Guild Wars 2

I think to say the range reduction (if true) isn’t a nerf is a blatant lie. However, it is needed to make more diverse weapons and playstyles for people (jubskie’s idea for a skirmish weapon is spot on in my opinion while Boomstin wants both in one weapon). Unfortunately Anet hasn’t made either weapon very memorable, Lb still will have grotesque defensive problems and easily avoidable damage and Sb will continue to be a snorefest.

Shortbow having 900 range may or may not be the correct range. But saying it makes players somehow better and it doesn’t affect anything is just false. Every shot counts before you switch to melee, or when you are trying to land that cripple to an escaping enemy.

Boomstin.3460:

Shortbow having 900 range may or may not be the correct range. But saying it makes players somehow better and it doesn’t affect anything is just false.

Did you even read and understand what I wrote?

Boomstin.3460:

Every shot counts before you switch to melee, or when you are trying to land that cripple to an escaping enemy.

Ok, I’ll give you that. The additional 14% damage may or may not help to down your target before they try escaping though.

Sorry, the players who were playing Sb well are the ones in 900 and below range. At 1200 you are limiting your ability to keep up the flanking bleeds. Sb has the tools (utilities as well) to keep enemies away (if you aren’t blowing 3-5 haphazardly on cd). You lose some PvE pulling range and that’s about it…

I really hope that lightning reflexes will cure movement conditions with this patch. Aside from the supposed axe/axe and longbow changes, it’s something I would kill to have.

I hope this patch notes are fake. The pets nerf should be compensated with son damage buff to our weapons, that is if they want rangers to play any other thing different from trapper or BM bunker.

Mcrocha.3891:

I’m starting to think the notes are fake too. Would Anet be stupid enough to not remember to balance the F2 skills on Owl and Rainbow Jellyfish which are both HoM pets?

It’s funny you think ArenaNet remembers the HoM pets any time they make a change. Have they buffed the vitality of the HoM pets that were ignored during the last buffs? The Black Widow spent most of its time in game with an abysmally low vitality value compared to it’s non-HoM equivalent. They didn’t fix that for several months. When they buffed the vitality of multiple pets last? balance patch, they forgot a couple of the HoM pets again.

What I find funny is that ArenaNet devs and the ranger players actually say they want the same thing. Players have been begging for pets to do less DPS and for ranger weapons to do more DPS (because ranger weapon DPS is worse than other classes to account for the pet). What is ArenaNet’s solution? Nerf pet DPS and leave ranger DPS also low.

Aylpse.6280:

Aquaman IS our class.

/fixed

Tricare.2946:

jdmThor.3806:

jubskie.3152:

jdmThor.3806:

sigh. just when i’m about to get my ranger to 80, they’ll do this to the short bow. i hope this is all false information but it doesn’t look like it.

It still does the same damage, and the SB3-5 got slight damage boosts. Tell me why losing 300 range makes you sigh.

because it will lessen my effectivity in wvw a lot. don’t ask me why, it’s just related to one of the things i do in wvw.

about the dmg buffs to other sb skills, tell me why you didn’t read the posts explaining how that doesn’t make a bit of difference.

Anyone who thought SB should have the same range as LB is fooling themselves.

I think shortbows should be 1200 longbows should be 1500 by default, classes that have the luxury of being invisible can be penalized in range imo oh wait they got 1200 on their shortbows now…

jubskie.3152:

Boomstin.3460:

jubskie.3152:

jdmThor.3806:

jubskie.3152:

jdmThor.3806:

hahaha. come on admit it. you don’t main a ranger. if you really are, it’s not our fault you can’t turn an additional 300 range into a great advantage

HAHAHAHAHA. You must be new here.

yeah i am new in the forums, not in the game. i don’t know who you are sorry lol.

Lurk moar.

Anyway, if you’re resorting to questioning my credentials and not rebutting my points, I don’t see why I should keep replying to you.

If you don’t see that removing the distance advantage of shortbow is not a good thing , there’s not much point in going on with this anyways.
And i guess ’ i’ve been posting on the forums longer than you ’ makes your opinion more valid than his.

I do see it as a good thing. It’ll make shortbow play more dynamic because we have to actually learn how to dodge better because we can actually get hit now. Sure it was easy to dodge red circles at 1200 range, now we have to actually pay attention. Sounds horrible, right? People have been using MH Axe at 900 range and there were no complaints about it’s range.

Also, I didn’t bring up “i’ve been posting longer”, he did when he asked if I really mained a ranger.

Maybe it was a good thing for people who needed to learn how to dodge not for me, it’s just one more reason runners will get away from me and nothing I can do to stop them.

Used in active competetive combat it won’t matter as much though like you say most people are probably already at 900range or less but losing range simply can’t be seen as a bonus regardless.

Substance E.4852:

Dardamaniac.1295:

Substance E.4852:

RyuDragnier.9476:

Substance E.4852:

RyuDragnier.9476:

Expiatus.4210:

Are these verified? Why decrease SB to 900? Call me suspicious but hey, “Trust but verify” you know.

People weren’t taking LB because SB had the same range for more DPS and conditions. Now that’s been replaced with less range for more DPS and conditions.

Anyone who thinks a 15-20% increase in damage on SB 2-5 is a dps boost has never used the thing before.

DPS = Damage per second

Conditions play into that, and #1 does all the DPSing, not the other 4.

So then explain your logic that they reduced the damage but increased the dps because, according to the notes, they didn’t touch the damage or conditions on crossfire nor did they increase the duration of poison volley.

Also let me inform you that you have 3 projectile finishers at Shortbow…Well i geuss that youve never fired above a fire field with dakittens ok,you will do it now

No, I wouldn’t, because I’m not a terrible player that blows their utility skills for a few ticks of burning.

the fact that 3,4,5 on sb are 100% projectile finishers and knowing how to use them can provide more utility and damage to the ranger – as in using combo fields, flame for more damage and light for condition clearing f.e. which is something you will have to do if you want to up your game on ranger.
firing of #5 lightly is not adviced though – potentially with the right runeset and 30 pts into skirmishing taking the trap traits and running dagger offhand instead of torch because it also has a 100% projectile finisher lets you apply about 12 seconds burning on one target so you can sustain burning and pressure quite a lot on targets.
running control pets on top of it will give you a huge amount of constant pressure which you can easily increase by going to close/midrange on shortbow because of the flanking and standing on point forces people to stand in your traps as well.
as for condition bursting setting up flame trap with spiketrap + spider/wolf using 4 + 3 on sb ( potentially 5 – depends on the situation) and swapping weapons mid animation of #3 will cancel the animation out while still evading and if you run geomancy/hydromancy they will take about 5-800 dmg noncrit ( if running carrion) on top of chill/ 3 bleeding stacks, if you follow it up with dagger #5 you will now have added 3-4 seconds of additional burning on your target.
so overall it’s : 3 bleeds spike trap, 3 bleeds geomancy, 3 bleeds crippling talon, 3 pet bleeds, flame trap + 3-4 seconds of extra burning and cripple ( if you continue the chain use dagger #4 for poison if the spider didnt use his poison field) in a really short time frame. given you’ve started harrasing earlier with sb #1 this condition/hybrid burst can easily bring down a target.
just one example.

also rangers always did great in applying constant pressure on targets – and bm being purely played for backpoint wasnt my perception of it, as you didnt use its full potential – it will certainly shuffle things up quite a lot, but in the end it increases the skillfloor of pretty much every ranger build and even though it appears that not many things have changed for you guys(or gotten worse even) , the perception people had of the meta will certainly have changed after the patch, so it possibly creates new viable roles for older builds or builds that got outshined pre-patch.
can’t really give an exact statement about the changes yet though, as i’ll have to test them first.
power rangers might be viable – trapper will be good and beastmaster will still be decent though imo.
for the rangers that want to play a bit more offensive and play a hybrid build utilizing the new weakness a lot i will suggest running the cave spider and using monarchs leap through poison gas to get more weakness.
also axe offhand is a great weapon and might see some use in tpvp to set up kills/spikes or for great interrupts/neutralizes.
just make use of the rangers most defining quality – adaptability and versatility and we should be good to go (even) after this patch.

K, I’ve been at work all night, and had to read some of the dumbest posts imaginable in this thread all night as well.

Lets clear something up right here and now, There was no damage buff in this patch for Ranger.

This was flat out a damage nerf to our damage…15% damage bonus’s to the utility SB attacks which virtually do no damage as it is (I think all but one of them actually do more damage then crossfire in the first place) does not equal anywhere near the amount of damage lost from the pets being nerfed…Its not even bloody close.

Having reviewed every other class, Most of them got damage increases…The ones that didn’t get damage increases generally got more utility, more defense, or more substain.

We’re the only class to eat a fairly heavy damage nerf….For anyone who thinks that acceptable please take the door out of these forums. If you want to see how over the top the damage nerfs were, Simply replace them with any other classes “damage” attacks"

Instead of Maul being nerfed on Cats, 100B is nerfed by 50%….Warriors would flip out if Anet did something like that, and they should.

Now….with that out of the way..

Anyone who thinks a 30 point Nature Talent to give Guard (and lets face it, this is the only Shout you’re going to use with that talent) a Regen/Swiftness boon is a good “GM talent” is out of their kitten mind.

Not only is Swiftness over abundant as it is, but Regen is as well…. with 30 Points in Natures you could kitten well have perma regen anyway with Healing Spring as well…

Plus its going to be on Guard, which is going to take up a utility slot for something that was only ever good when you could send pets into keeps to kitten people…

Attaching a Stun Break will not change that… I’d rather have Lightning Reflex or Signet of Renewal any day of the week over Guard, because they’re actually some what useful for other then a stun break.

The Changes to SB and Longbow…..Making Shortbow suck is not a solution to making Longbow better….If you think this is a good idea…You’re clearly not playing this class.

instead of nerfing Shortbow range to that of a bloody thiefs shortbow (which is vastly superior to ours in the first place) they should of just increased Longbows range to 1500 without a talent..Since we’re suppose to be the master of bows anyway…

The Offhand Axe Change…Again.. The problem with Offhand axe isn’t Path of Scars, I mean its not a great ability, and those people who keep saying “I crit people for 7k” are pretty much hitting underleveled people and should be ignored as they probably use Bears in the first place but the ability itself…Its not super…Attaching a Pull to it will not make me use offhand axe more, The problem with offhand axe still remains the absolute crap number 5 ability….until you can move with it, Offhand axe will suck and continue to suck..There is a reason you see no one running this weapon… and its not because it lacked a pull.

The spirit changes, Again……These are absolute useless abilities… You go out and make a video of you using Call Lightning on people.. Go on i’ll wait.

The other talent changes are hilarious at best, and people are talking about them like its amazing.

Companions Might is now 5 seconds instead of 1…Great…. To bad they just gutted all the pet damage by such a massive amount that even if you managed to stack 25 stacks of might on your pet, it still wouldn’t equal the damage lost.

Beastmaster’s Might, Again.. I saw some people talking about this like its amazing

I can get to the same thing on my Thief, only I get 5 stacks instead of 3…. and not only that..I can go stealth perma and pop out of stealth with 12 stacks already…So I can pop on you from stealth on a thief with 25 stacks of might already…And you have virtually no way of stopping me from doing or seeing it coming….I’ve popped people for 15k with Backstab doing this….15k….instantly..with no warning…They didn’t know I was there because I was D/P when doing it.

There is only 2 changes in that entire patch notes that I consider remotely good…

Stability Training… Which I’ll have to see how it works.

and Keen Edges…Which I’ll have to see how it works (I use this on my Rampager’s Build already but i’m not certain it even works)

Also..

For any Devs that happen to browse this post, I have one question..

WTF were you smoking that made you think that Moa’s and Pigs of all things needed a damage nerf…..i mean seriously..Were you slamming your heads against the keyboard kitten a kitten along saying “Pets need nerf..Nerf all pets”

Cause that’s the only logical conclusion i can come up with for nerfing those 2 pet families.

Oh and Devourer, cause when I think scary pet…I think that one…

So much for not playing whack-a-mole for balance.

Bran.7425:

So much for not playing whack-a-mole for balance.

if by playing whack-a-mole you mean them burning down the chuckie-cheese with all the children (ranger) inside.

Xsorus I totally agree with you here, one thing I wanna comment on though is that the devourer does tons of damage under water because of the faster attack speed but that’s just it why a flat damage nerf? it’s totally kittened if they thought it did too much damage in the water make it attack at the same rate as on land very strange choise it seems to me but it only gets stranger when you consider they buff the shark wich is already really strong and puts bleeds up like there’s no tomorrow.

Manekk.6981:

Xsorus I totally agree with you here, one thing I wanna comment on though is that the devourer does tons of damage under water because of the faster attack speed but that’s just it why a flat damage nerf? it’s totally kittened if they thought it did too much damage in the water make it attack at the same rate as on land very strange choise it seems to me but it only gets stranger when you consider they buff the shark wich is already really strong and puts bleeds up like there’s no tomorrow.

Sharks are pretty awful.. …I’ve tried using them, but unless the person is a complete baddie a shark will never actually hit the person under the water.

and in PVE they were outclassed bigtime by the Jellyfish and Armorfish.

Also the only reason I ever used Devourer underwater in pvp is because they apply poison, and killing some classes underwater (ranger) without poison is impossible

Xsorus.2507:

Manekk.6981:

Xsorus I totally agree with you here, one thing I wanna comment on though is that the devourer does tons of damage under water because of the faster attack speed but that’s just it why a flat damage nerf? it’s totally kittened if they thought it did too much damage in the water make it attack at the same rate as on land very strange choise it seems to me but it only gets stranger when you consider they buff the shark wich is already really strong and puts bleeds up like there’s no tomorrow.

Sharks are pretty awful.. …I’ve tried using them, but unless the person is a complete baddie a shark will never actually hit the person under the water.

and in PVE they were outclassed bigtime by the Jellyfish and Armorfish.

Also the only reason I ever used Devourer underwater in pvp is because they apply poison, and killing some classes underwater (ranger) without poison is impossible

I use double devourers the lashtail one is even better than the poison cloud cause he gets a double stun nothing will kill faster than using that and pirhanas school although I swap to the whiptail to drop a poison cloud aswell once the stun has fired off.

They do poison on their main attacks if i remember correctly.

Xsorus.2507:

They do poison on their main attacks if i remember correctly.

It’s only a 10% proc chance for a 3s poison on the normal attack complete garbage really it doesn’t happen very often, the cloud however can easily stack up to a long duration though and it fires off instantly so a stunned or stupid (not moving) opponent will quickly get a 10s poision or maybe more from it it’s pretty nice also to sometimes fire off on downed players cause between that and feeding frenzy nobody is going near him to heal him up again or if they are dumb enough to try they get minced too.

Traited shouts plus ‘Guard!’ → Perma regen/swiftness/protection for pet without any boon duration even required, given 30% base plus Fortifying Bond. Downside – 1s cast time and small radius, although all other shouts are instant, plus, we might have a stun breaker in there. 30WS/30NM/10BM is going to be cool.

@Xsorus,
Yes, I do believe the notes aren’t real (or hope anyways) for the simple fact that I don’t think (or I hope again) that ANet is silly enough to nerf all of the damage and an entire weapon and not return the lost damage in any way possible.

However, the aftercast delay on the longbow does equate to a DPS increase (I’m not saying this is the end all, be all buff, just saying) because it means that shots will refire at 1s, not 1.25s. Looking at 12s (I wanted a large enough common denominator is all), it means that before that patch, you are only shooting 8 arrows in that time frame, and after the patch, you are shooting 12 arrows in that same time frame.

That’s just something that I’m finding significant. Does is justify all of the changes if the leaked notes are to be believed? No. Did the shortbow surprise me? Absolutely. But did I think that the pet damage nerf would be worse? Yes. So I was actually pleasantly surprised by those figures simply because I expected it to be worse.

Also, the new grandmaster talent is for the ability to keep regen/swiftness up on a group (it isn’t for self use). I can see it being used for people in dungeons, or maybe in a small group in WvW, but no, it does not add to the self sustain whatsoever, and will generally (just like almost every other trait in the nature magic line) serve to boost those around you. I’m definitely not saying its good without a shout rework, and it more or less seems like an “okay, lets give them this option so they can’t say they’re useless in dungeons or at team support anymore” situation, but it won’t really affect my playstyle at all, so I can’t really complain.

As far as tpvp goes, the meta will just shift rangers into being healing trappers, and we’ll get complained about again, just like they tried to get traps nerfed back when Java was on the SoTG.

Setun.4368:

I really hope that lightning reflexes will cure movement conditions with this patch.

Or stun the target. It’s LOL you can hit for 2k plus with it when no one in their right mind would use it as a source of dmg.

I ask you to give us back our shortbow range. After reading the leaked notes I expected the changes to make sence in game. After playing with them I dont see anything but a huge disadvantage over all. We are rangers, as such we are expected to be ranged not stuck to only one weapon for long range. Also id like to point out your changes to the Longbow do not work right now. Testin shows me that there has been no effective change to the skills. The after cast change of the Long Range Shot has not effected it from my tests HOWEVER I admit this could simply be a bug. Other things iv noticed is the longbow Barrage … has no difference in cripple. Last night it was the same as today after the update no change reflected in the description or form hitting someone. Anyways Im happy that you(ANET staff) are changing things in an ever persistence of making sure the game has enough variations but you have left myself and fellow rangers… maybe not all of them but most iv talked to, very confused as to why take the shot bow so far back… if it had at-least 1000 range we could still feel like your giving a ranger the ability to stay a ranger and not become a skirmisher. In the end I cant change your minds but simply plead with you bring a little range back into the weapon, If 1200 is to much while 1500 for longbow is fine then … well what gives? Oh well Guess im just a ranger who prefers to use ranged weapons. Ill let time tell for me and leave you with these past thoughts.

PS, I call longbow as 1500 range due to the trait, for those who may question where that comes from.