Guild Wars 2

So i recently start playng with my mesmer in pvp, and in one of my first match one of my teammates told me that i am using an OP class and started telling baad things of me. And this happened to others matches and other players too.

Why all this hate? I though that the most hated class was thief, not mesmer

btw, i was using a burst shatter build that a friend of mine suggested me. Is that build so OP?

PvP is usually toxic, you need some laugh.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0v8HgcXEU4

Join usssssss

Fighting a mesmer is a 4v1, because I definitely don’t consistently win those in WvW on my elementalist

Honestly it’s just because due to the recent patch mesmers have become rather stronger and so a lot of people are playing them and they are thought by many to be broken or op, despite the fact that there are ways to counter them. Most people just hate it when they die easily to another class so they whine and complain to make up for their own lack of skill which is really stupid, I don’t complain when I die in 2 shots to a thief or take a ranger rapid fire in the back lol. Everything can be countered, people just would rather it be nerfed and call it op then to have to actually adapt their play style and try harder. Used to have the same problem whenever someone would roll ranger in pvp and people would yell at rangers for playing “the easy pew pew class.” Just ignore em and laugh lol

Tristan.5280:

Why all this hate? I though that the most hated class was thief, not mesmer

Please ask your local Arenanet balance team. They will be happy to answer that question for you.

Mesmer was always a class with one of the strongest burst inh the game, yet pre patch it was harder to land and mesmer was thus a niche class that few people bothered with. They expected very good players to rekt them but nothing more.
With the patch there has been power creeps all around, added to the possibility of traiting PU or even the inspiration line for better survivability without impacting the dps. This made the class much more viable et remarkable, giving more time to plan your burst, making it easier to land and giving access du sustain the class didn’t have previously. Because of the new hyper dps meta, mistakes are still heavily punished, yet average players are now considered good because the class became slightly easier to play. People hate mesmer because it’s, now, the FoTM a bit like they hated ele with the change to heal signet and like they hated Ranger with the change to power longbow. They are forced to recognize the class while they could just roflstomp them before

Moreover a few stronger traits/bugs (confounding suggestion, Pu blind on shatter goes through evade, etc) create dissatisfaction in the community

I think many are expressing hate towards the class out of several possible reasons:

- Mesmers pre-patch used to require a lot more practice to be good and in unranked matches, the class tend to be easy kill for many other classes. Now after the patch, It’s not the case any longer. I’m not implying the class is faceroll for wins now, but it is much easier to be adequate than pre-patch.
- The trait PU has garnered a lot of hate, but I think it’s kind of warranted. The current functionality really promotes abusing the stealth mechanic, which as part of the Mesmer community, we all should be too familiar WHY other classes hate it.
- The new patch just did a hard reset on the meta, and people are liking it. The builds/classes they use to play are no longer viable, and people are mad. When people get mad, they redirect their hate toward classes that got better. It’s just people being selfish.

Tristan.5280:

So i recently start playng with my mesmer in pvp, and in one of my first match one of my teammates told me that i am using an OP class and started telling baad things of me. And this happened to others matches and other players too.

Why all this hate? I though that the most hated class was thief, not mesmer

btw, i was using a burst shatter build that a friend of mine suggested me. Is that build so OP?

I’ll speak for myself. I love the concept of mesmer in itself and I have one too but I hate anything that get to have all the reward at no risk (yes, like some thieves since you talked about them). And right now, in WvW at least, this is pretty much all the mesmer is. A joke that let players with a few dozens of hours on their mesmer possibly easily triumph over players with thousands of hours on their main or that can troll entire groups forever (yeah so can thieves but how does that help it make it less annoying? I hate those thieves too).

The stealth mechanic is really bad in this game with no real counter play to it (don’t make me laugh with the stealth trap plz) and the mesmer, who was already very strong in duels vs a majority, just received a big boost in a broken mechanic. Hence, the hate from non-mesmers…

NICENIKESHOE.7128:

PvP is usually toxic, you need some laugh.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0v8HgcXEU4

ahah! That Moa Polymorph!

Thank you all, guys!

I still think that the change to Berzerker Amulet (removal of Vitality) has gone unnoticed by the majority of PvP players, who mostly just copy what they see on Metabuild and don’t read patch notes. So they’re noticeably more squishy than they used to be, they just don’t know it.

Burst classes are the ones most likely to end up on the receiving end of player hate in a situation like this, and most PvP Mesmers are playing power shatter. So it was basically inevitable that the hate on us would get amplified.

I think they hate having to work to acquire a target, and also hate the “ai spam”.

Compare that to a more “honourable” class like a warrior or guardian.

(I don’t share this opinion by the way)

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

And right now, in WvW at least, this is pretty much all the mesmer is. A joke that let players with a few dozens of hours on their mesmer possibly easily triumph over players with thousands of hours on their main or that can troll entire groups forever (yeah so can thieves but how does that help it make it less annoying? I hate those thieves too).

In WvW, I can tell exactly who is an experienced mesmer (or a very experienced thief playing mesmer) and who is just trying it now. The latter absolutely get pasted by organized teams even without any way to apply Revealed(*), and die very quick in 1v1 unless they’re playing tanky PU condition builds (in which case you have to hit them a lot to kill them).

• - The game definitely does need more ways to apply Revealed, though.

ASP.8093:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

And right now, in WvW at least, this is pretty much all the mesmer is. A joke that let players with a few dozens of hours on their mesmer possibly easily triumph over players with thousands of hours on their main or that can troll entire groups forever (yeah so can thieves but how does that help it make it less annoying? I hate those thieves too).

In WvW, I can tell exactly who is an experienced mesmer (or a very experienced thief playing mesmer) and who is just trying it now. The latter absolutely get pasted by organized teams even without any way to apply Revealed(*), and die very quick in 1v1 unless they’re playing tanky PU condition builds (in which case you have to hit them a lot to kill them).

• - The game definitely does need more ways to apply Revealed, though.

Sure, but how long does it take to get to that comfort zone? Not that long. Specially how it is now.

What the game really need if it want to keep stealth as it is is a way to force a character out of stealth. Not just prevent it from using it (revealed) but actively ending stealth.

It’s more like bunch of illusions is chasing you. You have two options:
1. Leave the illusions and get that dmg, condies and sometimes CC.
2. Kill the illusions… get dmg, condies, and CC. They will be back in “2 dodges” or 10-12s.

Do you want it or not, you will kill them accidently with your auto attack or one AoE skill…

I don’t know how to nerf it… But what I think is if illusion is killed by player (not shattered) the cooldown of skill should be increased or at least skill which generated this illusion should be unavaible for a few seconds. That would be, how to say it? JUSTICE!

Because your class can transform people into a moa while stealthed and then burn their HP in 2 seconds.

Assic.2746:

It’s more like bunch of illusions is chasing you. You have two options:
1. Leave the illusions and get that dmg, condies and sometimes CC.
2. Kill the illusions… get dmg, condies, and CC. They will be back in “2 dodges” or 10-12s.

Do you want it or not, you will kill them accidently with your auto attack or one AoE skill…

Anet literally removed every single clone-death effect from the game two weeks ago.

Assic.2746:

It’s more like bunch of illusions is chasing you. You have two options:
Do you want it or not, you will kill them accidently with your auto attack or one AoE skill…
JUSTICE!

Death traits have been removed, you do not suffer conditions to kill clones.

tobascodagama.2961:

I still think that the change to Berzerker Amulet (removal of Vitality) has gone unnoticed by the majority of PvP players, who mostly just copy what they see on Metabuild and don’t read patch notes. So they’re noticeably more squishy than they used to be, they just don’t know it.

Burst classes are the ones most likely to end up on the receiving end of player hate in a situation like this, and most PvP Mesmers are playing power shatter. So it was basically inevitable that the hate on us would get amplified.

Pretty much this. People go to metabattle and see what the meta build is for their class thinking they can faceroll others. It’s easier for them to complain on the forums than actually learning the class, the build, and how the game changed.

Also the pure lack of knowledge. The hate is from reading or listening from others. People still worried about clone death. Lol. Please play the Mesmer then understand what’s going on in order to fight them. It is blind hate. Because we Mesmer use stealth they scream pu. Just really a lack of basic knowledge and the riot mentality. Hate for no reason.

denis.9487:

Also the pure lack of knowledge. The hate is from reading or listening from others. People still worried about clone death. Lol. Please play the Mesmer then understand what’s going on in order to fight them. It is blind hate. Because we Mesmer use stealth they scream pu. Just really a lack of basic knowledge and the riot mentality. Hate for no reason.

Like I said, I do play a mesmer and I do fight a lot of them too. It is not just blind hate. They really are extremely hard to defeat at all for a large majority of the builds even if facing players that have thousands more hours on other professions.

Some build factually carry little to no risk vs high reward and were made even worse after the patch. Looking at you PU. Ppl have legitimate reasons to complain in this case whether you feel like acknowledging it or not.

denis.9487:

Also the pure lack of knowledge. The hate is from reading or listening from others. People still worried about clone death. Lol. Please play the Mesmer then understand what’s going on in order to fight them. It is blind hate. Because we Mesmer use stealth they scream pu. Just really a lack of basic knowledge and the riot mentality. Hate for no reason.

Yeah this is so annoying – when people complain about mesmer builds/traits when they are fighting a completely different build.

My only wish is that players can tell the difference between a mesmer using PU and a mesmer not using PU – especially now that the difference is so huge (double stealth duration and a ton of boons).

It really grinds my gears when players in game go complaining about “PU cheese” when they have no clue what traits are actually being used.

In fact the same goes for other builds – calling “cheap”, “cheating”, “cheese”, “post patch mesmer noob” or whatever. Learn the confounded mesmer traits and builds before spouting nonsense.

I’ve just taken to saying the build I’m playing now is actually weaker post patch than pre patch (MtD overnerf… )

Anyway, for the record I agree certain things need to be trimmed/balanced, like PU, Confounding Suggestions, Mantra of Recovery and overall damage from every class (shaving amulets or damage calculations).

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

denis.9487:

Also the pure lack of knowledge. The hate is from reading or listening from others. People still worried about clone death. Lol. Please play the Mesmer then understand what’s going on in order to fight them. It is blind hate. Because we Mesmer use stealth they scream pu. Just really a lack of basic knowledge and the riot mentality. Hate for no reason.

Like I said, I do play a mesmer and I do fight a lot of them too. It is not just blind hate. They really are extremely hard to defeat at all for a large majority of the builds even if facing players that have thousands more hours on other professions.

Some build factually carry little to no risk vs high reward and were made even worse after the patch. Looking at you PU. Ppl have legitimate reasons to complain in this case whether you feel like acknowledging it or not.

If this was even remotely true then were are the dominating Mesmer teams? People are sore Mesmer can actually fight back. This random pu hate from not being able to kill a wvw Mesmer. Pu is awful in pvp. No team support extremely selfish.

My favourite part about all this hate is that people haven’t discovered 1 mesmer can mimic portal and single handedly portal a zerg of 39 into SM.

You know, so long as their 6,6,6,6,6 PU power-condi clone death build keeps up its infinite stealth or a friendly thief does all the “hard” work of permanent stealth.

As for the OP, see ranger hate about longbow rapid fire.

Few people bothered to actually learn how to combat mesmers pre-patch because then, a failed burst basically just meant a dead mesmer. Now that mesmers have more potential for protecting themselves and their burst, people are left with no hp and no clue what just happened because they never bothered to actually form counter strategies for mesmers and instead just went with AoE>Block>Auto attack some>repeat.

It’s because bad players pre patch are being carried by traits post patch.

StickerHappy.8052:

It’s because bad players pre patch are being carried by traits post patch.

Isn’t that the case with all classes except maybe necro? Though I hear medic necro is very forgiving but haven’t played with it myself.

denis.9487:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

denis.9487:

Also the pure lack of knowledge. The hate is from reading or listening from others. People still worried about clone death. Lol. Please play the Mesmer then understand what’s going on in order to fight them. It is blind hate. Because we Mesmer use stealth they scream pu. Just really a lack of basic knowledge and the riot mentality. Hate for no reason.

Like I said, I do play a mesmer and I do fight a lot of them too. It is not just blind hate. They really are extremely hard to defeat at all for a large majority of the builds even if facing players that have thousands more hours on other professions.

Some build factually carry little to no risk vs high reward and were made even worse after the patch. Looking at you PU. Ppl have legitimate reasons to complain in this case whether you feel like acknowledging it or not.

If this was even remotely true then were are the dominating Mesmer teams? People are sore Mesmer can actually fight back. This random pu hate from not being able to kill a wvw Mesmer. Pu is awful in pvp. No team support extremely selfish.

Just wow… maybe you need to learn to read. WvW is the context I’m ranting about. In pvp you dominate by caping so of course stealth is a double edge sword there since you either disapear or cap. If pvp where death matches I would definitely bet on the mesmer team atm.

It is clear to me you don’t want to hear a word of it, and I don’t care, but it would help the discussion if ppl would at least try to argue in good faith.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

denis.9487:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

denis.9487:

Also the pure lack of knowledge. The hate is from reading or listening from others. People still worried about clone death. Lol. Please play the Mesmer then understand what’s going on in order to fight them. It is blind hate. Because we Mesmer use stealth they scream pu. Just really a lack of basic knowledge and the riot mentality. Hate for no reason.

Like I said, I do play a mesmer and I do fight a lot of them too. It is not just blind hate. They really are extremely hard to defeat at all for a large majority of the builds even if facing players that have thousands more hours on other professions.

Some build factually carry little to no risk vs high reward and were made even worse after the patch. Looking at you PU. Ppl have legitimate reasons to complain in this case whether you feel like acknowledging it or not.

If this was even remotely true then were are the dominating Mesmer teams? People are sore Mesmer can actually fight back. This random pu hate from not being able to kill a wvw Mesmer. Pu is awful in pvp. No team support extremely selfish.

Just wow… maybe you need to learn to read. WvW is the context I’m ranting about. In pvp you dominate by caping so of course stealth is a double edge sword there since you either disapear or cap. If pvp where death matches I would definitely bet on the mesmer team atm.

It is clear to me you don’t want to hear a word of it, and I don’t care, but it would help the discussion if ppl would at least try to argue in good faith.

It seems you care about a 1v1 game mode. Wvw is not balanced by its very nature. More people= win so why complain? Pu is a selfish trait that allows a Mesmer to get away more easily. Just by taking it you are reducing your potential damage output for more defense. Seems balanced to me.

denis.9487:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

denis.9487:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

denis.9487:

Also the pure lack of knowledge. The hate is from reading or listening from others. People still worried about clone death. Lol. Please play the Mesmer then understand what’s going on in order to fight them. It is blind hate. Because we Mesmer use stealth they scream pu. Just really a lack of basic knowledge and the riot mentality. Hate for no reason.

Like I said, I do play a mesmer and I do fight a lot of them too. It is not just blind hate. They really are extremely hard to defeat at all for a large majority of the builds even if facing players that have thousands more hours on other professions.

Some build factually carry little to no risk vs high reward and were made even worse after the patch. Looking at you PU. Ppl have legitimate reasons to complain in this case whether you feel like acknowledging it or not.

If this was even remotely true then were are the dominating Mesmer teams? People are sore Mesmer can actually fight back. This random pu hate from not being able to kill a wvw Mesmer. Pu is awful in pvp. No team support extremely selfish.

Just wow… maybe you need to learn to read. WvW is the context I’m ranting about. In pvp you dominate by caping so of course stealth is a double edge sword there since you either disapear or cap. If pvp where death matches I would definitely bet on the mesmer team atm.

It is clear to me you don’t want to hear a word of it, and I don’t care, but it would help the discussion if ppl would at least try to argue in good faith.

It seems you care about a 1v1 game mode. Wvw is not balanced by its very nature. More people= win so why complain? Pu is a selfish trait that allows a Mesmer to get away more easily. Just by taking it you are reducing your potential damage output for more defense. Seems balanced to me.

It sure isn’t balanced but there are limits. It is no secret that stealth in wvw is a problem since a long time and it would probably be best to avoid making it worse. Beside, I don’t only care of 1v1. All of wvw feel this even if roamers are definitely the first victims.

As for PU being purely defensive and balanced because it has a lower damage than shatter, I respectfully disagree. The damage ATM, condi or not, is so high that even if you sacrifice a good deal of it you still stay dangerous. Heck, a war in full nomad gear who hit like a wet noodle pale in his defensive capabilities in comparison to a PU who will still do much more damage via condi. It is not balanced at all.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

denis.9487:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

denis.9487:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

denis.9487:

Also the pure lack of knowledge. The hate is from reading or listening from others. People still worried about clone death. Lol. Please play the Mesmer then understand what’s going on in order to fight them. It is blind hate. Because we Mesmer use stealth they scream pu. Just really a lack of basic knowledge and the riot mentality. Hate for no reason.

Like I said, I do play a mesmer and I do fight a lot of them too. It is not just blind hate. They really are extremely hard to defeat at all for a large majority of the builds even if facing players that have thousands more hours on other professions.

Some build factually carry little to no risk vs high reward and were made even worse after the patch. Looking at you PU. Ppl have legitimate reasons to complain in this case whether you feel like acknowledging it or not.

If this was even remotely true then were are the dominating Mesmer teams? People are sore Mesmer can actually fight back. This random pu hate from not being able to kill a wvw Mesmer. Pu is awful in pvp. No team support extremely selfish.

Just wow… maybe you need to learn to read. WvW is the context I’m ranting about. In pvp you dominate by caping so of course stealth is a double edge sword there since you either disapear or cap. If pvp where death matches I would definitely bet on the mesmer team atm.

It is clear to me you don’t want to hear a word of it, and I don’t care, but it would help the discussion if ppl would at least try to argue in good faith.

It seems you care about a 1v1 game mode. Wvw is not balanced by its very nature. More people= win so why complain? Pu is a selfish trait that allows a Mesmer to get away more easily. Just by taking it you are reducing your potential damage output for more defense. Seems balanced to me.

It sure isn’t balanced but there are limits. It is no secret that stealth in wvw is a problem since a long time and it would probably be best to avoid making it worse. Beside, I don’t only care of 1v1. All of wvw feel this even if roamers are definitely the first victims.

As for PU being purely defensive and balanced because it has a lower damage than shatter, I respectfully disagree. The damage ATM, condi or not, is so high that even if you sacrifice a good deal of it you still stay dangerous. Heck, a war in full nomad gear who hit like a wet noodle pale in his defensive capabilities in comparison to a PU who will still do much more damage via condi. It is not balanced at all.

I’ll agree. Hit the nail on the head. Everyone damage needs adjustment before looking at class nerfs.

Take a warrior and go 1v1 on mesmer in wvw, hell even spvp in certain maps. Then tell me again how i should learn weakness of mesmer class.
I am dealing with your illusions, clones, stealth, dodges, dazes, stun breaks and now the ridiculous dmg boost. And i have to keep constant pressure while trying to burst you to be effective.
If you fail you can just reset the fight and try again and warriors can’t keep up with you anymore because of the GS nerf.
And you are playing vs most telegraphed class in game. The warrior burst are like kitten cinema screen. Earthshaker, backbreaker, skull crack , eviscerate you name it.

The thing a lot of replies are missing is Mesmer has pretty much been hated non stop since the Open betas no matter what state they were in. So obviously when Mesmers got made viable again they were going to get a lot of hate no matter what, thats why you see a lot more hate directed to Mesmers then the other classes who can currently put out similar burst and/or use stealth.

NvN.4321:

Take a warrior and go 1v1 on mesmer in wvw, hell even spvp in certain maps. Then tell me again how i should learn weakness of mesmer class.
I am dealing with your illusions, clones, stealth, dodges, dazes, stun breaks and now the ridiculous dmg boost. And i have to keep constant pressure while trying to burst you to be effective.
If you fail you can just reset the fight and try again and warriors can’t keep up with you anymore because of the GS nerf.
And you are playing vs most telegraphed class in game. The warrior burst are like kitten cinema screen. Earthshaker, backbreaker, skull crack , eviscerate you name it.

The warrior using signet has awesome sustain. Warrior weapons cleave no illusions no burst (removed clone death). Warriors have the same stun breaks plus immunities. Stuns with no diminishing return stun Mesmer is a dead Mesmer. Practice more is the answer to that statement. Sorry Mesmer isn’t face roll for you playing a warrior.

To answer your question. It’s because people like that are trash. Embrace your class.

denis.9487:

NvN.4321:

Take a warrior and go 1v1 on mesmer in wvw, hell even spvp in certain maps. Then tell me again how i should learn weakness of mesmer class.
I am dealing with your illusions, clones, stealth, dodges, dazes, stun breaks and now the ridiculous dmg boost. And i have to keep constant pressure while trying to burst you to be effective.
If you fail you can just reset the fight and try again and warriors can’t keep up with you anymore because of the GS nerf.
And you are playing vs most telegraphed class in game. The warrior burst are like kitten cinema screen. Earthshaker, backbreaker, skull crack , eviscerate you name it.

The warrior using signet has awesome sustain. Warrior weapons cleave no illusions no burst (removed clone death). Warriors have the same stun breaks plus immunities. Stuns with no diminishing return stun Mesmer is a dead Mesmer. Practice more is the answer to that statement. Sorry Mesmer isn’t face roll for you playing a warrior.

Pretty much any experienced mesmer knows, fighting against a warrior IS a faceroll. Yeah he can cleave clones but I can throw them back up quicker. With all this extra stealth it’s even easier not to even get hit by the warrior, on top of that pretty much constant protection if you manage to slip up and get hit once or twice..

dank.3680:

denis.9487:

NvN.4321:

Take a warrior and go 1v1 on mesmer in wvw, hell even spvp in certain maps. Then tell me again how i should learn weakness of mesmer class.
I am dealing with your illusions, clones, stealth, dodges, dazes, stun breaks and now the ridiculous dmg boost. And i have to keep constant pressure while trying to burst you to be effective.
If you fail you can just reset the fight and try again and warriors can’t keep up with you anymore because of the GS nerf.
And you are playing vs most telegraphed class in game. The warrior burst are like kitten cinema screen. Earthshaker, backbreaker, skull crack , eviscerate you name it.

The warrior using signet has awesome sustain. Warrior weapons cleave no illusions no burst (removed clone death). Warriors have the same stun breaks plus immunities. Stuns with no diminishing return stun Mesmer is a dead Mesmer. Practice more is the answer to that statement. Sorry Mesmer isn’t face roll for you playing a warrior.

Pretty much any experienced mesmer knows, fighting against a warrior IS a faceroll. Yeah he can cleave clones but I can throw them back up quicker. With all this extra stealth it’s even easier not to even get hit by the warrior, on top of that pretty much constant protection if you manage to slip up and get hit once or twice..

This is why. Again people don’t play Mesmer. Constant protection. Extra stealth. If your dueling why do you need extra stealth when dueling? Just throw it all in there. We hate Mesmer because we can!!!!!

dank.3680:

denis.9487:

NvN.4321:

Take a warrior and go 1v1 on mesmer in wvw, hell even spvp in certain maps. Then tell me again how i should learn weakness of mesmer class.
I am dealing with your illusions, clones, stealth, dodges, dazes, stun breaks and now the ridiculous dmg boost. And i have to keep constant pressure while trying to burst you to be effective.
If you fail you can just reset the fight and try again and warriors can’t keep up with you anymore because of the GS nerf.
And you are playing vs most telegraphed class in game. The warrior burst are like kitten cinema screen. Earthshaker, backbreaker, skull crack , eviscerate you name it.

The warrior using signet has awesome sustain. Warrior weapons cleave no illusions no burst (removed clone death). Warriors have the same stun breaks plus immunities. Stuns with no diminishing return stun Mesmer is a dead Mesmer. Practice more is the answer to that statement. Sorry Mesmer isn’t face roll for you playing a warrior.

Pretty much any experienced mesmer knows, fighting against a warrior IS a faceroll. Yeah he can cleave clones but I can throw them back up quicker. With all this extra stealth it’s even easier not to even get hit by the warrior, on top of that pretty much constant protection if you manage to slip up and get hit once or twice..

Depends. In SPvP, if you’re fighting over the point you obviously don’t want to stay in stealth for more than a few seconds and you don’t want to kite off point because your dps drops too low at that point to actually kill them. Many run LB since its condi removal that can’t be stopped like other burst skills and that’s basically an anti shatter field for as long as its burning. I usually either need one really good burst on a squishier warr, or two consecutive good bursts to take down your average warrior(since I usually opt for a little more defensive trait/sigil choices). If I mess up the first burst, they usually can gain back enough health to not die to the second. The longer this goes on the worse off it gets because you need to basically kite them perfectly since getting hit by more than one or two of their autoattacks on their dps weapons is no bueno. God forbid you get hit with their damaging burst skill, at that point it’d probably be better to just abandon the point and +1 somewhere else. If you can’t take them down quickly(say under 30-45 seconds), you’re wasting time that could be better spent +1ing a fight.

In WvW roaming/dueling, it doesn’t matter, because its WvW roaming/dueling.

NvN.4321:

Take a warrior and go 1v1 on mesmer in wvw, hell even spvp in certain maps. Then tell me again how i should learn weakness of mesmer class.
I am dealing with your illusions, clones, stealth, dodges, dazes, stun breaks and now the ridiculous dmg boost. And i have to keep constant pressure while trying to burst you to be effective.
If you fail you can just reset the fight and try again and warriors can’t keep up with you anymore because of the GS nerf.
And you are playing vs most telegraphed class in game. The warrior burst are like kitten cinema screen. Earthshaker, backbreaker, skull crack , eviscerate you name it.

I’ve been playing my warrior alt using the GS + M/S build has been moderately successful, and on my Mesmer I’ve been killed by some really good warriors. No doubt after this balance patch has made Mesmers harder to kill, but in no way is Warrior vs Mesmer scenario as bad as Mesmer hard-countered by thief.

rchu.8945:

NvN.4321:

Take a warrior and go 1v1 on mesmer in wvw, hell even spvp in certain maps. Then tell me again how i should learn weakness of mesmer class.
I am dealing with your illusions, clones, stealth, dodges, dazes, stun breaks and now the ridiculous dmg boost. And i have to keep constant pressure while trying to burst you to be effective.
If you fail you can just reset the fight and try again and warriors can’t keep up with you anymore because of the GS nerf.
And you are playing vs most telegraphed class in game. The warrior burst are like kitten cinema screen. Earthshaker, backbreaker, skull crack , eviscerate you name it.

I’ve been playing my warrior alt using the GS + M/S build has been moderately successful, and on my Mesmer I’ve been killed by some really good warriors. No doubt after this balance patch has made Mesmers harder to kill, but in no way is Warrior vs Mesmer scenario as bad as Mesmer hard-countered by thief.

Go to Warrior Forum and you’d see pretty much all of them agree that a Warrior should just run away when they see a PU mesmer.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/warrior/Countering-mesmers-in-WvW/first#post5255719

People hate mesmers for 3 reasons
Domination : CS spammable stuns no counterplay whatsoever, power block on heals is pretty guaranteed win, and the 30% more shatter damage is not too shabby either.

Dueling: Perma fury on targets under 75%, blind on shatter which is strong in itself but also goes through things it shouldn’t.

Inspiration: healing mantra removes 4 condis(6 after the bug gets fixed on last cast), aoe team heal too, heal on shatter, more heal etc.

robertul.3679:

Inspiration: healing mantra removes 4 condis(6 after the bug gets fixed on last cast), aoe team heal too, heal on shatter, more heal etc.

Condition play in this game is absolute garbage and you absolutely need specs that can remove them almost-kinda-as-fast as they are spammed on you, however.

robertul.3679:

People hate mesmers for 3 reasons
Domination : CS spammable stuns no counterplay whatsoever, power block on heals is pretty guaranteed win, and the 30% more shatter damage is not too shabby either.

I guess stability isn’t considered counterplay anymore. Open with stab, you waste their CS because it tries to turn the failed daze into a stun IIRC. Heck, I ran into an engi using Juggernaut to basically be immune to any opener that relied on CC from any class. Stab eats the opener, engi switches to toolkit and block the burst that follows. Way too many people just continue with their burst even if the opener failed for whatever reason(like when engis pry bar the air after a failed magnet).

Also as for Power Block hitting heals, its actually surprising how many classes have heals that can’t be interrupted. Warriors run healing signet almost exlusively(at least in my experience, could’ve changed with the patch), Guardians are almost always using Shelter, thieves usually use Withdraw, eles use Signet most of the time, and interrupting a healing turret is pretty much all luck with how fast it gets dropped. That leaves necros, other mesmers, rangers and anyone not running those common heals. Mesmers have several ways to protect their heal(or run mantra), Rangers now have fairly good stab uptime with the elite shout and their pet can absorb your CC if they traited it. Necros are probably worse off against Power Block and are the only class that, AFAIK, have no reliable method to prevent it or good alternative heal.

Are you aware that you can just kite until stability / rampage is over? Cooldown on stability skills on war are ~40-60 sec. And you can not always trait / use stability skills because all the condition pressure.
Don’t tell how to counterplay from mesmer perspective. Roll other classes and then talk.

robertul.3679:

People hate mesmers for 3 reasons
Domination : power block on heals is pretty guaranteed win, and the 30% more shatter damage is not too shabby either.

You cant have both.
And its 15% dmg. Only 30% if target its not activating skills… even stunned (1s most common mesmer stuns) its not so common to get it in pvp… just against slow kitten s.

robertul.3679:

Inspiration: healing mantra removes 4 condis(6 after the bug gets fixed on last cast), aoe team heal too, heal on shatter, more heal etc.

Also if they go into harmonious mantras for 3 mantra charges they loose clone production and therefore shatter power ( dmg or healing) and healing prism has 10s ICD

Stop qqing “nerf this that and ect.” cause mesmer just needs some tweaks, rest is up to ppl to adapt. l2p wise and “theorycrafting” wise (builds and way to play with and against).

NvN.4321:

Are you aware that you can just kite until stability / rampage is over? Cooldown on stability skills on war are ~40-60 sec. And you can not always trait / use stability skills because all the condition pressure.
Don’t tell how to counterplay from mesmer perspective. Roll other classes and then talk.

I do play other classes, thief and engineer to be specific, but I have started toying with my necro recently. Sure stability isn’t easily accessible in some builds, but at that point you’re basically saying “I want my build to be able to deal with condition classes, but I also want my build to be able to deal with zerker classes, while at the same time being able to deal respectable damage myself”. And while you’re kiting away that warrior for 20 seconds, he almost certainly got a hold of the point or at the very least decapped it. Kiting is integral to many mesmer playstyles, doing it on a small point while still maintaining pressure is easier said than done.

Also lol’d at that last comment. A huge majority of these l2p issues could be dealt with if people actually bothered to try playing mesmer themselves. Want a build that has more than a single utility slot to deal with conditions? Enjoy neutering your damage. Want to interrupt a heal? Too bad, most of the good ones are passive, instant cast, have blocking frames or happen so fast you’d need to be really lucky to hit it.

Yea mate just open with stability. Mesmer will just spam his mantra on your stability and go all like “why doesn’t this button work anymore? maybe I write a bug report”.

Yes the mesmer QQ is ridiculous. The hate exists because pre-patch many professions had large advantages going into a fight v.s. a power mesmer. Post patch, condi mesmers actually got worse, but now the playing field has been leveled for many professions v.s. power mesmer and it is going to take some time for players to adjust.

Having put in many hours as a mesmer, I find it very easy to absolutely destroy other mesmers on my DD ele. Any other matchup with AE spam is also going to be a tough one for the mes especially after the removal of on death traits because you can simply remove the mesmer’s main source of burst. In pvp I find that most players simply do not react to our extremely predictable burst. The QQ over PU is laughable seeing as this is one of the worst traits you can possibly take in sPvP, lock down is strong but not OP, and power shatter received some much needed buffs.

Every time I get ganked now and then ppl jump on my body. Probably because I play a PU (scrub) mesmer and I don’t really care about their hate.

I think a lot of it is from people who play classes that previously considered mesmers “free”.

This is no longer quite the case, and a mediocre thief will no longer trash a decent mesmer with his eyes closed.

If you were able to do ok to good on power shatter before the patch for example; you’re now very very dangerous instead, and it’s surprising people.

Players that are better than you will still beat you of course, as they should.