Guild Wars 2

Brujeria.7536:

Sword AA and Sword 3 are WAY to powerfull for how easy they are used, especially Sword 3 seems like a direct upgrade to some other burst skills, most noteable, Mesmer sword 2. Thats just way over the top.

It’s the only burst Revenant has (besides staff#5) because the rest is all sustained damage. Also, sword #3 is easily interrupted (3/4 seconds cast time) and feels clunky (see my long post above). I would instead see the casttime to 0 or 1/4 and from there balance the skill. Maybe reduce the number of hits (so reducing might stacks, evade frames and damage as a trade off)

and costs energy.

Kidel.2057:

and costs energy.

Not only that, it’s easily countered in pvp as well by effect on hit blocking/clones/multiple targets in general (because you lose target burst)/invis and you can’t cancel it. Also it possibly puts you out of position when it ends. I feel like there are a lot of non-revenant bèta testers in this thread that haven’t experienced the downside of the skill yet. Let’s try to give constructive feedback instead of saying: That skill gives x might, has evade, too high damage needs nerf. <<Isn’t constructive.

Does sword auto have to have a projectile? its too buggy and randomly doesn’t hit things when small terrain affects it.

Just make it normal slash/cleave with the delayed burst damage and its plenty unique still.

• ‘Brutal Blade’ (Sword 2nd AA Chain): Animation looks really strange and does not feel fluid. More like we are hitting the ground with the sword-hilt than actually trying to strike the opponent (tested with male&female sylvari and male charr).

• ‘Drop the Hammer’ (Hammer#5) cast time is far too slow. I suggest to lower it to 1 second.

I only just got to try out Revenant for a bit this morning so I am late to the party.

This is going to be my main. I really enjoy the look and feel of the class.

I have only tested out hammer and mace w/ shield so far. I wish I had more feedback to offer but I really only got to play it for about an hour. Just enough to get me hooked. The expansion can’t come out soon enough.

Mostly been trying out the Ventari legend in WvW this weekend.

It feels like it was designed when strong support wasn’t an option. Then Druid came along and now it feels in an awkward place. Its sole contribution is support, just like the Druid, but its output feels significantly weaker and more demanding of a player’s focus.

My suggestions:
– Boost overall passive healing near the tablet. It’s got a tiny area, but it should be powerful if allies are within that area.

- Add a final heal Ventari’s Will that’s bigger than the pass-through heal. It feels really annoying to have to run the thing “through” people all the time. I want to place it in the hottest area and leave it alone so I can use my other skills, not keep zipping it over people all the time. It feels like some sort of healing shake-weight right now.

Kelthien.8593:

Mostly been trying out the Ventari legend in WvW this weekend.

It feels like it was designed when strong support wasn’t an option. Then Druid came along and now it feels in an awkward place. Its sole contribution is support, just like the Druid, but its output feels significantly weaker and more demanding of a player’s focus.

My suggestions:
– Boost overall passive healing near the tablet. It’s got a tiny area, but it should be powerful if allies are within that area.

- Add a final heal Ventari’s Will that’s bigger than the pass-through heal. It feels really annoying to have to run the thing “through” people all the time. I want to place it in the hottest area and leave it alone so I can use my other skills, not keep zipping it over people all the time. It feels like some sort of healing shake-weight right now.

I played around with healing traits and Ventari a lot this weekend. Ironically what I found out was using herald and keeping regen on always was almost just as effective as using Ventari (because it looses a lot of healing from party members moving/dodging etc). Aside from the near perma projectile block with Ventari it just wasn’t used much. Personally I think it needs a much larger passive heal aoe range. But worst case scenario It stays the same and I just use it when I need a projectile block. =P

Forgot to mention was ticking over 500/s with regen from glint alone, with Ventari the passive regen and heals just wasn’t sticking because people would move/spread out etc.

Kronos.2560:

Kelthien.8593:

Mostly been trying out the Ventari legend in WvW this weekend.

It feels like it was designed when strong support wasn’t an option. Then Druid came along and now it feels in an awkward place. Its sole contribution is support, just like the Druid, but its output feels significantly weaker and more demanding of a player’s focus.

My suggestions:
– Boost overall passive healing near the tablet. It’s got a tiny area, but it should be powerful if allies are within that area.

- Add a final heal Ventari’s Will that’s bigger than the pass-through heal. It feels really annoying to have to run the thing “through” people all the time. I want to place it in the hottest area and leave it alone so I can use my other skills, not keep zipping it over people all the time. It feels like some sort of healing shake-weight right now.

I played around with healing traits and Ventari a lot this weekend. Ironically what I found out was using herald and keeping regen on always was almost just as effective as using Ventari (because it looses a lot of healing from party members moving/dodging etc). Aside from the near perma projectile block with Ventari it just wasn’t used much. Personally I think it needs a much larger passive heal aoe range. But worst case scenario It stays the same and I just use it when I need a projectile block. =P

Forgot to mention was ticking over 500/s with regen from glint alone, with Ventari the passive regen and heals just wasn’t sticking because people would move/spread out etc.

Same experience here. Herald is a great complement to Ventari… but Ventari by itself doesn’t feel like it has as much output as it should.

Now that Druid sets a bar for healing throughput, I’d like to see Ventari revs, Water eles, and Medkit engis get their healing adjusted to be on the same tier. As a mesmer main… I wouldn’t mind throwing Mesmer’s Inspiration line into that list as well. :-)

Either way, the gameplay is ok… for me it’s just that the numbers need to be worth the effort it takes to drive that little tablet around and right now they just aren’t.

envoy of exuberance

this skill is still a bit underwhelming. it’s very hard to land at distance and people will most of the time walk out of reach before you even get to heal them with it. you’re kinda forced to walk up to them and use it at point blank range.

another issue i have with this skill is that the protection is simply too short. it’s 2.25s so i would suggest to increase it to 4 seconds.

for the distance heal i would suggest a bigger radius, maybe 480, for the skill or increased healing the further away you hit somebody with it, to make it rewarding

Overall the Revenant continues to improve and gets more fluid and more enjoyable with every beta. Both visually and mechanically it has come on leaps and bounds. That being said theres still work and a narrow deadline for improvement! Damage on Mace/Axe/Sword still seems low.

Synergy
In an ideal world there would be a place for each pairing of the base legends and some role for Glint with most of the base. Roles would all be covered: DPS (Shiro/Mallyx), hybrid/control (Shiro or Mallyx/Jalis), support (Jalis/Ventari). As it stands Mallyx needs to use mace/axe and doesn’t get enough condi dealing skills to actually benefit from condi stats, imo. Most of the stat modifiers in Shiro’s traitline give ferocity and does nothing for condition damage! It would be nice if each traitline had something for the other legends and each weapon had a nod to an allied legend – some bleeds on the sword, hammer 4 be a Smoke field not a Dark field, etc. Mace could do with a burn on auto-chain and the Echoing Eruptions would be better a little closer together. Axe needs a different condition on 5 – so much unnecessary and cleansable Torment! If the skilled play is to use 5 to line them up and Frigid Blitz along the chain then switch the pass through and final damage. Staff is beautiful and never touch it again

Mallyx – first and foremost please for the love of god give him a stunbreak!

The demon monkey has been left in a weird place, improved but still off. It started off as a Epidemic-themed condi class with condi absorption and basing abilities on having above a threshold value for higher damage. Changing to condi damage and cc is totally fine but some of the skills no longer fit that theme. Leaving the epidemic ability as a GM trait fits perfectly, by the way, but now the only way to have that many condi’s is Pain Absorption (PA) in group play… otherwise its just weak or for vs necros. PA is now too ‘selfless’ for a demon! Wouldn’t it be perfect to swap PA for Jalis’ Forced Engagement?! Embrace the Darkness is weaksauce and compares badly with the Death Shroud it’s trying to pay homage to – bump it to 20% or have it increase condi damage duration too.

For damaging conditions, having so much bound into Torment is risky and a single cleanse just stops whatever massive stack in one fell swoop i- we need to diversify damage sources badly! Venom Enhancement and Diabilic Inferno have too long cooldowns and too few stacks, respectively.

• Ventari – just give him a water field for goodness sake.
• Shiro – moar damage. Impossible Odds still too expensive.
• Glint – please put a stunbreak on a Facet activation, or both sides of something. Change Elemental blast to Chill/Burn/Weakness so people don’t just.. run away.
• Jalis – seems fine. Love the new hammers.

TL;DR please give Mallyx a bit of synergy with the other legends and a good reason to run condi stats.

My feedback as shiro/glint, mainly from PvP:

- Sword AA nr 2 could make our life much easier if it wasnt a projectile, but a melee attack for reasons already stated. In general the sword AA’s animations would also look nicer with some tweaking, tho purely subjective (less stabby, but more swings to the sides like a sword not a dagger).

- Sword skill 2 also makes little sense, theres no situation where one would really benefit of using a 450 range attack, mediocre damage, just to apply some chill, and that energy is better spent on other skills. What if it was changed with 2 or 3 seconds of fury/quickness to support Sword 3. Not the best idea but it’s something.

- The herald ground icon graphic is really annoying during fights, at least for me, it’s unneeded info that doesnt really provide anything. It could also be a bit disturbing when jumping on tiny ledges etc. Maybe tone down/remove the center graphic and keep the outer circle? In any event it just draws to much focus on the graphic on ground, when we’d rather look at whats in front of us.

- Sounds on legend swapping could also be tweaked, Glints grumpy ladygrowl sounds a bit odd. Add short sentences maybe.

ive gone from a full blown rev hater, to it probably being my fav heavy class

BWE3 FEEDBACK

PvE General – Hard to really tell because the Maguuma PvE was undertuned or something compared to past weekends. Pretty much was zero challenge and just blitzed through everything without effort. Few encounters were rough, but mostly boss events where they all had one shot abilities.

WvW General – We’re entirely reliant on Stability from other classes at this time which means Guardians. Without Guardians we’re pretty much regulated to back line game play which is kinda depressing. The Guardian bottleneck is just so real.

STAFF
Changes to Punishing Sweep felt good. Couldn’t get it to trigger in WvW that often but could get it to trigger Debilitating a lot in PvE. Absolutely adored changes to Renewing Wave. Huge thumbs up there. Auto attack damage feels little low for a 2 handed weapon, but I’m okay with it because how good the other abilities are on the weapon.

SHIELD
At first I was leery about the new Crystal Hibernation but I am okay with it now. It excels at small group scenarios. I was able to tank a few bosses in PvE with using Crys Hib.

HAMMER
Hammer continues to face numerous bugs. Please fix these. I’ve reported them repeatedly on game and in the forums and have made videos documenting them broken.

SWORD
UA still feels okay with cool down at 12.

LEGENDS
Jalis continues to remain entirely situational in it’s usefulness. There are many other threads on this. Inspiring Reinforcements should be instant cast AOE 3-5 stacks of Stability that last for 3-5 seconds base.

Glint is the big winner with all it’s abilities in a good place. The energy upkeep costs can be felt if you overtax yourself. I ran out of energy many times because I wasn’t properly paying attention which is a good thing.

Shiro continues to be fine.

Mallyx is a shadow of it’s former glory. The elite is now functionally useless compared to simply spamming Unyielding Anguish for the same energy cost and an AOE effect. The condition copy should be brought back. The torment boost you were contemplating would be a good idea as Torment is very weak condition damage comparatively in PvE and many PvE encounters are starting to move towards wanting Condition damage alternative. The poison ICD is extremely high for Poison which is over all weaker now that it’s stackable.

TRAITS
Charged Mists is still broken/useless. It either has a 4s ICD or only triggers when you first go below 50 energy and never triggers from weapon skills. Traits like Equilibrium and Shrouded Mists will rare get used cause the alternatives are vastly superior to them. Invigorating Flow seems to have some sort of ICD or not counting weapon skills.

Ferocious Strikes swap was good.

Soothing Bastion / Crystal Hibernation sometimes don’t work if used too quickly one after the other. Using Envoy of Exuberance never seemed to refresh boon duration after numerous tests with Soothing Bastion.

FINAL WEEKEND SUMMARY
Being weak to Conditions and being weak to Controlling Effects is incredibly harsh on the Revenant. There are very, very few stun break abilities the primary of which is tied to a Trait almost making it mandatory. Even then Stun break abilities are ineffective in environments with multiple CC’s that also require mobility. Inspiring Reinforcements static nature and slow activation only compound this problem. Rite of the Great Dwarf’s cast time can be caught and interrupted despite being a stun break making it very ineffective under heavy pressure. The primary source of stability then becomes Unwavering Avoidance in which we’re forced to waste a Dodge to build stability before we’ve ever even engaged an opponent or would take advantage of said dodge especially on a class with no access to Vigor.

I’m new to Revenant/Herald, but I do enjoy its unique playstyle. I found a surprising synergy with Shiro/Glint legends with hammer/sword+shield to provide a nice overall damage/support. I am a little disappointed that only Shiro and Mallyx can be used underwater.

I didn’t get to try out Mallyx from last BWE, but currently, it seems a couple of the skills are….out of place – specifically Pain Absorption and Empowering Misery. I understand that previously, Mallyx utilities inflict certain conditions on self, but now only Pain Absorption will help improve the healing skill, which makes me feel like I should not use my healing skill until I have at least one or more conditions on me.

I didn’t try Ventari or Jalis a whole lot, so I can’t give much feedback. However, I feel like a water field should be in one of Ventari’s skills.

Weapon-wise, hammer’s autoattack and its ground-target skills are a little slow to cast. Maybe reduce it by 1/4 or 1/2 sec would make it more flowy.

Can the stunbreak on Gaze of Darkness (Glint’s) be also on Facet of Darkness?

Overall, I’m enjoying this profession. I was in debate of which heavy armor class that I’ll like, but now, I know revenant/herald is the one for me.

When it comes to off-hand weapons for Revenant, shield and axe seem really good. However it feels the off-hand sword can’t really compete with these two:

-Axe has really nice 900 range shadowstep + condition options
-Shield offers awesome defence + heals
-Sword has small block/immobilize + 600 range kidnap that you have to activate on melee range

So to make off-hand sword more viable option, you could possibly make it more damage focused or perhaps change the Grasping Shadow in a way that you shadowstep to the foe, hit them and if the hit lands you shadowstep to where you started this skill with the foe you targeted. Also it feels that Duelist’s Preparation could do some reworking, cause due the immobilize you can cause it feels to be only useful when running away from someone, not something you would waste 20 energy on when actually fighting.

I do like Sword#2, but I think it could use a slight range buff (e.g. 600 range). It doesn’t need to out-damage the auto-attack, it should just be more useful as a gap closer.

For Staff, I like the change to debilitating slam, but punishing sweep still seems too slow. When I use it (WvW, PvP), I pretty much have to hope my opponent will still be in range and casting when it goes off. I think the cast time should be reduced to 1/2 second.

Just 2 words: Nerf it.
I can faceroll everyone in pvp, too much sustain, too many blocks/invuls and damage, just too much. Unrelating Assault is braindead and uncounterable; change it or lower dps.

Glint heal is just op as instacast. I can kill bruisers in seconds, sustaining like an ele, doing damage like thief.

Herald’s Facet of Nature passive effect is so good that basically any PvE party should always have one around with as close to 100% up-time as possible. Among other things, it maximizes the Chrono’s quickness to a new level. 1 Herald + 1 Chrono + 1 Guard, you can get nearly a minute of contiguous quickness without any other boon extensions. Not sure if that’s intentional.

I don’t like the new Unyielding Anguish ( in land, firtunately the old version was kept underwater) – too similar to the elite skill, and too frontloadedin terms of delivering conditions. I would like more non-damage area denial to it somehow, also a single condition teansfer would fit, but cut down the torment.

Still missing being able to slot dufferent legends for land abd water.

Addressing the Shiro/Glint power spec.

Rev against conditions:

Perfectly fine. The lack of condition removal makes it challenging to avoid exposition to any condi. Your only backup is glint’s heal. The evades and the invulnerabilities can help too.

Rev against power:
Op.
Too many evades. Too many invulnerabilities. Too much damage at low risk. You can faceroll anyone. Just use unrelenting assault, block with your sword, evade and block with your staff, apply weakness with glint and turn all incoming damage into hp and you’ve got yourself a full rotation that can’t be countered. Oh yeah, and you get protection, fury and perma swiftness with that… a little bonus from the house… and stability on dodge…. oh yeah and I forgot that you can also stun break on both legends if you don’t feel like dodging.

Mobility in WvW is too high. Shiro can make you leap 2,400 units at a low cost.

Fix this. Right now, everybody is justifying revenant’s strenght by “it’s weak to conditions so it is a good trade off”. No, it is not. If you can beat all power specs, nothing is a good tradeoff.

If revenant is given access to more condition removals/stun breaks then yes I agree go ahead and tone the rev vs power builds but currently any amount of conditions or stuns will wreck a rev. If you take away any viability against power builds as well what do you have?

Kronos.2560:

If revenant is given access to more condition removals/stun breaks then yes I agree go ahead and tone the rev vs power builds but currently any amount of conditions or stuns will wreck a rev. If you take away any viability against power builds as well what do you have?

Please, do this and you’ll know what i am talking about.
Go to twitch.
Search for: thecryophoenix.
Watch his friday stream with revenant.
You can then hate the way it is atm like me.

One thing I’m concerned with is the lack of a leap finisher on any of our weapons. any chance to adding a leap finisher on Unrelenting Assault or frigid blitz ?

Brujeria.7536:

Sword AA and Sword 3 are WAY to powerfull for how easy they are used, especially Sword 3 seems like a direct upgrade to some other burst skills, most noteable, Mesmer sword 2. Thats just way over the top.

Don’t discount the Mesmer Blurred Frenzy (#2). It has a significant advantage on Unrelenting Assault in that you can use it to avoid damage without requiring a target. It’s also AoE damage whereas Rev Sword 3 is single target random strikes.

Said this last BWE, but some minor customisation within legend choice by adding a single extra skill per legend would be helpful in allowing you to synergise your legend choices better.

feedback on what I played this weekend. played a shiro/glint devastation/invocation/herald full zerk in scholar runes in the beta map/fractal 50/arah
very fun playstyle, lots of little things to improve on as I learn the class better to keep me wanting to get better, very helpful to my team. its one of the better classes for the current zerk meta in pve, still felt a little weaker than my ele, but much easier to survive and that could still be a L2P issue as I noticed a few things I can get better at.

played a marauder rev with the same above build for pvp. very strong against current meta builds, but does have counters with conditions, stealth at the right time to avoid damage from UA, not a lot of stability in the build I was running. felt about on par with other elite specs, there is a bit of a power creep with all elite specs (but that’s deserving of another post entirely.)

I played a mallyx/glint corruption/retribution/herald in wvw/pvp, in wvw I tried dire stats with tormenting runes food and utility, pvp I had rabid stats with undead runes.
for pvp it felt a little underpowered I was able to win a good bit of the 1v1s, but it felt a little underpowered compared to the power build I was running before. in wvw it felt way OP, it does have some counters like diamond skin eles, and some builds are able to kite you around as mace/axe/shield it can be hard to keep up with some builds and you have a lot of health/armor, but very little heals for extended fights.

I tried full sinister axe/mace/shield corruption/invocation/herald with malyx/glint in the beta map. totally useless set of gear. die even easier than any power builds as unrelenting assault is such a great evade it makes it far easier to survive in a zerk build. not only is the damage far inferior to a power zerk build even on moving targets (which I couldn’t find a single moving target in the beta map, not easy to kite with 130 range,) but the damage is barely better than my dire set. power/precision scales very poorly with a mace.

things I want changed.
the elite on mallyx competes a bit too much with unyielding anguish, they both pretty much accomplish the same goal, only the elite is better for keeping up with people trying to kite you as the chill doesn’t last long when your aiming at moving targets that don’t stay in it long. please change what the elite does.

Pain absorption has no reason to draw the condition away from our allies and put them on us. condi’s are our weakness not theirs. our allies can handle the conditions on them much better than we can, we do not want theirs.

revenants are the masters of torment. so why are most of our torment skills point blank range? torment does more damage vs moving targets. we need at least 300 range or so to kite someone around so we can get those targets moving (would fix a lot of the condi rev in pve problems)

Rev is overall in a good spot, but Glint is OP compared to every other legend. Glint needs a nerf, and all other legends need a buff to compensate. I wanna be able to use a build that doesn’t bring Glint, but I can’t because Glint is OP no matter what build your trying to run.

it would help the rev out a lot of you would add superior sigil of cleansing into pvp (condi clear on weapon swap) same goes for superior runes of tormenting, would really help condi revs get a foothold into the pvp scene.

power/precision needs to scale better with a mace, in most of pve defensive stats are worthless as theres no “challenging content” (at least that I have seen so far) , and on a mace so is power/precision as it scales so poorly, so why go condi unless somethings immune to power?

I love the class so far. Just needs some bug fixing and polishing.
Hammer #2 (Coalescence of Ruin) fails to hit 50% of the time in Verdant Brink due to uneven terrains. It will even stop after the first pulse of the animation if you used the skill behind a tiny ledge. The only thing that has worse terrain problems than this skill, so far, is the Mordrem Charger getting stunned over and over trying to charge at me while standing on a tiny ledge.
I also hope that sword chain 2 (Brutal Blade) will be changed to a non-projectile skill because it’s very clunky at the moment. You lose DPS if you’re up against a wall, and the whole skill will outright fail to hit on specific terrains.

Yeah pain absorb doesn’t make much sense anymore

Found a few bugs playing herald tonight:
1. Herald- ‘Radiant revival’ trait doesnt apply to revived targets
2. Herald- ‘Hardening persistence’ trait sometimes persists through legend swapping and doesn’t end despite not channeling anything

sasoriaka.6348:

Addressing the Shiro/Glint power spec.

Rev against conditions:

Perfectly fine. The lack of condition removal makes it challenging to avoid exposition to any condi. Your only backup is glint’s heal. The evades and the invulnerabilities can help too.

Rev against power:
Op.
Too many evades. Too many invulnerabilities. Too much damage at low risk. You can faceroll anyone. Just use unrelenting assault, block with your sword, evade and block with your staff, apply weakness with glint and turn all incoming damage into hp and you’ve got yourself a full rotation that can’t be countered. Oh yeah, and you get protection, fury and perma swiftness with that… a little bonus from the house… and stability on dodge…. oh yeah and I forgot that you can also stun break on both legends if you don’t feel like dodging.

Mobility in WvW is too high. Shiro can make you leap 2,400 units at a low cost.

Fix this. Right now, everybody is justifying revenant’s strenght by “it’s weak to conditions so it is a good trade off”. No, it is not. If you can beat all power specs, nothing is a good tradeoff.

im not saying youre wrong, but I saw a lot of reapers beating revs this weekend. As I type this I realize many of those reapers were cele signet with dhuumfire.

Does the energy have to drop down to 50% when swapping? There are so many reasons to swap Legends, it hurts to lose energy that took 10 seconds or more to build up.

Herald seems to be the glue required to make most of the legends work well

• Mallyx seems to benefit greatly from the massive boon duration(17+ seconds of Resistance from using Absorb Pain). You actually have a chance to survive the massive conditions you have.
• Ventari seems to benefit greatly from Herald (trait gives perma AoE protection from simply moving tablet around)
• Jalis seems to benefit greatly from Herald (tons of bonus long-lasting stability from the brick road).

Overall: Feels extremely complex and extremely limited at the same time. You are swapping to manage your role, while also swapping to manage energy, while also swapping to manage your 2 healing skill cooldowns… you are skimping on weapon skills so that you have energy to use utility skills or an elite. Your choices are 2 weapons and 2 legends… no mixing or matching of custom skillbars like other professions makes it feel extremely limited. Unlike other professions that can button mash, it looks like the hard part of playing Revenant will be the skills you don’t use, which in turn give you the energy required for the skills you need, when you need them.

I enjoyed playing around with Mallyx/Jalis, Jalis/Glint, Ventari/Jalis. And much of the time I was running Herald without running the Herald legend.

misterdevious.6482:

*

Herald seems to be the glue required to make most of the legends work well

• Mallyx seems to benefit greatly from the massive boon duration(17+ seconds of Resistance from using Absorb Pain). You actually have a chance to survive the massive conditions you have.
• Ventari seems to benefit greatly from Herald (trait gives perma AoE protection from simply moving tablet around)
• Jalis seems to benefit greatly from Herald (tons of bonus long-lasting stability from the brick road).

Yeah Herald is a must have, Glint is by far the more powerfull legend, she’s more strong and have more roles than any other legend. She can tank, support and dps very well.

Rev is broken as sheet holy sheet mama they have 2 much invul + doing enormeous damage

I think Jalis is too weak and Glint is too strong. Inspiring Reinforcement is a really strong skill even after the nerf and the reason to take Jalis, but not good enough to carry the whole legend, I think the other skills could use energy cost reductions (esp. the taunt) or other buffs. The regeration and fury are the strongest elements of Glint, they could both use an unpeek increase of one each. The protection isn’t as strong as on paper (where it looks really strong) since is not so on-demand and expensive to cancel, but still strong.

Reflexive summon could use an effect buff and a duration decrease.

Hi,

After a long try during this beta week end I can but say that the Revenant is weak compared to others classes.

Why ?
First because of energy mecanism.
Let’s try to press 2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-0… in most case you probably run out of energy at 8… while in the meantime every other classes can run their full skills set…

Second, because of CD
Ok, not to be able to chain cc… but why others like Thieves can ? (I’m talking about their ability to almost perma blind) Thief has initiative so no CD, it’s ok they have to make a choice of what to use (event if utils are still available only on CD). But so having two kinds of resources to manage (cd and energy) is quite a challenge for Revs.

Third, because of legends
The idea is really great, but this is really killing the ability to have a build able to face any situation, which is a strong point for any others classes.
I mean, revenant as almost no access to stun breaker, stability or condi removal unless you play some specific build/legend. So the game with revenant will be like changing his build every 3 minutes because the enemy in front of you changed ?

My suggestions :

1/ Disable/reduice (a lot) energy cost for weapon skills. Energy is about legends not weapons.
2/ Adjust Energy cost/CD so at least we are able to run all of them once before running out of energy so as to compete with other classes.
3/ Create news heal/utils/elite skills not linked to legends, based on CD, and that can replace any of your legend skill to give some choice and diversity. Another way would be to enable single legends invocation (I mean being able to swap between legends1/nothing instead of legends1/legends2), with the “nothing” giving access to news skills CD-based only that we can choose.
4/ More ways to break stun, get stability and cure condis.

Hi Roy, I did not get to play much this weekend but wanted to give you something quick and easy to read while you are scanning the forums.

First off kudos for really pulling off a very unique and complicated profession which is a blast! . Playing a Revenant I can really see where the hard work and effort of you and the team has been put in. I feel the Revenant is in a very good place right now, with the obvious polish and tuning in time to come.

-I would like to see some options on changing the opacity of Herald’s symbol, and possible toggle it on/off

-I would like a option to turn off the sound effects for swapping legends. They are great don’t get me wrong, but from what you already read they get a bit old and annoying.

-When playing certain Legends I feel discouraged and hesitant at times to use weapons skills due to energy cost, especially as Herald trying to upkeep my boons. I feel the weapon energy costs needs to have a look at. Many times I feel like this buff super being who just taps auto attack. It becomes anti climatic .

Otherwise good job. I hope Mallyx gets a little love like you are planning to do, we look forward to your response to our beta feedback.

This was my first chance to play Revenant, and I must say that the profession is a blast to play. Extremely fun. I do have a few criticisms though of the profession and some thoughts on their mechanics. This is all from a PvE perspective, by the way. I did mostly the raid, world content, and a fractal.

The Legends
I have very little to complain about when it comes to all 5 legends. They are all fun to play and have clear identity. I thought I would dislike Mallyx after the changes, but it probably is one of my favorites.

My only issue with the legends system is that switching legends isn’t really a thing you do very often. I found that most of the time I would camp 1 legend and switch only if I needed to fill a different role or needed to heal. I think the reason this is is because almost all of the legend utilities and skill have no cooldown or very short ones; so the only skill you switch legends for is the heal. Switching legends for energy isn’t worth it because it takes you out of a role that you might need and energy regens extremely fast; far too fast for me to care about switching for energy or even being concerned that my energy is low.

Energy
Energy management isn’t nearly as important as I thought it would be. I don’t really care if I run out of energy because my heal costs only 5, which is regen’d in less than a second it feels, and the auto attacks on revenant are very strong and usable throughout an energy drought. Energy only really came into play when using upkeeps; but I found flooding your upkeeps while playing with Glint to be a good way to turn off your facets without invoking their CDs; and it gives you a nice moment of having a lot of powerful boons.

I’m not sure the intended playstyle of Energy by the devs; but I basically cared much more about how many pips of regen/degen I had than how much energy I had. Having no energy wasn’t that detrimental to me.

Specializations
All the spec lines are great but have minor problems here and there… except for Salvation and Invocation.

It seems like most of the lines allow you to go into them and then use other legends and weapons that weren’t meant to gel with the lines. Say, I could go Corruption and use a sword/shield with Shiro and Jalis and I could get some useful things out of corruption for that build.

This is where Salvation falls short. Salvation is way too biased towards ventari and staff; to the point where the line is mostly a waste unless you have 1 of those 2 things. Ventari could possibly benefit from less benevolence and more base healing so that healing moves from the other legends could benefit. Without having ventari or a staff, the best I could do with the line is support this weak control type selection of traits. Staff/Ventari is too mandatory with the Salvation line.

As for Invocation, it has the problem of being difficult to use. Like I mentioned earlier, I spent most of my time camped in 1 legend and only swapped if the situation called for it or if I needed healing; due to heal skills having CDs and the other not. The traits related to energy in the Invocation line are better than the swapping traits. Taking advantage of legend swapping traits doesn’t come naturally because of lack of incentive to swap; I suppose invocation creates incentive; but does it outweigh swapping into a legend unfit for your current situation?

Final Thoughts
I can’t wait until HoT comes out and I can main this profession. It is by far the most fun I’ve had in a while; and as someone who has been fumbling to find his main in this game, this is very exciting. I have very few issues with Revenant other than the ones I’ve mentioned here. Great work.

Did PvP most of the weekend. What a wonderful class you have designed Roy, it is super fun to play. I got smacked around a lot but it was still really fun to learn the mechanics. It didn’t feel underpowered or overpowered at all, sure there are absolutely some minor tweaks to fix but overall really nice.

I played shiro/glint with knight/soldier gear and did many duels against a Scrapper. Every fight would last about 3-4 minutes and I lost the fights mainly because when his burst came I did not have the necessary energy to counter it (also he could restart the fight with stealth). I knew exact what to do, it was just not possible to do it.

I don’t think legend-swapping should reset energy, it doesn’t make sense that the resource you spent time/skill building up suddenly disappears just because you need to use another tool in your toolbox. It feels punishing and discouraging. “Oh I see you need to Riposting Shadows out of this cc or you will get rekt, but are in Glint-stance? Too bad let me remove a considerable amount of your resource…that you built up” I understand the need for a resource so you can’t just spam everything, but perhaps make it 75 energy on swap or something that doesn’t feel so… wingclipped?

Two more things:

Hammer 5 is absolutely useless in PvP, it hits nothing unless you fight complete noobs or peek out from behind a tree and attack people that has their backs turned against you. The casting time is too slow.

Glint “constipated old woman” scream is hilariously horrible, it sounds bizarre. The dragon sound effect on Chaotic release is awesome, something like that or something more Dragon-sounding would be great and shouldn’t be too hard to change? “Old woman”-sounds are quite simply not that fitting for an awesome knight of the mists…

So, from my experiences:

Was mostly playing around with the new Mallyx with my revenant time. Personally, I think Pain Absorption is fine: wiping all the conditions off your allies should have a price, and Mallyx gets to ameliorate that price by ignoring those conditions for a time. When on your own, I can think of times where that resistance is more useful than any condition cleanse that isn’t total: it makes sure you always get the one that REALLY matters.

Unyielding Anguish and Embrace the Darkness, though, feel a little redundant. There are certainly differences between the two, but both feel like they have ultimately the same purpose: the conversion of energy into Torment stacks across an area. That’s an interrelationship that’s likely to lead to one outcompeting the other pretty much always. Unyielding Anguish is still bugged when used at maximum range.

(I made a similar observation regarding the new Vengeful Hammers and Rite of the Great Dwarf, but in practise in the last two BWEs I’ve found them distinct enough to both be worthwhile. Between Unyielding Anguish and Embrace the Darkness… I could see situations where one would be slightly advantaged over the other by the conditions, but I think those distinctions are pretty small for two skills that will always be sharing the same skillbar.)

Inspiring Reinforcement is in a strange position: it has too much of a delay before the first stability stack is applied to be used reactively (I had a number of cases of finding my revenant on her back or otherwise CC’d on her own road…), but on its own it doesn’t feel like it generates enough stability to serve as a pre-emptive stability source like Hallowed Ground. Now that it’s been given a cooldown as well, it could possibly be allowed to generate longer-lasting stability stacks (2s, say, allowing them to stack 2 up and more with boon extension), or alternatively, make it apply a single stack to the revenant when the skill concludes so it can better be used reactively. (It’ll still be weaker used reactively than the likes of Stand Your Ground and Power Break, since it will still have a delay before affecting allies and isn’t also a stunbreak, but at least you can use it as a CC prevention for yourself.)

It’s good when combined with herald stuff to make the stability stacks double up on yourself and last longer, but currently, it’s in a bit of a ‘neither fish nor fowl’ state: it’s still stability on a reasonably short cooldown and that’s certainly worth having, but it doesn’t really fit well into either category of stability skills.

Still a lot of fun to play despite the above. Inspiring Reinforcement could probably be launched as is and we can see where it goes. The redundancy on the Mallyx skills is probably the biggest issue at the moment.

Malthurius.6870:

This is where Salvation falls short. Salvation is way too biased towards ventari and staff; to the point where the line is mostly a waste unless you have 1 of those 2 things. Ventari could possibly benefit from less benevolence and more base healing so that healing moves from the other legends could benefit. Without having ventari or a staff, the best I could do with the line is support this weak control type selection of traits. Staff/Ventari is too mandatory with the Salvation line.

As for Invocation, it has the problem of being difficult to use. Like I mentioned earlier, I spent most of my time camped in 1 legend and only swapped if the situation called for it or if I needed healing; due to heal skills having CDs and the other not. The traits related to energy in the Invocation line are better than the swapping traits. Taking advantage of legend swapping traits doesn’t come naturally because of lack of incentive to swap; I suppose invocation creates incentive; but does it outweigh swapping into a legend unfit for your current situation?

I agree that Salvation and Invocation (along with some traits from other lines) could use some work. Salvation is useless in anything other than a healing-oriented build. I tried using the control traits in WvW/PvP, but they were generally too weak to be worth it. I didn’t like Invocation primarily because it has one role – Rolling Mists. The other GM traits are too weak to be competitive at all, so anyone using Invocation is using it for the fury boost. I don’t think Rolling Mists should necessarily be nerfed, but I do think the other GMs need to be brought up to its level.

Some of the other trait lines had some traits that I found to be too weak to be worth considering. These traits include: (Devastation) Mutilate Defenses, (Corruption) Frigid Precision, (Retribution) Improved Aggression (atleast in WvW/PvP), Retaliatory Evasion, and Empowering Vengeance.

slow is bugging out revenant skills.

unrelenting assault
surge of the mist
riposting shadows
crystal hibernation
warding rift

they kinda lose their effects after the intended duration but the animation is longer due to slow, so you’re stuck not able to do anything.

I’ve not tested out the physical damage aspect of the class but I have extensively tested out the condition builds of the class. And I find it very balanced. The only thing that sticks out like a sore thumb is the skill “Phase Traversal”. It needs more energy cost and or shorter distance of us. As it is incredibly easy to enter and exit battles. Making the skill radical’s.

If I were to choose I would take away 10 energy cost from the skill “Riposting Shadows” and add 10 energy cost and decrees range to 900 to “Phase Traversal”. “Riposting Shadows” is one of those skills rarely used if you take all the other skills in to mind. So I believe making that skill when really needed to be of use and not find yourself with the lack of energy when you do need it.

Kidel.2057:

• Ventari:
  Sigh.
  Amazing legend but useless in the future meta if it’s so much inferior to Druid. In a scale from 1 to 10, where 1 is full zerker warrior, in terms of healing Ventari is 5, Druid is 11. There is almost no point in using it.
  It’s harder to use then Druid, heals less, does less boons (unless you give up healing to go into Dragon stance). Roy said that Druid is burst healing and Ventari is sustained, how when Celestial Avatar has no cooldown and can be loaded in less then 3 seconds? Druid makes healer Rev/Ele/Guardian something to laugh at. They’ll never be meta.

Staff is broken. Try with LB or Sword, it takes one minute to fill the Celestial bar.

Chaosbroker.3860:

Said this last BWE, but some minor customisation within legend choice by adding a single extra skill per legend would be helpful in allowing you to synergise your legend choices better.

I’m with you there. But so far as Roy appears to be concerned comments such as these might as well not be made. He’s never commented on this no matter how many times it’s been brought up.

So, Revenant. Fantastic profession so far. I will definitely be playing one as my main as soon as HoT launches. I have but two suggestions for the profession so far. One of them is a cosmetic suggestion, and the other is mechanics involving the Ventari Tablet.
First, the cosmetic; I’ve noticed that the Revenant hand-glow that changes color based on which legend you are channeling persists throughout the entirety of the Revenant’s existence. I’m a role-player and a fashion king, and the constant hand-glow is a bit off-putting. My suggestion; make the Revenant hand-glow and in-combat only graphical effect, much like how the elementalist’s elemental bracelets only show up while they have their weapon’s unsheathed. I know this is a minor detail, but I and many of my friends pointed it out, so I thought I’d offer the suggestion.

Second, the centaur stance; love the healing capabilities, but the tablet mobility is a serious issue. The issue was incredible exasperated in the raid’s first boss where my guild had to almost always be mobile. The druid, on the other hand, had a much easier time healing people on the fly because their healing was more positioned around themselves. Because of this, Revenant healing might fall far behind the potential that Druid has.

Here’s my suggestion; make the tablet hover next to the Revenant by default when it is summoned. When the Revenant moves, the tablet moves with him/her. Then, if the Revenant wants to send the tablet to another area, he/she can use the skill again to send it out towards the targeted area (like how the skill functions currently). The Revenant can then use the skill again to recall the tablet to him/her to resume “follow mode.”

Breakdown;
-#6 Summons Tablet; Tablet follows closely to Revenant by default.
-Using #6, Revenant can send tablet to targeted area, and it stays in that area until called back.
-Revenant can use #6 again while the tablet is stationary to summon it back to him/her to have the tablet follow him/her again.

This would make it much, much easier to position yourself to heal others, while still having the ability to send the tablet off into the distance to heal others who might need it. It would also make the Revenant’s healing much more competitive to Druid’s.

Feedback part 2:
Rev seems to be in a pretty good place but it still needs some adjustments.
1. Herald feels like easy mode. You have more energy since the utils don’t use energy and they do a fair amount of damage. You also get that facet of nature every 20s.
2. Mallyx isn’t viable or fun. You can get like 10-15 stacks of torment on an enemy tops. That’s not nearly enough damage output with full condi runes for anyone to take into PvP or pve.
3. Sword damage is a little high when you get 25 might stacks, which on rev and especially herald, pretty easy to do. I honestly think there might be a bug here because I was looking at the numbers and they weren’t adding up.
4. Jalis has the worst heal out of all of them. The animation on it is also a little clunky. It looks like its a 1.5s channel but cancels out 2/3s of the way.
5. Staff skill 4 is bugged. It doesn’t cleanse conditions.
6. Phase traversal is powerful. You can go anywhere with it with no CD. I like it but could use a nerf.

I’m excited for rev when it comes out.

Mallyx isn’t fun anymore, doesn’t have a role (as counter D/D and counter condi-teamfight) and all I do is basically spam the boonremoval.

- Because you don’t have basic condis like bleeding without sigils, stuff gets cleansed more easily
- No real range-options and the change of Mallyx and various other aspects (low amount of stunbreakers) make Mallyx-rev useless in teamfights now.
- Very very low amount of condi-cleanse was tolerable in 1v1’s cuz of the resistance-uptime and the fact you gave the condis right back. Now, the dmg is way too low to have a chance against D/D-Ele and other 1v1-builds.
- Pain absorbtion is now utterly useless because of the change of the Mallyx-Elite. Why would I take the risk to absorb all the condis in a teamfight if I can be killed with one simple boonstrip? Condis are way easier to remove when they are on multiple targets anyways, cuz of all the AoE condicleanse…. With the old elite, it was risk VS reward; I had to choose when to take the risk to get the reward – now it’s risk VS no reward. ;(

Just as I said when I heard about the change; it’s just a bad idea in every aspect imaginable: You took an amazing skill with tons of synergy (and more than enough ways to counter it, like boonsrtip) and teamfight-potential, which actually gave the rev a few pretty clear roles and made it uninteresting und useless.

I’m heavily in favour of changing it back, since I had no Idea why it got changed in the first place: you could’ve maybe just tweaked the numbers a bit.

Rev. looks really nice atm, except mallyx.

The traits at mallyx: Replenishing Despair, Bolstered Anguish and Pulsating Pestilence looks like they depend on the old schema. they are not good atm.

The elite is to weak for the -7 energy reg.

some bugs i found:

slow breaks some skills (UA, blocks etc)

staff 4 doesn’t always cleanse condis. not sure why

sometimes energy regen is slow after swapping legends

projectile on auto chain #2 bugs out