Guild Wars 2

Karolis.4261:

Seras.5702:

Maybe there’s a 10s ICD between instances of stealth for Shadow’s Embrace. So still removes every 3 secs, but once you leave stealth the 10s ICD begins. I’m at work. Can anyone test that?

I did test it in orr on poison field spamming mobs, it did remove poison every time i used cnd on it.

There’s something not quite right somewhere. I did a little testing on trolls in the Gorge, and there were several times I couldn’t remove the chill going into stealth. There may be more to this than we know. It’s a shame Devs can’t tell us it’s a bug, intended, and/or what the mechanic is.

Fade.7658:

Karolis.4261:

Seras.5702:

Maybe there’s a 10s ICD between instances of stealth for Shadow’s Embrace. So still removes every 3 secs, but once you leave stealth the 10s ICD begins. I’m at work. Can anyone test that?

I did test it in orr on poison field spamming mobs, it did remove poison every time i used cnd on it.

There’s something not quite right somewhere. I did a little testing on trolls in the Gorge, and there were several times I couldn’t remove the chill going into stealth. There may be more to this than we know. It’s a shame Devs can’t tell us it’s a bug, intended, and/or what the mechanic is.

That chill pulses when u sit in its field, maybe that was the reason, u just got new chill,

I was actually excited. The dev livestream hinted nothing at the nerfs, so I actually got a little giddy that perhaps they had decided against it and actually helped the class out.

Oh, how naive I was.

Seras.5702:

Maybe there’s a 10s ICD between instances of stealth for Shadow’s Embrace. So still removes every 3 secs, but once you leave stealth the 10s ICD begins. I’m at work. Can anyone test that?

That’s actually a good idea.

Shadow’s Embrace works as it did before.. actually “better” for D/Ps, for some reason I’m cleansing 2 conditions every 3s at several occasions..

Sceinna.3561:

Shadow’s Embrace works as it did before.. actually “better” for D/Ps, for some reason I’m cleansing 2 conditions every 3s at several occasions..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T26gZDGWRK8

Sounds like every time a new stealth is applied, the trait triggers immediately.

IE, if you could find a skill that would apply stealth once for 11 seconds, you’d see 2 condi removals – 1 immediately, 1 after the 10s ICD.

In SR and multiple leaps through a smoke field, the trait is considering any new application of stealth a new “instance” of stealth with its own 10s ICD.

In Short, Meld with shadows no longer allows a single stealth application to clear 2 conditions. Still a nerf, but not as severe as was thought, and does nothing against D/P with multiple leaps (which is how most thieves achieve “perma stealth” in pvp)

It seems the same to me. Got a load of conditions for 10s from a risen plague carrier, SR removed one on entering stealth then one every three seconds as expected.

EDIT: I was also able to remove 2 conditions with one BP+HS, one on entering and one at 3 seconds. Or maybe the clear on entering stealth just doesn’t count for the cooldown? I dunno.

Sceinna.3561:

Shadow’s Embrace works as it did before.. actually “better” for D/Ps, for some reason I’m cleansing 2 conditions every 3s at several occasions..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T26gZDGWRK8

How are you heart-seeking such a small distance?

Valvador.4291:

Sceinna.3561:

Shadow’s Embrace works as it did before.. actually “better” for D/Ps, for some reason I’m cleansing 2 conditions every 3s at several occasions..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T26gZDGWRK8

How are you heart-seeking such a small distance?

I’m crippled & doing a little camera trick there.. it’s not hard.

Josh Davis.6015:

This is a tooltip error. It still works correctly at 3 second intervals.

From the other thread.

Sceinna.3561:

Shadow’s Embrace works as it did before.. actually “better” for D/Ps, for some reason I’m cleansing 2 conditions every 3s at several occasions..

Oh jeez…

Nice work on capturing it. It’s bad enough there’s an undocumented change to begin with, so nobody knows how it’s meant to work… But having it so blatantly bugged and OP like this is just going to cause us more pain in the long run, from all the extra qq from other classes until it’s “fixed”. ><

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Shadow-s-Embrace/first#post3027464

Josh Davis.6015:

This is a tooltip error. It still works correctly at 3 second intervals.

Yey, I get some more time to play other games
Sorry, I simply don’t get what the devs are trying to achieve with this update
and the “evolution” of the thief in general.
In my eyes the thief needs to get revamped big time in pve.
Playing thief as main since prerelease (95% pve) and tried lots of different builds.

Basilisk venom: For those who think this is a nerf, it is not. Stunbreakers already broke the “stun part” of basilisk but it didn’t remove the petrified look. So the enemy continues fighting you, but for both sides his character is frozen in that particular stance (which is actually worse for you cause you don’t see the enemy’s skill movement)

Destroy shadow trap: Just tested this thing out. You stunbreak on use. The enemy now actually has 1.5 seconds to stun you a second time. Not sure if I like it this way, but we’ll see.

Basilisk venom is so pointless these days, immobilize basically does the same then for longer.

JUST CONFIRMED – THE SHADOWS EMBRACE AND PATIENCE TRAIT DESCRIPTION IS A TOOLTIP ERROR. STILL FUNCTIONS AS BEFORE. JUST A TEXT ERROR! OTHER TRAITS WITH SAME SHOULD STILL FUNCTION AS INTENDED!!!

Sceinna.3561:

I’m crippled & doing a little camera trick there.. it’s not hard.

Heartseeker with crutches? I’m impressed…

Don’t be so kitten yourself. You’re not crippled, just handi-capable! xD

Gwalchgwn.1659:

Destroy shadow trap: Just tested this thing out. You stunbreak on use. The enemy now actually has 1.5 seconds to stun you a second time. Not sure if I like it this way, but we’ll see.

…That seems odd. What if you hit Destroy Shadow trap for the stunbreak and immediately cancel the cast, say with a dodge roll – is the shadow trap consumed and put on CD, or is it an infinite stunbreaker now?

evilapprentice.6379:

Gwalchgwn.1659:

Destroy shadow trap: Just tested this thing out. You stunbreak on use. The enemy now actually has 1.5 seconds to stun you a second time. Not sure if I like it this way, but we’ll see.

…That seems odd. What if you hit Destroy Shadow trap for the stunbreak and immediately cancel the cast, say with a dodge roll – is the shadow trap consumed and put on CD, or is it an infinite stunbreaker now?

nope, can dode afer destroying it, but itll go on cooldown after

Two threads?
Might as well repost that S/P has been murdered and is now worse than P/P has ever been. R.I.P Pistol whip, good night sweet prince, you tried so hard.

ensoriki.5789:

Two threads?
Might as well repost that S/P has been murdered and is now worse than P/P has ever been. R.I.P Pistol whip, good night sweet prince, you tried so hard.

How so? What happened to PW? What did I miss?

1s stun reduced 50% to 0.5s. Good luck holding someone to slash them now.

Do not forget 1/4s daze fo heashot instead of 1s.

Puru.4217:

Do not forget 1/4s daze fo heashot instead of 1s.

I had no idea it was 1s before patch rofl.

That is a significant nerf.

Puru.4217:

Do not forget 1/4s daze fo heashot instead of 1s.

Im fine with it though because headshots role is as an interrupt. It’s a nerf but it’s acceptable given the purpose headshot is supposed to fulfill.
Nerfing the stun on pistol whip however reduces its ability to do actual damage.

ensoriki.5789:

Puru.4217:

Do not forget 1/4s daze fo heashot instead of 1s.

Im fine with it though because headshots role is as an interrupt. It’s a nerf but it’s acceptable given the purpose headshot is supposed to fulfill.
Nerfing the stun on pistol whip however reduces its ability to do actual damage.

Where is it stated that those two got nerfed btw? Can’t find any references to it besides you guys.

Gwalchgwn.1659:

ensoriki.5789:

Puru.4217:

Do not forget 1/4s daze fo heashot instead of 1s.

Im fine with it though because headshots role is as an interrupt. It’s a nerf but it’s acceptable given the purpose headshot is supposed to fulfill.
Nerfing the stun on pistol whip however reduces its ability to do actual damage.

Where is it stated that those two got nerfed btw? Can’t find any references to it besides you guys.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-October-15-2013/first#post3027301

The sigil of paralyzation fix is a change to the rounding mechanics of dazes and stuns (conditions didnt round up).
Since headshot and PW are fractions they always rounded up to the nearest second which was 1s. Now the game goes by .25 intervals for dazes and stuns of .25, .5, .75 and 1 (so on and so forth) for dazes and stuns. That is the fix to sigil of paralyzation.
As headshot is .25s daze and PW is .5s stun by default without rounding thats exactly what they do now. which is reducing them by 75% and 50% accordingly.

1s daze was useful for ranged support (or even during battle to be honest).
It was also useful if you were more interest in the auto attack chain for the cripple with 1s of breathing room and/or to surprise them with a fast interrupt unlike the first strike of pw. I guess you can still use bp, which will be more effective at it if the target like to stay inside it and worse if it moves around, still cost a bit more ini though.
I also liked to use daze then pw instead of autos to change things a bit.

It was basically nerfed as a support tool and as a mind game tool, which is a massive nerf for my playstyle at least, but overall i agree most people will probably be far more annoyed by the pw change which is simply breaking the set at this point.

Ah, seriously? You guys were crying about sigil of paralyzation? It isn’t really needed so no, S/P thieves aren’t screwed.
(I’ve been playing S/P for a half year already without using that sigil, it rly isn’t that important.)

You scared me that the intrinsic stun got nerfed… Which idd would ruin my build.

It’s hilarious how bad they are at this kitten. The change to Body Shot is laughable. The problem with the set is and always has been that it does weak DPS because its primary source of DPS is the #3 skill instead of the #1 skill, which creates unsustainable resource competition.

The change that has always needed to happen is a.) a buff to Vital Shot and b.) a redesign of Unload so that it has its own functionality rather than being your bread and butter shot.

Puru.4217:

1s daze was useful for ranged support (or even during battle to be honest).
It was also useful if you were more interest in the auto attack chain for the cripple with 1s of breathing room and/or to surprise them with a fast interrupt unlike the first strike of pw.
I also liked to use daze then pw instead of autos to change things a bit.

It was basically nerfed as a support tool and as a mind game tool, which is a massive nerf for my playstyle at least, but overall i agree most people will probably be far more annoyed by the pw change which is simply breaking the set at this point.

As ensoriki said, the collateral damage to head shot isn’t major – it was never intended to be more than an interrupt, even without sigil of para it gets it’s intended job done.

PW was being carried by SoP, and even then it was only mediocre. Without the extra .5s stun, it’s inability to be used effectively against anyone with a tiny bit of experience is finally out in the open. The spec went from UP to unplayable due to this, as Anet originally designed I guess.

No buffed venoms/conditions?
I thought they should come with this patch

Elxdark.9702:

I’m done with this kitten, if Anet want us to play as warriors then say it,instead of make these kittening changes.

Wtf is this? they didn’t put it in the notes and it got nerfed.
Anet f***k yourself.

devs are haters, i bet every second dev is warrior or ele. This game is……………………………there is no other way then stop playing “asd fl?kasjdf?lak sdfj?a sdfklas*rage” thief. Every class laugh at thieves now.. a? sdkfjla?sdkfasdf…………………..

So body shot continues to be useless, and larcenous strike removes only 1 boon while still costing 2 initiative. Other than that, not too bad.

But seriously, change the init cost of Larcenous strike back to 1, you made a great skill and then take back your decision by nerfing it twice with no reward.

FYI the tooltip for Shadow’s Embrace states it has a 10 second interval now? Is that a tooltip bug or was that an unofficial change?

evilapprentice.6379:

Puru.4217:

1s daze was useful for ranged support (or even during battle to be honest).
It was also useful if you were more interest in the auto attack chain for the cripple with 1s of breathing room and/or to surprise them with a fast interrupt unlike the first strike of pw.
I also liked to use daze then pw instead of autos to change things a bit.

It was basically nerfed as a support tool and as a mind game tool, which is a massive nerf for my playstyle at least, but overall i agree most people will probably be far more annoyed by the pw change which is simply breaking the set at this point.

As ensoriki said, the collateral damage to head shot isn’t major – it was never intended to be more than an interrupt, even without sigil of para it gets it’s intended job done.

PW was being carried by SoP, and even then it was only mediocre. Without the extra .5s stun, it’s inability to be used effectively against anyone with a tiny bit of experience is finally out in the open. The spec went from UP to unplayable due to this, as Anet originally designed I guess.

PW wasnt being carried by SoP. Guys listen cus Gywa got this wrong too.

Pistol whip NEVER worked with Sigil of Paralyzation. As 0.5 × 1.15 is still less than 1s.
The change that they did changes how the game itself handles dazes and stuns
Pistol whip and Headshot had the exact same duration of 1 second. The only thing that ever carried Pistol whip was haste, SoP literally did nothing to it, it did nothing to headshot and could not affect them. Likewise in Spvp SoP did nothing to tactical strike (which you are well aware of)

Every daze and Every stun in the game rounded up to the nearest second.
So if your skill was 0.5 like Pistol whip due to how the game worked it was 1 second.
If your stun was 2 seconds (remember Tactical strike?) it was 2 seconds.
Now if you had sigil of paralyzation or rune of the mesmer these multipled it.
0.5 × 1.15 = 0.575, rounded up to 1 second which meant no actual change
2 * 1.15 = 2.3 rounded up to 3s, and this is where SoP got wonky.
SoP did nothing for S/P. S/P’s nerf is collateral damage of changing the way the game has worked since beta if not alpha.

Gwya it’s not that we were using SoP, we weren’t no one would ever use SoP with Pistol whip because SoP never worked with pistol whip. It’s that changing the game to prevent SoP from making skills like PvE Tactical strike, Comet, Skull crack, Wail of doom, hilt bash and every other daze/stun that is 1,2 or 3 seconds long gain an extra second caused an effect on skills that are not 1,2 ,or 3 seconds. Which is spvp Tactical strike (1.5s), headshot, pistol whip.

Case in point lets look at spvp tactical
1.5s yesterday was rounded up (remember fractions are rounded up in GW2 prior to today) to 2 seconds of daze.
Now they are not rounded so it is 1.5s flat if you dont have SoP or rune of mesmer instead of the normal 2s, this is a nerf to tactical strike without SoP in spvp (which was already nerfed with SoP in mind). Now if you take SoP with Tactical strike
1.5s x 1.15 = 1.725. This rounds to 1.75s. So as you can see here now Tactical strike + SoP is actually weaker now then Tactical strike without SoP was yesterday, and this is why Pistol whip is nerfed. Not because of SoP but because of how rounding is handled.

How can they change this? I don’t know they might have to redo the skill. If you make Pistol whip 1 second again forcibly by changing it from 0.5s to 1s, then now SoP lets it go to 1.25s which is longer than it ever could be. Stronger yet is Rune of the mesmer 33% effect would change Pistol whip from 1s to 1.5s which would be 33% longer daze than it had yesterday if they fixed it back to it’s normal value. The only solution I see is to make it 0.8s which will round to 1s without SoP and with SoP become 0.92 and still round to 1s. With Rune of the mesmer taking it to 1.25s (a possible buff). However I don’t see anything that says there game can have 0.8s (4/5ths of a second) as a duration.

tl;dr SoP & PW were never used together, this fix nerfed it because it was a core game change.

@ Pura. I get it completely I used headshot for similar purposes, D/P thieves used it and so did P/P thieves, but it’s main intrinsic (right word?) purpose is as an interrupt to skills which it does and does well.

evilapprentice.6379:

PW was being carried by SoP, and even then it was only mediocre. Without the extra .5s stun, it’s inability to be used effectively against anyone with a tiny bit of experience is finally out in the open. The spec went from UP to unplayable due to this, as Anet originally designed I guess.

It’s still good with Runes of Perplexity, which I use with S/P in WvW and wasn’t nerfed in this latest patch. Headshot is better for the insta-interrupt, but PW actually brings real damage with it.

Honestly, this might just mean that I have to run with Devourer Venom on my bar, to hold people in place for the follow-up strikes. Now that the condition works properly, it’s viable.

Interceptor.2653:

evilapprentice.6379:

PW was being carried by SoP, and even then it was only mediocre. Without the extra .5s stun, it’s inability to be used effectively against anyone with a tiny bit of experience is finally out in the open. The spec went from UP to unplayable due to this, as Anet originally designed I guess.

It’s still good with Runes of Perplexity, which I use with S/P in WvW and wasn’t nerfed in this latest patch. Headshot is better for the insta-interrupt, but PW actually brings real damage with it.

Honestly, this might just mean that I have to run with Devourer Venom on my bar, to hold people in place for the follow-up strikes. Now that the condition works properly, it’s viable.

Devs already said they’re nerfing perplexity, just a matter of when now.

heavy nerfs, no consistent buffs on this patch
as expected … thief haters…

ensoriki.5789:

All good and well, but i’m just asking if PW got intrinsically nerfed or not, and if so, where are the patch notes?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-October-15-2013/first#post3027301

PW is a stun. PW no longer rounds.

Excalibur.9748:

Devs already said they’re nerfing perplexity, just a matter of when now.

What did they say that were doing with it? Not really a big kitten deal if they just add an ICD to the sixth slot ability.

Thank you (123456789)

Only reason i used sop on s/p was for the steal daze if i went 30 in trickery (2s instead of 1s unless i was mistaken), otherwise i didn’t bothered with it.

Bah, i guess i’ll just roll a troll trap lock build with my thief or a full offence vampiric necro, might aswell have some fun until this gets sorted out. Or maybe venom share since it must be ridiculously lame with the immobilize changes.

I’m really sorry guys.

Being the only Thief in the entire country to use sword and shadow trap in WvW I feel partly responsible for some of these nerfs effecting the game beyond Spvp.

Doggie.3184:

I’m really sorry guys.

Being the only Thief in the entire country to use sword and shadow trap in WvW I feel partly responsible for some of these nerfs effecting the game beyond Spvp.

I use sword too lol but I’m not sure I’m responsible for any nerfs. I don’t roam that much.

BTW how does a casting time on a stunbreaker work? Kinda confused~ guess I need to test it.
I must of made a single stunlock warrior developer angry in wvw on 1 occasion for this to happen. ;o

^

Destroy shadow trap: Just tested this thing out. You stunbreak on use. The enemy now actually has 1.5 seconds to stun you a second time. Not sure if I like it this way, but we’ll see.

And doggie/excalibur, I trained all the thieves in my guild and alliance guilds to use S/P and shadowtrap …

Well so much for landing any strikes after Pistol Whip in pvp/wvw now…..God forbid S/P is used for anything other than PVE.

Gwalchgwn.1659:

^

Destroy shadow trap: Just tested this thing out. You stunbreak on use. The enemy now actually has 1.5 seconds to stun you a second time. Not sure if I like it this way, but we’ll see.

And doggie/excalibur, I trained all the thieves in my guild and alliance guilds to use S/P and shadowtrap …

I prefer S/D.

They have nerfed every single viable thief pvp build this day… Thank You Anet! I can say one thing. I wish to see 1 major patch with no thieves notes, why? Because it would be the first real buff for thieves —-—>>> no nerfs.