Guild Wars 2

Just wondering, why did Anet remove the one shot thieves ones were masters of
It was the one thing that made thief really fun to play. If you messed up your combo you were dead, but if you succeded you would get a kill. Know it’s just running around playing a boring “traficgame”.

I do understand the tacticle aspect of the current thief gameplay, but God kitten its kitten. boring. If Anet love to make sure we run alot in the game, then move waypoints in pve and let people do all there running there!

Collon.2836:

Just wondering, why did Anet remove the one shot thieves ones were masters of
It was the one thing that made thief really fun to play. If you messed up your combo you were dead, but if you succeded you would get a kill. Know it’s just running around playing a boring “traficgame”.

Sacrificing fun for balance.

I do understand the tacticle aspect of the current thief gameplay, but God kitten its kitten. boring. If Anet love to make sure we run alot in the game, then move waypoints in pve and let people do all there running there!

Waypoints is their way of saying, “we’re too lazy to make mounts”, I mean the frog people have mounts, even Mordreds have mounts. Heroes are too awesome for mounts so they gave us gliders instead.

never understood this 1 shot thing, never found it fun tbh because there is no action. sure you may get a little excited if you are doing that sort of thing in zerg fights but general roaming solo or with people, I found 1 shotting people just as boring as playing condi thieves.

Then why do they create a profession who can burst (initiative use) but dont give them the damage or utillities to go through a soft target as ele? It’s so wierd that they would remove a core part of a profession. And i know thief is really good at moving x-y-z but then at least give thief 1200 range on SB, or the means to cap points while evading after they give us Daredevil. Ive fought people on points with its my point at start, during the fight they decap because Im evading and stealthing too much. Dont make any sense.

Collon.2836:

If you messed up your combo you were dead, but if you succeded you would get a kill.

Yeah, must be really hard to mess up that combo.. Stealth → Backstab.

Reason that kind of garbage was removed is because it takes no skill and the only person that enjoys one shotting is the person doing it, not really fair to anyone else to just be down state out of no where.

It’s gotta be terrible for retaining newer players. Look at the hate gunflame got despite how bad warriors were. Removing one-shot combos is not about balance. It’s about health.

Josh XT.6053:

Collon.2836:

If you messed up your combo you were dead, but if you succeded you would get a kill.

Yeah, must be really hard to mess up that combo.. Stealth -> Backstab.

Reason that kind of garbage was removed is because it takes no skill and the only person that enjoys one shotting is the person doing it, not really fair to anyone else to just be down state out of no where.

No but the made thief to go in stealth on demand = sneaking up on people and what do you get for sneaking up on people? You get af face full of auto proc traits and invuls and what not. And this got very cummon after HoT and thief got the abillity to run away from every 1 v 1 he gets in. Everybody talks about risk vs reward. Its fine that if you cant one shot, say a tank, then you have to run or die, but now you cant even one shot ( here I mean burst) a glasscannon who turns on you and burst you faster than you can escape. That is wrong when you consider what thief is build to do.

Collon.2836:

Josh XT.6053:

Collon.2836:

If you messed up your combo you were dead, but if you succeded you would get a kill.

Yeah, must be really hard to mess up that combo.. Stealth -> Backstab.

Reason that kind of garbage was removed is because it takes no skill and the only person that enjoys one shotting is the person doing it, not really fair to anyone else to just be down state out of no where.

No but the made thief to go in stealth on demand = sneaking up on people and what do you get for sneaking up on people? You get af face full of auto proc traits and invuls and what not. And this got very cummon after HoT and thief got the abillity to run away from every 1 v 1 he gets in. Everybody talks about risk vs reward. Its fine that if you cant one shot, say a tank, then you have to run or die, but now you cant even one shot ( here I mean burst) a glasscannon who turns on you and burst you faster than you can escape. That is wrong when you consider what thief is build to do.

You mean press 1 button right? You can trait to get stealth on steal, then just backstab and its over.

I’m not sure if you’re trolling or what, but I’m seeing a lot of bad ideas.

As long as Thief;
- gets Revealed
- has low health pool
- no access to defensive buffs like Resistance, Protection, and Aegis, instead gets damage oriented buffs
…Thief should be able to do their job by dealing a lot of damage. If not one shot, at least 66% damage in one shot.

Otherwise, Thief should;
- NOT get Revealed
- have high health pool
- have access to defensive buffs

Since the latter is not the case, Thief is not a fun profession to play as. The former is to balance the high damage burst, yet that capability has been nerfed without any survival compensation.

It might not be fun getting one shotted, but it’s also not fun having wet noodles as weapons.

Collon.2836:

No but the made thief to go in stealth on demand = sneaking up on people and what do you get for sneaking up on people? You get af face full of auto proc traits and invuls and what not. And this got very cummon after HoT and thief got the abillity to run away from every 1 v 1 he gets in. Everybody talks about risk vs reward. Its fine that if you cant one shot, say a tank, then you have to run or die, but now you cant even one shot ( here I mean burst) a glasscannon who turns on you and burst you faster than you can escape. That is wrong when you consider what thief is build to do.

We still have gimmick burst builds. They just require doing a little more, being more aware of someone’s defenses, and understanding that for some games, it’s a crappy build to attempt to play. We also have ways of varying those builds to plan for squishy classes with invulns so we open with a so-so burst, such as with flanking strike passive trait, while saving a stronger one, such as a burst with steal, for later. HoT has accomplished this weird feat by making the game more spammy and also sometimes more strategic for thief.

Josh XT.6053:

Collon.2836:

Josh XT.6053:

Collon.2836:

If you messed up your combo you were dead, but if you succeded you would get a kill.

Yeah, must be really hard to mess up that combo.. Stealth -> Backstab.

Reason that kind of garbage was removed is because it takes no skill and the only person that enjoys one shotting is the person doing it, not really fair to anyone else to just be down state out of no where.

No but the made thief to go in stealth on demand = sneaking up on people and what do you get for sneaking up on people? You get af face full of auto proc traits and invuls and what not. And this got very cummon after HoT and thief got the abillity to run away from every 1 v 1 he gets in. Everybody talks about risk vs reward. Its fine that if you cant one shot, say a tank, then you have to run or die, but now you cant even one shot ( here I mean burst) a glasscannon who turns on you and burst you faster than you can escape. That is wrong when you consider what thief is build to do.

You mean press 1 button right? You can trait to get stealth on steal, then just backstab and its over.

I’m not sure if you’re trolling or what, but I’m seeing a lot of bad ideas.

Your answer is bad, too. Using that trait mean you need SA = a lot less damage (a lot of damage comes through traits) Very likely that you will have less stacks from lead attacks (if you even use trickery) cause not initiative using for stealth needed —> less damage. Mug from DA would do less damage cause of less damage-traits, same with backstab. Other thing, your damage would come from mug+backstab and MAYBE fire/air proccs (less attacks → less chances to proc).
back in the days D/D-oneshot was from hidden-killer, assassins-signet, mug, C&D, backstab, fire. – hidden killer for guaranteed crit, mug was able to crit, C&D did more damage, backstab was stronger, fire was better than air and force was used.
More modern variant was with full signets for a lot of might to get more damage done.

Both variants over time used very similar mindset in using a lot of stuff to accomplish a lot of damage to oneshot people (where a hell lot of played terrible back then) → needed cd´s to do it again. Old variant needed shadowstep, newer one signets, ready to burst again. One-trick-pony.
Far more skill in that than all the passive stuff now.
Other variant was D/P crit-build. Was less one-shot though.

That being said, I like more the dueling mindset to overcome the enemy(outplaying the enemy, learing his reactions, moves, etc). But look at what we have now, full defense druids running around (WvW) wondering why people just walk away from them cause incredible boring fights which are won by the pet.
People complained about stealthburst meta in pvp, but miraculously hated the bunker-meta more.

rennlc.7346:

Collon.2836:

No but the made thief to go in stealth on demand = sneaking up on people and what do you get for sneaking up on people? You get af face full of auto proc traits and invuls and what not. And this got very cummon after HoT and thief got the abillity to run away from every 1 v 1 he gets in. Everybody talks about risk vs reward. Its fine that if you cant one shot, say a tank, then you have to run or die, but now you cant even one shot ( here I mean burst) a glasscannon who turns on you and burst you faster than you can escape. That is wrong when you consider what thief is build to do.

We still have gimmick burst builds. They just require doing a little more, being more aware of someone’s defenses, and understanding that for some games, it’s a crappy build to attempt to play. We also have ways of varying those builds to plan for squishy classes with invulns so we open with a so-so burst, such as with flanking strike passive trait, while saving a stronger one, such as a burst with steal, for later. HoT has accomplished this weird feat by making the game more spammy and also sometimes more strategic for thief.

You can´t be aware of passives though. One nightmare, eye for an eye, protective ward, exlixir, endure pain, etc-procc can completely negate your attempt and instead destroy you. The other player doesn´t even need to react. Retribution line from rev is a perfect example what is wrong with the game. Passive reduction with adept, eye for an eye procc on master, passive damage reduction on grandmaster minor and passive procc on grandmaster.

Had the situation today that I +1 as a rev in a 1vs1 that was going on for like 30sec. I engaged and instantly got a nightmare-procc. I definitly couldn´t know that it was ready at exactly that moment. ^^
Yes, thieves have a lot of passive damage-boosts, but you need them to actually do damage. Rev doesn´t even need retribution for anything than just be more tanky/passive.

Funny that as thieves we still kinda have to “oneshot”. Just that its on a +1 and the class mostly already used the passives in the fight and maybe low on health. ^^

Just for information, I´m playing rev annd thief equally currently, not biased here, I dislike the current impacting disruption, too (as long as there is still the powercreep its needed though).

Coronit.9432:

You can´t be aware of passives though. One nightmare, eye for an eye, protective ward, exlixir, endure pain, etc-procc can completely negate your attempt and instead destroy you. The other player doesn´t even need to react. Retribution line from rev is a perfect example what is wrong with the game. Passive reduction with adept, eye for an eye procc on master, passive damage reduction on grandmaster minor and passive procc on grandmaster.

I agree about ret. It’s lazily made and strong in all the wrong kind of ways. What do you mean by “can’t be aware” though? I must be misunderstanding because there are numerous situations where we can predict passives will proc. Being able to predict something is the epitome of awareness.

rennlc.7346:

What do you mean by “can’t be aware” though?

I believe they mean that there is no way of knowing who has what passives until you actually proc them. For example, who would ever suspect a Thief to be wearing Nightmare runes?

Traits like Mirror of Anguish are bad enough being profession-specific. Runes are universal. Unfortunately, we have effect icons shown to others for our active signets and venoms… for “balance” reasons. Having no such icon for passives makes those “balance” explanations rather silly.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

As long as Thief;
- gets Revealed
- has low health pool
- no access to defensive buffs like Resistance, Protection, and Aegis, instead gets damage oriented buffs
…Thief should be able to do their job by dealing a lot of damage. If not one shot, at least 66% damage in one shot.

Otherwise, Thief should;
- NOT get Revealed
- have high health pool
- have access to defensive buffs

Completely this!

While I would prefer to have the OPTION to VIABLY build for high-damage capability, if I can’t have it, at least buff my sustainability without me having to give up the damage-ouput I already have. And “high-damage” doesn’t necessarily mean “one-shotting damage.” It could mean the ability to bypass passive (or even some active) defenses.

All last season in PvP, I played pure Berserker D/P. Nearly as high of damage-output I could get without going trapper/signet. DA/CS/T. Yes, I hit hard. But only about as hard as other professions… who were not zerker. I was very lethal against squishies, but anyone else had the health to endure, and still had the damage-output to take me out as quickly as I could take them.

It may be different for Daredevils, but the base Thief feels sorely lacking of defense if trying to keep a viable amount of damage. As a D/P Thief, I have the same number of dodges as everyone else. I have the same movement speed as everyone else. I don’t even have weapon evades without getting locked into Shortbow. And speaking of switching to Shortbow, its “cooldowns” don’t even recharge while I’m using my other weapon set… making it much more difficult to be effective with hit-and-fade tactics.

Alas, there are so many great ways to “fix” the Thief’s sustainability… even simple changes. But I fear that’s not Anet’s goal.

I would sacrifice half of my damage for a proper stealth and better shortbow range.

there you go thief life. live the yolo dream

Taobella.6597:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XznGpUhibqU

there you go thief life. live the yolo dream

Haha, what was the build for that?
I ran something similar with Tripwire instead of Needle Trap, and I used Sigil of Impact to take advantage of the knockdown.
Unfortunately, it only worked when the opponent didn’t have auto-stun breaks… which was rare :-(

But I did get a 17,888 Backstab from it… on a poor Thief… RIP

HeII no to one-shotting. It’s no fun dropping someone and getting dropped in a second when playing a thief. I wouldn’t want my fight against another thief leaving it all to chances of who spotted who first and opening from stealth.

Kageseigi.2150:

Taobella.6597:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XznGpUhibqU

there you go thief life. live the yolo dream

Haha, what was the build for that?
I ran something similar with Tripwire instead of Needle Trap, and I used Sigil of Impact to take advantage of the knockdown.
Unfortunately, it only worked when the opponent didn’t have auto-stun breaks… which was rare :-(

But I did get a 17,888 Backstab from it… on a poor Thief… RIP

oh i figure no one care so i did not bother writing it up xD

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAW4KW4Jst00sZNpdm+BBg5C4CcCC-TZRBwAROIAPuCAAeAAX3fgcZAA

but idk i pretty sure you could of guess your way threw it.

Taobella.6597:

oh i figure no one care so i did not bother writing it up xD

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAW4KW4Jst00sZNpdm+BBg5C4CcCC-TZRBwAROIAPuCAAeAAX3fgcZAA

but idk i pretty sure you could of guess your way threw it.

Thanks! I don’t have HoT, so no Daredevil for me. So I believe this is the build I settled on…

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAoaVl0MhGnYZTwvJw/EH8ElPJeiqYXAzWEoPzfIAA-TZBFABVVG42TAgAHCAAeCAIt/AA

The problem comes if the opponent sees the Vulnerability applied from Shadow Trap. Hopefully, Bountiful Theft can steal Aegis/Protection/Stability so your Tripwire will be effective. Follow it up with a guaranteed critical Backstab. If that doesn’t finish them, a Heartseeker or two should! :-D

You could take No Quarter instead, then replace Sigil of Air with Sigil of Intelligence to guarantee the crit also… if you can swap weapons fast enough before the Backstab :-P

Hehe, fun times… I just wish it were useful outside of an ambush.

Ps. Thinking about it, one of the main problems with Shadow Trap is you teleport blindly into an area (when it even works). If it would also add a second or two of Resistance and Stability on the Shadow Pursuit portion, it would be AMAZING! :-D

Kageseigi.2150:

Taobella.6597:

oh i figure no one care so i did not bother writing it up xD

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAW4KW4Jst00sZNpdm+BBg5C4CcCC-TZRBwAROIAPuCAAeAAX3fgcZAA

but idk i pretty sure you could of guess your way threw it.

Thanks! I don’t have HoT, so no Daredevil for me. So I believe this is the build I settled on…

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAoaVl0MhGnYZTwvJw/EH8ElPJeiqYXAzWEoPzfIAA-TZBFABVVG42TAgAHCAAeCAIt/AA

The problem comes if the opponent sees the Vulnerability applied from Shadow Trap. Hopefully, Bountiful Theft can steal Aegis/Protection/Stability so your Tripwire will be effective. Follow it up with a guaranteed critical Backstab. If that doesn’t finish them, a Heartseeker or two should! :-D

You could take No Quarter instead, then replace Sigil of Air with Sigil of Intelligence to guarantee the crit also… if you can swap weapons fast enough before the Backstab :-P

Hehe, fun times… I just wish it were useful outside of an ambush.

Ps. Thinking about it, one of the main problems with Shadow Trap is you teleport blindly into an area (when it even works). If it would also add a second or two of Resistance and Stability on the Shadow Pursuit portion, it would be AMAZING! :-D

Ah well to be honest i would not run such a gimmick build XD i just posting it for the topic of one shotting i personally play bunker thief with no stealth

Taobella.6597:

Ah well to be honest i would not run such a gimmick build XD i just posting it for the topic of one shotting i personally play bunker thief with no stealth

Haha, I play a glass cannon power/crit build with little stealth…. but I do enjoy the one-shot potential occasionally! :-D

Kageseigi.2150:

Taobella.6597:

Ah well to be honest i would not run such a gimmick build XD i just posting it for the topic of one shotting i personally play bunker thief with no stealth

Haha, I play a glass cannon power/crit build with little stealth…. but I do enjoy the one-shot potential occasionally! :-D

yeah all good i tried every type of thief i now over 6000 hours on it XD i love the class currently my fav play style is S/P .

Might have been fun to play. Never was fun to play against.

I got one shot by an ele last night on my condi build. 20k health and 3k armor, dead in less than a second from full health. I know ele is a lot easier to see coming (I was distracted fighting a DH, kinda my own fault lol) which is why it’s more balanced, but it does beg the question of why can they do it but we can’t.

One-shotting is still around…except other classes like mesmers does it better.

Oneshotting is pathetic and people that enjoy it are equally pathetic.

No, there is no skill involved, a three year old could press the buttons and it wouldn’t make any difference.

If the game is too hard without it then go do something else.

Edit: FYI it is impossible for a Mesmer to oneshot anyone.

Had a DH of all things dump a 6k burn tick on me from stealth lol. I evaded instantly and even thought he missed me but died like 1.5 secs later.

Comforting to know at least some classes can still be one shot lol (much irony)

Crowley.8761:

Oneshotting is pathetic and people that enjoy it are equally pathetic.

No, there is no skill involved, a three year old could press the buttons and it wouldn’t make any difference.

If the game is too hard without it then go do something else.

Edit: FYI it is impossible for a Mesmer to oneshot anyone.

FYI: l2mesmer, and you’ll know that it’s not “impossible”.

Silverbolt.2301:

FYI: l2mesmer, and you’ll know that it’s not “impossible”.

I think you’re the one who needs to L2… well lots of stuff. Play Mesmer among them. And understand what oneshotting actually means would be a good follow up to that.

Perhaps even L2DH, has a far better option for “oneshot” than Mesmer.

mesmer,thief,dragonhunter,warrior can all down the enemy in 2 seconds with ease depending on the build and skill. so why argue?

ITT we:

1) complain about things

2) argue semantics

and

3) realize no one actually wants one-shot mechanics

Unless they stealth-nerfed backstab, it’s still there. You just need to build for it, in which case, there’s no issue.

It depends what you mean from ‘one-shot’. If you’re looking to kill people with just a single attack, then it happens regularly with Unload or Vault in WvW against Eles and other Thieves, also possibly Mesmers and Guardians with some Might. Also ye olde signet backstab build can still one-shot. However, if by ‘one-shot’ you means dealing considerable damage in say 2 seconds or less, then Thief has even more options for this than ever before. Just use Impairing Daggers channeled with Mug and Basilisk, then either a single Vault, Unload or one dagger AA chain will kill other squishes outright. No careful stealthy positioning required.

Or you could just role a Herald and one-shot 5 players with Coalescence of Ruin, 3 players with Surge of the Mists, or at least a single person with Precision Strike.