Guild Wars 2

Okay so… Pretty let down. Currently we’re looking at about a ( Removed damage, because I didn’t realize they also took that away…) 300 healing when hit with a 1 second ICD, a 35 second CD on use that causes us to gain some HP and put 25 stacks of the mark on the enemy causing hits on the enemy to steal life. Personally, I think it’s pretty terrible now…

Suggestion:
Passive:
Stealth health when you strike an enemy. (.1 second ICD, so cleave damage doesn’t multi-heal, but channel attacks heal each time it hits.)
Damage: 100
Healing: 100

On Use: 1/2 cast. 30 second Cooldown.
Heal for 3500 base.
Mark the enemy for 15 stacks, same .1 ICD.
The mark is unavoidable (entirely), though, evading attacks still remove stacks.
Hitting the marked enemy steals 300 HP, and consumes a stack.

Reasons:
For one, it’s a heal. It needs to reward us for playing well, so while we’re evading hits we can replenish health by landing good hits, and it benefits melee Dagger necros as they have the most risk in close range. Yes, it’s similar to the Vampiric trait, but Adrenal Health is very similar to Healing Signet, the uniqueness of the signet is in it’s use. The idea is, you can use the signet to empower your life stealing power by focusing on an enemy.

So with this, using a fast weapon the healing would be a bit less than healing signet still, but adds some damage to swings. The on use would effectively equal 3500 healing + 15×300 hp for the use, which is 8000 healing, with the ability to heal for less if the enemy evades. Personally, I’d wish it to be a selfish heal, as well to avoid strange PvE tactics of stacking it, it would simply be a way to burst siphon.

That’s my thoughts anyways. Not too excited about the current form. :/

No damage when we are hit. Just some healing. That change alone, I’m fine with (though I would have preferred it stay), as is adding the base heal value.

What I am NOT fine with is the drastic cast time increase, the ICD’s preventing us from getting much out of our OWN HEALING SKILL, and the 35 second recharge.

This skill as previewed in the livestream isn’t even worth 3 skill points, let alone the 25 we have to pay.

Honestly, the fact it hasn’t even been 2 hours since the skill was previewed (not released) and there are already suggestions on how to rework it should tell the dev team something. This skill isn’t just situational, the large numbers of nerfs from the tooltip currently in game make it impossible to even theorycraft with. It’s sad when Blood Fiend is the heal of choice over this for the exact same situations.

Maybe once they see that not a single Necromancer has bothered to unlock it maybe they will see they have taken an average heal and and made it useless.

Bellamy.9860:

Second part of the preview is up and it definately has a 1sec icd on the active part(at around 58:30 http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/b/485426386 ).
Ugh… atleast you could argue that our other heals are in no danger of beeing obsolete, since the new heal is like it is…

35 SECOND cOOL DOWN?!?!?

Ya that is not a spvp skill unless there’s some strange build that looks bad but works great.

Here is the mesmer skill and see what cool kitten i can do with it..
Here is the guardian skill and see how utterly op it will become
Here is the engie skill and see how crazy cool it is
Here is the warrior skill with the passive healing blind won’t hit you so have fun.
Here is the thief heal it can have a purpose.
Here is the ranger skill, another pet.
Here is the necro skill, we put a ICD on it, shall we move on?

Edit: Here is the elementalist heal, It will be awesome! (why do i keep forgetting ele’s? ^^)

I’m going to tell you now, unless you’re getting carried by the passive, its not going to be worth using. At ALL. The 1 second ICD means Blood fiend passively heals you for more. Yeah, no one’s using this BS.

so what purpose is the thief one?

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

Here is the mesmer skill and see what cool kitten i can do with it..
Here is the guardian skill and see how utterly op it will become
Here is the engie skill and see how crazy cool it is
Here is the warrior skill with the passive healing blind won’t hit you so have fun.
Here is the thief heal it can have a purpose.
Here is the ranger skill, another pet.
Here is the necro skill, we put a ICD on it, shall we move on?

It literally went like that. I think they saw the numbers and was like hm… yeah, next. I think they realized their own fail as they were showing it off… They were on Necro for like 10 seconds. >_>

phaeris.7604:

so what purpose is the thief one?

Venom share builds. Properly done, could be disgusting fun.

phaeris.7604:

so what purpose is the thief one?

Venom builds can actually make it a very powerful skill. Fully traited Skelk Venom can fill a thief’s health bar from 1 hp, as they demonstrated. Plus it buffs allies that were hugging you when you activated it.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Maybe once they see that not a single Necromancer has bothered to unlock it maybe they will see they have taken an average heal and and made it useless.

Unlock what?

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

Here is the mesmer skill and see what cool kitten i can do with it..
Here is the guardian skill and see how utterly op it will become
Here is the engie skill and see how crazy cool it is
Here is the warrior skill with the passive healing blind won’t hit you so have fun.
Here is the thief heal it can have a purpose.
Here is the ranger skill, another pet.
Here is the necro skill, we put a ICD on it, shall we move on?

Yep. Find it funny that how Overpowered some of these are and yet the one that not even Necros fully liked is the one that gets nerfed…

ronpierce.2760:

I’m going to tell you now, unless you’re getting carried by the passive, its not going to be worth using. At ALL. The 1 second ICD means Blood fiend passively heals you for more. Yeah, no one’s using this BS.

This skill is absolutely pathetic compared to what it could have been, holy kitten.

Steal health when hit? Nah, that’s too cool, you just heal (essentially a flat damage reduction).

The one good thing I see from the skill is that since they added an ICD, maybe they finally realized that siphon effects generally need ICDs, and they will do it on Vampiric/Vampiric Precision soon, along with a large buff to the amounts. The skill itself though is really sad.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Maybe once they see that not a single Necromancer has bothered to unlock it maybe they will see they have taken an average heal and and made it useless.

Unlock what?

You have to unlock the new heal with 25 skill points. His point is no one will unlock it because its absolutely garbage at the moment.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Maybe once they see that not a single Necromancer has bothered to unlock it maybe they will see they have taken an average heal and and made it useless.

Unlock what?

i meant buy, which is still right i guess. I doubt any of these heals will be open from the start and that we have to buy them.

The passive didn’t need an ICD, though. Now it’s “hey, you get some low damage reduction, but only against 1/4 of the hits you take on average”

lollers, venom share

You know venom share has a radius of 350

how many times is your whole team in a 350 radius.

phaeris.7604:

lollers, venom share

You know venom share has a radius of 350

how many times is your whole team in a 350 radius.

Stand next to an MM, boom full effect.

It doesnt need an icd because the whole idea of hitting fast means you should get more procs. Theres smart play if you save ur multi hit burst for when you need to heal. What theyve done is made it totally useless. Giving an icd and a max amount of stack while also having a short duration is completely moronic. If you are solo you should be able to atleast attempt to get all 25 stacks within 5 seconds. Honestly the fail on this is cringeworthy. I hope the devs realise how useless it is. No icd could make it ok.

I think the only way to balance it is to make it just have a maximum of 25 stacks with no icd. Or make it infinite stacks with no icd but a time limit of 5 seconds. They’ve retricted it in too many ways for it to be remotely useful in any situation.

There will be many necros, who will unlock it. Heck i will unlock it, even in that trashy state. I will test it, i will see it really sucks and then i will never use it again like corrosive poison cloud… (and that skill isnt as bad as that 25 point skill)

They could get away with no ICD if the siphons were not a flat damage effect but were instead a percentage based on the attack they piggybacked on instead.

It’s either that or a flat base with a scaling bonus plus an ICD to keep rapid AE attacks from being OP as hell once they finally get around to buffing the base value and bonus stat scaling to something actually worth using.

Spoj The Second.7680:

…. They’ve retricted it in too many ways for it to be remotely useful in any situation.

Necro balancing in a nutshell.

I will unlock Signet of Vampirism, but I sure as hell won’t use it until it gets some massive buffs (I.E., the removal of ICD’s)

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Maybe once they see that not a single Necromancer has bothered to unlock it maybe they will see they have taken an average heal and and made it useless.

Unlock what?

i meant buy, which is still right i guess. I doubt any of these heals will be open from the start and that we have to buy them.

What heal skills? XD

Bhawb.7408:

phaeris.7604:

lollers, venom share

You know venom share has a radius of 350

how many times is your whole team in a 350 radius.

Stand next to an MM, boom full effect.

Mesmer clone spam as well, iirc.

A 350 radius isn’t horrible for an effect you don’t have to stay within range for an extended period to get the benefit of. A decent team can flow together for a few moments to get a couple buffs and then spread back out; assuming they care to bother coordinating such things. This looks like a possibly good thing to fire off when doing a quick stack for a havoc team stealth bomb.

I strongly believe this signet was intended as an utility.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Maybe once they see that not a single Necromancer has bothered to unlock it maybe they will see they have taken an average heal and and made it useless.

Unlock what?

i meant buy, which is still right i guess. I doubt any of these heals will be open from the start and that we have to buy them.

What heal skills? XD

Exactly ^^

Anet must be crazy nerfing a skill that Necros didnt even fully like but allowing all the VERY strong and even Overpowered ones to stay…

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

I strongly believe this signet was intended as an utility.

As utility skill it would be better in its current from (ofc without the 4k heal on active).

But why would you need healing at the start of a bomb?

Thats the problem,. healing comes 1/3-1/2 way trhough the fight, not at the very start.

So venom at that point is useless.

Another idea:

Passive: gain life force when struck.
Active: large single siphon of health from target enemy. Stuns on hit.

And give it a short enough cool-down that encourages actually using it.

Overkillengine.6084:

Another idea:

Passive: gain life force when struck.
Active: large single siphon of health from target enemy. Stuns on hit.

And give it a short enough cool-down that encourages actually using it.

Make it so that Its passive works inside Transformations and make it so that a version of the active can be used in transformations as well Maybe:

Death Shroud: Gain large portion (6-8,000) Life Force and “Mark” the target the next 5 attacks siphons Life Force
Lich/Plague: Gain a Heal and “Mark” the target the next 5 attacks siphons health

phaeris.7604:

But why would you need healing at the start of a bomb?

Thats the problem,. healing comes 1/3-1/2 way trhough the fight, not at the very start.

So venom at that point is useless.

Not entirely. You still get the Might stacks, and the extra life steal. Even once you’re at the point where the heal is useful, you will still probably be able to share with a couple of allies easily enough.

So then just fire it off shortly after the initial alpha and the enemy has recovered from shock enough to fight back, and your melees are needing a touch of sustain to finish them/stay up.

Hmm if they did that they’d have to make all the signets work just to be fair. I don’t trust them to not nerf them even further in a fit of blind terror if they actually made them work at the same time.

Overkillengine.6084:

Hmm if they did that they’d have to make all the signets work just to be fair. I don’t trust them to not nerf them even further in a fit of blind terror if they actually made them work at the same time.

All Utilities and Elites SHOULD be useable inside Deathshroud – They could even make it so that the skills are that little bit stronger but at the cost of costing Life Force.

Ok..but why would a thief be in the front line?

phaeris.7604:

Ok..but why would a thief be in the front line?

…because their best damage is melee?

Honestly though, there’s no reason for a venom share thief to care about being in the front line. People further back like the venom benefits too. Besides, Havoc Squads are always diving into the enemy territory and are small groups. Pretty hard not to be on the front lines when you only have four friends with you.

Imho bandaid fix: Reduce the cd to 20 sec and decrease cast time to 0.5 and healing on activation by 25% (to 3k). While still not great this might atleast find some use.
Oh and also put the lifeleech (dmg part) on passive back in.

And a question: what was that about John beeing “honest”? Did he write something in the stream?

phaeris.7604:

Ok..but why would a thief be in the front line?

Because 95% of thief builds are either dagger or sword main-hand for damage.

Can we stop talking about thief on a necro thread. :P

What? I got them talking about Necro in a thief thread :p

Spoj The Second.7680:

Can we stop talking about thief on a necro thread. :P

We wouldn’t have the Necro forums if we weren’t allowed to complain about other classes.

Yeah but its gone so offtopic I have no idea what any of you are saying anymore rofl.

Bellamy.9860:

Imho bandaid fix: Reduce the cd to 20 sec and decrease cast time to 0.5 and healing on activation by 25% (to 3k). While still not great this might atleast find some use.
Oh and also put the lifeleech (dmg part) on passive back in.

And a question: what was that about John beeing “honest”? Did he write something in the stream?

I think increasing the passive heal and decreasing the cd may enough for me considering it.

Spoj The Second.7680:

Yeah but its gone so offtopic I have no idea what any of you are saying anymore rofl.

we were going rabble rabble rabble over signet of vampirism having a 35s cd and a 1s icd

So I missed the very obvious change from the data mine earlier. They removed the passive damage portion of the siphon and now it is just the heal. That means under the absolute best possible circumstances, it is 75percent of the warrior heal. Of course we have to be getting constantly hit too.

It made since for it to be lower than the warrior signet because it had the damage portion now it is just sadly weaker in every possible way.

Or the skill should simply work with procs, traits, ds, elites.. everything..

Congrats to being bottom of the heal pile with thieves.

At least you were at the top for a brief time.

Rennoko.5731:

So I missed the very obvious change from the data mine earlier. They removed the passive damage portion of the siphon and now it is just the heal. That means under the absolute best possible circumstances, it is 75percent of the warrior heal. Of course we have to be getting constantly hit too.

It made since for it to be lower than the warrior signet because it had the damage portion now it is just sadly weaker in every possible way.

That’s awesome. I was hoping for a bad skill. This is garbage XD

I kid the devs. but srsly.. xd

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

phaeris.7604:

Ok..but why would a thief be in the front line?

…because their best damage is melee?

Honestly though, there’s no reason for a venom share thief to care about being in the front line. People further back like the venom benefits too. Besides, Havoc Squads are always diving into the enemy territory and are small groups. Pretty hard not to be on the front lines when you only have four friends with you.

This. My Mesmer doesn’t even have a melee weapon but I often end up in near point blank range dancing around the enemy to misdirect them as much as possible.

Rennoko.5731:

It made since for it to be lower than the warrior signet because it had the damage portion now it is just sadly weaker in every possible way.

This. Also, note that it is at best a bit weaker than the warrior heal. It still relies on getting hit. Its pathetic.

Oh, and apparently John thinks the skill is fine because it can “add 6k damage in a team fight to one target”. Yeah, next they’ll tell us Reanimator is one of the best traits in the game.