Guild Wars 2

lchan.2169:

We became OP since the day some idiots decide to stand within melee distance and hoped to win.

^

Romgaard.1965:

ShadowNinja.1238:

Cause Healing Signet and ultra high stats. With full zerk u can get 3k armour 20k hp tell me thats not op.

U really need to get out more.
healing signet makes us “OP”?…really…guess the regeneration boon also makes people “OP” then.

Full zerker does not give u 3K armor….just saying
BTW…warrior stats has not changed since day 1 of this game…why is it a big deal now?

Getting out more sure has a lot to do with gw2!

It’s not that Warriors are OP. It’s because every class basically has something they are good at, and something they aren’t so good at. Warrior can play everything viably (that’s available). Warriors give results with very minimal effort, that’s why people seem to think they are OP.

I mained my Warrior for a long time until I got bored of how easy it was. I now have fice 80’s and can say that they aren’t OP, just boring.

Well, rather than say other people simply need to love your warrior. . . .

The general consensus is that the warrior became OP when ANET tried to quickly move them from being useless to useful.

The main disadvantage of the warrior was supposed to be (if you look at the original builds) condition damage. Now, the warrior is frankly far too able to remove conditions and avoid being locked down. Add passive healing, high toughness and high armor and you simply have too many benefits and not enough weaknesses.

Cleansing Ire and Dogged March are the biggest problems. Warriors should get locked down more and should take more condition damage with fewer cleanses. But God help another class that winds up toe to toe with you.

You need a pretty big claw back (nerf) of the abilities ANET put in after launch (cleansing ire, dogged march and healing signet) in that order.

High toughness and high armor is not an issue as warrior doesn’t have access to defensive boons. Plus if you run conditions what do you care about armor? Cleansing Ire is not a problem if it doesn’t hit you. Dogged March is not a problem if you use condition food. As far as I know conditional meta is still the king of pvp. So you want warrior to be a free kill do you?

bigmonto.4215:

High toughness and high armor is not an issue as warrior doesn’t have access to defensive boons. Plus if you run conditions what do you care about armor? Cleansing Ire is not a problem if it doesn’t hit you. Dogged March is not a problem if you use condition food. As far as I know conditional meta is still the king of pvp. So you want warrior to be a free kill do you?

Cleansing Ire becomes a problem when you combine it with burst mastery. ATM you can remove 3 condition with only 2 bars of adrenaline and easily have all your adrenaline back by the time your burst is off CD. So you get to burst more often, burst harder, and cleanse more than you should at the same time. It’s too strong a combination. Making it so that it removes 2 conditions instead of 3 since you are only using up 2 bars would probably be enough to make it balanced.

Dogged March is really only big problem in WvW when combined with for and -condition runes but then again there are plenty of other OP rune/food combos for every class and build in WvW. In PvP the fact fact that it grants regen combined with HS and adrenal health is a little too much, on of those healing methods should be toned down a bit.

Create a necro. enter spvp and duel a hambow warrior. This should answer all your questions. I love my warrior, but in spvp we are without a doubt stupidly difficult to kill with no real investment in skill. It is for this reason that people are also hating on engineer. There is certain builds within the profession that are notoriously difficult to down without any remarkable tactics being used by them and everything including the kitchen sink being thrown at them.

I don’t understand the argument of being ‘easy to play’.
I would love the warrior to have more depth and proactive gameplay instead of relying too much on passives, that is not a reason for a nerf however.

Bombsaway.7198:

Well, rather than say other people simply need to love your warrior. . . .

The general consensus is that the warrior became OP when ANET tried to quickly move them from being useless to useful.

The main disadvantage of the warrior was supposed to be (if you look at the original builds) condition damage. Now, the warrior is frankly far too able to remove conditions and avoid being locked down. Add passive healing, high toughness and high armor and you simply have too many benefits and not enough weaknesses.

Cleansing Ire and Dogged March are the biggest problems. Warriors should get locked down more and should take more condition damage with fewer cleanses. But God help another class that winds up toe to toe with you.

You need a pretty big claw back (nerf) of the abilities ANET put in after launch (cleansing ire, dogged march and healing signet) in that order.

Im sorry but this sounds like you want to face roll warriors by locking them down all the time as they were before getting the changes. I do a lot of wvw zerg fighting and roaming and say fighting an elementalist… if they want to and use all their abilities they can move so far away I have no chance of reaching them, even if im in range my abilities still do nothing. Its the same for a warrior, if they are built skill wise to be mobile, they are going to be mobile. You will have a hard time keeping them in place.

No class is equal, this is why there are different builds for every class. Again, this goes back to someone got mad because they didnt know how to fight a certain profession of another player and they start to scream nerrrrffff!!!

No matter how much you try to balance, or change, buff, nerf, it will never be equal for all professions. As a warrior, if i come up on a mobility warrior with gs/sword/wh, I take my chance to end him and if he starts to run, I stop chasing him and change my objective. Just my opinion that if people took the time to learn how to counter someone…. they wouldnt be screaming nerfs. Then again, sometimes its obvious something needs the nerf bat.

Bombsaway.7198:

Well, rather than say other people simply need to love your warrior. . . .

The general consensus is that the warrior became OP when ANET tried to quickly move them from being useless to useful.

The main disadvantage of the warrior was supposed to be (if you look at the original builds) condition damage. Now, the warrior is frankly far too able to remove conditions and avoid being locked down. Add passive healing, high toughness and high armor and you simply have too many benefits and not enough weaknesses.

Cleansing Ire and Dogged March are the biggest problems. Warriors should get locked down more and should take more condition damage with fewer cleanses. But God help another class that winds up toe to toe with you.

You need a pretty big claw back (nerf) of the abilities ANET put in after launch (cleansing ire, dogged march and healing signet) in that order.

Except most classes run condition heavy builds so what you’re saying is that warriors should easily be stomped and locked down by almost every other class.

You should stop orienting your hate towards warriors – it’s getting old. Do something new why don’t you?

Julie Yann.5379:

Cleansing Ire becomes a problem when you combine it with burst mastery. ATM you can remove 3 condition with only 2 bars of adrenaline and easily have all your adrenaline back by the time your burst is off CD. So you get to burst more often, burst harder, and cleanse more than you should at the same time. It’s too strong a combination. Making it so that it removes 2 conditions instead of 3 since you are only using up 2 bars would probably be enough to make it balanced.

Dogged March is really only big problem in WvW when combined with for and -condition runes but then again there are plenty of other OP rune/food combos for every class and build in WvW. In PvP the fact fact that it grants regen combined with HS and adrenal health is a little too much, on of those healing methods should be toned down a bit.

I would not say Cleansing Ire is a problem for every weapon. A lot of the bust are single target and hard to hit with exception being hammer and long bow. They are aoe and harder to dodge. Specially the long bow as a long range attack with huge AOE range with little animation to indicate the attack. I would suggest Anet to adjust long bow specifically and not Cleansing Ire. This is what people complain about the warrior, its the hambow build right? Please specify a particular build and not the profession as a whole.

Condi Bunker Mobility Warriors are OP (As most condi bunkers are currently, but warriors get to have the best mobility on top of it)

Hambow is OP

Healing Signet is OP

Warrior Mobility is OP.

What makes you think your class deserves the ability to get away from every other class scott free whenever they feel like it? You have the most gap closers in the game PLUS effective immunity to movement impairments.

Because you are a melee only class? Waow let me introduce you to Guardians, Power Necros and Thieves. Of those 3 only thieves rival warrior mobility. Maybe that’s why you always try to change the subject of Warrior OPness over to thieves. To get rid of that one pesky class that still sometimes gives you a sorta kinda hard time.

Don’t even mention mesmers. We all know about PU mesmers and their OPness. Losing to a PU mesmer doesn’t mean your class is under powered.

I don’t agree that warriors are ‘face roll’ easy. That is because to realize the true OPness of the warrior requires using a myriad of skills in concert. Warriors are built around weapon swapping, effectively giving them twice as many weapon skills to juggle. They also have a plethora of Utils that actually work (As opposed to many classes who only have a handful at best that are useful). Tuning 10 weapon skills, to the right utils and traits is not ‘face roll’ easy. I know because I have a warrior alt.

TLDR Warriors are OP when played right. Anet needs to find a way to better balance the risk/reward of being melee only. Right now there is no risk thanks to the super high mobility + condition immunity, yet very high reward (damage potential).

Warriors are scary in 1v1… They stun quite often then swap to great sword and hundred blades, or play banner build and have amazing health regent when concidering healing signet and regen. I don’t think it makes sense that a warrior can hit harder than any class in the game with zerk build and hundred blades. Sure go ahead and say that skill is clunky but mind you can have a stun option quite frequently. The only beef I really have with warrior is not being able to leave a dent in them with power crit build on some classes. Maybe the problem is not warrior but rather other class builds that need to see more DPS. Maybe warrior should have to be more skilled to absorb tons of DPS rather than relying on healing signet? Idk.. Just speculating

Lorelei.3918:

Condi Bunker Mobility Warriors are OP (As most condi bunkers are currently, but warriors get to have the best mobility on top of it)

Hambow is OP

Healing Signet is OP

Warrior Mobility is OP.

What makes you think your class deserves the ability to get away from every other class scott free whenever they feel like it? You have the most gap closers in the game PLUS effective immunity to movement impairments.

The hambow build you are calling OP doesn’t have the slightest mobility, hambow warriors can’t run away from anything: the warrior troll build you are talking about is sword/greatsword, hardly OP.

I wish all warriors wouldn’t be running that OP 30/30/30/30/30 build. Then maybe we wouldn’t be called OP all the time.

Just leave warriors alone !!!! What about guardians? They do just as much dps.. in fact more with that scepter, have a ton of healing, have a ton of boons. I haven’t seen any guardian nerfs that were significant either.

Grimreaper.5370:

Warriors are scary in 1v1… They stun quite often then swap to great sword and hundred blades, or play banner build and have amazing health regent when concidering healing signet and regen. I don’t think it makes sense that a warrior can hit harder than any class in the game with zerk build and hundred blades. Sure go ahead and say that skill is clunky but mind you can have a stun option quite frequently. The only beef I really have with warrior is not being able to leave a dent in them with power crit build on some classes. Maybe the problem is not warrior but rather other class builds that need to see more DPS. Maybe warrior should have to be more skilled to absorb tons of DPS rather than relying on healing signet? Idk.. Just speculating

Well hundred blades looks scary on paper but in reality, it hardly hits. And that’s the only damage skill of the GS. In fact we take GS not because of damage, but because of mobility.

The thing about you don’t make a dent on us is just a perception. We are best at taking small amount of damage continuously. So if you build for the typical WvW zerg, which is more tanking. You will be completely out of luck. However if you build for full burst, we are out of luck. We don’t have a “oh kitten my health is low, I better heal” button. When our health is low our only option is to run. You need to anticipate that and CC us, or just treat that as a win.

The reason why we choose weapons with a lot of mobility in WvW, is because that’s the only way for us to survive the in coming zerg. We survive the least amount of time when zerg rolls around.

Lorelei.3918:

Condi Bunker Mobility Warriors are OP (As most condi bunkers are currently, but warriors get to have the best mobility on top of it)

You are talking about long bow and sword/sword? the only movement they have is sword 2, hardly called best mobility. Plus half of their dps needs melee range, don’t you think they should be a little more mobile than a fully ranged character?

Lorelei.3918:

Hambow is OP

They have no mobility, they are OP in PVP for their ability to take a point, but no one use them in WvW due to the lack of mobility. You should also be able to get away from them easily.

Lorelei.3918:

Healing Signet is OP

But we don’t have any access to defensive boon, or even the emergency heal button when our health is low.

Lorelei.3918:

Warrior Mobility is OP.

The only truly OP Mobility is GS/sword+x. They can’t easily do damage, or have a lot of CCs. Burst also does not hit easily with it, so condition is definitely a huge issue. Definitely not OP. They are call a troll build for a reason.

Lorelei.3918:

What makes you think your class deserves the ability to get away from every other class scott free whenever they feel like it? You have the most gap closers in the game PLUS effective immunity to movement impairments.

We can’t, the only build that can is GS/sword+x, see above.

Lorelei.3918:

Because you are a melee only class? Waow let me introduce you to Guardians, Power Necros and Thieves. Of those 3 only thieves rival warrior mobility. Maybe that’s why you always try to change the subject of Warrior OPness over to thieves. To get rid of that one pesky class that still sometimes gives you a sorta kinda hard time.

I also main a Guardian. It actually does not have less mobility than a warrior with a single mobility weapon. When spec right Guardian also have a lot more mobility when engaging the enemy but not running away. The reason why you don’t think it has a problem is probably you run a condition build, which guardian is very weak against. But they can tank much better on direct damage compare to the warrior. I can’t comment on power necro, but perhaps they do need a boost, as I never seem then around.

Lorelei.3918:

TLDR Warriors are OP when played right. Anet needs to find a way to better balance the risk/reward of being melee only. Right now there is no risk thanks to the super high mobility + condition immunity, yet very high reward (damage potential).

There is risk, high mobility comes with a price. healing signet means we are super susceptible to burst. condition immunity is just not true for most weapons where burst is harder to hit. damage potential also comes with a trade off between easy-to-hit mobility and CC.

Overall I would say warrior has a lot of options. Perhaps the best in the game, that’s why you think we are everything in one. But in any one character, we are not. There are just so many of us that uses so many different combination of weapons that you think we are all-in-one. I think this is perfect example of game design. Anet should make every profession this way.

Grimreaper.5370:

Warriors are scary in 1v1… They stun quite often then swap to great sword and hundred blades, or play banner build and have amazing health regent when concidering healing signet and regen. I don’t think it makes sense that a warrior can hit harder than any class in the game with zerk build and hundred blades. Sure go ahead and say that skill is clunky but mind you can have a stun option quite frequently.

This… is what im talking about. If you are standing in 100b…. then you do not know how to fight a warrior. No amount of nerfing will save you from that. I never use a gs in wvw or 1v1, its only good for mobility.

Warrior is not the problem. Too much passive stacking of one type of effect is the problem. Especially when it doesn’t require you to plan what skills to use or in what order, because it all relies on traits and using the right food, right runes etc.

Warrior’s heal signet + dogged march + melandru runes + less condi time food is a response to massive condi stacking.
The problem here is that conditions is not only damage, and this sort of setup not only make warriors harder to damage with conditions, it also makes them harder to control with conditions (cripple, immob etc.) A warrior is very hard to deal with if you cannot prevent them from being in your face all the time and that’s fair.
But IMO, the effort of keeping the warrior at a distance far outweights the actual player effort the warrior has to put into never being controlled/pressured by conditions. And trying to facetank a warrior will always fail, as it should be.

I feel the boonspam/passive effect stacking is generally out of control, and relies more on building for as many passive benefits as possible than actively considering what boons are best used at what times. Pretty much the same problem conditions have had for a while.

Yeah I generally agree. The thing is melandru runes + less condi time food is actually not optimal for warriors, we are forced to use them because there are just too much conditions flying around, and they can be reapplied too fast, and too easily.

If Anet ever move away from the conditional meta, we will probably see warriors being less of an issue.

You’ve been OP since the healing signet insane overbuff. Fortunately arenanet will be toning that down soon, rightly so.

healing signet made warrior op thats it

go play a heal other then healing signet, you will see how trash this class is, yet again.

Okay, so i used to main warrior, back when it took skill. I didn’t play it for a while, so I decided to roam in WvW for a while the other night. I was full zerker, axe/shield and greatsword. Running a build centered around zerker burst dps. Note I do have cleansing ire, just because you need the condi clear and the 15 in defense is nice for a regen. Also, as much as I hate it I had on healing signet because now you can’t play without it because of how strong it is. Warrior became OP when I have 109% critical damage, 49% critical chance, stuns, knockdowns and a small amount of immunities. No big deal, right? The class I main (ele) can build kind of similar just maybe not the crit damage as effectively. But here is the kicker… I have 2.7k armor and 21k hp??? So I can burst near as hard as a shatter mesmer or sleight of hand thief but on the flip side I can take the heat like no other class in the game. Its the fact that so much burst or condis can be applied and you can still take a beating. Its just dumb how good they are. I don’t see how you aren’t playing warrior on god mode if you are even remotely involved in a guild that has some half decent people in it to help you with builds or cant look something up on intothemists. Warrior used to be fun for me and I USED to have fun on it because it proposed a challenge but now I can have insane offense, immunities off the wall, and nearly cleanse every condition on me unless I fight a necro or engi who is skilled… Now warrior is just an atrocity of skills that you can hit in any order and win it seems… It’s sad to see where they have fallen from and I hope anet does something to fix them.

bigmonto.4215:

Julie Yann.5379:

Cleansing Ire becomes a problem when you combine it with burst mastery. ATM you can remove 3 condition with only 2 bars of adrenaline and easily have all your adrenaline back by the time your burst is off CD. So you get to burst more often, burst harder, and cleanse more than you should at the same time. It’s too strong a combination. Making it so that it removes 2 conditions instead of 3 since you are only using up 2 bars would probably be enough to make it balanced.

Dogged March is really only big problem in WvW when combined with for and -condition runes but then again there are plenty of other OP rune/food combos for every class and build in WvW. In PvP the fact fact that it grants regen combined with HS and adrenal health is a little too much, on of those healing methods should be toned down a bit.

I would not say Cleansing Ire is a problem for every weapon. A lot of the bust are single target and hard to hit with exception being hammer and long bow. They are aoe and harder to dodge. Specially the long bow as a long range attack with huge AOE range with little animation to indicate the attack. I would suggest Anet to adjust long bow specifically and not Cleansing Ire. This is what people complain about the warrior, its the hambow build right? Please specify a particular build and not the profession as a whole.

Well… What warrior build that is good doesn’t utilize the longbow, cleansing ire, and a healing signet, link me a build in this chat that doesn’t use those and is used in top tier play. Whenever you do find a build that is used in the upper tier of play effectively without those things listed above… I will praise you because that brings life back to warrior and may actually make it fun once again.

bigmonto.4215:

High toughness and high armor is not an issue as warrior doesn’t have access to defensive boons. Plus if you run conditions what do you care about armor? Cleansing Ire is not a problem if it doesn’t hit you. Dogged March is not a problem if you use condition food. As far as I know conditional meta is still the king of pvp. So you want warrior to be a free kill do you?

No acess to defensive boons? Please. Do you want me to start listing?
Spiked armor – retaliation
Dogged march – regen
Balanced stance – stability
Inspiring battle standard – regen
Last stand – More stability
Furious reaction – Vigor
Vigorous Focus – More vigor
So what are we missing? Protection and aegis. Aegis is a passive boon granted to 2 classes in the game, 1 passively and purely to yourself (engi) and the obvious use of aegis on guardians as well. Protection is given out to other people in small time chunks and for the most part if you are in a situation where a warrior has protection someone worth a kitten is going to corrupt/steal/strip that boon quickly. Also lets nto forget the warrior’s access to condi removes. As you stated above “Plus if you run conditions what do you care about armor? Cleansing Ire is not a problem if it doesn’t hit you. Dogged March is not a problem if you use condition food.” Well. First off if you stack melandru with condition minus food , and clenching ire, that matters because everything I just listed gives you more toughness whether you like it or not. Secondly, it matters because that is a 33% reduction to cripple, immobilize, and chill. cripple is a situational condition and comes in various ways for almost every class. Chill and immobilize are the problem. Immobilize can set you up for a burst combo or can be used as a anti kite. Chill reduces the rate that your skills are re-casting. Other classes have this same trait. But don’t get regen when they get hit by those condis. Lets also keep in mind regen on cleansing ire stacks. While I am on the topic of immobilize, have you ever heard of the lb/gs meta for wvw/pvp? Immobilize on warrior can be used to set you up (longbow 5, throw bolas) for a nasty 100 blades and each of those skills (listed separately) are pin down 3.5 second immobilize, allowing a warrior to swap weapons and hundred blades(not immobilized the whole time, but for a good bit of it) or arcing arrow, both of which will mess you up quickly. Now lets say i sue throw bolas after pin down this is now a 8 and 1/4 second immobilize, enough for you tog et kittened easily. If you are saying people only use gs in wvw for mobility you quite frankly don’t know the class. Believe it or not people still use bulls charge/frezy/hundred blades combo. Which actually works because I have to react to the stun of bulls charge within 1 and 3/4 of a second which relies on me either using a teleport or popping an invuln to truly lose the full effect of hundred blades.

While I’m on it. Another issue is conditions warrior, warrior has access to confusion, bleeds, torment, and burning all in one build. By the way this is torment I cant do kitten about unless I dodge the sword which usually can be done but to someone who cant read a warrior well or doesn’t see a tiny sword flying through the air because they are at melee range when the sword is thrown and they are done(because having a sword in you is not a removable condition). Lets also discuss confusion, this isn’t small amount either FOUR stacks every time you interrupt someone. Hell lets put the mail in the coffin too, since you are such an experienced warrior you should know via projectile finishers in combo fields you can stack 4 seconds of burning without anyone ever touching your longbow burst move, right? Burning is the strongest passive ticking
condition ticking a about 600-700 depending on the build maybe a little higher.

This is why warrior is god mode at the moment. I would be happy to play my warrior again if they weren’t god mode though, feel free to post any rebuttal below.

Vylor.3276:

bigmonto.4215:

High toughness and high armor is not an issue as warrior doesn’t have access to defensive boons. Plus if you run conditions what do you care about armor? Cleansing Ire is not a problem if it doesn’t hit you. Dogged March is not a problem if you use condition food. As far as I know conditional meta is still the king of pvp. So you want warrior to be a free kill do you?

No acess to defensive boons? Please. Do you want me to start listing?
Spiked armor – retaliation
Dogged march – regen
Balanced stance – stability
Inspiring battle standard – regen
Last stand – More stability
Furious reaction – Vigor
Vigorous Focus – More vigor
So what are we missing? Protection and aegis. Aegis is a passive boon granted to 2 classes in the game, 1 passively and purely to yourself (engi) and the obvious use of aegis on guardians as well. Protection is given out to other people in small time chunks and for the most part if you are in a situation where a warrior has protection someone worth a kitten is going to corrupt/steal/strip that boon quickly. Also lets nto forget the warrior’s access to condi removes. As you stated above “Plus if you run conditions what do you care about armor? Cleansing Ire is not a problem if it doesn’t hit you. Dogged March is not a problem if you use condition food.” Well. First off if you stack melandru with condition minus food , and clenching ire, that matters because everything I just listed gives you more toughness whether you like it or not. Secondly, it matters because that is a 33% reduction to cripple, immobilize, and chill. cripple is a situational condition and comes in various ways for almost every class. Chill and immobilize are the problem. Immobilize can set you up for a burst combo or can be used as a anti kite. Chill reduces the rate that your skills are re-casting. Other classes have this same trait. But don’t get regen when they get hit by those condis. Lets also keep in mind regen on cleansing ire stacks. While I am on the topic of immobilize, have you ever heard of the lb/gs meta for wvw/pvp? Immobilize on warrior can be used to set you up (longbow 5, throw bolas) for a nasty 100 blades and each of those skills (listed separately) are pin down 3.5 second immobilize, allowing a warrior to swap weapons and hundred blades(not immobilized the whole time, but for a good bit of it) or arcing arrow, both of which will mess you up quickly. Now lets say i sue throw bolas after pin down this is now a 8 and 1/4 second immobilize, enough for you tog et kittened easily. If you are saying people only use gs in wvw for mobility you quite frankly don’t know the class. Believe it or not people still use bulls charge/frezy/hundred blades combo. Which actually works because I have to react to the stun of bulls charge within 1 and 3/4 of a second which relies on me either using a teleport or popping an invuln to truly lose the full effect of hundred blades.

While I’m on it. Another issue is conditions warrior, warrior has access to confusion, bleeds, torment, and burning all in one build. By the way this is torment I cant do kitten about unless I dodge the sword which usually can be done but to someone who cant read a warrior well or doesn’t see a tiny sword flying through the air because they are at melee range when the sword is thrown and they are done(because having a sword in you is not a removable condition). Lets also discuss confusion, this isn’t small amount either FOUR stacks every time you interrupt someone. Hell lets put the mail in the coffin too, since you are such an experienced warrior you should know via projectile finishers in combo fields you can stack 4 seconds of burning without anyone ever touching your longbow burst move, right? Burning is the strongest passive ticking
condition ticking a about 600-700 depending on the build maybe a little higher.

This is why warrior is god mode at the moment. I would be happy to play my warrior again if they weren’t god mode though, feel free to post any rebuttal below.

Ok…..
Im a noob.
Can you link me the build that can do all this?
THX..

From a noob warrior

warriors were complete kitten.
and since they got buffed every other class want their free kills back… why ? beacuse kitten who ever love warrior.

Warriors become “OP” after years of being pretty bad in PvP, and the players having to put in 110% to win through consintration, and proper character building.

Now, Warriors are on par with everyone else in PvP, but they still put in the 110%.

Vylor.3276:

bigmonto.4215:

Julie Yann.5379:

Cleansing Ire becomes a problem when you combine it with burst mastery. ATM you can remove 3 condition with only 2 bars of adrenaline and easily have all your adrenaline back by the time your burst is off CD. So you get to burst more often, burst harder, and cleanse more than you should at the same time. It’s too strong a combination. Making it so that it removes 2 conditions instead of 3 since you are only using up 2 bars would probably be enough to make it balanced.

Dogged March is really only big problem in WvW when combined with for and -condition runes but then again there are plenty of other OP rune/food combos for every class and build in WvW. In PvP the fact fact that it grants regen combined with HS and adrenal health is a little too much, on of those healing methods should be toned down a bit.

I would not say Cleansing Ire is a problem for every weapon. A lot of the bust are single target and hard to hit with exception being hammer and long bow. They are aoe and harder to dodge. Specially the long bow as a long range attack with huge AOE range with little animation to indicate the attack. I would suggest Anet to adjust long bow specifically and not Cleansing Ire. This is what people complain about the warrior, its the hambow build right? Please specify a particular build and not the profession as a whole.

Well… What warrior build that is good doesn’t utilize the longbow, cleansing ire, and a healing signet, link me a build in this chat that doesn’t use those and is used in top tier play. Whenever you do find a build that is used in the upper tier of play effectively without those things listed above… I will praise you because that brings life back to warrior and may actually make it fun once again.

I usually use this build when playing in TeamQ to help support my allies
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vIAQNAS3Xj8cUGaVIudQHaAAzwrqsH+R9Yu7iD-TsAg0CnIOSdk7IzRyjsHN+YVw2CA

Gives CC to help keep the enemy team stunned.
Gives raw damage to prevent ressing of allies with dual axe auto and #5
Does great damage while not being completely squishy.
Does not use healing signet.
And I am sorry to say but not using Cleansing Ire is a completely stupid idea in this condition heavy meta. I have a few builds that do not use it but they are not viable for team play simply because they cannot clean conditions off, they are mostly my dueling builds because I can actively dodge condition inflicting skills.

aaakm.4290:

warriors were complete kitten.
and since they got buffed every other class want their free kills back… why ? beacuse kitten who ever love warrior.

This is simply a poor reasoning for why Warriors are not OP.

Now I do not agree that they are, but everyone else seems to think so.

Therefore instead of clinging to one reason keep an open mind and look at all information given to you.

What disturbs me is that a warrior running berserker amulet can have some level of substained defense as a elementalist running clerks amulet. I don’t think warriors are overpowered but other classes surely need some buffs so they can fight on the same level.

talking about lockdowns there is no such thing in this game it seems there is so much stability and easy ways for melee classes to catch you it’s kitten. If warriors are supose to have this high armor/health/healing/damage midigation I think it would be reasonable to be able to lock them down aswell. I play elementalist mainly and I can say that it would be a BIG relief to get a breather every now and then when fighting a warrior as it is now you guys just pop your stances and steamroll, no fun at all.

ShadowNinja.1238:

Cause Healing Signet and ultra high stats. With full zerk u can get 3k armour 20k hp tell me thats not op.

It’s also not true.

Vylor.3276

Where do I start.

To put it simply: We don’t have all these you claim we have in one build.

Take defensive boons. Among all that you listed I only have regen from Dogged march which is not in my control, plus it doesn’t heal much and stability from Dolyak signet which is on a 48 sec cooldown when traited.

Dogged March really only added -33% from 3 conditions, and that’s the only difference between warrior and other professions. Everyone else can use Melandru rune and -condition food. If the meta is not conditional, we probably would not use Melandru rune or -condition food, since they only benefits us defensively against condition builds. The +condition food and rune benefits the conditional builds more as that increase your dam for every single enemy you meet. Talk about unfair.

Long bow, I don’t use long bow. Most guys in WvW don’t use one. As I said before long bow is OP in sPVP because the goal there is to take a point and prevent others from staying there. In any other situation, just kite around it. But Anet can simply adjust that particular weapon and not affect other builds.

You said “What warrior build that is good doesn’t utilize the longbow, cleansing ire, and a healing signet”. and then you claim you would be happy to play your warrior again if they are not GOD mode. You see the problem? All you have to do is not use longbow, cleansing ire, or a healing signet if you think they are OP. Or perhaps you are one of those who has no experience or no interest in playing one, and got beating badly by one as an Elementalist, and here QQing for nerf.

magical giant.8650:

What disturbs me is that a warrior running berserker amulet can have some level of substained defense as a elementalist running clerks amulet. I don’t think warriors are overpowered but other classes surely need some buffs so they can fight on the same level.

talking about lockdowns there is no such thing in this game it seems there is so much stability and easy ways for melee classes to catch you it’s kitten. If warriors are supose to have this high armor/health/healing/damage midigation I think it would be reasonable to be able to lock them down aswell. I play elementalist mainly and I can say that it would be a BIG relief to get a breather every now and then when fighting a warrior as it is now you guys just pop your stances and steamroll, no fun at all.

Funny. Here I thought all of those stuns and CC was actually happening, just at a reduced rate with the help of runes that are available to all classes…

So speccing and building to counter heavy CC is now officially OP ladies and gentlemen. Dota/League have clouded people’s minds…

It’s cute that you people would even try to argue that Warrior isn’t OP. The End.

Dagnaggit.5086:

It’s cute that you people would even try to argue that Warrior isn’t OP. The End.

Why? Because they can soak up an okay amount and damage and dish it out as well? It’s what Warriors DO.

Thieves are annoying kittens who fight dirty with stealth.

Mesmers are tricky kittens that literally clone themselves and can turn invisible.

Guardians are kings of protection and eating hits

Elementalists hit hard with ranged AoE, and have access to more skills at all times than any other class in the game.

Necromancers are tanky condition spewing nightmares you literally have a second life/dps bar.

Honestly, the only classes who should be comaining are Rangers and Engineers. I don’t think I’ve ever seen one I couldn’t at least come close to killing with each of my toons.

McFribble.2349:

Dagnaggit.5086:

It’s cute that you people would even try to argue that Warrior isn’t OP. The End.

Why? Because they can soak up an insane amount damage while afking in the middle of a small group and dish it out at an insane rate too while dashing all over the place? It’s what OP Warriors DO.

Thieves are annoying kittens who fight dirty with stealth. Even though most classes played well can make them run (unless the are god mode), still every guild raid group should have 1 for scouting.

Mesmers are tricky kittens that literally clone themselves and can turn invisible (which is great for tpvp and roaming, or they can also stand around and do nothing unless it’s a portal bomb or veil for all I care).

Guardians are kings of giving me more boons to make me even more OP.

Elementalists hit hard with a 1 trick ranged AoE and give me water fields in WvW, I don’t want them anywhere else though.

Necromancers are tanky condition spewing nightmares, which is easily countered in anything other that small conflicts. They literally have a second life/dps bar and no mobility, easy to CC….but they can take damage almost as good as us until they die.

Honestly, the only classes who should be complaining are Rangers and Engineers. I don’t think I’ve ever seen one I couldn’t at least come close to killing with each of my toons.

Fixed.

Dagnaggit.5086:

McFribble.2349:

Dagnaggit.5086:

It’s cute that you people would even try to argue that Warrior isn’t OP. The End.

Why? Because they can soak up an insane amount damage while afking in the middle of a small group and dish it out at an insane rate too while dashing all over the place? It’s what OP Warriors DO.

Thieves are annoying kittens who fight dirty with stealth. Even though most classes played well can make them run (unless the are god mode), still every guild raid group should have 1 for scouting.

Mesmers are tricky kittens that literally clone themselves and can turn invisible (which is great for tpvp and roaming, or they can also stand around and do nothing unless it’s a portal bomb or veil for all I care).

Guardians are kings of giving me more boons to make me even more OP.

Elementalists hit hard with a 1 trick ranged AoE and give me water fields in WvW, I don’t want them anywhere else though.

Necromancers are tanky condition spewing nightmares, which is easily countered in anything other that small conflicts. They literally have a second life/dps bar and no mobility, easy to CC….but they can take damage almost as good as us until they die.

Honestly, the only classes who should be complaining are Rangers and Engineers. I don’t think I’ve ever seen one I couldn’t at least come close to killing with each of my toons.

Broke.

Sorry you got in a fistacuffs match with a Warrior and lost. Perhaps try using your class strengths to your advantage next time, instead of trying to outdo a class at what it does best?

Let me give you an example of their OP in PvE. I took my level 20 Warrior into LA yesterday. Level 20 gear, level 10 trinkets and at most 10 trait points. I Went INTO the thick of battle, with axe/gs fighting massive amounts of vets/elites/champs and couldnt be taken down, my healing signet was outhealing all damage and was killing things fast (thanks to other players of course). I would not go down.

When I went with my level 80 ranger/ele/thief with full exotics, full traits it was a different story. I had to pull out time to time, heal up, blast finish water to heal or I will go down from condition damage, 1 shot from a Elite or AoE to death.

I dont understand how I can faceroll the event on a level 20 warrior but gotta play well on those other classes.

Am I asking for a nerf? Nah, they warriors, they do what they do best. I only joke to friends about them being too OP for PvE but some classes are better than others for some content. They got nerfed for WvW and PvP so balanced out.

Himei.5379:

Let me give you an example of their OP in PvE. I took my level 20 Warrior into LA yesterday. Level 20 gear, level 10 trinkets and at most 10 trait points. I Went INTO the thick of battle, with axe/gs fighting massive amounts of vets/elites/champs and couldnt be taken down, my healing signet was outhealing all damage and was killing things fast (thanks to other players of course). I would not go down.

When I went with my level 80 ranger/ele/thief with full exotics, full traits it was a different story. I had to pull out time to time, heal up, blast finish water to heal or I will go down from condition damage, 1 shot from a Elite or AoE to death.

I dont understand how I can faceroll the event on a level 20 warrior but gotta play well on those other classes.

Am I asking for a nerf? Nah, they warriors, they do what they do best. I only joke to friends about them being too OP for PvE but some classes are better than others for some content. They got nerfed for WvW and PvP so balanced out.

what are you talking about? i leveled in la from 60 to 80, healing signet my kitten. If you come to blob/zerg, even get upscaled so much you get one-2 shot from regular elite attacks or ground aoe. and healing signet is worse for burst damage you get to your face. All the time i leveled using either bow or rifle, just to stay far back, using shouts for team and ressing for extra exp. Like molten gunner, who uses flame tornados. get hit by 2 and you are dead ( sometimes even one if upscalled so much). or molten aoe on ground, or wurm aoe, anything

And even if would be super fantastic in pve, is player versus enviroment, a.k.a. you hit not player, but npcs

when rescuing civs – gj clearing patrols realying on hs. You actually need to use few phys utilities for interrupts, cleanse condis in time if you wish to kill patrol quick to not get outnumbered. all comes to player skill

The current warrior issues seem largely due to the sum of the parts. The combination of cleansing ire, healing signet, adrenal health and dogged march are what creates these scenarios. Lose any of the 4 and sustain drops noticeably. They’ve all been very meta and with things being so condition happy its honestly not a huge surprise. Combined with warrior’s large tool box of CC. movement options and immunities, they can be extremely difficult to stop, especially 1v1.

Add in the runes and food ( namely mango pie or lemongrass ) and bam. The combination of the above really is a strong anti condition meta but as mentioned before, cripple, chill and immobilize, all being condition based CC, are nearly useless against said setups ( again with the correct food / rune combos, of which do seem to be very popular in WvW ) This effects direct damage builds as well which often rely on these conditions for added control.

In the end this leaves warriors such as these only truly vulnerable to knockdowns, dazes, stuns and a lot of damage direct. They require follow through or they’ll scurry away and reset the fight passively with minimal difficulty.

Its a tough thing to balance because its not any one thing alone that would destroy things, it would only handicap it. Personally, I’d be interested to see a short cool down addition to dogged march’s condition component however. Would be nice to see a cripple on a warrior last more than .25 seconds

Warriors have always been really strong, its just people are just starting to realize how to use them, so now they are seeming OP. In this meta Heavys rule all in WvW, when new ideas of how to play WvW are developed other classes will shine higher. But atm Warriors work to well with this meta.

As a Non-warrior player (even though i have one), the only thing that made warriors OP is Healing signet.

Thats it. Other things help, yes. But this is the major culprit.

wyther.8372:

Buzzcrave.6197:

People should stop relying on stats, this is a game that have an active combat mechanics. No sane person will stand toe to toe with a war and just auto attack and click skill. If that is how you play, then this game is not for you. Its pointless to have the best stats in the game if you don’t even know how to play the game.

Active gameplay>passive stats.

Fix the immunities and skills of other classes and they wouldn’t stand toe to toe. However, right now, there isn’t much choice, our warriors move faster, cover more ground, and are mostly immune to CC and has CC that blows past immunities of many classes/builds. I have an 80 of every class, and by far warrior is the easiest to play and win on in WvW. Now does he have the usefulness in every fight or scenario as some of the other classes, no, he doesn’t. But for what we have, we don’t give up much at all.

This. of all my 80s my warrior is by far my most effective char both WvW and pve. Right now I am running a kitten axes / rifle zerker build and it is still better. Dogged march, cleansing ire, Mellandru’s and lemongrass and spec anything else you want.

Bombsaway.7198:

Well, rather than say other people simply need to love your warrior. . . .

The general consensus is that the warrior became OP when ANET tried to quickly move them from being useless to useful.

The main disadvantage of the warrior was supposed to be (if you look at the original builds) condition damage. Now, the warrior is frankly far too able to remove conditions and avoid being locked down. Add passive healing, high toughness and high armor and you simply have too many benefits and not enough weaknesses.

Cleansing Ire and Dogged March are the biggest problems. Warriors should get locked down more and should take more condition damage with fewer cleanses. But God help another class that winds up toe to toe with you.

You need a pretty big claw back (nerf) of the abilities ANET put in after launch (cleansing ire, dogged march and healing signet) in that order.

They said warrior use to be like it is now. They dialed it back on purpose before launch. People said warrior needs to be viable etc. They didn’t even give warrior the Healing Signet buff upfront when they did the other buffs to mace, and zerker stance etc. When they introduced those the community said where is the healing that you posted? Chap responded with we wanted to see how these other buffs work first BUT if you guys think it should go in to help the warrior ok. Then healing went in on a patch that wasn’t a balance patch. The other buffs went in on the balance patch healing came later after the community asked for it.

If I’m not mistaken there was leaked notes around that time and everyone knew what was coming for healing signet but it didn’t make it in that specific patch but a later one after people asked for it. It was already prepared and ready to go with the tweaked numbers.

I was heavy on the warrior forums at that time. I really don’t want to dig for that information. The statement about how the warrior was before release isn’t hard to find though just look at the OLD SOTG.

I think warrior is fine personally I was playing my warrior before those buffs came and warrior was the lowest profession in s/tPvP. In WvW it was ok but more of a thief with no stealth a elementalist with no sustain, go in the fight do some damage run out of the fight was the old warrior. Definitely not fun at all and didn’t fit what I imagine a warrior to be. Some would say it required more skill then but I beg to differe, because anyone decent would put you at a health deficit and you “stall” till surge is up again. Thieves with 30 SA and shadow rejuvenation had better sustain then warriors that was one of the main points brought up alot is how the squishy thief can stay in the thick of it better then the heavy armored warrior.

People don’t like to die in 1v1’s people don’t like things they can’t secure a kill on if they are winning. That is where most of the complaints come from. If the Warrior was slow and had no mobility people wouldn’t complain as much about warrior but since it has mobility and sustain people complain(mobility is greatly tied to weapon).

How does a warrior work without tankyness? theres no real tactical options.

OwnusMaximus.6385:

The current warrior issues seem largely due to the sum of the parts. The combination of cleansing ire, healing signet, adrenal health and dogged march are what creates these scenarios. Lose any of the 4 and sustain drops noticeably. They’ve all been very meta and with things being so condition happy its honestly not a huge surprise. Combined with warrior’s large tool box of CC. movement options and immunities, they can be extremely difficult to stop, especially 1v1.

Add in the runes and food ( namely mango pie or lemongrass ) and bam. The combination of the above really is a strong anti condition meta but as mentioned before, cripple, chill and immobilize, all being condition based CC, are nearly useless against said setups ( again with the correct food / rune combos, of which do seem to be very popular in WvW ) This effects direct damage builds as well which often rely on these conditions for added control.

In the end this leaves warriors such as these only truly vulnerable to knockdowns, dazes, stuns and a lot of damage direct. They require follow through or they’ll scurry away and reset the fight passively with minimal difficulty.

Its a tough thing to balance because its not any one thing alone that would destroy things, it would only handicap it. Personally, I’d be interested to see a short cool down addition to dogged march’s condition component however. Would be nice to see a cripple on a warrior last more than .25 seconds

Good post.

My main is a Ranger. My second is a Warrior who has 500+ hours in WvW. So not an expert by any means.

I spend far too much time theory crafting and trying new builds. When going back to my Ranger I realize one big difference between the classes. if I want to heal on the Ranger, I have to build for it…at the expense of something else. If I want a power spec, same thing, I lose somewhere else. etc etc

With Warrior, if I focus on something, the other attributes don’t take as big of hit. Go power build? My HPs, toughness, healing and mobility aren’t terrible.

I think that’s what gets people fired up.

…and no, I don’t want to see Warriors nerfed.

here is a small random video as example.

warrior on zerker dont loose much compared with other classes, high damage, good health, armor is at a good level, also skills are afar superios to some classes, and the lord banner rez…

lchan.2169:

We became OP since the day some idiots decide to stand within melee distance and hoped to win.

Shut this thread down and give this man a medal