Guild Wars 2

Agree.

/15chars

If they do that then it should be a pretty big effect since our shortest signet is 30 seconds. and the next up is 60 seconds.

But, ya, this really needs to happen. It’s silly that it even exists. Maybe it’s an old relic from back when we gave 150% with our pet during some point in development? Who knows, but it needs to go and be replaced with a proper power build grandmaster trait.

I don’t really think we’ll get a condi cleanse or heal in replace of it, but I absolutely agree that they need to get rid of it. Nearly all of our utility skills need an excessive trait investment before they’re even worth a spot on our bar. There isn’t a single signet effect that I feel is so powerful it warrants a 30pt trait before it can affect the Ranger and not just the pet.

jcbroe.4329:

Agree.

/15chars

/signed

If you don’t like the trait don’t use it. I for one use it. we are not other classes trying to compare traits on a one for one bases doesn’t give a true picture.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

If you don’t like the trait don’t use it. I for one use it. we are not other classes trying to compare traits on a one for one bases doesn’t give a true picture.

What are you saying? This change would give our class a well needed buff and give us diversity. It would mean you’d have the same effect with 10 less points. And we should compare with other classes when compared to some we are underpowered and not wanted, us Rangers really have to show we’re good.

Signet of the Beastmaster used to be Adapt Major (10 points), but it was moved to Grandmaster Major (30 points) just before release.

I don’t recall with which trait it was switched.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

If you don’t like the trait don’t use it. I for one use it. we are not other classes trying to compare traits on a one for one bases doesn’t give a true picture.

True. Doesn’t change the fact that having to invest 30 points into a traitline to get the benefits of active effects of signets sucks.

OGDeadHead.8326:

Serraphin Storm.2369:

If you don’t like the trait don’t use it. I for one use it. we are not other classes trying to compare traits on a one for one bases doesn’t give a true picture.

True. Doesn’t change the fact that having to invest 30 points into a traitline to get the benefits of active effects of signets sucks.

Or the fact that we need 30 to make traps useful.
Or 30 to make spirits useful.
Or 30 to make guard useful.
Atleast survival skills don’t need to be traited.

I agree with the TC, we shouldn’t need the trait to use it on ourselves, no other class needs to trait for that. Give us the active effects normally, and change Signet of Renewel’s active effect to not give conditions to our pet from around us…but to wipe all conditions from us, our pet, and 4 allies around us. Would this be OP? Considering it’s our ONLY active condition cleanse other than our Healing Spring, I say no.

Signet of Renewal active is the most unreliable utility skill Rangers have. The traited version makes things even worse, because it could draw all conditions from allies around you to your ranger, rather than clearing the ranger’s conditions. So it would do the opposite of what you would want it to do.

It really needs to be redesigned. I have a feeling the leash range of pets was reduced in hope to save this utility skill, but it failed. The pet can still be out of range. The pet can also still be dead.

Signet actives should affect the Ranger by default.
Signet of the Beastmaster should be changed to:
Activating a signet revives your pet or heals it for 50% of its max health. Pet swap goes on a full cooldown.

Soilder.3607:

OGDeadHead.8326:

Serraphin Storm.2369:

If you don’t like the trait don’t use it. I for one use it. we are not other classes trying to compare traits on a one for one bases doesn’t give a true picture.

True. Doesn’t change the fact that having to invest 30 points into a traitline to get the benefits of active effects of signets sucks.

Or the fact that we need 30 to make traps useful.
Or 30 to make spirits useful.
Or 30 to make guard useful.
Atleast survival skills don’t need to be traited.

Or the fact that we are required to invest 30 on precision for the sake of being a better trapper. (Does trap need crits?)

Back to topic… Yeah! I agree. Signet of the beastmaster is pure BS. I’ve noticed that, out of all the utility a ranger has, signets is somehow the best choice in terms of flexibility. I wont say that the other utility skills that we have sucks but in end signets would still be our safest choice.

Honestly, im having a hard time letting of “signet of the hunt” and it’ll be more hard for me to let go of it once they nerf natural vigor

Yeah i have been thinking about the same thing.

If they compare our Adept Minor trait 50% endurance regen to
Engineers Master Major 50% endurance regen(its 50% right?) and decide to nerf our trait.

Why cant we then compare our Master Major trait Signet of the Beastmaster to every other class since they get the same effects for free.

Edit: Making that trait baseline would increase our build diversity quite a bit

It´s just weird

Signet of Stone effect would have to be adjusted then somehow. 6 seconds would be well…not bad to have, but I doubt.
If they plan to do anything like that, fix “Protect Me!” first. At least stability for both you an pet, maybe protection for one of you to lower amount of damage taken would make it a good alterative for SoS. Other way, be prepared than literally noone would take shout over signet. Especially when you can easily cut cd on SoS ti about 60 seconds with adept trait.

Rym.1469:

Signet of Stone effect would have to be adjusted then somehow. 6 seconds would be well…not bad to have, but I doubt.
If they plan to do anything like that, fix “Protect Me!” first. At least stability for both you an pet, maybe protection for one of you to lower amount of damage taken would make it a good alterative for SoS. Other way, be prepared than literally noone would take shout over signet. Especially when you can easily cut cd on SoS ti about 60 seconds with adept trait.

That’s probably going over board on it.

Signet of Stone will become the immunity signet for damage, and Protect Me can become something like “for x seconds, all incoming conditions are transferred directly to your pet.”

I mean, our utilities are basically all versions of all of the warrior utilities, so I see no reason not to give us rangers our own Berserker Stance option.

Signet of the beast doesn’t just affect signet of stone. So you cant compare it to the immunity skill. Ranger pets give rangers a lot of utility. As far as condition cleanse or healing if you use the right runes you already have access to cleanse on shout or heal on signet uses.

I’m a power ranger so putting 30 points in this line is a no brainer. While a lot of us love conditions running conditions can result in adding nothing to the group if another class specs into condition.

A lot of signets passives are better than the active not in this class in all classes.
a lot of the active ability that the other classes have we have access to with our pets. From condition cleanse to kd’s and chill.

We are not the best at anything we aren’t the worst either. It is our strength and our weakness. Those of us who can adapt can tap in to our strengths those that can not only find weakness and fault with the class.

Holland.9351:

Signet of Renewal active is the most unreliable utility skill Rangers have. The traited version makes things even worse, because it could draw all conditions from allies around you to your ranger, rather than clearing the ranger’s conditions. So it would do the opposite of what you would want it to do.

It really needs to be redesigned. I have a feeling the leash range of pets was reduced in hope to save this utility skill, but it failed. The pet can still be out of range. The pet can also still be dead.

Signet actives should affect the Ranger by default.
Signet of the Beastmaster should be changed to:
Activating a signet revives your pet or heals it for 50% of its max health. Pet swap goes on a full cooldown.

Incorrect. I used the Signet of Renewal while in a signet build, tons of people with conditions around me in WvW, and it cleansed all my conditions. I believe it still transfers them to the pet, but since there’s no pet buff/debuff bar near their HP (we need this ASAP, Anet), I can’t tell you for certain.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

Signet of the beast doesn’t just affect signet of stone. So you cant compare it to the immunity skill.

Correct, but Signet of Stone is probably the biggest factor when it comes to this trait. Early in the game (or maybe it was still the beta), there were Signet Rangers that used the Signet of Stone and a Signet cooldown-reducing trait in order to become almost perpetually invulnerable. There were amazing videos in circulation of Rangers outlasting Necros. To fix this, A-net bumped up the Signet of the Beastmaster trait and reduced the effect of the Signet cooldown trait. Signet of Stone would have to be addressed before they could bring the Signet of the Beastmaster trait down/give the effect without traiting. Or we’d possibly out-tank Guardians and Necros. Which I wouldn’t mind, but other people would. <<

They should just make it so with Signet of the Beastmaster passive effects of signets affect allies and active affect both pet and ranger by default.

Suddenly Ranger will be viable in groups and maybe even dungeons

ewhalen.8604:

Serraphin Storm.2369:

Signet of the beast doesn’t just affect signet of stone. So you cant compare it to the immunity skill.

Correct, but Signet of Stone is probably the biggest factor when it comes to this trait. Early in the game (or maybe it was still the beta), there were Signet Rangers that used the Signet of Stone and a Signet cooldown-reducing trait in order to become almost perpetually invulnerable. There were amazing videos in circulation of Rangers outlasting Necros. To fix this, A-net bumped up the Signet of the Beastmaster trait and reduced the effect of the Signet cooldown trait. Signet of Stone would have to be addressed before they could bring the Signet of the Beastmaster trait down/give the effect without traiting. Or we’d possibly out-tank Guardians and Necros. Which I wouldn’t mind, but other people would. <<

The thing is, many other classes have comparable immune to damage skills that don’t break the game. Many of said skills are also true invulnerability and not just 0 damage for X seconds. Even with the trait, it’s still a 64 second cooldown for a skill that doesn’t keep you from getting stunlocked or hit with several second immobilize.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

Signet of the beast doesn’t just affect signet of stone. So you cant compare it to the immunity skill. Ranger pets give rangers a lot of utility. As far as condition cleanse or healing if you use the right runes you already have access to cleanse on shout or heal on signet uses.

I’m a power ranger so putting 30 points in this line is a no brainer. While a lot of us love conditions running conditions can result in adding nothing to the group if another class specs into condition.

A lot of signets passives are better than the active not in this class in all classes.
a lot of the active ability that the other classes have we have access to with our pets. From condition cleanse to kd’s and chill.

We are not the best at anything we aren’t the worst either. It is our strength and our weakness. Those of us who can adapt can tap in to our strengths those that can not only find weakness and fault with the class.

There is no strength in having to waste a Grandmaster trait to get something that absolutely every other class that has signets get’s by default.

Why would SoS need to be addressed ? It gives 6 seconds immunity to physical attacks , but it offers no stun break or stability . It is on an 80 second cooldown . Warrior endure pain is on a 60 second cooldown and offers a stun break and it can be traited to last 5 seconds and/or offer vigor when activated .

Also , ranger signet trait offers nothing else other then CD reduction , you need 2 traits to get CD and 3 might on activation . The fact that it affects the pet is irrelevant because pet should be invulnerable to begin with , considering its such a huge part of the ranger as all other class mechanics are reliable

This is somehing that has to be done as long with other kitten traits that offer nothing but a working utility…

Rangers have an immunity skill its protect me. Signet of stone is a second immunity skill if traited. Signet of stone is the go to option as it also provided extra toughness when its inactive.

You may have discounted protect me because your pet may die. Picking a more robust pet should be considered. Those of you who discount a certain weapon or skill or pet limit yourself.

As Rangers our class mechanism gives us so many option that other classes don’t have.
Those of you who see our pets as a weakness will always have a problem with this class.

Protect me is only useful in a 1v1 encounter and comes at a great cost : your pet is not applying pressure and it may die .
As far as signets go , its a problem because every other class can use them without traits then traits add something extra . With ranger, we need a GM trait just to use them . Silly

Serraphin Storm.2369:

Rangers have an immunity skill its protect me. Signet of stone is a second immunity skill if traited. Signet of stone is the go to option as it also provided extra toughness when its inactive.

You may have discounted protect me because your pet may die. Picking a more robust pet should be considered. Those of you who discount a certain weapon or skill or pet limit yourself.

As Rangers our class mechanism gives us so many option that other classes don’t have.
Those of you who see our pets as a weakness will always have a problem with this class.

Because the pet is the weakness and we really can’t do anything (aside from res ourselves from downed quickly) that any other class can’t do better. Why should I have to lower dps by bringing a bear to make my invuln skill work when other classes don’t? why should I have to risk killing my class mechanic at all to make it work? That’s the opposite of balance and doesn’t belong in a proper game.

Just about everthing other classes get through activating their signet we get in our pets. That is why our signets effect our pet. That seem balanced to me. We could be like engineers and get no signets.

No other class has invulnerability on a signet. Other classes get 1-5 seconds of invulnerability.

Fine you want to be like other classes take out signet of beast mastery make protect me a regular immunity and reduce it to 3 seconds. Now we are like everyone else.

Seems like a nerf to me. But that what everyone else has.

As far as traits that affect signet with the exception of The Ele written in stone there isn’t anything I like. Look for yourself. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet

Agreed, I used to run sig of beast with 3 sigs. It’s just not worth it when compared to picking up spotter, eagle eye, and another trait of your choice.

If anything, merge signet of the beastmaster with the signet reduced cool down minor trait.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

Just about everthing other classes get through activating their signet we get in our pets. That is why our signets effect our pet. That seem balanced to me. We could be like engineers and get no signets.

No other class has invulnerability on a signet. Other classes get 1-5 seconds of invulnerability.

Fine you want to be like other classes take out signet of beast mastery make protect me a regular immunity and reduce it to 3 seconds. Now we are like everyone else.

Seems like a nerf to me. But that what everyone else has.

As far as traits that affect signet with the exception of The Ele written in stone there isn’t anything I like. Look for yourself. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet

Signet of Mercy
Signet of Resolve
Dolyak Signet
Healing Signet
Signet of Stamina
Signet of Rage
Assassin’s Signet
Infiltrator’s Signet
Signet of Precision
Signet of Air
Signet of Restoration
Signet of Domination
Signet of Illusions
Signet of Spite
Signet of Undeath

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives (Signet of Air is a stunbreaker, something that our Signet of the Hunt isn’t).

The only ranger signets that even compete with the usefulness of any of the traits I listed are Signet of the Wild and Signet of Stone, and they require 30 points to be as useful as other classes untraited signets do.

The pets in no way make up for the functionality of any of the ones I listed, especially without Signet of the Beastmaster.

If Signet of Renewal had it’s range requirement removed (aka as long as the pet is alive it works) then it would be our best signet and on the list. But right now their are times when you need the condi removal on the spot and it just fails because the pet is too far away, which is just silly.

So yeah. The only thing I can add I guess is that this is just my opinion on it though, and not fact. But all of the listed signets are much more amazing than what rangers have access to, that aren’t made up for just by having a pet.

RyuDragnier.9476:

I agree with the TC, we shouldn’t need the trait to use it on ourselves, no other class needs to trait for that. Give us the active effects normally, and change Signet of Renewel’s active effect to not give conditions to our pet from around us…but to wipe all conditions from us, our pet, and 4 allies around us. Would this be OP? Considering it’s our ONLY active condition cleanse other than our Healing Spring, I say no.

Now hold on there just a second.

The only other classes that even have pets of any sort that can be traited into are Mesmer, Necromancer, and Guardian. Of the four pet capable classes the only ones whose pet’s are actually intrinsic part’s of their game mechanics (meaning things that can’t really be ignored completely) are the Mesmer, and the Ranger. In the case of the Mesmer this is because Illusions are summoned on 2 out of the 5 weapon skills, and many of the Utility Skills also summon illusions. In the case of the Ranger this is because people still haven’t figured out how to do reliable DPS without their pet for some reason.

That said, in the case of the Necromancer, to truly optimize Minions, you have to put at least 20 points into Death Magic, 20 points into Blood Magic (though 30 is preferred), and 20 points into spite. That first 20/20/20 split is really not optional in order to run a Minion Master successfully.

Mesmer’s aren’t as limited as Necromancer’s and Ranger’s. However to make Spirit Weapons viable for the Guardian, you kind of need 30 points in Zeal, and 20 points in Radiance.

The difference between those classes and the Ranger, is that they are paying to make their pet’s viable…. Ranger’s are paying to equalize themselves with their pet’s. While some people may argue that their Ranger’s pet is not very viable, what they are missing is that the Ranger’s Pet is already stronger in a 1 on 1 fight than all the other pet’s of all the other classes, with the possible exception of Flesh Golem (but that is an Elite Skill). In fact, in its own way the Ranger’s Pet could possibly be classified as an Elite Skill that the Ranger get’s at level 1, instead of a class mechanic.

What you fail to realize , that even though Necros and guards invest to make a pet build , even with it they themselves do proper damage . The ranger is penalized at the start by lower damage and utility simply because he has a pet . And this is the core of the issue .
The you have a pet is justification for : very poor power scaling and damage skills , lower utility from utilities , weaker traits . Not to mention there is always a very big risk of losing the pet itself .
The ranger himself should be an entity that is balanced for himself and the pet should be something extra , optional or not . Hell , the pet could even be completely invulnerable but take no agro . Oh , and give us full control over it .

It is a vicious circle : they wont give us full control over pets because it is too complicated to play so we are stuck with a half working AI companion , but then they wont make the pet strong and reliable through numbers because its an AI crutch and the play is too passive , and when we ask for more active play they just repeat that it will not happen because it would be to hard to play …..

So we are stuck with a badly performing unreliable AI that we cannot control . Winner design here

Chokolata, you are talking to somebody whose favorite class in the Final Fantasy Franchise is the Summoner. I like Ranger because it is the closest thing this game has to Final Fantasy XI’s Beastmaster, Summoner, and Puppetmaster classes.

Now what you may or may not know about Final Fantasy XI, is that the Beastmaster, Puppetmaster, and Summoner are among the only classes in that game that are perfectly capable of soloing practically everything in that game except the Mega-Bosses.

Now I need to quantify this a little. A Megaboss in Final Fantasy XI, is different from a Champion at the end of a dungeon in Guild Wars 2. For one thing even the strongest Bosses in Guild Wars 2 can generally be completed by a balanced group in at most a half-hour if I am understanding the game correctly. Final Fantasy XI as of the last I heard however, holds the World Record for single longest Boss Fight in a video game. When the record was set, a Linkshell had fought the MegaBoss Pandemonium Warden to a stalemate in a period of time that lasted OVER 18 hours for just that one fight. That is not counting time spent getting to said boss which probably tacked on another good 4 or 5 hours of game time on top of that. These people were falling victim to exhaustion sickness and vomiting as a result of this fight and they still hadn’t beaten the boss by the time they called it quits.

This all from a game where the majority of the game’s content can be soloed by 3 different Pet Classes. Each of which does not give you full control over the Pet’s A.I. and where the owner of the Pet was significantly weaker in a physical fight than the non-pet classes without it’s pet.

That said, the Pet classes were always welcome in groups, in fact for some content they were absolutely essential (certain BCNM’s and the Mega Crystals spring to mind). So really, complaining that you are somehow deficient because you are physically weaker than other classes because you have a pet will not fly with me, because I know exactly where the origin of the Pet Classes came from, it all started with Final Fantasies Summoner Class. And as any fan of Final Fantasy will tell you, although the Summoner can generally 1.H.K.O. amost anything at end-game, they are also the squishiest of all the classes in the series.

The problem with the pets is this:

1) They are dead 90% of the time even if you fully trait into BM. If they aren’t dead, then they aren’t pulling their weight in dps, because they are attached at your hip, or being pulled in and out of combat.

2) If your running BM in WvW, you are completely handicapping yourself from being effective. Sure it works for solo roaming (if that’s your goal), but you will inevitably get run over by the bigger group, all the time. Try using a BM build vs any other build in small group or zerg play and see just how inferior it is.

3) Nobody lands 100% of their hits; but the ranger suffers from this 2 fold. It’s not just them missing some attacks, now their pet is also subjected to the same behavior. Even if the ranger was given perfect hit accuracy (tracking arrows), they’d still be behind the ball because the pet will always miss a % of their attacks. For most people, it seems the pet misses most of their attacks already. If the damage is to be equalized out across all classes over a period of time, the pet has to have a 100% hit rate.

4) If you trait to keep your pet alive and do more damage, you are drastically taking potential damage away from yourself

I’ve tested builds every which way, I find the build that supplies the most dps over a period of time, is one where the pet is stays on passive, while you benefit from the +5% damage given for whatever those runes are that gives that bonus. Sad but true.

I don’t have a problem playing the ranger. I play them very effectively in WvW while dishing out a ton of damage. I learned long ago, the best solution is to just stick the pet on passive unless you end up in a 1v1.

I’m not going to put words in Anet’s mouth, but I highly doubt that was their intention with pets.

I have no problems with pet classes per se , but i have a problem with the ranger pets not working properly . The AI bad and our control over them is lacking in so many ways . To top it off the traits and the utilities seem as if they were not designed for this class as well . The only real pet interface utilities we have are shouts which are either useless , or badly designed .
The only shouts used are :
-guard , which is used to proc a GM trait , which is total design fail
-sick em , which is barely used and is rather meh because pets attack pattern is such that they rarely hit anything moving
Guard and SnR are useless because one kills your pet and the other cannot res dead allies . Having a small window of resing a downed player with the stupid AI pathing is night impossible . And why would anyone take it ? We have Spirit Elite which is strong and reliable , and can up 3 people at once as well as clear conditions and heal .

So , to sum it up : Insultingly bad AI and lack of ability control over pets , poor traits , poor utilities .

not gonna happend mate…that would make ranger actually OP…yes i said it,and its kinda true

An Siorai Tharian.4516:

RyuDragnier.9476:

I agree with the TC, we shouldn’t need the trait to use it on ourselves, no other class needs to trait for that. Give us the active effects normally, and change Signet of Renewel’s active effect to not give conditions to our pet from around us…but to wipe all conditions from us, our pet, and 4 allies around us. Would this be OP? Considering it’s our ONLY active condition cleanse other than our Healing Spring, I say no.

Now hold on there just a second.

The only other classes that even have pets of any sort that can be traited into are Mesmer, Necromancer, and Guardian. Of the four pet capable classes the only ones whose pet’s are actually intrinsic part’s of their game mechanics (meaning things that can’t really be ignored completely) are the Mesmer, and the Ranger. In the case of the Mesmer this is because Illusions are summoned on 2 out of the 5 weapon skills, and many of the Utility Skills also summon illusions. In the case of the Ranger this is because people still haven’t figured out how to do reliable DPS without their pet for some reason.

That said, in the case of the Necromancer, to truly optimize Minions, you have to put at least 20 points into Death Magic, 20 points into Blood Magic (though 30 is preferred), and 20 points into spite. That first 20/20/20 split is really not optional in order to run a Minion Master successfully.

Mesmer’s aren’t as limited as Necromancer’s and Ranger’s. However to make Spirit Weapons viable for the Guardian, you kind of need 30 points in Zeal, and 20 points in Radiance.

The difference between those classes and the Ranger, is that they are paying to make their pet’s viable…. Ranger’s are paying to equalize themselves with their pet’s. While some people may argue that their Ranger’s pet is not very viable, what they are missing is that the Ranger’s Pet is already stronger in a 1 on 1 fight than all the other pet’s of all the other classes, with the possible exception of Flesh Golem (but that is an Elite Skill). In fact, in its own way the Ranger’s Pet could possibly be classified as an Elite Skill that the Ranger get’s at level 1, instead of a class mechanic.

It’s not possible for the Ranger to do good DPS without the pet.

And what you fail to realize is, that while the pet is stronger than the minions of other classes, the Ranger is weaker than the other classes as well. Assuming the pet has 100% uptime and is dealing damage the whole fight, only then is the Ranger+Pet equal to other classes.

saalle.4623:

not gonna happend mate…that would make ranger actually OP…yes i said it,and its kinda true

You’ll have to give more information… WHAT exactly would be overpowered with signets if they affected the Ranger and the pet without requiring a 30pt trait? What signet’s active effect do you feel is so powerful to warrant a 30pt investment to use?

I personally don’t think that the AI is that bad. I mained an Enchanter in DAoC and a Loremaster in LotRO. I am used to the pathing stuff etc. What really puts me off on the Ranger is the pet interface. There is no point of streamlining the user interface and minimizing micro management if it makes a part of a class undesirable. No boon/condition bar. No real options for pet behaviour. Lack of control over pet skills. It’s annoying.

There will always be at least a small delay when ordering pets to perform an attack. Pet classes will always suffer in the damage department because at least some part of their damage is supposed to come from their pet. The pet will die a lot in certain game contents (dungeons, big bosses, zergs). And AIs will never be perfect. This won’t change. Don’t play a pet class if it annoys you. But ANet could improve the interface and make pets (all classes) less vulnerable against area effects (e.g. only receive a maxiumum of x% of their health as damage per hit from area effects). Make the pet (Ranger only) dodge when the player does (or grant it an evasion buff if it can’t dodge due to programming issues). This alone would help a lot.

Signets on Rangers actually have pretty nice passive effects and they affect both, the Ranger and the pet. Most actives are just fine without Signet of the Beastmaster. And it still is a great trait. If you’re honest, the real issue are neither the signets nor the trait. It is about people not being willing to give up a bow related trait for the utility provided by Signet of the Beastmaster although the invulnerability and stability would be worth it. If there was a change to signets on the Ranger they should look at the cooldowns and add a better trait to the Master tier in Marksmanship.

The shouts on the other hand… got to agree. They are pretty weird and too reliant on the pet. Stuff like “Guard” (without stealth) should be a basic pet command and not incorporated into utility skills. If there is no total rework, I can see shouts additionally granting buffs to the Ranger or even the Party (e.g. Fury on Sick’Em) which would be more in line with the other shouts in the game. Or they could add a (weaker) secondary effect which will apply if the pet is dead (e.g. revive or speed up the resurrection of the pet when using Search and Rescue).

Xaylin.1860:

It is about people not being willing to give up a bow related trait for the utility provided by Signet of the Beastmaster although the invulnerability and stability would be worth it.

I don’t think Signet of the Beastmaster is worth giving up Eagle Eye or Piercing Arrows for. I really want to use Signet of the Beastmaster, but just not at that cost. In PvE I do switch however.

In WvW I’m doing the following as a work-around:
1) Activate Protect Me and Signet of Stone at the same time. That’s 6 seconds of invulnerability to both you and your pet without using Signet of the Beastmaster.
2) I use Rampage as One for Stability.

jcbroe.4329:

Healing Signet

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives.

This is wrong.

Healing signet heals for 3k on active.

In 20 seconds, healing signet could regen for 7k.

runeblade.7514:

jcbroe.4329:

Healing Signet

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives.

This is wrong.

Healing signet heals for 3k on active.

In 20 seconds, healing signet could regen for 7k.

You won’t regen anything if you’re dead.

Wow, are you guys trolling rangers are something? Remove signet of the beastmaster? No thank you.

HSig is activated before death for that last bit of time to use yer imba mobility and escape mechanisms . Tis true

Thinking more on this last night, a good question popped into my head…if the pets are part of our class, then why hasn’t the Ranger automatically been given a “synergy” with the pet for boons? If the pet gets might, the Ranger gets might. If the Ranger gets Regen, the pets gets Regen. If the Ranger gets Aegis, the pet gets Aegis, etc.

RyuDragnier.9476:

Thinking more on this last night, a good question popped into my head…if the pets are part of our class, then why hasn’t the Ranger automatically been given a “synergy” with the pet for boons? If the pet gets might, the Ranger gets might. If the Ranger gets Regen, the pets gets Regen. If the Ranger gets Aegis, the pet gets Aegis, etc.

We have traits that do half of that. It should really go the other way though… boons our pet gets, we get.

Atherakhia.4086:

runeblade.7514:

jcbroe.4329:

Healing Signet

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives.

This is wrong.

Healing signet heals for 3k on active.

In 20 seconds, healing signet could regen for 7k.

You won’t regen anything if you’re dead.

I agree, but your point doesn’t back up any arguments.

runeblade.7514:

Atherakhia.4086:

runeblade.7514:

jcbroe.4329:

Healing Signet

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives.

This is wrong.

Healing signet heals for 3k on active.

In 20 seconds, healing signet could regen for 7k.

You won’t regen anything if you’re dead.

I agree, but your point doesn’t back up any arguments.

runeblade.7514:

jcbroe.4329:

Healing Signet

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives.

This is wrong.

Healing signet heals for 3k on active.

In 20 seconds, healing signet could regen for 7k.

Atherakhia.4086:

runeblade.7514:

Atherakhia.4086:

runeblade.7514:

jcbroe.4329:

Healing Signet

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives.

This is wrong.

Healing signet heals for 3k on active.

In 20 seconds, healing signet could regen for 7k.

You won’t regen anything if you’re dead.

I agree, but your point doesn’t back up any arguments.

runeblade.7514:

jcbroe.4329:

Healing Signet

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives.

This is wrong.

Healing signet heals for 3k on active.

In 20 seconds, healing signet could regen for 7k.

Your assumption =/= my assumption.

So you better explain clearly.

runeblade.7514:

Atherakhia.4086:

runeblade.7514:

Atherakhia.4086:

runeblade.7514:

jcbroe.4329:

Healing Signet

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives.

This is wrong.

Healing signet heals for 3k on active.

In 20 seconds, healing signet could regen for 7k.

You won’t regen anything if you’re dead.

I agree, but your point doesn’t back up any arguments.

runeblade.7514:

jcbroe.4329:

Healing Signet

Every single one of these is useful for both their passives and their actives.

This is wrong.

Healing signet heals for 3k on active.

In 20 seconds, healing signet could regen for 7k.

Your assumption =/= my assumption.

So you better explain clearly.

It’s a different type of healing. Yes, the passive heal is more potent over time than the active, but if you need to “burst” heal instead of regen heal, you activate the signet. So, if you’re at low health, you might not have time to wait 20 seconds for your health to come back, so you activate the signet to heal.

Regardless, just because the passive effect is more potent, it doesn’t make the active of healing signet useless. For a warrior, it’s skill bar compression. Rangers have to slot a heal and a signet to get passive and active healing, where in the same scenario warriors only have to slot their healing signet, which allows them to have their utility slot for something else.

Not to mention how healing scales with both classes heals, and the base amount that the warriors regen heals for, requiring basically no healing power investment to be a super useful and effective slot option.

Holland.9351:

Xaylin.1860:

It is about people not being willing to give up a bow related trait for the utility provided by Signet of the Beastmaster although the invulnerability and stability would be worth it.

I don’t think Signet of the Beastmaster is worth giving up Eagle Eye or Piercing Arrows for. I really want to use Signet of the Beastmaster, but just not at that cost. In PvE I do switch however.

That is exactly what I meant. People just prefer damage related traits. Which is okay. But it doesn’t mean that Signet of the Beastmaster is bad or should be granted to every Ranger like it was claimed above. It is a trade-off between offense and defense which I personally think is worthit.

I agree with you when it comes to zerging. For roaming Piercing Arrows is less important in many situations though. In PvP you could easily spare Eagle Eye since you won’t use max range most of the time anyway. Piercing Arrow also only makes sense in 8vs8 or against pet classes.

Holland.9351:

In WvW I’m doing the following as a work-around:
1) Activate Protect Me and Signet of Stone at the same time. That’s 6 seconds of invulnerability to both you and your pet without using Signet of the Beastmaster.
2) I use Rampage as One for Stability.

And with Signet of the Beastmaster you would be able to get the same without Protect Me (e.g. one more open utility slot) or just chain Protect Me and Signet of Stone for even more invulnerability. Or you could get even more Stability.

It is good that there is a work around or an alternative. But it still doesn’t make Signet of the Beastmaster useless.