Guild Wars 2

I’m sorry if this comes off as a bit of an angry rant, but…

I’ve been off of these forums for a few months, and I came back to find that apparently 2 0 0 6 6 (formerly 10 0 0 30 30) has become relatively popular (somebody made a thread on the build, which is enough for me to call it popular I guess). I’m not going to lie, I’m actually kinda amazed that the build has been graced with an appearance at the top tiers of play.

However, then I saw some comments such as these (emphasis mine)…

Audiogasm.7643:

The sizer build is the most effective one on thief at the moment.

Shockwave.1230:

Sizer’s build is an ‘evade tank’, it’s got a lot of evades that provide a lot of sustain. It also offers perma vigor. Between signet of agility, feline grace, and perma vigor you can literally dodge 6 times in a row. On top of that you have evades from flanking strike and withdraw. You also can evade via teleports. You have Slight of Hand too, and basi venom, for 2 interrupst. You have 3000 more health than any non-acro thief build, it’s basically as close as it gets to a bunker thief.

Combine all the above defenses with with a Berserker’s amulet and you have a pretty rediculous build on paper (I think it could be tiered on the level of Soldier’s Strength Rune Hambow Warrior and Celestial Strength Rune D/D Ele). I think it’s the thief’s best build honestly, but choose not to run it because I feel like having that many dodges and evades with that much damage and mobility isn’t an intended playstyle, so I don’t want to get used to it only to have it nerfed in the future and feel like I was playing with a crutch.

Crovax.7854:

@ panicbutton: we know sizer didn’t come up with it but i don’t even know the
name of this other guy. plus sizer made the build popular and everybody here knows immediatly it’s a 20066 s/d if you say ‘sizers build’.

Amonatory.2453:

Idk who made the build I don’t really think anyone does tbh. But people think whoever made the build popular made it, which can be true but idk about this build.

I actually created the build well over a year ago and have been playing it ever since. I created this guide to my old variation of the build at the end of July 2013: http://intothemists.com/guides/293-sd_heavy_boonsteal_harassment_thief_by_arga

As you can see from the pinned “Guide to Thief Guides”, the build was later adjusted to the state that I currently use it in (and to a state extremely close to the one used by Sizer): http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAsYVl0Mp3pVOx0J8PNBNh4d4vb1KQ3RL2E-TZRBwAROCAA3fgcZgHnAAAPAAA

Now, anybody who’s been around the forums for the past year or so may know how hard I fought to promote the build to the community, and I was met with a very large rejection from a very wide range of thieves. So, I hope that you guys understand that the fact that people are suddenly proclaiming it to be the best thief build now and are yet attributing the build to Sizer agitates me a lot. For those of you out there who have continued to attribute the build to me, such as RedSpectrum and Panicbutton, thank you. However, I do want to establish that Sizer leapt onto the 2 0 0 6 6 boat ages after I and some other S/D players did, and I’ll be checking in with Sizer soon to make sure that he isn’t plagiarizing the massive amounts of work that I’ve done on the build.

Again, I apologize for the nature of this post, but I hope you all can understand the amount of effort I put into making 2 0 0 6 6 viable, and why it makes attributing the build to Sizer extremely annoying to me. Thanks.

No offense but this is what i was talking about as in the build does not make its popular its the player. sizer is very skilled and is the main reason he sets trends, but people on the forums tend to think there a build is made popular by the build itself but it is the player that plays it. also sizer does not use 2/0/0/6/6 he uses a variant of it, i remember watching something with sizer and his build wasn’t 2/0/0/6/6.

Man, get over yourself please…

Do you really think that you were the first person on earth to play a 20066 build?
You clicked so fast on the traits that you acquired the right to own every 20066 build?

No to mention that 3 traits are different. In addition a build that is good today WASN’T good months ago, since patches introduced changes.

Sizer, a top thief, used this build and many people copied it. No one is wondering about who’s the very first thief in the world that used a 20066 build. Simple as that.

Mystogan.4157:

No offense but this is what i was talking about as in the build does not make its popular its the player. sizer is very skilled and is the main reason he sets trends, but people on the forums tend to think there a build is made popular by the build itself but it is the player that plays it. also sizer does not use 2/0/0/6/6 he uses a variant of it, i remember watching something with sizer and his build wasn’t 2/0/0/6/6.

First of all, I’m just responding to what I’m hearing. I’m sure that Sizer doesn’t use 2 0 0 6 6 every time he plays, but that doesn’t stop people from calling 2 0 0 6 6 “Sizer’s build”.

Secondly, I’ve seen Sizer play. I’m not massively impressed with him, but I would say he’s better than your average thief. That being said, just because he plays a build does not mean it belongs to him. For instance, there are many extremely famous people that use Facebook, but we don’t attribute the creation of Facebook to those extremely famous people. Hell, even if this was how we assigned ownership to builds, Sizer wouldn’t be able to be called the build’s owner. We’d have to give that to Mistpedia or Twitch, because the only reason Sizer was able to popularize the build was through those two organizations/businesses. I would just as easily have played in the ToL (which, if I’m not mistaken, is where Sizer played the build) if not for the fact that I was on a forum ban at the time, preventing me from creating a post looking for a team, and my in-game team fell apart when nobody wanted to commit to a team with Nettle and I.

It might not be serious to you people, but this build is my intellectual property. I created it, and to say that Sizer owns it is not only wrong but extremely offensive.

EDIT: I admit that “intellectual property” was not the most technically correct term. However, the idea belongs to me, which makes it my intellectual property in that it is “a work or invention that is the result of creativity”, but not my intellectual property in the legal sense.

NO POINT TO THIS THREAD

Sadly people will flame you. No chance you get the credit you think you deserve. Why did you make this? Unless you were the first person to click on traits I am 100% sure someone clicked 10/0/0/30/30 before you did and did not make a guide or post it on the forums. Flame war in 3…2…1

EDIT – “It might not be serious to you people, but this build is my intellectual property. I created it, and to say that Sizer owns it is not only wrong but extremely offensive.”

Seriously. I laughed out loud. Intellectual Property?! Anet owns the game and all builds made in-game, not you. Please sue sizer

Skile.1384:

Man, get over yourself please…

Do you really think that you were the first person on earth to play a 20066 build?
You clicked so fast on the traits that you acquired the right to own every 20066 build?

No to mention that 3 traits are different. In addition a build that is good today WASN’T good months ago, since patches introduced changes.

Sizer, a top thief, used this build and many people copied it. No one is wondering about who’s the very first thief in the world that used a 20066 build. Simple as that.

Was I the first person to play it? Probably not. However, as far as I can tell from my experience (which spans to almost the day the game was released), I was the

- First to write about it, and theory craft on the build.
- First to write a guide on the build
- First to have streamed videos in which the build was used
- First to have used the build in a tournament
- First to have advocated for the build
- First to make serious calculations on the stat distributions included in the build
- First to have kept constantly updating the build for the community’s use

Sizer, on the other hand, really doesn’t have any “firsts” to counter my own. And, to counter your point about “clicking so fast on the traits that you acquired the right to own every 20066 build”, would you say that Sizer has the right to own every single 20066 build because he/ToL (from what I’ve heard) streamed it? On the other hand, everybody refers to 2 6 0 0 6 S/P as Toker’s build, or 0 6 0 6 2 as Jumper’s build (or, at least, it would still be referred to as Jumper’s build if people still knew who Jumper was today. At the time, however, that was in fact what it was referred to). Neither of those players put in as much work into promoting the build as I did, and yet they get ownership of the build and I’m left empty-handed.

Also…

- Changing some traits around does not give you ownership of a certain point allocation, nor has it ever in the GW2 community. Plus, I’ve even advocated some of the trait/utility changes for many players throughout the build’s life span.
- The build was fine three months ago, and if you look at the changes over the last few months, from what I’ve seen, S/D has received virtually no buffs. Instead, other builds have been nerfed. To think that that means that S/D was bad three months ago but is now suddenly good is, frankly, ridiculous.

I don’t care. I don’t know you but I know Sizer.
Most people know Sizer while not knowing you. For me it’s Sizer’s build
because he won the ToL with it and made it popular.
Who cares about your ego when it is much more practical
to use a term, almost everybody understands?

Besides, making a thread with the title ‘PSA’ as if it was a ‘service’ of you to tell people to refer to a build as yours seems pretty…. yeah

My biggest question is why did my comment get mentioned? I don’t think sizer made the build I was stating that since he streams with it and does good with it people think he made it. It’s happened to me, people think I made 2/0/6/0/6 which may or may not be true. I’ve ran that spec for well over a year too and I made it popular so people think I made it. But I was kind of defending whoever did make it you or whoever idrc, it’s a build and a streamer uses it so it’s always going to be labeled as his build, live with it.

Crovax.7854:

I don’t care. I don#t know you but I know Sizer.
Most people know Sizer while not knowing you. For me it’s Sizer’s build
because he won the ToL with it and made it popular.

No, for you it’s Sizer’s build because you’re too stubborn to change your mind in the face of the truth. Saying “I don’t care” makes you look ridiculous at best.

The only reason that Sizer won the ToL with it and I didn’t was because ANet made it extremely difficult for me to join the tournament, and my team fell apart because of a lack of committment from people looking to join. I also find it insanely funny that you think that a single tournament allows you to own a build, but streaming/writing guides/theorycrafting/arguing with other top thieves/etc about the build doesn’t give you an ounce of credit.

Amonatory.2453:

My biggest question is why did my comment get mentioned? I don’t think sizer made the build I was stating that since he streams with it and does good with it people think he made it. It’s happened to me, people think I made 2/0/6/0/6 which may or may not be true. I’ve ran that spec for well over a year too and I made it popular so people think I made it. But I was kind of defending whoever did make it you or whoever idrc, it’s a build and a streamer uses it so it’s always going to be labeled as his build, live with it.

I mentioned your comment because people don’t seem to understand that the build was originally created by me. And up until less than a month ago, 2 0 0 6 6 was labeled as “Arganthium’s build” (when it was referred to at all), not Sizer’s.

Arganthium.5638:

Crovax.7854:

I don’t care. I don#t know you but I know Sizer.
Most people know Sizer while not knowing you. For me it’s Sizer’s build
because he won the ToL with it and made it popular.

No, for you it’s Sizer’s build because you’re too stubborn to change your mind in the face of the truth. Saying “I don’t care” makes you look ridiculous at best.

The only reason that Sizer won the ToL with it and I didn’t was because ANet made it extremely difficult for me to join the tournament, and my team fell apart because of a lack of committment from people looking to join. I also find it insanely funny that you think that a single tournament allows you to own a build, but streaming/writing guides/theorycrafting/arguing with other top thieves/etc about the build doesn’t give you an ounce of credit.

You make yourself look like a little child begging his parents to acknowledge
some petty achievement of his. I explained the reasoning behind my terminology perfectly fine but your ego obviously can’t handle it.

Crovax.7854:

Arganthium.5638:

Crovax.7854:

I don’t care. I don#t know you but I know Sizer.
Most people know Sizer while not knowing you. For me it’s Sizer’s build
because he won the ToL with it and made it popular.

No, for you it’s Sizer’s build because you’re too stubborn to change your mind in the face of the truth. Saying “I don’t care” makes you look ridiculous at best.

The only reason that Sizer won the ToL with it and I didn’t was because ANet made it extremely difficult for me to join the tournament, and my team fell apart because of a lack of committment from people looking to join. I also find it insanely funny that you think that a single tournament allows you to own a build, but streaming/writing guides/theorycrafting/arguing with other top thieves/etc about the build doesn’t give you an ounce of credit.

You make yourself look like a little child begging his parents to acknowledge
some petty achievement of his. I explained the reasoning behind my terminology perfectly fine but your ego obviously can’t handle it.

For a person that considers the creation of the somewhat unorthodox 2 0 0 6 6 build to be a “petty achievement”, you seem to be pretty intent on arguing about its ownership.

Arganthium.5638:

Mystogan.4157:

No offense but this is what i was talking about as in the build does not make its popular its the player. sizer is very skilled and is the main reason he sets trends, but people on the forums tend to think there a build is made popular by the build itself but it is the player that plays it. also sizer does not use 2/0/0/6/6 he uses a variant of it, i remember watching something with sizer and his build wasn’t 2/0/0/6/6.

First of all, I’m just responding to what I’m hearing. I’m sure that Sizer doesn’t use 2 0 0 6 6 every time he plays, but that doesn’t stop people from calling 2 0 0 6 6 “Sizer’s build”.

Secondly, I’ve seen Sizer play. I’m not massively impressed with him, but I would say he’s better than your average thief. That being said, just because he plays a build does not mean it belongs to him. For instance, there are many extremely famous people that use Facebook, but we don’t attribute the creation of Facebook to those extremely famous people. Hell, even if this was how we assigned ownership to builds, Sizer wouldn’t be able to be called the build’s owner. We’d have to give that to Mistpedia or Twitch, because the only reason Sizer was able to popularize the build was through those two organizations/businesses. I would just as easily have played in the ToL (which, if I’m not mistaken, is where Sizer played the build) if not for the fact that I was on a forum ban at the time, preventing me from creating a post looking for a team, and my in-game team fell apart when nobody wanted to commit to a team with Nettle and I.

It might not be serious to you people, but this build is my intellectual property. I created it, and to say that Sizer owns it is not only wrong but extremely offensive.

yea i know where you are coming from in annoyed by it too because its false information that every sees and assumes is true

Crovax.7854:

@ panicbutton: we know sizer didn’t come up with it but i don’t even know the
name of this other guy. plus sizer made the build popular and everybody here knows immediatly it’s a 20066 s/d if you say ‘sizers build’.

Crovax.7854:

Who cares about your ego when it is much more practical
to use a term, almost everybody understands?

Arganthium.5638:

you seem to be pretty intent on arguing about its ownership.

Reading comprehension. Do you have it?
Beside, nobody owns this build as the game and any of its content is intellectual property of Arenanet.

Arganthium.5638:

For a person that considers the creation of the somewhat unorthodox 2 0 0 6 6 build to be a “petty achievement”…

I was using a metaphor to show the image I now have of you.

Crovax.7854:

Beside, nobody owns this build

Crovax.7854:

‘sizers build’.

Oh.

Arganthium.5638:

Crovax.7854:

Beside, nobody owns this build

Crovax.7854:

‘sizers build’.

Oh.

A name doesn’t declare ownership. My name for example is not ‘Property of [insert my parents’ name]

Crovax.7854:

Arganthium.5638:

Crovax.7854:

Beside, nobody owns this build

Crovax.7854:

‘sizers build’.

Oh.

A name doesn’t declare ownership. My name for example is not ‘Property of [insert my parent’s name]

I’m not seeing the point you’re trying to make with the “My name for example is not” example, but that’s missing the point. Unless you actually meant “Sizers” instead of “Sizer’s” (and I’m quite certain that’s not the case), the term “Sizer’s” refers to something as belonging to Sizer, the same way that I would say that Guild Wars 2 is ArenaNet’s game, or that [some limousine] is the President’s limousine.

You seem to be missing the point i was making for the last couple of posts;
Name recognition for Sizer is much higher than for whatever your ingame name is.
Therefore people immediatly know it’s a 2/0/0/6/6 s/d-sb with III-II III VIII-V VII XII
with air-fire and fire-energy.
Aside from some people on the forums, most ingame don’t know you but know Sizer since TCG won the ToL. Deal with it.

I’m out by the way so don’t even bother with your delusional ‘People are supposed to know who I am.’ By creating this thread you made a big enough fool of yourself already.
Maybe people will know you when your team wins the next big tournament

Crovax.7854:

You seem to be missing the point i was making for the last couple of posts;
Name recognition for Sizer is much higher than for whatever your ingame name is.
Therefore people immediatly know it’s a 2/0/0/6/6 s/d-sb with III-II III VIII-V VII XII
with air-fire and fire-energy.
Aside from some people on the forums, most ingame don’t know you but know Sizer since TCG won the ToL. Deal with it.

I’m out by the way so don’t even bother with your delusional ‘People are supposed to know who I am.’ Maybe people will know you when your team wins the next big tournament

Yes, I’ll stick to my delusional “people are supposed to know who I am” statements, and you can keep to your delusional “well, Arganthium made this build over a year ago, wrote about it and streamed it, and played it and advocated it, but it’s really Sizer who owns the build” statements.

Dude they have a different GM trait, they’re not the same build.

scerevisiae.1972:

Dude they have a different GM trait, they’re not the same build.

Builds are never referred to by their specific traits, just point allocation. For example, you wouldn’t call Toker’s build a 2 6 0 0 6 III, IV, X, XI, V, VII, XII S/P build, you’d just call it a 2 6 0 0 6 build. For Jumper’s old build (0 6 0 6 2 S/D S/D), you’d refer to the trait point allocation and weapon sets as his build, even if you had different traits. It’s hilarious that suddenly people want to use a double standard against me to remove my ownership of the idea of the build with comments such as yours. If I changed Sleight of Hand on Toker’s build to Hastened Replenishment, that wouldn’t suddenly make it my build. It might make it my variation of the build, but I still couldn’t claim the build itself. Similarly, Sizer might take variations of the build, or even create the most popular variation of the build, but the build itself still belongs to me.

Furthermore, Sizer, from what I’ve heard, changes his traits around a lot anyways, so it’s not like you can really say he has different traits from me in the first place.

Dude who gives a kitten.. I used this build long before I ever “heard” of it, and not your kittenty variation of it either, the exact one thats popular now.. I’ve tried just about any build combo you could come up with, as have thousands of people.

The only people who post these builds and “promote” them are #1 attention seekers or #2 people seeking Youtube views.

Obviously you didn’t impress anyone, so nobody thinks of you when they consider the build.

“intellectual property” “my idea” “i was first to blah blah” – who gives a kitten .

dank.3680:

Dude who gives a kitten.. I used this build long before I ever “heard” of it, and not your kittenty variation of it either, the exact one thats popular now.. I’ve tried just about any build combo you could come up with, as have thousands of people.

The only people who post these builds and “promote” them are #1 attention seekers or #2 people seeking Youtube views.

Obviously you didn’t impress anyone, so nobody thinks of you when they consider the build.

“intellectual property” “my idea” “i was first to blah blah” – who gives a kitten .

Except that, unlike you, I have evidence to show that I used the build before anybody else claiming to do so. Even if I wasn’t the first to play it, I still was the first to do a lot of things for the build, which neither you nor anybody else can claim. I also think it’s extremely funny that, after writing about this build for well over a year, you have never once made a comment stating that you played 2 0 0 6 6 / 10 0 0 30 30 until now, of all times.

I hope you have something to back up your tasteless insults.

For all you know, Sizer got this build directly from me (with a few adjustments). Who are you to say that nobody was impressed? And either way, the point of this post was not to determine who was and was not impressed by my build, but to establish my ownership of the build.

Obviously, the guy who just responded to my post seems to give a kitten.

You set yourself up for bad karma when you started this thread :/

No one owns any build in this game. It’s so easy to re-trait, why would you even attempt to claim a build? I personally switch my builds almost two times a day trying out something different or quirky. The number of players heavily outnumbers the amount of possible viable variations of all builds in this game. So statistically speaking you could never trace the first time someone ever used a build. Documenting it also mean nothing in the game — I know a handful of thieves that used 2/0/0/6/6 before you or sizer, that don’t stream because they rather keep secrecy of their builds.

How dare Sizer allocate those trait points into those specific traits to where they perfectly matched up to the traits that rightfully belongs to you and no one else. /s

But seriously though, I was the first one to put 30 points into Critical Strikes creating the standard x/30/x/x/x build. Anyone that uses that build should give credit to me because I was the first one to create/use it.

I ran 10/0/15/15/30 just a week after steal had its cd reduced to 35 seconds. I was sooo close ; ;

But who cares what build is labeled as, hell I’ve found a way to get rich quick on the tp by buying mats making an exclusive recipe and selling the results back, but I could care less if someone put up a guide and said they’re a genius. Honestly I’d be upset if I were sizer not from this thread but from being praised like some religious figure and spawning a wave or poor thieves who can’t think for themselves. Call it “sizer’s build”, I call em phonies who make thieves look bad but hey, it’s still not as kitteneeing p/p thieves.

I don’t see anything wrong with asking for build advice, but when people literally copy paste some YouTube hero’s build and multiply in numbers it gets really boring really quick.

This message brought to you by Death-to-Hambow. May you perish slowly and painfully.

Arganthium.5638:

dank.3680:

Dude who gives a kitten.. I used this build long before I ever “heard” of it, and not your kittenty variation of it either, the exact one thats popular now.. I’ve tried just about any build combo you could come up with, as have thousands of people.

The only people who post these builds and “promote” them are #1 attention seekers or #2 people seeking Youtube views.

Obviously you didn’t impress anyone, so nobody thinks of you when they consider the build.

“intellectual property” “my idea” “i was first to blah blah” – who gives a kitten .

Except that, unlike you, I have evidence to show that I used the build before anybody else claiming to do so. Even if I wasn’t the first to play it, I still was the first to do a lot of things for the build, which neither you nor anybody else can claim. I also think it’s extremely funny that, after writing about this build for well over a year, you have never once made a comment stating that you played 2 0 0 6 6 / 10 0 0 30 30 until now, of all times.

I hope you have something to back up your tasteless insults.

For all you know, Sizer got this build directly from me (with a few adjustments). Who are you to say that nobody was impressed? And either way, the point of this post was not to determine who was and was not impressed by my build, but to establish my ownership of the build.

Obviously, the guy who just responded to my post seems to give a kitten.

You never seen me comment on it because I don’t go around seeking attention. I also don’t visit many “build” threads on the forum because I’d rather make up my own kitten and play it my way.

The real funny part, is your build is not even the same build. You claim its only decided by trait point allocations but that is ridiculous. Your build does not have several of the major staples that make it even a good build. Namely, Sleight of Hand and Pain Response, not to mention Signet of Agility which is pretty important to it as well. On top of that your rune and sigil choices are outdated and bad.

This is not the same build-

What exactly are you after with this topic? You want people to say “Arganthium’s build” instead of “Sizers build”… —--Seeking attention only, like I said.

I said you didn’t impress anyone, because if you had PEOPLE WOULD KNOW WHO THE FK U ARE.

Oh btw the difference is- Sizer did not post a topic and go call this “Sizer’s Build”, people just DID.

Just for the record, I don’t really like the build as much as 2 6 0 0 6 or 5 6 0 0 3 or 4 0 0 4 6 or 4 6 0 0 4 or some of the other many builds I play on a regular basis. I own all the builds, from here on out every thief setup is “Dank’s Build” kthnx.

NinjaEd.3946:

Call it “sizer’s build”, I call em phonies who make thieves look bad but hey, it’s still not as kitteneeing p/p thieves.

That’s it. I’m taking you to e-court for slandering dual pistol builds (which I own all rights to and can be rented out for the low, low price of 5g/hr). You’d better lawyer up, pal.

It’s called sizer build b/c he made it somewhat popular .
If you would have streamed it when playing it might would be called your build – but this is how things go normally …

There a plenty of good players out there, playing nice interesting builds which also might become popular as soon as some known streamer plays them, its just the way it is.

Be proud that you did play the build before and get over it .

Well, I started messing around with 2/0/0/6/6 S/D in January after getting bored with always traiting into critical strikes, then logged onto the forums and saw that you do it too, and that Arcadius Cole had videos of himself playing it as well. I saw it as proof that my theorycrafting was sound, as I figured that if it was viable the odds are someone would have done it and written about it somewhere.

It’s the old adage, there’s nothing new under the sun. I played it before Sizer made it popular, you did it before he did, and odds are there’s others that did it before you. I imagine you feel the same way as people who played 0/6/6/2 before Yishis did, not much that can be done about that either.

I’m not trying to be a kitten or anything, I just think the horse might have left the stable on this one :/

In regard to the OP, if you’re curious as to why it’s called Sizer’s build, it’s a pretty simple formula.

The stage it was used (ToL) +
The recency it had been observed as a meta build (never?/forever ago?) +
The Results it Produced (Winning ToL) +
It’s effectiveness (easy to play, low risk, high reward) +
The player the above happened through (Sizer)

Whether or not you feel it’s unfair or fair that the build is referred to as Sizer’s is irrelevant, because the above are true and people have respect for those things and are therefore showing respect to Sizer and giving him credit for both his build choice, which at the time was a seemingly odd one to make as a thief, and the results he and his team produced with the build and thier comp.

I remember you advocating this build a ton last year and you were taking a lot of heat from a lot of players—like Jumper who said the build was really lacking.

Pretty funny how paradigms shift.

As for ownership, I know you’re not claiming to be the first to click 10-0-0-30-30, and it’s ridiculous for people to say you’re suggesting that. I agree with what you’re -actually- saying—that you were the prime and sole advocate for the virtues of this build when no one else considered it viable in competitive play.

As for viability, I never tried it, and I don’t know how viable it is/would have been without the strength runes—regardless you were the only person backing the build until sizer made it popular.

Builds are given ownership within the community, if you can even call it ownership to the person who popularized the build. It has absolutely nothing to do with being the first to make it or what ever.

Sure, you documented the build, and tried to spread it amongst thief players as a legit build, yeah great good for you!

But you are not the reason the build is currently as popular as it is. That is why almost no one credits the build to you.

Stop being so salty over this.

After the feature patch came out, I immediately created and posted a video guide with the new optimal PvE build for Thieves. This setup happened to be the exact same one that DnT would come up with a couple of days later, and that garnered much more attention in the long run because DnT are a popular name in the GW2 community so it only makes sense.

Does that mean they “own” the build? No, and neither do I! So why do people refer to it as the “DnT build”? Because a lot of people know who DnT are, and thus will instantaneously recall the setup in question. Popularity works wonders for a frame of reference in players’ minds, but that doesn’t somehow equate to ownership.

You should be happy that the build you promoted has been validated, as I was. Seeking to claim ownership of it is childish.

To be painfully honest, almost all high-level builds in this game can be attributed to common sense. Most knowledgeable players are going to be able to slot together at least the framework for builds that work in a current or recent meta. Nobody should be pretending that they are some sort of genius innovator when it comes to buildcraft in this game.

I will say one thing, however – back when you were heavily promoting 20066, Air + Fire (combined) and the new Strength runes weren’t a thing. They are a heavy, heavy influence on how well this build works at high level competitive play. Not saying everyone was right to criticise the way they did, because 20066 has always worked pretty much everywhere else (hell, I made it up on the spot for some WvW shenanigans a bunch of times).

Moreover, how is this a PSA?

It doesn’t matter who made the build. For goodness sake within the first week of the game I’d tried out 10 0 0 30 30 on my thief with s/d.

There are reasons why people refer to it as Sizer’s build, namely he made it popular and its easy to say “Sizer’s build” when talking about it since a large number of thief players will immediately know what build is being talked about. If I was to say “Oh yeah I switched over to Arganthium.5638’s build at the patch” people would have no idea what I was saying.

TLDR: Its not about who made the build its about who made it popular.

lol this guy made my day.

This guy is like a pre-adolescent chick yelling for attention.

I’ll keep saying Sizer’s build, we’ll keep saying Sizer’s build ‘cause its easier and he’s good at it.

peace.

Arganthium, you’re an annoying kitten, and so are all these Sizer fanboys, but I remember you were the first to popularise the build. You should get the credit for it. But then again, the reason this build is seeing use now is because you don’t have to put as many points into Crit Strikes as you already how some of the crit damage from that line and wide usage of Strength Runes which boosts your damage and makes boon stealing even more important than before. Which obviously makes the build much stronger now than it was before.
Anyway, to all the people that don’t understand the point of this thread, it’s no fun being laughed at for using a certain build, only to discover that a year later every single thief is using it and giving the credit for the build to someone else. Also, please stop saying it doesn’t matter who comes up with it first. There’s a LOT of people that constantly try out new builds, and finding a new build, sticking to it, putting it to use in top tier play and popularising it is no easy feat and deserves the credit.

Hey Argan welcome back.

I think we had quite a discussion a while back about your 20066 vs the “old meta” 26006 and 26060

Now sizer uses 20066 and yes he has made it relatively popular. However, there are some very big differences between your 20066 and his 20066 that make his “viable,” and yours not so much (IMO).

1. Strength Runes and Power of Inertia. This by itself helps to make up for the general lack of damage present in your build.

2. Sleight of Hand. Speaks for itself. Interrupt, shorter steal CD, all in all is what makes thieves so beastly atm.

3. Change to Ferocity and Berserker Amulet.

4. Shadow Refuge. Just standard tPvP thief utility.

At the end of the day, superficially I’d say that yes your 20066 is “the same” as what he runs. But if you dig a little deeper, they’re very different in concept, do very different things, and bring very different things to the table. Sizer’s setup has enough damage and enough utility to be viable. Your 20066 setup focusing on Initiative gain and regen does not.

All i read from the op was memememememmemememememememememememe…. Get over it man its everyone’s build now Sizer made it popular everyone looks up to him because of that it is called Sizer’s Build

Get over it …
It’s like motorsports … The driver gets the fame … not the engineer.
If you like to craft builds you should do it for the community and not your ego.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/The-Evasive-Invader-Support-Bunker

With best regards!
Shino

I’m sure many thieves have run this build just randomly without reading the forum or any guides, but it never really became popular, just like 2/6/0/0/6 with S/D. And now just because some generic skilled thief played it and won with it in ToL it’s apparently is the best build, sizer played it so it must be op!

But I remember I tried this build out in the past when Arganthium was talking a lot about it, so he’s the one who introduced it to me, he was well known on the forum a while back (he even has a sticky thread) and he tried really hard to spread the build out to the community, seems disrespectful to christen it “Sizer’s build” in this situation in particular.

I don’t understand why anyone would (or even could) claim ownership or IPR on a particular build. It doesn’t make sense. I’m not going to pay royalties if I use it.

Sizer’s build == the build that Sizer plays at the moment. When thief gets patched and he changes to 3/5/2/0/4, that will be the build that Sizer plays. Sizer’s build.

Who is Sizer ? And 10 0 0 30 30 is maybe 2 years old condition build

Most OP thread in thief’s forums history.
You deserve a cookie Arganthium

Alright, I’ve just created 1/6/5/2/0 build.

Copyright protected. This is lazycalm’s build

Your build was terrible, Arganthium. Sizer’s is not.

People give names to builds because of the people who made it popular,
2/6/0/6/0 s/d is “Jumper’s” build
2/6/0/0/6 d/p is “Caed’s” build
0/6/6/2/0 d/d is “Yishis’s” build
2/0/0/6/6 s/d is “Sizer’s” build
Did these people create the build? No. But they were famous enough to make it known to most players hence people refer to those builds by calling it after the player who made it popular.

azerte.4365:

People give names to builds because of the people who made it popular,
2/6/0/6/0 s/d is “Jumper’s” build
2/6/0/0/6 d/p is “Caed’s” build
0/6/6/2/0 d/d is “Yishis’s” build
2/0/0/6/6 s/d is “Sizer’s” build
Did these people create the build? No. But they were famous enough to make it known to most players hence people refer to those builds by calling it after the player who made it popular.

Exactly.

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

NinjaEd.3946:

Call it “sizer’s build”, I call em phonies who make thieves look bad but hey, it’s still not as kitteneeing p/p thieves.

That’s it. I’m taking you to e-court for slandering dual pistol builds (which I own all rights to and can be rented out for the low, low price of 5g/hr). You’d better lawyer up, pal.

You Can’t handle the truth!

Ok tom, now you can sue me.

Of course arganthium ill give you credit for your kittenty ineffective outdated 2/0/0/6/6 build and continue to put sizer’s properly updated 2/0/0/6/6 build on my rotations that i use when i play thief and spit at your setup.

well since i m quoted in here i’ll have to expose my point of view on here.

I called it “Sizer build” because to my knowledge Sizer is the best known thief playing this build and every one will see what i’m talking about without going into details about the build that’s all.
I’m not sure i’ll get the same effect if i called it “Arganthium build” or any other name.

Then we have to keep in mind that this damage lacking build was only made viable after the april feature patch and rune of strength meta, because everyone is stacking might and you can steal it from them to boost your own damage, allowing to trait into more defence and utility.
So the build may have been played by any thief before, and maybe with sucess, but it is only a trend and as soon the might stacking meta will be nerf, we won’t hear about it so much just like old thief build.