Guild Wars 2

Malchior.5732:

Varezenem.2813:

Harbinger.5129:

Serophous.9085:

Don’t worry revs, you got a lot of stuff warriors could’ve used. Now, you’ll be sitting down there soon with them

At least warriors are still fun to play, which is something that revs never were (in my personal opinion, of course).

Ventari is fun IMO condi rev and auramancing tempest weren’t that’s why I didn’t play them.

Condi Rev used to be fun…

Not for me TBH but that’s for every ones preference.
For example there are quite a few people that want Ventari to be a druid or tempest clone. I wouldn’t like it since both play styles care a lot less about positioning and are a lot more spammy.

Fun is subjective anyways.

Wolfs Shadow.7234:

Zoltar MacRoth.7146:

As someone who’s just made a revenant and is learning to play it, I have to ask….. can you shed some light on what exactly you don’t like about it? You don’t offer any details in your post.

Hopefully it was a serious question because I will provide an actual answer to it.

From a dedicated Revenant. And a truly honest response.

The concept behind Revenants was the focus around energy management and not on cool downs. It does require skill to play for this matter. The issue is they arived out the gate as OP….. and there begins the problem.

The bumpy road most traveled by….. ANET…. Overnerf.

Q: So why do revenants hate what anet is doing?

1. Adding cooldowns to a class that already needs to micromanage their energy, their elites, their skill rotation and their surrounding. This also goes directly against what we were told about the revenant. That there would be very minimal cool downs.
2. Nerfing boons/buffs that are directly related to a revenants elite. (Quickness, Energy)
3. Nerfing the only elites the rev get use out of without looking into the most unused ones. And buffing those (Ventari & Jalace).

Just because Rev’s focus on Energy Management does not ‘free’ them of the burden of CD’s … In fact, if the premise of your argument was correct, they would be more like an initiative mechanic like thieves

So obviously, you are wrong. Anet intends for CDs to be a ‘thing’ on Revs, even WITH energy management.

Problem with Rev is that it’s new … it hasn’t been around for 3 years to get the polish. Hell, even after three years some classes are still getting polished. Now people expect Revs, after ONE round of balancing, to come out like there is nothing wrong with the class? These threads just confirm one thing; MMO players have MUCH to learn about class development, need a good dose of humility and a sprinkle of reason.

Obtena.7952:

Wolfs Shadow.7234:

Zoltar MacRoth.7146:

As someone who’s just made a revenant and is learning to play it, I have to ask….. can you shed some light on what exactly you don’t like about it? You don’t offer any details in your post.

Hopefully it was a serious question because I will provide an actual answer to it.

From a dedicated Revenant. And a truly honest response.

The concept behind Revenants was the focus around energy management and not on cool downs. It does require skill to play for this matter. The issue is they arived out the gate as OP….. and there begins the problem.

The bumpy road most traveled by….. ANET…. Overnerf.

Q: So why do revenants hate what anet is doing?

1. Adding cooldowns to a class that already needs to micromanage their energy, their elites, their skill rotation and their surrounding. This also goes directly against what we were told about the revenant. That there would be very minimal cool downs.
2. Nerfing boons/buffs that are directly related to a revenants elite. (Quickness, Energy)
3. Nerfing the only elites the rev get use out of without looking into the most unused ones. And buffing those (Ventari & Jalace).

1. This one is quite shocking: because this one alone has basically made the Rev Glint useless.

• Note: Revenants is one of the top classes to apply multiple boons both to themselves & teammates.

• Note: Revenants greatest weakness is the lack of condi removal. In fact they are the worst class to remove condis.

• Balance patch: Giving a condi heavy class (Necro) the ability to convert boons in to conditions

• Balance patch: Nerfing the strongest and only useful heal Revenants have.

Additional nerfs that actually hurt revenant without taking the class into account. (Quickness, Sigil of Energy, rune of durability)

Trying not make assumptions, but it was a overnerf based on stats alone.

I personally do not hate the Revenant, but I do hate having put my heart and soul into several classes just to watch them turn into mush based on a communities QQ level.

As a result I quit GW2. I was curious what this patch would bring.

So obviously, you are wrong. Anet intends for CDs to be a ‘thing’ on Revs, even WITH energy management.

The whole point was to have minimal amount of CDs on utilities (sorta like a utility-initiative system) and to balance them around energy. Only a couple skills had any CDs at all, but that number has increased and now it feels like energy is more of an extra burden rather than a balancing factor.

Edit: they had 3 years worth to learn from, 3 beta weekends, and then several more patches (of which we barely got any fixes).
Revenant shouldn’t be this non-functional at this stage.

Like I said, if that was the whole point, Revs would have become more like a Theif initiative management system. If that was the case, I suspect they would be even HARDER to balance than the energy management system, based on how much Anet struggles with Thieves. Minimal CD’s are in a practical sense, non-existent CD’s. When I can set my Auto on Hammer to #2, THAT is a problem.

So recognize this; the smaller the CD’s, the more like Thieves Reves look. I get it, everything is a nerf until you can see three years down the road that nerf NEEDED to happen to get there.

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Wolfs Shadow.7234:

Zoltar MacRoth.7146:

As someone who’s just made a revenant and is learning to play it, I have to ask….. can you shed some light on what exactly you don’t like about it? You don’t offer any details in your post.

Hopefully it was a serious question because I will provide an actual answer to it.

From a dedicated Revenant. And a truly honest response.

The concept behind Revenants was the focus around energy management and not on cool downs. It does require skill to play for this matter. The issue is they arived out the gate as OP….. and there begins the problem.

The bumpy road most traveled by….. ANET…. Overnerf.

Q: So why do revenants hate what anet is doing?

1. Adding cooldowns to a class that already needs to micromanage their energy, their elites, their skill rotation and their surrounding. This also goes directly against what we were told about the revenant. That there would be very minimal cool downs.
2. Nerfing boons/buffs that are directly related to a revenants elite. (Quickness, Energy)
3. Nerfing the only elites the rev get use out of without looking into the most unused ones. And buffing those (Ventari & Jalace).

1. This one is quite shocking: because this one alone has basically made the Rev Glint useless.

• Note: Revenants is one of the top classes to apply multiple boons both to themselves & teammates.

• Note: Revenants greatest weakness is the lack of condi removal. In fact they are the worst class to remove condis.

• Balance patch: Giving a condi heavy class (Necro) the ability to convert boons in to conditions

• Balance patch: Nerfing the strongest and only useful heal Revenants have.

Additional nerfs that actually hurt revenant without taking the class into account. (Quickness, Sigil of Energy, rune of durability)

Trying not make assumptions, but it was a overnerf based on stats alone.

I personally do not hate the Revenant, but I do hate having put my heart and soul into several classes just to watch them turn into mush based on a communities QQ level.

As a result I quit GW2. I was curious what this patch would bring.

So obviously, you are wrong. Anet intends for CDs to be a ‘thing’ on Revs, even WITH energy management.

Edit: they had 3 years worth to learn from, 3 beta weekends, and then several more patches (of which we barely got any fixes).
Revenant shouldn’t be this non-functional at this stage.

Didn’t you mean 2 bwes? After all “we are in a good spot”.

Varezenem.2813:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Wolfs Shadow.7234:

Zoltar MacRoth.7146:

As someone who’s just made a revenant and is learning to play it, I have to ask….. can you shed some light on what exactly you don’t like about it? You don’t offer any details in your post.

Hopefully it was a serious question because I will provide an actual answer to it.

From a dedicated Revenant. And a truly honest response.

The concept behind Revenants was the focus around energy management and not on cool downs. It does require skill to play for this matter. The issue is they arived out the gate as OP….. and there begins the problem.

The bumpy road most traveled by….. ANET…. Overnerf.

Q: So why do revenants hate what anet is doing?

1. Adding cooldowns to a class that already needs to micromanage their energy, their elites, their skill rotation and their surrounding. This also goes directly against what we were told about the revenant. That there would be very minimal cool downs.
2. Nerfing boons/buffs that are directly related to a revenants elite. (Quickness, Energy)
3. Nerfing the only elites the rev get use out of without looking into the most unused ones. And buffing those (Ventari & Jalace).

1. This one is quite shocking: because this one alone has basically made the Rev Glint useless.

• Note: Revenants is one of the top classes to apply multiple boons both to themselves & teammates.

• Note: Revenants greatest weakness is the lack of condi removal. In fact they are the worst class to remove condis.

• Balance patch: Giving a condi heavy class (Necro) the ability to convert boons in to conditions

• Balance patch: Nerfing the strongest and only useful heal Revenants have.

Additional nerfs that actually hurt revenant without taking the class into account. (Quickness, Sigil of Energy, rune of durability)

Trying not make assumptions, but it was a overnerf based on stats alone.

I personally do not hate the Revenant, but I do hate having put my heart and soul into several classes just to watch them turn into mush based on a communities QQ level.

As a result I quit GW2. I was curious what this patch would bring.

So obviously, you are wrong. Anet intends for CDs to be a ‘thing’ on Revs, even WITH energy management.

Edit: they had 3 years worth to learn from, 3 beta weekends, and then several more patches (of which we barely got any fixes).
Revenant shouldn’t be this non-functional at this stage.

Didn’t you mean 2 bwes? After all “we are in a good spot”.

I won’t debate with you, but NO one with a reasonable expectation will think that 2 BWE’s will result in a balanced class at release.

Obtena.7952:

Like I said, if that was the whole point, Revs would have become more like a Theif initiative management system. If that was the case, I suspect they would be even HARDER to balance than the energy management system, based on how much Anet struggles with Thieves. Minimal CD’s are in a practical sense, non-existent CD’s. When I can set my Auto on Hammer to #2, THAT is a problem.

So recognize this; the smaller the CD’s, the more like Thieves Reves look. I get it, everything is a nerf until you can see three years down the road that nerf NEEDED to happen to get there.

Ugh, we have even more to “balance” us out than Thieves do since we share energy across weapon skills and utilities.
Hammer 2 had too short of a CD, yes, but then the rest of Hammer is pretty mediocre! How is that still like this? Why didn’t they try moving the power from Hammer 2 to the other skills? Why didn’t they try anything at all?

Also, minimal CDs is NOTHING like no cooldowns. Suddenly, Phase Traversal went from a somewhat reliable teleport to being affected by chill, able to be punished HARD by Mesmers (enjoy that 15s CD), and now when it fails, you also get a full CD and lost 20 energy.
Almost every Revenant would have preferred an energy increase rather than kitten CD for multiple reasons (which includes the fact that the CD removes the energy management from the skill; you can literally spam it off cooldown if you wanted and you would end up with a net GAIN of energy).

There’s nothing to excuse here. The class has been out for a while, we had multiple betas, and we’re still riddled with bugs and unfixed issues. I didn’t expect balance, I expected functionality.

Obtena.7952:

Varezenem.2813:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Wolfs Shadow.7234:

Zoltar MacRoth.7146:

As someone who’s just made a revenant and is learning to play it, I have to ask….. can you shed some light on what exactly you don’t like about it? You don’t offer any details in your post.

Hopefully it was a serious question because I will provide an actual answer to it.

From a dedicated Revenant. And a truly honest response.

The concept behind Revenants was the focus around energy management and not on cool downs. It does require skill to play for this matter. The issue is they arived out the gate as OP….. and there begins the problem.

The bumpy road most traveled by….. ANET…. Overnerf.

Q: So why do revenants hate what anet is doing?

1. Adding cooldowns to a class that already needs to micromanage their energy, their elites, their skill rotation and their surrounding. This also goes directly against what we were told about the revenant. That there would be very minimal cool downs.
2. Nerfing boons/buffs that are directly related to a revenants elite. (Quickness, Energy)
3. Nerfing the only elites the rev get use out of without looking into the most unused ones. And buffing those (Ventari & Jalace).

1. This one is quite shocking: because this one alone has basically made the Rev Glint useless.

• Note: Revenants is one of the top classes to apply multiple boons both to themselves & teammates.

• Note: Revenants greatest weakness is the lack of condi removal. In fact they are the worst class to remove condis.

• Balance patch: Giving a condi heavy class (Necro) the ability to convert boons in to conditions

• Balance patch: Nerfing the strongest and only useful heal Revenants have.

Additional nerfs that actually hurt revenant without taking the class into account. (Quickness, Sigil of Energy, rune of durability)

Trying not make assumptions, but it was a overnerf based on stats alone.

I personally do not hate the Revenant, but I do hate having put my heart and soul into several classes just to watch them turn into mush based on a communities QQ level.

As a result I quit GW2. I was curious what this patch would bring.

So obviously, you are wrong. Anet intends for CDs to be a ‘thing’ on Revs, even WITH energy management.

Edit: they had 3 years worth to learn from, 3 beta weekends, and then several more patches (of which we barely got any fixes).
Revenant shouldn’t be this non-functional at this stage.

Didn’t you mean 2 bwes? After all “we are in a good spot”.

I won’t debate with you, but NO one with a reasonable expectation will think that 2 BWE’s will result in a balanced class at release.

Seems like you are new to rev then because that’s exactly what we were told when we asked as to why they didn’t buff ventari/jalis after bwe3.

The only complaint revenants should be making is that Jalis and Ventari were never buffed.

killahmayne.9518:

The only complaint revenants should be making is that Jalis and Ventari were never buffed.

I would argue that mallyx needs buffs too now, considering the fact that their counters were buffed immensely and they got nerfed quite a bit too. For example for the previous output of boon removal/corrupt demonic defiance at a 5 sec cooldown was OK now it clearly isn’t.

fellyn.5083:

Samnang.1879:

Kattenpootjes.4291:

Samnang.1879:

“it is a very hard profession to master”

Is this sarcasm???

Raid / Meta wise he’s right, but for pve it’s just 1111 :p

I’ll have to kindly disagree.

In raids, revenant is the easiest class for me to play, I don’t know, maybe I’m a natural at revenant? But I literally have to beg people to not let me play revenant because it’s so boring and you can’t die, ever. There’s like 0.0000000001% of me dying as a rev. There’s like a heal skills that fully heals you for 3seconds, and a toughness trait that gives 1400 toughness…

Whereas if I play chrono or ele, I have a higher chance of downing in raids because I’m doing much more complex skill rotations + very low health.

Well it’s easy to understand because you must be the best player to grace the game with your presence. It’s not like you’re exaggerating to suit your argument at all. Nope, none of that going on.

I’m far from the best, I make tons of mistakes, died tons of times. I even fully died once in fractals level 2 post-HoT as veteran player.

All I’m saying is revenant is not hard for me to master… I’m not trying to brag about my mmo skills.
So I’m just surprised.

Varezenem.2813:

killahmayne.9518:

The only complaint revenants should be making is that Jalis and Ventari were never buffed.

I would argue that mallyx needs buffs too now, considering the fact that their counters were buffed immensely and they got nerfed quite a bit too. For example for the previous output of boon removal/corrupt demonic defiance at a 5 sec cooldown was OK now it clearly isn’t.

That, I will admit as well. But revenants are far from destroyed.

killahmayne.9518:

Varezenem.2813:

killahmayne.9518:

The only complaint revenants should be making is that Jalis and Ventari were never buffed.

I would argue that mallyx needs buffs too now, considering the fact that their counters were buffed immensely and they got nerfed quite a bit too. For example for the previous output of boon removal/corrupt demonic defiance at a 5 sec cooldown was OK now it clearly isn’t.

That, I will admit as well. But revenants are far from destroyed.

Yea, but saying we should only complain about Jalis and Ventari is silly.
We have a ton of bugs and issues littered through out the entire class.

Sword 2,3,5 are all buggy and 5 in particular is mostly useless.
Sword 4’s follow-up is worthless.

Hammer 2 being useless if there’s more than one Revenant is a big issue, along with all the terrain bugs that Hammer 2,3, and 5 all have.
Hammer in-general being mediocre and awful at kiting is an issue.

Shield being just for healing is an issue.

Mallyx and the Corruption line both have to be changed to accommodate his “overhaul”. Relies way too much on Resistance, and now it’s going to be a big problem any time a necromancer looks in your general direction. Before, you could sorta play around it with Facet of Nature, but now I don’t see it happening.

The over-reliance on Herald is an issue, albeit not unique to Revenant.

Enhanced Bulwark being untouched, but Unwavering Avoidance being nerfed is an issue (the former’s only real use is with the latter!).

Underwater Revenant is unfinished (even excluding Glint, UW Mallyx still has the old Unyielding Anguish!).

Etc.

Yes, Revenant isn’t dead, but getting nerfed so much while NONE of the issues are fixed (actually, they fixed Staff 4…which wasn’t broken in Beta…so I don’t think that counts as a “fixed issue” when it broke afterwards) is concerning.

Varezenem.2813:

Obtena.7952:

Varezenem.2813:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Wolfs Shadow.7234:

Zoltar MacRoth.7146:

As someone who’s just made a revenant and is learning to play it, I have to ask….. can you shed some light on what exactly you don’t like about it? You don’t offer any details in your post.

Hopefully it was a serious question because I will provide an actual answer to it.

From a dedicated Revenant. And a truly honest response.

The concept behind Revenants was the focus around energy management and not on cool downs. It does require skill to play for this matter. The issue is they arived out the gate as OP….. and there begins the problem.

The bumpy road most traveled by….. ANET…. Overnerf.

Q: So why do revenants hate what anet is doing?

1. Adding cooldowns to a class that already needs to micromanage their energy, their elites, their skill rotation and their surrounding. This also goes directly against what we were told about the revenant. That there would be very minimal cool downs.
2. Nerfing boons/buffs that are directly related to a revenants elite. (Quickness, Energy)
3. Nerfing the only elites the rev get use out of without looking into the most unused ones. And buffing those (Ventari & Jalace).

1. This one is quite shocking: because this one alone has basically made the Rev Glint useless.

• Note: Revenants is one of the top classes to apply multiple boons both to themselves & teammates.

• Note: Revenants greatest weakness is the lack of condi removal. In fact they are the worst class to remove condis.

• Balance patch: Giving a condi heavy class (Necro) the ability to convert boons in to conditions

• Balance patch: Nerfing the strongest and only useful heal Revenants have.

Additional nerfs that actually hurt revenant without taking the class into account. (Quickness, Sigil of Energy, rune of durability)

Trying not make assumptions, but it was a overnerf based on stats alone.

I personally do not hate the Revenant, but I do hate having put my heart and soul into several classes just to watch them turn into mush based on a communities QQ level.

As a result I quit GW2. I was curious what this patch would bring.

So obviously, you are wrong. Anet intends for CDs to be a ‘thing’ on Revs, even WITH energy management.

Edit: they had 3 years worth to learn from, 3 beta weekends, and then several more patches (of which we barely got any fixes).
Revenant shouldn’t be this non-functional at this stage.

Didn’t you mean 2 bwes? After all “we are in a good spot”.

I won’t debate with you, but NO one with a reasonable expectation will think that 2 BWE’s will result in a balanced class at release.

Seems like you are new to rev then because that’s exactly what we were told when we asked as to why they didn’t buff ventari/jalis after bwe3.

I think whatever statement was made, you simply took it out of context to ‘prove’ whatever negative thinking you have about Anet, which of course ignores the history we have for their balancing cycles. Even if that statement was made, we know it’s not true.

Besides, the incessant ‘Revs are dead/destroyed’ … haven’t most of us been here long enough to know this is nonsense? It’s going to take a long time for Anet to make up for those changes … IF they think it needs to happen. We know their balance cycles. Time to get with the program people.

Yes, there are lots of things lacking … and it would have been STUPID for Anet to pile on more of those lacking things while some other things were wildly OPed. If none of you have noticed, this is how the works, and not just in GW2. The OPed stuff gets the nerfs first, then whatever needed to boost the rest, IF needed. And I don’t fault Anet for letting the players gain some experiences with the current version before (if) they make those boosts, otherwise you’re going to get even MORE QQing clueless players on the forums.

Obtena.7952:

I think whatever statement was made, you simply took it out of context to ‘prove’ whatever negative thinking you have about Anet, which of course ignores the history we have for their balancing cycles. Even if that statement was made, we know it’s not true.

Roy Cronacher.1576:

Overall, after the last BWE, we felt like revenant was in a solid spot. For launch we mainly focused on bug fixing and a few outliers such as changing the second hit of the sword auto-attack as well as speeding up the tablet move speed.

That’s not to say that there aren’t more things we are thinking about how to improve or tweak, but we want the profession to get in more playtime and thus more feedback before we make any more larger changes. I’m definitely reading all the feedback and taking under consideration for future changes so keep up the awesome work.

My only agenda here is making ventari viable. It was before the last patch in spvp it’s not anymore. On that bug fixing part.

Yea, but saying we should only complain about Jalis and Ventari is silly.
We have a ton of bugs and issues littered through out the entire class.

Sword 2,3,5 are all buggy and 5 in particular is mostly useless.
Sword 4’s follow-up is worthless.

Hammer 2 being useless if there’s more than one Revenant is a big issue, along with all the terrain bugs that Hammer 2,3, and 5 all have.
Hammer in-general being mediocre and awful at kiting is an issue.

Shield being just for healing is an issue.

Mallyx and the Corruption line both have to be changed to accommodate his “overhaul”. Relies way too much on Resistance, and now it’s going to be a big problem any time a necromancer looks in your general direction. Before, you could sorta play around it with Facet of Nature, but now I don’t see it happening.

The over-reliance on Herald is an issue, albeit not unique to Revenant.

Enhanced Bulwark being untouched, but Unwavering Avoidance being nerfed is an issue (the former’s only real use is with the latter!).

Underwater Revenant is unfinished (even excluding Glint, UW Mallyx still has the old Unyielding Anguish!).

Etc.

Yes, Revenant isn’t dead, but getting nerfed so much while NONE of the issues are fixed (actually, they fixed Staff 4…which wasn’t broken in Beta…so I don’t think that counts as a “fixed issue” when it broke afterwards) is concerning.

You are also mistaken if you believe that I think Anet is some kind of evil overlord that is out there to screw revs. What I do believe is that this last balance patch was mostly terrible and if you look at the official feedback thread that around 80%-90% of the feedback mentions that too.
Also within this subforum since BWE3 it has been mentioned that Jalis and Ventari are greatly underpowered. So the feedback was there.

Obtena.7952:

Yes, there are lots of things lacking … and it would have been STUPID for Anet to pile on more of those lacking things while some other things were wildly OPed. If none of you have noticed, this is how the works, and not just in GW2. The OPed stuff gets the nerfs first, then whatever needed to boost the rest, IF needed. And I don’t fault Anet for letting the players gain some experiences with the current version before (if) they make those boosts, otherwise you’re going to get even MORE QQing clueless players on the forums.

Sorry, you must be new here.
How long did it take to fix simple Mesmer bugs? 3 years was it?
How long did it take for Necro to get a proper overhaul? 3 years was it?
How long will it take for Revenant to get a proper overhaul? 3 years too?

Fun fact is that core necro (shroud) still sux balls even after 3 years compared to lets say.. reaper shroud. Axe, focus are also a joke weapons, dagger mh is just 1 fest spam and gs is used in pve only due to how terrible it is. And that took..3 years. Are they op right now? Sure condi builds definitely but power is a joke along with the stuff i mentioned.

Meanwhile revenant armor is still bugged, chest has different color than rest of the armor in medium shaders and weapons clipping. Another fun fact, inst it?

I would like to add to this that all the “easy to master” discussion only applies to 2/5 of the class. Mallyx is not super-easy (though not hard either) and Jalis/ventari just needs help to even function well on a basic level.

It’s still a new class so I guess it is to be expected there are things to work out, however it’s easy to start speculating if the legend design really worked out properly. Since it’s fun to play some of them for sure I like to think it’s possible iterations down the line.

Amethyst Lure.5624:

I would like to add to this that all the “easy to master” discussion only applies to 2/5 of the class. Mallyx is not super-easy (though not hard either) and Jalis/ventari just needs help to even function well on a basic level.

It’s still a new class so I guess it is to be expected there are things to work out, however it’s easy to start speculating if the legend design really worked out properly. Since it’s fun to play some of them for sure I like to think it’s possible iterations down the line.

I can guarantee one thing. If they fix ventari properly it’ll be harder to master than tempest and druid… But it’ll be fun \o/.

Being harder is a consequence of being focused on micromanaging in case anyone asks.

KamiKaZe.8173:

it is a very hard profession to master

Bahahaha

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Yes, there are lots of things lacking … and it would have been STUPID for Anet to pile on more of those lacking things while some other things were wildly OPed. If none of you have noticed, this is how the works, and not just in GW2. The OPed stuff gets the nerfs first, then whatever needed to boost the rest, IF needed. And I don’t fault Anet for letting the players gain some experiences with the current version before (if) they make those boosts, otherwise you’re going to get even MORE QQing clueless players on the forums.

Sorry, you must be new here.
How long did it take to fix simple Mesmer bugs? 3 years was it?
How long did it take for Necro to get a proper overhaul? 3 years was it?
How long will it take for Revenant to get a proper overhaul? 3 years too?

I’m not new and I did said it takes a long time for these things to be worked out. I’m not defending that; it’s just how it works. Deal with it.

The fact is that it’s NORMAL that some bugs take a long time to get fixed; in fact some NEVER get fixed in MMO’s; including GW2. And I’m the new one here?

Obtena.7952:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Yes, there are lots of things lacking … and it would have been STUPID for Anet to pile on more of those lacking things while some other things were wildly OPed. If none of you have noticed, this is how the works, and not just in GW2. The OPed stuff gets the nerfs first, then whatever needed to boost the rest, IF needed. And I don’t fault Anet for letting the players gain some experiences with the current version before (if) they make those boosts, otherwise you’re going to get even MORE QQing clueless players on the forums.

Sorry, you must be new here.
How long did it take to fix simple Mesmer bugs? 3 years was it?
How long did it take for Necro to get a proper overhaul? 3 years was it?
How long will it take for Revenant to get a proper overhaul? 3 years too?

I’m not new and I did said it takes a long time for these things to be worked out. I’m not defending that; it’s just how it works. Deal with it.

The fact is that it’s NORMAL that some bugs take a long time to get fixed; in fact some NEVER get fixed in MMO’s; including GW2. And I’m the new one here?

Yes, you are.
This is normal for Anet. That’s why we want change and that’s why we complain. It’s literally the only thing we can do to hopefully get them to change or fix something.
Do you really think it’s okay to wait years for basic issues to be fixed? After tons of people paid $50+ for this expansion that includes a half-functional class?

There’s no reason to defend Anet, or any company, on this. There are issues. People WILL complain until they get fixed.

Do I think it’s OK or not is irrelevant; I’ve been here 3 years+ and that’s long enough to know Anet has a process for fixing bugs, and they do. I also know Anet has balancing cycles and those don’t happen in a week or two. I also know ranting about it on the forums is a pretty useless activity; Anet has given guidelines on how to give good feedback; you should try reading that as well.

You’re just sensational and it doesn’t make your point any stronger; half functional class? You must be with the guy that finds Rev hard to play.

I find it hard to believe that you don’t think this class is riddled with bugs and half-finished concepts.

Malchior.5732:

I find it hard to believe that you don’t think this class is riddled with bugs and half-finished concepts.

I find it hard to believe you got that idea from ANYTHING I have posted thus far.

Obtena.7952:

Malchior.5732:

I find it hard to believe that you don’t think this class is riddled with bugs and half-finished concepts.

I find it hard to believe you got that idea from ANYTHING I have posted thus far.

“You’re just sensational and it doesn’t make your point any stronger; half functional class? You must be with the guy that finds Rev hard to play.”

Sensational: “presenting information in a way that is intended to provoke public interest and excitement, at the expense of accuracy.”

Seems like you were trying to make that point.

So you’re saying that I’m accusing you of being sensational about Revenant being a half-functional class is indicative that I’m in denial that Rev is a class ‘riddled with bugs and half-finished concepts’? Alrighty then. I guess I will stick with my opinion of how sensational you are being.

Frankly, I don’t even know where you’re going with this; fixing bugs is a different activity than balancing a class so complaining about fixing bugs in a thread about ‘destroying Revs because of a few changes’ seems illogical to me.

It’s not just about bugs…

To be honest I agree with OP
REV had good DPS in PVE also great support now …..their DPS is mediocre …..Even my Power necro with Dagger pull off better DPS….

Since all the nerfs were focused on power revs the assumption is that power revs were tearing it up. Where they? They were pretty powerful in PvE, but other than that the answer is no.

In addition there is a serious issue with the current way sword is structured (and I am not talking about AA). It is clear Anet wants sword to be focused more towards single target, which is okay, except the damage drops significantly if there is more than one target, which is almost always the case in every game mode. This makes the focus of sword single target damage pointless.

Then what is really under performing, Jails, ventari and staff, is untouched. While not all the changes were not correct, but overall if the goal of these changes is to balance rev, they are epic fail changes on all levels and by all means. The missed the mark in every possible way.

Chaith.8256:

KamiKaZe.8173:

it is a very hard profession to master

Bahahaha

Chaith, the silent forum lurker strikes where you don’t expect! Tbh, most popular PvP builds are easy to play and effective, that’s why they’re popular. I like the Revenant because concept behind profession is quite solid, even if execution is lacking in many places. There’s a lot of potential in the mechanics.

In general, at least in PvP, you guys should take a closer look at that Precision Strike. Yeah, it’s buggy af and any AI screws with it, but I kinda like the feeling and damage can be obscene.

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

Agemnon.4608:

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

People don’t see the whole picture. They see what they want to see, exclude the rest, ignore parts of the reality that prevent them from coming to logical conclusions. It’s easier to ragepost than it is to think how to adapt, though one is more effective than the other.

Obtena.7952:

Agemnon.4608:

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

People don’t see the whole picture. They see what they want to see, exclude the rest, ignore parts of the reality that prevent them from coming to logical conclusions. It’s easier to ragepost than it is to think how to adapt, though one is more effective than the other.

Or maybe we don’t mind the nerfs, but hate the fact that all the weak aspects were completely untouched?
I agree that people don’t see the whole picture. That much is clear from your post and many others.

That’s you just not recognizing their balancing cycles, understanding history, etc …

That’s OK, these threads make a huge impact on Anet’s decisions >< I hope people make more. In the meantime, if people are actually any good at playing the class, they will adapt.

So you want people to NOT complain about poor decisions on Anet’s part?
Their balancing history is no excuse to send out such bad changes. I will complain, people will complain. Does that mean I won’t adapt? Of course not. That still doesn’t excuse such bad practices and as a customer, I WILL complain.

Malchior.5732:

So you want people to NOT complain about poor decisions on Anet’s part?
Their balancing history is no excuse to send out such bad changes. I will complain, people will complain. Does that mean I won’t adapt? Of course not. That still doesn’t excuse such bad practices and as a customer, I WILL complain.

Malchior.5732:

So you want people to NOT complain about poor decisions on Anet’s part?
Their balancing history is no excuse to send out such bad changes. I will complain, people will complain. Does that mean I won’t adapt? Of course not. That still doesn’t excuse such bad practices and as a customer, I WILL complain.

Like I said, which you ignored, you don’t know what the future holds, so you don’t know if these are poor decisions; lack of seeing the whole picture.

I’m not discouraging complaining, but your complaining about something we have seen as standard practice since day 1. GL.

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Agemnon.4608:

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

People don’t see the whole picture. They see what they want to see, exclude the rest, ignore parts of the reality that prevent them from coming to logical conclusions. It’s easier to ragepost than it is to think how to adapt, though one is more effective than the other.

Or maybe we don’t mind the nerfs, but hate the fact that all the weak aspects were completely untouched?
I agree that people don’t see the whole picture. That much is clear from your post and many others.

Ventari needs serious fixing but if it’s tweaked to be viable in PvP it may be “OP” in PvE. Yet another solution that can be solved by separate balancing. To be PvP ready it needs faster charge times and less energy consumption. By the time it pumps out a heal or even cleanse the players you wanted to heal or cleanse would likely have ran out of the tablet’s range.

I adapted by nearly leaving gw2 ( already about 2 weeks before the season 1 ended).

All and ill say it again all classes needed a nerf as there is too much spam in general, let it be condi, boons, evades or whatever.

But instead we see rev nerfed, mes nerfed, ele nerfed, scrapper untouched despite being broken, thief buffed which makes absolutely no sense, necromancer buffed to braindead level where all you have to do is faceroll keyboard for your kill. Thats not balance by any means. HoT power creep was too high and its wasnt adressed, all they did is switch between opness between few classes.

The only reason you might see rev on tourney is due to the nerf that ESL rules now prevents stacking. Otherwise people would run something like thief, necro, 2x scrapper, druid.

Power rev is not really something i consider playable as hes too unreliable due to the overall changes and bugs that are here and doing well. So far the only class in game that deals less and less damage the more targets show up and yet in 1v1 he has a fairy high chances to lose the fight vs thief, scrapper, druid, necro or even mesmer now. It will be interesing to see how it play out at organized teams.

Agemnon.4608:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Agemnon.4608:

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

People don’t see the whole picture. They see what they want to see, exclude the rest, ignore parts of the reality that prevent them from coming to logical conclusions. It’s easier to ragepost than it is to think how to adapt, though one is more effective than the other.

Or maybe we don’t mind the nerfs, but hate the fact that all the weak aspects were completely untouched?
I agree that people don’t see the whole picture. That much is clear from your post and many others.

Ventari needs serious fixing but if it’s tweaked to be viable in PvP it may be “OP” in PvE. Yet another solution that can be solved by separate balancing. To be PvP ready it needs faster charge times and less energy consumption. By the time it pumps out a heal or even cleanse the players you wanted to heal or cleanse would likely have ran out of the tablet’s range.

It’s mainly salvation which need tweeks. Salvation has 0 possibility to be used with others traitline coz there is no talents that can be used outside ventari stance or usefull to revenant in general. Salvation’s traitline and ventari legend also suffer from a lack of self sustain coz there is no talent for improve self survivability and the tablet of ventari is to clunky for being usefull for self healing and be usable in pvp (5vs5). Where Ventari can be usefull is in big groups like wvw or raid but, even here, he suffer from being too weak and clunky to use. He is never picked. Ventari/salvation, Jailis/retribution and corruption traitline (so half revenant) needs tweeks and changes to be used and be proper. That’s what revenant need to be a true class (i mean out of beta state than can only use 2 legends and full of glitches)

Burtnik: “Power rev is not really something i consider playable as hes too unreliable due to the overall changes and bugs that are here and doing well. So far the only class in game that deals less and less damage the more targets show up and yet in 1v1 he has a fairy high chances to lose the fight vs thief, scrapper, druid, necro or even mesmer now. It will be interesing to see how it play out at organized teams.”

Yeah i don’t really love power revenant too but it’s really (mainly herald) the only viable builds we have. I would really enjoy to be viable with Glint/Jailis or Mallyx/jailis. Maybe one day if we can dream.

Agemnon.4608:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Agemnon.4608:

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

People don’t see the whole picture. They see what they want to see, exclude the rest, ignore parts of the reality that prevent them from coming to logical conclusions. It’s easier to ragepost than it is to think how to adapt, though one is more effective than the other.

Or maybe we don’t mind the nerfs, but hate the fact that all the weak aspects were completely untouched?
I agree that people don’t see the whole picture. That much is clear from your post and many others.

Ventari needs serious fixing but if it’s tweaked to be viable in PvP it may be “OP” in PvE. Yet another solution that can be solved by separate balancing. To be PvP ready it needs faster charge times and less energy consumption. By the time it pumps out a heal or even cleanse the players you wanted to heal or cleanse would likely have ran out of the tablet’s range.

I’m fairly sure it will hardly be OP in pve before being OP in conquest. In PvE it’s all about damage. Tempest and Druid bring in more than enough healing. What ventari can’t do is getting even close to Druids offensive support while maintains the minimum amount of healing.

Obtena.7952:

Malchior.5732:

So you want people to NOT complain about poor decisions on Anet’s part?
Their balancing history is no excuse to send out such bad changes. I will complain, people will complain. Does that mean I won’t adapt? Of course not. That still doesn’t excuse such bad practices and as a customer, I WILL complain.

Like I said, which you ignored, you don’t know what the future holds, so you don’t know if these are poor decisions; lack of seeing the whole picture.

I’m not discouraging complaining, but your complaining about something we have seen as standard practice since day 1. GL.

Conversely, you don’t know the future and therefore don’t know if these are good decisions; lack of seeing the whole picture.

Of course, that line of thinking means that nothing ever gets discussed, criticized, or praised.

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Malchior.5732:

So you want people to NOT complain about poor decisions on Anet’s part?
Their balancing history is no excuse to send out such bad changes. I will complain, people will complain. Does that mean I won’t adapt? Of course not. That still doesn’t excuse such bad practices and as a customer, I WILL complain.

Like I said, which you ignored, you don’t know what the future holds, so you don’t know if these are poor decisions; lack of seeing the whole picture.

I’m not discouraging complaining, but your complaining about something we have seen as standard practice since day 1. GL.

Conversely, you don’t know the future and therefore don’t know if these are good decisions; lack of seeing the whole picture.

Of course, that line of thinking means that nothing ever gets discussed, criticized, or praised.

The difference is that I didn’t claim they were good, simply that those people complaining they were bad are doing so without knowledge of overall class direction. Therefore, you can’t accuse me of such a thing.

Frankly, I don’t think these were ‘class-destroying’ changes in any way and they were probably done on the premise of a mixture of being OPed elements of the class as well as class concept; some of these changes were in fact, completely obvious to a person with an objective view of the game, as well as experience with other classes. When I see threads about ‘destroyed classes’, YES, please be more sensational, the more the better because that’s what Anet pays attention to AMIRITE! Class is no less playable than it was for anyone that was as knowledgeable about it as you claim you are.

In fact, as we have seen, some people actually agree that these weren’t entirely unreasonable changes; I guess you’re going to call them clueless as well right? Seems like the in vogue thing to do when people disagree with you.

Obtena.7952:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Malchior.5732:

So you want people to NOT complain about poor decisions on Anet’s part?
Their balancing history is no excuse to send out such bad changes. I will complain, people will complain. Does that mean I won’t adapt? Of course not. That still doesn’t excuse such bad practices and as a customer, I WILL complain.

Like I said, which you ignored, you don’t know what the future holds, so you don’t know if these are poor decisions; lack of seeing the whole picture.

I’m not discouraging complaining, but your complaining about something we have seen as standard practice since day 1. GL.

Conversely, you don’t know the future and therefore don’t know if these are good decisions; lack of seeing the whole picture.

Of course, that line of thinking means that nothing ever gets discussed, criticized, or praised.

The difference is that I didn’t claim they were good, simply that those people complaining they were bad are doing so without knowledge of overall class direction. Therefore, you can’t accuse me of such a thing.

Frankly, I don’t think these were ‘class-destroying’ changes in any way and they were probably done on the premise of a mixture of being OPed elements of the class as well as class concept; some of these changes were in fact, completely obvious to a person with an objective view of the game, as well as experience with other classes, so when I see threads about ‘destroyed classes’, YES, please be more sensational, the more the better because that’s what Anet pays attention to AMIRITE! Class is no less playable than it was for anyone that was as knowledgeable about it as you claim you are.

In fact, as we have seen, some people actually agree that these weren’t entirely unreasonable changes; I guess you’re going to call them clueless as well right? Seems like the in vogue thing to do when people disagree with you.

And your proof that complainers don’t have knowledge of overall class direction?
It’s silly to say that, because they’re complaining, it means they don’t know class direction, but if they’re just accepting it, then it’s fine.
You can’t possibly think that’s logical.

You keep saying I’m sensational, but don’t provide any real counter-arguments. You never try to disprove the claim. I also didn’t say the class destroyed. In fact, I think it’s still pretty strong, but the underlying issues are going to continue becoming more and more noticeable the longer we wait.
We already got a few threads complaining about Sword 2 and Hammer 2 barely working, for example.

Finally, I didn’t call someone clueless just because they like the changes. I disagree, point out my thoughts and let them answer if they want. I don’t start calling them sensational either, just because I disagree.

Tristan.5678:

To be honest I agree with OP
REV had good DPS in PVE also great support now …..their DPS is mediocre …..Even my Power necro with Dagger pull off better DPS….

That doesnt make sense. You say that Rev had good DPS before the patch. The patch buffed Revs DPS and now it is mediocore? I mean good and good is not mediocore, it’s still good.

Varezenem.2813:

Agemnon.4608:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Agemnon.4608:

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

People don’t see the whole picture. They see what they want to see, exclude the rest, ignore parts of the reality that prevent them from coming to logical conclusions. It’s easier to ragepost than it is to think how to adapt, though one is more effective than the other.

Or maybe we don’t mind the nerfs, but hate the fact that all the weak aspects were completely untouched?
I agree that people don’t see the whole picture. That much is clear from your post and many others.

Ventari needs serious fixing but if it’s tweaked to be viable in PvP it may be “OP” in PvE. Yet another solution that can be solved by separate balancing. To be PvP ready it needs faster charge times and less energy consumption. By the time it pumps out a heal or even cleanse the players you wanted to heal or cleanse would likely have ran out of the tablet’s range.

I’m fairly sure it will hardly be OP in pve before being OP in conquest. In PvE it’s all about damage. Tempest and Druid bring in more than enough healing. What ventari can’t do is getting even close to Druids offensive support while maintains the minimum amount of healing.

Normally it’s the case that something is OP in PvP first (players have fewer immunities and much less HP than bosses and even elite and vet trash mobs) but the very nature of PvP battles and the unique mechanics behind the tablet say such a buff would make it so. In PvP on a small point consistently upkeeping cleanse and healing on a point will be a bit of a challenge and still need to use weapon skills but skills like scorpion wire and point blank shot would get their teammates out of the tablet’s range (the shield skill would put healing on hold making them vulnerable to the melee inside) so it’d still have good counterplay whereas in PvE people can stack and it’d be easier to alternate between tablet skills and weapon skills due to the pace. I don’t know how raids work though but heard conditions play a big part there.

Ventari needs lots of work to be viable in PvP but I think they’re afraid of overpowering the legend in PvE. I only one two matches (all unranked) out of six as Ventari and I spent lots of time in Shiro in those matches too. Then again I went mid in Legacy for one of the losses but the tablet’s precasts and cooldowns make it unwieldy.

Agemnon.4608:

Varezenem.2813:

Agemnon.4608:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Agemnon.4608:

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

People don’t see the whole picture. They see what they want to see, exclude the rest, ignore parts of the reality that prevent them from coming to logical conclusions. It’s easier to ragepost than it is to think how to adapt, though one is more effective than the other.

Or maybe we don’t mind the nerfs, but hate the fact that all the weak aspects were completely untouched?
I agree that people don’t see the whole picture. That much is clear from your post and many others.

Ventari needs serious fixing but if it’s tweaked to be viable in PvP it may be “OP” in PvE. Yet another solution that can be solved by separate balancing. To be PvP ready it needs faster charge times and less energy consumption. By the time it pumps out a heal or even cleanse the players you wanted to heal or cleanse would likely have ran out of the tablet’s range.

I’m fairly sure it will hardly be OP in pve before being OP in conquest. In PvE it’s all about damage. Tempest and Druid bring in more than enough healing. What ventari can’t do is getting even close to Druids offensive support while maintains the minimum amount of healing.

Normally it’s the case that something is OP in PvP first (players have fewer immunities and much less HP than bosses and even elite and vet trash mobs) but the very nature of PvP battles and the unique mechanics behind the tablet say such a buff would make it so. In PvP on a small point consistently upkeeping cleanse and healing on a point will be a bit of a challenge and still need to use weapon skills but skills like scorpion wire and point blank shot would get their teammates out of the tablet’s range (the shield skill would put healing on hold making them vulnerable to the melee inside) so it’d still have good counterplay whereas in PvE people can stack and it’d be easier to alternate between tablet skills and weapon skills due to the pace. I don’t know how raids work though but heard conditions play a big part there.

Ventari needs lots of work to be viable in PvP but I think they’re afraid of overpowering the legend in PvE. I only one two matches (all unranked) out of six as Ventari and I spent lots of time in Shiro in those matches too. Then again I went mid in Legacy for one of the losses but the tablet’s precasts and cooldowns make it unwieldy.

Currently in both condition cleanse and maximum healing potential druids and tempests can do better. The reason it would be in PvP first is because PvP isn’t really as much about killing fast but about holding a point (this could be observed in the last meta). Under these conditions a healer will always be OP first in conquest.
BTW in the current raid condi cleanses are almost irrelevant and in PvE there is a concept called overhealing ;p. Truth be told, it’s even possible to clear the raid with a berzerker druid.

Varezenem.2813:

Agemnon.4608:

Varezenem.2813:

Agemnon.4608:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Agemnon.4608:

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

People don’t see the whole picture. They see what they want to see, exclude the rest, ignore parts of the reality that prevent them from coming to logical conclusions. It’s easier to ragepost than it is to think how to adapt, though one is more effective than the other.

Or maybe we don’t mind the nerfs, but hate the fact that all the weak aspects were completely untouched?
I agree that people don’t see the whole picture. That much is clear from your post and many others.

Ventari needs serious fixing but if it’s tweaked to be viable in PvP it may be “OP” in PvE. Yet another solution that can be solved by separate balancing. To be PvP ready it needs faster charge times and less energy consumption. By the time it pumps out a heal or even cleanse the players you wanted to heal or cleanse would likely have ran out of the tablet’s range.

I’m fairly sure it will hardly be OP in pve before being OP in conquest. In PvE it’s all about damage. Tempest and Druid bring in more than enough healing. What ventari can’t do is getting even close to Druids offensive support while maintains the minimum amount of healing.

Normally it’s the case that something is OP in PvP first (players have fewer immunities and much less HP than bosses and even elite and vet trash mobs) but the very nature of PvP battles and the unique mechanics behind the tablet say such a buff would make it so. In PvP on a small point consistently upkeeping cleanse and healing on a point will be a bit of a challenge and still need to use weapon skills but skills like scorpion wire and point blank shot would get their teammates out of the tablet’s range (the shield skill would put healing on hold making them vulnerable to the melee inside) so it’d still have good counterplay whereas in PvE people can stack and it’d be easier to alternate between tablet skills and weapon skills due to the pace. I don’t know how raids work though but heard conditions play a big part there.

Ventari needs lots of work to be viable in PvP but I think they’re afraid of overpowering the legend in PvE. I only one two matches (all unranked) out of six as Ventari and I spent lots of time in Shiro in those matches too. Then again I went mid in Legacy for one of the losses but the tablet’s precasts and cooldowns make it unwieldy.

Currently in both condition cleanse and maximum healing potential druids and tempests can do better. The reason it would be in PvP first is because PvP isn’t really as much about killing fast but about holding a point (this could be observed in the last meta). Under these conditions a healer will always be OP first in conquest.
BTW in the current raid condi cleanses are almost irrelevant and in PvE there is a concept called overhealing ;p. Truth be told, it’s even possible to clear the raid with a berzerker druid.

Ouch. Sounds like they need to buff raiding then. Not only should dying be avoided but a very credible risk of it happening to even good groups needs to be there especially for elite content. Ventari has great point holding potential in group fights but is too slow and clumsy to be practical.

I remember in the last meta getting into duels on points where none of us would die (especially ele vs. mesmer or ele vs. ele) until a +1 occurred.

Agemnon.4608:

Varezenem.2813:

Agemnon.4608:

Varezenem.2813:

Agemnon.4608:

Malchior.5732:

Obtena.7952:

Agemnon.4608:

The overwhelming consensus last season was that revenant was overpowered. I thought nerfing overpowered classes lead to balance (you know, that thing all players want and devs actively work towards)?

People don’t see the whole picture. They see what they want to see, exclude the rest, ignore parts of the reality that prevent them from coming to logical conclusions. It’s easier to ragepost than it is to think how to adapt, though one is more effective than the other.

Or maybe we don’t mind the nerfs, but hate the fact that all the weak aspects were completely untouched?
I agree that people don’t see the whole picture. That much is clear from your post and many others.

Ventari needs serious fixing but if it’s tweaked to be viable in PvP it may be “OP” in PvE. Yet another solution that can be solved by separate balancing. To be PvP ready it needs faster charge times and less energy consumption. By the time it pumps out a heal or even cleanse the players you wanted to heal or cleanse would likely have ran out of the tablet’s range.

I’m fairly sure it will hardly be OP in pve before being OP in conquest. In PvE it’s all about damage. Tempest and Druid bring in more than enough healing. What ventari can’t do is getting even close to Druids offensive support while maintains the minimum amount of healing.

Normally it’s the case that something is OP in PvP first (players have fewer immunities and much less HP than bosses and even elite and vet trash mobs) but the very nature of PvP battles and the unique mechanics behind the tablet say such a buff would make it so. In PvP on a small point consistently upkeeping cleanse and healing on a point will be a bit of a challenge and still need to use weapon skills but skills like scorpion wire and point blank shot would get their teammates out of the tablet’s range (the shield skill would put healing on hold making them vulnerable to the melee inside) so it’d still have good counterplay whereas in PvE people can stack and it’d be easier to alternate between tablet skills and weapon skills due to the pace. I don’t know how raids work though but heard conditions play a big part there.

Ventari needs lots of work to be viable in PvP but I think they’re afraid of overpowering the legend in PvE. I only one two matches (all unranked) out of six as Ventari and I spent lots of time in Shiro in those matches too. Then again I went mid in Legacy for one of the losses but the tablet’s precasts and cooldowns make it unwieldy.

Currently in both condition cleanse and maximum healing potential druids and tempests can do better. The reason it would be in PvP first is because PvP isn’t really as much about killing fast but about holding a point (this could be observed in the last meta). Under these conditions a healer will always be OP first in conquest.
BTW in the current raid condi cleanses are almost irrelevant and in PvE there is a concept called overhealing ;p. Truth be told, it’s even possible to clear the raid with a berzerker druid.

Ouch. Sounds like they need to buff raiding then. Not only should dying be avoided but a very credible risk of it happening to even good groups needs to be there especially for elite content. Ventari has great point holding potential in group fights but is too slow and clumsy to be practical.

I remember in the last meta getting into duels on points where none of us would die (especially ele vs. mesmer or ele vs. ele) until a +1 occurred.

Even for point holding Tempests can compete with ventari in sustained healing and take less effort. Druids have a far better burst heal and give a lot of offensive buff.

On the cleansing side only considering AoE cleanses
Ventari can cleanse about 0.53 condis/sec (with unlimited energy 0.83/sec)
Tempests can cleanse 0.69 condis/sec
Druids can cleanse 1.09 condis/sec

Ventaris only real advantage against the others is a larger access to active defenses, our projectile block and better protection uptime.

Because of this larger access to active defense our self heal can’t be too large or else we would turn into unkillable point holders in SPvP.
We can’t have too many cleanses for the same reason, we have a lot of power damage reduction if we had too many cleanses we wouldn’t die.