Guild Wars 2

wich is better build condition or zerker??

Full clerics healing build especially with all the strong buffs to siphoning

It depends on your playstyle. Are you looking for a build for PvE, PvP, WvW or a combination?

Do you like sticking back and dealing damage from range or do you like to be on the frontline in the heat of the battle?

Are you someone who runs and dodges around like a maniac or do you operate at a slow pace?

Conditions and Berserker builds are both fun and viable in different situations. Really depends on your playstyle. I would reccomend playing with different weapon sets while you are leveling. Try out a build using scepter/dagger and staff, then try out one using dagger/warhorn and axe/focus. If you like the former, plan to go conditions. If you like the later, plan to go berserker. There are also other builds (hybrid, minion master, pure power, clerics) that are less popular but can be fun depending on what you like.

open world pve – whatever
world bosses – power (zerk… soldiers… whatever)
dungeons – zerk
wvw – either (sort of… id strongly recommend against full zerk)… though i prefer power (currently using a mix of soldier and zerker) because i primarily zerg and stuff dies before condis ramp up

Linguistically Inept.6583:

wvw – either (sort of… id strongly recommend against full zerk)… though i prefer power (currently using a mix of soldier and zerker) because i primarily zerg and stuff dies before condis ramp up

Or, you could run Knights for the extra toughness.

In any event, Inept’s correct: in a zerg, condis will get cleansed quickly so go for power/crits. Condis work much better for roaming, though. Power builds are a bit vulnerable in 1v1 situations.

I can’t get into the whole power spec, I always seem to just die against thieves, since I can never keep them targeted long enough to get off axe2.
On the other hand condi works just fine in roaming, but to me it’s getting boring. So I’ve begun to move over to hybrid specs, I want to do dmg with everything I do, though it might not be as much dmg as pure specs, however if an attack fails there’s always the other side of the coin that will hit.
I use a/wh and staff with rabid armor/traveler’s runes, zerker rings, rabid everything rlse with ruby jewels.

I only solo roam, but do sometimes join in on zergs if taking something big. I do good dd but still have good condi dmg.

it depends on how you prefer to play and game mode

for me,
Dungeons: 30/10/0/0/30 Full zerker
PVE & WvW (Large scale): Power+Wells 5/10/25/30/0 mix of (Soldier + Zerker) or (Knight + Cavalier)
sPvP/tPvP/WvW Roaming: Terror (Condi always fun in 1-5 players xD)

Play it as it’s meant to be played:

Defensive stats+conditions.

Feel the invulnerabity.

as of right now, condi is the easiest way to do damage for necromancer and live while doing it. after the eventual addition of new weapons to necromancer, that might change. or it might not. so right now my verdict is tank conditionmancer. even though i run power with daggers.

Condi is a far better build then Zerker. You get more armor along with higher damage. However, Zerker does have some advantages over condi. One, it builds DS much faster then Condi. 2, it works better against objects. 3, it stacks better with your allies.

The difference in damage between the 2 isn’t significant enough to really tell you to go one way or the other. If you add both of them up, Zerker looks like it has higher damage, but don’t be fooled by that. Zerker is effected a great deal by damage reduction while the condi’s damage is almost all armor ignoring.

Dietzen.6127:

I can’t get into the whole power spec, I always seem to just die against thieves, since I can never keep them targeted long enough to get off axe2.

Kiting thieves are a big problem but most run-of-the-mill, dagger 2 spamming glass cannon thieves are easy to kill with a power necro (one of the few) because they’re too aggressive. Here’s what I do: drop marks on yourself and take the backstab so he triggers them. If he’s still blindly attacking, drop wells. Next, DS5, DS2, DS3, DS1 or if he stealths at any time during this, DS4 and listen for the sucking sound. When they reappear, they’re usually down.

However, most other classes will pound a power necro as wells are horrible outside of zergs and PvP point holding. Personally, I temporarily reslot minions/shield if I need to run anywhere by myself of a little while. They give a power necro a bit of a fighting chance. XD

Lily.1935:

Condi is a far better build then Zerker. You get more armor along with higher damage. However, Zerker does have some advantages over condi. One, it builds DS much faster then Condi. 2, it works better against objects. 3, it stacks better with your allies.

The difference in damage between the 2 isn’t significant enough to really tell you to go one way or the other. If you add both of them up, Zerker looks like it has higher damage, but don’t be fooled by that. Zerker is effected a great deal by damage reduction while the condi’s damage is almost all armor ignoring.

Condi builds are actually not as good as power builds in a zerg. There’s far too much area cleanse in organized zergs and besides, the nature of the fight won’t allow you to build up conditions on a target. In this instance, the best damage is the sure damage.

Condi builds are, however, far superior to power builds in roaming. The 1v1 fights allow stacking by the single target scepter/signet.

PvE:

Normally I would say zerker for every class. But my necro runs a 30/30/0/10/0 dual dagger build in full rampager in PvE and is a blast.

I do not have as many hours on him as on my mesmer (full zerker) and probably never will, so I might still be lacking enough experience to see all constrains, but on the other hand, mobs melt like butter in the sun.

Rampager necro is fine for dungeons/fractals. Zerker is generally better for regular dungeons though. Would never go full condi, that kittens bad.

LoRdZeRo.5364:

it depends on how you prefer to play and game mode

for me,
Dungeons: 30/10/0/0/30 Full zerker

why not 30/25/0/0/15?

Kaiyanwan.8521:

my necro runs a 30/30/0/10/0 dual dagger build in full rampager in PvE and is a blast.

why rampager with mainhand dagger? its only worth it with scepter or staff offhand

Linguistically Inept.6583:

LoRdZeRo.5364:

it depends on how you prefer to play and game mode

for me,
Dungeons: 30/10/0/0/30 Full zerker

why not 30/25/0/0/15?

Kaiyanwan.8521:

my necro runs a 30/30/0/10/0 dual dagger build in full rampager in PvE and is a blast.

why rampager with mainhand dagger? its only worth it with scepter or staff offhand

The attack rotation of the dagger is faster (2.1s vs. 3.0s) and the base damage is higher. With rampager gear, I get more bleed proccs over time from dagger and while I won’t get the additional bleed on every attack, I hit harder (about 9 hits in 6s versus only 6 times with a scepter) with every singe attack.

Maybe I am wrong, but it feels like more damage over all. If I have time, I will run the numbers.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Linguistically Inept.6583:

LoRdZeRo.5364:

it depends on how you prefer to play and game mode

for me,
Dungeons: 30/10/0/0/30 Full zerker

why not 30/25/0/0/15?

Kaiyanwan.8521:

my necro runs a 30/30/0/10/0 dual dagger build in full rampager in PvE and is a blast.

why rampager with mainhand dagger? its only worth it with scepter or staff offhand

The attack rotation of the dagger is faster (2.1s vs. 3.0s) and the base damage is higher. With rampager gear, I get more bleed proccs over time from dagger and while I won’t get the additional bleed on every attack, I hit harder (about 9 hits in 6s versus only 6 times with a scepter) with every singe attack.

Maybe I am wrong, but it feels like more damage over all. If I have time, I will run the numbers.

barbed precision? 2s bleed (unmodified it wont even last as long as an AA chain) and geomancy>earth(more so because dagger is melee)

Barbed Precision lasts 3sec (trait +30% trait line), and will be applied about 1.5 times in the chain of 2.1s just by auto-attack. Let’s just say, in 2 attack chains (about 4s), you apply three 3s bleeds.
Add the fact, that the dagger hits three times as hard in 2/3 of the timeframe of a scepter chain, those 2 bleeds for 6s every 3 secs are not going to outdamage the dagger in matters of auto-attack with rampager gear in open world PvE.

I do not refer to dungeons though, open world is what I am talking about.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Barbed Precision lasts 3sec (trait +30% trait line), and will be applied about 1.5 times in the chain of 2.1s just by auto-attack. Let’s just say, in 2 attack chains (about 4s), you apply three 3s bleeds.
Add the fact, that the dagger hits three times as hard in 2/3 of the timeframe of a scepter chain, those 2 bleeds for 6s every 3 secs are not going to outdamage the dagger in matters of auto-attack with rampager gear in open world PvE.

I do not refer to dungeons though, open world is what I am talking about.

2 sec unmodified…
the damage you gain from those few bleeds surely isnt as much as the power/crit dam from berserker would be

Nagato no Kami.4980:

Lily.1935:

Condi is a far better build then Zerker. You get more armor along with higher damage. However, Zerker does have some advantages over condi. One, it builds DS much faster then Condi. 2, it works better against objects. 3, it stacks better with your allies.

The difference in damage between the 2 isn’t significant enough to really tell you to go one way or the other. If you add both of them up, Zerker looks like it has higher damage, but don’t be fooled by that. Zerker is effected a great deal by damage reduction while the condi’s damage is almost all armor ignoring.

Condi builds are actually not as good as power builds in a zerg. There’s far too much area cleanse in organized zergs and besides, the nature of the fight won’t allow you to build up conditions on a target. In this instance, the best damage is the sure damage.

Condi builds are, however, far superior to power builds in roaming. The 1v1 fights allow stacking by the single target scepter/signet.

Excuse me for not specifying. I almost always refer to PvE before other formats.

Except in pve beserker does beat condi.

Matter of taste. You could always run a hybrid build if you can’t decide.

spoj.9672:

Except in pve beserker does beat condi.

It really doesn’t. I’ve done the testing and have armor and weapons for both specs. The Zerker is better then condi for one dungeon. And that is CoF. Other then that, Condi is still better.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

LoRdZeRo.5364:

it depends on how you prefer to play and game mode

for me,
Dungeons: 30/10/0/0/30 Full zerker

why not 30/25/0/0/15?

Since its zerker build why should i go through curses line?!

i think the only reason that let me spend 25 in condi line is to get (25) minor trait

Well.. why i think 30 in Soul Reaping should be better ??
+30 crit damage
+50% crit chance (XII) in DS (with zerker set you should be able to get 100% crit chance in DS)

so basically your best damage will come from DS #1, you can also gear it with “Reaper’s Might” from spite and “Unyielding Blast” from Soul Reaping and finally you cleave at 5-8k/hit (since all hits are crits it depends now on number of might stacks you have)

the damage is good, however the only issue here is the survivability to solve it you can reduce crit damage and get some toughness/vitality, the only thing you need to care about is to keep your crit chance at 50%

hopefully its clear now

the 50% crit chance from DS XII , is it a flat 50% or is it 50% of your current crit chance?

Lily.1935:

spoj.9672:

Except in pve beserker does beat condi.

It really doesn’t. I’ve done the testing and have armor and weapons for both specs. The Zerker is better then condi for one dungeon. And that is CoF. Other then that, Condi is still better.

It actually does. With something like 30/25/0/0/15 you’ll be killing things a lot faster than you can setting up all of your conditions in most groups for pretty much every PvE encounter. Not that conditionmancer is particularly bad, but it’s in no way faster than a full zerker setup. Despite this though, I play hybrid because I’m a vanity fiend and want to use my Eye of Rodgort and my fused axe in the same build while still being viable.

declan.3968:

the 50% crit chance from DS XII , is it a flat 50% or is it 50% of your current crit chance?

Its +50% but ive said this countless times before. DS isnt good for dps even with capped 99% crit chance. If you want to min max necro dps you want to max dagger dps. So going 25 in curses is a must. Having said that, with the buff to strength of undeath coming next patch I may be altering the build to 20/25/0/0/25. There are a few variants I need to check before I update the build though.

In wvw I mostly roam, I will.collapse into the zerg for keep/tower takes.

I run 30/20/0/0/20. Axe mastry, dhuumfire,terror and master of terror are key traits.
signet of spite, epidemic, spectral wall for utilities.

axe/dagger with sigil of earth and sigil of torment (shh its new don’t let on to it)
staff (also torment)

mix of rampager and carrion gear.
power crit damage food and sharpening stones.

your defense sucks but man can you drop a fool or several. It works real well if you run with a hybrid mesmer also. The mix of Condi and direct damage over whelms your target and sets them on the defense fast. Also when you need to go on the defense having your fears do damage is also nice.

as for pve, this build can work but you’ll get one shot but any real boss.

SolemnMalevolence.5248:

Lily.1935:

spoj.9672:

Except in pve beserker does beat condi.

It really doesn’t. I’ve done the testing and have armor and weapons for both specs. The Zerker is better then condi for one dungeon. And that is CoF. Other then that, Condi is still better.

It actually does. With something like 30/25/0/0/15 you’ll be killing things a lot faster than you can setting up all of your conditions in most groups for pretty much every PvE encounter. Not that conditionmancer is particularly bad, but it’s in no way faster than a full zerker setup. Despite this though, I play hybrid because I’m a vanity fiend and want to use my Eye of Rodgort and my fused axe in the same build while still being viable.

My time for Zerker and my time for Condi against a single target is about a 2 second difference, give or take. My time for a Zerker and my time for a Condi against a group is closer to 10-15 seconds With Condi on the quicker up and up. My time for a Vet for a Zerker and for a Condi is about the same. My time for a champion is a dead Zerker and a Healthy Condi. The last part is solo. Going against a legendary in a dungeon that isn’t CoF the Zerker struggles after their death shroud dies down. Depending if you are capable of getting in close with a dagger or not this can be the difference of around 3k-7k a second to 500-2k a second. The damage out of death shroud and in it for a Zerker is that different. This number is also adjusted based on the foe’s armor. Reducing its max number by a possibility of 50%. While the Condi build maintains a stable 3k-5k a second depending on how active you are with conditions. This damage is less effected by armor. You must still factor in the base damage of your skills and weapons while attacking and not only your conditions. While Condi has a lower cap, it also isn’t walled as hard by high armor foes.

Now lets talk about the defenses of the 2. The Condi build has a advantage at face value. The Condi build often has armor comparable to Medium armor Professions when you added up the values of the toughness along with their base armor rating. This means that a Condi necro can take a hit far better then the Zerker. They also have access to more condition cleansing as the common weapon set up for them is Scepter/dagger and Staff. This gives them access to 2 cleansing skills just on their weapon. Along with Consume conditions which is the necromancer’s staple heal. However the advantages of their defenses end there. The Condi necromancer has the worst life force building out of any of the necromancer’s builds. Which puts it at a defensive disadvantage against a few bosses. This can put you in a tight spot when using the condi necro.

On the Zerker side of things their defenses at face value are garbage. They have the lowest possible armor rating possible and are up front attacking at melee range far more often then a Condi. Not to mention that they need to stay within 600 range to get the full value while in death shroud. Their max range is usually restricted by their Axe as that is usually favored over the Staff but not always. It isn’t all doom and gloom for the zerker though. As they have the best possible life force gain of the necromancer builds. You can often build it 2-3x faster then the condi build which can quickly make up for the lack of armor and forced close combat. However, even with this fact if a foe can knock a Condi necro out of full ds and knock out a good 2/3s Health then the Zerker will either be hanging on by a thread or be downed.

Now lets talk about that Hybrid Condition/Damage build. I Personally don’t like these builds. I end up with both the weaknesses in defenses from both a Condi build and the zerker build with neither of their selling factor. The advantage of these builds is really only this. They don’t get walled by high armor foes or foes that cleanse since when these foes have both they tend to have a mechanic that needs to be abused. Other then that, I wouldn’t recommend a Hybrid build as it stands should, in theory, equal out to around the same damage as both a proper Condi and a Zerker build. The Hybrid is never going to cap out their damage for more then a few seconds after switching to their axe before their bleeds begin to fall off while the zerker and Condi will be able to sustain their damage for a least a decent period of time.

In conclusion, any one of these picks for PvE is mostly preference. None of these have a significant advantage over the other to really call one the ultimate Superior build. My personally preference is Condi. As it has the least gaps in its defenses and its damage sustainability is generally solid through out the whole fight where as the other two tend to fluctuate fare more.

Thankfully most people who have a brain can surely tell why your report is complete bull.

Lily.1935:

None of these have a significant advantage over the other to really call one the ultimate Superior build.

It’s like you’ve never played a necro.

LoRdZeRo.5364:

Linguistically Inept.6583:

LoRdZeRo.5364:

it depends on how you prefer to play and game mode

for me,
Dungeons: 30/10/0/0/30 Full zerker

why not 30/25/0/0/15?

Since its zerker build why should i go through curses line?!

dagger dps>life blast dps (well… sort of)

curses for damage modification from condis on target (theres also banshees wail, reapers precision and enfeebling shroud) and base crit rate

deathly perception (considering with zerker you should be at ~50% crit rate) wastes group fury, banners and spotter

Samhayn.2385:

axe/dagger with sigil of earth and sigil of torment (shh its new don’t let on to it)
staff (also torment)

all sigil ICDs are shared… if your earth triggers then torment wont until sigil of earth is off CD

Linguistically Inept.6583:

LoRdZeRo.5364:

Linguistically Inept.6583:

LoRdZeRo.5364:

it depends on how you prefer to play and game mode

for me,
Dungeons: 30/10/0/0/30 Full zerker

why not 30/25/0/0/15?

Since its zerker build why should i go through curses line?!

dagger dps>life blast dps (well… sort of)

curses for damage modification from condis on target (theres also banshees wail, reapers precision and enfeebling shroud) and base crit rate

deathly perception (considering with zerker you should be at ~50% crit rate) wastes group fury, banners and spotter

Samhayn.2385:

axe/dagger with sigil of earth and sigil of torment (shh its new don’t let on to it)
staff (also torment)

all sigil ICDs are shared… if your earth triggers then torment wont until sigil of earth is off CD

sigil of earth has no in game listed cool down and I have had both go off on a target. This is the only reason I run both.

spoj.9672:

Thankfully most people who have a brain can surely tell why your report is complete bull.

Logged in just to upvote this, lol :/

declan.3968:

the 50% crit chance from DS XII , is it a flat 50% or is it 50% of your current crit chance?

In German you’d say 50% percent points to make clear that it doesn’t relate to the current crit chance, but is a flat 50% percent chance increase in the critical chance stat. Dunno how well that translates to english though. Anyway, just add +50 to whatever your crit chance is; it’s super easy to shoot way over 100% crit chance with this trait.

spoj.9672:

Having said that, with the buff to strength of undeath coming next patch I may be altering the build to 20/25/0/0/25. There are a few variants I need to check before I update the build though.

That’s similar to my leveling build of 20/25///20+x before I realized that I was missing out on both 30Spite and 30SoulReaping xD
kitten , was I proud of making use of the fury.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

Samhayn.2385:

axe/dagger with sigil of earth and sigil of torment (shh its new don’t let on to it)
staff (also torment)

all sigil ICDs are shared… if your earth triggers then torment wont until sigil of earth is off CD

Rumor has Torment doesn’t share ICD with other Sigils (yet).
Still, I don’t see Torment being a DPS sigil :/

Lily.1935:

SolemnMalevolence.5248:

Lily.1935:

spoj.9672:

Except in pve beserker does beat condi.

It really doesn’t. I’ve done the testing and have armor and weapons for both specs. The Zerker is better then condi for one dungeon. And that is CoF. Other then that, Condi is still better.

It actually does. With something like 30/25/0/0/15 you’ll be killing things a lot faster than you can setting up all of your conditions in most groups for pretty much every PvE encounter. Not that conditionmancer is particularly bad, but it’s in no way faster than a full zerker setup. Despite this though, I play hybrid because I’m a vanity fiend and want to use my Eye of Rodgort and my fused axe in the same build while still being viable.

snip

Well, uhm…going through all of this one by one, I’ll say this.

The zerker Necro build that does the most damage doesn’t rely on death shroud in the slightest, so DS uptime and time spent outside of DS won’t affect your dps at all. It uses the dagger auto attack as the primary method of dealing damage. When I played the build, the only time I really went into DS was to soak up damage I couldn’t avoid, which is still pretty effective even with damage overflowing into our health since you have so much life force generation.

As far as defenses go, I honestly never even think about this when I decide on a build for a character. Not to sound elitist here or anything, but dodging key attacks has never been an issue for me for any boss in the game, so damage taken won’t really be an issue, thus, neither is armor. The way I see it, conditionmancers have built in toughness because of rabid, so that’s their damage buffer if they can’t evade attacks. Zerker mancers have rapid life force generation to use DS to mitigate damage to their real health bars. It all kind of evens out. Or at least, that’s how it’s felt to me after playing both. Still, though, avoiding attacks has never been an issue for me, so…

As far as range goes, staying in melee range isn’t difficult for anything. If you absolutely -have- to have range, the zerker build can just use life blast, which has 1200 range now. Granted, the damage will be lower because you’ll be that far, but it’s still an option (though I can’t see where you’d ever -need- range). As for the staff, I haven’t touched it in a while. I personally don’t think it’s a good weapon at all.

For hybrid…I can’t vouch for it too much since I’ve only recently started using the build on my necro. It definitely doesn’t outdamage what I was putting out as a zerker but I think it holds its own against condition builds with the advantage of not having to solely rely on such things. As I said before though, I play hybrid for the extremely trivial reason of wanting to be viable while still being able to use all of my neat little weapons. >_> But it’s still pretty good in my opinion. Regardless though, none of those three builds are particularly bad. All of them can be used in PvE, as you said, since there’s nothing hard about PvE. But in terms of what’s the ‘best’ I think zerker takes that by far.

Laar.5476:

Lily.1935:

None of these have a significant advantage over the other to really call one the ultimate Superior build.

It’s like you’ve never played a necro.

I almost exclusively play a necromancer. I’ve tested and worked with all these builds. It all boils down to preference.

Math: Boils down to preference!

SolemnMalevolence.5248:

Lily.1935:

SolemnMalevolence.5248:

Lily.1935:

spoj.9672:

Except in pve beserker does beat condi.

It really doesn’t. I’ve done the testing and have armor and weapons for both specs. The Zerker is better then condi for one dungeon. And that is CoF. Other then that, Condi is still better.

It actually does. With something like 30/25/0/0/15 you’ll be killing things a lot faster than you can setting up all of your conditions in most groups for pretty much every PvE encounter. Not that conditionmancer is particularly bad, but it’s in no way faster than a full zerker setup. Despite this though, I play hybrid because I’m a vanity fiend and want to use my Eye of Rodgort and my fused axe in the same build while still being viable.

snip

snip snip

I have noticed the difference actually. its very possible that you have far better reaction time then I do. Which in that case, I could see where defense isn’t as big of a deal. But in my case, I don’t have Competitive fighting game player reaction time. I have to plan out my attacks and use intelligent positioning. I did the same in GW1 and it was one of the factor why I never mained a Mesmer then.

To add, It doesn’t matter at all when you are free roaming. Mobs and events are easy enough that either build will work fine. In dungeons, at least from my personal experience, the condi has an easier time walking through them. In dungeons this changes. You have aoe fields that you can’t always dodge out of, or multiple mods that all chain immobilize you or chain knock you down. If you can handle these with out a problem, more power to you. Not all of us have the twitch reaction time or a rear view mirror in our computer to see all these signals.

Either way, I will keep with my stance that Condi has the least kinks in its armor then the other 2.

Samhayn.2385:

sigil of earth has no in game listed cool down and I have had both go off on a target. This is the only reason I run both.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sigil_of_Superior_Earth
2s ICD (too lazy to personally test)

Bawi.9541:

Rumor has Torment doesn’t share ICD with other Sigils (yet).

interesting…

Linguistically Inept.6583:

Samhayn.2385:

sigil of earth has no in game listed cool down and I have had both go off on a target. This is the only reason I run both.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sigil_of_Superior_Earth
2s ICD (too lazy to personally test)

It does have a cool down. Unfortunate side effect of this is it negates Sigil of Energy. Which I haven’t gotten around to suggesting arena net to fix this.

Lily.1935:

Laar.5476:

Lily.1935:

None of these have a significant advantage over the other to really call one the ultimate Superior build.

It’s like you’ve never played a necro.

I almost exclusively play a necromancer. I’ve tested and worked with all these builds. It all boils down to preference.

It doesn’t show at all, considering if you did your testing, and your math you would have come to the same conclusion as most theorycrafters, because y’know math.

The OP asked which is better and the simple answer is zerker, for PvE at least.

Bawi.9541:

Math: Boils down to preference!

So I prefer the number 8 because it is pretty, that makes it mathematically better than all the other numbers, right?

Eh, from what I gather, her play style makes her more efficient with a condition build over zerker, and there’s nothing wrong with that. Honestly, as far as builds go I’d just pick the one I like the most since PvE isn’t demanding in the slightest. And from what I’ve seen her post she does have quite a few hours of necro under her belt. x:

Yeah but zerker is better. If your more comfortable with condi then yes its possible that it achieves better dps for you, but thats a player skill/playstyle issue. Ignoring skill and playstyle beserker is far better for dps. However if you need sustained aoe (dredge and ascalon fractal) rampager or condi is argueably better. This tends to only really be the case for fractals 60+ though.

Lily.1935:

Linguistically Inept.6583:

Samhayn.2385:

sigil of earth has no in game listed cool down and I have had both go off on a target. This is the only reason I run both.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sigil_of_Superior_Earth
2s ICD (too lazy to personally test)

It does have a cool down. Unfortunate side effect of this is it negates Sigil of Energy. Which I haven’t gotten around to suggesting arena net to fix this.

I will rerun my tests tonight, yet I have not had earth sigil effect any other sigil I have uses in the past. I will run unspeced and test on mobs tonight.

Samhayn.2385:

Lily.1935:

Linguistically Inept.6583:

Samhayn.2385:

sigil of earth has no in game listed cool down and I have had both go off on a target. This is the only reason I run both.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sigil_of_Superior_Earth
2s ICD (too lazy to personally test)

It does have a cool down. Unfortunate side effect of this is it negates Sigil of Energy. Which I haven’t gotten around to suggesting arena net to fix this.

I will rerun my tests tonight, yet I have not had earth sigil effect any other sigil I have uses in the past. I will run unspeced and test on mobs tonight.

It has effected me. Considering I use both the earth sigil on my dagger and sigil of energy on my staff. Test it if you like.

SolemnMalevolence.5248:

Eh, from what I gather, her play style makes her more efficient with a condition build over zerker, and there’s nothing wrong with that. Honestly, as far as builds go I’d just pick the one I like the most since PvE isn’t demanding in the slightest. And from what I’ve seen her post she does have quite a few hours of necro under her belt. x:

thank you. And that is fair. I could be getting difference results based on my play style. I will submit to this concept, sure.

Also, yes. This was my point from the start. Play what is most fun for you.

Laar.5476:

It doesn’t show at all, considering if you did your testing, and your math you would have come to the same conclusion as most theorycrafters, because y’know math.

I go on the most average base. No cons added to the equation as they seem to warp the result pretty drastically. I also average the low end of the damage with their high end along with the duration each can maintain this damage. I have to do this because the Zerker damage dips and rises drastically based on the fight while the condi does not. This also is not including buffs from allies which also warp the equation.

A Zerker has a higher burst while the Condi has a higher sustain. Sustain and AOE are what I tend to value most considering how frequently I run fractals and dungeon.

But then again Some people might call my Condi build a Hybrid build… Which I find strange as it is the purest form of condition damage I could get. But I’ve also noticed people Call condition builds the same thing what Nemesis calls them. Which if you asked me he is using a hybrid Healing/Condition build and not a pure condition build.

Lily.1935:

Samhayn.2385:

Lily.1935:

Linguistically Inept.6583:

Samhayn.2385:

sigil of earth has no in game listed cool down and I have had both go off on a target. This is the only reason I run both.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sigil_of_Superior_Earth
2s ICD (too lazy to personally test)

It does have a cool down. Unfortunate side effect of this is it negates Sigil of Energy. Which I haven’t gotten around to suggesting arena net to fix this.

I will rerun my tests tonight, yet I have not had earth sigil effect any other sigil I have uses in the past. I will run unspeced and test on mobs tonight.

It has effected me. Considering I use both the earth sigil on my dagger and sigil of energy on my staff. Test it if you like.

I did and it did not effect torment sigil. This may be an issue with torment sigil thou.

Lily.1935:

A Zerker has a higher burst while the Condi has a higher sustain. Sustain and AOE are what I tend to value most considering how frequently I run fractals and dungeon.

Zerker necro doesnt have burst. It has sustained high single target dps and burst aoe. The burst aoe is less dps on a single target than the regular dagger rotation. Also a good player wont have any downtime on zerk necro dps in full melee.

Condi does have better sustained aoe and thats a reason to consider it for certain fractals. Everywhere else zerker is better.

spoj.9672:

Lily.1935:

A Zerker has a higher burst while the Condi has a higher sustain. Sustain and AOE are what I tend to value most considering how frequently I run fractals and dungeon.

Zerker necro doesnt have burst. It has sustained high single target dps and burst aoe. The burst aoe is less dps on a single target than the regular dagger rotation. Also a good player wont have any downtime on zerk necro dps in full melee.

Condi does have better sustained aoe and thats a reason to consider it for certain fractals. Everywhere else zerker is better.

They mentioned axe and staff in their talk about zerker builds so at best they might be using a 30/x/x/x/30 build and counting axe 2 and DS 4 as burst. I don’t recall them talking about dagger at all until the 30/25/0/0/15 build was mentioned by SolemnMalevolence, which apparently takes competitive fighting game type reflexes to play. If it was some kind of axe/staff build that was used it’s no wonder the DPS was low.

Laar.5476:

spoj.9672:

Lily.1935:

A Zerker has a higher burst while the Condi has a higher sustain. Sustain and AOE are what I tend to value most considering how frequently I run fractals and dungeon.

Zerker necro doesnt have burst. It has sustained high single target dps and burst aoe. The burst aoe is less dps on a single target than the regular dagger rotation. Also a good player wont have any downtime on zerk necro dps in full melee.

Condi does have better sustained aoe and thats a reason to consider it for certain fractals. Everywhere else zerker is better.

They mentioned axe and staff in their talk about zerker builds so at best they might be using a 30/x/x/x/30 build and counting axe 2 and DS 4 as burst. I don’t recall them talking about dagger at all until the 30/25/0/0/15 build was mentioned by SolemnMalevolence, which apparently takes competitive fighting game type reflexes to play. If it was some kind of axe/staff build that was used it’s no wonder the DPS was low.

30/25/0/0/15, d/d is great dps with little to no chance to survive anyone with CC. All of that would be fine minus the fact it lacks one key thing to make it truly viable. Cleave. With out cleave the risk vs reward is just not there.