Signet of Ether - Adding 0 illusion heal

Signet of Ether - Adding 0 illusion heal

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Posted by: phokus.8934

phokus.8934

Original thread:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/archive/balance/Mesmer-Signet-of-the-Ether/

Bumping this thread because I feel as if Signet of Ether could use a look at adding passive healing with zero illusions. As it ticks every three seconds, I don’t see it being a huge issue and the healing is relatively low but something is better than nothing.

At least give Ether Feast a run for its money.

I post from a phone so please excuse any references to ducks or any other auto corrections.

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Posted by: MailMail.6534

MailMail.6534

+1

Or alternative instead of making it passive, just bump the healing per illusion to a more significant amount. This will give players another incentive to balance between shattering and actually keeping illusions alive.

https://www.twitch.tv/thatcho
“The jealous are troublesome to others, but certainly a torment to themselves.”

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Posted by: Esplen.3940

Esplen.3940

Can we just get smaller intervals, please? Heck, even if it was every 1/10, 1/4, or even 1/2 second, it would make it a lot more reliable…

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Posted by: Ross Biddle.2367

Ross Biddle.2367

Also, the active should set of an atomic like explosion.

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Posted by: Bubi.5237

Bubi.5237

Also, the active should set of an atomic like explosion.

You Killshot Mesmer! The Active Should Make Everyone In 1500 Range Moa For 1/4 Second!

“Revenant is actual proof that devs read the necromancer forum” – Pelopidas.2140

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Posted by: Zenith.7301

Zenith.7301

It’s just a crappier version of healing signet…. it should do more if the heal is not going to be changed.

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Posted by: Loony.3714

Loony.3714

I was expecting someone else to have said this by now but I’m pretty sure signet of ether is the best heal in PvE by a fair amount. Its in a really good place and doesn’t need to be changed, especially with the signet trait so readily available

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Posted by: Fay.2357

Fay.2357

I was expecting someone else to have said this by now but I’m pretty sure signet of ether is the best heal in PvE by a fair amount. Its in a really good place and doesn’t need to be changed, especially with the signet trait so readily available

The signet is only better in PvE because you don’t need the healing and it allows for higher phantasm uptime. That’s hardly a ringing endorsement though, and it’s still worse than the mantra if you need to pump out high reflect damage (despite how horrid HM is).

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Posted by: Agent Noun.7350

Agent Noun.7350

I was expecting someone else to have said this by now but I’m pretty sure signet of ether is the best heal in PvE by a fair amount. Its in a really good place and doesn’t need to be changed, especially with the signet trait so readily available

Signet of the Ether isn’t a popular heal in PvE because of its healing—it’s popular because it recharges your phantasm cooldowns, and that’s immensely important for our sustained damage.

Making it better very slightly better at actually healing wouldn’t affect its PvE popularity one way or the other.

Personally, I wish that PvE Mesmers weren’t so tied to it, much like many Mesmers wish Dueling was less mandatory in builds. If there were other ways to get phantasms out quickly, I think you’d immediately see most PvE builds switch to other heals. You’d probably see Mantra of Recovery a lot, actually, given that many PvE builds are already taking Harmonious Mantras.

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Posted by: Conncept.7638

Conncept.7638

It’s just a crappier version of healing signet…. it should do more if the heal is not going to be changed.

Every passive healing in the game (save healing turret, and that can be killed) is just a lesser version of healing signet. Unabashed favoritism at its finest.

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Posted by: Zenith.7301

Zenith.7301

It’s just a crappier version of healing signet…. it should do more if the heal is not going to be changed.

Every passive healing in the game (save healing turret, and that can be killed) is just a lesser version of healing signet. Unabashed favoritism at its finest.

Granted, the turret is still the best heal ingame. It has the longest lasting water field on top of pretty nice aoe regen.

And then they went and nerfed the ranger’s healing spring water field duration lol. I’m not sure what they’re doing anymore.

It just seems like throwing darts based on the spvp forums complaint of the day. They got spirit rangers nerfed into irrelevance, and now mesmers are on their mark so you can rest assured the mesmer won’t be getting some much needed buffs in PvE.

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Posted by: Trigr.6481

Trigr.6481

Original thread:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/archive/balance/Mesmer-Signet-of-the-Ether/

Bumping this thread because I feel as if Signet of Ether could use a look at adding passive healing with zero illusions. As it ticks every three seconds, I don’t see it being a huge issue and the healing is relatively low but something is better than nothing.

At least give Ether Feast a run for its money.

The last thing Signet of Ether needs is to dumb it down to the levels of passive warrior healing signet that require you to do nothing for the effect. Atleast mesmer signet has some type of barrier of entry via illusions to get the desired passive healing. If anything any signet heal that has passive healing needs to be removed, and compensated in some way to encourage more active play. I mean It’s not like you don’t get a phantasm reset or anything regardless…

Countless

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Posted by: phokus.8934

phokus.8934

Times change and along with that, so does the game. It’s not necessarily dumbing down the ability but rather opening up other alternatives to different game modes. Now there’s no doubt that they’ve designed certain abilities to excel in different game modes and maybe SoE doesn’t belong in PvP but it’s at least worth having a discussion on.

We’re expected to shatter our illusions more often so that is a little contradicting the healing utility. But that seems to be there inherent risk vs reward. Then again, it does have a fairly high base heal amount and the healing every three seconds for total HPS is nothing to scoff at but it’s every three seconds where every second does count.

With the passive of 980 with 3 illusions every three seconds, that’s 326 per second heal. In pvp, you’re not having 3 illusions out to make the HPS worthwhile.

Consider this: Changing the interval to every one second and adjusting the heal per illusion is:
3 illusions – 326
2 illusions – 220
0,1 illusion – 114

I post from a phone so please excuse any references to ducks or any other auto corrections.

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Posted by: Mikkel.8427

Mikkel.8427

I’m not sure why people are finding this suggestion so outrageous… Warrior’s healing sig passive heals for more than ours and its effect is not even conditional on anything. I really dont think asking for the signet to be more reliable is so terrible..

Should be something like this-
No illusions- 176 hp/sec
1 illusion- 226hp/sec
2- 276hp/sec
3- 326hp/sec

then lower the recast to 25 secs and drop the active heal to about 4k

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Posted by: Crossplay.2067

Crossplay.2067

Personally I feel our healing signet is one of the best heals in the game. While it does suck for glassy builds, it excels with tanky builds that heavily rely on illusions which my bunker and condi builkd do. The best thing about it is the passive heal can’t be interrupted. I have won almost all my duels and a few 1v2s because of this.

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Posted by: msalakka.4653

msalakka.4653

I think buffing it is a great idea. Still wouldn’t use it though, not with that cooldown and lack of reflect.

Gutter Rat [cry] | Gandara | Roaming nuisance
~ There is no balance team. ~

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Posted by: phokus.8934

phokus.8934

Personally I feel our healing signet is one of the best heals in the game. While it does suck for glassy builds, it excels with tanky builds that heavily rely on illusions which my bunker and condi builkd do. The best thing about it is the passive heal can’t be interrupted. I have won almost all my duels and a few 1v2s because of this.

It’s actually a really bad healing utility with 154 hps, not counting active illusions.

Illusions in pvp are not alive long enough to make the hps worthwhile as the interval is every three seconds on the passive heal. With the amount of cleave and how often we shatter or should be shattering, the three second interval is just way too long.

You’re still better off with Ether Feast due to its 20 second cool down and if you manage to get three illusions out, your hps goes from 264 (5500 health) to 356 (7480 health).

Using napkin math, cutting the interval down to one second, adding a passive heal with zero illusions, and adjusting the heal/illusion passive, it’s not Warriors Healing Signet 2.0.

Base heal would be dropped slightly and I’d decrease its 35 second cool down to 30 seconds – with Blurred Inscriptions that’s down to 24 second recharge.

The only argument I can see against this is that Mesmers have the best hps healing abilities in the game currently. But being the selfish person I am when it comes to the Mesmer class, there’s room for improvement and updating Signet of Ether is a no brainer for me.

I post from a phone so please excuse any references to ducks or any other auto corrections.

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Posted by: tobascodagama.2961

tobascodagama.2961

I suspect that Signet of Ether is intentionally bad for PvP because ANet doesn’t want Phantasm burst builds to have good passive healing. (They’re obviously nervous about Phantasm burst in general; see their caution around Chronophantasma’s follow-up attack.) As it is, you can try it, but you’re sacrificing a lot of healing to get those double-iZerker bursts off. (And keep in mind that Chronophantasma turns that into potentially a quadruble-iZerker burst with Mind Wrack icing.)

I absolutely agree that PvE Memsers need better options to get out Phantasms quickly, though. This is especially true if HoT’s encounter design starts to require PvE builds to run with good self-healing.

Amberley Avalen – Charr Mesmer
Tanya Larina – Human Thief
Finchy Whyte – Sylvari Ranger

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Posted by: Esplen.3940

Esplen.3940

I mean, in non burst scenarios, if you have 3 Phants out and can maintain them, the healing from SotE is really nice (although if you need that extra oomph, you either have to be running MoP or you’re going to blow your HP/S).

My main beef with it is the long intervals. Illusions are squishy things and you don’t replace a Phant/Clone as soon as it’s dead (maybe a clone) and if you miss the interval, your “regen” just got shafted.

If it was changed to be a “counter”, where it counted up your Illusions over set intervals (not counting Illusions over 3, which is very possible), and then healed at the end based on the counter and a multiplier or just simply had a smaller interval, I would be happy with it.

As for now, I’m sticking to the MoR swap since RM makes it a better heal, IMO.

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Posted by: MailMail.6534

MailMail.6534

Point blank, signet of ether is usually not best for squishy builds, but they are amazing in tanky builds that can maintain phantasms.

https://www.twitch.tv/thatcho
“The jealous are troublesome to others, but certainly a torment to themselves.”

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Posted by: Crossplay.2067

Crossplay.2067

It’s actually a really bad healing utility with 154 hps, not counting active illusions.

Illusions in pvp are not alive long enough to make the hps worthwhile as the interval is every three seconds on the passive heal. With the amount of cleave and how often we shatter or should be shattering, the three second interval is just way too long.

You’re still better off with Ether Feast due to its 20 second cool down and if you manage to get three illusions out, your hps goes from 264 (5500 health) to 356 (7480 health).

Using napkin math, cutting the interval down to one second, adding a passive heal with zero illusions, and adjusting the heal/illusion passive, it’s not Warriors Healing Signet 2.0.

Base heal would be dropped slightly and I’d decrease its 35 second cool down to 30 seconds – with Blurred Inscriptions that’s down to 24 second recharge.

The only argument I can see against this is that Mesmers have the best hps healing abilities in the game currently. But being the selfish person I am when it comes to the Mesmer class, there’s room for improvement and updating Signet of Ether is a no brainer for me.

If you’re not counting active illusions, you’re doing it wrong. With a bleed build, I can expect to keep at least 2 clones up at all times. That more than makes it worth it. Of maybe it just works for me because I rarely shatter. And for my bunker, which has phantasms giving regen to me as well as each other, if it’s not shut down early, it can take on nearly the entire opposing team at once. Sure, I can’t kill them but it takes them a very long time to kill me. That delay has won the game on more than one occasion.

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Posted by: Fay.2357

Fay.2357

Point blank, signet of ether is usually not best for squishy builds, but they are amazing in tanky builds that can maintain phantasms.

Sorta. Ether feast is still better for healing than the signet, especially if you have any healing power. SoE only becomes useful if you actually use the active…but then that means you lose the healing.

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Posted by: MailMail.6534

MailMail.6534

Point blank, signet of ether is usually not best for squishy builds, but they are amazing in tanky builds that can maintain phantasms.

Sorta. Ether feast is still better for healing than the signet, especially if you have any healing power. SoE only becomes useful if you actually use the active…but then that means you lose the healing.

We’re at different parts of the circle in this argument. SoE should never be on par with Ether Fest in terms of raw healing because it has that additional active effect. In a tanky build utilizing a lot of phantasms (i.e. pDefender or pDisenchanter), the active effect combined with the less than stellar healing can really get you out of a bind and allow you more options than you would have with Ether Fest or any of our other heals for that matter.

I don’t think our signet should be compared to the braindead OPness that is Healing Signet. I like that you have to maintain illusions to proc the healing every 3 seconds. I’d just rather the passive numbers be bumped up a bit more to compensate for the extremely long CD.

https://www.twitch.tv/thatcho
“The jealous are troublesome to others, but certainly a torment to themselves.”

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Posted by: phokus.8934

phokus.8934

How exactly will SoE get you out of a bind with the passive?

What time frame are we talking about here? 10 seconds? 30 seconds? 5 seconds?

If nothing else, the three second interval should be dropped to one second and the passive healing adjusted accordingly.

I post from a phone so please excuse any references to ducks or any other auto corrections.

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Posted by: Miroe.2054

Miroe.2054

OMG absolutly, +1 to the OP
My PU min size Asura Mesmer is underpowered anyway. I die way too quickly while waiting in invis, especially when a Zerg runs me over after 2 hours of dueling d/d eles. Maybe you could replace the active with another invis. Thaaank you very much!

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Posted by: MailMail.6534

MailMail.6534

How exactly will SoE get you out of a bind with the passive?

See my quote here:

the active effect combined with the less than stellar healing can really get you out of a bind

I wasn’t referring to the passive. I was referring to when you activate the heal, gaining some healing and the additional effect of refreshing phantasms.

https://www.twitch.tv/thatcho
“The jealous are troublesome to others, but certainly a torment to themselves.”