Guild Wars 2

“Evolve your gameplay. With profession specializations, you’ll unlock access to a weapon previously unavailable to your profession as well as new traits, skills, and unique mechanics – all of which will transform your profession into something new.
New” ~heartofthorns.guildwars2.com

So lets discuss the potential future of our profession. What does this mean for us? Although we can only guess and make up conspiracies as to what this actually means let alone what it means for us a few things are pretty clear. I wont state the obvious but I do want to look at a very important feature they mentioned at Pax. They didn’t talk at all about traits, unless I missed something. I would like to talk primarily about the “unique mechanics” that they mentioned.

Now As we all know each profession as a unique mechanic already we call a profession mechanic. So for the sake of discussion lets assume that the unique mechanics are actually profession mechanics. I’ve been thinking a bit and I have a few ideas of what this could mean and how it might shake up the profession.

The First possibility that I thought about was just another mechanic on top of the existing one. Like Death shroud plus or something like that. But that didn’t sound too interesting and I feel it would actually add needless complication to an already very full skill bar.

The second possibility I thought about actually splits into two parts of what it could be. It could be an alternative version of the existing mechanic. So perhaps when you enter death shroud you’re greeted with a completely new set of skills but is still a bonus life pool, or it could be a complete change on how death shroud works. Perhaps a lower life pool but access to your utility skills. The possibilities for this are pretty expansive on what this could be.

The Third possibility we could be looking at with this is the introduction of a completely new mechanic that might replace death shroud. This could mean we might not be getting power from deaths. Or it could mean we still do but use it in a completely new way not yet thought of.

Another thing I wanted to bring up was the possibility that going through this change might lock out old skills and traits we previously had access to in order to give us access to new ones. They said its like a secondary profession, but that in it of itself could mean a lot of different things. It doesn’t have to be similar to GW1’s dual profession system at all.

What does this mean for the necromancer? Well, previously we’ve been described as an attrition profession. A job we aren’t very good at. Well, this could change that description. Perhaps go from attrition to more support and control. Or even raw damage. The possibilities and even the idea that they might play around with this and allow us to make new and interesting choices is exciting.

What are your guys’s thoughts? Do you think we could be looking at a change so drastic as this? And how might this shake up our usability?

I wouldnt be surprised if it was something along the lines of replacing deathshroud with 3-5 F key skills which cost life force to use. And then any traits or abilities that effect deathshroud would be replaced with new traits more suited for the different mechanic. I also think some utilities might be completely replaced. So for example if our specialisation has no deathshroud we no longer have our main defence mechanic. So they would have to give us more defensive skills and utilities to compensate.

I suspect the new mechanics are going to be similar to what the classes already have but also work very differently. So instead of a transform that uses our class resource we get abilities which use our class resource. That sort of thing.

My guess is the base profession that we have now will be available to every Necromancer. You have the basic Necromancer, which is what we currently have, and then specializations that are mutually exclusive to each other. So if you specialize in attrition, you bar yourself from the support specialization. Each specialization has a weapon associated with it, a new heal, set of utilities, elite, and some unique change to the profession mechanic which are only available when you specialize there, but are optional what is picked up.

And like Spoj said, I imagine the profession mechanic change will either involve new Death Shroud skills which change some of the utility of death shroud but not its base use, or will completely change Death Shroud into a similar (life force gated utility skillset) but different mechanic.

I think I’d rather keep Death shroud as a mechanic and have it function very differently then to have it replaced with an entirely new mechanic. As much as I dog on Death shroud I still really like it as a concept. Plus I think this is more likely. We did see that the ranger/druid still had their wolf in the trailer. But that doesn’t always mean something. I’d just like to point that out though.

Yeah thats true. I do like deathshroud. Its just a shame it limits the class so much. If specialisation just changes the DS skills that could also be nice.

Given how they said you’ll get new mechanics, it isn’t exactly stated you’ll lose your old ones. Possibly, this might give you a new “Shroud” which fills your F2 button and gives you more skills as well as a new way to think about the distribution between your Death Shroud use and your other “Shroud” use.

Lily.1935:

The First possibility that I thought about was just another mechanic on top of the existing one. Like Death shroud plus or something like that. But that didn’t sound too interesting and I feel it would actually add needless complication to an already very full skill bar.

What makes you say that? They could easily make something like a Death Shroud Overdrive that makes your stuff stronger. I personally dig the idea of an overdrive mode. Say first you press F1 to normally enter and then you can press F2 to shift into overdrive mode which consumes 3x as much Life Force as normally in exchange for more powerful versions of the existing Death Shroud skills and maybe some stat boosts. It’s simple and simple things are always good because the simpler something is the harder it is to bungle it up.

The reason i dont believe it will be simply adding extra is because then its no longer a specialisation. Its just a power creep and a flat upgrade.

Spoj The Second.7680:

The reason i dont believe it will be simply adding extra is because then its no longer a specialisation. Its just a power creep and a flat upgrade.

Any addition that doesn’t replace or override any existing skills will be a flat upgrade though.

Thats what im saying. Its not going to be flat additions.

I don’t think they will be flat additions, and nothing they have said so far seems to suggest that. Specializations seem to just allow you to gain access to replacements for things we currently have to allow people to further focus on something specific. The only real worry for powercreep is if they allow too much specialization. For example imagine a condi necro with scepter/dagger plus another heavy offensive condi weapon set, a condi heavy DS, a condi-damage elite. Scary stuff.

I imagine that there will be 3 different types of specialization that you will get to choose from
dps
support
crowd control
their 3 main roles your suppose to see in gw2
that specialization i imagine affect what four new utility skills are, an elite, alternate weapon and heal skill, with maybe new class mechaninc

quick guess at what the specializations are
lich necro : new mechanic controlling your minions, mace (support)
ritualist necro : current death shroud, greatsword (dps)
cataclysm necro : new mechanic usuable abilities from life force, bow (crowd ccontrol)

Bhawb.7408:

I don’t think they will be flat additions, and nothing they have said so far seems to suggest that. Specializations seem to just allow you to gain access to replacements for things we currently have to allow people to further focus on something specific. The only real worry for powercreep is if they allow too much specialization. For example imagine a condi necro with scepter/dagger plus another heavy offensive condi weapon set, a condi heavy DS, a condi-damage elite. Scary stuff.

I don’t think so either. But it is a possibility none the less. To add, I don’t see why that would be scary as it would only really allow you to maintain your conditions. The necromancer can already do that with power and so can most professions with power. So why would this be “scary”?

Personally, I feel that the specializations will flesh out what our character already does. Example, one might be more minion control/summoning a minion army. Another will be focused more on using the life force side of the necromancer to buff himself (and hopefully) allies, possibly even allow the necromancer to step out of his body for a time and become in essence just a soul, reinforcing spectral skills. For wells…i’m not sure, corruptions though I can see this being about sacrifice for greater power, possibly even letting us start to actually trade health and/or life force to give ourselves more power. For siphons, i’d LOVE for us to be able to use our life force to heal ourselves, instead of just going into deathshroud to protect ourselves. Something sorta like Alucard from hellsing and his whole soul tank thing.

@Lily: The one time Condi Necromancer was OP was when we gained access to a lot of offensive conditions all at once. If they introduced a new weapon that applied a lot of offensive conditions, plus a Death Shroud that applied offensive conditions, and an elite that applied offensive conditions (realizing that our current ults are highly defensive or non condition), we could potentially see something similar to what happened during the Dhuumfire patch where we suddenly gained a ton of offensive presence all at once.

It isn’t at all guaranteed that it would be bad. But one of the things that keeps our current condi build from being totally overbearing offensively is that it really only has scepter/dagger plus utility skills to apply offensive conditions (while staff/DS/utilities are there for utility or small bursts, but don’t sustain much), it lacks offensive synergy with quite a few other areas where it could potentially gain a lot of new offensive options. A “worst case” scenario for condi power creep on necro would be: 5 new skills on a new weapon, 5 new skills on a new death shroud, and a new elite that gave offensive condition pressure. We could very easily overwhelm condi removal with that many new skills.

Again, nothing guaranteed. Its just a possibility that I hope they have considered.

Edit: okay I’ve heard from a couple of people that say they talked to ANet people at the afterparty. One specialization per class, and when you specialize you lose access to some of the base abilities of your profession, and in exchange get the stuff the specialization gives you. Just something I’ve heard, not 100%.

Bhawb.7408:

Edit: okay I’ve heard from a couple of people that say they talked to ANet people at the afterparty. One specialization per class, and when you specialize you lose access to some of the base abilities of your profession, and in exchange get the stuff the specialization gives you. Just something I’ve heard, not 100%.

Whats a “base ability”? If its skills and traits only, it sounds kinda dull. But if its our mechanic then I’m pumped.

As an example, if you specialize in Druid as a Ranger, you might lose access to a certain weapon/utility type, but gain the Druid stuff. I don’t know specifics though. I imagine we’ll have to wait on that.

Bhawb.7408:

As an example, if you specialize in Druid as a Ranger, you might lose access to a certain weapon/utility type, but gain the Druid stuff. I don’t know specifics though. I imagine we’ll have to wait on that.

I hope you’re wrong on that. That sounds incredibly dull.

I hope I’m wrong too.

Part of me thinks they’ll just use GW1 Ritualist as our spec

Druid Spez as Ranger makes sense, Ranger is close to nature I guess then Maybe Necromancer gets stuff and Spaz in the Death-Underworld region:

A Vampiric Life Siphon Spez that actually works with maybe some improvements to our Signet could be one way.

Another Spez focuseing on our Death Shroud mechanic would also make sense.

Maybe some spez into Minions or powers to raise the dead. All in all this is the thing Iam most intrested in and tbh its the only thing that make wanna buy the expansion.

I think there will be a set of skills whereby you sacrifice health in order to do massive damage or massive supporting the gs might come in hand with this sacrifices/empowerments.
Killzruby

I welcome any good group utility and group support with hopeful arms.

Bhawb.7408:

I hope I’m wrong too.

There is that whole “Unique mechanics” aspect of it which might suggest something more.

Bhawb.7408:

Edit: okay I’ve heard from a couple of people that say they talked to ANet people at the afterparty. One specialization per class, and when you specialize you lose access to some of the base abilities of your profession, and in exchange get the stuff the specialization gives you. Just something I’ve heard, not 100%.

Well this is pretty much what i expected. So it doesnt really change anything for me. And im still hyped. Because one of the main reasons necro isnt in the meta is because it has no special ability over the other classes. If our specialisation boosts anything in terms of control, utility or damage (this would have to be significant or group buffs) it will be a huge step forward. Might not fix us in record runs. But it would certainly make us more welcome in pugs and fractal groups.

Give me Life Force management as a resource for DS skills for one, caster spec with Sword and a Torch.

And give me Siphoning greatsword/melee spec as the other.

That will silence and satisfy me.

Think it might be something like, "Super ultra grandmaster is available in one trait line disabling 2 trait lines, altogether. "

The thing about barring old stuff sounds interesting.
(Yea I know they are just rumors, but still.)

There are so many things I’ve wanted for Necro that Anet simply can’t do because it’d make Necro imba or just completely break existing systems.

With the Specialization system they could do crazy things like give Necro a Spec that removes access to Scepter and Fear Traits but gives them access to stuff like a Block or Invul skill.

Or say have a nerfed version of Death Shroud (less damage or w/e) that in return allows healing to go through it completely, allowing Blood Magic specs to work better in return for being weaker in other ways.

On trailer druid still got pet so I don’t think we get new class mechanic. New weapon plus some new utility’s and that’s all.

met.9653:

On trailer druid still got pet so I don’t think we get new class mechanic. New weapon plus some new utility’s and that’s all.

Just because there is a pet doesn’t it mean that it is the same class mechanic.

Also just because Rangers might not get a big change doesn’t mean we won’t. They are already the only profession that can customize their profession mechanic (and it is possible that being a Druid changes the pet active/passive abilities). So there isn’t a lot we can say based off that, all we saw was that being a Druid doesn’t remove their pet.

met.9653:

On trailer druid still got pet so I don’t think we get new class mechanic. New weapon plus some new utility’s and that’s all.

That doesn’t necessarily mean we wont. Its very possible they’ll use the pet in an entirely new way. Like, perhaps the wolf can turn into light and strike a foe multiple times. Or perhaps the polar bear turns into a small blizzard. We can’t be certain at this point. We may still get death shroud but it could be fundamentally changed.

This is all speculations, for now pet is still there so its rather same mechanic. Ofc no one know for sure unless we see gameplays form test version.

At first I was thinking it would be like “master levels” in daoc (that game is a huge influence on gw2 moreso than gw1 imo)… which essentially let you level up 10 levels in an abbreviated form of another class.

But if they tied us to one weapon (GS) then it probably is a bit more specific about the abilities.. It may be a choice in the sense that you can either stay a traditional necromancer, or tee off onto this new class mechanic, lots of examples of this in other games. The ranger/druid examples are making me think this way, because “druid” is really another class.

Dondagora.9645:

Given how they said you’ll get new mechanics, it isn’t exactly stated you’ll lose your old ones. Possibly, this might give you a new “Shroud” which fills your F2 button and gives you more skills as well as a new way to think about the distribution between your Death Shroud use and your other “Shroud” use.

A lot of this is determined by how Anet is defining new mechanics. This could be anything from complete change in skills to minor/major adjustments in functionality, such as minion control, Dark Path becoming ground targeted, or an all condition or all power focused death shroud.

It is really too soon to have any solid ideas, the demo at pax may be the first glimpses.

Comparing it to a secondary profession raises my expectations a lot personally. Unless it was Exaggerated Marketing Speak™, it makes me hope that the new weapon skills/utilities/traits/whatever that specialisations will unlock will let you play your profession in a style that wasn’t previously viable. Such as a bunkery thief, or a necro with lots of mobility. Stuff like that. I’m not saying I’m specifically expecting necro GS skills to give us lots of mobility, I just mean I’m hoping specialisations will really make each class feel different. I doubt that’ll mean fundamentally changing the profession mechanics, so we’ll still have DS, but there might be traits that change profession mechanics in subtle ways (like PoC does).

Necro+greatsword=death knight
I personally hope they change the mechanic, make DS an energy bar and give abilitites that use that energy bar.

It’s hard to realize what they mean until you see it in action.

It’s either:

1. Grind a lot and at the end get 5 new skills on the greatsword weapon

Or

2. Unlock an entirely new profession that shares about 50% of necromancer stuff and 50% new stuff.

This could be huge, as it would essentially mean 8-10 new classes, even though the new classes are substantially the same as old classes.

We’d have to choose on the spot whether we want the new class or not, however. (but if we cannot reswap on the fly, I’m sure gemstore items will do this for us).

As for myself, my bet is more towards #1 than #2, due simply to the amount of work involved.

So they’ve talked a bit more about it, using Druid as a template.

Johanson: Specializations is a new system that allows you to take each of the professions we have in the game and grow them almost into a new sub-profession or secondary profession. An example of this is, a Ranger can become a Druid. Once a Ranger becomes a Druid, they have the ability to use the powers of the jungle and that gives them new skills, new traits, they can use a new weapon that a Ranger could never use before, and they get new profession mechanics that fundamentally change the way a Ranger plays when they become a Druid. Each of the professions will be getting one of these Specializations and this also is a framework that we’ll use to grow the professions in the future. This will be the way we add more skills, traits, and abilities to the game moving forward. That’s how we’re growing our existing professions.

So that is what we can expect. Necromancers will get one specialization at HoT launch, with more on the way at some point later down the line. We’ll get a greatsword to use, a new heal, utility set (4 skills), elite, traits, and profession mechanics. At first this will be literally just an upgrade from the sound of it, later on when they release more it’ll actually be a more meaningful choice.

Bhawb.7408:

So they’ve talked a bit more about it, using Druid as a template.

Johanson: Specializations is a new system that allows you to take each of the professions we have in the game and grow them almost into a new sub-profession or secondary profession. An example of this is, a Ranger can become a Druid. Once a Ranger becomes a Druid, they have the ability to use the powers of the jungle and that gives them new skills, new traits, they can use a new weapon that a Ranger could never use before, and they get new profession mechanics that fundamentally change the way a Ranger plays when they become a Druid. Each of the professions will be getting one of these Specializations and this also is a framework that we’ll use to grow the professions in the future. This will be the way we add more skills, traits, and abilities to the game moving forward. That’s how we’re growing our existing professions.

So that is what we can expect. Necromancers will get one specialization at HoT launch, with more on the way at some point later down the line. We’ll get a greatsword to use, a new heal, utility set (4 skills), elite, traits, and profession mechanics. At first this will be literally just an upgrade from the sound of it, later on when they release more it’ll actually be a more meaningful choice.

I like what I hear from you so far. But I took away something different. I think you’ll have a reason not to become the secondary option. I think there will be incentive for players to stay with their base version. A new mechanic sounds like it would replace our profession mechanic. And losing death shroud could be a serious choice to make for a player. Or for a guardian losing their virtues. Although we can’t be completely sure It doesn’t sound like a strict upgrade to me.

It may not cause us to lose Death Shroud, but it very well could give us different skills in death shroud.

For Guardian virtues, a specialization probably wouldn’t get rid of them, but it might increase the effectiveness of their actives at the cost of no longer applying to allies.

Bhawb.7408:

So they’ve talked a bit more about it, using Druid as a template.

Johanson: Specializations is a new system that allows you to take each of the professions we have in the game and grow them almost into a new sub-profession or secondary profession. An example of this is, a Ranger can become a Druid. Once a Ranger becomes a Druid, they have the ability to use the powers of the jungle and that gives them new skills, new traits, they can use a new weapon that a Ranger could never use before, and they get new profession mechanics that fundamentally change the way a Ranger plays when they become a Druid. Each of the professions will be getting one of these Specializations and this also is a framework that we’ll use to grow the professions in the future. This will be the way we add more skills, traits, and abilities to the game moving forward. That’s how we’re growing our existing professions.

So that is what we can expect. Necromancers will get one specialization at HoT launch, with more on the way at some point later down the line. We’ll get a greatsword to use, a new heal, utility set (4 skills), elite, traits, and profession mechanics. At first this will be literally just an upgrade from the sound of it, later on when they release more it’ll actually be a more meaningful choice.

kitten knew it
now if gs is a power weapon then condi necros will be stuck for a looong time. lets hope the utilities arent power based.

I just hope Anet doesn’t kitten up the heal skill like they did with SoV, lol.
Just thinking of SoV makes me very skeptical of anet.

Lily.1935:

I like what I hear from you so far. But I took away something different. I think you’ll have a reason not to become the secondary option. I think there will be incentive for players to stay with their base version. A new mechanic sounds like it would replace our profession mechanic. And losing death shroud could be a serious choice to make for a player. Or for a guardian losing their virtues. Although we can’t be completely sure It doesn’t sound like a strict upgrade to me.

I feel like it is unlikely for them to fundamentally change things. Not that it is impossible, but with how they’ve made decisions so far it seems more likely to me that they will make slight changes to existing mechanics rather than completely change them. A few reasons for this: they don’t seem to like professions being too complex from a learning standpoint (losing DS is basically like a different profession), Druid kept the pet, this is considered progression (and having a reason to not progress seems weird to me).

I basically expect any changes to the profession mechanic to be either like something you’d see from a trait, or like they did with Tainted Shackles (an addition, but without a huge power creep).

Yeah, I doubt we’re losing death shroud.

nekretaal.6485:

Yeah, I doubt we’re losing death shroud.

I agree. More likely they’d give Deathshroud a new set of skills. From the trailer we saw the Druid still had a pet.

If they borrow the system from Aion, where a warrior had base skills and then could specialize into a Templar (tank) or a Gladiator (heavy DPS)…

Then we are essentially looking at 8-10 new classes, depending on whether the revenant is something entirely new or is a specialized warrior.

Revenant is entirely knew.

It is a brand new profession, presumably with a specialization as well although I don’t know if they have explicitly said so.

nekretaal.6485:

If they borrow the system from Aion, where a warrior had base skills and then could specialize into a Templar (tank) or a Gladiator (heavy DPS)…

Then we are essentially looking at 8-10 new classes, depending on whether the revenant is something entirely new or is a specialized warrior.

The system you are talking about is far older then Aion. My first MMO used a similar system of classes changing into other classes. Ragnarok Online had things like Acolyte turning into a priest or thief into a Rogue. Things of that nature.

I don’t think its going to be the same. They described it as a secondary profession so we can expect that our current profession will be the bulk of what we are capable of and if they introduce new specializations then we’ll have to choose one over the other and not have access to some of the other’s skills.