack if the opponent is awake, they only take 1-2 hits to kill!

Being good at a Mesmer takes huge amounts of effort, its all about skill, timing and knowing your limits, where not a 1-2 button spam class like others out there that can pull of major damage with no effort at all.

If nothing else, Mesmer’s should be buffed in ways that make non shatter builds more desirable to play, right now its one of the very few ways to get any damage out of us so that’s the build everyone uses!

AkiraZero.8514:

You can easily tell when someone doesn’t play a Mesmer due to them thinking its all OP stuff with no effort… the skill level needed to play a Mesmer far exceeds that of most – if not all other class bar the D/D Ele bunker build.

We may be able to put out high damage in a few seconds, but usually once you’ve fired off your high burst as a Mesmer your left with very little else to cover your backside! We go down in a few hits, we have no real aoe’s to compensate if shatters had major cooldowns. What you see when you get hit by a mesmer is someone using everything they can muster to take you down as quickly as possible as we aren’t all bulky high def/high damage classes.

There doesn’t need to be cooldowns between shatters, using more than 1 in a row means we’re throwing out everything we have and leaving nothing in the bag, if we use them all and it doesn’t take a player down then chances are we’re going to die!

Of course Phantasms can spawn right on a target… most classes skills hit their target straight away, why should our skills wait around to die before they do anything? No phantasm should ever be able to get off more than 1 attack if the opponent is awake, they only take 1-2 hits to kill!

Being good at a Mesmer takes huge amounts of effort, its all about skill, timing and knowing your limits, where not a 1-2 button spam class like others out there that can pull of major damage with no effort at all.

If nothing else, Mesmer’s should be buffed in ways that make non shatter builds more desirable to play, right now its one of the very few ways to get any damage out of us so that’s the build everyone uses!

Quoted for truth. I’d like to play something else than the burst shatter spec in pve, but I have no choice if I want to keep up with other classes.

Konfuzfanten.6503:

dirtyshame.1863:

Seriously, this is coming from an Engineer doing WvW and SPvP.

From the engi perspective i agree with your post, but ALL classes are OP compared to engi right now

From a mesmers PoV:
Clones/shatter is fine, except the shattered strength is too OP right now. Blink, mirror images+2 on GS/staff, F3 then double dodge weapon swap sword 2, again 2 for immo, then F1 and you can nearly destory any class in melee before they even know what hit them.

5. Confusion is fine as it is.

6. Before i played a mesmer i thought that portal was fine and after i started playing mesmer i still think its fine.

7. yes mesmer got good elites, game breaking? no.

Explain to me before the buff to shattered strength everyone was still getting owned by the Shatter Cat build. hmm explain please.

If you cant its not Op in anyway shape or form you guys are totally missing the point of the basics of pvp FREAKIN dodge dodge dodge kite kite kite use ur kitten stun breakers use ur condition removals the blurred frenzy combo is among the easiest to dodge EVER!

IF you dont use your skills that can negate that combo then thats your own fault tbh you deserve to be killed 10 times over.

I second the request for you to play one for a week and then reply to your own post. If you still have concerns at least they will be objective.

These coments only poped after the shatter cat build…. The mobility is the main thing that makes u think that way… In general all glass cannon builds are op but look at the gear also…. The gear is what makes the insane burst damage viable.. fight a good ele d/d or s/d they have the same movement but much higher damage potential. You will see the next flavour of the month build will be ele after the nerf patch….

dirtyshame.1863:

Seriously, this is coming from an Engineer doing WvW and SPvP.

1. There are no CDs between using shatters. There needs to be a CD between each shatter of 2 to 3 seconds minimum.
2. Clones and phantasms can be created at alarming rates allowing for massive explosion spam.

There is no CD between shatterskills due to the CD of illusion/phantasm skills.
Illusions and phantasms are the way of a mesmer. Instead … the mesmer does not great direct damage like … fireballs or something like this.
It seems that you didn’t even plan to counter this. Did you even notice the hitpoints of illusions and phantasms? Even an engineer has some aoe skills.

dirtyshame.1863:

3. Explosions are a 360 degree damage spread at target allowing hardly any targetting, plus clones go right after enemy.

Are you serious? Thats called aoe and its part of mmorpg-pvp.
A mesmer needs 3 illusions/phantasms to deal good damage or enough confusion.

dirtyshame.1863:

5. Confusion is the worst game mechanic I have ever seen in a MMO. Retaliation is fine, you can choose not to hit the target. But confusion forces you to do nothing in a game except remove boon (if you can) or take massive amounts of damage. I am aware engineers can also make a build using this but it’s much harder to apply and the duration is far too short. The stacks on confusion should go away as the target casts spells instead of waiting out duration. Confusion needs a major rework.

Confusion is a CONDITION. You may cure it if you have skills.

dirtyshame.1863:

You can begin your kitten flaming, but this class has been too powerful since launch and only made stronger. I would rather deal with the burst thieves.

You are the one who is flaming because you are too lazy to invent your own tactic.
This game is not about buttonmashing 2 – 10 and autoattacking. There are many possiblities to counter illusions/phantasms (like aoe skills [yes even engineers got some] and dodging [yes even engineers are able to dodge]) and there is even a solution about confusion. This is hilarious.

Lordryux.9785:

Explain to me before the buff to shattered strength everyone was still getting owned by the Shatter Cat build. hmm explain please.

If you cant its not Op in anyway shape or form you guys are totally missing the point of the basics of pvp FREAKIN dodge dodge dodge kite kite kite use ur kitten stun breakers use ur condition removals the blurred frenzy combo is among the easiest to dodge EVER!

IF you dont use your skills that can negate that combo then thats your own fault tbh you deserve to be killed 10 times over.

Dont understand what you are trying to say…are you saying that the shatter cat build is easy to counter or that all combo’s and skills in the game are perfectly balanced since you can dodge all dmg skills?

AkiraZero.8514:

the skill level needed to play a Mesmer far exceeds that of most – if not all other class bar the D/D Ele bunker build.

If we are talking WvW, i strongly disagree. The mesmer might be one of the easiest classes to play. Yes you cant spam 2 buttons and win but you can play with a bad case of tunnel vision and still survive better then near all other classes. For me degree of difficulty of a class is as much about getting the kills as it is about avoid getting killed when you are on the short end of the stick.

And compared to nearly all other classes the mesmer has better and easier to use escape tools.

And as i have said in other threads: we get useful stuff for our PvE suckiness and lack of reliable/sustained aoe.

Vewen.8016:

AkiraZero.8514:

You can easily tell when someone doesn’t play a Mesmer due to them thinking its all OP stuff with no effort… the skill level needed to play a Mesmer far exceeds that of most – if not all other class bar the D/D Ele bunker build.

We may be able to put out high damage in a few seconds, but usually once you’ve fired off your high burst as a Mesmer your left with very little else to cover your backside! We go down in a few hits, we have no real aoe’s to compensate if shatters had major cooldowns. What you see when you get hit by a mesmer is someone using everything they can muster to take you down as quickly as possible as we aren’t all bulky high def/high damage classes.

There doesn’t need to be cooldowns between shatters, using more than 1 in a row means we’re throwing out everything we have and leaving nothing in the bag, if we use them all and it doesn’t take a player down then chances are we’re going to die!

Of course Phantasms can spawn right on a target… most classes skills hit their target straight away, why should our skills wait around to die before they do anything? No phantasm should ever be able to get off more than 1 attack if the opponent is awake, they only take 1-2 hits to kill!

Being good at a Mesmer takes huge amounts of effort, its all about skill, timing and knowing your limits, where not a 1-2 button spam class like others out there that can pull of major damage with no effort at all.

If nothing else, Mesmer’s should be buffed in ways that make non shatter builds more desirable to play, right now its one of the very few ways to get any damage out of us so that’s the build everyone uses!

Quoted for truth. I’d like to play something else than the burst shatter spec in pve, but I have no choice if I want to keep up with other classes.

Try 20/0/20/0/30, with Cleric armor and Staff/Sword/Focus. High survivability + decent damage.

Konfuzfanten.6503:

Lordryux.9785:

Explain to me before the buff to shattered strength everyone was still getting owned by the Shatter Cat build. hmm explain please.

If you cant its not Op in anyway shape or form you guys are totally missing the point of the basics of pvp FREAKIN dodge dodge dodge kite kite kite use ur kitten stun breakers use ur condition removals the blurred frenzy combo is among the easiest to dodge EVER!

IF you dont use your skills that can negate that combo then thats your own fault tbh you deserve to be killed 10 times over.

Dont understand what you are trying to say…are you saying that the shatter cat build is easy to counter or that all combo’s and skills in the game are perfectly balanced since you can dodge all dmg skills?

AkiraZero.8514:

the skill level needed to play a Mesmer far exceeds that of most – if not all other class bar the D/D Ele bunker build.

If we are talking WvW, i strongly disagree. The mesmer might be one of the easiest classes to play. Yes you cant spam 2 buttons and win but you can play with a bad case of tunnel vision and still survive better then near all other classes. For me degree of difficulty of a class is as much about getting the kills as it is about avoid getting killed when you are on the short end of the stick.

And compared to nearly all other classes the mesmer has better and easier to use escape tools.

And as i have said in other threads: we get useful stuff for our PvE suckiness and lack of reliable/sustained aoe.

you really need to open your eyes and read any burst combo is fairly easy to dodge with the exception of the thief steal C&D backstab combo because of the stealth issue atm. its the whole point why you have a dodge mechanic the point why you have a stun breaker. and aswell as condition removals if the mesmer cant set up thier combo and that goes for any class if they miss it you have the chance to counter and woop they kitten and im saying shattered strength isnt the problem here its people comming on here complaining because they got shut down easily learn to dodge learn to use your skills to negate that damage and you wont have a problem with any burst from any class. especially since you are an engi dunno why your not using your elixer S i think it is? to negate that combo just as easily.

Lordryux.9785:

With that argumentation all skills(excluding thief and im gussing reta-guardian) no matter how crazy broken are fine, since you can always dodge it.
Beta arror carts? fine.
Beta ranger range weapons? fine.
Warrior? actually needs a buff, since the class got nerf a few times because it got skills that might destroy ppl if they dont dodge…

And i dont play engi, i play mesmer and guardian.

Seriously?….Were you high when you thought this up?

1.) Our shatters have CD’s…have u ever played a mesmer? I’m willing to bet the answer is a flat out no! MindWrack(F1) has a 15 sec CD and is our only attacking shatter. Cry of Frustration(F2) has a 30 sec CD for a mere 3 sec of confusion [bold]IF[/bold] we have 3 illusions on the field(phantasms or clones) [bold]AND ONLY IF[/bold] they all hit you. Diversion(F3) has a 45 sec CD for a mere 3 sec of daze if it even works half the time it seems to fail. Lastly Distortion(F4) has an insanely long 60 sec CD for a max of 3 sec of invulnerability [bold]IF[/bold] we have 3 illusions up when we pop it. So No, just no…if you don’t know then don’t speak.

2.) LOL! Unless you are spec’ed for deceptive evasion you only have 2 skills per weapon set that will create an illusion and even with deceptive evasion and mirror images + decoy(the 2 utilities to make illusions) thats a total of 9 illusions that can be generated all at once if you want to play foolishly and blow all you illusion CDs and your endurance meter for dodges and leave your self totally vulnerable which no one will do, not to mention the fact that we can only have 3 on the field at a time. Also illusions tend to die rather quickly, leaving us rather unprotected as illusion generation is our main source of damage reduction by way of deception.

3.) Hardly any targeting? If you are talkin about 1v1 scenarios we are targeting you and in non 1v1 scenarios its called AOE…what are you gunna start QQ’ing about the fact that placement AOEs such as a ele’s meteor shower allow hardly any targeting? How about you run away from the AOE plus most players know how to effectively dodge a shatter…obviously you do not.

4.) First of all the LOS issue is not true…and secondly most illusions spawn at the mesmers location baring a few such as the GS’s 2 atk but it spawns a clone that usually dies before it can be useful because its in melee range. Then theres Illusionary leap which spawns a clone that runs into melee range and dies most of the time before you can use the swap ability which is the only reason to use that skill…that clone should actually spawn at target location but it does not and it hurts us.

5.) Really?!? Confusion has the same mechanic as retaliation…do not attack when you have it on you its very simple…..

6.) Portal…a skill that deal 0 damage to you and that has an insanely short usage time once the exit portal is placed in conjunction with the fact that its CD is at least 70 sec long is what your going to try and complain about next? Please…

7.) LOL! Most of our skills are crap so having some nice elites helps and besides you complaining about fighting us in WvW since moa morph is single target it makes it rather unhelpful in WvW situations and therefore most mesmers I see, my self included do not run with it. In sPvP its used a bit more but still not as much and with time warp its simple to deal with it, do not stand in the bubble and if there are ranged players in the bubble attacking you get out of there range…I mean come on do you need some one to baby sit you and tell you how to play this game everytime someone attacks you? There is a dodge ability for a reason, and TW does not make people deal higher damage its just increased attack rate which = ^of dps but if you arent gettin hit by it by goin out of range poof problem solved. Mass invisibility is a problem for you? Thieves can stealth their party way more efficiently than us using mass invis or veil and I don’t see you complaining about them.

So do your homework before you try to rant please…

I basically disagree with the first post in this thread (as layed out earlier by other posts and my own). But some posts paint an unfair picture too. The Mesmer ain’t that weak, as some describe it. Yes we die quickly if we run out of illusions and yes, we do not deal 2k dmg with each single hit. But do we need to?

I actually had to rework my Mesmer for WvW purposes and wanted a build that works in PvE as well as WvW and I believe I found that for me. Relying on phantasms do deal direct dmg and apply bleeding and clones to also cause bleeding and fuel my shatters I am very pleased with the performance of the mesmer. I still struggle sometimes, but after 2 weeks of constant training in different WvW situations and tweaking my gear to the stats I desire, I find myself quite effective in both PvE and WvW.

Often switching my weapons, to get the most out of it, and using different weapons for WvW and PvE I think that the Mesmer (in the right hands) is very powerfull but not overpowered. Maybe there are some issues to be dealt with (clones not breaking target is one of them imho), but for the most part the Mesmer is fine as it is atm and I love playing that profession.

TyPin.9860:

I basically disagree with the first post in this thread (as layed out earlier by other posts and my own). But some posts paint an unfair picture too. The Mesmer ain’t that weak, as some describe it. Yes we die quickly if we run out of illusions and yes, we do not deal 2k dmg with each single hit. But do we need to?

I actually had to rework my Mesmer for WvW purposes and wanted a build that works in PvE as well as WvW and I believe I found that for me. Relying on phantasms do deal direct dmg and apply bleeding and clones to also cause bleeding and fuel my shatters I am very pleased with the performance of the mesmer. I still struggle sometimes, but after 2 weeks of constant training in different WvW situations and tweaking my gear to the stats I desire, I find myself quite effective in both PvE and WvW.

Often switching my weapons, to get the most out of it, and using different weapons for WvW and PvE I think that the Mesmer (in the right hands) is very powerfull but not overpowered. Maybe there are some issues to be dealt with (clones not breaking target is one of them imho), but for the most part the Mesmer is fine as it is atm and I love playing that profession.

If only more people realized that =P Mesmers are not over powered they just have a play style that most players are not used to dealing with so they QQ and beg us to be nerfed into the ground. It takes a lot of work to be a good mesmer.

Advent.1387:

TyPin.9860:

I basically disagree with the first post in this thread (as layed out earlier by other posts and my own). But some posts paint an unfair picture too. The Mesmer ain’t that weak, as some describe it. Yes we die quickly if we run out of illusions and yes, we do not deal 2k dmg with each single hit. But do we need to?

I actually had to rework my Mesmer for WvW purposes and wanted a build that works in PvE as well as WvW and I believe I found that for me. Relying on phantasms do deal direct dmg and apply bleeding and clones to also cause bleeding and fuel my shatters I am very pleased with the performance of the mesmer. I still struggle sometimes, but after 2 weeks of constant training in different WvW situations and tweaking my gear to the stats I desire, I find myself quite effective in both PvE and WvW.

Often switching my weapons, to get the most out of it, and using different weapons for WvW and PvE I think that the Mesmer (in the right hands) is very powerfull but not overpowered. Maybe there are some issues to be dealt with (clones not breaking target is one of them imho), but for the most part the Mesmer is fine as it is atm and I love playing that profession.

If only more people realized that =P Mesmers are not over powered they just have a play style that most players are not used to dealing with so they QQ and beg us to be nerfed into the ground. It takes a lot of work to be a good mesmer.

The only thing that will be looked at is shattered strength, and people abusing the F1→f2 shatter with the same clone to get an extra 9 stacks of might.

not true, they said they would be addressing the shatter build as well and it was F1→F3 not the F2

More like F3 (to get Vulnerability on your target) then F1, right?

its a f1→f3 shatter bug meaning that f3 was acting as an extra mind wrack

Okay, so you’re unhappy with the state of engineers at this moment in time; so stop subtly sending hints that you want other classes to be nerfed and instead take your problems to the engineer thread and ask for buffs.

Complaining about other classes doesn’t help anyone.

Advent.1387:

its a f1->f3 shatter bug meaning that f3 was acting as an extra mind wrack

That’s not how the bug functions. . . but regardless most of the recent Mesmer QQ is really a by product of this bug and not because the profession is horribly imbalanced.

Learn to dodge when the Mesmer summons illusions… and the illusions don’t appear at all. This also works with blocks and blinds.

Kill any misc illusions that pop up due to your own errors.

Grats! You can now shut down any Mesmer. Yes… it really is that kitten simple.

I wonder how much whining and crying the dev’s actually put up with before they will actually start caving in to the demands of the bads that refuse to learn how to play.

I wonder at what point there becomes a demand for what people have been playing before their whining is listened to. There’s a definite need to separate WvW, PvE, tPvP, and sPvP when discussing game dynamics, and also separate what sort of build somebody was using. Glass cannons are ill equipped to deal with certain builds as are Bunkers.

Plus add in skill level to sPvP and WvW. Even when they have managed to put a rating system in place the hot join and open world game styles do not have any such controls and restrictions, and I have a hard time imagining them ever putting that in place for casual play.

What will they do… what will they do.

just another person playing a diffrent proffession trying to make it where other professions get nerfed…….mesmer is obviously not op so stop QQing

seriously coming from an engineer as well,
this guy needs to learn his class… Engs adapt to anything.
So learn to change your style to counter a mesmer..

mikeson.7605:

seriously coming from an engineer as well,
this guy needs to learn his class… Engs adapt to anything.
So learn to change your style to counter a mesmer..

exactly =P

welp doesnt matter now we are getting nerfed simple to put it brace yourselfs because we all know how anet likes to make friends with the complaining cry babies these days so manyy many many threads of how OP shatter build is cant wait to see wat thier going to do

the funny thing is even with all they’ve been doin to us because of the QQ threads we are still owning ppl and making making ppl cry xD Its not that our class is OP we are just more skilled than the noobs who post all these QQ threads so it seems like we are OP haha

Heh – worst part is … if the whingers get shatter kittened over, then what? They’re gonna cry ’bout condi builds next? Pussies.

One thing to keep in mind – for both sides of the argument:
Perspective is everything.

For us Mesmers, we see our failures, our long utility CDs, our constant nerfs, our broken mechanics and horrible traits.
For someone facing is, more often than not they see CDs wasted on clones, clone-spam and our evasive mechanics.

Perspective.

Thing is, Carighan – how many Mes players pull the ‘go to another class’ forum and twitch the frell out cause they killed me’ mess? Or do we, as a whole, figure out a new tactical spread/build set? That’s what gets me. I pack one of kitten near every class at some level (except Warrior, atm.) and don’t go about giving Class “X” poop due to losing a fight with ’em. I simply swap my stuff around and go back at the bastid.

Advent.6193:

Thing is, Carighan – how many Mes players pull the ‘go to another class’ forum and twitch the frell out cause they killed me’ mess? Or do we, as a whole, figure out a new tactical spread/build set? That’s what gets me. I pack one of kitten near every class at some level (except Warrior, atm.) and don’t go about giving Class “X” poop due to losing a fight with ’em. I simply swap my stuff around and go back at the bastid.

I raged on thief forums a week ago cuz he 2 shotted me xD lol that Steal and backstab is no joke :P

through all of it, i say mesmers are the strongest class in the game. toe to toe vs each class the mesmer will win reguardless if they know how to play it.

Convict.8526:

through all of it, i say mesmers are the strongest class in the game. toe to toe vs each class the mesmer will win reguardless if they know how to play it.

Only against opponents who are completely clueless. And apparently there seems to be no shortage of those.

A Mesmer that doesn’t know how to play his class will die over and over again until he gets fed up with it and rolls a Warrior or Thief.

I just read the title of this thread. Mesmers are a squishy, underpowered, utility class. If we’re that great, go roll one and enjoy.

The mesmer does not need nerfs. Is your engineer that needs buffs. Altough after i’ve seen an engineer, not even level 80, trolling an entire 4 man group in WvW without dieng, i’m pretty sure the engineer has it’s own strong points.

Why can’t people understand that nerfing 5 proffesions because 2 of them are UP is not the way to go…

Well I’ve max lvl mesmer but I stopped playing it because I don’t like mesmer playstyle so much.

However. I have to say they get a little bit too much everything in PvP. Okay clones fine, shatter fine… but then they also get crazy damage from GS (check yourselves it’s crazy) plus at least some confusion dmg which is much more annoying than i.e. retaliation. Some builds also do pretty insane confusion dmg.

My general complaint is a bit questionably high damage output (auto attack+handy other skills) while having ton of clones to avoid damage yourself in GS builds. This is what I noted while playing mesmer myself. Not to mention pretty powerful downed state skills. I moved to mesmer after playing necro and I was pretty amazed with downed state, heh.

Just 5 cents.

jalmari.3906:

Well I’ve max lvl mesmer but I stopped playing it because I don’t like mesmer playstyle so much.

However. I have to say they get a little bit too much everything in PvP. Okay clones fine, shatter fine… but then they also get crazy damage from GS (check yourselves it’s crazy) plus at least some confusion dmg which is much more annoying than i.e. retaliation. Some builds also do pretty insane confusion dmg.

My general complaint is a bit questionably high damage output while having ton of clones to avoid damage yourself in GS builds. This is what I noted while playing mesmer myself.

Just 5 cents.

GS is probably the easiest to counter of all Mesmer weapons.

Autoattack? Get in melee range and gg
Mirror Blade? Dodge the slow projectile
Mind Stab? Does anybody even use this in PVP?
Berserker? Just watch for the animation (very recognizable) and dodge
Knockback? Can’t do much about that, but high cooldown and low damage

Back on topic:

Mesmers get too much…

… whining on their forums

It’s been said already, but I cannot stress this enough. Play a Mesmer for yourself and figure out how to beat them. It’s not as hard as you might think.

jalmari.3906:

Well I’ve max lvl mesmer but I stopped playing it because I don’t like mesmer playstyle so much.

However. I have to say they get a little bit too much everything in PvP. Okay clones fine, shatter fine… but then they also get crazy damage from GS (check yourselves it’s crazy) plus at least some confusion dmg which is much more annoying than i.e. retaliation. Some builds also do pretty insane confusion dmg.

Greatsword damage is actually around on par with the longbow from rangers at 1200range if I remember that test correctly.

Confusion if you spec for conditions is beast, other than that its an annoying shortlived condition

jalmari.3906:

My general complaint is a bit questionably high damage output (auto attack+handy other skills) while having ton of clones to avoid damage yourself in GS builds. This is what I noted while playing mesmer myself. Not to mention pretty powerful downed state skills. I moved to mesmer after playing necro and I was pretty amazed with downed state, heh.

Just 5 cents.

Your going to notice that the mesmer has a lot better damage than the necro, and the ele has a lot better damage than the mesmer.
Its not that the mesmer is OP damage wise ( discounting the bug that we all anticipate will be fixed). Its that the necro isnt made to put out the damage of the ele or mesmer.

And the mesmer downed state < Ele Downed state :P

I only have one real issue with mesmer. The number of stunbreakers available to you guys is fine. Their cool downs are way to short. Shatter is a little OP in melee and yes your elite skills are insanely good. Too good. But not OP. And yeah I did I do the play for a week thing. Honestly Mesmer is still OP and easy but not OP in the, “Nerf it to the ground!”, way.

Things I noticed is that its slow really slow. Its got great range but its chase down is garbage. AOE = Laughable I could do more dps with a shortbow thief (in fact I do). Utility? When was the last time you saw some one run Mantras? DPS sort of tricky. Confusion vs a player is kitten near OP in WvW (but the game isnt balanced around that) in Spvp its still a little much. Confusion in PvE is a joke. Most mobs swing far too infrequently. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blurred_Frenzy is still the most OP piece of crap skill. Either other skill like it get brought up or it gets toned down (probably neither will happen).

And on a little note as far as PvE goes mesmers are useful for portal and that’s about it. Not insulting you guys (support specs need some love) but its like thief. Half the time you know another class would probably be better for the party.

As far as the skill threshold. After months of ele all those arguments sound and smell like bullkitten. After play mesmer still sound like bullkitten. You have a rotation and all your really doing is timing. On ele I wont even start a damage rotation till chaos storm is dropped. There is a rotation you can spot it. Honestly you know don’t you guys? Its not really that hard. Some ele admit it to stop acting leet and admit it.

A short story my second toon in this game was a mesmer. I went to WvW at level 20 and proceeded to drop full exo 80s with GS and Staff. It felt really OP to me. I went into PvE and every fight early on was a struggle whilst I watched warriors and thieves brush through content. PvP felt OP pve UP. So I shelved and eventually deleted the toon. I don’t think the story has changed much. In PvP 1v1 mesmer is a force. However in PvE its a one trick pony.

Instead of crying nerf this or that try and see the big picture. Sure mesmer is loved in Tpvp and is a monster in WvW but in PVE its lack luster and honestly might be the lowest class on the bracket. That might be the cost of being boss. Thieves are very much the same. Sure they can rez and help you grab skill nodes but what else is there? Blast finishers no cd except init.

The dynamics of the Memser give it too much offensive and defensive ability at the same time. The Mesmer is the only profession in this game that can easily battle 3 other players and come out on top.

mesmer is not op you guys just suck at your class and cant figure out how to counter a mesmer wich is very so you want it nerfed you QQ about clones that you can 1 hit to get them out of the way wich is pretty much are Defens people kill you because your too busy QQin on here instead of learning how to play your class

If mesmer is so OP why are the majority of top tier players and top ranked teams not mesmers? Though there are some, the ones who are not seem to do perfectly fine against mesmers.

I’m pretty sure it’s a skill issue on your part if you feel the need to complain.

I get lost in the clones too, esp when anyone r30+ doesn’t have a star and keeps tittle turned off. But that’s my personal lack of skill and something to over come not QQ about.

Constantine.7812:

mesmer is op class, and ppl who say they arent are ppl playing mesmers. anet pls also do something about those dozens of clones coming out on me during few seconds when im vs mesmer cuz its really ridiculous thx. mesmer is op, end of story.

You’re just bad, sorry.

That’s not to say that there aren’t some OP things about a mesmer, but if you haven’t figured out the clone game yet, you’re not trying or paying attention.

Sigh. I’m sorry OP but you have misunderstood a lot about the class and how it works. As many others have already said, roll a level 2 Mesmer in sPVP and you will quickly understand what other Mesmers are doing to beat you and therefore what you need to beat them.

If you haven’t got time to do that, I recommend asking on the Engineer forums how to combat Mesmers. I guarantee you there will be many people rolling Engineers who know exactly how to take down Mesmers with the skills available to them.