Guild Wars 2

I am not a pro Mesmer player but even a starter would realize the difference between normal evade and Cloak…

I mean at least it should make you faster right? I don’t think Mesmers would give up an evade for 3/4 seconds Distortion which doesn’t give you any mobility.

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Have they said that elite specs are supposed to be upgraded? Because last I saw they said they were supposed to be side grades IE no overall improvement, just variation. But that was back when HoT was announced so their stance could’ve changed.

If it did change, yes, a blink would be fantastic, if not they better make superspeed work in all directions, but if they do it’d be alright.

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Have they said that elite specs are supposed to be upgraded? Because last I saw they said they were supposed to be side grades IE no overall improvement, just variation. But that was back when HoT was announced so their stance could’ve changed.

If it did change, yes, a blink would be fantastic, if not they better make superspeed work in all directions, but if they do it’d be alright.

They have changed. And yes, I don’t know the normal evade’s range but I’ll take it as 500, and I expect them to make a blink with 250 range.

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Have they said that elite specs are supposed to be upgraded? Because last I saw they said they were supposed to be side grades IE no overall improvement, just variation. But that was back when HoT was announced so their stance could’ve changed.

If it did change, yes, a blink would be fantastic, if not they better make superspeed work in all directions, but if they do it’d be alright.

No but nerfing gen 1 to gen 2 lvls wont happen so might as well buff gen 2 to their lvl.

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Have they said that elite specs are supposed to be upgraded? Because last I saw they said they were supposed to be side grades IE no overall improvement, just variation. But that was back when HoT was announced so their stance could’ve changed.

If it did change, yes, a blink would be fantastic, if not they better make superspeed work in all directions, but if they do it’d be alright.

They have changed. And yes, I don’t know the normal evade’s range but I’ll take it as 500, and I expect them to make a blink with 250 range.

You have a link to where they said they changed their mind? Because until then it’s just them kittening up on numbers.

And normal dodge roll is 300 units

The underlying idea is sound. Trade defensive value (the movement) for offensive (the ambush).

That’s where the good ends. The ambushes are so badly balanced that most of the time I wish I could AA instead, and as a result the gain in damage can’t remotely hope to keep up with the loss of defense.

Further, beyond normal dodging our ability to gain cloak through mirrors is just… poor. Generation is astonishingly bad, and they last ~3x-4x too short. Should be 8-12 seconds.

Carighan.6758:

The underlying idea is sound. Trade defensive value (the movement) for offensive (the ambush).

That’s where the good ends. The ambushes are so badly balanced that most of the time I wish I could AA instead, and as a result the gain in damage can’t remotely hope to keep up with the loss of defense.

Further, beyond normal dodging our ability to gain cloak through mirrors is just… poor. Generation is astonishingly bad, and they last ~3x-4x too short. Should be 8-12 seconds.

play holosmith or scourge or spellbreaker seems to be best solution to me until anet rework mirage from ground .

musu.9205:

Carighan.6758:

The underlying idea is sound. Trade defensive value (the movement) for offensive (the ambush).

That’s where the good ends. The ambushes are so badly balanced that most of the time I wish I could AA instead, and as a result the gain in damage can’t remotely hope to keep up with the loss of defense.

Further, beyond normal dodging our ability to gain cloak through mirrors is just… poor. Generation is astonishingly bad, and they last ~3x-4x too short. Should be 8-12 seconds.

play holosmith or scourge or spellbreaker seems to be best solution to me until anet rework mirage from ground .

Which wont happen because it doesnt need it.

@Zealex – Do you think mirage doesn’t need to be reworked? Not even mirrors and ambush attacks? Can you tell us truthfully that the traitline is cohesive, has internal synergy, has synergy with core mesmer traits and is overall a very strong traitline?

@OP -Mirage cloak in and of itself is a great mechanic. I actually really love it. The only things that it needs aren’t improvements to mirage cloak itself but the sources of it. We could stand to gain a bit more mirage cloak (maybe 1 second like others have suggested, or alternatively have superspeed to work while going backwards and sideways to still take us to max movement speed), possibly have a longer window for ambush attacks, have better ambush attacks. But the cloak itself is fine imo

The ambush and mirror mechanics are just bad.

Ambush skills are hard to execute and the effect is very weak. They are so telegraphed and I don’t see how they are ‘ambush’. These skills will be so easy to avoid or interrupt. They are nothing like thief stealth attacks which are true ambushes.

Mirror spawn location is bad and they exist for such a short time that it is almost impossible to make use of them.

The sad truth is that so many of mirage’s new skills and traits evolve around these 2 mechanics. All of them turn out to be underwhelming due to how poor these 2 feature mechanics are implemented.

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Have they said that elite specs are supposed to be upgraded? Because last I saw they said they were supposed to be side grades IE no overall improvement, just variation. But that was back when HoT was announced so their stance could’ve changed.

If it did change, yes, a blink would be fantastic, if not they better make superspeed work in all directions, but if they do it’d be alright.

They have changed. And yes, I don’t know the normal evade’s range but I’ll take it as 500, and I expect them to make a blink with 250 range.

You have a link to where they said they changed their mind? Because until then it’s just them kittening up on numbers.

And normal dodge roll is 300 units

Yeah, they kittened up numbers for over 2 years now and by a very high margin.

Man I wish I had the amount of delusions some people bring to these arguments.

OriOri.8724:

@Zealex – Do you think mirage doesn’t need to be reworked? Not even mirrors and ambush attacks? Can you tell us truthfully that the traitline is cohesive, has internal synergy, has synergy with core mesmer traits and is overall a very strong traitline?

@OP -Mirage cloak in and of itself is a great mechanic. I actually really love it. The only things that it needs aren’t improvements to mirage cloak itself but the sources of it. We could stand to gain a bit more mirage cloak (maybe 1 second like others have suggested, or alternatively have superspeed to work while going backwards and sideways to still take us to max movement speed), possibly have a longer window for ambush attacks, have better ambush attacks. But the cloak itself is fine imo

Imo utilities that provide mirrors should change to a return to mirror skill for the durr of the mirror much like a shadow step back.

As feint had said removing the icd on ambush skills will make them better. The furthest in terms of changes i would do to ambush skills is make scepter not a root and make their projectiles better at tracking the enemy (something like unload and and the projectiles rev’s staff 3 sents after a block). Removing the icd woul prob make them somewhat spamable hance giving them alot more streinght.

I was thinking of buffing their numbers in terms of dmg. But these arent thief ambush skills thief’s acess to stealth is argueably less than the acess mirage has to evade frames there for you can way more often deal this dmg.

As for th traits i ahve suggested changes tht imo would make mirror generation and clone generation an easier thing to achieve in a respectable lvl.

Imo the trade of of somewhat more limited movement during dodge (even tho that could might as well be changed if they make superspeed work on any direction) is worth compaired to the supperior utility this dodge provides us with.

The biggest steps to a rework i suggested was merging the shadow step utils into 1 skill where you saddowstep and your illusions retarget with a second skil apearing that allows you to sadowstep back where you were.

Id also rework from the ground the gs ambush as it is uninspired and take fay’s suggestion to staff ambush. These imo arent necessary tho just in terms of flavour.

Thought it would also be fun if we had an f5 that would teleport you on a mirror created by a shattered illusion (somewhat limited since mirror generation through shatters is limited)

In the end of the day this were my takes from the 2 hour window i had to play mirage i played a build around interupt power based mirage with sword that creates openings for shatters and burst. Ppl can say its hard to reliably land the daze but theres a big number of long channeled skills that already exist in the game or where added with pof. I had a pretty decent daze and interuption rate (considering im absolute helltrash at pvp and clearly im oblivious to mesmer ).

But in the end ill be happy with whatever mirage gets be it a total rework or the existing capabilities of the mirage further polished ans somewhat buffed. Just that imo a total rework would be alot of unecesary resources. /shrug

Cyninja.2954:

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Have they said that elite specs are supposed to be upgraded? Because last I saw they said they were supposed to be side grades IE no overall improvement, just variation. But that was back when HoT was announced so their stance could’ve changed.

If it did change, yes, a blink would be fantastic, if not they better make superspeed work in all directions, but if they do it’d be alright.

They have changed. And yes, I don’t know the normal evade’s range but I’ll take it as 500, and I expect them to make a blink with 250 range.

You have a link to where they said they changed their mind? Because until then it’s just them kittening up on numbers.

And normal dodge roll is 300 units

Yeah, they kittened up numbers for over 2 years now and by a very high margin.

Man I wish I had the amount of delusions some people bring to these arguments.

Have you not seen Mesmers damage for the last 2 years? Or Ventari rev healing? Or Power reaper? Anet hasn’t been known for getting the numbers right

Durzlla.6295:

Cyninja.2954:

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Have they said that elite specs are supposed to be upgraded? Because last I saw they said they were supposed to be side grades IE no overall improvement, just variation. But that was back when HoT was announced so their stance could’ve changed.

If it did change, yes, a blink would be fantastic, if not they better make superspeed work in all directions, but if they do it’d be alright.

They have changed. And yes, I don’t know the normal evade’s range but I’ll take it as 500, and I expect them to make a blink with 250 range.

You have a link to where they said they changed their mind? Because until then it’s just them kittening up on numbers.

And normal dodge roll is 300 units

Yeah, they kittened up numbers for over 2 years now and by a very high margin.

Man I wish I had the amount of delusions some people bring to these arguments.

Have you not seen Mesmers damage for the last 2 years? Or Ventari rev healing? Or Power reaper? Anet hasn’t been known for getting the numbers right

Is something wrong with ventari heal rev?

Can you Mirage during an action and not interrupt it?

Durzlla has got to be the only person who still believes that elite specs aren’t upgrades to the core class.

Notice how he doesn’t go around to other class forums and ask for other elite specs to be brought down, he just sits here and insists that the one elite spec weaker then the core spec is fine.

Justine.6351:

Can you Mirage during an action and not interrupt it?

every action really.

Levetty.1279:

Durzlla has got to be the only person who still believes that elite specs aren’t upgrades to the core class.

Notice how he doesn’t go around to other class forums and ask for other elite specs to be brought down, he just sits here and insists that the one elite spec weaker then the core spec is fine.

I don’t go around to other class forums period, and regardless I’ve said the tier 1 elite specs have been too strong since they came out.

Durzlla.6295:

Levetty.1279:

Durzlla has got to be the only person who still believes that elite specs aren’t upgrades to the core class.

Notice how he doesn’t go around to other class forums and ask for other elite specs to be brought down, he just sits here and insists that the one elite spec weaker then the core spec is fine.

I don’t go around to other class forums period, and regardless I’ve said the tier 1 elite specs have been too strong since they came out.

Yes, well that ship sailed about 2 years ago didn’t it. Elite specs are a hard upgrade in almost all situations, this is not a debatable point. Whether Anet originally intended this or not no longer matters. The reality of what exists in the game is what matters.

Durzlla.6295:

Cyninja.2954:

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Have they said that elite specs are supposed to be upgraded? Because last I saw they said they were supposed to be side grades IE no overall improvement, just variation. But that was back when HoT was announced so their stance could’ve changed.

If it did change, yes, a blink would be fantastic, if not they better make superspeed work in all directions, but if they do it’d be alright.

They have changed. And yes, I don’t know the normal evade’s range but I’ll take it as 500, and I expect them to make a blink with 250 range.

You have a link to where they said they changed their mind? Because until then it’s just them kittening up on numbers.

And normal dodge roll is 300 units

Yeah, they kittened up numbers for over 2 years now and by a very high margin.

Man I wish I had the amount of delusions some people bring to these arguments.

Have you not seen Mesmers damage for the last 2 years? Or Ventari rev healing? Or Power reaper? Anet hasn’t been known for getting the numbers right

Have you seen Mesmer damage for oh I don’t know, since launch?

Ventari Revenant healing is actually quite powerful and received multiple buffs over the HoT lifespan (like alacrity upgrade). It’s just still inferior to druid and as such less desired.

Power repear also received multiple buffs and greatsword even received a rework to bring th numbers and the build up.

I’m not sure what those 3 build are supposed to show besides elites being more powerful than core (except for mesmer for which the community had some hilarious facepalms on some of the balance and upgrade decisions over the last 2 years like might for phantasms proving that arenanet does not understand the class).

You are deluded and are either so inexperienced with the classes and elite builds in this game, or are to dense to accept that every single elite spec from generation 1 was a tremendous upgrade and still remains a tremendous upgrade to this day.

Durzlla.6295:

Levetty.1279:

Durzlla has got to be the only person who still believes that elite specs aren’t upgrades to the core class.

Notice how he doesn’t go around to other class forums and ask for other elite specs to be brought down, he just sits here and insists that the one elite spec weaker then the core spec is fine.

I don’t go around to other class forums period, and regardless I’ve said the tier 1 elite specs have been too strong since they came out.

So you agree then that elite specs have been power upgrades for the last 2 years? So what makes you come back to your ridiculous notion that they should not be or aren’t designed as such?

No matter what arenanet intended, they either failed miserably for over 2 years, or they designed elite specialisation with them being upgrades in mind. Both possibilities mean that elite specs will remain upgrades and the generation 2 ones do not break that trend, some of the coming up ones are very far off the power scale compared to core builds.

zealex.9410:

Which wont happen because it doesnt need it.

True. As beneficial as it would be (because let’s be honest, this spec was done from nothing but a name, no one had a concept they were following on a gameplay level, it’s quite noticeable), it’s not necessary. Just needs:

• Lots more mirror production. Make all Deception skills spawn mirrors, and give shatter skills mirror production if phantasms are shattered.
• x3-x7 damage on the ambush skills depending on which one it is.
• Mirrors last ~10 seconds.
• If this turns out too strong, make enemies able to destroy mirrors by touching them, but this generates a clone if a spot is free.

Carighan.6758:

zealex.9410:

Which wont happen because it doesnt need it.

True. As beneficial as it would be (because let’s be honest, this spec was done from nothing but a name, no one had a concept they were following on a gameplay level, it’s quite noticeable), it’s not necessary. Just needs:

• Lots more mirror production. Make all Deception skills spawn mirrors, and give shatter skills mirror production if phantasms are shattered.
• x3-x7 damage on the ambush skills depending on which one it is.
• Mirrors last ~10 seconds.
• If this turns out too strong, make enemies able to destroy mirrors by touching them, but this generates a clone if a spot is free.

I would pick 1 or the other u cant have ambush hit like thief’s and have them 5 times more accessible. Sure we can make some qol changes to some ambush skills and gs needs a decent power buff but if you are able to access cloak alot of the time then the dmg should remain the same.

The third would make sense to have an icd of like 10-12sec.

I don’t know why so many of you seem to think that me saying the elite specs shouldn’t be upgrades means that I don’t realize they currently are upgrades, whether intentional or not by abets part.

zealex.9410:

Carighan.6758:

zealex.9410:

Which wont happen because it doesnt need it.

True. As beneficial as it would be (because let’s be honest, this spec was done from nothing but a name, no one had a concept they were following on a gameplay level, it’s quite noticeable), it’s not necessary. Just needs:

• Lots more mirror production. Make all Deception skills spawn mirrors, and give shatter skills mirror production if phantasms are shattered.
• x3-x7 damage on the ambush skills depending on which one it is.
• Mirrors last ~10 seconds.
• If this turns out too strong, make enemies able to destroy mirrors by touching them, but this generates a clone if a spot is free.

I would pick 1 or the other u cant have ambush hit like thief’s and have them 5 times more accessible. Sure we can make some qol changes to some ambush skills and gs needs a decent power buff but if you are able to access cloak alot of the time then the dmg should remain the same.

The third would make sense to have an icd of like 10-12sec.

I fully disagree, you absolutely could have then hit harder and available more often because it’d be balanced by the fact you need to run over to said mirrors to trigger them. Not to mention you’d be running over to them on a spec that is less mobile than base Mesmer unless you’re running jaunt, which would both make jaunt worth taking as an elite (super damage elite via mirror pick up), and still leave counter play for enemies in PvP by not letting you get to mirrors in the first place.

Durzlla.6295:

zealex.9410:

Carighan.6758:

zealex.9410:

Which wont happen because it doesnt need it.

True. As beneficial as it would be (because let’s be honest, this spec was done from nothing but a name, no one had a concept they were following on a gameplay level, it’s quite noticeable), it’s not necessary. Just needs:

• Lots more mirror production. Make all Deception skills spawn mirrors, and give shatter skills mirror production if phantasms are shattered.
• x3-x7 damage on the ambush skills depending on which one it is.
• Mirrors last ~10 seconds.
• If this turns out too strong, make enemies able to destroy mirrors by touching them, but this generates a clone if a spot is free.

I would pick 1 or the other u cant have ambush hit like thief’s and have them 5 times more accessible. Sure we can make some qol changes to some ambush skills and gs needs a decent power buff but if you are able to access cloak alot of the time then the dmg should remain the same.

The third would make sense to have an icd of like 10-12sec.

I fully disagree, you absolutely could have then hit harder and available more often because it’d be balanced by the fact you need to run over to said mirrors to trigger them. Not to mention you’d be running over to them on a spec that is less mobile than base Mesmer unless you’re running jaunt, which would both make jaunt worth taking as an elite (super damage elite via mirror pick up), and still leave counter play for enemies in PvP by not letting you get to mirrors in the first place.

I prefer having the ability to teleport to these mirros through a second skill on the utils that summon one. At least then take the mirror u left back wont make you look like a clown.

Durzlla.6295:

I don’t know why so many of you seem to think that me saying the elite specs shouldn’t be upgrades means that I don’t realize they currently are upgrades, whether intentional or not by abets part.

It’s not that you are saying that elite specs should not be upgrades but more that you are using this line of thought as an argument to justify shortcoming in Mirage.

It’s fine to have a disscussion about if elite specs should or should not be more powerful, but until one or the other is implemented (and currently they clearly are upgrades) you can’t go off arguing that single elite specs should not be upgrades.

Elite specs are upgrades, period. Every argument that stuff is okay based around elite specs not being upgrades is currently invalid until the time when arenanet either:

- declare their goal will be to tone down elite specs
- they actively tone down all elite specs to be sidegrades to core builds.

Or they can create a F5 that allows you to blink to the mirror that’s currently in the world. If you have multiply mirrors in the world then you’ll be able to blink X amount of times to each one, allowing you to trigger the Cloak better.

Or create a F5 that creates this sort of feigned death by shattering yourself, causing you to detarget and become stealthed for 3s.

zealex.9410:

Justine.6351:

Can you Mirage during an action and not interrupt it?

every action really.

So that makes it good in that way then, cool.

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Idk scepter laser beam. Rallying an ally. Stomping a foe. Interacting with thingies where you channel and interupts are counter play mechanic. Laying traps in wvw. Not sure if you can Mirage during this stuff though.

0.75 duration dodge isn’t really long though. It would only cover one spell/action for the duration. Adding the fact that we don’t have that much means of generating endurance.

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

So play chronomancer.

Justine.6351:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

So play chronomancer.

I am (and I even play core power mesmer), I just don’t take to bs arguments about things being useful when they are not.

Cyninja.2954:

Justine.6351:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

So play chronomancer.

I am (and I even play core power mesmer), I just don’t take to bs arguments about things being useful when they are not.

People will find ways to utilize Mirage dodge. Ask any ele, ranger or rev how good it feels to get warded in aoe with their only option as dodge, burning retreat, lightning reflexes or phase retreat. It’s going to be wierd at first but I think it will be appreciated.

Justine.6351:

Cyninja.2954:

Justine.6351:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

So play chronomancer.

I am (and I even play core power mesmer), I just don’t take to bs arguments about things being useful when they are not.

People will find ways to utilize Mirage dodge. Ask any ele, ranger or rev how good it feels to get warded in aoe with their only option as dodge, burning retreat, lightning reflexes or phase retreat. It’s going to be wierd at first but I think it will be appreciated.

Did you see me mention elementalist and how great Mirage dodge would be on that class? Apply this knowledge to any other class which actually has cast times.

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

Idk i must be the only one then that can go mass invis in the middle of the fight to create breathing room.

Idk i play alot of duels and enjoy romaikf in both instances a thief or a mesmer will and can interupt gs2 and 4

Instead of use a dodge with hardky a few secs of down time i should use my f4 which is well over prob 40-50 sec cd :thinking:

Cyninja.2954:

Justine.6351:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

So play chronomancer.

I am (and I even play core power mesmer), I just don’t take to bs arguments about things being useful when they are not.

Unare just salty that mirage isnt chrono lvls of strong. Like it could ever rival one of the most if not the strongest elite spec.

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

Justine.6351:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

So play chronomancer.

I am (and I even play core power mesmer), I just don’t take to bs arguments about things being useful when they are not.

Unare just salty that mirage isnt chrono lvls of strong. Like it could ever rival one of the most if not the strongest elite spec.

Hahahahahahahaha, right….. that’s what got most oldschool mesmer going atm, we are salty because Mirage is not on par with Chrono. Man you really do live in your own world.

Cyninja.2954:

Justine.6351:

Cyninja.2954:

Justine.6351:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

So play chronomancer.

I am (and I even play core power mesmer), I just don’t take to bs arguments about things being useful when they are not.

People will find ways to utilize Mirage dodge. Ask any ele, ranger or rev how good it feels to get warded in aoe with their only option as dodge, burning retreat, lightning reflexes or phase retreat. It’s going to be wierd at first but I think it will be appreciated.

Did you see me mention elementalist and how great Mirage dodge would be on that class? Apply this knowledge to any other class which actually has cast times.

You are hung up on skill-fact cast times way too much.

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

Justine.6351:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Cyninja.2954:

zealex.9410:

Refia Montes.3205:

It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.

Why wouldnt it? It give you a insurance that every channel every burst every part of your rotation can be pulled off without getting killed cced interupted.

Aside from mantras which have their very own issues, how many actually non instant spells do you run on your mesmer?

Exactly, nearly none.

Mirage dodge would be amazing on a class like elementalist. Less so on mesmer.

Well gs in general, sword ambush? moa and mass invis, mantras as you mentioned any heal really.

GS? Let;s go through the GS skills shall we:

GS1 – useless at close range, no reason to cover or protect the cast at long range
GS2 – instant (well 3/4 of a cast but that’s nothing someone will ever interupt)
GS3 – instant (1/4 cast, absolutely unintertuptable)
GS4 – 1 second cast (almost instant) which is far more important to be used when the enemy can’t dodge or interupt it.
GS5 – 1/2 cast, uninteruptable basically

Moa – far more important for the enemy not to dodge or evade it thus needs to get used strategically. How often were you interupted on a Moa cast? Oh yes, It’s also a 1 second cast, sooo hard to not get countered on

Mass Invis – when exactly are you using MI that any protection would be required? When you are engaging trying to get a jump on the enemy when they haven’t spoted you yet? Very useful.

What about when you are trying to get away? In that case you F4 and MI, done.

You are making yourself look even foolisher than usuall. Mesmer has no need of the Mirage protection mechanic.

So play chronomancer.

I am (and I even play core power mesmer), I just don’t take to bs arguments about things being useful when they are not.

Unare just salty that mirage isnt chrono lvls of strong. Like it could ever rival one of the most if not the strongest elite spec.

Hahahahahahahaha, right….. that’s what got most oldschool mesmer going atm, we are salty because Mirage is not on par with Chrono. Man you really do live in your own world.

/shrug

Cyninja.2954:

Durzlla.6295:

I don’t know why so many of you seem to think that me saying the elite specs shouldn’t be upgrades means that I don’t realize they currently are upgrades, whether intentional or not by abets part.

It’s not that you are saying that elite specs should not be upgrades but more that you are using this line of thought as an argument to justify shortcoming in Mirage.

It’s fine to have a disscussion about if elite specs should or should not be more powerful, but until one or the other is implemented (and currently they clearly are upgrades) you can’t go off arguing that single elite specs should not be upgrades.

Elite specs are upgrades, period. Every argument that stuff is okay based around elite specs not being upgrades is currently invalid until the time when arenanet either:

- declare their goal will be to tone down elite specs
- they actively tone down all elite specs to be sidegrades to core builds.

That’s fair, I’m more hoping that mirage, and Soulbeast are at the power level they are wanting elite specs to go towards and that the others will be meted down, but as I’ve mentioned in several other threads, if their intent is that elite specs are an upgrade then Mirage is woefully underperforming.

Durzlla.6295:

Cyninja.2954:

Durzlla.6295:

I don’t know why so many of you seem to think that me saying the elite specs shouldn’t be upgrades means that I don’t realize they currently are upgrades, whether intentional or not by abets part.

It’s not that you are saying that elite specs should not be upgrades but more that you are using this line of thought as an argument to justify shortcoming in Mirage.

It’s fine to have a disscussion about if elite specs should or should not be more powerful, but until one or the other is implemented (and currently they clearly are upgrades) you can’t go off arguing that single elite specs should not be upgrades.

Elite specs are upgrades, period. Every argument that stuff is okay based around elite specs not being upgrades is currently invalid until the time when arenanet either:

- declare their goal will be to tone down elite specs
- they actively tone down all elite specs to be sidegrades to core builds.

That’s fair, I’m more hoping that mirage, and Soulbeast are at the power level they are wanting elite specs to go towards and that the others will be meted down, but as I’ve mentioned in several other threads, if their intent is that elite specs are an upgrade then Mirage is woefully underperforming.

Well regardless of how much buffing mirage gets chrono just has some too powerfull stuff going for it.

While the sound and visual effect of the mirrors are nice, I don’t care for the gameplay of picking up “powerups”.

It’s really gimmicky.

I’d rather mirrors be an optional supplementary mechanic that you can choose to trait for/build into or not. Sure I agree every Deception skill should drop a mirror, and shatters should drop mirrors – but I don’t want mirrors flying out of our kitten every few seconds because for me it’s not elegant gameplay IMO.

I’d rather they focus on the ambushes and sustain of clones through evade sharing (really want IH baseline).

zealex.9410:

I would pick 1 or the other u cant have ambush hit like thief’s and have them 5 times more accessible. Sure we can make some qol changes to some ambush skills and gs needs a decent power buff but if you are able to access cloak alot of the time then the dmg should remain the same.

Frankly ignoring scepter, those damage increases would merely make the ambush skills not be AAs with weird graphics. And the Scepter roots you, whenever you dodge, in the middle of your AA chain.

Aren’t ambush skills supposed to be stronger than just attacking regularly?