Guild Wars 2

( Click here for more lockdown Mesmer info!)

So, apparently, the devs do pay attention to our class forums. I’m like 90% positive that the lockdown buffs we’re seeing are a direct result of the lockdown mesmer initiative we’ve started here in the Mesmer subforum. No where else is there such a wealth of information and discussion on the previously-underexplored playstyle.

I wanted to take a look at the exciting new Domination trait Power Lock and how it’ll affect the Lockdown Mesmer in the future.

POWER LOCK
Interrupted skills go on a 10 second cooldown rather than 5

• Why is this important?
  Locking out a skill for 10 seconds can be game-changing depending on the situation. If putting the enemy heal on a 10 second cooldown (mostly versus Elementalists, Necros, & Mesmer) wasn’t rough enough, lets not forget about the Chill condition. Chill makes skills take 66% longer to cooldown, combined with power lock this can get really nasty. Things like Chaotic Interruption, Sigils of Hydromancy, and Runes of Grenth are all easy ways for a Mesmer to proc chill, and with 30 Dom/Grenth Runes alone we have a 50% chill duration, meaning that if even 1 of our weapons has a Hydromancy Sigils (w/Grenth Runes) a heal and weaponswap is 9 seconds of chill or about an additional 5s cooldown. With Power Lock, we now have the ability to put skills on an estimated 15 second cooldown!

• Versus Confounding Suggestions/Harmonius Mantras
  Power Lock has some stiff competition. Confounding Suggestions (25% daze duration, 50% chance for a 1s stun) allows Mesmer to add a vicious chain-dazing element to their playstyle. I’m assuming both Runes of the Mesmer and Sigil of Paralyzation are also getting buffs in this patch, which could make Confounding a strong competitor to Power Lock, yet for now I don’t think either one is a better trait (atleast not in the same way Imbued Diversion is overshadowed by iPersona). Harmonious Mantras is similar. While a good trait, it usually assumes you’re taking at least more than oen mantra, which could make for a radically different playstyle than a build taking Power Lock. I think that both traits can be effective for different playstyles.

• Versus Chaotic Interruption
  Here’s where things get dicey. Do you go 30/20/20/0/0 or 20/20/30/0/0? What is better for your team? What makes you more viable? This is going to be something that we’re just going to have to wait and see. Chaotic Interruption’s 3s immobilize + Blind or Cripple or Chill is extremely strong, and can be very effective in team/outnumbered fights while Power Lock is better geared to horribly shut down a single opponent. I feel Chaotic Interruption is more versatile, and definitely works better versus thieves, but Power Lock has a higher skill ceiling and better rewards a careful, focused, diligent play.
  Then again… Why choose just one?

The “Pure” Lockdown (Blackout) Mesmer.

Make no mistake, 30/10/30/0/0 is going to be a very unique playstyle. It will not play like a shatter build, a PU build, boonshare, or a phantasm build. Many of the current lockdown builds make use of Deceptive Evasion, adding an element of shatter gameplay for more damage, better chain dazing/boon removal, and an additional layer of defense. Going 20/20/30 also allows you to make a more Phantasm-flavored playstyle if you so choose. 30/10/30/0/0 is essentially the “purest” lockdown-iest version of Blackout Mesmer you can get. And with that will come pros and cons.

PROS
- Best lockdown in the game hands down.
- Devastating in team fights.
- Prestigious. Requires a skilled player to be effective.
- Using a focus will yield GLORIOUS results!

CONS
- Less effective in 1v1s
- Thieves may still omnomnom you.
- Less utility without Deceptive Evasion

The only time I’ve made a lockdown build without Deceptive Evasion is in Shatterlock, and the only reason I was effective in 1v1s was because of iPersona. I honestly can’t say how this’ll work out, but I know for a fact that some Mesmer have made it work. (Misha used this in a recent tourney, and Nettle recently shared their lockdown-heavy build. ) I think this’ll be a build better suited for teamfights that’ll have a hard time handling itself when focused.. At the same time though, I think that a skilled Blackout Mesmer will be able to single-handedly swing fights into his team’s favor with smart play and proper timing.

Whatever the case, it’s likely April 15th will see a surge in new fresh-faced lockdown Mesmer. If you’re someone who’s looking to get into the style then know that it’s daunting and difficult at first, but as any vet lockdown Mesmer can tell you, it becomes more than worthwhile!

Yeah, I commented on this over the weekend, but 30/10/30/0/0 is going to be one of the strongest specs since power lock and chaotic interruption have such a beautiful synergy in working on interrupt.

I think chaotic interruption will end up being stronger though due to the cc conditions and visible respresentation. power lock will be great and serves a good purpose but the net result is not as visible. Unless you’re paying very close attention it might be difficult to determine which skill you interrupted (that went on cool down) so as to gain a tactical advantage. So I definitely agree playing power block will be a higher skill cap than other lockdown builds we’ve seen thus far.

Honestly, I’m one of those Mesmers who attempts to work without Deceptive Evasion every so often. I think our community uses it as a crutch… I’m immediately going to test out 30/20/20, but also 30/10/30/0/0 in order to take all the interrupt traits I can.

skcamow.3527:

Unless you’re paying very close attention it might be difficult to determine which skill you interrupted (that went on cool down) so as to gain a tactical advantage. So I definitely agree playing power block will be a higher skill cap than other lockdown builds we’ve seen thus far.

True, but by the time your enemy’s 10CD is up, you should have already interrupted another skill. The magic of this trait is that you can have multiple skills on CD, severely handicapping him/her into essentially only being able to use their 1 skill.

btw, I’m Cho! I was watching Countless a bit ago. haha

MailMail.6534:

skcamow.3527:

Unless you’re paying very close attention it might be difficult to determine which skill you interrupted (that went on cool down) so as to gain a tactical advantage. So I definitely agree playing power block will be a higher skill cap than other lockdown builds we’ve seen thus far.

True, but by the time your enemy’s 10CD is up, you should have already interrupted another skill. The magic of this trait is that you can have multiple skills on CD, severely handicapping him/her into essentially only being able to use their 1 skill.

btw, I’m Cho! I was watching Countless a bit ago. haha

Yo, Cho! Let’s see, still have chat up … Chokurai? Nice to put a face with a name (kinda).

Yep, and that makes the trait somewhat of a paradox. You can have incredibly skillful play, interrupting specific skills cause you’re boss and you know all the tells. Or you can just blow your interrupts (daze/push/pull/F3, blah) and likely land some which I’m sure will be ultimately perceived as easymode.

Yeah, I don’t claim to be a lockdown master. I only tend to know how to interrupt the really easy identifiable casts AND easily identifiable profession combos. I focus a bit less on disrupting certain skills and more on setting my own burst combos up using CI.

example: Pull→iWarden→leap→Blur

But hopefully with more practice, I’ll become a more skillful lockdown Mesmer.

Regarding CS and chain dazing, what they need to do is ensure that the duration increases from Rune of Mesmer and CS stack, as currently they do not (at least in WvW/PvE).

Until they fix that I’m not seeing CS as an option really over PB (is it Power Lock or Power Block???).

Also, does Sigil of Paralyzation still affect daze? If not then it does nothing for CS, because a 1 sec stun would only get .15 seconds added to it, which wouldn’t be enough to get it over the threshold of 1.25 sec where you would actually see an increase.

Great thread, just might want to get some clarity in the community on the stacking of Runes/Sigils/CS.

Just my two cents: What you point about above regarding chill synergizing with PB seems to put PB way ahead of CS, even if they do fix the above stacking issues.

Edit: don’t forget about sigil of Ice. I bet after the rework this sigil will be a few seconds of chill guaranteed every 10 sec or whatever the new icd is. Should be pretty awesome. Also runes of ice seem like a nice alternative to grenth since vitality may be more useful than condi dmg to a power based build. Overall adding chill to the mix looks pretty amazing, I’m excited.

I like all this theoretical ideas and brings up good discussion over which and what and how to improve this play style. As a tester by profession, I like to get hands on on things before really accept the theory.

I and I believe many others who play or would like to play this style can’t wait for the patch to drop.

But if I should add my own theory to it, the new 30/20/20/0/0 or 30/10/30/0/0 against most other class will work well, but against the thief class we will still have problems.

The question is with this affect thief stealth ability,?

MailMail.6534:

Honestly, I’m one of those Mesmers who attempts to work without Deceptive Evasion every so often. I think our community uses it as a crutch… I’m immediately going to test out 30/20/20, but also 30/10/30/0/0 in order to take all the interrupt traits I can.

Same here. Since ANet tried to nerf the on death traits I started playing without DE. I rarely shatter so DE is rather unimportant to me in most situations. I’ll go for 30/10/30.

skcamow.3527:

Yeah, I commented on this over the weekend, but 30/10/30/0/0 is going to be one of the strongest specs since power lock and chaotic interruption have such a beautiful synergy in working on interrupt.

I think chaotic interruption will end up being stronger though due to the cc conditions and visible respresentation. power lock will be great and serves a good purpose but the net result is not as visible. Unless you’re paying very close attention it might be difficult to determine which skill you interrupted (that went on cool down) so as to gain a tactical advantage. So I definitely agree playing power block will be a higher skill cap than other lockdown builds we’ve seen thus far.

If I had to choose between CI and PL I’d probably also root for CI. But why decide when you can get both? So far I never went for 30 Domination because the lack of synergy between CI and CS annoys me. CI and PL on the other hand will be awesome especially when you get CI to procc Chill. I plan on being a major pain in the butt and also use Sigils of Ice. My opponents skills will never ever come off cooldown again.

In total agreement with MS about the stacking of Daze. I have posted several times in the bug forums about it stacking with Runes of Mesmer/Paralyze/etc. When equipped in pvp, it does NOT show an increased duration whatsoever, which is why I’m skeptical of using them at all. What’s the point of using them if Diversion still only says “1 second”? Maybe they fixed it? It’s been awhile since I even checked myself.

That being said, CS is still a worth-while trait and imo on equal footing with the new trait. It depends on your playstyle. Both are different forms of “lockdown”. The former physically locking you down in place (due to stun) and the other locking down your opponents’ options.

eta- re the above post, also agree with the lack of synergy between CI and CS. Stunning stops them from attacking, but you already have the “physical lockdown” with CI. Really, CS only adds the supposed 25% extra daze. 30/10/30 is much more viable if you take PL over CS in this situation.

Hmmm.. a 30/10/30/0/0 build… why didn’t I think of that.

I don’t think, at least for me, that power block is going to be worth it.

The 30/0/30/10/0 pure lockdown I’m running now is just too good with the immense amount of condi cleanse and 3 dazes using harmonious mantras. Having played pure lockdown extensively recently, I just don’t think 5 more seconds is going to make a big enough difference to warrant dropping what I have now.

I think you are onto something very interesting with your pure lockdown build.

To get rid of the cons:

Bring a thief and moa morph and all your thief problems are gone, your build will synergize insanely with thieves (you will cut through bunkers like they were made of paper) and to stop the enemy thief it takes a thief anyway.

Put a condi necro on top and things will get really nasty, people will not be able to do anything.

Bazzoong.7145:

I think you are onto something very interesting with your pure lockdown build.

To get rid of the cons:

Bring a thief and moa morph and all your thief problems are gone, your build will synergize insanely with thieves (you will cut through bunkers like they were made of paper) and to stop the enemy thief it takes a thief anyway.

Put a condi necro on top and things will get really nasty, people will not be able to do anything.

I just started experiencing with this lockdown concept and It really is amazing

Yesterday I did some tests with my mesmer 30/10/30 against a thief ( d/p at first and then d/d )

To beat the d/p build I had to use moa morph cause he kept stealthing when he was low Hp, he had full condi cleans, so my immobilizes where always cleansed before I could finish my burst, it also had lots of blinds so it wasn’t easy to interrupt/burst.

The d/d was fairly easy to beat, he didn’t had enough utilities/skills to prevent my bursts.

After all I was pleased with this build, a lot of potential, I belive this build after the balance patch will be awesome for skirmishes

p.s. do you belive it’s better a balance set of armor/trinket or a full zerker set ? I was playing with a balanced set and the damage wasn’t bad considering the fact that I could easily put 15+ staks of vuln on the thief

Nettle.9025:

I don’t think, at least for me, that power block is going to be worth it.

The 30/0/30/10/0 pure lockdown I’m running now is just too good with the immense amount of condi cleanse and 3 dazes using harmonious mantras. Having played pure lockdown extensively recently, I just don’t think 5 more seconds is going to make a big enough difference to warrant dropping what I have now.

My thoughts exactly, hell you can lock someone down for as good as it gets for 5 secs cd. It would be still though getting it over CS or Harmonious mantras.

UNLESS = Powerlock would be a GM minor for Domination.

StickerHappy.8052:

Nettle.9025:

I don’t think, at least for me, that power block is going to be worth it.

The 30/0/30/10/0 pure lockdown I’m running now is just too good with the immense amount of condi cleanse and 3 dazes using harmonious mantras. Having played pure lockdown extensively recently, I just don’t think 5 more seconds is going to make a big enough difference to warrant dropping what I have now.

My thoughts exactly, hell you can lock someone down for as good as it gets for 5 secs cd. It would be still though getting it over CS or Harmonious mantras.

UNLESS = Powerlock would be a GM minor for Domination.

I think something similar to this should have been done actually. Since Wastrel’s Punishment is a pretty so-so trait for a GM minor.

SlimChance.6593:

Hmmm.. a 30/10/30/0/0 build… why didn’t I think of that.

Biggest issue here is not the loss of DE itself – hurtful as it is to any Mesmer-build, even Phantasm-builds – but that you also lose bleed on illusion-crits. That’s a lot of damage lost to make up for with active interrupting.

Carighan.6758:

SlimChance.6593:

Hmmm.. a 30/10/30/0/0 build… why didn’t I think of that.

Biggest issue here is not the loss of DE itself – hurtful as it is to any Mesmer-build, even Phantasm-builds – but that you also lose bleed on illusion-crits. That’s a lot of damage lost to make up for with active interrupting.

For the last two days I have been running a 30/10/30/0/0 counfounding suggestions lock out build.

As much as DE sucks not having you really get used to it being gone. The pros of this build is the ability to do 4 different things when you interrupt someone.
These four are always going to be:

• Bountiful Interruption
• Chaotic Interruption
• Damage
• Vulnerability.

I am shocked at how fast I can bring someone down with this. Usually what I run is scholar runes coupled with illusions increase damage and halting strike.
This combination alone gives me 15% total output for myself and 15% increase for illusions. (taking wastrels punishment into acct.)

Does the loss of DE make it harder to work? Yes.

However I truly truly truly think that a mesmer lockdown build is the absolute highest skill cap build that mesmers have and possibly the highest skillcap build in the game.

jportell.2197:

However I truly truly truly think that a mesmer lockdown build is the absolute highest skill cap build that mesmers have and possibly the highest skillcap build in the game.

Taken by itself that’s a serious downside to the build, though.

I mean ofc it has a certain underdog appeal, like successfully healing tough encounters on a Mind Mastery Mentalist back in DAoC.

But on its own it just means extra risk and extra chance of missing something important (due to increased focus on character gameplay), for little return.
Still an interesting build, but would need to further be worked on.

Carighan.6758:

jportell.2197:

However I truly truly truly think that a mesmer lockdown build is the absolute highest skill cap build that mesmers have and possibly the highest skillcap build in the game.

Taken by itself that’s a serious downside to the build, though.

I mean ofc it has a certain underdog appeal, like successfully healing tough encounters on a Mind Mastery Mentalist back in DAoC.

But on its own it just means extra risk and extra chance of missing something important (due to increased focus on character gameplay), for little return.
Still an interesting build, but would need to further be worked on.

I think that is what makes the builds such a rewarding build…. You have to actually manage your cooldowns and watch your enemies for their boons. I feel like it requires the most micromanaging of any build mesmers have.

The problem I have with the interrupt builds is that they are great 1vs1 or focusing down a single target with a group. As soon as you get multiple attackers you are toast.

All these interrupt skills should be doing aoe damage if you are giving up all stealth and most of you phant/clone production.

As for thieves: my interrupt builds are the only reliable way to take down a (solo) d/p thief and I can usually drop them very quickly.

There are actually some interrupt builds that work great for team fights, namely the 20/20/30 CI build. The AoE interrupts are plentiful and you have a single focused interrupt in MoD at your disposal.

To this point we haven’t seen interrupt builds in high level team play but I’m hearing this one is starting to break through.

Oh, BI and CI work very well in group situations with Sword #4, Focus #4 and GS #5.

I suspect the new trait could also work well. AE daze on F3 would be awesome for Confounding Suggestions in medium~small scale group encounters.