Guild Wars 2

Stating the obvious, but since a-net devs were not sure what type of utility to make it, here’s my feedback;)

I personally agree. It would have to be balanced around the concept, certainly, but I would like to see this happen.

However, understand that there are many rangers who would hate for this to be a trap.

I’m almost sure that HS will be a trap, specially because the only other type that left to be is signet and I doubt it will.
Ranger has shouts, survival, trap, signet and spirit skills, and we already have a spirit healing and we know that TU will be a survival skill and HaO a shout.

After they worked around the heal trap for dragon hunter, its almost 90% they will make it a trap.
probably heal on use and water field on activation. I wounder if the trait that doubles condition on traps will also apply for HS and double the effect of regen+condi removal ticks.

I’m also looking forward to what that “making up” for arming time of traps will be, including the healing spring if it’s thrown in there.

ZeftheWicked.3076:

I’m also looking forward to what that “making up” for arming time of traps will be, including the healing spring if it’s thrown in there.

For Dragonhunters I’m pretty sure it was half a second casting time and half a second arming time. So I’m guessing it will be the same for thieves and rangers.

Yes, heal+stealth would be quite nice.

If it is categorized as a Trap, I would hope it remains as it currently is without an activation time or needing allies/enemies to activate it.

Wondrouswall.7169:

If it is categorized as a Trap, I would hope it remains as it currently is without an activation time or needing allies/enemies to activate it.

It is very likely that it will be similar to the dragonhunter’s healing trap, you get an initial heal at cast and another effect on activation.

If they changed it to work like the DH heal trap, then I’d probably stop using it all together. Would seem like a nerf to HS.

I’m pretty sure this has been discussed elsewhere, but realistically it should be a trap or wilderness survival.

I don’t feel that having troll unguent be a survival skill should exclude the healing spring. after all there are other skills that some classes have more of ( i.e. engineer elixers) and every class has more of a type of skill than slots allow meaning that the player has to choose (3 utility slots, but most utilities have 4 of each type).

Being a gw1 player, healing spring was originally a trap. I believe instead of having to be triggered it just went off after a delay though, of course i could be wrong.

Honestly I’d rather Troll just become a signet with a passive of 25% run speed and the same active it has now.

Change signet of the hunt.

Put healing spring as survival, it resembles muddy terrain more than a trap imo.

That has more to do with me not wanting a knock off of the DH heal trap though. If HS is made a trap and functions the same as it does now I’m fine with that.

There is a way to make it anti-hated for those who like it the current way.

Make the heal a separate part of the trap.
You could throw the healing spring wherever you want, but only the regen and cleanse mechanic would make the “trap” and would trigger on any friendly target. Pets included.

The direct heal will be applied instantly on use. No on trap trigger.

Does it sound user-friendly?

WiIlderness survival would make the most sense, if it can’t be due to TU then I’d prefere a signet. We should have got a heal signet instead of water spirit in the first place.

Give us a signet elite while they are at it as well.

I love it as is. Don’t want it to be a trap that needs activation. The only reason to take it over ungent is for the fast initial burst and reliable water field. You are usually dropping it in battle followed by a quick leap or pet swap to blast it. It needs to be reliable to be used like this… Or those pansy warriors will continue to run around and away from you with their flaming bows and not proc it. Biggest cowards in gw2. I always picture them with a skirt.

Not gonna happen as all skills that were uncategorized will be put into some category like it or not.

Survival is already taken by troll unguent, which fits there much better (it’ll be able to get small condi cleanse and fury when traited). Healing spring already has a condi cleanse and it’s own boon (regeneration). Making it a survival skill would be over the top vs other heals.

Also traps are known for having their own combo fields, and once again healing spring falls neatly into that category with it’s water field. I wonder what additions it’ll get as part of that trap improvement change, but i’ll just have to wait and see.

Belzebu.3912:

Wondrouswall.7169:

If it is categorized as a Trap, I would hope it remains as it currently is without an activation time or needing allies/enemies to activate it.

It is very likely that it will be similar to the dragonhunter’s healing trap, you get an initial heal at cast and another effect on activation.

What makes you think “very likely”? Opinion?

I think they will just add the category and leave it alone, no point making more work for yourself by re-coding the skill. They won’t do that with the other skills like RaO, HaO or TU.

They are giving traps longer activation times, so… That would make it worthless…

Archon.6480:

They are giving traps longer activation times, so… That would make it worthless…

erm no they are adding Arming times , they take the same amount of time to cast but won’t be armed untill 0.5secs after the trap is seated on the ground so in effect the further your throw it the less noticable you’ll see the 0.5 arming time because by the time you reach the said healing spring trap it’ll be ready to be tirggered.

HaO and Tu are much better for a fast heal than Healing spring .

and making healing spring clearly defined as a trap adds different game play to the heal a throwable water field you can main from Mid line zerg with a SB and Gs for movement while supporting with thrown traps + healing AoE into the front line or back line.

versitile use healing spring is much better off as a trap with the 0.5 than without the 0.5 as someone else will activate it before you could even reach it, onther reason why a 0.5 arming time could be very useful.

I think it will be a trap.
And IMO the best option is to get the Heal with using and the water field and regen when its activated by an enemy. It also could act as a “blast activation”, so that all ppl they are inside when the trap is activated get a small amount of heal…something like 800-1000 HP or so.

Archon.6480:

I love it as is. Don’t want it to be a trap that needs activation. The only reason to take it over ungent is for the fast initial burst and reliable water field. You are usually dropping it in battle followed by a quick leap or pet swap to blast it. It needs to be reliable to be used like this…

Yup. I share the sentiment. I use it just as much for the heals as I do for the condi cleanse and water field. Making it have a arming time and conditions to whether the water field activates or not… terrible terrible terrible. That’ll have a significantly bad impact on my use of HS in PVE group content.

Wondrouswall.7169:

If it is categorized as a Trap, I would hope it remains as it currently is without an activation time or needing allies/enemies to activate it.

Then it wouldn’t be a trap, now would it?

Nike.2631:

Wondrouswall.7169:

If it is categorized as a Trap, I would hope it remains as it currently is without an activation time or needing allies/enemies to activate it.

Then it wouldn’t be a trap, now would it?

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Belzebu.3912:

Wondrouswall.7169:

If it is categorized as a Trap, I would hope it remains as it currently is without an activation time or needing allies/enemies to activate it.

It is very likely that it will be similar to the dragonhunter’s healing trap, you get an initial heal at cast and another effect on activation.

What makes you think “very likely”? Opinion?

I think they will just add the category and leave it alone, no point making more work for yourself by re-coding the skill. They won’t do that with the other skills like RaO, HaO or TU.

I mean that HS and the dragonhunter healing will be similar mechanically, as in both will have an initial heal and a 2nd effect after it triggers, I say “very likely” because devs said that traps would change and the 1st and only time we saw the new trap system was in the DH announcement, so … I concluded that all other traps will follow that mechanic.

TheFantasticGman.9451:

Archon.6480:

I love it as is. Don’t want it to be a trap that needs activation. The only reason to take it over ungent is for the fast initial burst and reliable water field. You are usually dropping it in battle followed by a quick leap or pet swap to blast it. It needs to be reliable to be used like this…

Yup. I share the sentiment. I use it just as much for the heals as I do for the condi cleanse and water field. Making it have a arming time and conditions to whether the water field activates or not… terrible terrible terrible. That’ll have a significantly bad impact on my use of HS in PVE group content.

The arming time is like half a second at most. Half a second. Not to mention the only “conditions” is for you to be standing over it….don’t you do that already? Kinda feel like you are being overdramatic :\

Razor.9872:

TheFantasticGman.9451:

Archon.6480:

I love it as is. Don’t want it to be a trap that needs activation. The only reason to take it over ungent is for the fast initial burst and reliable water field. You are usually dropping it in battle followed by a quick leap or pet swap to blast it. It needs to be reliable to be used like this…

Yup. I share the sentiment. I use it just as much for the heals as I do for the condi cleanse and water field. Making it have a arming time and conditions to whether the water field activates or not… terrible terrible terrible. That’ll have a significantly bad impact on my use of HS in PVE group content.

The arming time is like half a second at most. Half a second. Not to mention the only “conditions” is for you to be standing over it….don’t you do that already? Kinda feel like you are being overdramatic :\

If they make it like dh healing trap then it would require an enemy to trigger the stronger part of the heal which is what they are hoping doesnt happen.

THey could just have it automatically trigger instead of having to be triggered by an enemy. That would allow them to maintain the current functionality while also letting it benefit from trap-related traits and such.

If they did make it into a more conventional trap with an arming and trigger phases, there would need to be some rebalancing done on the skill so that it wouldn’t be crap.

or Hs trigger when a Ally walks over it where thier hp is below 100% so its heal is not wasted .

why in the name of hell would this type of trap trigger if the Enemy would walk over it its a RoT regen over time field , if the enemy triggers it you’ll be wasting a lot of regen time because as soon as he/she triggers the spring they could just CC you in place preventing you from getting that heal and kill you where you stand .

Enemy triggered won’t be a thing for Hs.

don’t forget the main bulk of Hs healing comes from the stacked durations of regen rather than the one off 4.75k heal .

at 300 healing power the base heal is 5k and the regen heal (with a 30% boon duration currently is at 5.15k for 6secs there after a extra 515hps per tick of extended regen, the Auto trigger is the least of your worries.

5+5=10k for only 6secs of regen+heal burst on use there after so in the end over time it heals for nearly 16-17k mostly from the regen if you get the full ticks+duration.

its much better off with the 0.5 arming time and being able to throw it to support allies.

with timber comming as well you could run a shout or two and give yourself per regen+ evading weapons you won’t need that heal burst of 5k and if you did that 0.5sec activation time is nothing in the grand sceme of things.

Nike.2631:

Wondrouswall.7169:

If it is categorized as a Trap, I would hope it remains as it currently is without an activation time or needing allies/enemies to activate it.

Then it wouldn’t be a trap, now would it?

Healing Spring was a trap in GW1 with different functionality to the other traps, but it was typed as a trap and worked with Trapper’s Speed and Trapper’s Focus. I see no reason they couldn’t do the same here, leave the functionality exactly the same, just adding the trap classification so it functions with runes and traits. Would be less work too.

I could deal with the above… assuming I could still get it just about as fast as I get it now.

Razor.9872:

TheFantasticGman.9451:

Archon.6480:

I love it as is. Don’t want it to be a trap that needs activation. The only reason to take it over ungent is for the fast initial burst and reliable water field. You are usually dropping it in battle followed by a quick leap or pet swap to blast it. It needs to be reliable to be used like this…

Yup. I share the sentiment. I use it just as much for the heals as I do for the condi cleanse and water field. Making it have a arming time and conditions to whether the water field activates or not… terrible terrible terrible. That’ll have a significantly bad impact on my use of HS in PVE group content.

The arming time is like half a second at most. Half a second. Not to mention the only “conditions” is for you to be standing over it….don’t you do that already? Kinda feel like you are being overdramatic :\

It depends on how it is implemented. Don’t you know that it isn’t written in stone? Yup, everything is still up for change. So, they could put a trigger on it that someone in the healing spring AOE has to be below a certain HP % before the water field activates. That’d be terrible. I drop HS becasue I need the heals, water field, and condi cleanse most of the time and I need them right now when I drop it. I need that water field to be there as fast as it is now, not slower. As far as I know it’s still the best water field in the game. It’s great for pug fractals and dungeons. It sucks they are “fixing” something that isn’t broken… just like the SB long ago. Anyone who has been playing a Ranger for a year should always be hesitant and keep expectations low when it comes to changes coming.

Vizardlorde.8243:

Razor.9872:

TheFantasticGman.9451:

Archon.6480:

I love it as is. Don’t want it to be a trap that needs activation. The only reason to take it over ungent is for the fast initial burst and reliable water field. You are usually dropping it in battle followed by a quick leap or pet swap to blast it. It needs to be reliable to be used like this…

Yup. I share the sentiment. I use it just as much for the heals as I do for the condi cleanse and water field. Making it have a arming time and conditions to whether the water field activates or not… terrible terrible terrible. That’ll have a significantly bad impact on my use of HS in PVE group content.

The arming time is like half a second at most. Half a second. Not to mention the only “conditions” is for you to be standing over it….don’t you do that already? Kinda feel like you are being overdramatic :\

If they make it like dh healing trap then it would require an enemy to trigger the stronger part of the heal which is what they are hoping doesnt happen.

Right, but nothing is keeping our trap to act just like the Dragonhunter’s. I would argue that A-net would try to be more diverse by making he HS trap ally activatable (with conditions to not waste it, of course).

TheFantasticGman.9451:

I could deal with the above… assuming I could still get it just about as fast as I get it now.

Razor.9872:

TheFantasticGman.9451:

Archon.6480:

I love it as is. Don’t want it to be a trap that needs activation. The only reason to take it over ungent is for the fast initial burst and reliable water field. You are usually dropping it in battle followed by a quick leap or pet swap to blast it. It needs to be reliable to be used like this…

Yup. I share the sentiment. I use it just as much for the heals as I do for the condi cleanse and water field. Making it have a arming time and conditions to whether the water field activates or not… terrible terrible terrible. That’ll have a significantly bad impact on my use of HS in PVE group content.

The arming time is like half a second at most. Half a second. Not to mention the only “conditions” is for you to be standing over it….don’t you do that already? Kinda feel like you are being overdramatic :\

It depends on how it is implemented. Don’t you know that it isn’t written in stone? Yup, everything is still up for change. So, they could put a trigger on it that someone in the healing spring AOE has to be below a certain HP % before the water field activates. That’d be terrible. I drop HS becasue I need the heals, water field, and condi cleanse most of the time and I need them right now when I drop it. I need that water field to be there as fast as it is now, not slower. As far as I know it’s still the best water field in the game. It’s great for pug fractals and dungeons. It sucks they are “fixing” something that isn’t broken… just like the SB long ago. Anyone who has been playing a Ranger for a year should always be hesitant and keep expectations low when it comes to changes coming.

How would a % HP trigger be terrible? You said yourself that you need it when: you need heals (you would get the heal. if the trap HS replenishes, say, 40 % of your HP, and you are at 65 % then using it as it is now would result in a 5 % waste, no? The trap would trigger perfectly for you — negating waste.); you need condi clear (What are the condi’s doing to you? Getting you killed? Not to worry, because as soon as you are “killed” enough, you would be brought back to full.); waterfield (Why do you need a waterfield? For heals? You would get the heals when you need them). All of this, and you could pre-cast it to have HS running its cooldown to use it faster after the following time you activate it.

Beautiful.

Please understand, they are not trying to “fix” the skill, so much as they are giving as many catagory-less skills catagories as possible. Saying “Anyone who has been playing a Ranger for a year should always be hesitant and keep expectations low when it comes to changes coming” is incredibly pessimistic.

Need to smile some, dude.

Like I said, it depends on how it is implemented is how it will play out. If they do it right and not make it worse, then great, but I’ve seen “fixes” go wrong, such as the SB.

And being “incredibly pessimistic” is much more realistic than being “incredibly optimistic” about them not screwing things up. I repeat: anyone whose been playing Ranger a long time should know this already.

Thanks for caring for my well being. I smile plenty. Don’t you worry your little head about that… especially when I twist the throttle on a ’14 zx10r

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Archon.6480:

They are giving traps longer activation times, so… That would make it worthless…

erm no they are adding Arming times , they take the same amount of time to cast but won’t be armed untill 0.5secs after the trap is seated on the ground so in effect the further your throw it the less noticable you’ll see the 0.5 arming time because by the time you reach the said healing spring trap it’ll be ready to be tirggered.

HaO and Tu are much better for a fast heal than Healing spring .

and making healing spring clearly defined as a trap adds different game play to the heal a throwable water field you can main from Mid line zerg with a SB and Gs for movement while supporting with thrown traps + healing AoE into the front line or back line.

versitile use healing spring is much better off as a trap with the 0.5 than without the 0.5 as someone else will activate it before you could even reach it, onther reason why a 0.5 arming time could be very useful.

Ah, understood. I am coming from PvP perspective. The activation time is too long on HaO and TU. Too easy to pick up poison or get interrupted while casting HaO and TU is in no way a “quick heal.” It heals you over time, and does little to help if you get gang spiked. I spend most time in melle range so Healng Spring is fantastic as is. Can drop it n .5s and leap through/into it instantly.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Nike.2631:

Wondrouswall.7169:

If it is categorized as a Trap, I would hope it remains as it currently is without an activation time or needing allies/enemies to activate it.

Then it wouldn’t be a trap, now would it?

Healing Spring was a trap in GW1 with different functionality to the other traps, but it was typed as a trap and worked with Trapper’s Speed and Trapper’s Focus. I see no reason they couldn’t do the same here, leave the functionality exactly the same, just adding the trap classification so it functions with runes and traits. Would be less work too.

Ah, that was nostalgic! This I could live with, only with .5s to set.

TheFantasticGman.9451:

Like I said, it depends on how it is implemented is how it will play out. If they do it right and not make it worse, then great, but I’ve seen “fixes” go wrong, such as the SB.

And being “incredibly pessimistic” is much more realistic than being “incredibly optimistic” about them not screwing things up. I repeat: anyone whose been playing Ranger a long time should know this already.

Thanks for caring for my well being. I smile plenty. Don’t you worry your little head about that… especially when I twist the throttle on a ’14 zx10r

More realstic? Perhaps. But I still prefer to keep a bright outlook. Feels less dreary. I’ve played Ranger as my main since day -3, and I still have high hopes for what we can do (we’re getting better, slowly). In other words, the secret is being optomistic -- but not having high expectations.

If that makes any sense…

Archon.6480:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Archon.6480:

They are giving traps longer activation times, so… That would make it worthless…

erm no they are adding Arming times , they take the same amount of time to cast but won’t be armed untill 0.5secs after the trap is seated on the ground so in effect the further your throw it the less noticable you’ll see the 0.5 arming time because by the time you reach the said healing spring trap it’ll be ready to be tirggered.

HaO and Tu are much better for a fast heal than Healing spring .

and making healing spring clearly defined as a trap adds different game play to the heal a throwable water field you can main from Mid line zerg with a SB and Gs for movement while supporting with thrown traps + healing AoE into the front line or back line.

versitile use healing spring is much better off as a trap with the 0.5 than without the 0.5 as someone else will activate it before you could even reach it, onther reason why a 0.5 arming time could be very useful.

Ah, understood. I am coming from PvP perspective. The activation time is too long on HaO and TU. Too easy to pick up poison or get interrupted while casting HaO and TU is in no way a “quick heal.” It heals you over time, and does little to help if you get gang spiked. I spend most time in melle range so Healng Spring is fantastic as is. Can drop it n .5s and leap through/into it instantly.

8k over 10secs is fast while in active combat + the regen from timber is onther 3-4k over 12-14secs averaging over 10secs = 1.1-1.2k per second.

vs a healing spring which has a small currently (post HoT) quick instant heal of 4.75k base and a 2.95k over 6secs its strong for a reason and that is being locked to the location of the spring , the spring being able to be placed else where stops that problem even if you don’t get the " i want the heal now effect" it’ll still heal for more over time than TU.

HoA is a situational heal its not somthing you’d use on its own and with a 20sec cooldown (could be traited for since after hot will be shout 16sec? traited) 6.75k every 16secs , i wouldnt worry too much about poison while its combined with timber or a different source of regen.

Ether or Hs and TU are over time heals one allows mobility (TU) hs allows placement/team support rather than a quick instant heal ( and heals for more over time compaired to TU , as to why i said its a quick heal its faster than Hs with a lower cooldown and HaO (is a spike heal on a relitive short cooldown and strong with Regen/damage migration)

Hs is slow in the long run a 5k heal as a first use is quite poor without the regen bonus.

so TU and HoA are faster heals because you are allowed to ether spike heal or kite while healing effectively healing you faster due to less damage.

by now people have relised that ranger is a class of preparation and proficiency , (instant heals are not somthing the class requires to survive).

Razor.9872:

In other words, the secret is being optomistic — but not having high expectations.

That’s a fine line you walk, sir. I can respect that.

HS with trap runes/trait – Super Speed, Stealth, 300 radius, ground targeting, double duration Regeneration and 24s CD, that is going to be fully sick btw. Optimism.

TheFantasticGman.9451:

Razor.9872:

In other words, the secret is being optomistic — but not having high expectations.

That’s a fine line you walk, sir. I can respect that.

Thank you. I find it rewarding on an emotional level.

If enemy must trigger the trap, it’s way to easy for enemies to work around it, denying you the cleanse you need. If i’m immobalized now, healing spring is almost an instant cleanse (unless i got other condies also, but still). Making it a trap makes it massively to easy for enemy to predict. Only way to make Healing spring viable then is to increase the base healing (5k is nothing, almost all meta heals do 6-9k, or do 5k but in 12-15 seconds cooldown). Healing spring falls short in this because the waterfield/cleanse. But because it’s fast, one leap/blast is enough to make it up with the best heals there are. Remove this part, or make the enemy able to ‘outsmart it’, and it’s a big nerf, wich is cannot agree onto. Also remember it’s one of our few reliable condition removal skills outside of traits. It gives diversity. Nerfing it, will nerf that diversity.

They should make it ally triggered, so if you or anyone else walks over it it activates. It would retain pretty much the same functionality given they didn’t change the activation, but maybe add another layer of depth.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

If enemy must trigger the trap, it’s way to easy for enemies to work around it, denying you the cleanse you need. If i’m immobalized now, healing spring is almost an instant cleanse (unless i got other condies also, but still). Making it a trap makes it massively to easy for enemy to predict. Only way to make Healing spring viable then is to increase the base healing (5k is nothing, almost all meta heals do 6-9k, or do 5k but in 12-15 seconds cooldown). Healing spring falls short in this because the waterfield/cleanse. But because it’s fast, one leap/blast is enough to make it up with the best heals there are. Remove this part, or make the enemy able to ‘outsmart it’, and it’s a big nerf, wich is cannot agree onto. Also remember it’s one of our few reliable condition removal skills outside of traits. It gives diversity. Nerfing it, will nerf that diversity.

throwing a trap is a obvious animation but it does not show what type of trap so i highly doubt they will notice which is which if your running 2-3 traps and then you can take LR to break the immobilse and get to the hs trap.

everyones having to change their tactics and some are having to alter their builds, you can’t expect things to stay the same way and rely on hs for a condi clear its a field its clearly made for support and restricting it for self use is Greedy and what is currently the Rangers Bane of only having good things for itself.

are anet keeping the 100% duration on traps trait , if so will it increase the regen by 100% duration , (going on the basis of they are removing Boon duration from the Trait line as a stat?)
if that is also the case 100% more regen duration

I know no conceivable way to reconcile the idea of a TRAP intended to be tripped by an ALLY.

yep, trap makes the most sense. just needs some interesting trap mechanics added,

eg:
heals for X when laid, and grants 3sec regen every 3seconds until sprung. HS trap can be sprung by pressing heal again, or by an enemy entering the AOE. when HS trap is sprung, allies within the AOE are healed and condi cleared & enemies are immobilised.

The upside to HS is the on-demand cleanse/waterfield, if that goes it’s going to hurt HS severely. We’ll have to see what they have in mind. The Idea of changing TU into a signet and HS to survival is interesting, but I feel that could possibly harm CondiSurvival builds.

Razor.9872:

TheFantasticGman.9451:

Razor.9872:

In other words, the secret is being optomistic — but not having high expectations.

That’s a fine line you walk, sir. I can respect that.

Thank you. I find it rewarding on an emotional level.

Walking along a Razor’s edge? Oh god tell me your forum name isn’t chosen just for this…

#teamSIGNET
same cd
active is the current healing spring

what changes?
the icon could need a change
the name could need a change (signet of spring, river, breeze etc…)
a new passive effect

I agree that HS makes much more conceptual sense as an Sv skill, and TU converted to signet.

Precedence for Sv skills with lingering area effects: Muddy Terrain.

Only problem is we already have a heal-pet signet, sort of…

Precedence for survival skills to have effect over time; 100%.

TU is much more about survival, name wise and effect wise.

There is need for a NEW heal signet, not destruction of one of the best heals in the game to make one.

I keep saying this but TU already is a survival skill and HS already is a trap in GW1. So, in effect, in the GW universe, they already are a survival skill and trap, respectively.

Exactly what Heimskarl Ashfiend is saying.
In gw1 TU is a skill that scale with Wilderness Survival, while HS is a trap, even though all traps also scale with Wilderness Survival too.