Guild Wars 2

Phantom.8130:

i’m not the one with the history of making things up to support a flawed argument, then switching around what i say, and say the complete opposite to support another flawed argument in a blatant personal war against something as ridiculous as a class in a video game. you, however…..: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/members/showposts/sorrow-2364/1

it’s all there in black and white. i don’t even need to say a word, you’ve done all the arguing on both sides of pretty much every topic already. you’re a troll, and not even a very good one at that. i’m just trying to save you further embarrassment. if you want to keep making a fool of yourself on an internet forum, be my guest.

I did switch what I say only if fact changes.
In 7 months, there was 7 different patch full of changes to the game.
Do I have to keep saying that instagib build is still too strong after the nerfs? Do I have to keep saying that Stealth is still OP after the Revealed nerf? Do I have to keep saying that condi thieves are cheap due to caltrops after its duration nerf?

Last time I said that something was too cheap about thief, was about Flanking Strike which was, in fact, nerfed in the 25 june patch with increased initiative.

I don’t think anymore that Thief is OP as I don’t agree with the huge amount of people in these forums who like to cry for buffs for the Thief class.

I don’t know what’s your purpose. But it’s YOUR OPINION that my arguments are flawed. And, honestly, I don’t feel the urge to dig in your post history to prove my points as you do. In a game forum.

The “you are an internet troll”, also, is a nice touch of stupidity. Congrats.

sorrow.2364:

“Thieves are the masters of mobility, stealth and high single target damage. They can be very fragile if you counter their stealth with area of effects or large stacks of conditions, but they trade this fragility in order to have some of the highest burst damage in the game. They are able to help allies through traps, venoms and the mobility to flank most encounters.”

Design concept of thieves according to ANet. (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/first#post999247)

I can’t see where ArenaNet said that Thief is supposed to be good at long range.
In that topic there are also listed which professions are supposed to be effective at long range but, as you can see, thief is not one of those.

They aren’t supposed to be a Cluster Bomb turrets. If you want to get free badges when attacking or defending a castle, either build and use an Arrowcart, or change profession to another which is supposed to do the WvWvW turret, like Elementalist, Ranger, Necro or Engineer.
If all the professions should have all the same capabilities, why can’t I roam with my Necro as I do with my Thief?

Arkham Creed.7358:

To Sorrow: I wasn’t demanding anything. I was merely making a polite exit, and attempting to say goodbye to a subsection of the Guild Wars 2 community I’ve been with since beta, and who have given me tons of advice and words of encouragement over the last several months. But by your posts I can see the subtleties of tact, diplomacy, and manners are beyond you.

Well, to me, your topic sounds more like another rant than a goodbye.
If you wanted it to look like a goodbye, you should have wrote a different OP.

@sorrow just as much as you complain about thieves…..we people whom actually main thieves have the same right to complain to anet and give our feedback. anet actually wants forum threads like this so they understand what/how we feel and why. so when you say to stop complaining or ranting or QQing about a class who has 4x the amount of nerfs as everyone else…especially when 50% of them are for no seen reason… or even if people just want to say goodbye to thief profession/game let them. its their right.

also…….. anet says :

Thieves are the masters of mobility, stealth and high single target damage. They can be very fragile if you counter their stealth with area of effects or large stacks of conditions, but they trade this fragility in order to have some of the highest burst damage in the game. They are able to help allies through traps, venoms and the mobility to flank most encounters.

they kind of go against their goal…..we have had only 1 buff to mobility and a dozen nerfs to mobility :P….stealth got a debuff in spvp and so did our single target dmg which is now ranked 3rd total. we cant help thru traps or flanks…..venoms kinda but thats a click tthe venoms and might as well watch the fight.

so basically the only thing they said with any merit is venoms….and in combat mobility even tho we have more nerfs to it than anything which contradicts what they said about increasing our mobility.

sorrow.2364:

Phantom.8130:

i’m not the one with the history of making things up to support a flawed argument, then switching around what i say, and say the complete opposite to support another flawed argument in a blatant personal war against something as ridiculous as a class in a video game. you, however…..: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/members/showposts/sorrow-2364/1

it’s all there in black and white. i don’t even need to say a word, you’ve done all the arguing on both sides of pretty much every topic already. you’re a troll, and not even a very good one at that. i’m just trying to save you further embarrassment. if you want to keep making a fool of yourself on an internet forum, be my guest.

I did switch what I say only if fact changes.
In 7 months, there was 7 different patch full of changes to the game.
Do I have to keep saying that instagib build is still too strong after the nerfs? Do I have to keep saying that Stealth is still OP after the Revealed nerf? Do I have to keep saying that condi thieves are cheap due to caltrops after its duration nerf?

Last time I said that something was too cheap about thief, was about Flanking Strike which was, in fact, nerfed in the 25 june patch with increased initiative.

I don’t think anymore that Thief is OP as I don’t agree with the huge amount of people in these forums who like to cry for buffs for the Thief class.

I don’t know what’s your purpose. But it’s YOUR OPINION that my arguments are flawed. And, honestly, I don’t feel the urge to dig in your post history to prove my points as you do.

The “you are an internet troll”, also, is a nice touch of stupidity. Congrats.

i’m not digging into MY history. i’m digging into YOUR history, and YOUR history is filled with counterarguments against….. YOURSELF. you’re just using anyone that responds to you as a medium in which you argue with yourself. in fact, it’s a bit alarming, as there actually is an explanation for such behavior: http://addadhdadvances.com/ODD.html

now, i don’t know whether you actually suffer from oppositional defiant disorder or not, but you’ve spent 9 months arguing with everyone and everyone, including yourself about everything. if you don’t believe me, and i’m sure you don’t, spend some time reading through your own posting history. it’s all there for you to see.

sorrow.2364:

Shemsu.8721:

So we are using the class outline as gospel now? according to the outline thieves are masters of mobility, so why are our shadowsteps nerfed to the ground but mesmer can teleport through walls, up/down any obstacle, while we fail on a pebble or 1 degree slope, even NECRO retains an infinite range teleport

According to the outline mesmers have low health when you get past clones, yet we have lower health then mesmers, should they nerf mesmer health to bottom tier too? because the outline says so?

Thieves are masters of single target damage, yet killshot can do the same damage as backstab to an entire group at 1500 range (despite outline saying they are not strong at range, and are intended for melee)

Should i continue?

It looks like that you’re incredibly narrow-minded according to what you wrote.

Are you trying to say that Mesmer has better mobility compared to Thief?
Are you trying to say that Warrior’s single target burst damage is better than Thief’s?

If so, I think you should play the game more.

I’m narrow minded? Who’s the one saying that thief should not be allowed to have a 1200 range weapon because it is not specified in the class description. I simply pointed out that those class descriptions are not an accurate state for any class. You started that line of logic, its too bad it goes against your argument

Do you play a class more because you like the class or do you play the class because it’s effective? If the latter, then you’ll never really enjoy the class because changes happen all the time. Better save them hair strands and just re-roll smoothly without having to stress about it too much. On that note, I do agree with sorrow on this.

edit: Reworded to make my note more clear. If you originally play thief to be effective because of a certain specific build, then you won’t enjoy it as someone who plays thief for thief and is flexible enough to theorycraft into something viable and effective when unforeseen buffs/nerfs come your way.

ArcTheFallen.7682:

Do you play a class because you like the class or do you play the class because it’s effective? If the latter, then you’ll never really enjoy the class because changes happen all the time. Better save them hair strands and just re-roll smoothly without having to stress about it too much. On that note, I do agree with sorrow on this.

So either have fun playing the class who’s style you like or be effective? Is it really so wrong to actually want all classes to be effective, so we can play the ones we like? I have to disagree with you both, i want to have fun and be effective, not choose one or the other

Shemsu.8721:

So either have fun playing the class who’s style you like or be effective? Is it really so wrong to actually want all classes to be effective, so we can play the ones we like? I have to disagree with you both, i want to have fun and be effective, not choose one or the other

Point is that thief is effective.
People still fear thieves and they still have tough times against.
There are also some people left who still think that thief is still OP.

What is your source to saying thief is not effective?

Your experience?
What people say in the forums?

I’m narrow minded? Who’s the one saying that thief should not be allowed to have a 1200 range weapon because it is not specified in the class description. I simply pointed out that those class descriptions are not an accurate state for any class. You started that line of logic, its too bad it goes against your argument

Well, if it isn’t said in the description, then probably ANet designed the thief not to be a long-range profession. It’s the most logical conclusion to the SB range nerf.
Or you actually believe that ANet hating thief and nerfing things randomly makes more sense..?

sorrow.2364:

Shemsu.8721:

So either have fun playing the class who’s style you like or be effective? Is it really so wrong to actually want all classes to be effective, so we can play the ones we like? I have to disagree with you both, i want to have fun and be effective, not choose one or the other

Point is that thief is effective.
People still fear thieves and they still have tough times against.
There are also some people left who still think that thief is still OP.

What is your source to saying thief is not effective?

Your experience?
What people say in the forums?

i dont mind if u wanna troll or hate on thieves or say that the new QQers on nerfs are wrong . but when u say something just like elaborate a lil.

thief is effective you say? go on explain? how and where? to what effect? keep in mind the goals/point of each mode (PVE TPVP SPVP and WVW) basically id like to hear this explaination outside of a roaming sense.

my thoughts: thief are VERY ineffective. we had a role as bunker busters but now that init cost is higher on LS….which i guess i cant totally argue with…although i think its kitten backwards bc FS is 3 which does little and LS is 2 which does ALOT more effect. and also lost stun break so even tho thats major we can still function in a 1 on 1 …not as well but soon as 3+ come that s/d build is in trouble.

Travlane.5948:

i dont mind if u wanna troll or hate on thieves or say that the new QQers on nerfs are wrong . but when u say something just like elaborate a lil.

thief is effective you say? go on explain? how and where? to what effect? keep in mind the goals/point of each mode (PVE TPVP SPVP and WVW) basically id like to hear this explaination outside of a roaming sense.

my thoughts: thief are VERY ineffective. we had a role as bunker busters but now that init cost is higher on LS….which i guess i cant totally argue with…although i think its kitten backwards bc FS is 3 which does little and LS is 2 which does ALOT more effect. and also lost stun break so even tho thats major we can still function in a 1 on 1 …not as well but soon as 3+ come that s/d build is in trouble.

Do I have to link you some twitch channels of effective Thieves?

effective thieves squabble on the outskirts of fights being annoying and taking out wounded sheep/weak players in wvw. in spvp its too early to say how bad/good s/d still is bc its only been short of 2 days. generally our only effectiveness is in 2 v 2 or 1 v 1 fights. anything larger and we move back and kind of wait for our fight …which is cool in the assassin sense but at the same time we are getting nerfed bc of it even tho it has an extremely small effect on the game. so im asking for a written explanation of where/how we are effective outside of 1 v 1.

this guy here has a decent build….exemplifying the best of what anet buffed and its a build that is very good 1 on 1 bc i personally ran a variation of it and did extremely well excluding against 1 certain build but thats bound to happen.

95% of the time this is what happens in wvw/spvp. notice how this video DOES NOT cut and only choose the 1 out of 8 fights he did well in. most of the time the thief goes down fast. i have had strectches were i have downed 8+ players in a row several times but when its 3 v 3 theres way to much incidental contact for squishy thieves with you defense. excuse me extremely low defense.

sorrow.2364:

I can’t see where ArenaNet said that Thief is supposed to be good at long range.
In that topic there are also listed which professions are supposed to be effective at long range but, as you can see, thief is not one of those.

Let’s follow your logic. Here’s what they said about Warriors;

“We want the Warrior to be capable of good melee damage in a sturdy body. They can still do some decent damage at range, but they aren’t as good at it as the Ranger (with their pet). They have a hard time taking enemy boons down, and instead, have to just go through them with raw force. They may have a hard time with enemy conditions, and may need to ask for ally help in order to keep themselves free of hampering conditions.”

Now let’s test your logic.
“I can’t see where ArenaNet said that [WARRIORS] is supposed to be good at long range.”

Yet Warriors have both Longbow and Rifle.

Yet another fallacy from our friend sorrow.

PS
You can try to argue that Warriors “can still do some decent damage at range”, but so can Thieves so that simply cancels each other out.

I will say I read OP and skipped all the rest so pardon if this has been said.

SB did get nerfed, however it came with several trap buffs

Corrosive Traps – Trait (longer Vulnerability)
Shadow Trap – Really good. I suggest using it as a long range Stunbreker/ Teleport

I also played in the SOAC Tournament yesterday with Shadow Trap in sPvP and I will assure you of how wonderful it is

OIIIIIO.7825:

I will say I read OP and skipped all the rest so pardon if this has been said.

SB did get nerfed, however it came with several trap buffs

Corrosive Traps – Trait (longer Vulnerability)
Shadow Trap – Really good. I suggest using it as a long range Stunbreker/ Teleport

I also played in the SOAC Tournament yesterday with Shadow Trap in sPvP and I will assure you of how wonderful it is

i still don’t see a use for traps in pve…

OIIIIIO.7825:

I will say I read OP and skipped all the rest so pardon if this has been said.

SB did get nerfed, however it came with several trap buffs

Corrosive Traps – Trait (longer Vulnerability)
Shadow Trap – Really good. I suggest using it as a long range Stunbreker/ Teleport

I also played in the SOAC Tournament yesterday with Shadow Trap in sPvP and I will assure you of how wonderful it is

vulnerability sux for thief :P ….wpould u really take out shadow refuge for corrosive trap?

shadow trap rarely has worked right once for me on uses that have objects in way or elevations. would u really take out blinding powder (offensive and defensive utitlity) for this?

no to both of them. srry its a fail. VERY good concept on shadow trap. but since they nerfed the pathing on all shadow steps its a fail. my shadow step cannot like 1 step on a set of stairs infront of me. tahts pathetic.

OIIIIIO.7825:

I will say I read OP and skipped all the rest so pardon if this has been said.

SB did get nerfed, however it came with several trap buffs

Corrosive Traps – Trait (longer Vulnerability)
Shadow Trap – Really good. I suggest using it as a long range Stunbreker/ Teleport

I also played in the SOAC Tournament yesterday with Shadow Trap in sPvP and I will assure you of how wonderful it is

I’ve been putting shadow trap on my bar ever since the patch, because on paper it sounds amazing. And yet over half the time (at least 6/7 out of 10) when i activate it (even at very short ranges) I dont get teleported at all, So I agree the trap itself is wonderful, however the trap relies on shadowstep pathing, which is beyond worthless.

Also, the nerf to cluster bomb hit siege attack/defense warfare for thieves very hard, not a single one of the buffs helps us at all when on wall or below one

I am not suggesting using Corrosive Traps just wanting to highlight the fact traps did indeed get buffed. Also I don’t use Shadow Refuge.

Shadow Trap works if you know how to use it right. Make sure the distance is correct and there is no Line of Sight Issues. I have been able to tele full sPvP map distance.

“no to both of them. srry its a fail. VERY good concept on shadow trap. but since they nerfed the pathing on all shadow steps its a fail. my shadow step cannot like 1 step on a set of stairs infront of me. tahts pathetic.”

I highly suggest you re-test this trap. I think it’s very very strong in it’s current form. About the pathing I also suggest you retest this since the last patch You will be pleasantly surprised.

well its like saying body shot got buffed….kinda but not really. if u get something a 1 sec buff from 10 secs to 11 …technically its a buff…but relaly its not. onlythign that got buffed is death blossom and steal related stuff. and a few traits. onlything major was steal.

the trap CAN be strong…WHEN it actually works right. but i can risk dropping something that works 100% for osmething thats 50% on a good day. too risky.

The trap works 100% for me. If you need help on where to place it I will assist.
Just message me in game.