Guild Wars 2

Disclaimer: this is my opinion, there are other reasons I’m sure but this seems most prevalent.

The current meta is focused on what an individual can do within a team, not for the team.

The traits and utilities are there, though some traits are a bit skewed from optimal allocation. A warrior has great combo finishers on weapon sets. Low c/d blast, leaps and whirls. They also have low c/d utility blast finishers, and these are generally good for the team as well.(e.g., all banners are blast finishers) We have traits that would be great for team synergy, as well as the war horn.
I have recently been spending a lot of time on my warrior again, and these points really stick out to me. Every time I use a hammer I think about how great a water field or smoke field would be for the team. Things like this happen all the time.
I believe, that once the meta shifts to a stronger focus on synergy and the team as a sum of it’s parts warriors will be much more desirable as a class in tourney play.(aside from lolhbfrenzy)

Now, Im no warrior veteran, I only recently started seriously playing him. So please offer more insight, and things that would make the warrior more desirable teammate in tor current meta.

tOss.9024:

Disclaimer: this is my opinion, there are other reasons I’m sure but this seems most prevalent.

The current meta is focused on what an individual can do within a team, not for the team.

The traits and utilities are there, though some traits are a bit skewed from optimal allocation. A warrior has great combo finishers on weapon sets. Low c/d blast, leaps and whirls. They also have low c/d utility blast finishers, and these are generally good for the team as well.(e.g., all banners are blast finishers) We have traits that would be great for team synergy, as well as the war horn.
I have recently been spending a lot of time on my warrior again, and these points really stick out to me. Every time I use a hammer I think about how great a water field or smoke field would be for the team. Things like this happen all the time.
I believe, that once the meta shifts to a stronger focus on synergy and the team as a sum of it’s parts warriors will be much more desirable as a class in tourney play.(aside from lolhbfrenzy)

Now, Im no warrior veteran, I only recently started seriously playing him. So please offer more insight, and things that would make the warrior more desirable teammate in tor current meta.

You don’t like it because it doesn’t have the exact same skills as other professions? The professions are MEANT to be different, and as you get better you will find DIFFERENT ways to support the team, dropping combo fields isn’t the only way. Though I do like switching to the longbow and using banners to rack up a lovely 25 stacks of might for myself and allies. Boons aren’t the warriors strong point, they provide more direct support through healing and staying on the front lines.

Dolan.3071:

tOss.9024:

Disclaimer: this is my opinion, there are other reasons I’m sure but this seems most prevalent.

The current meta is focused on what an individual can do within a team, not for the team.

The traits and utilities are there, though some traits are a bit skewed from optimal allocation. A warrior has great combo finishers on weapon sets. Low c/d blast, leaps and whirls. They also have low c/d utility blast finishers, and these are generally good for the team as well.(e.g., all banners are blast finishers) We have traits that would be great for team synergy, as well as the war horn.
I have recently been spending a lot of time on my warrior again, and these points really stick out to me. Every time I use a hammer I think about how great a water field or smoke field would be for the team. Things like this happen all the time.
I believe, that once the meta shifts to a stronger focus on synergy and the team as a sum of it’s parts warriors will be much more desirable as a class in tourney play.(aside from lolhbfrenzy)

Now, Im no warrior veteran, I only recently started seriously playing him. So please offer more insight, and things that would make the warrior more desirable teammate in tor current meta.

You don’t like it because it doesn’t have the exact same skills as other professions? The professions are MEANT to be different, and as you get better you will find DIFFERENT ways to support the team, dropping combo fields isn’t the only way. Though I do like switching to the longbow and using banners to rack up a lovely 25 stacks of might for myself and allies. Boons aren’t the warriors strong point, they provide more direct support through healing and staying on the front lines.

You seem to have misunderstood my post. I’m saying we have a ton of useful team skills that are underutilized. Not that we need more things like other classes.

I only play a Warrior, period. Lvl 80, rank 42 before I quit playing almost a month ago.

The problem is exactly as you describe, but it comes down to the issue of mobility vs. being a tank.

To pick up the more team-oriented skills you have to either:
A) Sacrifice mobility or potential damage output.
B) Become very tanky

Unfortunately, the most effective way to sPvP atm is to remain mobile, consistently. It’s about what 1-2 people can do in 4 seconds and less what 1-2 people can do for the rest of the team over a 3 minute engagement.

Because of this Warriors are pigeonholed into either being Tanky, or Mobile / Bursty.
Considering many other classes can be better tanks we’re forced into the Mobile/Bursty role which has very little in the ways of team abilities.

The class is just up against a wall, its why I’ve quit playing until major changes happen or a huge meta shift. Until then I’m playing Forge, since its the PvP game I always wanted GW2 to be.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/warrior/Bunker-Warrior-tPvP-prototype/first#post953515

Lots of team contribution covered in this thread. No point in keeping one’s thought a secret when there is hope. Just a few more tweaks on traits though..

@Defek

Could you push out my Bunker Warrior though?

Schwahrheit.4203:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/warrior/Bunker-Warrior-tPvP-prototype/first#post953515

@Defek

Could you push out my Bunker Warrior though?

Now, you know I love you.

But.

Any competent tPvP team would steam roll a Warrior bunker

Sure you’d last a decent amount of time, but I’d estimate about 30% less time than a Bunker guardian.

Defektive.7283:

Schwahrheit.4203:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/warrior/Bunker-Warrior-tPvP-prototype/first#post953515

@Defek

Could you push out my Bunker Warrior though?

Now, you know I love you.

But.

Any competent tPvP team would steam roll a Warrior bunker

Sure you’d last a decent amount of time, but I’d estimate about 30% less time than a Bunker guardian.

Yeah definitely burn EVERYTHING on the guy with 22k HP, 4k defense, Signet of Stamina, permanent regeneration, and permanent vigor.

Don’t have to burn them just push them off the point and decap it. No one cares to kill the tank they just want the point.

I know the build you’re running, I ran something similar as a test.

Good teams stomped on us.

Of course you need to know how to dodge Hammer Guards via Counter Blow and Permanent Vigor. Even then.. 26 second stability says hi.

But then you have to sacrifice Shield Stance which isn’t that bad.

Have you won any paid tournies yet using this build?

Defektive.7283:

Have you won any paid tournies yet using this build?

Its hard to find consistent team mates you know. I’ve fought decent players in frees however.

Not that I care showing what I mean in-game either.. (Of course I won’t deny, some traits are bad)

Put me in your team.

Schwahrheit.4203:

Not that I care showing what I mean in-game either.. (Of course I won’t deny, some traits are bad)

Put me in your team.

Or

You could play a fun game! (http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1787158)

Defektive.7283:

Schwahrheit.4203:

Not that I care showing what I mean in-game either.. (Of course I won’t deny, some traits are bad)

Put me in your team.

Or

You could play a fun game! (http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1787158)

Is smite even that good?

Schwahrheit.4203:

Defektive.7283:

Schwahrheit.4203:

Not that I care showing what I mean in-game either.. (Of course I won’t deny, some traits are bad)

Put me in your team.

Or

You could play a fun game! (http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1787158)

Is smite even that good?

Thats Forge, not smite.

And it’s god kitten amazing.

Braxxus.2904:

Defektive.7283:

Until then I’m playing Forge, since its the PvP game I always wanted GW2 to be.

Ohhh, you have me interested… does it actually have decent melee/warrior style mechanics?

Oh hell, gonna go check it out anyways.

WHY, WHY IS IT SO HARD TO FIND A GAME WHERE YOU CAN BE A FRIGGIN’ WARRIOR THAT ISN’T LAME? (Other than M&B Warband, but the community is so small there and it definately needs modernization… and a persistant world. But the melee combat is the friggin’ best)

There’s 2 melee classes, Warden (Hybrid Warrior / Guardian, can’t heal itself).
And assassin (Less OP Thief, can lock a player down, slow them, but dmg is on par w/ other classes).

Targeting is done like in an FPS via aiming, there’s blocking in the game so potentially you could seperate the healer from the enemy and block his LOS with your bodies.

Right clicking ‘blocks’ Holding down block drains your resources, and the longer you have it held down the more damage you take. However, if you block a caster spell or attack, you put it on cooldown for 5 seconds.

The game has a high skill cap and all the classes seem rather balanced.

Defektive.7283:

Braxxus.2904:

Defektive.7283:

Until then I’m playing Forge, since its the PvP game I always wanted GW2 to be.

Ohhh, you have me interested… does it actually have decent melee/warrior style mechanics?

Oh hell, gonna go check it out anyways.

WHY, WHY IS IT SO HARD TO FIND A GAME WHERE YOU CAN BE A FRIGGIN’ WARRIOR THAT ISN’T LAME? (Other than M&B Warband, but the community is so small there and it definately needs modernization… and a persistant world. But the melee combat is the friggin’ best)

There’s 2 melee classes, Warden (Hybrid Warrior / Guardian, can’t heal itself).
And assassin (Less OP Thief, can lock a player down, slow them, but dmg is on par w/ other classes).

Targeting is done like in an FPS via aiming, there’s blocking in the game so potentially you could seperate the healer from the enemy and block his LOS with your bodies.

Right clicking ‘blocks’ Holding down block drains your resources, and the longer you have it held down the more damage you take. However, if you block a caster spell or attack, you put it on cooldown for 5 seconds.

The game has a high skill cap and all the classes seem rather balanced.

Sweeet. Sold, will DL it tonight.

Also downloading Forge to give it a go. I still enjoy the pants off of GW2, but I love to play around with new games.

Here’s hoping they add some light/medium armored greatsword-wielding class at some point. Aesthetics or bust.

Cogbyrn.7283:

Aesthetics or bust.

Agreed wholeheartedly.

For those grabbing Forge, hit me up on steam – Defektivex [COAL]

Also, watch my stream! I do a lot of forge stuff: (twitch.tv/Defektive)
http://www.playforgewar.com/forums/index.php?/topic/2780-stream-highlights-defektivex-pyro-team-coalition/
^^My Forge page.

PYRO MANNIIAAAA
http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1787158

1v1 Vs. Assassin, I start with 1/2 HP
http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1787173

The Rocketeer:
http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1787177

Cannot hide from ze rocketeer!
http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1787199

DON’T STAND IN THE FIRE
http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1788908

…Lol
http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1788912

Saved by the be.. Shaman(s)?
http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1788920

Defekt vs. 2 (Pathfinder aka hunter / Shaman)
http://www.twitch.tv/defektive/c/1788933

warrior is very decent,
low skill players just want the warrior to be thief burst and mobility clad in plate armor, backstabbing opponents with two greatswords and then vanish in a meteorite storm and firing lightning bolts out of their kitten like William Wallace.

all classes has strong points and weak points, most of the classes are undone, have some broken traits and utilities, this is not something unique to warrior.
people blame the class when their play doesn’t live up to their expectations.

I have played amost exlusively a warrior since release, and although I have played most other classes I keep going back to my warrior mainly becuase I love the look of them and enjoy melee. But the warrior is flawed, in its current state in wvw and spvp and even Pve/dungeons it is lacking in it’s ability to perform as a warrior should.

With so much ranged damage happening in both pve, wvw, spvp warriors need the ability to lock down their targets more and prevent escaping a sort of circle of melee ability where any enemy engaged has to stay within the circle for 6 seconds. We should be feared in melee and not just seen as meat shield that needs to be slowed and kitited from range. Either that or we need more abilities to close the gap upon an enemies (Example. A very long ranged charge attack.) Our traits also need a lot of work, we need more options for speed, more options for ignoring slows and stuns.

As for all our weapons why should we be forced to use rifle and longbow in both dungeons, Pve, and WvW.

I’m a warrior! I want my enemies to fear me when I get within melee range. I want to be able to get within melee range and cause havoc when I’m within melee range!

The more you play other classes, the worse the warrior flaws seem.

Warriors my main, but for sPvP i slow added other classes in both to be versatile and also learn them in order to fight against them better as a warrior. Problem is the more i did that the more i realized, “holy crap, my warrior can’t do anything against this build”. This would get progressively worse as i added more classes (now i play all the classes except ranger and engie)

Warrior’s just not in a good state for tPvP. Even if you can down someone fast, alot of comps these days run with multiple rez skills, which makes you useless since usually after you blow your combo, you get focused and killed fast (and unlike thieves, you don’t have a reliable escape). Its in this weird position where the most reliable build is a glass cannon build, yet has the worst escape /survival of all the glass cannons despite being a “heavy armor” class.

Pretty much done with this class for anything aside from hot join (warrior farms glory like a boss at least) tPvP, i’m better off playing any of the other classes i play now; i don’t like holding back my team.

Recently.1043:

The more you play other classes, the worse the warrior flaws seem.

Warriors my main, but for sPvP i slow added other classes in both to be versatile and also learn them in order to fight against them better as a warrior. Problem is the more i did that the more i realized, “holy crap, my warrior can’t do anything against this build”. This would get progressively worse as i added more classes (now i play all the classes except ranger and engie)

^Exactly this.

I felt the same way about my Warrior. I felt pretty beast until I branched out after awhile(also to learn how to fight other classes). Once you seriously dedicate some time to another class, without bias, you see the big difference. That same warrior dedication pays off a lot more as another class and for your team.

However, according to some we’re just “bad” because warrior takes so much “skill” to play. Which is very laughable to say the least. The Warrior community is losing passionate warriors by the truckload, yet some are still blind enough to blame it on the player.

I hate to break it to you, but a majority of other class players see warriors as skill-less walking win buttons who can do everything better than they can with half the effort.

Can’t step into the Engineer, Necro or Elementalist forums without someone complaining about warriors and how awesome they are. It’s actually pretty funny because it really does seem like the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. “Warriors only have to press 1 button to do X while we need to press at least 5!”

Forge is on sale for $9.99 right now on Steam =D holiday sale ftw!

@Lifelike

Until they learn to dodge. Then everything is solved. Also, That’s a haste problem not a Warrior problem.

The warrior is a noob measuring stick. So I love when someone complains about one.

Akumu.7238:

@Lifelike

Until they learn to dodge. Then everything is solved. Also, That’s a haste problem not a Warrior problem.

The warrior is a noob measuring stick. So I love when someone complains about one.

So wait, you can dodge a skill that gives 11 stacks of might on a very low cooldown and heals? You can dodge a shout that grants stability for a ridiculously long duration in comparison to stability of other classes, also on a fairly short cooldown? It’s not things like hundred blades or kill shot that make warriors strong in my eyes, it’s that they have many skills that other classes would simply kill for. I’ve played just about every class there is with the exception of Ranger at a mid-basic level, and while I understand that warrior does have it’s (major) weaknesses in practical play, there are still parts of the moveset that make me just think “this is much too good to be true”. It’s silly the way other classes complain about warriors, but calling warriors weak when you guys have so many powerful skills and utilities seems a bit harsh.

Lifelike.5862:

Akumu.7238:

@Lifelike

Until they learn to dodge. Then everything is solved. Also, That’s a haste problem not a Warrior problem.

The warrior is a noob measuring stick. So I love when someone complains about one.

So wait, you can dodge a skill that gives 11 stacks of might on a very low cooldown and heals? You can dodge a shout that grants stability for a ridiculously long duration in comparison to stability of other classes, also on a fairly short cooldown? It’s not things like hundred blades or kill shot that make warriors strong in my eyes, it’s that they have many skills that other classes would simply kill for. I’ve played just about every class there is with the exception of Ranger at a mid-basic level, and while I understand that warrior does have it’s (major) weaknesses in practical play, there are still parts of the moveset that make me just think “this is much too good to be true”. It’s silly the way other classes complain about warriors, but calling warriors weak when you guys have so many powerful skills and utilities seems a bit harsh.

Yes we can dodge a skill that can stack 11 might and what are you talking about heals?
Warriors aren’t guardians because guardians have that 2hand sword heals trait.

When calling warriors weak I guess that means they don’t have much to bring to the tables besides the ordinary cookie cutter builds like burst or hybrid burst to tourneys.

Heck you don’t see too much condition spec sword/sword long bow warriors in pvp at all since most conditions can be cleanse easily or turn into boons. The class has a limited choice here you know.

Sure we have a lot of skills but are they really useful? Not many…not many at all and if we want to die quicker we take Frenzy

Lifelike.5862:

So wait, you can dodge a skill that gives 11 stacks of might on a very low cooldown and heals? You can dodge a shout that grants stability for a ridiculously long duration in comparison to stability of other classes, also on a fairly short cooldown? It’s not things like hundred blades or kill shot that make warriors strong in my eyes, it’s that they have many skills that other classes would simply kill for. I’ve played just about every class there is with the exception of Ranger at a mid-basic level, and while I understand that warrior does have it’s (major) weaknesses in practical play, there are still parts of the moveset that make me just think “this is much too good to be true”. It’s silly the way other classes complain about warriors, but calling warriors weak when you guys have so many powerful skills and utilities seems a bit harsh.

I don’t know what class you played, but it’s clearly not the warrior. We don’t even have a shout that grants stability for a long duration on a fairly low cd. Balanced stance is 8 secs with a 40 sec cd. Even with that Warrior is still the one of the easiest classes to CC and nuke down. 30 seconds is a long time when you’re a class that sucks at damage mitigation. Please don’t bring up warrior toughness/armour either. Tell someone else who doesn’t have almost 4k armour how great it is.

You are clearly exaggerating and know very little about the warrior. 2/3 utilities are terrible and most of our traits are not any better. Anyone wanting to swap with us does not have good odds in their favor.

A shout with 8 seconds of stability that you can use even while CC’d, on a 40 second cooldown is better than anything the elementalist, engineer, and necromancer get, I know that much for certain. Ele get stability on a much longer cooldown, or for a measly 2 seconds when they attune to earth and only if they’re traited into it. Engineers have nothing, and necromancers have to rely on unwieldy ultimates and death shroud for stability, which they have to spec into a generally useless and buggy tree to obtain, again for only a fraction of balanced stance’s duration. The only class I’ve seen that competes with warrior for stability is guardian. I’m pretty sure thieves don’t even GET stability.

40 seconds isn’t even that long compared to the ‘escape’ utilities of most other classes.

Lifelike.5862:

Akumu.7238:

@Lifelike

Until they learn to dodge. Then everything is solved. Also, That’s a haste problem not a Warrior problem.

The warrior is a noob measuring stick. So I love when someone complains about one.

So wait, you can dodge a skill that gives 11 stacks of might on a very low cooldown and heals? You can dodge a shout that grants stability for a ridiculously long duration in comparison to stability of other classes, also on a fairly short cooldown? It’s not things like hundred blades or kill shot that make warriors strong in my eyes, it’s that they have many skills that other classes would simply kill for. I’ve played just about every class there is with the exception of Ranger at a mid-basic level, and while I understand that warrior does have it’s (major) weaknesses in practical play, there are still parts of the moveset that make me just think “this is much too good to be true”. It’s silly the way other classes complain about warriors, but calling warriors weak when you guys have so many powerful skills and utilities seems a bit harsh.

Buddy. Do you have a warrior? First of all balance stance is a stance, not a shout and its 40 sec cd for 8 sec duration stability + stun break.

My bunker guardian has a shout that gives 6 sec stability + 6 sec retaliation + stun break on 24 sec (30 sec untraited). Its a shout so it effects your team, unlike balanced stance which only helps you I think its pretty kittening obvious which of the 2 skills is better.

I also got no flipping idea what warrior ability has low cd ability gives 11 stacks of might and heals.

The fact that you think balance stance is a shout (aka it effects the team) just shows you how incredibly misinformed you are about the warrior class. You might want to stop now before you continue to make an kitten out of yourself.

I obviously meant to say stance. Don’t try to derail this on a technicality like that, it doesn’t actually make my point any less valid. Balanced stance can be used while CC’d, it provides an insanely long amount of stability, and the only, literally only reliable stability skill that outclasses it amongst all professions is the guardian version.

Also, btw, when did I ever bring up Balanced Stance as effecting the team? Hmmm, I’m pretty sure I didn’t even mention that, did I? I wasn’t even talking about teams. I mistakedly called it a shout, but that doesn’t change my argument at all.

As for the might stacking skill, it’s obviously For Great Justice. I know there are several builds out there which allow it to stack a lot of might very fast due to it’s low cooldown. It’s a rather infamous move and non-warriors always bring it up when arguing about how ‘easy’ the warrior class is. I was partying with a warrior at karkas the other day who was keeping 11 stacks of might up easily and doing little more than spamming that skill. I was watching him closely since my engineer build was also focussed on might-building and I wanted to see how many stacks I could give him combined with his own.

You can try to call me out on ignorance as much as you want, but attempting to point fingers at guardians and trying to use that as a claim for having bad stability, when you have the second best stability granting utility in the game is pretty ignorant in itself. And what about Engineers/Ele/Ranger/Thief/Necro and their inferior methods of obtaining stability? For a class that’s supposed to be all about dealing heavy DPS, (fun fact, warrior dps with a rifle is better at range than even a ranger, the supposed masters of ranged combat, and without even sacrificing much at all for it) warriors sure have a lot of excellent defensive utilities. On top of that, they’re a heavy armor class. Even if you guys build flat glass cannon, you STILL have more hp and innate defense and survivability than an elementalist, thief or engineer going hybrid, simply because you get to wear plate. I know warriors will hear that a lot, but it is a factor that most cloth or medium armor classes are left scratching their heads about.

You can’t maintain 11 stacks of might with for great justice even with shout reduction traits and insane boon duration buffs. You can maintain 6 for a portion of the time. The other 5 is coming from SoR

Again your so full of kitten its insane. Done even responding to you since you don’t know anything about the warrior class lol.

And yes, when you call balance stance a shout multiple times it implies its effecting the team since all shouts are aoe.

Lifelike.5862:

So wait, you can dodge a skill that gives 11 stacks of might on a very low cooldown and heals?

What’s my 11 Might button?

Does Lifelike even play guildwars 2? When did innate defenses and hp matter? Alpha testing?

Recently.1043:

You can’t maintain 11 stacks of might with for great justice even with shout reduction traits and insane boon duration buffs. You can maintain 6 for a portion of the time. The other 5 is coming from SoR

I can and do maintain 11 stacks of might very easily from using both FGJ and SoR and that is not just for a portion of the time.

It does seem that some like looking for something to have a pop about to skip past the main point, or could it be just to kill a topic!!

Lifelike.5862:

A shout with 8 seconds of stability that you can use even while CC’d, on a 40 second cooldown is better than anything the elementalist, engineer, and necromancer get, I know that much for certain. Ele get stability on a much longer cooldown, or for a measly 2 seconds when they attune to earth and only if they’re traited into it. Engineers have nothing, and necromancers have to rely on unwieldy ultimates and death shroud for stability, which they have to spec into a generally useless and buggy tree to obtain, again for only a fraction of balanced stance’s duration. The only class I’ve seen that competes with warrior for stability is guardian. I’m pretty sure thieves don’t even GET stability.

40 seconds isn’t even that long compared to the ‘escape’ utilities of most other classes.

I’ll swap balanced stance for Ele attunement system or Necro Death shroud any day. I’ll also take Engies kits/abilities that allow them to self rez, go mini to avoid CC, their big high damage AoE CC bomb, and their good healing/regen. Trying to build the “perfect” class is not the point and doesn’t deny the warriors flaws. Which is what you’re trying to do when talking about a utility that still doesn’t prevent Warrior from being one of the easiest CCed classes while also being terrible at damage mitigation.

However, pay attention to something. Guardians have good access to stability as well, as you said. Did it ever occur that it’s probably more for the Heavy Armour classes? You know the melee guys that don’t have all that mobility everyone else have? As someone that plays Ele I wouldn’t need balanced stance and having access to it would make it impossible to kill me. Same goes for a bunker Engie or necro.

No, other classes may not have balanced stance but they have more than enough useful utilities and traits. Are the other classes perfect and without there own troubles? no

However, this is the warrior forums and all issues with the class should be made public for proper feedback and suggestions on improvement. Which should be continued to be done until our weapons get improvements(other than greatsword…) and our traits adjusted to allow for more competitive builds. Being forced to be a thief without stealth should not be our only choice for trying to compete.

Finally, 40 seconds might as well be a lifetime in SPvP when you’re a class that cannot mitigate damage properly. You continue to show that you know nothing about guild wars 2 outside of a PvE environment.. Building the “perfect” class is not what most of the “complainers” here are trying to accomplish.

^
You also fail to realize that (Also the fact that you can’t admit that you are low skill) Warriors only need a little tweak. Not an over-buff. A balanced class simply needs small tweaks to be on par with the “broken” ones. Simple as that.

You on the other hand sounds like you want everything to be handed to you on a silver platter.

Schwahrheit.4203:

^
You also fail to realize that (Also the fact that you can’t admit that you are low skill) Warriors only need a little tweak. Not an over-buff. A balanced class simply needs small tweaks to be on par with the “broken” ones. Simple as that.

You on the other hand sounds like you want everything to be handed to you on a silver platter.

What are you talking about? Have you reduced yourself to trolling and throwing out random bullkitten these days?

Akumu.7238:

Schwahrheit.4203:

^
You also fail to realize that (Also the fact that you can’t admit that you are low skill) Warriors only need a little tweak. Not an over-buff. A balanced class simply needs small tweaks to be on par with the “broken” ones. Simple as that.

You on the other hand sounds like you want everything to be handed to you on a silver platter.

What are you talking about? Have you reduced yourself to trolling and throwing out random bullkitten these days?

I took it as he was seconding what you said and adding his comment to it and it was directed at lifelike… but i can see where might take it as directed at you. Perhaps he should clarify.

Akumu.7238:

@Schwar quote:
What are you talking about? Have you reduced yourself to trolling and throwing out random bullkitten these days?

Pretty much.

@OP: Warriors just need a few tweaks to their setup to put them in a good spot. The issue is that it’s a few tweaks across multiple areas:
Trait bonuses: Seriously why do our trait bonuses make no sense? The healing stat should be in the Tactics tree, and perhaps the HP in the toughness tree. The Disc “burst damage” bonus is a complete joke.

A few weapons: Swords. The 2 attack (leap) should have the cripple attached to it and the 3 attack should be either a blind/interrupt/evade attack (imo). The longbow should have it’s range of 1500 BASE. Not something you have to waste a trait on. It’s silly.

Utilities: Healing signet for example desperately needs SOMETHING. Don’t really know what, perhaps a larger heal on use. Perhaps a “cures 1 condition every 10 seconds” function attached. But something. Endure pain needs to last the full 5 seconds.

Weapon traits: The forceful greatsword trait should really just apply to all 2 handed weapons for instance. There should be a similar trait for 1hers. And crackshot should perhaps apply to the longbow as well.

General Bug fixes/ability issues: Such as pathing/attack issues on GS 5. Earthshaker not affecting people clearly well with the aoe circle, etc.

Braxxus.2904:

Akumu.7238:

@Schwar quote:
What are you talking about? Have you reduced yourself to trolling and throwing out random bullkitten these days?

Pretty much.

@OP: Warriors just need a few tweaks to their setup to put them in a good spot. The issue is that it’s a few tweaks across multiple areas:
Trait bonuses: Seriously why do our trait bonuses make no sense? The healing stat should be in the Tactics tree, and perhaps the HP in the toughness tree. The Disc “burst damage” bonus is a complete joke.

A few weapons: Swords. The 2 attack (leap) should have the cripple attached to it and the 3 attack should be either a blind/interrupt/evade attack (imo). The longbow should have it’s range of 1500 BASE. Not something you have to waste a trait on. It’s silly.

Utilities: Healing signet for example desperately needs SOMETHING. Don’t really know what, perhaps a larger heal on use. Perhaps a “cures 1 condition every 10 seconds” function attached. But something. Endure pain needs to last the full 5 seconds.

Weapon traits: The forceful greatsword trait should really just apply to all 2 handed weapons for instance. There should be a similar trait for 1hers. And crackshot should perhaps apply to the longbow as well.

General Bug fixes/ability issues: Such as pathing/attack issues on GS 5. Earthshaker not affecting people clearly well with the aoe circle, etc.

I completely second this.

Pre-emptive – I think I just reached my logging off point tonight after every fight being ‘get the warrior first’ and feeling rather soft.

Right now I can’t say why the warrior doesn’t feel/seem effective… but what I’ve noticed, is if I’m in 2v2, 3v3, 4v4 whatever…. I’m the first target. Running round with an ele and meet a thief? he goes for the warrior first. That shouldn’t be the case… heavy armor class should not be the first target of a thief.

Outside of a greatsword, our escape is terrible compared to others, our survival skills are weaker and in general there’s just little we can do to up that survival… first target to focus is the warrior in almost every fight. Most days I feel like changing to glass cannon out of “I won’t last much longer anyway”.

Considering giving up my hammer for a greatsword (which would suck cos I’ve almost got Juggernaught) due to one ability: Whirlwind Attack. Escape, very high damage, and it’s a lot harder to miss with it than it is with something like 100b (even a combo’ed 100b is easily avoidable… most 100b warriors I take no damage from the 100b, WW does it all). This is the kind of ability we need on our weapons. Although on the GS front I gotta say.. when Rush hits its a flipping truck, using it point blank is insane.

Most of all, I put our effectivity problems down to survival. There’s no flashy bubbles, protection, ride the lightning, teleports or heals on weapons etc. You wait for Endure Pain to end, and then hope. Okay so I can say a general idea of why, but I can’t pinpoint the issues.

I agree with Schwar that we need tweaks, not some sort of mega-buff. How is the question. We lack the damage prevention tools outside of dodging (available to all), endure pain (CD is insane and doesnt stop condi’s) or Shield Stance. This I think is the core issue for it, however it would have to be very careful that such things weren’t available to the glass warriors…. and that’s where another problem occurs, because the glass part is stats not traits. If they for instance gave us protection via a trait, a glass warrior could still pick it up and gain a huge boost (33% is a lot after all) to survival.

I get the feeling that people assume guardians get protection to offset their low hp, but the combination of reduced damage + heals (same for ele) is better than more hp any day. For a frontline (predominently) melee class we have surprisingly little ways to stay there.

Lastly before I stop rambling with things that people will massively disagree on… everyone seems to do different aspects of gameplay which make us have very different viewpoints on what the issue is. The warriors issues in sPvP are completely different to in WvW. Everyone claims that in WvW anything works, but that’s not exactly true, builds are far more varied there due to the different stat mixtures, but you will often find yourself in amongst 20 or so players and you just can’t last there – whilst a guardian or ele can.

As such, that’s why I think the warrior needs more tools to mitigate damage (but the issue is no way to seperate it from glass cannons unless its a trait/ability based on toughness somehow) so it can do its job in WvW, but this may inbalance it in sPvP. A blowout or proper punt asides from stomp would be nice in either though.

Err, yeah. 5:40am, disgruntled probably not my most coherent or well thought out post!

Neandramathal.9536:

Pre-emptive – I think I just reached my logging off point tonight after every fight being ‘get the warrior first’ and feeling rather soft.

lmao that’s exactly my first thought. I usually even put a target above the warriors head so we can quickly put the odds in our favour. Even 1v2 I noticed I can stand a good chance of winning, if one of them is a warrior. I just need to quickly focus down the warrior.

Warrior just doesn’t have the mitigation and self healing capability. This is one class that poison completely dominates. Turning bad healing into utter crap. I noticed other classes are not as hindered, when compared, by that 33% reduction due to having more healing and mitigation overall(condition removal included).

I would love to play my warrior again, but every time I try to it gets more and more frustrating. It feels more like being a suicide bomber than a real warrior.

Though…it is in our description.

“They have a hard time taking enemy boons down, and instead, have to just go through them with raw force. They may have a hard time with enemy conditions, and may need to ask for ally help in order to keep themselves free of hampering conditions.”

Very practical philosophy Anet… Boons and Conditions are very valuable. Warriors have the joy of trying to trudge through both with crappy damage mitigation and healing. Only have good CC if we take out the hammer, since physical utility cds are too high, but then we rely on someone else to do damage. So like everything else whip out the greatsword and hope the guy is a noob or makes enough errors.

Neandramathal.9536:

I agree with Schwar that we need tweaks, not some sort of mega-buff. How is the question. We lack the damage prevention tools outside of dodging (available to all), endure pain (CD is insane and doesnt stop condi’s) or Shield Stance. This I think is the core issue for it, however it would have to be very careful that such things weren’t available to the glass warriors…. and that’s where another problem occurs, because the glass part is stats not traits. If they for instance gave us protection via a trait, a glass warrior could still pick it up and gain a huge boost (33% is a lot after all) to survival.

…….

As such, that’s why I think the warrior needs more tools to mitigate damage (but the issue is no way to seperate it from glass cannons unless its a trait/ability based on toughness somehow) so it can do its job in WvW, but this may inbalance it in sPvP. A blowout or proper punt asides from stomp would be nice in either though.

I’m scratching my head wondering why you think (and go out of your way specifically to pinpoint) that any warrior not traited as a bunker warrior, should not have a fix for a problem that plagues all warrior builds? Do glass warrior builds not die even quicker than bunker warriors? Do glass warriors not already have a significant hp deficit from being glass…compared to bunker warriors? Do glass warriors not already have a huge toughness deficit from being glass…compared to bunker warriors? Both glass and bunker warriors need to be in melee to be at maximum effectiveness…and glass warriors suffer more from the lack of the protection boon than bunker warriors. If anything, glass traited warriors should be the first considered to get the protection buff and put it out of range of the bunker warriors…as they already have superior survivability among warriors. Honestly..that probably why they haven’t given protection to warriors…because the bunker build exists.

Because I can see that 20k 100b’s with protection up would be ridiculous? Our damage in DPS builds is fine and our survival is where it should be for something phrased “Glass” cannon.

As I said, I come from a WvW perspective, and even running with over 3k armor I die the second Endure Pain runs out, unless I have our support ele nearby.

no offense but wvw is pvp for dummies. No one really complains about anything in wvw balance wise (aside from stealth/culling and portal). Any build is viable in wvw cause people there are just plain bad for the most part.

go play some spvp, get to at least rank10 minimum (doesn’t take that long) playing only warrior. Play free tourneys at least also, and watch what happens to a warrior in those fights. You don’t understand until you try it yourself sorry.

What you just said makes no sense. The damage output of one unbalanced ability, tied to one specific weapon, does not somehow make a core flaw of the entire class not exist. I’m sorry you got gibbed by some 100b warrior, but your argument makes no sense if that is what you are basing it on.

The term “glass cannon” is something that has been applied to any warrior spec that is not a bunker spec…specifically because of the problem we have with survivability. It’s ironic that you want to use that as a justification to leave 1/2 of the specs in the profession broken…just because of one ability using one weapon. That just does not follow any kind of logic. If you hate 100b so much…that is a different issue altogether. And no….our survival as a dps warrior is not where it should be….that’s something that is widely known even by the developers themselves.