Guild Wars 2

Just did a test of this, which was something I wasn’t aware of, posted a video up in general chat about it.

I had several builds that were just short of the 100% duration on fear and I might well be using one of these now.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Fear-is-a-stun-Video/first#post2214182

This is pretty cool and I’m definitely going to use this.

But I must be getting a little jaded if I felt annoyed realizing that both stun breaks and condi removal remove fear.

We had a rather lengthy discussion about it last week in this thread:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/Off-hand-dagger-is-meh-more-love-to-warhorn/

and I also updated this one with the fear info
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/stun-sigil-work-for-wh-daze/

I did the exact same test as you. In case you didn’t test 2 sigils: they don’t stack.

Wow, I never knew this. This is really interesting.

What needs to be tested now is if the same bug that affects daze also affects fear. Sigil of Paralyzation causes a rounding error with daze and increases daze effects by a full second. A 2 second daze becomes a 3 second daze with just the paralyzation signet. I wonder if fear is affected the same way.

EDIT: Just tested it. It does not cause the rounding error on fear as it does on daze effects.

I don’t think it’s a bug. Stun and daze durations just get rounded up, I believe that’s intended.
I guess it works like when you are dazed by one of those raptor mobs. You see each second ticking down seperately, not the full duration in one go.

The Sigil itself doesn’t add a full second, just 15%. This is also varifyable in combo with the 33% of the rune of the mesmer. Each gives you an extra second because it’s rounded up. Both will just add 48% and therefore also just add 1 second, not 1 each.

flow.6043:

I guess it works like when you are dazed by one of those raptor mobs. You see each second ticking down seperately, not the full duration in one go.

Nah, thats because the raptors screech applies daze every second that you stand in their cone of fire. It functions similar to wells. It pulses. If you step out of it or dodge roll, the daze will only last 1 second.

flow.6043:

We had a rather lengthy discussion about it last week in this thread:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/Off-hand-dagger-is-meh-more-love-to-warhorn/

and I also updated this one with the fear info
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/stun-sigil-work-for-wh-daze/

I did the exact same test as you. In case you didn’t test 2 sigils: they don’t stack.

I wasn’t aware they didn’t stack, but admittedly I didn’t try…. I was debating trying to do double sigils and see what kind of build I could get…. I will test verify those findings though since you seem to have already done so (to support).

EDIT: Just tested, the sigil does stack in the case of fear. I assume your test was about using 1 sigil of para vs. 2 sigils as it relates to daze and warhorn, which it may do nothing for, but in the case of fear, they DO stack.

I can run 20 spite, master of terror, and two sigils of para and get two ticks of terror. I am going to try a build around this later.

Rennoko.5731:

EDIT: Just tested, the sigil does stack in the case of fear. I assume your test was about using 1 sigil of para vs. 2 sigils as it relates to daze and warhorn, which it may do nothing for, but in the case of fear, they DO stack.

I can run 20 spite, master of terror, and two sigils of para and get two ticks of terror. I am going to try a build around this later.

No I didn’t even bother testing with daze because – as I said – you would need to get more than 100% stun duration to get 2 extra seconds.

I tested for fear and I just repeated the test to see if I made a mistake the last time.
So 20 spite, master of terror, 2 sigils: I still couldn’t get 2 ticks.

You can get 115% fear duration, but is it worth it?

20% Necromancer runes
15% Sigil
30% 30 in Spite
50% from Master of Terror

Personally Fear would probably be the only thing worth speccing for duration on in tPvP, since almost everyone is practically oozing condition cleanses. Otherwise, go for quantity.

I’d bet that it’s pretty funny on the Underwater Fear, which has a 2second base duration.
Well I’m not too hot with Mathematics, just guessing.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

You can get 110% fear duration, but is it worth it?

20% Necromancer runes
10% Sigil
30% 30 in Spite
50% from Master of Terror

Personally Fear would probably be the only thing worth speccing for duration on in tPvP, since almost everyone is practically oozing condition cleanses. Otherwise, go for quantity.

All conditions, and boons, cap at 100% duration. The only reason Lingering Curse goes over is because it modifies the base duration of the skill rather than act as a bleed duration statistic.

Kravick.4906:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

You can get 110% fear duration, but is it worth it?

20% Necromancer runes
10% Sigil
30% 30 in Spite
50% from Master of Terror

Personally Fear would probably be the only thing worth speccing for duration on in tPvP, since almost everyone is practically oozing condition cleanses. Otherwise, go for quantity.

All conditions, and boons, cap at 100% duration. The only reason Lingering Curse goes over is because it modifies the base duration of the skill rather than act as a bleed duration statistic.

I was simply listing the sources out for people, but I am wondering if you can go over with Fear, since it is both a CC and a Condition.

flow.6043:

Rennoko.5731:

EDIT: Just tested, the sigil does stack in the case of fear. I assume your test was about using 1 sigil of para vs. 2 sigils as it relates to daze and warhorn, which it may do nothing for, but in the case of fear, they DO stack.

I can run 20 spite, master of terror, and two sigils of para and get two ticks of terror. I am going to try a build around this later.

No I didn’t even bother testing with daze because – as I said – you would need to get more than 100% stun duration to get 2 extra seconds.

I tested for fear and I just repeated the test to see if I made a mistake the last time.
So 20 spite, master of terror, 2 sigils: I still couldn’t get 2 ticks.

I can make a video if you like to compare. I did get this to work. If someone else doesn’t mind going into mists and testing as well, it could help. I will make a thirty second vid later today if I find the time.

I apologize….. I went to retest and I had made a mistake

I can verify what you said above…. the two sigils of para do not stack in any way….

But what is so very strange about what I found happening, is that at exactly 89% duration, if 15% of that was from one sigil of para, you will get two ticks from terror.

Tested with 10% from lyssa runes, master of terror for 50%, 14 points in spite for 14%, and the sigil of para for 15%.

This gives exactly 89% duration, yet it gives your fear 100% duration….. the only thing I can determine is that the sigil of para does not stack, but has some sort of rounding going on.

Not sure how to leverage this to my benifit, but I am going to think about it.

EDIT: It is also horribly buggy…. i can literally equip a weapon with the sigil, have it work, equip another weapon with the same sigil, and the sigil does nothing… I hate it when the game does things like this with no rhyme or reason….

Does anyone know if fear being a stun affects the sigil of impact as well?

Rennoko.5731:

EDIT: It is also horribly buggy…. i can literally equip a weapon with the sigil, have it work, equip another weapon with the same sigil, and the sigil does nothing… I hate it when the game does things like this with no rhyme or reason….

I feel a bit bad for asking this, since I think you surely know about it… but uhm… fear was the only condition on the target when you tested this, right?

Saturn.6591:

Rennoko.5731:

EDIT: It is also horribly buggy…. i can literally equip a weapon with the sigil, have it work, equip another weapon with the same sigil, and the sigil does nothing… I hate it when the game does things like this with no rhyme or reason….

I feel a bit bad for asking this, since I think you surely know about it… but uhm… fear was the only condition on the target when you tested this, right?

Yes, starting with and the only attacking being DS3. It will crit and proc the bleed, but since the fear and the bleed originate at the same time it doesn’t matter.

It seemed to be that after equiping the sigil, it would either increase the fear duration or not…. I don’t really know why. After leaving the mists and using one in wvw, I got better results, but I only used the one sigil on the one weapon.

I will investigate impact as it relates to conditions. I would bet it works with regular attaacks, but it woul be hard to tell outside of Spvp.

Edit: Too bad… No effect on terror from impact. I would say it works with direct damage, though that is not my area of expertise.

Rennoko.5731:

I apologize….. I went to retest and I had made a mistake

I can verify what you said above…. the two sigils of para do not stack in any way….

But what is so very strange about what I found happening, is that at exactly 89% duration, if 15% of that was from one sigil of para, you will get two ticks from terror.

Tested with 10% from lyssa runes, master of terror for 50%, 14 points in spite for 14%, and the sigil of para for 15%.

This gives exactly 89% duration, yet it gives your fear 100% duration….. the only thing I can determine is that the sigil of para does not stack, but has some sort of rounding going on.

Not sure how to leverage this to my benifit, but I am going to think about it.

EDIT: It is also horribly buggy…. i can literally equip a weapon with the sigil, have it work, equip another weapon with the same sigil, and the sigil does nothing… I hate it when the game does things like this with no rhyme or reason….

Now that you mention it. They might be multiplicative.

Base duration 1 sec
10% cond from lyssa
14% cond from spite
50% cond from master of terror
=74%

sigil 15%

1,74*1,15=2,001 which means it’ll reach the double.

I tried verifying if stun duration multiplies condition duration for fear by stacking Doom and Reaper’s Mark to get 3 ticks with 31% condition duration. (1,31 x2 x1,15= 3,01)
I only got 2 ticks.
Then I tried your way, 74% + sigil to get 2 ticks (or 4 with Doom and mark)… it didn’t work :/

Then the weirdest thing happened:
I tried if any of the weapons were acting buggy, like Rennoko said. So I had axe, wh, staff with a Sigil of Paralyzation each.
I then tried 85% fear duration + each weapon. I couldn’t make fear tick twice.
But then I took both axe+wh (so 2 sigils) and then it worked again O_o

I’ll have to test some more later -.-

Think I mentioned this in the other thread about this, but might as well repost here.

The sigil of para also appears to allow you to break the 100% cap on fear. Tested with already having 100% fear and enemies will be feared about two steps farther (seems like 15% based on distance) with the sigil on vs off, or simply swapping your sets between the one that has it vs not.

Whether this could actually tick 3 terrors, did not test, but seems like it should be theoretically possible, if very rare.

Best use of this might be simply to gain back duration vs the increasingly common builds that use lemongrass and melandru runes. Though the nice thing it still gives additional impact even on those who don’t have reduction, unlike going over 100% with any other known duration, where it would be wasted (outside lingering curses).

Though I’ve yet to be convinced that alone is good enough to make you take the sigil over other ones, if you don’t need it to reach 100%.

So does this stack with master of terror + the 20% Fear Duration from rune of the necromancer?

Or is it better to simply stretch out condition durations in general to reach the cap? Because I’ve only recently started experimenting with a fear build.

Pendragon.8735:

Think I mentioned this in the other thread about this, but might as well repost here.

The sigil of para also appears to allow you to break the 100% cap on fear. Tested with already having 100% fear and enemies will be feared about two steps farther (seems like 15% based on distance) with the sigil on vs off, or simply swapping your sets between the one that has it vs not.

Whether this could actually tick 3 terrors, did not test, but seems like it should be theoretically possible, if very rare.

Best use of this might be simply to gain back duration vs the increasingly common builds that use lemongrass and melandru runes. Though the nice thing it still gives additional impact even on those who don’t have reduction, unlike going over 100% with any other known duration, where it would be wasted (outside lingering curses).

Though I’ve yet to be convinced that alone is good enough to make you take the sigil over other ones, if you don’t need it to reach 100%.

Thanks for the idea to go test. See attached screen.

Note that a normal full 4 second fear will show a duration of 3-2-1-0 (the 4 seconds).

With the sigil in use the fear is about .3-4 seconds longer (which would make sense if it was stacking on top of 100%). Note the duration actually starts ABOVE 4 seconds.

I am going to be using this sigil all the time now that I know this. No extra fear tick, but an extra .2 or so second on fear is pretty darn good. Using a stop watch I checked this vs. our normal full 2 second fear and it does indeed last longer.

Btw to test if you get 3 terror ticks, daze/place non damaging combat effect on them (blind em, daze em, vuln em, turn the enemy invul; would add damage em but it would kinda kitten with the results).
And wow that little sigil seems to be helping a lot of people, but i still have to note one thing, how does that help you over energy, hydromancy, force or any other combat sigil in general?

There is no question I could get 5 ticks on reapers protection, or 3 ticks on normal DS3 fear for terror damage, but all that proves is the fear lasts slightly longer than 4 seconds/2 seconds respectively, which I just proved. It is all a matter of timing the fear just before the other damage ticks.

For a condition user, one who doesn’t find themselves in melee range very often, I tend to think it is the best offhand sigil choice now. Really if damage is your concern, you could argue Earth/Earth does the most, but i would pass up the slightly higher bleed chance for the longer fears in WvW by going Earth/Para.

Energy/geo/hydro/agony/generosity are all situational, and conflict with Earth. Assuming you get your stacks before you put on your normal offhand, I am going to run Para.

Rennoko.5731:

There is no question I could get 5 ticks on reapers protection, or 3 ticks on normal DS3 fear for terror damage, but all that proves is the fear lasts slightly longer than 4 seconds/2 seconds respectively, which I just proved. It is all a matter of timing the fear just before the other damage ticks.

For a condition user, one who doesn’t find themselves in melee range very often, I tend to think it is the best offhand sigil choice now. Really if damage is your concern, you could argue Earth/Earth does the most, but i would pass up the slightly higher bleed chance for the longer fears in WvW by going Earth/Para.

Energy/geo/hydro/agony/generosity are all situational, and conflict with Earth. Assuming you get your stacks before you put on your normal offhand, I am going to run Para.

Wait, so I am curious as to how you would get 3 ticks. Would it be master of terror + food+ stun sigil or is there something else I am missing?

40% Food + sigil + 10% duration (from runes or spite tree) + master of terror (50%).

Then apply fear JUST RIGHT before you see their health bar decrease from bleeds/poison, and it will tick 3 times. I could make a video, but it would take me a bit to get the timing down just right I bet.

EDIT: Turns out it wasn’t so hard. See video.

Andele.1306:

And wow that little sigil seems to be helping a lot of people, but i still have to note one thing, how does that help you over energy, hydromancy, force or any other combat sigil in general?

It’s really hard. Because most sigils you can rate out on balance by doing pure damage math based on your build and project how much they add. Based on things like your crit rate, condition damage tick, normal skill rotation, etc.

But for the para sigil, you have to figure how much additional damage (and positioning, etc) you should expect to gain during that extra CC time, where the enemy cannot return any damage at the same time.

Though of course, the para sigil is only good if you fire off your fears while having the weapon equipped that has it. If its on your off hand dagger say, but not staff, it wont help Reaper’s Mark, and won’t even help Doom if you DS Doom while holding staff.

Many players will also break CC before fears run their full course, I notice this a lot even having 2 second fears on our 2 main ones, so the chance that a 2.15, or 2.30 fear, however it is multiplying, you might not always get the extra time, or chance at more ticks.

Definitely interesting though and worth theorycrafting about.

Pendragon.8735:

Many players will also break CC before fears run their full course, I notice this a lot even having 2 second fears on our 2 main ones, so the chance that a 2.15, or 2.30 fear, however it is multiplying, you might not always get the extra time, or chance at more ticks.

Definitely interesting though and worth theorycrafting about.

I think this duration stacking is actually most valuable in tPvP. A terror necro with a competent team mate can shred a bunker in a few seconds, particularly Eles and Guardians. Corrupting stability=fear. You can basically run them out of condi cleanses and stun breaks in a few casts. If you go CC heavy with Scepter/WH, Staff and Golem on the elite, then they have no choice but to eat about 6s of hard CC. It puts them to the choice of which ones to eat, and God forbid they try to CC you and eat that 4s+ from Reaper’s Protection. It is actually pretty impactful.

I agree that a terror necro in this kind of build will have the utility and hard cc to shred a bunker to bits (especially with wh), but only with a teammate helping with the actual damage output. However, seriously, if you want to take out a bunker yourself, I think you’re better off doing it in a power spec, prepare well to land an immobilize+wells+lichform and he will just blow up, no assistance required.

Also, someone asked if it’s worth trading geomancy/hydromancy damage for paralyzation. I think it is, because it basically grants you the 10 trait points that you were otherwise missing to make a “complete” build, by allowing you to not take Master of Terror in a Terror build.