Guild Wars 2

first nothing does more damage on this class beside Condi which is A/D or A/T and Staff with http://dulfy.net/gw2traits#build=AgUG-AJ8A6g~ and utility of Zephyr, Sharpening Stone, Signet of Stone and Entangle. if you don’t believe me then go try it your self and see which one has higher dps, survival cleanse and fast kill.

now for the real problem here. I’ve said this before and I will say this again. me and I know allot of other people out there chose this class for DPS range and not as a healer. we the Rangers are being toyed around and ignored for a long time and this has gone far enough.. this is how I see things in this game, we are the buyer and imagine Ranger as a 2003 Honda that still runs ok. then ANET have this old broken wheels but have cool colors in it and some glitters on the side and present it as a trading Item in exchange of our 2003 Honda. this is always the case and there are allot of players here who are simple minded and took that offer of a worn out shiny wheels with glitters. these people are the who have this childish excuse of “you dont like healers? then dont play it” while missing the fact that YA we don’t like healers thats why we did not roll for guardian and we chose DPS ranger!. I like the new pets but the druid is in no what so ever worth wasting our money for.

what I think should be the changes for Druid?
well. do not make us a healer and give us dps on astral form and change those heals to support buffs or disables or condi just not heals. change the animation of Staff wield and change the effect of those gylphs that can actually be a better option that Wilderness Survival for Survival cd reduct as our cleanser (Astral form have this but not worth it since you will end up as a dummy target due to the fact that you don’t ahve any skills beside heals). this way we won’t be OP but will still feel useful and be able to have fun.

Again with this…..nvm nvm. Carry on

Ranger didn’t need an elite spec to specialize in DPS since ranger already focuses on DPS.

Elite specializations aren’t suppose to be an upgrade to the core, they are suppose to open up a new playstyle that wasn’t there before.

It’s not a childish response to tell you to simply not play the druid. Druid is a completely optional addition to the profession. Core ranger is still there and still functional without the druid trait line.

Ehecatl.9172:

Ranger didn’t need an elite spec to specialize in DPS since ranger already focuses on DPS.

Elite specializations aren’t suppose to be an upgrade to the core, they are suppose to open up a new playstyle that wasn’t there before.

It’s not a childish response to tell you to simply not play the druid. Druid is a completely optional addition to the profession. Core ranger is still there and still functional without the druid trait line.

Just do it Ehecatl.
Tell him that his Ranged ranger is viable.

And while at it, tell him that we already are ZerkMeta.

We need people like him realize that Elite Specialization was not supposed to buff their current play-style but to give ranger more options.

Ehecatl.9172:

Ranger didn’t need an elite spec to specialize in DPS since ranger already focuses on DPS.

Elite specializations aren’t suppose to be an upgrade to the core, they are suppose to open up a new playstyle that wasn’t there before.

It’s not a childish response to tell you to simply not play the druid. Druid is a completely optional addition to the profession. Core ranger is still there and still functional without the druid trait line.

that is why I said support is better and not heals that disabled us.

Well, complaining that the Druid doesn’t deal enough damage fits in perfectly with the running Ranger community argument of the last three years that Ranger doesn’t do enough damage. And since people want that damage problem addressed (you know the whole Ranger 70 / Pet 30 argument that is more like Ranger 85 / Pet 15, but the argument still stands because pet dies instantly in more difficult content…), and only got a healer and little else….

I say let them continue to complain. I think they have every right to and the fact that people keep posting the argument that its just another option without addressing the main issue these guys have just shows how disingenuous you guys really are. Or are you guys really going to tell me that Ranger is 100% viable and not at all handicapped by its poor mandatory AI?…Or the fact that we don’t have specifically single target or AoE weapons and as a result, all of our weapons are kind of half effective at both?

(also, I really like the Druid specialization and I don’t want it to change in any way really, but, we need the core issues with Ranger fixed, like 3 YEARS AGO)

Tragic Positive.9356:

Ehecatl.9172:

Ranger didn’t need an elite spec to specialize in DPS since ranger already focuses on DPS.

Elite specializations aren’t suppose to be an upgrade to the core, they are suppose to open up a new playstyle that wasn’t there before.

It’s not a childish response to tell you to simply not play the druid. Druid is a completely optional addition to the profession. Core ranger is still there and still functional without the druid trait line.

Just do it Ehecatl.
Tell him that his Ranged ranger is viable.

And while at it, tell him that we already are ZerkMeta.

We need people like him realize that Elite Specialization was not supposed to buff their current play-style but to give ranger more options.

that is my target.. to have more options on this druid trait line that is better that survival. this is a dps class and we can already tank, somewhat heal but need to be able to buff. most of the classes that are mostly required in dungeons and other things are buffers. if we can just have helpful buffs or buff stripping skills or daze ( not from astral or staff) then we could have been ok with it. like I said before, we do not have any good use on most cases because we cannot provide buffs like other class but we are DPS class so we should at least get that on elite because it is part of what we are paying for. I would never yield to a class play that is forced to us.. this is what most Rangers want and it will always be the reason why everyone else gets Elite that at least playable and then we get to be a useless healers, as if no one else can heal. the end of the stick will always be on us and you guys are letting them pay you like a tool while taking your money. only thing I can do now is to change to Revenant and this is about the end of BWE so no use to force anyone, just want you guys to see the reality of our situation.

OP paid for a product. He wants to get his money’s worth out of it. For him it was the Druid doing want he wanted it to do. He has every right to complain just as much as others have the right praise it.

@ lxghostxl
You keep going on about helpful buffs. Ranger can already give a party 100% uptime on 11 might, Fury, Swiftness, Regeneration, 80% uptime on Protection and 70% uptime on Vigor as well as 50% uptime on Stability, those those have CDs no not technically 100%, it will be 100% during a fight. This, while putting out near 1000hps for a party, passively. That’s using sword MH and doing respectable damage at the same time.

If Druid could build AF better through damage, it would be the only support a party needs, phalanx warrior would be obsolete because everyone else can stack the other 14 might, no need for guard hammer or mace just aegis and blinds + DPS, a chrono, an aura tempest and rest DPS.

I see raids becoming;
2x Support Druid... Something like this…
2x DPS Auramancer Tempest
2x DPS Chrono
2 x DPS/Aegis/Blind Guards
2 x Pure DPS builds

[deleted post redacted by mod]

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

@ lxghostxl
You keep going on about helpful buffs. Ranger can already give a party 100% uptime on 11 might, Fury, Swiftness, Regeneration, 80% uptime on Protection and 70% uptime on Vigor as well as 50% uptime on Stability, those those have CDs no not technically 100%, it will be 100% during a fight. This, while putting out near 1000hps for a party, passively. That’s using sword MH and doing respectable damage at the same time.

If Druid could build AF better through damage, it would be the only support a party needs, phalanx warrior would be obsolete because everyone else can stack the other 14 might, no need for guard hammer or mace just aegis and blinds + DPS, a chrono, an aura tempest and rest DPS.

I see raids becoming;
2x Support Druid... Something like this…
2x DPS Auramancer Tempest
2x DPS Chrono
2 x DPS/Aegis/Blind Guards
2 x Pure DPS builds

[deleted post redacted by mod]

party buff not solo buff and I am well aware of those buffs and the party buff we can provide so Do not tell me someone knows Rangers better than anyone because there is no such thing!. we could have just had a better fix on pets or buff our pets, if you would use that excuse as a form of authority then you failed. I know he does post for rangers and give fix and never said he don’t, but this is not the best approach for this class. I am speaking on my own opinion and accept all comment but never tell me I don’t know anything about the class. healer? LOL! don’t make me laugh.. this game was build without a healer and you already forgot that and feels the need to just follow this joke, I want the money i spent to be worth it.

lxghostxl.5097:

…this game was built without a healer.

ftfy

And now it is being built with one.

Ehecatl.9172:

Core ranger is…..still functional without the druid trait line.

It’s not for a lot of people, though.

That’s the problem.

It’s unintuitive and kind of sketchily designed and has all sorts of existing issues that never seem to be tackled.

Ranger players are also treated really, really badly, by other players.

Basically, because they (apparently) think we are idiots for choosing/sticking to what they consider to be a bad class!

Kind of like being treated badly, on the road, because you supposedly chose the wrong brand of car, or something.

It’s not something most adults would do, but many of the players of games will do all sorts of things most adults wouldn’t do, unfortunately…

So, the class needs to be solid, even if some people can cope with its foibles, just to convince other players that we’re not idiots for choosing it (if you see what I mean?).

This used to be the case in WoW, as well, when Hunters were more like the Rangers in this game.

Then they made some changes and the only people still saying that stuff, there, are imports from other games (this one maybe?) and/or people who haven’t played WoW for years and are still stuck in the past.

This game needs to look to what they did there, with Hunter in MoP, because GW2 Ranger is far too much like the clunky, old school, WoW Hunter.

Been ranger since launch. Yes, I rolled my ranger to be a long ranged DPS (pew pew with bow!) and that’s what I got to play and will keep on playing.

I tried druid, doesn’t fit the playstyle. It does add some CC if I want to do LB/Staff or at least go druid spec, but probably just won’t! It’s not like I am forced to play my ranger as a druid, I’ll just play Pew Pew ranger, Spam MA HAMMER 4k aoe on my Rev, Dragon Hunter looks promising to my playstyle as well!

It’s ok really!

Also, while I agree with the overall “don’t have to play druid if you don’t like it”, the argument that Druid makes pure logical sense only based on the fact that rangers are a pure DPS class isn’t valid.

Thiefs, Mesmers, and Necromancers got additional DPS/Utility specs. You could argue that they all have some utility/support specs already, but so does the Ranger.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I see raids becoming;
2x Support Druid... Something like this…
2x DPS Auramancer Tempest
2x DPS Chrono
2 x DPS/Aegis/Blind Guards
2 x Pure DPS builds

In another post this is pretty much what I predict. Minimum 2 druids. No straight rangers allowed unless there are 2 or more druids and only if they can’t fill the spots with someone else. And the other thing that I predict is that if the heals of the druid fail to keep up the druids will take all the blame for party wipes which will lead to griefing and elitism. (yes I know there is that now but you wait, it will get worse.)

I have only once been kicked from a party and that was cause it was a fractal scammer. I’ve only had one real instance of being complained at for my class and that was I having a bad night due to a lag fest.

I really almost never get complained at playing ranger because I know what I’m doing. But I see in the future: “why haven’t you joined as a Druid” “when are you changing to Druid.” “can’t you see we don’t want a ranger and we have enough druid’s”.

Tigaseye.2047:

Ehecatl.9172:

Core ranger is…..still functional without the druid trait line.

It’s not for a lot of people, though.

That’s the problem.

It’s unintuitive and kind of sketchily designed and has all sorts of existing issues that never seem to be tackled.

Ranger players are also treated really, really badly, by other players.

Basically, because they (apparently) think we are idiots for choosing/sticking to what they consider to be a bad class!

Kind of like being treated badly, on the road, because you supposedly chose the wrong brand of car, or something.

It’s not something most adults would do, but many of the players of games will do all sorts of things most adults wouldn’t do, unfortunately…

So, the class needs to be solid, even if some people can cope with its foibles, just to convince other players that we’re not idiots for choosing it (if you see what I mean?).

This used to be the case in WoW, as well, when Hunters were more like the Rangers in this game.

Then they made some changes and the only people still saying that stuff, there, are imports from other games (this one maybe?) and/or people who haven’t played WoW for years and are still stuck in the past.

This game needs to look to what they did there, with Hunter in MoP, because GW2 Ranger is far too much like the clunky, old school, WoW Hunter.

My point was that druid is an addition to ranger, not a core aspect of it that you absolutely need to take to play it.

Core ranger still has problems, certainly. But the elite spec wasn’t going to be a straight upgrade that fixed core ranger’s problems. In fact it shouldn’t be. Ranger needs to be improved. It needs it’s traits and utilities improved as well as some tweaks to certain under performing weapons. Adding an elite spec that fills the same role core ranger fills would only serve to make core ranger worse by comparison.

In an ideal world ranger and druid would be taken in the same group for providing different benefits. Ranger would provide good DPS while druid provides healing support. To use your WoW comparison, ranger is feral druid while druid is resto. Both are viable but fill different roles in a raid and/or pvp team.

But if the elite spec was just a straight upgrade to ranger DPS there’d be no point in anyone ever using ranger, and that would be sad.

Did you have to caps lock the title….
Same goes for that other ironically opposite thread.

The druid is pretty solid for what it does, but what this weekend spotifies when you compare all classes now is just how bad the ranger actually is, compared to any class the ranger falls very short of in spvp. It now has a single track use in wvw, and in pve it is still sub par (raids excluded as I couldn’t test there)

Ehecatl.9172:

My point was that druid is an addition to ranger, not a core aspect of it that you absolutely need to take to play it.

Core ranger still has problems, certainly. But the elite spec wasn’t going to be a straight upgrade that fixed core ranger’s problems. In fact it shouldn’t be. Ranger needs to be improved. It needs it’s traits and utilities improved as well as some tweaks to certain under performing weapons. Adding an elite spec that fills the same role core ranger fills would only serve to make core ranger worse by comparison.

In an ideal world ranger and druid would be taken in the same group for providing different benefits. Ranger would provide good DPS while druid provides healing support. To use your WoW comparison, ranger is feral druid while druid is resto. Both are viable but fill different roles in a raid and/or pvp team.

But if the elite spec was just a straight upgrade to ranger DPS there’d be no point in anyone ever using ranger, and that would be sad.

That’s a really good statement and well said.

Fixes are needed for both Ranger and Druid. I think for most people a few more AoE and a bit more DPS for Ranger.

For Druid most people suggest better boons/support than buffing healing higher.

Firebird Gomer.9563:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I see raids becoming;
2x Support Druid... Something like this…
2x DPS Auramancer Tempest
2x DPS Chrono
2 x DPS/Aegis/Blind Guards
2 x Pure DPS builds

In another post this is pretty much what I predict. Minimum 2 druids. No straight rangers allowed unless there are 2 or more druids and only if they can’t fill the spots with someone else. And the other thing that I predict is that if the heals of the druid fail to keep up the druids will take all the blame for party wipes which will lead to griefing and elitism. (yes I know there is that now but you wait, it will get worse.)

I have only once been kicked from a party and that was cause it was a fractal scammer. I’ve only had one real instance of being complained at for my class and that was I having a bad night due to a lag fest.

I really almost never get complained at playing ranger because I know what I’m doing. But I see in the future: “why haven’t you joined as a Druid” “when are you changing to Druid.” “can’t you see we don’t want a ranger and we have enough druid’s”.

I really can’t see there not being enough healing with a team composition like that. There is like 43% damage mitigation through Protection and Frost Aura. Add in Blinds, Aegis, Weakness with Slow and miles of projectile reflects. The incoming damage is not going to be over the top. You have HS to drop 1st, which will be blasted for heals too before you even get into CAF.

Besides, why would you complain that people actually want your Druid ability for something? That is far better than them simply not caring that you want to run your Ranger or that they don’t want a Ranger at all. Take a look at that build I posted, its pretty much a Melee ranger with spirits for support, you just have the CAF for healing… I’m assuming they fix AF generation so DPS is a viable way of generating it.

lxghostxl.5097:

first nothing does more damage on this class beside Condi which is A/D or A/T and Staff with http://dulfy.net/gw2traits#build=AgUG-AJ8A6g~ and utility of Zephyr, Sharpening Stone, Signet of Stone and Entangle. if you don’t believe me then go try it your self and see which one has higher dps, survival cleanse and fast kill.

now for the real problem here. I’ve said this before and I will say this again. me and I know allot of other people out there chose this class for DPS range and not as a healer. we the Rangers are being toyed around and ignored for a long time and this has gone far enough.. this is how I see things in this game, we are the buyer and imagine Ranger as a 2003 Honda that still runs ok. then ANET have this old broken wheels but have cool colors in it and some glitters on the side and present it as a trading Item in exchange of our 2003 Honda. this is always the case and there are allot of players here who are simple minded and took that offer of a worn out shiny wheels with glitters. these people are the who have this childish excuse of “you dont like healers? then dont play it” while missing the fact that YA we don’t like healers thats why we did not roll for guardian and we chose DPS ranger!. I like the new pets but the druid is in no what so ever worth wasting our money for.

what I think should be the changes for Druid?
well. do not make us a healer and give us dps on astral form and change those heals to support buffs or disables or condi just not heals. change the animation of Staff wield and change the effect of those gylphs that can actually be a better option that Wilderness Survival for Survival cd reduct as our cleanser (Astral form have this but not worth it since you will end up as a dummy target due to the fact that you don’t ahve any skills beside heals). this way we won’t be OP but will still feel useful and be able to have fun.

i think youre wasting your time – i’d also wished for a different outcome for druid BUT druid IS a healer and it is supposed to be a healer and will stay a healer – so all comments need to be with that in mind…just upping damage on staff while keeping all the healing skills would make it ridicoulosly overpowerd….you could however exchange one or two of the staff heals fro something more damaging or add at least some damaging abilities (there was a good post here on where someone added condi damage to staff skills that were also thematically sound such as burning for solar beam)…

If you want to drastically increase damage output or something, i think its better served for the ranger discussion itself then the druid….

I do however agree that staff needs some tweaking

I don’t get why people use the argument ‘’I didn’t pick X to play Y, I want to play X’’, when the whole point of E-specs is to change the playstyle and give something we previously lacked in. Just don’t use the E-spec then, instead of crying for changes.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

lxghostxl.5097:

…this game was built without a healer.

ftfy

And now it is being built with one.

And he’s awesome as healer. Pick another class if you dislike ranger/druid so much. There are 8 other classes with their own specialization. Problem solved.

lxghostxl.5097:

what I think should be the changes for Druid?
well. do not make us a healer

Play the Power Druid build. It is quite fun and possibly even better than Power Ranger.

illenos.5134:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

lxghostxl.5097:

…this game was built without a healer.

ftfy

And now it is being built with one.

And he’s awesome as healer. Pick another class if you dislike ranger/druid so much. There are 8 other classes with their own specialization. Problem solved.

I normally don’t post but I don’t get how any of you guys don’t get each other. Look it’s simple and to the point. You have a class that started for the past 3 years as a DPS, and for that matter one of two classes that time and time again the Meta has said NO to. Yes, if your friends let you roll with them as a DPS ranger letting you show off how good a ranger can be in the right hands that is great! You have no real reason to be here in the forums worrying about anything or defending anything…move on! But know this, your friend are not the “Meta”

Some one a few posts back pointed out how this reminded them of the Hunters Back in WoW, funny enough this reminds me more of the Druid themselves back in WoW. Now for those of you that don’t know, the Druid in WoW could change forms for what was needed, DPS, Tanking, and Healing. The problem at the time was that the only thing people wanted a Druid for was healing, and it was GOOD at it, but those that sat back and learned the ends and outs and knew how to make the DPS of a Druid work where great at it, yet at the time no one wanted them….kind of like now how you have some Rangers out there that could walk into a group and show just how good if not great a ranger can be, but with the meta the way it is…good luck with that.

What is bugging a lot of people is the fact that as it is, trying to get a spot on a team as a ranger is hard enough, throw in a healing spec, and suddenly if a team does want you I am sure it won’t be for your ranger ways! 3 years of being told your DPS and Utility sucks only now to get on a team and be faced with, “Oh we thought you where a Druid…KICK!” or “Do you mind change to a Druid spec?” that is IF the Druid is even good at healing, if not then it kind of puts a lot of people back at square one trying to get a spot in WvW, PvP, and now raids. Once again this is no problem for you at all if you are playing with great friends, or in a very cool Guild.

Keep in mind I am not crying DOOM or saying that others are, but lets be real here people, 3 years…can you really blame a lot of these guys for being worried? And to simple tell them “if you don’t like it play another class…” at the end of the day does that not kind of prove their point and 3 years worth of worrying?

Myself personally am a solo ranger, so like the ranger that play with friends and a good guild, I am good. Heck I am working on seeing if I can get a solo build or two out of the new Druid spec. While I am cool and have no worries, even I can’t come here and tell a group of people that have been putting up with stuff for 3 years who know have raids and other stuff thrown on top of that, and to tell them if they don’t like it kick rocks…just seems kind of past mean at this point don’t ya think?

I like the druid and the support with heals alot! but it should not be only heals!
It should be more like a dps and in celestrial form become even stronger supporter/dpser!
would really love some boons in it plus some heals!

Core ranger issues dont come under druid issues.

And you dont HAVE to use the elite.

However

We do HAVE to get some development time on core Ranger issues too. So it is on par with some of the ludicrous sheet the other classes ( and their Elites) can pull off.

Ive seen some insane stuff (boon stacking and DPS) done by Engy(Scrapper), Mesmer(Chrono), Rev, Necro(Reaper) on streams over the weekend. The same sort of stuff that made Roy instantly nerf WHaO.

Sandzibar.5134:

Core ranger issues dont come under druid issues.

And you dont HAVE to use the elite.

However

We do HAVE to get some development time on core Ranger issues too. So it is on par with some of the ludicrous sheet the other classes ( and their Elites) can pull off.

Ive seen some insane stuff (boon stacking and DPS) done by Engy(Scrapper), Mesmer(Chrono), Rev, Necro(Reaper) on streams over the weekend. The same sort of stuff that made Roy instantly nerf WHaO.

The core ranger is a bit ok right now since most players got use to it. I think they should focus on the future of druids because that is the theme of this expansion and what we paid for.. now players that I know are saying it is quite not as challenging as before since now in pvp/pve we have a class that is focused on heals and tons off buffer so it no one can die as long as they keep this cycle. before most players are based on timing, good decision making for play style and now its just broken and there is no other way to play a Druid other than heal or not. I suggested that we get some other buff or debuff and some DPS more like a support dps class like everyone else so we do not break the balance of no requirements for a healer. I know there are other players that can do party buff but that doesnt mean we can have a unique one or just get rid of the stability stacking but leave the might buff. Druid skills on glyphs should also add some nature theme and what I mean is like, earth armor on elementalist, some elemental aura that adds a unique element like aura of the Light, while activated out going damage have the chance to burn or take out a buff. aura of the Night that could randomly add offensive Condition damage. there are options and I do not understand how we end up with this healer class…

lxghostxl.5097:

Sandzibar.5134:

Core ranger issues dont come under druid issues.

And you dont HAVE to use the elite.

However

We do HAVE to get some development time on core Ranger issues too. So it is on par with some of the ludicrous sheet the other classes ( and their Elites) can pull off.

Ive seen some insane stuff (boon stacking and DPS) done by Engy(Scrapper), Mesmer(Chrono), Rev, Necro(Reaper) on streams over the weekend. The same sort of stuff that made Roy instantly nerf WHaO.

The core ranger is a bit ok right now since most players got use to it. I think they should focus on the future of druids because that is the theme of this expansion and what we paid for.. now players that I know are saying it is quite not as challenging as before since now in pvp/pve we have a class that is focused on heals and tons off buffer so it no one can die as long as they keep this cycle. before most players are based on timing, good decision making for play style and now its just broken and there is no other way to play a Druid other than heal or not. I suggested that we get some other buff or debuff and some DPS more like a support dps class like everyone else so we do not break the balance of no requirements for a healer. I know there are other players that can do party buff but that doesnt mean we can have a unique one or just get rid of the stability stacking but leave the might buff. Druid skills on glyphs should also add some nature theme and what I mean is like, earth armor on elementalist, some elemental aura that adds a unique element like aura of the Light, while activated out going damage have the chance to burn or take out a buff. aura of the Night that could randomly add offensive Condition damage. there are options and I do not understand how we end up with this healer class…

The core ranger is NOT ok, do not spread these lies. The druid is bound to how well the core ranger is in multiple ways. Want to be more supportive? look at spirit issues. Want a useful pet? Look at how critically bad the pets in both pvp and pve. The core ranger is in bad state (worst core of any of the 8 atm) this will drastically effect how good the druid is, and the potential for build diversity.

Ehecatl.9172:

But if the elite spec was just a straight upgrade to ranger DPS there’d be no point in anyone ever using ranger, and that would be sad.

I paid for the Druid just like I paid for every aspect of HoT. I want the elite spec to at least be useful to me in dungeons and fractals. I want to get my money’s worth out of the elite spec that I looked forward to the most… Sadly, there’s just too much of a DPS loss taking the Druid spec for my tastes. Maybe if there was party wide offensive support it’d be worth it, but it’s not. I mean, I expected the Druid to be support, I just didn’t expect the utter lack of offensive support in the traitline.

Ehecatl.9172:

Tigaseye.2047:

Ehecatl.9172:

Core ranger is…..still functional without the druid trait line.

It’s not for a lot of people, though.

That’s the problem.

It’s unintuitive and kind of sketchily designed and has all sorts of existing issues that never seem to be tackled.

Ranger players are also treated really, really badly, by other players.

Basically, because they (apparently) think we are idiots for choosing/sticking to what they consider to be a bad class!

Kind of like being treated badly, on the road, because you supposedly chose the wrong brand of car, or something.

It’s not something most adults would do, but many of the players of games will do all sorts of things most adults wouldn’t do, unfortunately…

So, the class needs to be solid, even if some people can cope with its foibles, just to convince other players that we’re not idiots for choosing it (if you see what I mean?).

This used to be the case in WoW, as well, when Hunters were more like the Rangers in this game.

Then they made some changes and the only people still saying that stuff, there, are imports from other games (this one maybe?) and/or people who haven’t played WoW for years and are still stuck in the past.

This game needs to look to what they did there, with Hunter in MoP, because GW2 Ranger is far too much like the clunky, old school, WoW Hunter.

My point was that druid is an addition to ranger, not a core aspect of it that you absolutely need to take to play it.

Core ranger still has problems, certainly. But the elite spec wasn’t going to be a straight upgrade that fixed core ranger’s problems. In fact it shouldn’t be. Ranger needs to be improved. It needs it’s traits and utilities improved as well as some tweaks to certain under performing weapons. Adding an elite spec that fills the same role core ranger fills would only serve to make core ranger worse by comparison.

In an ideal world ranger and druid would be taken in the same group for providing different benefits. Ranger would provide good DPS while druid provides healing support. To use your WoW comparison, ranger is feral druid while druid is resto. Both are viable but fill different roles in a raid and/or pvp team.

But if the elite spec was just a straight upgrade to ranger DPS there’d be no point in anyone ever using ranger, and that would be sad.

I agree with you, in general, but basic Ranger is, clearly, not Feral Druid.

Ranger is, clearly, Hunter.

Anyone who plays/played WoW would tell you that.

Hunters coming from WoW will choose Ranger as an equivalent class, here – Druids won’t (or wouldn’t have, prior to this).

That is why a Druid healer spec seems such a weird choice.

I suppose what I was trying to say is that, as a developer, you shouldn’t even be asked to add fancy, “Elite” specs, when you haven’t even made sure your core classes function properly.

That “Elite” specs should be the icing, on an already pretty perfect cake.

Not as an attempt to cover-up and distract the eye from the hollow mess of a cake, underneath and not as a way to make one class you can’t, or don’t want to, deal with into another.

“Come, eat our lovely icing!!! Just ignore the cake – you were never here for the cake, right? Right…?”.

It’s a mistake, IMO.

Most people are (or were) here for the cake.

If they wanted Druids, they probably should have added a separate Druid class and if they wanted healing Rangers, they should have done something appropriate to the class (like healing bows, or something) and only after making sure core Ranger worked properly.

NutellaCrepe.6745:

… It’s not like I am forced to play my ranger as a druid, I’ll just play Pew Pew ranger, Spam MA HAMMER 4k aoe on my Rev, Dragon Hunter looks promising to my playstyle as well!
…

You’re not forced in the beta, but wait a week after release. Playing ranger without druid is like playing monk on smiting.

FatalQuin.3057:

illenos.5134:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

lxghostxl.5097:

…this game was built without a healer.

ftfy

And now it is being built with one.

And he’s awesome as healer. Pick another class if you dislike ranger/druid so much. There are 8 other classes with their own specialization. Problem solved.

You have a class that started for the past 3 years as a DPS, and for that matter one of two classes that time and time again the Meta has said NO to. Yes, if your friends let you roll with them as a DPS ranger letting you show off how good a ranger can be in the right hands that is great! You have no real reason to be here in the forums worrying about anything or defending anything…move on! But know this, your friend are not the “Meta”

A lot of specialisations are not like the base class and some are even worse in all aspects of the game. Druid will find his spot in GW2 or not like many other specialisations. It looks like raids are going to need “healers”. Druids are handy for setting up bombs and countering pressure in WvW due all those quick burst heals combined with a kitten load of ccs. Druids could shine in PvP within organised groups.

There are so many rangers out there and about 90% are not dps at all. Why? Because they suck with their longbow camping and this is the reason why ranger never made it into meta. If you dislike it, play another profession/specialisation. We’ve got plenty of it.

TheFantasticGman.9451:

I paid for the Druid just like I paid for every aspect of HoT. I want the elite spec to at least be useful to me in dungeons and fractals. I want to get my money’s worth out of the elite spec that I looked forward to the most… Sadly, there’s just too much of a DPS loss taking the Druid spec for my tastes. Maybe if there was party wide offensive support it’d be worth it, but it’s not. I mean, I expected the Druid to be support, I just didn’t expect the utter lack of offensive support in the traitline.

It doesn’t really matter what you paid for. I paid for it too. We all did. It is impossible for the elite spec to cater to what everyone wanted. And dungeons/fractals are so overwhelmingly exclusive in terms of what is viable for speed running that there was a very good chance any sort of boon support druid might have brought wouldn’t have been wanted. Especially offensive boon support seeing as I doubt anyone can compete with the Herald in that regard without being blatantly overpowered.

There are just so many other professions that produce boons in mass. Druid taking on a healing focused approach is likely the only way it could fit into a future raid meta without being in direct competition with almost every other profession.

If you really want the offensive support of ranger improved you should look into getting spirits buffed. That’s where the boon/offensive support of the profession comes from. Maybe if Nature Magic had a damage multiplier in it, I dunno.

I didn’t say anything about speed running… but ok. As it stands right now that much healing just isn’t needed. Maybe that’ll change, but then do we take a Druid or Tempest or Rev? of course, why would we take a person focused on healing if it wasn’t forced on us?

I really would like spirits to be like the wisps… That’d be nice. Like, you know, they couldn’t die.

Ehecatl.9172:

Elite specializations aren’t suppose to be an upgrade to the core, they are suppose to open up a new playstyle that wasn’t there before.

Them bias

Berzerker ? Totally not a condi based melee elite, no such thing as sword!

Reaper ? Totally not a power based melee elite, no such thing as dagger!

mah fanboyssss

Maikky.8526:

Them bias

Berzerker ? Totally not a condi based melee elite, no such thing as sword!

Reaper ? Totally not a power based melee elite, no such thing as dagger!

mah fanboyssss

I’ve not really paid much attention to what berzerker can do so I’ll skip that one.

But a necromancer’s dagger isn’t a cleaving weapon and it isn’t designed for high group sustain, and even with a dagger your shroud is still ranged. Reaper offers a fully melee playstyle for the necromancer they didn’t have before, as well as access to cleave damage and sustain that scales well in team fights.

Necromancers didn’t have a heavy melee team fighting specialist build. Now they do.

Maikky.8526

Them bias

Berzerker ? Totally not a condi based melee elite, no such thing as sword!

Warrior is one of the most solid classes out for this, yes.

Reaper ? Totally not a power based melee elite, no such thing as dagger!

Well, there is a dagger, but see above.

DH seems to be about bringing ranged dps with some backup.

Herald focuses on boons and offensive support (In fairness, given that Revenants’ Schtick is ‘discrete modes that you pick two of, this isn’t necessarily a huge change)

Daredevil almost definitely does not change the core role that much.

Scrapper definitely does change the core that much (I mean, seriously, it’s a full melee weapon).

Chronomancer seems to get much better buff access, but maybe I’m off entirely and underestimating Mesmer!

Elementalist is hard to place, because their schtick is ‘do everything perfectly’,

Did Ranger have to be like DH or Scrapper? No. Was there a cosmic law it couldn’t be? No. Rather than making me question druid, it makes me question Daredevil and Berserker in particular.

Ehecatl.9172:

Ranger didn’t need an elite spec to specialize in DPS since ranger already focuses on DPS.

Elite specializations aren’t suppose to be an upgrade to the core, they are suppose to open up a new playstyle that wasn’t there before.

It’s not a childish response to tell you to simply not play the druid. Druid is a completely optional addition to the profession. Core ranger is still there and still functional without the druid trait line.

“Elite specializations aren’t suppose to be an upgrade to the core” so your premise is that the rest of the other “Elite Specializations” don’t add to the core damage?

HahahahahHAhahahaahahHAHAhaahahahah.

Wrong.

atheria.2837:

“Elite specializations aren’t suppose to be an upgrade to the core” so your premise is that the rest of the other “Elite Specializations” don’t add to the core damage?

HahahahahHAhahahaahahHAHAhaahahahah.

Wrong.

Given how many classes hate their specialization, your misreading of Ehecatl’s point is surprisingly accurate

I dunno, I thought Rangers hated Druid, but looking at the Tempest and Berserker hate seemed to quickly cure that. I thought for sure Berserker would be tons of fun too, since it has a 10s Stun break, but then, I don’t actually PvP, much less on Warrior, so I defer to the experts.

It often feels like the Necro’s the only class genuinely happy with their spec (Granted, I’d be shocked if it didn’t increase their dps, since melee tends to have higher dps than ranged if it can live through it… but that also isn’t what folks tend to talk about w/ it.)

“It’s supposed to be an addition, it’s supposed to be an addition”.

Guardian: Dragonhunter
Revenant: Herald
Warrior: Berserker
Engineer: Scrapper
Ranger: Druid
Thief: Daredevil
Elementalist: Tempest
Mesmer: Chronomancer
Necromancer: Reaper

Which of these changes the ENTIRE ROLE of the core class? None except the Druid.

All of these are a TRUE addition to their role, either giving them a extra boost to their power or to their utility.

NONE of them change the entire role of the profession. You don’t see the Reaper changing the DPS Necromancer into a Tank. You don’t see the Dragonhunter changing the Tank Guardian into a Healer. Why does the Druid change the DPS Ranger into a Healer?

Ranger isn’t a pure DPS profession. It has support utilities and a support train line and traits that made another set of utilities provide support boons like regeneration and swiftness. In fact ranger is one of the best providers of regeneration in the game.

Just because you play Marksmanship/Skirmishing/Wilderness Survival exclusively doesn’t mean Nature Magic doesn’t exist. It doesn’t mean spirits don’t exist. And it doesn’t mean ranger should NEVER get an addition to more support options just because you’re scared of having more to offer a team than raw damage numbers.

Druid adds healing potential to the ranger’s kit to expand on our meager support options to make a more viable support role.

Maybe if people actually bothered to check out what the skills they don’t use did there’d be less confusion. As for now this will be my last response in this thread. It’s getting too populated with ignorance for my taste.

Ephemiel.5694:

“It’s supposed to be an addition, it’s supposed to be an addition”.

Guardian: Dragonhunter
Revenant: Herald
Warrior: Berserker
Engineer: Scrapper
Ranger: Druid
Thief: Daredevil
Elementalist: Tempest
Mesmer: Chronomancer
Necromancer: Reaper

Which of these changes the ENTIRE ROLE of the core class? None except the Druid.

All of these are a TRUE addition to their role, either giving them a extra boost to their power or to their utility.

NONE of them change the entire role of the profession. You don’t see the Reaper changing the DPS Necromancer into a Tank. You don’t see the Dragonhunter changing the Tank Guardian into a Healer. Why does the Druid change the DPS Ranger into a Healer?

Agreed.

it is supposed to be a sort of upgrade which most class has but this is to be expected because ANET hates the rangers and now they even decided to break the game mechanics of no healer required and dump it on their most hated class. there is no challenge in dungeon now because of this only heal class mechanics. No one can change this now and it is far too late to save. most of us who main Rangers already gave up on this class because we are sick and tired of being beaten to the ground and ignored like we don’t exist.

Ehecatl.9172:

Ranger isn’t a pure DPS profession. It has support utilities and a support train line and traits that made another set of utilities provide support boons like regeneration and swiftness. In fact ranger is one of the best providers of regeneration in the game.

Just because you play Marksmanship/Skirmishing/Wilderness Survival exclusively doesn’t mean Nature Magic doesn’t exist. It doesn’t mean spirits don’t exist. And it doesn’t mean ranger should NEVER get an addition to more support options just because you’re scared of having more to offer a team than raw damage numbers.

Druid adds healing potential to the ranger’s kit to expand on our meager support options to make a more viable support role.

Maybe if people actually bothered to check out what the skills they don’t use did there’d be less confusion. As for now this will be my last response in this thread. It’s getting too populated with ignorance for my taste.

We aren’t a full support. I wouldn’t have minded if they expanded on the SUPPORTING aspects of the Ranger, that would’ve been awesome honestly, but why the hell are they making us HEALERS?

Maybe if people actually bothered to understand this, we could try to move forward. Druid isn’t an addition, it’s a complete change to what the Ranger is and none of the specializations do this, NONE of them.

Forgot to mention that Druid also does absolutely nothing with the Ranger’s pet.

Ephemiel.5694:

Why does the Druid change the DPS Ranger into a Healer?

Then why does my power druid spend more time kicking kitten than healing people?

runeblade.7514:

Ephemiel.5694:

Why does the Druid change the DPS Ranger into a Healer?

Then why does my power druid spend more time kicking kitten than healing people?

Actually power druid is lame. The staff do the direct damage as the shortbow without the condi component.
Go with condi druid it will have more synergy. But you still have to use the staff that is a really weak weapon or you’ll waste most of the sustain and druid trait line.

I vote to make a minor to heal on hit with any weapon like the sigil of water.
Healing more in line of the Staff AA but trigger on hit.
That way 1/3 of the problems with the druid would be fixed for me. They can do with the staff whatever they want.

anduriell.6280:

runeblade.7514:

Ephemiel.5694:

Why does the Druid change the DPS Ranger into a Healer?

Then why does my power druid spend more time kicking kitten than healing people?

Actually power druid is lame. The staff do the direct damage as the shortbow without the condi component.

And shortbow lacks the insane wisp travel.

Because we already have enough support if people could open their eyes, we and the game were missing true healing capability.

Not only that, but they cannot even open their eyes wide enough to see all the other builds that Druid can run and be effective at. This is how you know they are utterly hopeless Rangers.

Get over it and play something else or stick with vanilla Ranger if you do not like it. It’s just one trait line.

anduriell.6280:

runeblade.7514:

Ephemiel.5694:

Why does the Druid change the DPS Ranger into a Healer?

Then why does my power druid spend more time kicking kitten than healing people?

Actually power druid is lame. The staff do the direct damage as the shortbow without the condi component.
Go with condi druid it will have more synergy. But you still have to use the staff that is a really weak weapon or you’ll waste most of the sustain and druid trait line.

I vote to make a minor to heal on hit with any weapon like the sigil of water.
Healing more in line of the Staff AA but trigger on hit.
That way 1/3 of the problems with the druid would be fixed for me. They can do with the staff whatever they want.

I have to disagree Power Druid is not good. Just don’t use the staff.

Healing on attack is not a bad idea though, I wouldn’t make it a trait though, why not make our glyph function like Signet of Malice while not in celestial form and then deal damage PBAoE on heal when we are, as well as a mild heal? That would solve a LOT of problems actually.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I have to disagree Power Druid is not good. Just don’t use the staff.

Healing on attack is not a bad idea though, I wouldn’t make it a trait though, why not make our glyph function like Signet of Malice while not in celestial form and then deal damage PBAoE on heal when we are, as well as a mild heal? That would solve a LOT of problems actually.

Anything could be good, I don’t like the shout-like mechanic of the glyphs anyway.
However that could make that glyph a nice thing. We already saw what happens when we get nice things.

the thing is if you don’t use the staff you miss the sustain the Druid can have. And most of the traits in the druid line are referring to healing.

Ephemiel.5694:

We aren’t a full support. I wouldn’t have minded if they expanded on the SUPPORTING aspects of the Ranger, that would’ve been awesome honestly, but why the hell are they making us HEALERS?

Healing, ultimately, is nothing more than a form of support (Which, indeed, is why many other games tend to just throw the healers in with the other supports in categorization). You are forsaking some damage dealing (either by potential or by action economy) to help the team win (and you aren’t doing it by eating hits, since it’s genuinely useful to distinguish tanks). Hearing this just reinforces that people are allergic to green numbers.

Forgot to mention that Druid also does absolutely nothing with the Ranger’s pet.

Yeah, that’s bloody weird, and a complaint I have with the traitline. I took the class for the explicit purpose of using the little guys (Or big ones, My ranger’s an asura so they’re basically all bigger than me). Like, I get ‘no minors affect it’, that’s not new, but ‘no traits at all’? No staff skills or majors? WTH?

they should also fix the signet. now it has 1sec cast time which is the most annoying thing and one of our main requirements to survive. other class with signet does not have that cast time because its supposed to be instant…… ANET always mess up Rangers and they will not stop showing how worthless we are.

nvm they already fixed the signet..