Guild Wars 2

Hm, quoting doesn’t seem to work, so @previous poster who said toughness helps, well.. I stacked toughness gear on my elementalist and still got 2-shotted by a warrior (1 hit being 14k damage), so, yeah..

chikinhok.3645:

nothing is going to change unless we make it change. I would much rather play my warrior, i just enjoy the sword and board / rifle playstyle.

but there is no beating a good thief 1v1… so what did i do? i rolled a thief! It’s easy really, the builds are just one google search away, and if you think getting owned by backstab is fun, wait til you come across a unicorn thief. It’s what i roll and it’s just as easy to play as backstabbers, only MORE powerful. It’s less frustrating to lose to us, because you assume it takes more skill, but it really doesnt LOL.

Basically the only thing that will make anet balance classes is everyone rolling thieves.

If you are stubbornly holding onto your favorite non-thief class, you are the problem, not the solution

Agreed. I run a full toughness Ranger with Soldiers Amulet in sPvP. I am good at my class and have no issues with any class but thieves. Last night it took less than 8 seconds for a thief to kill me and since he kept dropping to stealth I never got a shot off. And he was sure to wait until I had completed my dodge rolls and evades to hit me. I assumed he knew how to play, but I could do nothing to defend myself since I couldn’t see him.

So I rolled a thief, came back in and rolled face. Its stupid that one class can be so OP.

These threads are so stupid. You have to realize it’s just a matter of how you play and what class you are. Every class of every mmo i’ve played had it’s counters, and that’s ll it is here. The issue people have is they are not expecting it from that class. Talk to any theif and you’ll find out that some classes they dominate with proper planning, and others are either a great struggle or near impossible.

Theif is not like most other classes. You have to plan your attacks out a great deal more. That alone makes the theif class LESS OP as people state. It’s not all that simple to stealth up and get BEHIND a target to backstab in such a small time. Again, it’s all about planning and proper skill in implementing. There is no 1 button wonder in doing these attacks.

If you got smacked the way you did, you obviously were either idle/afk, not moving, or not paying attention. Theives don’t have a long kitten stealth time like other games, so we cannot just sit there and follow you, or come from a great distance to get the jump on you. They are in an area that if you were paying attention, you would HAVE to see them before they stealth and prepare yourself.

Stop blaming a class just because you get dominated by them..learn to play better instead.

Antiriad.7160:

Hm, quoting doesn’t seem to work, so @previous poster who said toughness helps, well.. I stacked toughness gear on my elementalist and still got 2-shotted by a warrior (1 hit being 14k damage), so, yeah..

Well, Warriors have way higher burst than Thieves, so, yeah… they pretty much 2 shot everything.

But Elementalists and Thieves are the squishiests classes anyway, and it doesn’t really matter how much defense we get, the incredible low base health will screw us anyway.

The only class able to excape the low base health trap is the Guardian with all his defenive spells.

The stealth and mobility of Thieves, and the healing, mobility and other defensive abilities (mist form etc) of the Elementalist just aren’t enough in the long term, at least not versus skilled players who know what which abilities do, and how to avoid/counter them.

If they further nerf Elementalists or Thieves, they will just get useless.

If they take away the damage of the Thief, then whats left?
Would be like taking attunement swapping from Elementalists.

If they do anything of that, what would be the reason to play any of those natural squishy classes?

DoubleUnder.9052:

Agreed. I run a full toughness Ranger with Soldiers Amulet in sPvP. I am good at my class and have no issues with any class but thieves. Last night it took less than 8 seconds for a thief to kill me and since he kept dropping to stealth I never got a shot off. And he was sure to wait until I had completed my dodge rolls and evades to hit me. I assumed he knew how to play, but I could do nothing to defend myself since I couldn’t see him.

So I rolled a thief, came back in and rolled face. Its stupid that one class can be so OP.

Congratulations, you are a terrible Ranger player, and you are capable of playing a pubstomping class versus noobs.

OP, 10/10, would read again.

Word of advice to everyone that gets destroyed by other thieves. Do your research. I have a 72 thief, he is my main, but I also play warrior, guardian(alt), necro, and ranger in spvp. If you know the idea behind a backstabbing thief he is easily countered, keep moving… In spvp they do get the jump but if you see them coming, you can easily avoid or win against them. Not difficult. Just like how players are starting to get thier dodges off on warrior using Bull’s Rush + 100 derps/frenzy (I use this combo too).

Not hard guys. It’s more of a L2P issue than a design flaw. The only thing I will agree with is mug’s dmg could be lowered a little.

Ianervan.3415:

You were hit for 5,743 damage by Unknown using Steal.
You were hit for 13,782 damage by X using Backstab.

You should double-check your combat log for the 6-7k Cloak and Dagger that also hit you.

Also, find a Thief that actually has all his gear so you’ll get hit for 18k by the Backstab and 7k by Steal. And, don’t forget the 2k Air Sigil proc.

Zzzz.

If thief is so awesome and overpowered, why not play one?

Consider what happens when you nerf thief too much, they have no utility like elementalist and other classes have, no group buffs, they are absolutely worthless in dungeons, they are a roaming mobile scout class.

The second they nerf more things from thief, the balance may be worse and karma usually comes back to rear its ugly head.

Consider what an elementalist can do..
Permament Regeneration for the group…
Permament Swiftness for the group…
High Damage.
Very Mobile/Lots of Escape moves. (can even outrun a thief!)
Permament Mist Rain, which also heals the party.
Heal his own conditions.
AOE Protection.

Consider now what a warrior can do.
Permament Regeneration for the group…
Permament Swiftness for the group…. (Warhorn.)
Fury for the group 50% of the time…. “FOR GREAT JUSTICE!”
Shout Healing/Shout Cure Conditions…
Warhorn Cure Conditions…

Consider what a Guardian can do.
AOE Protections.
Cure 2 conditions every 10 seconds.
AOE group regeneration…

Thief? What can he do?
Run Away.
Damage.

My warrior has around 2250 toughness and the same thing happened to me. Luckily I had the Ignore Pain trait pop or I would have died right there. There’s no l2play issue or me going glass cannon, he got on me and hit me literally 2 or 3 times.

“Ignore Pain” trait is bugged to only last 2 seconds instead of the 5.

I would invest in “Rune of the Earth” this almost makes it impossible for a thief to one shot you, because as soon as he attacks you with his chain of attacks, you get 33% Damage Reduction for a good 5 seconds, assuming you have any points in vitality.

This makes the barrage and burst of thief almost completely useless, a -33% base damage decrease wipes the floor with most thieves damage wise, and if they cannot kill you in that 5 seconds like there spec demands then they are cat food.

That 9500 damage backstab is now a 6500 damage one, assuming your moving, and if he hits you on your front its only 3250 damage.

BlackRabbit.1259:

Although I agree entirely that thiefs need work, particulalrly HS spam and WvW rendering issues.

you will survive longer if you invest more in tough/vit. both through skillpoints and gear.

I am also a full exotic zerker glasscannon with 15k hp (not thief). But I can also melt stuff when left alone.

1/2 ltp
1/2 thief issues

case closed m’lud

lets assume he stacked toughness, it wouldn’t even be close to negating 50% damage and even if it did… a 6.5k hit is FAR too high compared to every other class

Hes investing his gear into kill you, but you don’t even have the common courtesy to invest in gear to make sure your living?

Get 4 pieces of “Rune of the Earth”.

Daecollo.9578:

Hes investing his gear into kill you, but you don’t even have the common courtesy to invest in gear to make sure your living?

Get 4 pieces of “Rune of the Earth”.

that is NOT a solution, people shouldn’t have to re-gear to deal with a single class… the game is flawed if that has to happen, i haven’t ran into any decent thieves yet (apart from hs quickness spammers) but from seeing a 13k hit, that isn’t balance whether it’s on a glass cannon or not

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Hes investing his gear into kill you, but you don’t even have the common courtesy to invest in gear to make sure your living?

Get 4 pieces of “Rune of the Earth”.

that is NOT a solution, people shouldn’t have to re-gear to deal with a single class… the game is flawed if that has to happen, i haven’t ran into any decent thieves yet (apart from hs quickness spammers) but from seeing a *13k hit *, that isn’t balance whether it’s on a glass cannon or not

Thief has to gear to kill you that way, otherwise he could not, its not like the rune is useless against other classes either, its a very good set.

Don’t complain about a class if you don’t want to fix yourself to beat them.

“Thief uses Steal, this does damage twice, 50% chance to proc rune of Earth.” [due to the poison (this counts as damage.) and then steal doing damage (mug.)]
“Thief uses Cloak And Dagger, this is another 25% chance to proc rune of Earth.”
“Thief uses Backstab, this is another 25% chance to proc rune of Earth.”
When it procs, it procs before the damage is applied, therefore if it proced on steal, it would reduce the damage of STEAL/C/D/Backstab ALL by 33%.

This completely obliterates the combo, if you nerfed the class down further, it would make the combo completely worthless just with this rune, have you ever seen a thief NOT able to kill someone in those precious seconds? they have no vitality, 10k HP, and all there stuff is on CD, they are SITTING ducks.

Daecollo.9578:

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Hes investing his gear into kill you, but you don’t even have the common courtesy to invest in gear to make sure your living?

Get 4 pieces of “Rune of the Earth”.

that is NOT a solution, people shouldn’t have to re-gear to deal with a single class… the game is flawed if that has to happen, i haven’t ran into any decent thieves yet (apart from hs quickness spammers) but from seeing a *13k hit *, that isn’t balance whether it’s on a glass cannon or not

Thief has to gear to kill you that way, otherwise he could not, its not like the rune is useless against other classes either, its a very good set.

Don’t complain about a class if you don’t want to fix yourself to beat them.

you’re so ignorant it’s unreal, get your head out of the mud and look at the bigger picture

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Hes investing his gear into kill you, but you don’t even have the common courtesy to invest in gear to make sure your living?

Get 4 pieces of “Rune of the Earth”.

that is NOT a solution, people shouldn’t have to re-gear to deal with a single class… the game is flawed if that has to happen, i haven’t ran into any decent thieves yet (apart from hs quickness spammers) but from seeing a *13k hit *, that isn’t balance whether it’s on a glass cannon or not

Thief has to gear to kill you that way, otherwise he could not, its not like the rune is useless against other classes either, its a very good set.

Don’t complain about a class if you don’t want to fix yourself to beat them.

you’re so ignorant it’s unreal, get your head out of the mud and look at the bigger picture

Oh i’m sorry, I just don’t understand your logic, your complaining about an easy counter and NOT doing anything to help yourself besides posting on the forums like a child.

I use Runes of the Earth, I never die to one-hit wonders like 100b and backstab builds.

Daecollo.9578:

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Hes investing his gear into kill you, but you don’t even have the common courtesy to invest in gear to make sure your living?

Get 4 pieces of “Rune of the Earth”.

that is NOT a solution, people shouldn’t have to re-gear to deal with a single class… the game is flawed if that has to happen, i haven’t ran into any decent thieves yet (apart from hs quickness spammers) but from seeing a *13k hit *, that isn’t balance whether it’s on a glass cannon or not

Thief has to gear to kill you that way, otherwise he could not, its not like the rune is useless against other classes either, its a very good set.

Don’t complain about a class if you don’t want to fix yourself to beat them.

you’re so ignorant it’s unreal, get your head out of the mud and look at the bigger picture

Oh i’m sorry, I just don’t understand your logic, your complaining about an easy counter and NOT doing anything to help yourself besides posting on the forums like a child.

I use Runes of the Earth, I never die to one-hit wonders like 100b and backstab builds.

my first post was about 10 mins ago saying that any class doing 13k damage is unacceptable, if you think that’s “like a child” then i actually feel a little bad for replying to you because you obviously don’t quite understand what’s going on

i’ll go over what i quite literally just said a 2 posts ago and went over again in this post; doing that much damage in 1 hit is unacceptable, whether on a glass cannon or not.. sugar coat it all you like and post around saying to counter not taking a 13k hit you have to go defensive and take a 9k hit instead but the fact remains that damage that high isn’t fair to any class

I use Runes of the Earth, I never die to one-hit wonders like 100b and backstab builds.

You know, a Protection boon won’t stop >30k damage from instagibbing, or nearly instagibbing you. Eating >20k damage is still all, or almost all of the HP pool of any class in the game.

You’re making absurd arguments to try to avoid a nerf to an obviously broken combo. Waste of time.

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Hes investing his gear into kill you, but you don’t even have the common courtesy to invest in gear to make sure your living?

Get 4 pieces of “Rune of the Earth”.

that is NOT a solution, people shouldn’t have to re-gear to deal with a single class… the game is flawed if that has to happen, i haven’t ran into any decent thieves yet (apart from hs quickness spammers) but from seeing a *13k hit *, that isn’t balance whether it’s on a glass cannon or not

Thief has to gear to kill you that way, otherwise he could not, its not like the rune is useless against other classes either, its a very good set.

Don’t complain about a class if you don’t want to fix yourself to beat them.

you’re so ignorant it’s unreal, get your head out of the mud and look at the bigger picture

Oh i’m sorry, I just don’t understand your logic, your complaining about an easy counter and NOT doing anything to help yourself besides posting on the forums like a child.

I use Runes of the Earth, I never die to one-hit wonders like 100b and backstab builds.

my first post was about 10 mins ago saying that any class doing 13k damage is unacceptable, if you think that’s “like a child” then i actually feel a little bad for replying to you because you obviously don’t quite understand what’s going on

i’ll go over what i quite literally just said a 2 posts ago and went over again in this post; doing that much damage in 1 hit is unacceptable, whether on a glass cannon or not.. sugar coat it all you like and post around saying to counter not taking a 13k hit you have to go defensive and take a 9k hit instead but the fact remains that damage that high isn’t fair to any class

You expect to live against someone in full berserkers whilst being full berserker yourself and having no defensive gear or vitality, against a class designed to hit hard and fast with multiple strikes?

Genius Bro.

I’m quite confused, why does everyone compare thieves to other classes? it’s not like we can do everything others have AND we do more damage…
Sooo, examples:
-Woho, Warriors can wield greatsowrd, OMG WHY CAN’T WE THIEVES DO THIS.
-OH MYYY, That ranger has a cute pet! OMG WHY CAN’T WE THIEVES DO THIS.
kitten I love how necromancer lichform looks, OMG WHY CAN’T WE THIEVES DO THIS.
-Woah, Guardians can summon weapons, OMG WHY CAN’T WE THIEVES DO THIS.
-Ohuhuh, dem engineer torrets, OMG WHY CAN’T WE THIEVES DO THIS.
-Lawl, Mesmers can turn people into moa, OMG WHY CAN’T WE THIEVES DO THIS. (yes i know we can stun for 1.5sec after casting for 1sec.)
-Woots, These elementalist guys can do lots of kitten at once and swap from defense to offense in a jiffy, OMG WHY CAN’T WE THIEVES DO THIS.

See…This is how stupid your argument is.

Daecollo.9578:

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Syn.3459:

Daecollo.9578:

Hes investing his gear into kill you, but you don’t even have the common courtesy to invest in gear to make sure your living?

Get 4 pieces of “Rune of the Earth”.

that is NOT a solution, people shouldn’t have to re-gear to deal with a single class… the game is flawed if that has to happen, i haven’t ran into any decent thieves yet (apart from hs quickness spammers) but from seeing a *13k hit *, that isn’t balance whether it’s on a glass cannon or not

Thief has to gear to kill you that way, otherwise he could not, its not like the rune is useless against other classes either, its a very good set.

Don’t complain about a class if you don’t want to fix yourself to beat them.

you’re so ignorant it’s unreal, get your head out of the mud and look at the bigger picture

Oh i’m sorry, I just don’t understand your logic, your complaining about an easy counter and NOT doing anything to help yourself besides posting on the forums like a child.

I use Runes of the Earth, I never die to one-hit wonders like 100b and backstab builds.

my first post was about 10 mins ago saying that any class doing 13k damage is unacceptable, if you think that’s “like a child” then i actually feel a little bad for replying to you because you obviously don’t quite understand what’s going on

i’ll go over what i quite literally just said a 2 posts ago and went over again in this post; doing that much damage in 1 hit is unacceptable, whether on a glass cannon or not.. sugar coat it all you like and post around saying to counter not taking a 13k hit you have to go defensive and take a 9k hit instead but the fact remains that damage that high isn’t fair to any class

You expect to live against someone in full berserkers whilst being full berserker yourself and having no defensive gear or vitality, against a class designed to hit hard and fast with multiple strikes?

Genius Bro.

i’m beginning to think you haven’t actually read any of my posts, i’ll just leave it here because you’re obviously a thief that’s defending a class that makes him compete with others

when you get the time to read it all let me know and actually comment on it rather than talking about nonsense

Daecollo.9578:

You expect to live against someone in full berserkers whilst being full berserker yourself and having no defensive gear or vitality, against a class designed to hit hard and fast with multiple strikes?

Genius Bro.

Why do you expect Thieves to auto-win every 1v1 within 1.0 seconds from range using equal gear?

Genius.

EasymodeX.4062:

Daecollo.9578:

You expect to live against someone in full berserkers whilst being full berserker yourself and having no defensive gear or vitality, against a class designed to hit hard and fast with multiple strikes?

Genius Bro.

Why do you expect Thieves to auto-win every 1v1 within 1.0 seconds from range using equal gear?

Genius.

I do expect that, anyone who stands around in full dps gear with all dps adornments deserves to be melted by a hit and run class like thief.

If you don’t like it, tough kitten, play one.

But thieves don’t “melt” them, they instagib them automatically.

Why exactly should one class out of all classes be able to instakill automatically using the same gear?

@Daendur

I like the part where you provided actual proof that this actually happened to you.

Oh wait…

EasymodeX.4062:

I use Runes of the Earth, I never die to one-hit wonders like 100b and backstab builds.

You know, a Protection boon won’t stop >30k damage from instagibbing, or nearly instagibbing you. Eating >20k damage is still all, or almost all of the HP pool of any class in the game.

You’re making absurd arguments to try to avoid a nerf to an obviously broken combo. Waste of time.

Would you consider thinking twice about those numbers you put there? I mean, I would be so happy if you could stop nerfing thieves…Pretty please?

You do know that any other glass cannons can kill a thief extremely quick right? We build our class to have a 1 shot kill against light armored somewhat glass players (10k burst damage), but any thief fighting a full tank class in WvW will tell you it’s impossible to kill them.

On the other hand, if we fail to kill the other players, it’s over for us if they manage to stun for 2 seconds (some players did 8 k damage when I’m invisible, or just hit so hard with their 20k hp warriors and downed me in 3 seconds with no way to escape.). You might write about how we have stealth and all that, but the truth is you guys simply need to l2p. It’s WvW for crying out loud. Stop building your hero with a glass build and then whining how it gets killed easily.

I’ve seen so many players who managed to escape from my burst thief, the only ones who did not are those who have upscaled levels and poorer equipments.

Whatever their plan might be with the classes and balancing them who knows?
Seems the road they have taken is to not communicate about how they see different classes going forward. What needs fixing and what doesn’t, what changes they are working on.
No communication will be the downfall of another game, or atleast now it seems like that way.
I might have not agreed with Ghostcrawler but atleast i understood his views since he took the time to communicate with the community atleast once in a blue moon.

Thief killed me in 1 sec last night too.
Came to forums to QQ.
“QQ!”

This has never happened to me but that’s because I know how to… you know… dodge. Same goes for HS spam.

FunFact: HS spammers don’t know how to control themselves.

That’s why they’ll hit you 2 times with HS spam after you’re down. They’re auto queing. One dodge negates 2 HS’s. That’s a lot of wasted Init. Learn to dodge and cut those spammers already pathetic DPS in half. I was up against 3 spammers yesterday and swapped to D/D. As a trickery/acro build I made it my job to turn them into wasted space. Which was pretty easy since they must have been buddies or something because they kept together.

500-114

I man handled the **** out of them.

Syn.3459:

my first post was about 10 mins ago saying that any class doing 13k damage is unacceptable

You are right, we should nerf Rangers, Elementalists, Warriors, Mesmers, Guardians, Engeneers and Thieves right now.

I mean, the only class that can’t burst out that much dmg in 2 – 5 seconds when speccing full on glass cannon is the Necromancer.

Thief burst is actually only the 4th highest in the game (with Warriors > Engeneers > Mesmers taking the lead).

The only question left is:
Why do we see so many Thieves running burst builds, compared to other classes?

Short answer is: because the Thief can’t do anything else (effectively, compared to other classes).

Want to play support? Nobody picks a Thief for that.
Want to play control? Why would you pick a Thief?
Want to be tanky? Thief is probably the worst decision on this you can make.
Want to be mobile? Thief is good here, but not the best. But being mobile alone isn’t doing anything.
Want to do damage? At least the Thief is pretty good here.

The only reason the Thief profession stands out for it’s damage is because you don’t see a variety in roles.
If every Engeneer would run burst, it would be worse than Thieves.
If every Warrior would run burst, it would be worse than Thieves.
If every…

If you complain about people not getting the whole picture, you should probably check how biased you are yourself.

You complain about Thief burst, only because every Thief bursts you.
You dont complain about Warrior burst, just because not every Warrior bursts you, even tho their burst is higher (while having much more defensive at the same time).
Same goes for Engeneers and so on.

That paired with Assassins (stealth bursts) being pubstompers, and noobs crying the loudest in fourms etc. (while pros just search a counter, if they have a problem at all), just gives a wrong, small, picture of a class.

It’s simply psychology, and if anything, then Thieves are lacking in role diversity and surviveability (besides the noob trap stealth).

Again, they only gear, trait and skill for full burst because thats the only role they can play really effectively, while not even being the best in that role.

[And btw, if you want to simply beat someone who is fully geared for glass cannon, it’s only fair if you have to gear for fully anti glass cannon]

If any 2 classes aren’t OP, then is has to be the Thief and the Elementalist.
While the Elementalist has the ultimate role diversity (but being a master at none), the Thief is only really good at one thing.
Both is lacking.

Giving the Elementalists some more health would nearly fix his problem, since then he would be kind of powerful with all the roles he can play (at basically the same time), without dieing when someone looks at him.

The Thief, while also desperately in need for more base health, also really needs a buff to his (atm) uncommon weapon sets, and probably more viable weapon choices added, which should support playing different roles.

That would also thin out burst Thieves by a great deal, making them not standing out as bursters all the time any more, which would fix the problem, and elevating them to be on par with the other classes (not standing out for one thing, and one thing only, getting much attention).

Asum’s post should be on the front page of the GW2 website.

Well said, Asum. There are a few problems here and there that need toned down (like QUICKNESS), but the major issue is covered pretty well in your post.

As far as more weapon choices, i propose an offhand sword with defensive skills and a melee staff with support/control skills.

Backstab damage is pretty reasonable all things considered; a bit higher than Eviscerate, lower than Flame Touch, and still requiring set up. The issue is Assassin’s Signet leading to huge bursts. I expect Assassin’s Signet to be nerfed, which will deal with most of the issue.

It is possible that Mug is dealing too much damage as well, though I don’t have good numbers on it. Mug is dangerous not just because of the combo with Cloak and Dagger, but because it’s instant damage regardless of the situation that stacks with everything else.

Beyond those two I don’t really see anything grossly out of line here.

It is possible that Mug is dealing too much damage as well, though I don’t have good numbers on it.

I have a feeling the mug damage people are seeing is a display bug more than anything. When I had that trait it usually crit for well under 1k. I used it more for applying a venom than any actual damage.

Okay, I’m sorry, but the requests to nerf thief are insane.

Thief cannot do anything as good as other classes except burst, and even then, it’s barely even ahead. Other classes CAN and do burst as hard as thief (warrior, grenade engineer, dagger/dagger glass cannon elementalist, etc.). However, that is all thief has. Thief is burst damage.

Thief doesn’t have the CC options of a warrior. Thief doesn’t have the AoE options of an elementalist. Thief doesn’t have the heals of a guardian. Thief doesn’t have the insane amount of utility and clones that a mesmer has. These are only some things that other classes have over thief.

You guys are asking for them to take away what makes a thief a thief. Thief is the assassin class in this game. What’s the assassin’s role in video games? To assassinate squishy, high damage classes that are a threat. That’s their job. The fact that someone did their job against your glass cannon build means they need nerfed? Sorry, but no.

Stop complaining. What you’re asking for is that thief gets nerfed to have its damage be in line with other classes while it’s outclassed in every other thing. Hell, even its DPS isn’t good. It just has burst damage. You don’t want the thief nerfed; you want the thief removed from the game.

Asum.4960:

Want to play support? Nobody picks a Thief for that.
Want to play control? Why would you pick a Thief?
Want to be tanky? Thief is probably the worst decision on this you can make.
Want to be mobile? Thief is good here, but not the best. But being mobile alone isn’t doing anything.
Want to do damage? At least the Thief is pretty good here.

I have no problem with the assertion that many thief players enjoy playing the thief a certain way so there are a majority of thieves that take on one particular role.

That said, I hope you do realize that the thief can fill all of these roles (and more) excellently. The profession isn’t inherently only able to be played one specific way, that is a community decision. GW2 has been fairly successful in its mission to allow every profession to fill a variety of battlefield roles. The thief is an extremely malleable profession that can excel at a lot of things aside from quick assassination-style play.

I understand why people get upset at DD thieves. It’s because they don’t understand the class nor how to counter it. There are videos on youtube for every class at how to counter a DD thief… heck, I regularly see thieves in these forums tell you how to couter that spec. Go and look them up and get those tatics down until you can do them effortlessly. This shouldn’t take long if you’re an experienced gamer… might take a short while if you’re not.

Yes thieves can burst hard and fast… if you let them. It’s very common that I see some one just let a thief beat on them… dear god it’s like half the players don’t think to bring some sort of anti-cc utility to counter these tactics (which are definitely not just limited to a thief). If it’s a reaction time issue, then you either need to toughen yourself up to give yourself more time or learn to react faster… or both. If I can stop them from doing this to me then you can stop them from doing it to you.

There are several classes a DD thief won’t even try to fight 1v1 because it’ll just be a guaranteed loss. This shows that they are the omni 1 shot killing imba class that I see so many try to make them out to be.

I see a DD thief as not much more than a noob killer. DD thieves are very much a one trick pony and once you learn to beat that one trick they just become easy prey. I wound up changing my thief spec and eventually re-rolled to another class and now laugh at any DD thief foolish enough to try the typical DD rubbish on me.

13k backstab would mean you are rather squishy afaik. I’m not completly glass cannon, but I hit between 7-9k on things with more toughness. So if you can survive this, you got a chance to do something about it.

Tulisin.6945:

Asum.4960:

Want to play support? Nobody picks a Thief for that.
Want to play control? Why would you pick a Thief?
Want to be tanky? Thief is probably the worst decision on this you can make.
Want to be mobile? Thief is good here, but not the best. But being mobile alone isn’t doing anything.
Want to do damage? At least the Thief is pretty good here.

I have no problem with the assertion that many thief players enjoy playing the thief a certain way so there are a majority of thieves that take on one particular role.

That said, I hope you do realize that the thief can fill all of these roles (and more) excellently. The profession isn’t inherently only able to be played one specific way, that is a community decision. GW2 has been fairly successful in its mission to allow every profession to fill a variety of battlefield roles. The thief is an extremely malleable profession that can excel at a lot of things aside from quick assassination-style play.

So true! We aren’t even the best at DPS tbh, but we might be the best at filling different roles without losing much effectiveness. Some of our utility skills are rather unique and extremely useful!

Funniest thing of all is, as a thief myself, I’ve never been instagibbed by another thief?
We are the weakest class ingame when taken by suprise, so it would be logical that a BS thief would kill me in 1 second according to ppl who wants us nerfed. Yet that never happens to me …

Gwalchgwn.1659:

Funniest thing of all is, as a thief myself, I’ve never been instagibbed by another thief?
We are the weakest class ingame when taken by suprise, so it would be logical that a BS thief would kill me in 1 second according to ppl who wants us nerfed. Yet that never happens to me …

It actually happened to me the first time yesterday, and i laughed for around 5 minutes why the hell i didn’t just used my con removal and dodged.

I met the same Thief three more times that day, and just outplayed him.

I don’t know, I just instant react in using shadow step when I notice my character isn’t moving anymore (which I assume is caused by petrify or immobilize). His backstab fails, and he appears from the shadows. He has a 36second CD on steal, a 2second CD on stealth, 39s CD on assassin’s signet, 45s CD on venom. He flees or I kill him, either way, I won the fight …

im very frustrated how thief are VERY OP (this is SPVP and sorry mi game is in spanish)
Puñalada=Backstab

My HP 18.952

1hit KO

I hit a heavy target dummy for 18-19k with 100 blades on my warrior in sPvP. That is about 1.5 seconds or less because of quickness. It’d be even worse in WvW because of higher power/crit damage…. and lower toughness targets… mmm.

It isn’t just thief that can burst for really big numbers…

Kephos.9675:

im very frustrated how thief are VERY OP (this is SPVP and sorry mi game is in spanish)
Puñalada=Backstab

My HP 18.952

1hit KO

Question: do you play Warrior by any chance? and do you use Frenzy by any chance?

Okay, this thread won’t let me quote, so…

Thief? What can he do?
Run Away.
Damage.

Permanent Blind.
One of the most frequently useable blast finishers.
Good ST damage.
Good AoE damage.

DesertRose.2031:

Okay, this thread won’t let me quote, so…

Thief? What can he do?
Run Away.
Damage.

Permanent Blind.
One of the most frequently useable blast finishers.
Good ST damage.
Good AoE damage.

If you “perma-blind” you cannot attack.
Boss mobs in PVE are immune to blind.
AoE Damage has long range, but takes forever to get to the target, easilly avoided unless your in close range.

Asum.4960:

Syn.3459:

my first post was about 10 mins ago saying that any class doing 13k damage is unacceptable

You are right, we should nerf Rangers, Elementalists, Warriors, Mesmers, Guardians, Engeneers and Thieves right now.

I mean, the only class that can’t burst out that much dmg in 2 – 5 seconds when speccing full on glass cannon is the Necromancer.

Thief burst is actually only the 4th highest in the game (with Warriors > Engeneers > Mesmers taking the lead).

The only question left is:
Why do we see so many Thieves running burst builds, compared to other classes?

Short answer is: because the Thief can’t do anything else (effectively, compared to other classes).

Want to play support? Nobody picks a Thief for that.
Want to play control? Why would you pick a Thief?
Want to be tanky? Thief is probably the worst decision on this you can make.
Want to be mobile? Thief is good here, but not the best. But being mobile alone isn’t doing anything.
Want to do damage? At least the Thief is pretty good here.

The only reason the Thief profession stands out for it’s damage is because you don’t see a variety in roles.
If every Engeneer would run burst, it would be worse than Thieves.
If every Warrior would run burst, it would be worse than Thieves.
If every…

If you complain about people not getting the whole picture, you should probably check how biased you are yourself.

You complain about Thief burst, only because every Thief bursts you.
You dont complain about Warrior burst, just because not every Warrior bursts you, even tho their burst is higher (while having much more defensive at the same time).
Same goes for Engeneers and so on.

That paired with Assassins (stealth bursts) being pubstompers, and noobs crying the loudest in fourms etc. (while pros just search a counter, if they have a problem at all), just gives a wrong, small, picture of a class.

It’s simply psychology, and if anything, then Thieves are lacking in role diversity and surviveability (besides the noob trap stealth).

Again, they only gear, trait and skill for full burst because thats the only role they can play really effectively, while not even being the best in that role.

[And btw, if you want to simply beat someone who is fully geared for glass cannon, it’s only fair if you have to gear for fully anti glass cannon]

If any 2 classes aren’t OP, then is has to be the Thief and the Elementalist.
While the Elementalist has the ultimate role diversity (but being a master at none), the Thief is only really good at one thing.
Both is lacking.

Giving the Elementalists some more health would nearly fix his problem, since then he would be kind of powerful with all the roles he can play (at basically the same time), without dieing when someone looks at him.

The Thief, while also desperately in need for more base health, also really needs a buff to his (atm) uncommon weapon sets, and probably more viable weapon choices added, which should support playing different roles.

That would also thin out burst Thieves by a great deal, making them not standing out as bursters all the time any more, which would fix the problem, and elevating them to be on par with the other classes (not standing out for one thing, and one thing only, getting much attention).

if you’re going to reply to me read my post before commenting, don’t just nitpick at parts taking them out of context and i haven’t even bothered to read your post because of it but what i said was;

“i’ll go over what i quite literally just said a 2 posts ago and went over again in this post; doing that much damage in 1 hit is unacceptable”

no clue why you’re defending classes that can do 13k damage in a single hit though but i think i’ve got the gist of it from seeing how much effort you put into wall of text

Ravnodaus.5130:

I hit a heavy target dummy for 18-19k with 100 blades on my warrior in sPvP. That is about 1.5 seconds or less because of quickness. It’d be even worse in WvW because of higher power/crit damage…. and lower toughness targets… mmm.

It isn’t just thief that can burst for really big numbers…

100 blades is very easy to evade and are 8 hit dont have any point of comparation with 1 unnespected hit impossible to evade