Guild Wars 2

Why?! I don’t wanna hear anything about pets either, they so fast it’s not even funny, especially in team fights. Their bow power is better and so are their traps.

Let’s look at just the basic auto attack.

Puncture Shot: Fire an arrow which can bounce to the enemies behind your target. If an arrow hits a second target, all enemies struck are crippled. 317 damage +13% damage if range is greater than 600.

Vs.

Long range shot: Shoot your foe from long range. The farther the arrow flies, the more damage it does. 336 damage if distance is greater than 1000.

DH wins.

>The other skills are self explanatory, not to mention DH’s get an amazing F1 shot that does ridiculous damage.
>They get Piercing on some of their attacks without having to specialize in a garbage trait line.
>Knockback + 6s stability every 10s when an enemy gets close. DUBYA TEE EFF
>Passive cripple ability+10% damage to crippled enemies
>Traps are better and they don’t need to spec into some garbage line no one uses.

Like, what the hell? I feel like I’m taking crazy pills. Does anyone else feel this way?

I mean Piercing arrows and projectile speed should be a ranger perk of LB, not something we have to have in a trait line. Lead the Wind should reduce recharge time of skills and has a cripple effect added for better kiting.

As it stands right now, the DH can kite better, can trap better, and can shoot better.

People use the skirmishing line.

Can’t really say much to the rest. So maybe just roll dragon hunter? I know I’m considering it. I just don’t know if I’m rdy to give up hunters shot and ancestral grace yet.

So your argument isn’t that they are better rangers, just that you think their longbow skills are better. That’s a totally different argument.

bearshaman.3421:

So your argument isn’t that they are better rangers, just that you think their longbow skills are better. That’s a totally different argument.

Negative. Pretty clear I think they do almost everything better when it comes to pure archery and trapping. I don’t have one, I have zero issues killing them in places like wvw, but that’s only bc I know how to play and keep them at 14-1500 range and shut down their traps. Places like spvp they are ridic.

Furajir.3815:

bearshaman.3421:

So your argument isn’t that they are better rangers, just that you think their longbow skills are better. That’s a totally different argument.

Negative. Pretty clear I think they do almost everything better when it comes to pure archery and trapping. I don’t have one, I have zero issues killing them in places like wvw, but that’s only bc I know how to play and keep them at 14-1500 range and shut down their traps. Places like spvp they are ridic.

That’s still not the entirety of what a ranger is. In fact you can easily play a very good ranger and never touch longbow or traps.

I agree that our traps could use some rework. I don’t know that I would agree that their longbow is better, only different. I have a guardian and have tried out the longbow. Tbh, not a fan. (but then I honestly like DH the least of all the elite specs I’ve tried, which is all except for berserker and herald).

I understand what you are getting at. There are quite a few people who feel like rangers should have gotten the DH traitline, not guardians. I get that. They want to be the masters of the longbow. Most of the people who say that also don’t like druid, so it makes them even more upset that another class got the elite they wanted for ranger.

All I am saying is longbow and traps is not the entirety of ranger. Guardians//DH do not make better rangers. Better trappers? Yes, but then traps were never that good a mechanic in the game until DH regardless of profession. Better longbowman? Depends on how you measure things. If you want, I can try to go into specifics, but I will say generally that our longbow synergies with the rest of the class (skills, traits, etc) better than the DH longbow does. Is theirs good? Sure. Is it the best for us with everything else we have? I don’t think so.

Edit: stupid kitten filter getting mixed up. Fixed now.

I’ve played my ranger as melee regen since inception, sw/torc and axe/dagger. But I’m experimenting with staff/lb. It just feels a tad out of place. I feel a ranger should be a master kiter, making use of traps, immobs, cripples etc.

DH is complete crap in PvP in my opinion, and beyond useless in WvW roaming. As far as I know they aren’t really used in PvE either, but I’m not into that scene much anymore.

Furajir.3815:

I feel a ranger should be a master kiter, making use of traps, immobs, cripples etc.

We are.

Well the 5 skill lets you cripple a whole group of things, and our longbow is one of only 2 1500 range weapons in the game, which is great for kiting. In fact you could technically kite a DH and never get hit but be able to hit them.

Traps imo need to be bigger. Larger radius.

But as far as their traps being better, that’s gonna happen. It’s an elite spec. Chrono has better wells than Necro. Tempest and Reaper shouts are amazing. That’s more to do with it being an elite than anything else.

Personally I think this says everything you need to know about Ranger vs Dragonhunter and Anets attitude to them

Rangers: Traps are a bit weak and could use some more utility
Anet: Ok we have added a knockdown to spike trap and greatly increased its cd

Dragonhunters in beta: Traps are a bit weak and could use some more utility
Anet: Ok we have given fragments of faith a stun break, increased the damage of some of them, each trap now gives boons when activated and the cd reduction trait now makes every trap daze the enemy.

Levetty.1279:

Personally I think this says everything you need to know about Ranger vs Dragonhunter and Anets attitude to them

Rangers: Traps are a bit weak and could use some more utility
Anet: Ok we have added a knockdown to spike trap and greatly increased its cd

Dragonhunters in beta: Traps are a bit weak and could use some more utility
Anet: Ok we have given fragments of faith a stun break, increased the damage of some of them, each trap now gives boons when activated and the cd reduction trait now makes every trap daze the enemy.

And again, this is a false comparison. You can’t compare elite specs to core professions. They were not meant to be on the same power scale.

bearshaman.3421:

Levetty.1279:

Personally I think this says everything you need to know about Ranger vs Dragonhunter and Anets attitude to them

Rangers: Traps are a bit weak and could use some more utility
Anet: Ok we have added a knockdown to spike trap and greatly increased its cd

Dragonhunters in beta: Traps are a bit weak and could use some more utility
Anet: Ok we have given fragments of faith a stun break, increased the damage of some of them, each trap now gives boons when activated and the cd reduction trait now makes every trap daze the enemy.

And again, this is a false comparison. You can’t compare elite specs to core professions. They were not meant to be on the same power scale.

Actually they actually claimed elites were meant to be sidegrades not upgrades but then just buffed everything up in the betas to where they were mandatory to get people to buy the expansion.

Except druid because the druids role was to get WoW players to look at GW2.

Druid is pretty much a part of every build now, just like the others. Raids were the lure for WoW players.

Furajir.3815:

I’ve played my ranger as melee regen since inception, sw/torc and axe/dagger. But I’m experimenting with staff/lb. It just feels a tad out of place. I feel a ranger should be a master kiter, making use of traps, immobs, cripples etc.

We’re amazing kiters. What are you talking about? Kiting is vital to good ranger gameplay. Because you know…RANGE-r.

Furajir.3815:

I’ve played my ranger as melee regen since inception, sw/torc and axe/dagger. But I’m experimenting with staff/lb. It just feels a tad out of place. I feel a ranger should be a master kiter, making use of traps, immobs, cripples etc.

Played properly, you can kite extremely well with Ranger even without longbow…

I used to play a full trapper, Sw/T A/D, then moved to Survival, Sw/D SB, then moved to what I’m at now Staff/Longbow. I’ve tried many other builds as well those were just the 3 I played the most of. And I can tell you from personal experience, if you’re not spammy and you actually know what you’re fighting/how to fight it, people should hardly get near you for more than a second with a few exceptions like Thief.

With my set up right now using Staff and Longbow, I can’t tell you how frustrating it must feel for some people to never be able to touch me. I used to hate longbow personally but I’ve come to like it recently just because it’s fun to constantly keep people on a leash. The only things that ever get close to me are Thieves, Ele’s and good Warriors. Otherwise I can keep everything at a comfortable range and if I can’t, I can quite easily slip away from them. With 16k health and 0 armor or blocks, I feel totally content being absolute glass because I know unless I’m careless, I should be able to start and finish the majority of my fights without ever going below 50% health.

I agree that Dragonhunter feels superior sometimes to be honest but for different reasons. They have a heap of blocks and health recovery, conditions do nothing to them and their bow has a lot more beefy damage than our dinky pew pew’s do. Still, I don’t think they’re better than us, just maybe in certain areas they’ve got an upper hand, mostly with all the block/reflect spam.

Because they have reliable burst and CC.
And that CC ignores blocks, evades and stuff.

You know, something that they took away from our taunt.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

Furajir.3815:

I’ve played my ranger as melee regen since inception, sw/torc and axe/dagger. But I’m experimenting with staff/lb. It just feels a tad out of place. I feel a ranger should be a master kiter, making use of traps, immobs, cripples etc.

Played properly, you can kite extremely well with Ranger even without longbow…

I used to play a full trapper, Sw/T A/D, then moved to Survival, Sw/D SB, then moved to what I’m at now Staff/Longbow. I’ve tried many other builds as well those were just the 3 I played the most of. And I can tell you from personal experience, if you’re not spammy and you actually know what you’re fighting/how to fight it, people should hardly get near you for more than a second with a few exceptions like Thief.

With my set up right now using Staff and Longbow, I can’t tell you how frustrating it must feel for some people to never be able to touch me. I used to hate longbow personally but I’ve come to like it recently just because it’s fun to constantly keep people on a leash. The only things that ever get close to me are Thieves, Ele’s and good Warriors. Otherwise I can keep everything at a comfortable range and if I can’t, I can quite easily slip away from them. With 16k health and 0 armor or blocks, I feel totally content being absolute glass because I know unless I’m careless, I should be able to start and finish the majority of my fights without ever going below 50% health.

This sounds pretty awesome. Since I’m very new to the class, would you mind posting a sample build for this kind of play?

if you have 5 dragon hunter team in pvp its a sure win , after 1 cap
they set up traps , no one will live with 20 traps set on cap ground lol

just have to say it since no one seems to do so DH 1200 with fall of about 1350 range while ranger 1500 with fall of about 1800 range also we have increased velocity have you even fought a DH at long range there is an easy counter simply side strafe and they can barely hit you pop swiftness and they cant

Imo the only change they should do to Longbow is make the peircing arrows baseline since now to make lb viable as a range weapon you pretty much need it IMO atleast

also they do hit harder and so on but theyre LB is more for hard hitting while ranger lb is for more hits just look at the number 2 skills just look at the number 2 skills rapid fire vs true shot
personaly I still think Ranger is the better one on LB BUT that is with Lead the Wind since if you fight multiple enemies like lets say a team fight if you only hit one you cant do any realy dmg but if you line up the shoots and hit 2-3 enemies then you start getting somewhere also thanks to the long range its an excellent way to finnish someone of

Keviin Snow.5760:

if you have 5 dragon hunter team in pvp its a sure win , after 1 cap
they set up traps , no one will live with 20 traps set on cap ground lol

SoS, asctral grace or just dodge backwards when you se the daze hit you since it for some reason hits about 1 sec before the traps activate there you have 3 ways to counter the first set of traps also the simplest way stay range I atleast have yet to loose a range fight with a DH
while they do a lot of dmg the can be countered since they are mostly droped on certain locations so just avoid those

No offence but Id argue that ppl lose against DH is simple because they have nothing to counter burst builds I always have one invaun equiped in pvp or wvw

but the easiest counter vs a 5 man dh team charge in before your team does pop that invaun and spring ALL the trapsyou might die or take a lot of dmg but the will go down pretty fast thats why you dont se that many dh in pvp anymore

bearshaman.3421:

Druid is pretty much a part of every build now, just like the others. Raids were the lure for WoW players.

And they needed to shoehorn tanks and healers into the game (directly going against what they sold the game as) to make raids appeal to wow kids. Rangers got shafted by having a completly diferent poorly made class bolted onto them.

All saying ‘druid is a part of every build’ proves is how much rangers got shafted because they can’t even be rangers anymore.

MSFone.3026:

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

Furajir.3815:

I’ve played my ranger as melee regen since inception, sw/torc and axe/dagger. But I’m experimenting with staff/lb. It just feels a tad out of place. I feel a ranger should be a master kiter, making use of traps, immobs, cripples etc.

Played properly, you can kite extremely well with Ranger even without longbow…

I used to play a full trapper, Sw/T A/D, then moved to Survival, Sw/D SB, then moved to what I’m at now Staff/Longbow. I’ve tried many other builds as well those were just the 3 I played the most of. And I can tell you from personal experience, if you’re not spammy and you actually know what you’re fighting/how to fight it, people should hardly get near you for more than a second with a few exceptions like Thief.

With my set up right now using Staff and Longbow, I can’t tell you how frustrating it must feel for some people to never be able to touch me. I used to hate longbow personally but I’ve come to like it recently just because it’s fun to constantly keep people on a leash. The only things that ever get close to me are Thieves, Ele’s and good Warriors. Otherwise I can keep everything at a comfortable range and if I can’t, I can quite easily slip away from them. With 16k health and 0 armor or blocks, I feel totally content being absolute glass because I know unless I’m careless, I should be able to start and finish the majority of my fights without ever going below 50% health.

This sounds pretty awesome. Since I’m very new to the class, would you mind posting a sample build for this kind of play?

This is my current build.

97% critical chance with Fury, a little over 300 healing power while in staff, 4 ways to access immobilize to maximize kiting potential and lowered cooldown on staff for higher mobility uptime with Ancestral Grace.

Since most times people won’t get close enough to touch me, I rarely have to worry about conditions. Druidic Clarity is great and all but honestly with 4 Survival utilities I have plenty of condition removal and if I get nuked I wasn’t playing properly anyway.

As I’d said, the only things that manage to get close to me the majority of the time are Thieves, Ele’s and decent Warriors. But Warrior’s are extremely easy to kite if they’re full melee, often not getting close even once and Thieves I can 100 – 0 if I manage to negate their Backstab opener with a Hunter’s Shot then Point Blank Shot → Quickening Zephyr → Rapid Fire.

It takes a bit of patience to learn when you’ll need to swap to staff to go on the defensive, kiting away and regaining health, but generally it’s an easy build and difficult for people to pin down.

Also PS, keep in mind this is a personalized build so if you’re wanting to use it you might want to change some things around. Like foods, sigils, utility, etc. I’ve just found this the most comfortable to use.

Levetty.1279:

bearshaman.3421:

Druid is pretty much a part of every build now, just like the others. Raids were the lure for WoW players.

And they needed to shoehorn tanks and healers into the game (directly going against what they sold the game as) to make raids appeal to wow kids. Rangers got shafted by having a completly diferent poorly made class bolted onto them.

All saying ‘druid is a part of every build’ proves is how much rangers got shafted because they can’t even be rangers anymore.

I disagree. Raids was the thing they swore they would never do, and did to appeal to those kids. Druid has nothing to do with that.

While alot of people feel like druid forces you to play a healer, that’s simply not the case. Druid makes berserker builds more powerful (glyph of empowerment and GotL giving a combined 25% increase to damage), and give condi builds another way to quick stack bleeds. Most of the builds for druid don’t even use gear with healing power on it, or bother with the staff. On top of that, nature magic is already one of our traitlines, so druid is a natural outgrowth from that thematically. Just because it’s something that you may not use on your ranger doesn’t mean it’s not ranger.

Yes, I get you don’t like druid, and you (probably, I’m assuming) wanted a longbow elite spec of some kind, but LB does not define the entire profession, and there will be more elites as the game progresses.

In WvW at least, when I run into a dragon hunter I usually own him. They seem to rely too much on their powerful traps. I usually just get aggressive with them and they go down fast. I run LB/Axe/Torch.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

MSFone.3026:

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

Furajir.3815:

I’ve played my ranger as melee regen since inception, sw/torc and axe/dagger. But I’m experimenting with staff/lb. It just feels a tad out of place. I feel a ranger should be a master kiter, making use of traps, immobs, cripples etc.

Played properly, you can kite extremely well with Ranger even without longbow…

I used to play a full trapper, Sw/T A/D, then moved to Survival, Sw/D SB, then moved to what I’m at now Staff/Longbow. I’ve tried many other builds as well those were just the 3 I played the most of. And I can tell you from personal experience, if you’re not spammy and you actually know what you’re fighting/how to fight it, people should hardly get near you for more than a second with a few exceptions like Thief.

With my set up right now using Staff and Longbow, I can’t tell you how frustrating it must feel for some people to never be able to touch me. I used to hate longbow personally but I’ve come to like it recently just because it’s fun to constantly keep people on a leash. The only things that ever get close to me are Thieves, Ele’s and good Warriors. Otherwise I can keep everything at a comfortable range and if I can’t, I can quite easily slip away from them. With 16k health and 0 armor or blocks, I feel totally content being absolute glass because I know unless I’m careless, I should be able to start and finish the majority of my fights without ever going below 50% health.

This sounds pretty awesome. Since I’m very new to the class, would you mind posting a sample build for this kind of play?

This is my current build.

97% critical chance with Fury, a little over 300 healing power while in staff, 4 ways to access immobilize to maximize kiting potential and lowered cooldown on staff for higher mobility uptime with Ancestral Grace.

Since most times people won’t get close enough to touch me, I rarely have to worry about conditions. Druidic Clarity is great and all but honestly with 4 Survival utilities I have plenty of condition removal and if I get nuked I wasn’t playing properly anyway.

As I’d said, the only things that manage to get close to me the majority of the time are Thieves, Ele’s and decent Warriors. But Warrior’s are extremely easy to kite if they’re full melee, often not getting close even once and Thieves I can 100 – 0 if I manage to negate their Backstab opener with a Hunter’s Shot then Point Blank Shot -> Quickening Zephyr -> Rapid Fire.

It takes a bit of patience to learn when you’ll need to swap to staff to go on the defensive, kiting away and regaining health, but generally it’s an easy build and difficult for people to pin down.

Also PS, keep in mind this is a personalized build so if you’re wanting to use it you might want to change some things around. Like foods, sigils, utility, etc. I’ve just found this the most comfortable to use.

Thanks! Looks cool, definitely something I’m going to explore.

I don’t know if the OP is just a kitten starter, woke up on the wrong side of the bed, trolling, or playing a totally different class. I don’t want to say it is a L2P issue, but really.

There really is no way to say any one class is better than the other, it is just a matter of opinion. Personally, I don’t see the DH has being any better than my Ranger/Druid. I have both, play both regularly, and found myself on my Ranger pre HoT more and post HoT is Druid.

Simply put. If I’m in a DPS mood in WvW I’ll hop on the DH. However, when I’m in the built for comfort mood, which is 99% of my play style, then I’ll hop on my Druid. Druid, in my opinion, is in another league when it comes to survival in WvW. The primary meta I play.

Doesn’t mean DH’s are not good. Just a personal choice. Note how I didn’t say sPvP or PvE. PvE it doesn’t matter. Roll glass, kill stuff, stuff dies, no big deal. SPvP, player skill ends up winning outside the broken classes we all know about. Some classes just have a harder time and at the end of the day, unless you are playing with the same team, a lot of if comes down to just dumb luck…

Keviin Snow.5760:

if you have 5 dragon hunter team in pvp its a sure win , after 1 cap
they set up traps , no one will live with 20 traps set on cap ground lol

Mesmer GS#2 will spawn clones at target. It’s a 5 second cooldown when traited, even faster under alacrity. Yeah, 20 traps all useless thanks to 1 clone.

Crapgame.6519:

I don’t know if the OP is just a kitten starter, woke up on the wrong side of the bed, trolling, or playing a totally different class. I don’t want to say it is a L2P issue, but really.

There really is no way to say any one class is better than the other, it is just a matter of opinion. Personally, I don’t see the DH has being any better than my Ranger/Druid. I have both, play both regularly, and found myself on my Ranger pre HoT more and post HoT is Druid.

Simply put. If I’m in a DPS mood in WvW I’ll hop on the DH. However, when I’m in the built for comfort mood, which is 99% of my play style, then I’ll hop on my Druid. Druid, in my opinion, is in another league when it comes to survival in WvW. The primary meta I play.

Doesn’t mean DH’s are not good. Just a personal choice. Note how I didn’t say sPvP or PvE. PvE it doesn’t matter. Roll glass, kill stuff, stuff dies, no big deal. SPvP, player skill ends up winning outside the broken classes we all know about. Some classes just have a harder time and at the end of the day, unless you are playing with the same team, a lot of if comes down to just dumb luck…

You need to learn to read. I stated that in wvw i can ill anything on druid, I can stay at 1k+ range all day. Spvp is what im referring to.

bearshaman.3421:

Yes, I get you don’t like druid, and you (probably, I’m assuming) wanted a longbow elite spec of some kind, but LB does not define the entire profession, and there will be more elites as the game progresses.

Don’t just pull kitten out of your kitten . I wanted an elite spec similar to other classes. Can be useful with multiple builds, synergises with our base class and actaully provides a fun new way to play the class. I was happy when staff was revealed and it was obviously going to be a more magic themed spec.

What I didn’t want was a 1 note braindead heal spam spec with no synergy with Ranger, a broken new mechanic that ads a skill bar that has 3 absolute useless skills, a weapon with only 1 good skill, a new set utilities which somehow managed to be even worse then Ranger shouts were when the game first launched and complete tunnel focus on raids to the exclusion of everything else.

Yes Druid was made a healer to attract people to raids, just watch the reveal again where he announces its a healer and spends the rest of the reveal patting himself on the back because ‘Raids need healers so Ranger is meta now because raids need healers and druid is a healer thus ranger is meta because I said so’.

bearshaman.3421:

Druid makes berserker builds more powerful (glyph of empowerment and GotL giving a combined 25% increase to damage)

Blatently false. It makes Raid druids more appealing to the team (and gotl is part of the reason why the healing is so boring and why glyphs make no sense at all) but for a Berserker ranger in any other mode they range from terrible to giving up too much to take them.

Yes, we all knew Rangers lack any reliable burst.
But I got the chance to win the game through tactics and real-time strategy. I’m not any tournament player anymore.

If you want to play something bursty – roll DH. I just want my Ranger to be reliable, not “stronger”.

Levetty.1279:

Don’t just pull kitten out of your kitten . I wanted an elite spec similar to other classes. Can be useful with multiple builds, synergises with our base class and actaully provides a fun new way to play the class. I was happy when staff was revealed and it was obviously going to be a more magic themed spec.

What I didn’t want was a 1 note braindead heal spam spec with no synergy with Ranger, a broken new mechanic that ads a skill bar that has 3 absolute useless skills, a weapon with only 1 good skill, a new set utilities which somehow managed to be even worse then Ranger shouts were when the game first launched and complete tunnel focus on raids to the exclusion of everything else.

Well I’m sorry I’ve been able to figure out how to use the Druid skills for more than just being a healbot.

[/quote]Yes Druid was made a healer to attract people to raids, just watch the reveal again where he announces its a healer and spends the rest of the reveal patting himself on the back because ‘Raids need healers so Ranger is meta now because raids need healers and druid is a healer thus ranger is meta because I said so’.

bearshaman.3421:

I won’t entirely disagree with you on this point. As I said, they made raids to attract WoW people, and so yeah druid happens to be good at healing. But it’s good for a lot of other things, and the other classes already had some significant healing abilities (blood magic for necros, and water attunement for eles and tempests, and healing turret for engis to name three). So what if we got a more useful group healing ability that a lot of other classes already had?

bearshaman.3421:

Druid makes berserker builds more powerful (glyph of empowerment and GotL giving a combined 25% increase to damage)

Blatently false. It makes Raid druids more appealing to the team (and gotl is part of the reason why the healing is so boring and why glyphs make no sense at all) but for a Berserker ranger in any other mode they range from terrible to giving up too much to take them.

I gave up nothing to take druid (I’ve been using it for fractals, I don’t do raids), and gained alot. Have you even tried that combo in a group? I can visibly see a huge difference in how quick a boss’ health bar is being taken down when I pop GoE and use CA 4 with GotL.

Honestly, now that I rethink some of the things you said, it sounds like you don’t like the fact that the druid tends to shine most in a group, and not as much solo. If that’s your issue, then sure, its not really designed for solo work. But to say it’s nothing more than healspam is to really not see all the other possibilities with it.

Me: glyph of empowerment and GotL make your wanted more in a group
You: Thats not true, they make me wanted more in a group

That’s a thing that just happened.

Levetty.1279:

Me: glyph of empowerment and GotL make your wanted more in a group
You: Thats not true, they make me wanted more in a group

That’s a thing that just happened.

Way to change the conversation to make yourself look better. You were ranting about druids in raids, I point out that they are useful in other forms of group content. You rant about them being only good at healing, I point out that they offer a lot more than that and cited examples.

What you also didn’t do? Analyze your own feelings about it to figure out that what you wanted something that was more of a solo build. Instead you just blindly raged about them being healbots and about raids and about getting WoW players. I had to do that for you. You’re welcome.

I got blocked for a few days for telling tragic and fluffy to get a room in another thread so I will just say this,

Get a room.

Wait what? I don’t think TP and I have ever argued anything heatedly. I suppose both of us tend to write things too tersely, but we don’t attack each other personally. Anywho, moving on.

Lol don’t need one. Unless it’s a classroom. Used to be a teacher. Habits die hard.

In any case, I’m done. I don’t like repeating myself, especially in fruitless argument.

bearshaman.3421:

Way to change the conversation

Considering the conversation was orignally about how Anet handled the same problem with the same set of utilities on 2 different classes before you derailed because you were upset people weren’t blindly defending Anet.

Also nice insults because you can’t refute my points.

Well, not sure myself…
… I tend to put a pressure or stress on things I want to explain but I already did, but I thought nobody really took it personally since I believe none of us veterans use stress for offense or anything of that matter. Anyways, nice to have you back Justine.

I think it’s pretty much obvious that this now became a matter of people who are still upset about not getting stuff they wanted and people who already use the druid the way it works. There’s not really much to see anymore.

Furajir.3815:

You need to learn to read. I stated that in wvw i can ill anything on druid, I can stay at 1k+ range all day. Spvp is what im referring to.

Furajir, look, you may be a really swell person. Who knows, maybe we would even do lunch, adult beverage, cup of coffee, what have you. However, this isn’t a learn to read issue. I simply replied to your opening statement in which case you do not mention WvW let alone sPvP. I’ve placed it below for your to read. What you might have replied to others or since posted I cannot speak of since I don’t keep up…

You ever see the video It’s Not About The Nail? I sort of think that might be applicable here. You didn’t hear me…

Furajir.3815 said:
Why?! I don’t wanna hear anything about pets either, they so fast it’s not even funny, especially in team fights. Their bow power is better and so are their traps.

Let’s look at just the basic auto attack.

Puncture Shot: Fire an arrow which can bounce to the enemies behind your target. If an arrow hits a second target, all enemies struck are crippled. 317 damage +13% damage if range is greater than 600.

Vs.

Long range shot: Shoot your foe from long range. The farther the arrow flies, the more damage it does. 336 damage if distance is greater than 1000.

DH wins.

>The other skills are self explanatory, not to mention DH’s get an amazing F1 shot that does ridiculous damage.
>They get Piercing on some of their attacks without having to specialize in a garbage trait line.
>Knockback + 6s stability every 10s when an enemy gets close. DUBYA TEE EFF
>Passive cripple ability+10% damage to crippled enemies
>Traps are better and they don’t need to spec into some garbage line no one uses.

Like, what the hell? I feel like I’m taking crazy pills. Does anyone else feel this way?

I mean Piercing arrows and projectile speed should be a ranger perk of LB, not something we have to have in a trait line. Lead the Wind should reduce recharge time of skills and has a cripple effect added for better kiting.

As it stands right now, the DH can kite better, can trap better, and can shoot better.

you forgot rifle warrior and p/p thief.

The Ranger is dead its not really an option anymore. If you want to play that class you need to play druid.
I took the ranger class as a Pet range DPS and loved playing it. it is now a Support class at best or a healer. RIP Behrang (my ranger)

ya right , Druid is a option and if used correctly a core ranger can still work in teams and solo Que as long as people don’t Expect a druid to fit a Support role.

it is ironic people forget that druid Reduces the rangers Flexiablity , it can’t realy take traps or use Wilderness knowledge+remoresless as you’d not have enough defence or weapon cooldown reductions , and if you take wilderness knowledge it uses up 3/5 of the Utiltiy so going druid in the first place makes those traits into Celestial shadow or Natural stride removing the purpose of druid to focus on Attack traits in the druid line.

a SK/NM/WK ranger can still kick royal condi mesmer butt , don’t let the druid over shadow a core rangers potentional the druid may have more Fancy team support options but in a power speced build and you have other traits covering defence like Striders defence ect going druid is counter productive , it would be better to just use SK/NM/WK Saga amulet + sun spirit+LR+muddy terrain+troll ungent and Entangle .

more than enough condi clears and CC still combo that as a Quickdraw sword+torch/ Sword+axe you’ll have evades comming out of ya nose , a whirling finisher/ projectile protection , regen , vigour from traited spirits .

everything you need to beat a player and offer Vigour support+burns for the other condi spec classes on the team.

unlike other Specalisations druid does overshadow the core ranger the whole build / play style changes , other classes only have Additonal skills added in the form of F skills or things that don’t replace there survival utilties for example DH still have decent survival through the traps and damage due to Virtues while druid replaces some or most of the utiltiy bar with glyphs and replaces decent traits for team support options.

if the role in your team doesn’t require you to spec for team support , support in a different way like Natures vengence (vigour+burn+blind sunspirit that way)

has anyone seen how fast Shambling horrors die to a torch bonfire or a Whirling defence attack retail+burns are very nasty , the thing about retailiation its damage isn’t reduced as its not incomming damage , its self delt so it avoids the 50% damage reductions on any of these trait types , retaliation effectivly Negates the boon Regen.

to say Ranger is dead is a opinion and i’d rather not have Players in the ranger Community Put beginners off and not learn the core ranger mechanics , Druid is a powerful tool but it is also a easy way out of learning that any class can beat any class with the correct build and correct amount of skill.

so in the end DH’s are just different but no better than Rangers.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

to say Ranger is dead is a opinion and i’d rather not have Players in the ranger Community

Fortunately your are not in charge of people, so they don’t have to subscribe to your delusions.

Levetty.1279:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

to say Ranger is dead is a opinion and i’d rather not have Players in the ranger Community

Fortunately your are not in charge of people, so they don’t have to subscribe to your delusions.

deluded now whos putting words into peoples mouths , Telling people a class is dead is like killing someones hope as that new player tells other people spreading that crap around forums isn’ the answer to help people progress so who is Deluded certainly not me.

if people want help in pvp vs Dragons hunters or somehow think they are better need to focus on the weaknesses rather than the strenghts then they will start to see the differences but they can only do that with experience + practice , simply not playing ranger Because of a person implying " ranger is dead" isn’t a reason at all nor that comment does not help the ranger community at all , you wana help put some Tips into your comments and share some knowledge.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Levetty.1279:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

to say Ranger is dead is a opinion and i’d rather not have Players in the ranger Community

Fortunately your are not in charge of people, so they don’t have to subscribe to your delusions.

deluded now whos putting words into peoples mouths , Telling people a class is dead is like killing someones hope as that new player tells other people spreading that crap around forums isn’ the answer to help people progress so who is Deluded certainly not me.

if people want help in pvp vs Dragons hunters or somehow think they are better need to focus on the weaknesses rather than the strenghts then they will start to see the differences but they can only do that with experience + practice , simply not playing ranger Because of a person implying " ranger is dead" isn’t a reason at all nor that comment does not help the ranger community at all , you wana help put some Tips into your comments and share some knowledge.

Climbed up through Diamond in pvp league using pure vanilla ranger. And it’s not because I got lucky and got paired with a pro team or something, all solo queue. Some of the matches were literally 500-499.

When played right, it’s dangerous, just as any other class. It’s definitely not a keyboard smash class, very technical and tactical. Just a bit of random tips. Know all the characteristics of each weapon:

How the sword leaps on autoattack, master how to parkour with sword#2, turn corners with sword#3. Understand the cone of vision of the longbow, practice how to avoid WASD and stand completely still so your character rotates properly if the enemy is dancing around you.

Read enemy’s boons, especially stability, before you randomly spam bow#4 knockback on your bow. Know that you cannot invisible on bow#3 when you have a bow#5 barrage still raining down. Basically all bow skills needs some situation awareness before being used.

I think the best would be to have someone do some play-by-play commentary on their ranger during fights.

DH is better ranger because simply there is no pet that takes away 40% of our damage.
A pet that does not hit anything hat is affected by swiftness.

Ranger is now locked in druid spec, and in tank/healer druid if you go with staff.
But that’s not because the Druid is amazing, that is not, but because the Ranger class is still broken and buggy as hell.

When somebody in Aney open their bh and actually bring the ranger the same as any core class in game the Druid will be mostly as amazing as DH or Tempest.

Still the 2 seconds delay between you enter the CAF and you actually can cast any skill annoys me.
And the completely lack of damage from the staff. And the lack of range from the glyphs.
And the fact that you are locked in staff or shouts if you want to build AF.
And that enlargement trait destroy your caf.

But those are just merely annoyances compared to the absolutely game breaking bugs the ranger has and the lack of any actual choice and bad design.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

deluded now whos putting words into peoples mouths ,

Nobody, nobody is doing that.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Telling people a class is dead is like killing someones hope as that new player tells other people spreading that crap around forums isn’ the answer to help people progress so who is Deluded certainly not me.

You think pretending a classes problems don’t exist will somehow help the class. Delusions.

Levetty.1279:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

deluded now whos putting words into peoples mouths ,

Nobody, nobody is doing that.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Telling people a class is dead is like killing someones hope as that new player tells other people spreading that crap around forums isn’ the answer to help people progress so who is Deluded certainly not me.

You think pretending a classes problems don’t exist will somehow help the class. Delusions.

and not learning what the issues are by avoiding the class because " dead" is highly opinionated view so yes i am more correct than you are , if people don’t learn to play the class properly even if it does have issues " like every class does" if you don’t know where to look in the first place " the new players of ranger" will never learn what needs changing and then keep making silly Suggestions like " bring back moving spirits ect"

and im not pretending there are not any issues , but right now Other classes have MORE issues than a core ranger.

i see no damage issues apart from a pet tweek for HoT skill sets some modernising
i see no condi clear issues
i see no conflicting trait lines

and the whole point of me telling people NOT to lable the Ranger as Dead is because if they did they wouldn’t play ranger , we’d loose more new players for ranger and it will fall under the Radar again being ignored , if people don’t learn the skills/traits and how to play a ranger in the first place because of somes ones opinion of " don’t bother its dead" , Anet do not Buff classes based on popularity ether so by not playing the class things won’t change and we need more people playing ranger rather than telling them its " dead" when its not they way i see it Core ranger is running at 80% efficency with only the pet slowing things down.

if people want to spout " ranger is dead" go do it in your own guild or to personal friends don’t wreak it for new people trying to find a fun class because starting somthing new and getting all worked up over statistics to find out if its worth it " isn’t a reason not to play a class" even if they try it and don’t like it , they walk away with atleast some extra experience rather than never trying.

it really grinds my gears when people do that in anything telling people not to bother because its not worth it , something is always worth it for the experience of it unless its a stupid thing to do like jumping off a cliff , then why not try and solve the issues .

you honestly answered your own question by saying " avoiding the issue " which you didn’t really give it a lot of thought ?

i still hold my point that DH is no better than a Core ranger as its only Damaging ranged attack is pretty much trueshot and suffers the ranger Pre-longbow buff slow arrows clunky timings and stop AA when throwing Traps easly avoided through decent practice and skill.

most of the DH traits for lb defence are all close range it lacks at midium to long range , and also lacks Stability its not pulsing effects so a DH can easly be pressured by ranged CC 2x and its locked down unlike a ranger which can kite forever and still be effective in combat, unless that player puts all traits into damage and support with no defences like striders , one trait is more than enough to help and even overpower a DH with a lb , then at that point all you’ll need to do is save weapon evades for the traps being thrown at you because a Dh can not sustain hp fast enough to counter Ranger Ranged damage.

Oh the number of times I spanked a DH 1v1 with druid… Sometimes I’ll lose the cap if I play too conservatively by standing off point to take away the usefulness of their traps/traits. Overall I just dodge the trueshots and position myself where the DH is facing me and my pet is wrecking his bum from the rear so even if he pops his F3 it won’t save him.

Any decent DH won’t be camping longbow and they will still be using sword/shield or focus and that will be their primary weapon set. If they are using the melee set you just need to set up a burst combo whether it be a remorseless maul one shot wonder or a longbow 4 & 2 and just pew pew him to death taunting as needed w/ F2 and PM.

The only thing DH has over Druid is blocks but we have tons more evade, the same or more CC, more heals, more sustain, and a better role in team fights.

Allison The Strange.4519:

Oh the number of times I spanked a DH 1v1 with druid… Sometimes I’ll lose the cap if I play too conservatively by standing off point to take away the usefulness of their traps/traits. Overall I just dodge the trueshots and position myself where the DH is facing me and my pet is wrecking his bum from the rear so even if he pops his F3 it won’t save him.

Any decent DH won’t be camping longbow and they will still be using sword/shield or focus and that will be their primary weapon set. If they are using the melee set you just need to set up a burst combo whether it be a remorseless maul one shot wonder or a longbow 4 & 2 and just pew pew him to death taunting as needed w/ F2 and PM.

The only thing DH has over Druid is blocks but we have tons more evade, the same or more CC, more heals, more sustain, and a better role in team fights.

This so much.

I’m a recent convert from DH to Druid, and I’m not sure what it is, but I just seem to click playing it.

DH is great at lower levels because of all the people that face plant themselves into traps. As the skill level of opponents goes up you can see what a one-trick pony they actually are.

Having played as one I know the counters and in some ways actually feel bad playing against one. With so many weapon skills having evade and smokescale phase atack tripping their traps I kinda feel sorry for them.

Now at least I have an explanation on why I was getting beat up so frequently by Rangers when I was playing as DH…

Just as a side note, is it strange that I actually enjoy being a melee ranger? Some of the weapon skills are things I wished I had on Guardian.

Melee Ranger a blast, been doing it for Ages =D