Guild Wars 2

So, the more I look at things, the more I realize this class has fallen into the same position necromancers were in before the Specialization update. What happened there was simple – they didn’t have the ability to really keep up anywhere that mattered, because their class wasn’t really built to keep up in those situations. And then the trait change was patched in and suddenly they’re good at everything except for conditions. By and large, nothing changed – except that they got some support, some numbers shuffled, and the ability to access a full three trait lines.

The thing is, there was complaints before the patch went up. Specifically, regarding the Reaper, and how much it opened up. This may seem kind of strange, but it spoke of a larger problem – before the Reaper was revealed, there was one, maybe two good necromancer builds in each game mode. As soon as the Reaper was fully revealed, 13+ new builds suddenly showed up all involving the Reaper, because they covered problems that Necromancers had simply built into them. This brought to light the issues with the base necromancer, and led to them becoming what they are now – powerful in a large variety of ways, and genuinely fun to play because of it.

Are we in that position now? We have something like 3 or 4 builds floating around that are actually good – trapper, quick draw, and remorseless, with some build trying to figure out how to tank in a meta that simply doesn’t support it. People feel like it’s required to use Wilderness Survival because the defensive options we get from it (most notably Empathic Bond and wilderness Knowledge being in the same slot) completely outweigh the benefits of speccing for damage, with marksmanship or similar. Beast mastery is basically required due to it being necessary for several builds, and yet is bugged so that out pets are actually worse off than before when we’re focusing on beast mastery.

What this forum feels like, to me, is what Necromancer was before the trait changes. The same sort of feeling of dread, the feeling of almost not being worth playing, because it feels like the Devs don’t respect rangers as a class. It’s probably not true, but it’s endemic of a larger problem, and that’s that rangers simply aren’t good right now, and are probably worse off than before because while every other class was buffed, rangers are sitting at about the same level they were before the patch went live.

If they reveal the Druid to us and we suddenly start churning out builds because the druid actually solves the problems the class has, then it’ll become eminently clear that the Ranger needs the same treatment, or we’ll continue to fall into obscurity in the shadow of classes that are actually working as well as they should be.

beast mastery makes pet worse?

I have no idea what you’re yammering about, rangers are as good as, if not better than, they were before the patch.

Well Anet doesnt respect ranger, they showed it in their stream earlier. They made lots of joke about bearbow and such while providing little to none ranger related discussion. Thats just a sign we are not loved…

Susulemon.3204:

beast mastery makes pet worse?

not directly, but we got a net 300 stats for pets pre-patch, and now we only get 150. Beast Mastery is overall weaker now.

I have no idea what you’re yammering about, rangers are as good as, if not better than, they were before the patch.

that’s my point. We’re just as good as we were before the pathc – which was when we were limited to one or two builds per gametype. Thing is, everybody else got buffed, and left us in the dust. that’s the issue.

Ranger pets were suppose to receive a baseline boost on all pets by 150 (some have report this didn’t happen oversight or bug unsure myself haven’t checked) and another 150 if you spec into the bm line.

I don’t think everyone got buffed. I think everyone got fkt in one way or another.

Every class forum I look at, players have some very legitimate complaints.

Even engi, who everyone is complaining about with their 7k burning ticks. They don’t like changes either.

Rangers are very strong spvp and wvw roamers ATM.
BM is very strong.

Rangers are strong but the bugs are stronger. I see an engi with grenades and I have to be VERY careful.

Fluffball.8307:

Rangers are strong but the bugs are stronger. I see an engi with grenades and I have to be VERY careful.

Keep your distance and let the taunt birds to the rest. They break blocking and even Elixir S. DK if its a bug or working as intended but its incredibly strong.

Durzlla.6295:

I have no idea what you’re yammering about, rangers are as good as, if not better than, they were before the patch.

The issue is not about being good or not. It’s about not being on par with other classes that are more good aka better than us.

“In this world there are people who are equal, more equal and equal the most.”

Rangers are fine. But not fine enough – is the deal. I hope Druid brings some stuff to the table.

From a dungeon perspective I think we’re doing fine. Really enjoying the new Zephyr’s speed.

Wow really? The pets did not receive the base 150 stats?

Just wow…

J Eberle.9312:

From a dungeon perspective I think we’re doing fine. Really enjoying the new Zephyr’s speed.

From a dungeon perspective I find rangers as fine as before. Much better to be honest. And we finally have rotations so it’s not boring anymore.
But as long as Icebows keep their cheesy “press #4 to win the dungeon” mechanic, things won’t change.

People should start looking at the real problems in PvE – and that’s Elementalists’ single conjure weapon that pushes everyone out of meta. Without them – so many possibilities for various classes would appear. But currently that’s not possible because every record run is based on 2-3 eles.

Chokolata.1870:

Wow really? The pets did not receive the base 150 stats?

Just wow…

Bugs be plentiful, man. At least Rangers don’t have as many bugs as Engineers, granted, we don’t have bugs that work to our advantage (looking at you Grenadier).

I highly doubt that druid will be able to save rangers.

every single class forum right now has posts about how this patch ruined their class. every single one. so that must mean all classes are terrible and are therefor balanced.

Doug.9628:

every single class forum right now has posts about how this patch ruined their class. every single one. so that must mean all classes are terrible and are therefor balanced.

except for mesmers, they’r to busy deflecting all the community flame. Good thing they all moved on from LB rangers.

niconori.7235:

I highly doubt that druid will be able to save rangers.

Well, if they did it properly, it could cover everything that the Ranger is lacking for group play, which would indeed save Ranger and get it a place in the Meta.

Tragic Positive.9356:

J Eberle.9312:

From a dungeon perspective I think we’re doing fine. Really enjoying the new Zephyr’s speed.

From a dungeon perspective I find rangers as fine as before. Much better to be honest. And we finally have rotations so it’s not boring anymore.
But as long as Icebows keep their cheesy “press #4 to win the dungeon” mechanic, things won’t change.

People should start looking at the real problems in PvE – and that’s Elementalists’ single conjure weapon that pushes everyone out of meta. Without them – so many possibilities for various classes would appear. But currently that’s not possible because every record run is based on 2-3 eles.

imo, Frost Bow should be nerfed so as to not be able to critically hit, unless a nerf of that calibre happens, it will always be the Meta, sadly.

LughLongArm.5460:

Doug.9628:

every single class forum right now has posts about how this patch ruined their class. every single one. so that must mean all classes are terrible and are therefor balanced.

except for mesmers, they’r to busy deflecting all the community flame. Good thing they all moved on from LB rangers.

You must mean REFLECTING, hahahahah….no?

But I totally agree with OP here. We need some love. I feel like Anet has no direction for the Ranger, no end goal. I see us as slightly faster, less tanky warriors, but slower, more tanky thieves. We’re that middle ground, well I think we’re supposed to be. I don’t even know anymore.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

imo, Frost Bow should be nerfed so as to not be able to critically hit, unless a nerf of that calibre happens, it will always be the Meta, sadly.

No… As much as I don’t necessarily like other classes being squeezed out due to a single class’s utility, that kind of nerf is unwarranted – ever.

What are these necro changes you’re talking about? They got a decent buff in blood magic but they took quite a few nerfs, like their only viable heal stacking vulnerability on them. Reaper looks like it will be terrible for pvp/WvW. It turns DS1, their main source of damage, into a melee skill. Ranged players are going to be able to kite them even more now.

Wondrouswall.7169:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

imo, Frost Bow should be nerfed so as to not be able to critically hit, unless a nerf of that calibre happens, it will always be the Meta, sadly.

No… As much as I don’t necessarily like other classes being squeezed out due to a single class’s utility, that kind of nerf is unwarranted – ever.

What do you suggest then? Frost bow on a zerk ele will damage Lupi for over 6k per hit and hits 24 times in just a few seconds. That is like hitting with Maul 15 times. Unless that damage is reduced by at least half, Frost Bow will always be the Meta. In order to reduce it enough you can either reduce the base damage, or just make it unable to crit, which would also reduce the zerk meta.

@Op I completely agree with you that we did not get buffed as much as other classes however, we got a lot last patch. Just to list some of the things:

• We got interesting choices to make and skill rotations with quick draw, You can double maul to take a target down or swoop to close the gap.
• With quickdraw and remorseless we have some of the quickest burst in the game.
• We got permanent furry up time between red moa and warhorn.
• A boost in pet stats, 150 base added on, + 150 more for going down beast mastery, then ferocity. literally pets do more damage the avg pug in a group.
• We got quick swap on pets, additional damage modifiers. Additionally we got the choice of quickness or taunt depending on how we choose to use those pets.
• Spirits don’t require upgrading to get good use out of them.
• Remorseless mechanic that allows for a damage boost as well as a guaranteed crit.
• tones of condi clear with wilderness knowledge. The ability to proc the above mechanic and reduced cool downs on some of our corner stone skills
• with the two above you can guarantee that your big skills crit; be it maul, path of scars or rapid fire, and have a 25% increase in damage.
• you can effectively remove about 40% crit chance from your build(if you were maxed at 100%), as you can keep that up with spotter, moa, and hunters tactics.
• the list goes on…

We didn’t get nerfed. We got lots of buffs. Were they the buffs that we needed to be a TOP tier class in every game mode? No. However, were still pretty useful. I think you like many people jumping the gun, saying were useless when a lot of people are still adapting to the change and trying new things and don’t even have the builds or the play style figured out.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

What do you suggest then? Frost bow on a zerk ele will damage Lupi for over 6k per hit and hits 24 times in just a few seconds. That is like hitting with Maul 15 times. Unless that damage is reduced by at least half, Frost Bow will always be the Meta. In order to reduce it enough you can either reduce the base damage, or just make it unable to crit, which would also reduce the zerk meta.

A damage reduction is fine, but even then, people would still take another staff Ele for Meteor Shower. Ice Bow would still be used to CC a boss for 5 seconds, or in the future, break the defiance bar faster.

I would rather some of our own utilities be reworked so Rangers can have a spot providing something unique to the party besides an increase in critical chance and RNG damage with mediocre boons.

Yes, Frost Bow is powerful, but that never stopped Thieves, Guardians, Warriors, and Mesmers from being accepted into the meta since they are able provide something that no other class can and do it exceedingly well.

Look past the damage, mate. Asking for straight up nerfs does not accomplish much.

I always look at the whole picture, but in this case, nothing will change unless Frost Bow does, it is just far too powerful. Damage is the only thing that matters in the pve meta. If you do enough damage, you don’t need anything else.

I’d love to see everything re-worked so we had a real in-demand mechanic for things, but unless we also bring at least the same DPS as a thief/guard/war there is no point even thinking about it.

My point is that FB is so OP that if you bring enough of them, you don’t need to bring anything else. Why would you bring a Ranger for anything if you can just have an extra FB that does 15 mauls in 3s? Nothing can compare to that.

That’s not the whole picture. Even if they nerfed Frost Bow into the ground, nothing changes. We stack up staff eles and burst stuff down some more. As for DPS comparison vs Thieves, Guards, and Warriors – that’s an awful point to bring up. Even if all 4 of those classes were on par with each other, Rangers bring DPS and only DPS.

Providing and sustaining max Might stacks? Group Aegis and Stability? Stealth? Reliable projectile blocks/reflects chaining? Nope. Any change would be negligible because we don’t have anything unique to offer besides DPS. Again, look past the damage.

I personally love seeing record runs and kills, with or without a Ranger, but in terms of party composition, the class needs to offer something stronger and unique besides Frost Spotter.

Yes, and as well as that they need the DPS to compete. But it literally does not matter what mechanic is added to Ranger because of Frost Bow it will still not take a place from an additional FB.

Susulemon.3204:

beast mastery makes pet worse?

Nah. don’t worry. I still enjoy how much my pet can survive. I rock BM, WS, and marks (LB+GS). It doesn’t speak to the most common builds BUT i’m more into playing how I want to play.
I have fun with how quickly I can burn down mobs within seconds and my pet(s) can survive more than ever before.

In closer quarters I’d likely switch the traits and use SB+axe/warhorn

Well, they could always turn Barrage to work like Ice Storm, but then that would be strong in its own right. Anyway, at least it is currently fine to have 1 Ranger in a group and I’m okay with that.

Wondrouswall.7169:

Yes, Frost Bow is powerful, but that never stopped Thieves, Guardians, Warriors, and Mesmers from being accepted into the meta since they are able provide something that no other class can and do it exceedingly well.

Look past the damage, mate. Asking for straight up nerfs does not accomplish much.

It does.
Thieves were accepted for stealth and skipping
Guardians for fine DPS but huge AoE damage mitigation or recovery
Warriors for banners = DPS boost.

Rangers bring 15% unique DPS boost via Frost Spotter – which can as well be meta. Also be noted that we have lots of % dmg boosters and Signet of the Wild for +25% damage which can be applied to Frost Bow.
That means we just as well be meta. But we aren’t. Because without the Icebow – everyone sucks. Everyone in the meta is just supporting the Icebow. That’s just a sad fact that we can’ get through, and we can just thank A-net for buffing Icebow further.

If Icebow gets nerfed to normal numbers that make sense instead of AoE instakilling machine – we wouldn’t need 5 people in the party holding Icebows in their hands.
I haven’t been able to understand how people are okay with this – and no one really cared. Everyone was fine with it and everyone is fine with it even now. If the thing that has dominated PvE gets nerfed to match everyone else in PvE content – even our unique 15% DPS boost would become meta.

I’m with you, but I don’t think this is anything new. I’ve been ranting and raving to everyone on this board for years about how ranger is the forgotten class in this game. Ive been calling the ranger a druid forever because the pet is so awful and we just have spirits and a bow, bow there’s a druid spec so I don’t even know what to call it anymore. The ranger works, but is clunky and strange. It’d basically the same as it was after launch, warrior lite. Until the pet is unique and great enough that people pick the class because of how awesome the pet is, ranger will always be warrior lite. This is the only game/mmo where ranger isnt my main or atleast top three.

Tragic Positive.9356:

It does.

-snip-

Again, no, it doesn’t. So, Rangers become more acceptable? Great small change there. Utility-wise? We’re still the same as before. Nerfing Frost Bow won’t change much – Rangers will still be a Ranger.

Give the class a unique support, buff, or boon that can fit into both old and new PVE content – now we’re talking.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

niconori.7235:

I highly doubt that druid will be able to save rangers.

Well, if they did it properly, it could cover everything that the Ranger is lacking for group play, which would indeed save Ranger and get it a place in the Meta.

I think ranger lacks too much be it dps-wise or group support, and the overall design of the class shackled to a dysfunctional mechanic.. takes too much to fix.

Wondrouswall.7169:

Tragic Positive.9356:

It does.

-snip-

Again, no, it doesn’t. So, Rangers become more acceptable? Great small change there. Utility-wise? We’re still the same as before. Nerfing Frost Bow won’t change much – Rangers will still be a Ranger.

Give the class a unique support, buff, or boon that can fit into both old and new PVE content – now we’re talking.

You need both. Without nerfing Frostbow, our mechanic wouldn’t matter anyway, so we need something extra over Frost Spotter and also a nerf to frost bow, then we can be in a good place.

niconori.7235:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

niconori.7235:

I highly doubt that druid will be able to save rangers.

Well, if they did it properly, it could cover everything that the Ranger is lacking for group play, which would indeed save Ranger and get it a place in the Meta.

I think ranger lacks too much be it dps-wise or group support, and the overall design of the class shackled to a dysfunctional mechanic.. takes too much to fix.

It wouldn’t take much to fix, really, if you think about it.

And with the recent nerf to Ranger’s damage modifiers, Ranger has just been downgraded from crap tier to utter garbage tier when it comes to wvw zerging.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

niconori.7235:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

niconori.7235:

I highly doubt that druid will be able to save rangers.

Well, if they did it properly, it could cover everything that the Ranger is lacking for group play, which would indeed save Ranger and get it a place in the Meta.

I think ranger lacks too much be it dps-wise or group support, and the overall design of the class shackled to a dysfunctional mechanic.. takes too much to fix.

It wouldn’t take much to fix, really, if you think about it.

I hope so

Wondrouswall.7169:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

niconori.7235:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

niconori.7235:

I highly doubt that druid will be able to save rangers.

Well, if they did it properly, it could cover everything that the Ranger is lacking for group play, which would indeed save Ranger and get it a place in the Meta.

I think ranger lacks too much be it dps-wise or group support, and the overall design of the class shackled to a dysfunctional mechanic.. takes too much to fix.

It wouldn’t take much to fix, really, if you think about it.

The main issue with that is an Elite Spec should not be the fix of a class. The core needs to be addressed first and foremost.

I didn’t say Druid was the answer.

We just need more party support options, we have plenty of mediocre GM traits that could be re-worked to do this.

Yeah, I replied to the wrong quote. My bad lol

So I’m wondering, as a regular pvE person since prophecies, (hardly ever in the pvp) are most of the ranger complaints in regards to the pvP?

I mean, it sounds like a lot of people want any class to be optimal in EVERY scenario, whether it be pvp/pve, solo/group, tank/dps, aoe/single. I say, if you want to play a character that can literally do it all, maybe you should try elder scrolls online (ESO) if you haven’t already. ESO is also f2p and has a lot to offer, imo, most mmo lovers.
Personally, I enjoy some level of cookie-cutter. For me, it provides a different experience each time I log in with a different class.

Is the ranger so bad right now that people are looking at it as useless??? (I say, hell no. Props to the ranger and their pet. pvE FTW lol)

In a PvE sense I’d say gameplay is without a doubt improved, but our net impact is debatable because for non-competitive play we experienced the same power creep everybody else did but competitively it’s measured relative to other classes.

You gotta’ bear in mind, competitive applications receive a disproportionate amount of conversation on forums that isn’t at all representative of the general population.

The problem with this whole update is, it is going to get stale really fast. They took out a lot of build options when they forced spec into three lines.

That is, I feel it is impossible to ever have more than one or two ‘good’ builds for any class with a system like this.

Relative to other classes, Ranger is about the weakest now, fortunately I spend almost as much time on my Ele. Ranger will never be fixed while ANet doesn’t bother to play it themselves.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Wondrouswall.7169:

Tragic Positive.9356:

It does.

-snip-

Again, no, it doesn’t. So, Rangers become more acceptable? Great small change there. Utility-wise? We’re still the same as before. Nerfing Frost Bow won’t change much – Rangers will still be a Ranger.

Give the class a unique support, buff, or boon that can fit into both old and new PVE content – now we’re talking.

You need both. Without nerfing Frostbow, our mechanic wouldn’t matter anyway, so we need something extra over Frost Spotter and also a nerf to frost bow, then we can be in a good place.

We bring perma AoE fury, over 15 stacks of vulnerability uptime, 2 unique buffs in terms of 15% dps increase and DPS that only got higher ever since we were able to out-DPS warriors and guardians before patch (I don’t want to jump to conclusions because I can’t say for sure if we do more DPS now, since I haven’t played Warrior or Guard, yet).

Do you really believe we “need” more? If I was to build a party without Icebow possibilities – I would definitely go for Warrior (banners), Ele (might), Ranger (unique 15% boost), Thief or Mesmer (skips / quickness).
As a matter of analytical and scientific results in terms of DPS and time economy. Not as a personal preference.

Tragic Positive.9356:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Wondrouswall.7169:

Tragic Positive.9356:

It does.

-snip-

Again, no, it doesn’t. So, Rangers become more acceptable? Great small change there. Utility-wise? We’re still the same as before. Nerfing Frost Bow won’t change much – Rangers will still be a Ranger.

Give the class a unique support, buff, or boon that can fit into both old and new PVE content – now we’re talking.

You need both. Without nerfing Frostbow, our mechanic wouldn’t matter anyway, so we need something extra over Frost Spotter and also a nerf to frost bow, then we can be in a good place.

We bring perma AoE fury, over 15 stacks of vulnerability uptime, 2 unique buffs in terms of 15% dps increase and DPS that only got higher ever since we were able to out-DPS warriors and guardians before patch (I don’t want to jump to conclusions because because I can’t say for sure if we do more DPS now, since I haven’t played Warrior or Guard, yet).

Do you really believe we “need” more? If I was to build a party without Icebow possibilities – I would definitely go for Warrior (banners), Ele (might), Ranger (unique 15% boost), Thief or Mesmer (skips / quickness).
As a matter of analytical and scientific results in terms of DPS and time economy. Not as a personal preference.

Warrior brings AoE perma-fury with less investment, while also giving out might. Engi can currently maintain 25 stacks of vuln by themselves while dealing more damage. Spotter isn’t amazing because a good number of builds are running with 100% crit chance anyways. We don’t bring anything unique to the table except a built in tank, which isn’t a necessity due to the DPS meta, and frost spirit, which isn’t super useful to begin with due to being completely stationary and killable.

There are many issues that are ailing PvE.

1) ICEBOW – As was with FGS before it, this is the biggest offender. Nothing will ever be better then 4x icebows on a large hitbox mob. Also 5 seconds of stun on a boss is irreplaceable on a boss.

2) Some classes have abundant damage modifiers while others do not. Take elementalist as an example.
They get 150 power while in fire, which they will be for most of the fight, 10% to burning foes and 10% while in fire. Other then using Ice bow, their strongest damage is casting 2 then auto attack while on staff in fire.
Then we have a 20% damage while the foe is under 50% HP, 20% on a stunned foe which it will be with Ice bow.
And then either 10% while over 90% hp while if you take water or the ferocity boost/2% per boon if you take arcana. This is extreme damage

Now these are only damage modifiers for a class which already has high base damage. As far as utilities go, ice bow, condi cleanse, and 3 on demand blast finishers. Glyph of storms permanent blind or 25 instant vulnerability stacks.

And you take two of those. Then you take the thief for the highest single target dps in the game and stealth and the guardian to reflect. Warrior for solid damage and unique buffs and PS.

It was very hard to justify taking anything other then this composition into dungeons before the patch, and now the difference between these 4 classes and the other 4 have just been highlighted even more.

I have played my Ranger for over 3000 hours, albeit i went AFK a lot. 1000s of fractals. I love the core changes even if some are bugged or not good enough. But as far as PvE goes, I am done for the time being. I have a fully decked out warrior and elementalist. I cannot justify taking a ranger into a dungeon anymore.

Harnel.6810:

Warrior brings AoE perma-fury with less investment, while also giving out might. Engi can currently maintain 25 stacks of vuln by themselves while dealing more damage. Spotter isn’t amazing because a good number of builds are running with 100% crit chance anyways. We don’t bring anything unique to the table except a built in tank, which isn’t a necessity due to the DPS meta, and frost spirit, which isn’t super useful to begin with due to being completely stationary and killable.

The spirit provides 15 seconds of the Buff after dying. If it dies – you are left without the buff for 5 seconds only. Which means you can kill it a few seconds before the target dies and you’ll have it at every encounter you need.

But I cannot deny that warriors are good with fury application, or that Spotter has a cap unlike Empowered Allies (which makes it less worthy in record runs).

But who knows, Druid is still unrevealed (we might get a buff through there), and Sinister Stats for the new maps would turn the tide towards rangers that are far superior in Condition competition (Sinister Already proves to have higher solo-DPS than a Zerk).
I do agree that we are not as OP as other classes, but in terms of arzenal of mechanics, Rangers have quite a bit of everything hand in hand with 2 unique buffs (that, yet again, have some flaws).

We are just simply not OP in a specific area like Warriors or Eles. That’s it.

Tragic Positive.9356:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Wondrouswall.7169:

Tragic Positive.9356:

It does.

-snip-

Again, no, it doesn’t. So, Rangers become more acceptable? Great small change there. Utility-wise? We’re still the same as before. Nerfing Frost Bow won’t change much – Rangers will still be a Ranger.

Give the class a unique support, buff, or boon that can fit into both old and new PVE content – now we’re talking.

You need both. Without nerfing Frostbow, our mechanic wouldn’t matter anyway, so we need something extra over Frost Spotter and also a nerf to frost bow, then we can be in a good place.

We bring perma AoE fury, over 15 stacks of vulnerability uptime, 2 unique buffs in terms of 15% dps increase and DPS that only got higher ever since we were able to out-DPS warriors and guardians before patch (I don’t want to jump to conclusions because I can’t say for sure if we do more DPS now, since I haven’t played Warrior or Guard, yet).

Do you really believe we “need” more? If I was to build a party without Icebow possibilities – I would definitely go for Warrior (banners), Ele (might), Ranger (unique 15% boost), Thief or Mesmer (skips / quickness).
As a matter of analytical and scientific results in terms of DPS and time economy. Not as a personal preference.

OK, I need to clarify this ice bow business. Are we referring to icebow as in the icebow conjured by an ele or is there some icebow skill I am unaware of within the ranger traits? Granted it has been several months since I’ve invested more than a boss here & there into GW2 and just last week reentered and revamped and adjusted each character’s skills.