Guild Wars 2

Reisinger.4203:

Yeah after the SB range nerf nobody is forcing us to play longbow…

Apart from that though, I dislike having to build up a vuln stack on my target and stealth is cheesy (I read this somewhere in another thread) but it’s not like this patch was the end of the profession…

Not yet at least.

exactly, lol. Saying we are not forced to play longbow is just stupid.

rchu.8945:

Reisinger.4203:

Yeah after the SB range nerf nobody is forcing us to play longbow…

Apart from that though, I dislike having to build up a vuln stack on my target and stealth is cheesy (I read this somewhere in another thread) but it’s not like this patch was the end of the profession…

Not yet at least.

exactly, lol. Saying we are not forced to play longbow is just stupid.

we aren’t that’s like saying necros are forced to use staff cause it is the only 1,200 range weapon they have. you just need to play differently and set up differently for being closer.

Criminal.5627:

WatchTheShow.7203:

FranBunnyFFXII.3508:

darkace.8925:

jonnjo.2594:

I am in complete agreement with OP. I found the new mechanic refreshing. I also love stacking vulnerability. Oh and thinks for the raven tip. Never occurred to me.

If you love stacking vulnerability with a longbow, then why don’t you deplore the change? The new version of Hunter’s Shot requires twice the work and one subpar trait to get the same effect the old Hunter’s Shot got with one push of the button.

^This.

This x1,000

In WvW especially. Try rapid fire on any enemy player and you will get “obstructed”, “miss” “miss” “miss” 1,356 “miss” “miss”. It’s called dodge rolling twice. Anyone can dodge roll twice through rapid fire and now your precious vulnerability has only stacked 4 times instead of our old guaranteed 10.

this argument can also be applied if someone dodged the old hunters shot only then you would get 0 stacks of vuln which most people usually dodge the first shot you fired at them anyways since it is telegraphed much more and a lot of people admitted to opening with hunters shot previously for their rotation

You’re right, they could dodge hunter’s shot and end up with 0 vulnerability, but there were 2 things that helped us avoid that:

1. Don’t start with Hunter’s Shot. Since the enemy player is used to seeing rangers start with #3, they’ve trained themselves to dodge roll when they see an arrow incoming. To avoid your shot missing, start with an auto-attack first, then use Hunter’s Shot. Works 99% of the time.

2. Hunter’s Shot is an instant cast skill. Meaning, there is no charge up to shoot it (compared to other skills like barrage for example). This makes it harder to dodge because the arrow is not telegraphed.

Miflett.3472:

Criminal.5627:

WatchTheShow.7203:

FranBunnyFFXII.3508:

darkace.8925:

jonnjo.2594:

I am in complete agreement with OP. I found the new mechanic refreshing. I also love stacking vulnerability. Oh and thinks for the raven tip. Never occurred to me.

If you love stacking vulnerability with a longbow, then why don’t you deplore the change? The new version of Hunter’s Shot requires twice the work and one subpar trait to get the same effect the old Hunter’s Shot got with one push of the button.

^This.

This x1,000

In WvW especially. Try rapid fire on any enemy player and you will get “obstructed”, “miss” “miss” “miss” 1,356 “miss” “miss”. It’s called dodge rolling twice. Anyone can dodge roll twice through rapid fire and now your precious vulnerability has only stacked 4 times instead of our old guaranteed 10.

this argument can also be applied if someone dodged the old hunters shot only then you would get 0 stacks of vuln which most people usually dodge the first shot you fired at them anyways since it is telegraphed much more

And then that’s the problem they should have fixed, instead of adding something else which compromised a playstyle.

then couldn’t you say the change they did was the fix after all they cant avoid every single shot from rappid fire so they still get some stacks of vuln out of it. the play style hasn’t change drasticly it has just been delayed, you still can get what you had before even beyond if you are willing to give it a try, only thing is different is if you are relying on burst from rappid fire previously you have to wait until it finishes it’s CD before you can get the full benefit of the burst. but you should pay attention more to how much your auto attack is doing as well as barrage and hell even point blank shot, idk if you guys haven’t noticed but point blank does some decent dmg and now that it’s ranged has been increased it is much nicer for combat. I’m just tired of people being stuck on one thing from changes without looking at the bigger picture, acting like it is the end of the world cause 1 button cant grant something instantly…
I’m not aiming this at you Miflett, this is a constant thing on our ranger forums. so few people look at the whole before they jump on the forums. they are soo tunnel minded they see one skill changed they jump on forums and say their build is broke they cant play anymore, don’t take into account all of the other things, there would need to be a whole lot more done to longbow to ruin builds then what has that people are saying their whole build is trash now. like if LB had its dmg reduced and was given conditions to its attacks that would kill the longbow power builds.
I play wvw, pve, spvp, and tpvp and the longbow changers I really like in fact for the first time I am able to have pretty much one build that is viable in everything with only a few traits needing to be changed in the lines and utilities swapped.

also has anyone taken into account rapid fire has a shorter CD then hunters shot?

WatchTheShow.7203

2. Hunter’s Shot is an instant cast skill. Meaning, there is no charge up to shoot it (compared to other skills like barrage for example). This makes it harder to dodge because the arrow is not telegraphed.

it still has flight time and that at max range is enough to give someone time to dodge it, rappid fire also has no charge up time it just has the channel time. so even if the first one is fired and dodged you still have all of the other ones that can connect and apply vulnerability. lol we can keep this going but the point is the argument is not valid since it could happen with the old hunters shot and rappid fire is not a step down for vuln application like people are implying it is, it is just different that is all. slightly better in my opinion since it would take 3 dodges to avoid every single application of vuln from it

I guess what I will say is that if this new 3 is here to stay in its current form, I will expect them to clean up the MM trait line and not make picking the LB entirely dependent on 30 into MM.

Hopefully, once again if this is here to stay, the other longbow skills will be open to improvements such as AA minimum range decrease for damage, a slight AA damage buff to make it a more clear power choice over SB, and a slight precast time shave from barrage.

Criminal.5627:

WatchTheShow.7203

2. Hunter’s Shot is an instant cast skill. Meaning, there is no charge up to shoot it (compared to other skills like barrage for example). This makes it harder to dodge because the arrow is not telegraphed.

it still has flight time and that at max range is enough to give someone time to dodge it, rappid fire also has no charge up time it just has the channel time. so even if the first one is fired and dodged you still have all of the other ones that can connect and apply vulnerability. lol we can keep this going but the point is the argument is not valid since it could happen with the old hunters shot and rappid fire is not a step down for vuln application like people are implying it is, it is just different that is all. slightly better in my opinion since it would take 3 dodges to avoid every single application of vuln from it

Yeah. I was just really good at smacking them with #3 when they were least expecting it though. Was never a real issue for me from people dodging out of it. My issue has always been that terrible “oh there’s a blade of grass so your rapid fire is obstructed”. Even someone rocking back and forth with A and D can trololol out of your rapid fire fairly easily.

Just kind of bummed they took out something I was good at. Critical timing and situational awareness. Not that the new way is “impossible” for me to pick up, it’s just so much easier for enemies to avoid rapid fire since it lasts for so long. Just like how nobody will stand inside a barrage AoE. They’ll be dodge rolling/teleporting/shield #5/perma stealthing through it all day long.

Miflett.3472:

I guess what I will say is that if this new 3 is here to stay in its current form, I will expect them to clean up the MM trait line and not make picking the LB entirely dependent on 30 into MM.

Hopefully, once again if this is here to stay, the other longbow skills will be open to improvements such as AA minimum range decrease for damage, a slight AA damage buff to make it a more clear power choice over SB, and a slight precast time shave from barrage.

yeas I am with you on that, I’m hoping that the new traits and utilities that are coming as well as future balances will improve the Longbow power builds even more. we can only hope right?

this argument can also be applied if someone dodged the old hunters shot only then you would get 0 stacks of vuln which most people usually dodge the first shot you fired at them anyways since it is telegraphed much more and a lot of people admitted to opening with hunters shot previously for their rotation

Its better they dodge the hunters shot before. Then they eat at least part of the rapid fire, a fairly low 3k rapid fire is the same as the difference vulnerability would make at 10% if you took 30,000 damage. Now all eggs are in one basket and you can avoid the lot.

Criminal.5627:

ok I just wanted to come in here and say a few things

1. if you are using signet of the beastmaster trait you should not be using long bow as your weapon to use when under the effects of signet of the wild, you should be using a weapon that can grant more hits and more reliably hit in the 8 seconds that the signet is active.
2. Remorseless actually grants more dmg to a longbow user than signet of the beast master cause it is a consistent way to stack vulnerability that increases your dmg on your target over a much longer time than the 8 seconds from the active signet and also guaranties that your first attack out of stealth is a critical hit (do not forget the minor that grats opening strikes 100% critical hit)
3. axe is actually a very good fire and forget weapon, it bounces you don’t even need to worry about aoe just sit there chucking axes if they get to close to you hit 5 and kitten em in whirling defense if you like the fire and forget playstyle.
4. rappid fire does not require every hit to get the 10 stacks of vuln (I didn’t actually keep trake it is something like 2 stacks every hit?) also the vuln from rappid fire lasts 13 sec not 10 sec

1: I disagree, weapon choice is up to the player and if you can make a killing blow with the Longbow due to the range while other weapons would put you in the fray, there is no reason not to use it.
2: The 100% crit trait is bugged (and confirmed.) It also only grants more damage if the target is not already maxed out on vunerability stacks. That’s consistent damage and not burst damage; most encounters will be over before Remorseless takes the lead. (Mind you, that is comparing personal DPS and not how much your team benefits from the vunerability stacks. Again; if it was not already stacked to 25 before using it.)
3: It is indeed a fire and forget weapon… but it has a major downside; you can draw aggro from more mobs than intended (same argument as pet AI drawing aggro before the patch that fixed it…)
4: The 13 seconds vunerability is probably because you have 30% condition duration from 30 points in Marksmanship.

JorneMormel.9850:

ItIsFinished.9462:

Let me fix this for you, bud.

• Cripple for 2 seconds and 3 stacks of bleed – 20 second cooldown.

• Chill for 1 second – 5 second duration for a potential 5 second Chill – 24 second cooldown.
  Reduces movement speed by -66% and skill recharge rate by -66%
  Grants a combo: Ice Field
  – Frost Aura reduces 10% damage for 4 seconds and inflicts a 1 second Chill when attacked.

Frost trap looks a lot better to me for a non traited Trap build.

But if traited: (Direct quote from the wiki. inb4 wiki lol. The information is correct though.)

Spike Trap has a hidden effect in which it immobilizes foes hit by the initial trigger for 1 second without any condition duration modifiers. This only occurs if the Trapper’s Expertise trait is active.

Spike trap’s problem is that the effects are all front-loaded. That means it’s not a trap, it’s a targeted instant AOE. The only way to make it hit multiple targets is if you toss it directly onto those targets.

If you try to use it like a trap by setting it down and waiting for targets to run across it, only the first mob/player to run into it gets the cripple/bleed/immobilize. After that the trap is gone even though the graphic is still there. So as a trap it’s effectively single-target.

Frost trap (and fire trap and muddy terrain) will pulse for several seconds. That means even after they’re triggered, any mob/player running into the field will suffer its effects. It’s a true field. You can use it for area control – putting down a red circle and forcing enemies to choose between spending time moving around it, or entering it and suffering its negative effects. If they start off in the effect, you force them to either dodge out, or to stand in there suffering its effects. You don’t get any of that with spike trap.

My first ranger build was a trapper. I used spike trap for about 5 minutes before figuring this out. After that, I never used it again, always taking frost trap instead. Yeah the damage and cripple/bleed is decent. But it total lacks any area control capability.

And if you want immobilize, take muddy terrain. 2 sec immobilize when first thrown (vs 1 for spike trap). No trait needed. And it sticks around for 10 of 25 seconds (potential max cripple of 22 sec), vs. spike trap’s one instant per 20 seconds.

Still if you traited for traps (which most “trap builds” do…) it is not hard at all to use Spike Trap as a ground targetted AoE. And its’ strength is also in that it applies all conditions at once, making it harder to cleanse.

Also if you consider it to be no trap because it only affects the first target that enters it; take a look at thief traps.

And yeah I agree; Muddy Terrain is the poor trapper’s alternative. It is great though, because it does not require traits to make it work.