Guild Wars 2

1 – can prevent capping while in stealth.
2 – can finish from stealth.
3 – can rezz in stealth.
4 – permanent stealth due to culling in W v W.

This here ^^ is ridiculous !

while in stealth you shouldn’t be able to prevent capping this would take care of mechanics exploits in W v W and sPVP specially supply camp cap prevention by a single player in stealth taking advantage of culling bug to perma stealth

while in stealth you cannot perform finisher this is so OP it’s ridiculous it’s still in the game finish from stealth ? what moron was it that thought that this would be balanced? fire that dev right now !

Ressing from stealth, sure you can start the res from stealth but should become visible 1 second afterwards. otherwise how cozy is it to revive while no one is aware of you at all huh ?and I’m not only talking about the target you’re currently fighting so don’t even bother using that as an example it’s obvious that if I see my current target’s HP suddenly going up even if I see no one I’d know there was a thief there !

Here’s an idea A.net, if culling and stealth mechanics cannot be solved you need to introduce stealth detection skills and problem solved

Extra: backstabbing from stealth is fine as long as the CD for going back into stealth is increased to prevent permanent going in and out of stealth without consequences, out of combat stealth CD can remain the same in combat CD a lot longer !

I mean seriously, stealth is a means of escape not a freaking do it all ability even SWTOR as bad as it is understood this concept and you cannot cap or attack while in stealth the moment you do you come out of stealth.

A.net should know that stealth is always one of the most OP skills in all mmorpg’s!
doing anything that adversely affects other players should end stealth in order to keep things balanced.

WvW culling and rendering issues is a bug and should be addressed. If you let a thief revive someone in stealth you’re doing something wrong. I mean come, seriously, you see the enemies health bar randomly going up. A rational person would have the common sense to assume someone in stealth is kneeling right there. Just because he’s invisible doesn’t mean he’s invincible. Finishing in stealth is a legit tactic and is used by all classes who have stealth. If you down that person, you should deserve the kill, it shouldn’t be about “balance” and that point. You already lost and the only likely reason why you would complain about that is if you and your teammates massively outnumber him and he gets the kill while all your teammates are trying to revive you.

On point 4 – this is not just due to culling. There is a video made by a thief showing how he managed to stay permanently stealthed while preventing a supply point from being capped. Granted, he wasn’t attacking anyone and he did pop out of stealth a few times due to people finding him, but, until that point, he was constantly stealthed for about 2 minutes or so. Despite taking damage and having DoTs on him, he was still able to stealth, which is wrong.

Culling is a part of the problem but, stealth needs to be reworked as there really is no true counter to it.

@doomdesire !

W v W unbalance is fine we’re talking here about a massively broken class mate…!
sure you picked the one example that I did not mean for the revival while in stealth because it is convenient for you I take it you’re a thief lol !

reviving a target while in stealth is not just about the target you are fighting !

finishing in stealth is also not about balance is about how broken and moronic that idea is ! You assume and presume to much in your statement about if you lost he deserves the kill LOL.

if I’m facing someone and he goes in stealth and than when he starts the finisher comes out of stealth I’d be fine with it !

As long as any interaction adversely to other players breaks stealth all is fine, it’s the go in stealth and do whatever you want with no way to stop you unless I have 15 friends with me part I have issues with.

moirweyn.9872:

Culling is a part of the problem but, stealth needs to be reworked as there really is no true counter to it.

Or like I proposed introduce stealth detection skills for all classes.

Latinkuro.9420:

moirweyn.9872:

Culling is a part of the problem but, stealth needs to be reworked as there really is no true counter to it.

Or like I proposed introduce stealth detection skills for all classes.

That is not a solution at all. A skill designed solely with the purpose of defending against only one other class is a waste. Better to balance stealth.

Stealth stomps/resses is just a game mechanic and this a l2p issue, while ressing the thief is still there, hit the point.

If this is removed so should be Endure pain stomps, Mist stomps, Invul signet stomps.

Why is stealth stomping an issue when stability stomping is much more powerful?

And rezzing in stealth is safe? Even the worst of players will realize that the enemy’s health steadily increasing means there’s a thief crouched over the body after it happens once or twice. Stealth doesn’t exactly help you much for rezzing when your opponent can see what’s going on, and auto-attack you to death.

Lets face it downstate shouldn’t even be in pvp. As for contesting points wile stealth i agree this should be fixed. perm stealth due to rendering is a game problem not a thief problem.

@ Doomdesire – I take issue with the way you simply dismissed the OP. These things are problems, and if you don’t see that, then you either play a Thief, or you play a class that can take 15-16K damage in 1.5 seconds and not die. Sure, he may drop your health down quite a bit, but you’ll live; not ever seeing where the damage comes from is probably not a big deal to you. You back off and heal up or pop your quick heal, either way, it’s only a mere annoyance to you. To the rest of the people playing, it’s simply instant death from out of nowhere. I used to get upset about it, but at this point, the developers either think its peachy or don’t care; no real reason to get upset. I go back to my spawn point and run back to the fight and carry on. But don’t pretend it’s balanced or okay for this kind of thing.

You can have your opinion, but as for me, a perfectly rational person, none of those things are okay. And, it should always be about balance, maybe not always fairness, but ALWAYS about balance. I mean come on, let’s face it, some people are better than others at this sort of thing, and that might not be fair, but it’s a fact. As long as there is a balanced foundation from which everyone plays, then whatever each player does from that position should be all that makes the difference. In other words, it should be skill, not exploits and unfair advantages that determine the outcome. I would hate to play a class that has that unfair advantage. Wouldn’t you? I mean, otherwise, they would have a tendency to say that it was the unfair advantage and not player skill that won the battle; there would always be a cloud of uncertainty hanging over it. Better to just beat someone fair and square I say.

“You already lost and the only likely reason why you would complain about that is if you and your teammates massively outnumber him and he gets the kill while all your teammates are trying to revive you.”

You sound like you may believe it’s some sort of privilege to be able to steak your kill. I agree to a point. But let’s look at the “likely” scenario. The Thief, who really doesn’t fight, doesn’t really show any superior skill, skulks about in stealth, around the edges of the fight, looking for soft targets. He finds one, walks up behind him and mashes about 3 or 4 keys, the moves play out in about 1-2 seconds, and the ‘target’ is dead. The Thief stays in stealth, stakes his kill, and then removes himself from the battle to recover his cool-downs. Rinse and repeat. I don’t see this as requiring any great skill. This is why I don’t play a Thief. At the moment, in this game, it is (in my opinion) simply not balanced. Anyone can play that style. It takes guts to use the Thief in just about any other way, but some people like having things handed to them I guess. Maybe we should just get some folks to park their characters in the middle of a field and then go afk. Then you can just walk up and kill them by the dozens; frankly, it’d be about the same thing. However, that is just my opinion. ;-)

lmao no ressing while stealth??

I find that the only thing i do best in pve is control aggro, by invising those who shouldnt have it and if team’s about to die shadow refuge squishies with me while ressing the tanks. That will ruin the only thing i do well in instances.

Latinkuro.9420:

finishing in stealth is also not about balance is about how broken and moronic that idea is ! You assume and presume to much in your statement about if you lost he deserves the kill LOL.

This is the only point of yours I have significant issues with. Many classes have a “stomp aide” that will help them get the kill. Stealth is just as fair as stability, to be honest. Even in stealth, you can knockback or AoE fear a Thief. A class with stability just can’t be stopped (does fear still work on them? I forget…). The Thief may be invisible, but that doesn’t mean they can’t be stopped in any way.

AS for the rezzing issue, I tend to think that you would just run around slashing at air until you see numbers if you notice your enemy gaining life too quickly. That or AoE the downed character and let the Thief stand in whatever hell you are unleashing, right?

But yes, they shouldn’t be able to cap/prevent cap of points while invisible and the culling issue needs fixing desperately.

Judas.5432:

Latinkuro.9420:

finishing in stealth is also not about balance is about how broken and moronic that idea is ! You assume and presume to much in your statement about if you lost he deserves the kill LOL.

This is the only point of yours I have significant issues with. Many classes have a “stomp aide” that will help them get the kill. Stealth is just as fair as stability, to be honest. Even in stealth, you can knockback or AoE fear a Thief. A class with stability just can’t be stopped (does fear still work on them? I forget…). The Thief may be invisible, but that doesn’t mean they can’t be stopped in any way.

AS for the rezzing issue, I tend to think that you would just run around slashing at air until you see numbers if you notice your enemy gaining life too quickly. That or AoE the downed character and let the Thief stand in whatever hell you are unleashing, right?

But yes, they shouldn’t be able to cap/prevent cap of points while invisible and the culling issue needs fixing desperately.

Fear does not affects stability and if it does ive never seen a target about to finish my necro off run away. Also for necros to fear from a downed state have to see a target and they even have a cast time on that fear. Wonderful down state necros have.

One of the best things is to cast stealth on a downed team mate while 3 ppl are performing the finisher on him and then ress him and kill those 3 enemies… ahaha wunderbar!
Stealth stomps is fine.
Stealth ress is fine.
Stealth camp cap prevent should be fixed.
Revealed debuff is fine

First off, tactical stomps and revives are tactical. If your team can’t throw a KD or fear out while you’re downed then it’s just bad synergy. It’s extremely obvious what a thief is going to do when a C&D or shadow refuge comes out. As another poster said, when someones health starts going up it’s pretty blatant what is going on. The thief may be stealthed, but now you know where he is so by all means ATTACK or CC him.

This is all mostly just a L2P issue. The only valid argument you have is contesting caps while stealthed which I agree it shouldn’t be allowed. Stealth detection is just horrible and should never be added. As always, all this coming from a WvW hero…

Btw there is a revealed debuff, can’t stealth for 3s if you attack someone in stealth.

Gator.7581:

…or you play a class that can take 15-16K damage in 1.5 seconds and not die.

You say that like it’s some exceptional thing, but every single character in the game should be able to take a 15-16k damage hit and not die. If you can’t, you’re doing it wrong.

True – but I was sort of thinking that the 15-16K in 1.5 is followed up by another 3-5K over the next 3 seconds or so…

I agree though. I’m playing some alts through atm – so I’m a bit vulnerable to that kind of burst. Maybe its made me oversensitive…LOL. But yes, I agree.

Well, underleveled alts in WvW are mostly cannon fodder. I too play WvW with my alts but I expect to be destroyed in basically any matchup with an 80 character because that’s just how it’s gonna be if they aren’t a horribad player.

On my thief if I see the green arrow on an enemy there is my attack priority

Daendur.2357:

Stealth stomps is fine.
Stealth ress is fine.
Stealth camp cap prevent should be fixed.

Pretty much this. Stealth stomps/rez are not hard to counter and create a good skill dynamic. Stealth camp capture is bad and should function in WvW like it does in sPvP (stealthed characters do nothing as far as capture or defend).

Latinkuro.9420:

Or like I proposed introduce stealth detection skills for all classes.

Or you can just delete the Thief class and refund it´s players with a free character with equal lvl and equip the deleted Thief had, less effort, 100% effectivity

I would love to have this culling affect me more. Everytime I pop out of stealth I get unloaded on and have to use sword 2 to get hell out of the middle of zerg.

Latinkuro.9420:

while in stealth you shouldn’t be able to prevent capping this would take care of mechanics exploits in W v W and sPVP specially supply camp cap prevention by a single player in stealth taking advantage of culling bug to perma stealth

While I agree with this (you shouldn’t be able to prevent capping while stealthed), make sure you know what you are talking about before posting, or you look like just one of the other thousands of qq threads. sPVP has already solved this. Preventing capping [bold]from stealth[/bold] only occurs (at least as far as I’ve observed, my main is a thief) in WvWvW.

As for the culling issue, it is known by the devs, I’m sure they are working on it, it’s probably not an easy fix, and bring it up in every qq thread probably just makes them ignore most of the thread.

Latinkuro.9420:

I mean seriously, stealth is a means of escape not a freaking do it all ability even SWTOR as bad as it is understood this concept and you cannot cap or attack while in stealth the moment you do you come out of stealth.

Funny you should bring in SWTOR, as you COULD stealth cap for a very long while before they fixed it. You could also stealth through doors, preventing the other side from attacking you, or stealth plant bombs onto the doors. SWTOR is a horrible example to use in proper stealth mechanics. I played an IA, and yes, had great fun abusing this. Sometimes it was the only way to win vs another team that was exploiting some other way (there were many exploits….).

If they want to give the thief a perma stealth and remove our 3 sec stealth every few seconds, I would be up for that: ie make them like every other stealth class, let us wander around invisible without making us work for it, but then when we attack, we only have a few abilities to put us back into stealth, each of these abilities with a cd (say 30+ seconds). But then players would probably just complain about hordes of invisible players slipping past the zerg to ninja cap points…

BTW, we aren’t the only class that can do the above things in your post while “invisible” (or worse invulnerable).

1 – can prevent capping while in stealth.

Doesn’t prevent capping in s/tpvp. In WvW you just need to spam auto attacks all over the place and the thief is dead in no time. I realize the 30 people around you are never aware of it but if they actually had a clue it wouldn’t be such an issue.

2 – can finish from stealth.

Black powder stomp are arguably stronger than stealth stomp. Mist form or elixir S (i think it’s S) stomps are far more op.

3 – can rezz in stealth.

Again you know the thief is here, auto attack, they will both die. And again engi + ele use an utility skill and laugh.

4 – permanent stealth due to culling in W v W.

This one i agree, it is pretty broken.

Latinkuro.9420:

while in stealth you shouldn’t be able to prevent capping this would take care of mechanics exploits in W v W and sPVP specially supply camp cap prevention by a single player in stealth taking advantage of culling bug to perma stealth

Okay, first off, you can’t cap in stealth in sPvP. Since stealth is our main form of defense, this makes thieves horribly bad at node control. You can get 9/10 seconds into capping something before an enemy contests it. Stealth one time, and you lose all of that progress. Likewise, if you’re defending a node, it only takes one stealth and the enemy can take it to grey.

Second, this is insanely easy to counter in WvW. Just group up tight and AoE. Thief melts in one hit from each person once you know where they are. It’s not our fault that you haven’t figured out how to counter us yet.

Third, I would be 100% okay with them removing this (making stealth capture like in sPvP), because it’s a stupid, cheesy tactic. However, it doesn’t bother me either way because my group loves to smash these thieves (I run with 1-2 hammer warriors at all times).

Latinkuro.9420:

while in stealth you cannot perform finisher this is so OP it’s ridiculous it’s still in the game finish from stealth ? what moron was it that thought that this would be balanced? fire that dev right now !

I don’t see the OP here. First off, 5/8 classes can still used their downed interrupt on a stealthed player. Second, your allies can still prevent the thief from finishing you off if they’re not stupid. If you see a thief vanish near a downed enemy, just assume that they’re going for a stomp and act accordingly.

In contrast, almost every other class in the game has a way to give themselves stability so that it is literally impossible to interrupt them. Elementalists, Mesmers, and Warriors can even go 100% invulnerable, where you can’t interrupt them or even damage them while they’re stomping.

Latinkuro.9420:

Ressing from stealth, sure you can start the res from stealth but should become visible 1 second afterwards. otherwise how cozy is it to revive while no one is aware of you at all huh ?and I’m not only talking about the target you’re currently fighting so don’t even bother using that as an example it’s obvious that if I see my current target’s HP suddenly going up even if I see no one I’d know there was a thief there !

You know what? Every single other class has a revive skill. For us, stealth is our revive skill. All stealth skills last four seconds, which isn’t enough to get a full revive off. The only exception is Shadow Refuge, which gives us 15s to revive. Even still, that’s far weaker than any other class’s revive skill, because you have to sit there and revive them. Smart opponents will do huge AoE damage to you, and you should get interrupted.

Compare this to Necro/Ele 3-target instant revive, Warrior unlimited-target revive, Ranger AoE spirit revive and pet revive, etc. Each class has a slightly different way of reviving, and ours is to slowly do it by hand while in stealth.

One other thing you should know. When thieves are in stealth, they’re still there. Hit them. They won’t hit back until they get in position (because that would break stealth), so if you keep moving and use AoE damage/stuns, they’ll melt. Thieves are the game’s squishiest class.

Also, see this list of ways to counter stealth.

So pistol whip, backstab, signets now stealth needs to be nerfed, is there any thing else.
Will people not be happy with the state of the Thief till they can auto attack them to death while afk? Lets rename the class the Practice dummy.

If you can permanently stealth then it’s not a balance issue, it’s a glitch.

Gator.7581:

@ Doomdesire – I take issue with the way you simply dismissed the OP. These things are problems, and if you don’t see that, then you either play a Thief, or you play a class that can take 15-16K damage in 1.5 seconds and not die. Sure, he may drop your health down quite a bit, but you’ll live; not ever seeing where the damage comes from is probably not a big deal to you. You back off and heal up or pop your quick heal, either way, it’s only a mere annoyance to you. To the rest of the people playing, it’s simply instant death from out of nowhere. I used to get upset about it, but at this point, the developers either think its peachy or don’t care; no real reason to get upset. I go back to my spawn point and run back to the fight and carry on. But don’t pretend it’s balanced or okay for this kind of thing.

You can have your opinion, but as for me, a perfectly rational person, none of those things are okay. And, it should always be about balance, maybe not always fairness, but ALWAYS about balance. I mean come on, let’s face it, some people are better than others at this sort of thing, and that might not be fair, but it’s a fact. As long as there is a balanced foundation from which everyone plays, then whatever each player does from that position should be all that makes the difference. In other words, it should be skill, not exploits and unfair advantages that determine the outcome. I would hate to play a class that has that unfair advantage. Wouldn’t you? I mean, otherwise, they would have a tendency to say that it was the unfair advantage and not player skill that won the battle; there would always be a cloud of uncertainty hanging over it. Better to just beat someone fair and square I say.

“You already lost and the only likely reason why you would complain about that is if you and your teammates massively outnumber him and he gets the kill while all your teammates are trying to revive you.”

You sound like you may believe it’s some sort of privilege to be able to steak your kill. I agree to a point. But let’s look at the “likely” scenario. The Thief, who really doesn’t fight, doesn’t really show any superior skill, skulks about in stealth, around the edges of the fight, looking for soft targets. He finds one, walks up behind him and mashes about 3 or 4 keys, the moves play out in about 1-2 seconds, and the ‘target’ is dead. The Thief stays in stealth, stakes his kill, and then removes himself from the battle to recover his cool-downs. Rinse and repeat. I don’t see this as requiring any great skill. This is why I don’t play a Thief. At the moment, in this game, it is (in my opinion) simply not balanced. Anyone can play that style. It takes guts to use the Thief in just about any other way, but some people like having things handed to them I guess. Maybe we should just get some folks to park their characters in the middle of a field and then go afk. Then you can just walk up and kill them by the dozens; frankly, it’d be about the same thing. However, that is just my opinion. ;-)

I dismissed him because I, along with other thieves, are sick are tired of others coming here, not knowing how to properly play, and complain to nerf our class. Stealth is an advantage of thief, whether you like it or not, and destroying it ruins the thief class entirely. I take it’s you’re running a glass cannon and don’t know how to counter a thief? It you cannot spot an enemy player’s health randomly increasing, and you come and complain about stealth rezz, then it’s by far the biggest L2P issue. It’s so simple and I’ve killed so many thieves. Then the stealth finish part. A RATIONAL person WOULD assume a thief going into stealth and the edge of a down players it going to finish him. Just because he’s INVISIBLE doesn’t mean he’s INVINCIBLE. Thieves are so predictable it isn’t even funny. The fact that people can’t even predict the simplest of things, but rather come here and complain is unacceptable. So forgive me if I’m sick and tired of players coming here to scream nerf x, nerf y every other day instead of paying attention to the small details that count and make them really successful against stealth rezzing/finishing/

Latinkuro.9420:

1 – can prevent capping while in stealth.
2 – can finish from stealth.
3 – can rezz in stealth.
4 – permanent stealth due to culling in W v W.

This here ^^ is ridiculous !

while in stealth you shouldn’t be able to prevent capping this would take care of mechanics exploits in W v W and sPVP specially supply camp cap prevention by a single player in stealth taking advantage of culling bug to perma stealth

while in stealth you cannot perform finisher this is so OP it’s ridiculous it’s still in the game finish from stealth ? what moron was it that thought that this would be balanced? fire that dev right now !

Ressing from stealth, sure you can start the res from stealth but should become visible 1 second afterwards. otherwise how cozy is it to revive while no one is aware of you at all huh ?and I’m not only talking about the target you’re currently fighting so don’t even bother using that as an example it’s obvious that if I see my current target’s HP suddenly going up even if I see no one I’d know there was a thief there !

Here’s an idea A.net, if culling and stealth mechanics cannot be solved you need to introduce stealth detection skills and problem solved

Extra: backstabbing from stealth is fine as long as the CD for going back into stealth is increased to prevent permanent going in and out of stealth without consequences, out of combat stealth CD can remain the same in combat CD a lot longer !

I mean seriously, stealth is a means of escape not a freaking do it all ability even SWTOR as bad as it is understood this concept and you cannot cap or attack while in stealth the moment you do you come out of stealth.

A.net should know that stealth is always one of the most OP skills in all mmorpg’s!
doing anything that adversely affects other players should end stealth in order to keep things balanced.

I’ll address the points you gave in the order you gave them:

1. Can prevent capping while in stealth – If a thief deliberately spec’s for this I dont see much of a problem. You see, If a thief is doing this, they are literally rendering themselves useless to do anything but this. They can’t attack. They can’t defend. They just sit there repeating the same combo until they are caught or the other team gives up. You think its an exploit? Maybe, but no more of an exploit than mesmer’s being able to portal people through walls so they don’t have to take down a gate. Its a tactic. Learn to deal.

2. Spiking in stealth – A thief doesn’t have stability. They also have the worst hp in the game. This means that they can’t reliably spike anyone without stealth. Even in stealth, they can be cc’ed and killed before the spike goes off. Without this mechanic the thief would be utterly useless in a fight, because even though they can down someone, if they cant finish them then there’s no point. Most other classes have stability. Mesmer’s can stealth stomp as well, and Engineer’s can shrink stomp, leaving themselves completely invulnerable, so not only can you not CC them to stop it, you can’t even kill them before the stomp goes off. Thief stomping is not broken. Save a stun or knock back. It is a tactic. Learn to deal.

3. Ressing in stealth – Read above, Thief has low hp and no stability. Pay attention to your surroundings. If a dead man is mysteriously gaining hp. Auto attack next to him and throw out a CC. Stealth ressing is not broken. It is a tactic. Learn to deal.

4. Permastealth via culling – This is the only one that you pointed out that is a viable complaint. but it is not a Thief issue. The culling issue has been labeled a bug for a while now. Calling for changes and balance to the thief class before this bug is fixed is only going to mean that the Thief will be under powered once it is fixed. Again permastealth is real. There’s no reason for any thief to deny that. But thief’s simply gain more of an advantage from it than other classes. The more crying Anet has about thieves based on the culling bug, the less time and resources they have to fix the actual bug, because they will be trying to fix a symptom instead of the root problem. Yes it sucks that they can get their heart seekers off before you see them and C&D cap stalling. But its not worth breaking a class prematurely with major changes when that time could be spent fixing the bug in the first place.

cargan.5689:

So pistol whip, backstab, signets now stealth needs to be nerfed, is there any thing else.
Will people not be happy with the state of the Thief till they can auto attack them to death while afk? Lets rename the class the Practice dummy.

Did I ever talk about nerfing any of those abilities LOL ?
NO I did NOT !

if you got hit for 20k by a single backstab it’s mainly your fault spec some more vit/tough not just glass cannon !

than why would you bring those up in here ?
probably to try and derail the true issue of the matter

We all know stealth in WvW is way overboard broken and the culling issue only makes it worse !

Sons.5493:

Stealth stomps/resses is just a game mechanic and this a l2p issue, while ressing the thief is still there, hit the point.

If this is removed so should be Endure pain stomps, Mist stomps, Invul signet stomps.

This, all of it. Also, we got Temple of Balthazaar on my server and while it wouldn’t be cool to say if I weren’t there the attempt would fail I did nevertheless shadow refuge NPCs on the way up to maintain morale, smokescreen the acolytes (blinds them and keeps their floating hands away), and switch out dagger storm for basilisk venom for the priest part, where I shadow refuged downed players. Also, I’m specced so that stealth removes a condition, first immediately and others every three seconds. In that event even tanky characters drop pretty fast so shadow refuging people so I can rez people uninterrupted matters a lot. If you take away rezzing from stealth then you effectively rob the thief of a lot of utility.

While the priest is immune to being turned to stone ( I know =( ) the abomination and veterans can be hit with it. Dagger storm is great for waves of non-tanky mobs, but for a few spread out vets you need something else.

Rashagal.5867:

1. Can prevent capping while in stealth – If a thief deliberately spec’s for this I dont see much of a problem. You see, If a thief is doing this, they are literally rendering themselves useless to do anything but this. They can’t attack. They can’t defend. They just sit there repeating the same combo until they are caught or the other team gives up. You think its an exploit? Maybe, but no more of an exploit than mesmer’s being able to portal people through walls so they don’t have to take down a gate. Its a tactic. Learn to deal.

The fact that GW2 lacks a mechanic for multiple people to contribute to the capture of a point is already pretty weak, but being able to prevent a capture via a single enemy in stealth is just salt in the wound. This should change, it isn’t particularly good for WvW or the game as a whole.

That build lacks tons of damage and tools, all he has is the black powder and heartseeker which btw is moronic easy to kill ! one properly placed backstab and he’s dead.

@4:25 look what happens when he goes against a properly speced guardian and gets pulled in and aoed to death.

Don’t go calling NERF before examining and understanding what is going on !
This build is easily beaten by any balanced specced profession, some can even completely immobilize this kind of build.

(copied from OP.)

Latinkuro.9420:

1 – can prevent capping while in stealth.
2 – can finish from stealth.
3 – can rezz in stealth.
4 – permanent stealth due to culling in W v W.

This here ^^ is ridiculous !

1- OK, I’ll give you this one I agree that its not really fair and should be addressed

2- Thieves aren’t the only ones with this kind of ability, Elementalists for example can finish from mist form. I’m a thief and I’ve been finished from stealth I don’t see the problem here.

3- Again I don’t see the problem here, when I use Shadoe Refuge to try and raise an ally anyone with any sense pelts the area with some kind of AOE and continues to beat on be while I raise. Sometimes I pay the price for doing it. So again I say, What’s the problem here?

4- I really shouldn’t have to address this. This is a problem with the game in general not an issue with our class or it’s mechanics. Are there people abusing it? Yes. Have you ever played any MMO where some people didn’t find a way to gain an unfair advantage of others and then proceed to beat it to death? I play a thief and I don’t like it so, I’ve chosen to stay out of WvW till it’s fixed. Give them time it WILL get fixed.

Latinkuro.9420:

I did NOT post this on the thief forum a stupid MOD moved it here !

That’s kinda not cool lol, we rage about people coming into our forums and complaining. I wonder how many of those other posts were moved as well. Thanks Mods!!!

The mods moved it here cuz u might have posted it in the wrong place. It happens and plz dont rage, and before u start saying how some things like stealth needs to be changed plz roll a thief and do everything that u posted and come back and rethink what u posted.

people have stopped playing due to this class alone. game is done

players learned to counter thieves, they improve every day
the ones who stoped are ppls who love to complain, and refuse to improve own play style.

OP

1. Can’t see why it’s not a valid tactic to employ. It would be a crappy build for anything else.

2. I have an 80 Thief, Mesmer and Ranger – I finish from stealth with bot the Mesmer and the Thief and don’t bother at all with the ranger. My preference would be to get rid of the downed state altogether. If I couldn’t finish from stealth with the Thief I’d never kill another lvl 80 player.

3. You’re just wrong.

4. Agreed.

People honestly need to learn to play their own toons and stop kittening about balance. My thief is a special build with only 11K health. If I see you first, you’re solo and my timers are up, you’re dead no matter what class you are (with the possible exception of mesmers – I’ve killed a load of high dmge spec’d thieves with my Mesmer from the downed state – as a thief I tend to avoid mesmers, inm y view mesmers and not thieves are the most op class in the game and if you don’t think so you haven’t fought a good one).

So I will almost certainly kill you if I’m on my thief, you’re solo and I see you first. But that is basically my one shot. If you’re in a group I’m going to die before I can finish you, even with stealth (unless it’s a really crappy group of people or their all very low level).

If you see me first, I should be dead, no matter what toon you are on. I’m not going to tell you how to do it on each class because if you can’t figure it out yourself you should be pveing until you can play your class properly.

I will tell you how to counter with a ranger, however, because rangers are, unless well played, basically meat when facing a well played thief. Also they seem to constitute a large proportion of the biggest whiners.

Assassination spec thief sees ranger first, ranger is dead unless basilisk venom doesn’t hit. If basilisk venom misses or the thief’s timers aren’t up, the first thing the ranger should hit is Protect Me and then burn the thief down as below.

Ranger sees thief first, switch to short bow (rapid fire is too buggy to waste Zephyr on), Rage as One, headshot, zephyr, (hit headshot and zephyr keys simultaneously) go to town – if the ranger’s spec’d and geared right that’s 12-15K damage in about 4 secs and that will take out most high dmge spec thieves. If the thief is still up or manages to get into stealth, either hit protect me, switch to longbow and hit rapid fire or set your pet on him and run. Yes they have heartseeker and the shortbow port to try and catch you with but that will burn their initiative, so watch for it and turn and fight. Once a assassination thief misses the opening opportunity they are a poor class – oh and save dodges for any thief who is poorly played enough to think Dagger Storm is an effective tool in a 1v1.

I missed sharpening stone in that equation – you need that for the bleed to take down thieves that have spec’d the vanish at 10% health trait. (I hit that at the same time as zephyr basically – if you have a progamable keyboard you can probably macro this so its super fast and never fails).

Culling is the only thing the op got right.

Last time I cheched you couldn’t cap in stralth. It didn’t move the bar at all.
The invis stomp, well as guardian no prob imo. And I guess other classes got knockback as well.
Debuff for stealth is already there. Max stealth dura is 13 sec with a 1min CD and traited.
Else it is only 3 sec and u got a 3 sec debuff.
Mesmers can stalth as well:)
Stealth is our weak form for stability.
Imo try play a thief. If it is too easy, try an ele.

While i admire the effort, why do you even try to argue on this guys?
It’s obvious that all listed “problems” are fair and balanced game mechanics, and the QQ a simple butthurt case.
Btw. last time i checked, people could stomp while having stability, and even protection too on them. Now how OP is that?

Just be happy that Latinkuro.9420 has no say in balancing GW2, and never will have.

Why wouldn’t you be able to finish an opponent while in stealth, are you kidding me? If a thief uses one stealth ability for finishing a downed player he then has no stealth ability for longer than 30seconds, which for me is worst case since I only use Hide in Shadow for stealth. So I have to chose. Same applies for stealth res.

If you get downed in WvW and die by a Thief that stealths you can only blame yourself or your team, since you got downed in the first place and also your teammates didn’t attempt to res you.

This is a game where everything you do has it’s consequences, using burst build leaves you with no defense, using defensive build lowers your dps and such.

I just have a level 10 Thief, but half of the OP’s complaints are whining plain and simple.

Legitimate:

1. Improper rendering leaving a character in stealth who should not be.

2. Being able to stay stealthed for longer than say, 20-30 seconds, on general principle and in regards to controlling points in particular.

Whining:

1. Stealth rez/stomp. Elementalists have mist form, a couple of bubbles, sustained blinds, and invulnerability, all of which can be used for a rez/stomp. Other classes have stability/stealth/invulnerability equivalents. Heck, if I’m willing to spend a utility slot on it (my main is an Elementalist), I can rez a player from a distance and teleport him to me, or rez him at full health, or rez three at once.

2. Backstab complaints. Unless it falls into culling/rendering issues, working as intended. The Thief class is about ambush, burst, and stealth. The entire class is built around the burst mechanic, and has a boatload of stealths and teleports specifically for this.

I’m not sure I’ll ever have to speed and control setup to play a Thief well, but I’m very intrigued by the class and having fun (at level 10).

Druitt.7629:

I just have a level 10 Thief, but half of the OP’s complaints are whining plain and simple.

Legitimate:

1. Improper rendering leaving a character in stealth who should not be.

2. Being able to stay stealthed for longer than say, 20-30 seconds, on general principle and in regards to controlling points in particular.

Whining:

1. Stealth rez/stomp. Elementalists have mist form, a couple of bubbles, sustained blinds, and invulnerability, all of which can be used for a rez/stomp. Other classes have stability/stealth/invulnerability equivalents. Heck, if I’m willing to spend a utility slot on it (my main is an Elementalist), I can rez a player from a distance and teleport him to me, or rez him at full health, or rez three at once.

2. Backstab complaints. Unless it falls into culling/rendering issues, working as intended. The Thief class is about ambush, burst, and stealth. The entire class is built around the burst mechanic, and has a boatload of stealths and teleports specifically for this.

I’m not sure I’ll ever have to speed and control setup to play a Thief well, but I’m very intrigued by the class and having fun (at level 10).

You’re getting nerfed in several days. I hope the nerf will be hard enough so you can see what it actually means to be balanced and “working as intended”.

Thief is ridiculously overpowered. It’s not even fun to play, no challenge at all.

Ofcourse it’s no challenge since most opponents are bad players that joined this game to play casually.

Wait and see what will happen to this game if they nerf thief class without it being needed, you will see warriors and mesmers getting nerfed after and even more crying around the whole forums. The community will drop dramatically with kids fighting all over the place. After that you will see skill changes that will change the class you started with which for me is wrong.

If after all this balance is achieved on this game, then go on and do what you have to do but as other companies have proved they can’t balance a game because they listen to the playerbase.

Edelweiss.9815:

Druitt.7629:

I just have a level 10 Thief, but half of the OP’s complaints are whining plain and simple.

Legitimate:

1. Improper rendering leaving a character in stealth who should not be.

2. Being able to stay stealthed for longer than say, 20-30 seconds, on general principle and in regards to controlling points in particular.

Whining:

1. Stealth rez/stomp. Elementalists have mist form, a couple of bubbles, sustained blinds, and invulnerability, all of which can be used for a rez/stomp. Other classes have stability/stealth/invulnerability equivalents. Heck, if I’m willing to spend a utility slot on it (my main is an Elementalist), I can rez a player from a distance and teleport him to me, or rez him at full health, or rez three at once.

2. Backstab complaints. Unless it falls into culling/rendering issues, working as intended. The Thief class is about ambush, burst, and stealth. The entire class is built around the burst mechanic, and has a boatload of stealths and teleports specifically for this.

I’m not sure I’ll ever have to speed and control setup to play a Thief well, but I’m very intrigued by the class and having fun (at level 10).

You’re getting nerfed in several days. I hope the nerf will be hard enough so you can see what it actually means to be balanced and “working as intended”.

Thief is ridiculously overpowered. It’s not even fun to play, no challenge at all.

Too much personal QQ, its becoming quite clear that you just want to see the class ruined and dont really care about game balance. at all.

Next time just count to 10 when you get outplayed instead of showing how butthurt you are about the thief

I see GW2 going the way of DaoC sadly.

Vicious nerf cycle which will effect every class eventually, leading to massive immigration to some other mmorpg.

A hardcore base will stick around and keep leveling toons to 80 to compensate for the fact that their other toons have been nerfed beyond utility. Sadly what then happens is that competent players start playing under appreciated classes is innovative ways and the nerfs calls just move to that class.

One day a designer will just say, this is the game we created, find ways of dealing with it, that is the challenge you face.

Sure, that approach will mean all the whiners will leave fairly quickly, but history tends to demonstrate they do that anyway – after ruining the game for everyone else.

I want to play THAT game.

I’d love to be proved wrong but I suspect if the nerfs keep coming you can look for server merges in the next 3 months and expect population levels to be dismal by February/March 2013.

@ Original Poster
mesmers can do all that stuff in stealth to what is the problem? mesmsers can stealth just as much if not more than a theif

Stealth-stomping isn’t actually that great. I mean, it’s a nice option to have, but you can stomp people just as easily with Signet of Shadows and Infiltrator’s Signet (or Signet of Midnight and Blink, if you’re a mesmer) — and it’s faster, because you don’t waste time casting your stealth skill.