Guild Wars 2

Just yesterday I ran a test with the Electric Wyvern without Beastmastery against that golem and it took him more than 6 minutes to kill it. I made a video but haven’t uploaded it anywhere yet, but the state of pets is absolutely disastrous.

Guess this dispels the rumours about birds being the best able to hit a moving target. I’ve found them to be utterly useless, especially given the small AoE circle they get with beastly warden.

Now on to find another pet with a low cooldown skill to use instead of my owl.

Also Daredevil perfectly illustrates just how useless pets are. All the flipping around and stealth and teleports renders them entirely useless. Not only can they not land a hit, but they can’t even come within range of having even the tiniest hope of hitting them.

The range of their attacks needs to be increased and movement speed should be buffed further.

Eirh.1439:

Just yesterday I ran a test with the Electric Wyvern without Beastmastery against that golem and it took him more than 6 minutes to kill it. I made a video but haven’t uploaded it anywhere yet, but the state of pets is absolutely disastrous.

Current state of our pets is absurd.
And i’m uploading 6 videos, of how our pets are incapable of doing simple tasks.
Who ever is working on this pets, and thinks that this is ok pet state then… i’m really concerned for Esports and GW2 future.

I think the most shocking news to me is Jungle Spider took 60 secs to kill a moving target.. It is a range pet after-all.

Guess Smokescale and Bisterback is the only usable pet in PVP then.

Eirh.1439:

Just yesterday I ran a test with the Electric Wyvern without Beastmastery against that golem and it took him more than 6 minutes to kill it.

Try to sic it on the moving golem if you really want to feel the pain.

Just be prepared to watch your stopwatch roll over completely at some point.

They will never fix pets. This is because they have already been nerfed several times at this point (leash range, damage, etc.).

Sorry.

Gotejjeken.1267:

They will never fix pets. This is because they have already been nerfed several times at this point (leash range, damage, etc.).

Sorry.

Purpose of this topic is making awareness between rangers and other players that would actually like to learn something from this data.

+1 for blisterback. Also, thanks for your work compiling all those data.

They could do a minor change by increasing the attack range of the auto attacks for the melee pets to make them at least somewhat more reliabe… This video demonstrates how much they could be improved if they matched the auto attack range from 130 to 250 with the Polymorph’s auto attack. Although, the wyvern still won’t benefit as much due to its unneccesary long cast time for their auto attacks.

Guild wars 1 already had the main solution to this problem, don’t know why they removed it in GW2, especially since the pets became a permanent profession mechanic now. All pets in GW1 moved 20% faster than the base player movement speed, plus that bonus wasn’t counted against them when they had additional speed buffs (so a RaO buffed pet would be going at 45% movement speed, instead of 25% that the player received).

Pets were actual sustain damage threats there, I’ve won countless RA and HA games by having the pet on one target permanently while focusing others with the rest of the team. Especially useful was locking the pet on warriors, made them think twice about frenzying.

They should just implement the same 20% buff to GW2 (which would stack with swiftness, or the BM minor). We’d still need adjustments to most of the pet autoattacks, but it would be band aid solution for starters.

Thanks for the numbers. I’m wondering how owl and leopard would do, since they’ve got F2 snares, I remember testing long ago and leopard did really well.
lol@wyvern kill times.

nerf wyvern! too OP!
I hope Irenio will totally ruin ranger, so i can play BDO and don’t even think about gw2.
You can do it!

Adrian Guardian.9480:

Thanks for the numbers. I’m wondering how owl and leopard would do, since they’ve got F2 snares, I remember testing long ago and leopard did really well.
lol@wyvern kill times.

From my testing leopard is actually a bit slower than lynx, cause the extra bleeds go a long way. Especially now that cats have 1000 cond damage.

I used my fire wyvern for about an hour when I got it in pve. Haven’t touched it since. I got the feeling they weren’t working right. Let’s just say your nice compilation here confirmed my suspicions, so +1 for that.

Elorna.5329:

From my testing leopard is actually a bit slower than lynx, cause the extra bleeds go a long way. Especially now that cats have 1000 cond damage.

Actually the bonus condition damage pets got from the patch is bugged and only effects the number shown in the tooltips not the actual skills.

For example the lynx rending pounce and maul tooltips state that 4 stacks of bleeds are applied for 10 sec doing 5.200 damage (520 dmg per tick), but they actually do 3.280 damage (so 328 dmg per tick).

Similar thing with the hawk can’t remember the exact numbers since i am not ingame but it should deal 225 dmg per tick, the actual number is ~130 dmg per tick.

This is a big issue that has gone unfixed for 4(?) months.

foste.3098:

Elorna.5329:

From my testing leopard is actually a bit slower than lynx, cause the extra bleeds go a long way. Especially now that cats have 1000 cond damage.

Actually the bonus condition damage pets got from the patch is bugged and only effects the number shown in the tooltips not the actual skills.

For example the lynx rending pounce and maul tooltips state that 4 stacks of bleeds are applied for 10 sec doing 5.200 damage (520 dmg per tick), but they actually do 3.280 damage (so 328 dmg per tick).

Similar thing with the hawk can’t remember the exact numbers since i am not ingame but it should deal 225 dmg per tick, the actual number is ~130 dmg per tick.

This is a big issue that has gone unfixed for 4(?) months.

Please post about it in every druid/ranger bugs thread you can find!

Adrian Guardian.9480:

Thanks for the numbers. I’m wondering how owl and leopard would do, since they’ve got F2 snares, I remember testing long ago and leopard did really well.
lol@wyvern kill times.

Check the videos u’ll laugh, or try for yourself. If human is not using F2 skills on electric or fire wyvern, they literally cannot kill moving target EVER..

foste.3098:

Elorna.5329:

From my testing leopard is actually a bit slower than lynx, cause the extra bleeds go a long way. Especially now that cats have 1000 cond damage.

Actually the bonus condition damage pets got from the patch is bugged and only effects the number shown in the tooltips not the actual skills.

For example the lynx rending pounce and maul tooltips state that 4 stacks of bleeds are applied for 10 sec doing 5.200 damage (520 dmg per tick), but they actually do 3.280 damage (so 328 dmg per tick).

Similar thing with the hawk can’t remember the exact numbers since i am not ingame but it should deal 225 dmg per tick, the actual number is ~130 dmg per tick.

This is a big issue that has gone unfixed for 4(?) months.

I guess they only act quickly to fix “bugs” when they result in a nerf.

I guess they only act quickly to fix “bugs” when they result in a nerf.

I understand them, something really bad is less frustrating then something broken.
But what I don’t understand is, why they don’t take a moment, and fix bad things, because they are equally frustrating, just less visible… #fact

Wow. I knew pets were bad against moving targets, but I didn’t know they were this bad. If the A.I. is this bad they should really consider removing most of the damage from pets and instead give it back to the ranger. I would personally be okay with them just giving us control over both pet utility skills, and drastically reducing the percentage of ranger damage distributed to pet auto attacks. Thank you for testing this and sharing your results, although it is making me question my choice to main a ranger…

Pets should have constant superspeed OR move while attacking OR have much faster cast times on attacks OR update paths a hell of a lot more frequently than once a second OR some combination of the previous.

LOL, pets are literally useless since gw2 started. Unreliable pathing check, kittenty F2 with long cast time and misses 80% of the time check, totally useless in wvw mass fight check, hardly able to tank anything in end game content check, pretty sure there are more cons than pros for being the “main mechanic” of the ranger class. /puke
Truly I am just glad they didn’t make druid revolve around the pets, which is already considered a blessing imo.

vespers.1759:

Guess this dispels the rumours about birds being the best able to hit a moving target. I’ve found them to be utterly useless, especially given the small AoE circle they get with beastly warden.

The small circle is actually a bug. The effective Taunt radius is the same as other pets. This has been tested and is in the Ranger bug thread.

Thank you for posting your results with the pets, everyone. I found the wyverns to be most egregiously bad, considering their incredibly, ridiculously slow autoattack, cast times and huge aftercasts (combined with their relatively low HP pool). These are new pets—they should not suffer from the worst aspects of our other pets combined.

Another great thread, cannot express how great it is to have someone running experiments and gathering good data like this. Keep it up.

Sicarius.4639:

Another great thread, cannot express how great it is to have someone running experiments and gathering good data like this. Keep it up.

Thanks, It’s good to see that people appreciate it, sadly i didn’t have enough patience, to run all this pets on moving targets, because those fights were pain to watch :/

Sicarius.4639:

Another great thread, cannot express how great it is to have someone running experiments and gathering good data like this. Keep it up.

data that will be probably completely ignored by devs, sadly…

This is outrageous, I DEMAND A FIX, or im quitting this game for real.

Thank you for doing these tests Firelysm, much appreciated. Now we just need to keep bumping it so it stays on the 1st page and see if we can get a response. The videos contained within are saddening, mostly the new pets, they are seriously pathetic. They just created them and they are the worst pets ever, that is just terrible!

foste.3098:

Elorna.5329:

From my testing leopard is actually a bit slower than lynx, cause the extra bleeds go a long way. Especially now that cats have 1000 cond damage.

Actually the bonus condition damage pets got from the patch is bugged and only effects the number shown in the tooltips not the actual skills.

For example the lynx rending pounce and maul tooltips state that 4 stacks of bleeds are applied for 10 sec doing 5.200 damage (520 dmg per tick), but they actually do 3.280 damage (so 328 dmg per tick).

Similar thing with the hawk can’t remember the exact numbers since i am not ingame but it should deal 225 dmg per tick, the actual number is ~130 dmg per tick.

This is a big issue that has gone unfixed for 4(?) months.

Wasn’t the bug that pet skill tooltips use your condition damage instead of their own? And any bonus cond damage (like the one from the trait) doesn’t get applied. But base values still get applied afaik. Just like precision, only the base prec and fury determine the pet crit chance, while any trait bonuses, spotter and banner get ignored.

That’s why pets taking 30% of Ranger damage has always been a fallacy.

It wasn’t like that in beta/release mind you. They nerfed Ranger because people were saying Ranger has more damage potential than other classes because it has a pet. Forgetting that it’s just another class mechanic.

This topic shows why I’ve been running Red Moa on avoid combat for years in WvW. So I basically don’t have a pet and get high up time of Fury instead.

This is the first time in years that I’ve picked other pets over Red Moa(fury)/Blue Moa(protection)/Brown Bear(condi clear). Bristleback and Smokescale are both quite nice.

(PS: It’s Bristleback, not Blisterback)

I am surprised you didn’t use a bear for this test… because you are playing worse than a bearbow (albeit with other pets) and complaining they do no damage.

You should re-title this thread “Bearbow don’t work in PvP”

This tread will get ignored by the devs because you are poorly using your pet and complaining it does no damage.

Archon.6480:

I am surprised you didn’t use a bear for this test… because you are playing worse than a bearbow (albeit with other pets) and complaining they do no damage.

You should re-title this thread “Bearbow don’t work in PvP”

This tread will get ignored by the devs because you are poorly using your pet and complaining it does no damage.

Wat?

THE ENTIRE POINT of the test is to test the AI without human intervention. Did you watch the videos?

Please explain how better use of the pet will make it hit moving targets more reliably. Better yet, post a video.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Wat?

THE ENTIRE POINT of the test is to test the AI without human intervention. Did you watch the videos?

Please explain how better use of the pet will make it hit moving targets more reliably. Better yet, post a video.

I think you are missing my point. My point is:

Pets are useless without player intervention.

This is by design. If you don’t do anything, they don’t do anything.

That is how they are supposed to work. If you are AFK, they are AFK. Despite the fact they run around and feebly flail at your opponents. Is this the fault of the AI? You bet it is. And they move too slowly.

Is this on purpose? Yes

Is ANet going to change this? I don’t think so

We can’t test the pet by itself, because it is tied to us like a ball and chain. The only test that would be good must include the Ranger doing its best to kill target, as well.

Archon.6480:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Wat?

THE ENTIRE POINT of the test is to test the AI without human intervention. Did you watch the videos?

Please explain how better use of the pet will make it hit moving targets more reliably. Better yet, post a video.

I think you are missing my point. My point is:

Pets are useless without player intervention.

This is by design. If you don’t do anything, they don’t do anything.

That is how they are supposed to work. If you are AFK, they are AFK. Despite the fact they run around and feebly flail at your opponents. Is this the fault of the AI? You bet it is. And they move too slowly.

Is this on purpose? Yes

Is ANet going to change this? I don’t think so

We can’t test the pet by itself, because it is tied to us like a ball and chain. The only test that would be good must include the Ranger doing its best to kill target, as well.

What? How does a player control the pet anymore than telling it to attack its target? Sure there are f2 skills, but otherwise how do we have anymore control over our pets ability to deal damage? If pet auto attacks are not meant to deal decent damage then why does the ranger have such low damage on its skills? Surely a single ability, with a sizable cooldown (pet f2) does not equate to a 25%-30% damage reduction. I think you are maybe just confusing poorly implemented A.I. for intentional design.

Archon.6480:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Wat?

THE ENTIRE POINT of the test is to test the AI without human intervention. Did you watch the videos?

Please explain how better use of the pet will make it hit moving targets more reliably. Better yet, post a video.

I think you are missing my point. My point is:

Pets are useless without player intervention.

This is by design. If you don’t do anything, they don’t do anything.

That is how they are supposed to work. If you are AFK, they are AFK. Despite the fact they run around and feebly flail at your opponents. Is this the fault of the AI? You bet it is. And they move too slowly.

Is this on purpose? Yes

Is ANet going to change this? I don’t think so

We can’t test the pet by itself, because it is tied to us like a ball and chain. The only test that would be good must include the Ranger doing its best to kill target, as well.

I didn’t miss your point. Your point is just moot. What can the Ranger do to make the pet hit a moving target?

Please explain how better use of the pet will make it hit moving targets more reliably. Better yet, post a video.

if they were remotely capable of fixing this it wouldve happened already.

I am finding that Bristleback and Smokescale are both better suited to this new HoT zone. The Fire Wyrven not so much. He seems to be a bit late to the party most of the time. I found that if he is not directly on top of his prey when you have him do his fire spray, it is ineffective at causing much damage.

Seems to work pretty well if you get swarmed by those pocket raptors and you hit that skill…he just sprays fire all around you which cooks those little dudes to toast.

And who on earth decided to call them pocket raptors? Silly name…I think something along the lines of swarm raptors would have been more appropriate.

Raven.9603:

if they were remotely capable of fixing this it wouldve happened already.

Because they have fixed so many Ranger bugs and issues?

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

I didn’t miss your point. Your point is just moot. What can the Ranger do to make the pet hit a moving target?

Please explain how better use of the pet will make it hit moving targets more reliably. Better yet, post a video.

I really think we are in agreement. I also believe that having a pet is not a good justification for the damage reduction we receive, because the pet does not land enough hits in combat to account for our damage reduction. This is very true when fighting high tier players that move really fast, cleanse soft and hard cc nearly instantly, and never stop moving.

Here is the video to describe what I mean: Pets Need Our Help

3 button presses and the Miley kills the moving target in under10s. I could have had the pet kill it faster using utilities and starting with pet swap and BM. I used clerics amulet to lower my personal damage.

The OP posted that it takes the Lynx about 26.9s to kill a moving target. That argument is such an extreme exaggeration that we will get ignored. We need to make better arguments if we want anyone to listen.

Archon.6480:

I am surprised you didn’t use a bear for this test… because you are playing worse than a bearbow (albeit with other pets) and complaining they do no damage.

You should re-title this thread “Bearbow don’t work in PvP”

This tread will get ignored by the devs because you are poorly using your pet and complaining it does no damage.

Archon is a living example why some guild wars 2 players will argue about the complete oppsite no matter what evidence you bring, if that is complete ignorance, trolling or low IQ we never know.

I seriously hope the devs actually take this to heart. If I was working on something and it was in this poor state I’d be embarrased and sad. C’mon, we actually need some kind of response on this, or has the developers been asked to be silent ever since Roy was forum devloper of the month.

Inflames.8026:

Archon is a living example why some guild wars 2 players will argue about the complete oppsite no matter what evidence you bring, if that is complete ignorance, trolling or low IQ we never know.

See evidence as to why standing afk to analyze pet damage is a myopic test:

Weapon Skills that directly effect pet’s attack:

• Daze your foe with a hilt bash. Stun them if you hit from behind. Your pet’s next attack does 50% more damage.
• Fire an arrow that grants you stealth when it hits an enemy. Your pet gains swiftness.
• Fire an arrow that cripples your target. Your pet’s next three attacks inflict bleeding.
• Leap at your foe, striking them. Your pet gains might.
• Throw an axe to chill your foe. Your pet’s next attack inflicts weakness.
• Bounce your axe between multiple foes, gaining might for each enemy struck.
• Throw an axe to chill your foe. Your pet’s next attack inflicts weakness.
• Grant fury, might, and swiftness to yourself and nearby allies.

Weapon Skills that indirectly effect pet’s chance to land an attack:

• Block and counter an attack with a kick that pushes foes back.
• Throw your greatsword, crippling your foe.
• Push back your foe with a point-blank shot. The closer they are, the farther it pushes them back.
• Barrage the target area with a hail of arrows that cripple.
• Daze your foe with an arrow. Stun them if you hit from behind or from the side.
• Kick your foe, crippling them for a short time.
• Leap back into the fight, crippling your foe.
• Throw your axe so that it returns to you, striking foes each way.
• Set a fire around you, damaging and burning foes.

Utilities That directly effect pet’s attack:

• Heal yourself and your pet. You each gain a copy of the other’s boons.
• Your pet runs faster and does more damage.
• Command your pet to aggressively guard an area. Your pet gains stealth and protection for a short duration.
• Signet Passive: Grants 25% increased movement speed to you and your pet. Signet Active: Your next attack and your pet’s next attack deal more damage.
• Signet Passive: Grants health regeneration to you and your pet. Signet Active: You and your pet grow larger, dealing more damage and gaining stability.
• Summon a frost spirit that has a chance to grant bonus damage to nearby allies.
• Summon a storm spirit that grants nearby allies a chance to apply vulnerability when attacking.
• Summon a sun spirit that grants allies a chance to inflict burning.
• You and your pet gain quickness.
• Rampage with your pet, gaining stability, fury, and swiftness. You and your pet also grant might to each other when you attack.

Utilitites that indirectly effect pet’s attack:

• Your Frost Spirit sacrifices itself, releasing a freezing blast of arctic air to chill nearby foes.
• Your stone spirit sacrifices itself to soften the earth around it, immobilizing and crippling foes.
• Use mud to cripple and immobilize foes.
• Set a trap that chills foes.
• Set a trap that bleeds and launches foes.
• Entangle foes around you with vines. Entangled foes bleed and are immobilized until the vines are destroyed.

I am too lazy to include all the traits that boost pet damage and chances of landing a hit based on player action.

Inflames.8026:

I seriously hope the devs actually take this to heart. If I was working on something and it was in this poor state I’d be embarrased and sad. C’mon, we actually need some kind of response on this, or has the developers been asked to be silent ever since Roy was forum devloper of the month.

Yes, I seriously hope they increase our base damage, as well. I am not here to defend them, because I am still annoyed they took a powerful GM trait, that had a 3s cooldown, and turned it into a useless trait with a 12s cooldown, which is filmsier than a single sigil of leeching.

We have to make better arguments than the OP did, however. We are bearbowing, if we do nothing and watch our pet flail around. It’s not a valid test.

Archon.6480:

It’s not a valid test.

It is. The pet should be capable of reliably hitting foes that do not have movement impeding conditions on them. End of discussion.

Archon.6480:

Inflames.8026:

Archon is a living example why some guild wars 2 players will argue about the complete oppsite no matter what evidence you bring, if that is complete ignorance, trolling or low IQ we never know.

See evidence as to why standing afk to analyze pet damage is a myopic test:

Weapon Skills that directly effect pet’s attack:

• Daze your foe with a hilt bash. Stun them if you hit from behind. Your pet’s next attack does 50% more damage.
• Fire an arrow that grants you stealth when it hits an enemy. Your pet gains swiftness.
• Fire an arrow that cripples your target. Your pet’s next three attacks inflict bleeding.
• Leap at your foe, striking them. Your pet gains might.
• Throw an axe to chill your foe. Your pet’s next attack inflicts weakness.
• Bounce your axe between multiple foes, gaining might for each enemy struck.
• Throw an axe to chill your foe. Your pet’s next attack inflicts weakness.
• Grant fury, might, and swiftness to yourself and nearby allies.

Weapon Skills that indirectly effect pet’s chance to land an attack:

• Block and counter an attack with a kick that pushes foes back.
• Throw your greatsword, crippling your foe.
• Push back your foe with a point-blank shot. The closer they are, the farther it pushes them back.
• Barrage the target area with a hail of arrows that cripple.
• Daze your foe with an arrow. Stun them if you hit from behind or from the side.
• Kick your foe, crippling them for a short time.
• Leap back into the fight, crippling your foe.
• Throw your axe so that it returns to you, striking foes each way.
• Set a fire around you, damaging and burning foes.

Utilities That directly effect pet’s attack:

• Heal yourself and your pet. You each gain a copy of the other’s boons.
• Your pet runs faster and does more damage.
• Command your pet to aggressively guard an area. Your pet gains stealth and protection for a short duration.
• Signet Passive: Grants 25% increased movement speed to you and your pet. Signet Active: Your next attack and your pet’s next attack deal more damage.
• Signet Passive: Grants health regeneration to you and your pet. Signet Active: You and your pet grow larger, dealing more damage and gaining stability.
• Summon a frost spirit that has a chance to grant bonus damage to nearby allies.
• Summon a storm spirit that grants nearby allies a chance to apply vulnerability when attacking.
• Summon a sun spirit that grants allies a chance to inflict burning.
• You and your pet gain quickness.
• Rampage with your pet, gaining stability, fury, and swiftness. You and your pet also grant might to each other when you attack.

Utilitites that indirectly effect pet’s attack:

• Your Frost Spirit sacrifices itself, releasing a freezing blast of arctic air to chill nearby foes.
• Your stone spirit sacrifices itself to soften the earth around it, immobilizing and crippling foes.
• Use mud to cripple and immobilize foes.
• Set a trap that chills foes.
• Set a trap that bleeds and launches foes.
• Entangle foes around you with vines. Entangled foes bleed and are immobilized until the vines are destroyed.

I am too lazy to include all the traits that boost pet damage and chances of landing a hit based on player action.

Inflames.8026:

I seriously hope the devs actually take this to heart. If I was working on something and it was in this poor state I’d be embarrased and sad. C’mon, we actually need some kind of response on this, or has the developers been asked to be silent ever since Roy was forum devloper of the month.

Yes, I seriously hope they increase our base damage, as well. I am not here to defend them, because I am still annoyed they took a powerful GM trait, that had a 3s cooldown, and turned it into a useless trait with a 12s cooldown, which is filmsier than a single sigil of leeching.

We have to make better arguments than the OP did, however. We are bearbowing, if we do nothing and watch our pet flail around. It’s not a valid test.

This is a perfectly valid test of the pet’s shoddy AI, lackluster damage, and long casts and aftercasts. You are arguing a completely separate point that is unrelated to the OP. Pets, our class mechanic, should not require assistance to hit a target. Period. No amount of player-enhanced damage can make up for a pet NOT HITTING THE TARGET. If we are to have an AI as our class mechanic, and for that AI to do a significant portion of our damage, that AI must be competent enough to serve its purpose. It is not. This is an AI and pet skill issue, not a player issue.

:) Well, look at the bright side. No one can rightly say, “Ranger is a skill-less class that noobs and plebs use because the pet AI does all the work.”

Clearly, the pet barely hits if the Ranger does nothing. The OP’s tests show this very well.

Remember how we were able to tell Wyverns were bad from the reveal video? But this is about 3 times worse.

Pets still need a lot of work. OPs testing methods are reproducable, accurate and consistent.
The validity of this test is without a doubt solid.

What we have learnt from this, is that pets require faster tick (0.3sec/update on enemy), shorter animations and shorter aftercasts.

Some animals require larger hit radiuses/single target splash damage (so you actually hit)…

30% of a class’s DPS being “permanently affected by weakness” is not how this should be. Arenanet CAN do better then that.

I think pets should have been all about utility from the start, not about damage and it should have never reduced Ranger’s personal damage output, except maybe through a Beastmastery GM trait to make it a choice.

Like how Scrapper has a drone that goes around and removes conditions. Pretty “lame”, but fun and useful. Imagine pets going around and healing allies or giving out boons or taunting enemies. Applying cripple, daze, stun, poison, etc in an area around them, depending on which pet you have. All utility. Not much about damage or missing their target and running around like headless chickens.

Archon.6480

Yo mate, this topic is not how to use pets efficiently, this topic is how efficient pets are on their own, and how accurate they are.

That’s the same like making example how poorly clones are placed of mesmer, and you would complain how stupid some mesmer player is because they don’t know how to shatter.

Your arguments make sense, but not for this topic. Ranger pet is “30%” of rangers damage, but what we did just prove is that this is far from reality.

If you mean to troll, you have more appropriate forums for that. Ty.