Guild Wars 2

As a matter of fact, all they got were buffs. I genuinely would like to know.

Warrior

Dual Shot: This skill’s damage has been increased by 10%.
Bull’s Charge: This skill’s range fact now properly reflects the actual range of the skill.
Reviver’s Might: This trait now uses the correct icon.
Stick and Move: This trait now uses the correct icon.
Forceful Shot: This skill is now a projectile combo finisher.
Brutal Shot: This skill is now a projectile combo finisher.
Split Shot: This skill is now a small projectile combo finisher.
Knot Shot: This skill is now a projectile combo finisher.
Repeating Shot: This skill is now a small projectile combo finisher.
Triple Chop: This skill’s responsiveness has been improved.

well playing the war feels pretty good, let’s hope they mean in the future to bring all the other classes on par, i’d be delighted to play so pleasantly on my ele like i do on my war (this is a PVE only opinion, not interested in to PVP and should be kept separated)

Because warriors are okay as-is? In particular, warriors with longbows aren’t really wrecking the meta or anything.

Did they ever fix that 40k sword-throw bug, though?

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

Long story short, Warriors weren’t nerfed because much of the warrior kit that people complain about consists of moves that are easy to react to, and require setups to use.

Kill Shot: Telegraphed and then some. Deadly as can be, but really, the only reliable way to land it is to land an immobilise that lasts 2s+, and start this up the moment it hits. Otherwise, you’re hoping the enemy doesn’t notice the fact you stopped shooting, and crouched down (at least for human/norn)

100b combo: You essentially need to land Bolas/pin down, then land bull charge, then start it up. Against people like Mesmers, you can do all of this, and still fail it because they used an 8s cooldown. Usually needs frenzy too, so the entire combo is literally wasted.

Evis: Nobody really uses axes for some reason, from what I’ve seen, and it’s Axe’s only real gap close regardless of it’s offhand. Given axe needs to be in melee to charge Evis up, the weapon is pretty balanced as is.

Bull Rush: Telegraphed, stunbreaker food, and pretty easy to beat out with a dodge. Pin down or bolas atop it makes it easy to land, but that’s popping 2/3 utilities, or being stuck with a ranged weapon most people consider inferior to rifle for killing power just to land a utility.

Everything else on warrior that people complain about is either balanced or slightly underpowered, but still good.

I heard somewhere that Warriors were always defined as “average” and everything else was balanced around that assumption.

I guess it makes sense given the patch notes.

But then again when I read them they don’t make any sense whatsoever.

Is dual shot even that good of a skill anyway? I don’t think I’ve ever had to worry about fighting a ranged warrior in PvP; they usually need to switch to melee if they want to get serious.

are you serious?

warriors are pretty much completely average. i’d be surprised to see them nerfed.

Shouts warriors were nerfed if that makes you feel better.

Proper glass cannon warrior in pve content is actually not in need of a nerf.
In essence, warrior trait wise and build wise is a duality.
You can build heavily in one direction or heavily in another direction.
An unstoppable wall that has lousy attack power and utility.. or a dps warrior with laughable ability to survive which has to use some degree of dancing skill to stay within melee range of any considerable threat.

Many classes simply do not have this as their traits give them nice things but my ranger plays roughly the same whether I have traits set to one build or another.

Yes, it does good damage. However, other classes have variety and consistency which allow them to set the pace of the fight more effectively (thiefs ability to go invisible and play defensively, guardians heal, etc), while glass cannon warrior has no such ability and can get outright useless in melee in many encounters. You have to know what you can do safely before going into any encounter, whereas my greatsword ranger (yes I said it, it has terrible damage but it is able to simply survive better by having damage mitigation and other things, it is able to have a longevity in battle that outclasses my dps warrior).

Thus, I see no need for it to have a nerf, I’d rather have the builds/trait alignments of other classes balanced alongside it to provide as much min/maxing.

!!!!For clarity, trash mobs do not equal dungeon mobs and other mobs with mechanics such as rooting and high attack power!!!!

Certain builds of warrior have terrific longevity, but nerfing the glass cannon build is unnecessary because we are basically thief without the utility skills, cooldown specs, etc. Think of dps warrior as assassin class. Good on trash mobs, more sketchy on anything above veteran level.

An example:
Even though my build can burst damage entire enemy groups before a guardian can..
The guardian may be less efficient at ruining the trash mob squads, but its health is unlikely to drop to 0 during a boss fight and cause downed skills to come into play. Guardian has longevity here, whereas the same boss will lower the warriors health (with no proper healing mechanics unless you are a shout warrior IE Not glass cannon)
to 0. The warrior was capable of destroying a bunch of trash in seconds because the greatsword allows stacks of might to accumulate on critical.. if you have a high crit chance and you swing at a group of enemies, you will very quickly rack up might. This effectively makes the warriors attack damage increase in accordance to how many targets it has.

This is also why champions with adds are easier for warrior than champions who do not have adds, but still difficult to solo unless using a shout build or other non glass cannon builds. In addition, our downed skill is basically a suicide button unless you trait it. A glass cannon warrior who traits the downed skill can effectively CONSUME the adds to rise from the grave, either by damaging on the ground( not a great idea), or by holding out for vengeance and then using the burst skills to kill the add within 15 seconds to guarantee they stay “alive”. On a guardian, you can pretty much guarantee a win on most builds if you play your cards right. On my ranger, my pet can tank, I can root them, I can use my well which buffs both, bow has range and greatsword has damage mitigation. The fight will take longer.. but it will happen.
The balance is in the utility.. situational.
Glass cannon (healing shoutless) warrior vs. many balanced builds comes down to the same difference as..

Jogging 10 miles or running 1 and getting tired near the end.

DPS warrior is fantastic against trash mobs, but it lacks endurance which other classes have in spades. Even if you trait the downed skill, you can only use nearby mobs to rez yourself a limited number of times before the champion you are fighting runs out of adds and one shots you with a huge swirly attack of doom.

The signet is effectively something that limits endurance in battle but makes certain trash mob encounters easy.

Things will feel easier on many levels if you use burst builds on certain classes, but they are simply more direct in their approach while disallowing pacing.

I hope that gives you insight, I did tables and math and stuff for alot of this but I found out that actual play on a competitive level showed me the positives and negatives of these builds with more accuracy.

I don’t mind being utterly squishy and having a build that loses its breath quickly though… I love using a greatsword and running a glass cannon build. I’d have played thief but no greatsword and really its such a waste of potential to go pure dps on thief considering it has access to SO many awesome defensive capabilities (while retaining good enough burst damage to down opponents) in pvp if you build it properly.

Jasher.6580:

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

because you are looking at things in a vacuum.

a warrior cannot turn invisible to avoid being attacked.
a warrior cannot teleport away when things are going badly.

also your numbers are so inflated its ridiculous.

Exactly, warrior sacrifices utility for dps and a bit of survival.. and on many glass cannon builds the survival does not outweigh the ability to dodge → life leech, → stealth → dodge.. etc. (thief..)

Stat damage mitigation is very poor for fighting endurance in this game. It does not provide longevity, only the ability to be hit in melee range by certain ridiculous champion attacks and be two hitted rather than 1 hitted if you dodge incorrectly. Being able to dodge or completely avoid damage will always be better for any skilled player and especially min/maxer.

I still honestly have difficulty understanding why my ranger greatsword build has better survivability during soloing champions and stuff like this.. but I analyzed it and it came down to damage mitigation and flexibility. My warrior greatsword build puts out the numbers FAST. The problem is, with less defensive traits to protect me, so does that champion. I tried building ranger greatsword to be as min/maxed toward damage but the simple fact is… it wouldn’t be fair if my ranger had the same attack power and armor. The utility skills that provide huge bonuses (pets, healing well)… are built into the class. As a result, the traits don’t allow as much of the game to be changed by the trait build.

When your skills provide stuff such as this, your ability for wiggle room via traits is decreased substantially to balance it. That explains the differences between those builds, at their core.

I have already posted many paragraphs and I have a method of saying very little with alot of words.. so I won’t go any deeper. I’ve analyzed it at the base level, and there is balance in these builds and most imbalance that occurs is a result of the player not optimizing their build for their playstyle. A build can be viable, but if the player does not shift the playstyle as well, it doesn’t work.

Because Engineers with Grenade Kits were the real problem.

Remember when a Warrior or Thief ripped out your spine and played it like a banjo within 1-2 seconds? That apparently was the work of an Engineer with his devil-forged grenades. Somehow.

Yeah go frigging figure.

They were too busy fail nerfing thieves to look at anything else. Oh by the way, they didn’t even nerf the problem with thief burst (mug + steal + C&D + backstab combo). I know, makes no sense but apparently they felt nerfing balanced builds was more appropriate. Dancing dagger down by 50% damage and C&D gets a 33% damage nerf. Lol

Obviously they want burst to be crazy OP in pvp, idk why it’s not even fun or takes any skill. Get punished for rolling anything but a glass cannon build… sigh.

The fact is, if you don’t watch your opponent and bring ways to punish them for using a glass cannon build.. you will lose. Its not imbalance. Its not adjusting playstyle for a different situation.

In my experience, due to the fact that dodging is much better than armor/hp… a glass cannon build is going to be able to gank you only if you let them via not coming prepared. Some builds are just better at beating each other, too…
Theres a certain class in the game with GREAT condition removal.. Traits make it almost impossible to keep a condition on that class, but due to the core mechanic of the class allowing healing as well, it becomes a curb stomp moment..
And theres a certain class in the game that EVERYONE uses condition damage builds with, sacrificing many alternatives. I won’t name them but I am fairly certain its obvious.

Guess which class complains about losing constantly on the forums to the other class?
(neither class is warrior or thief)

Likewise, if you encounter a very defensive build, and you spec for defense but a bit less and still didn’t do very well because they have condition removal and you have no alternative options, you will lose.

Rock paper scissors is balanced because its cyclical. The balance in this game is cyclical.

I’m sorry I have to disagree. Even if it’s situational where someone snuck up on you. Giving a profession the ability to “global” you from full health to zero is unacceptable.

The most well-known reason — this is Guild War(rior)s 2.

TheVirtualFrog.8714:

Why would they nerf the class that the developers play with?

Warriors are climbing in yo game, snatching yo PvP rankings up. They’re tryna dominate the battlefield so ya all need to hide yo Rangers, hide yo Necromancers and hide yo Engineers cuz they ain’t worth a kitten out there.

Exactly, no need to explain it further, this is like the only person who got it right. Expect to see warrior buffs in every patch. Might see like a 5% reduction to an ability they never use just to try and cover up the issue that the dev in charge of balance plays a warrior, and they will continue to be OP until they make a Super Saiyan Jealous

Arena Net have stated repeatedly that they were ‘happy’ with the warrior profession, so if someone could grab the exact quote and post it here, that’d be brilliant. Sadly, most of the ‘fixes’ to other professions have spawned more problems than they’ve solved, particularly for the likes of mesmers who already struggle to do much in PvE thanks to zergs and the way ‘tapping’ enemies for loot works.

Warriors are fine. Bunker guardian and maybe tone down thief burst.

Rangers, ele’s, necros and engi’s needs buffs though.

Garenthal.1480:

Arena Net have stated repeatedly that they were ‘happy’ with the warrior profession, so if someone could grab the exact quote and post it here, that’d be brilliant. Sadly, most of the ‘fixes’ to other professions have spawned more problems than they’ve solved, particularly for the likes of mesmers who already struggle to do much in PvE thanks to zergs and the way ‘tapping’ enemies for loot works.

A-net= " yea we are happy with the warrior profession, but we will keep buffing it till we are ecstatic, every other class should be a a weaker, warrior copy. Also we are renaming the game to World of Guildwarriorcraft with the new gear treadmill we are applying"

Fritz.5026:

Jasher.6580:

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

because you are looking at things in a vacuum.

a warrior cannot turn invisible to avoid being attacked.
a warrior cannot teleport away when things are going badly.

also your numbers are so inflated its ridiculous.

Those are perfectly acurate numbers.

Ravnodaus.5130:

Fritz.5026:

Jasher.6580:

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

because you are looking at things in a vacuum.

a warrior cannot turn invisible to avoid being attacked.
a warrior cannot teleport away when things are going badly.

also your numbers are so inflated its ridiculous.

Those are perfectly acurate numbers.

very accurate numbers, and actually a GS warrior with signet of rage and EP can actually traverse a battlefield faster then a thief (which you were comparing) when they need to remove themselves from a fight.

Warrior: Well I just used 100b and 1 shotted 3 pple, but their friends are coming, ill just pop signet of rage GS whirlwind away then charge and BR if its up and Endure pain (AKA INVUL) if I take any damage.

Thief in the same scenerio: Well I just used PW 3 times and killed maybe 1, hopefully my 1-2 stealth abilities arent on their long cooldowns, but even then stealth doesnt stop channeled abilities, pets, AOE, or random swinging from killing me, hopefully my 1 teleport is of its long cooldown, but hell most of my mobility comes from my weapon abilities, well I just used ALL my initiative in that fight….. kitten /p>

Jasher.6580:

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

Exactly this. Whoever the mentally challenged employee is at Anet is that allowed this class to remain unchanged needs to go work for Bioware. End of disucussion.

They’re specialty is wrecking anything they touch, taking a billion dollar IP and running into the ground.

Am I saying that the lack of Warrior nerf means this game is being run into the ground? No I’m saying the single person that said in their mind “Warriors are ok” needs to move on. Because they’ll continue to allow this trash to happen.

Alternatively, they can give theives a knockdown (in which the other player is now defenseless for 3 seconds and cannot get up, and I can then unload 20K dmg. Most thieves play with 14-15K health.

In case anyone at Anet isn’t aware doing 19K dmg to someone that is rooted with a health pool of 14-15 means they’re extra dead. It’s not an oversight. it was done on purpose.

That right there, is called balance kids. Overpowered as hell, but balanced. Let’s get to it. Chop Chop. F2P means it’s a privilege to have anyone play your game. Not the other way around.

As a mesmer, I can only chuckle bitterly that my iBerserker hitting for 4k was nerfed to hit a mere 2k when warriors dish out up to 5-10k with some of their own attacks.

Glass cannons getting mad about being blown up by other glass cannons and calling out imbalances seems legit. As for iBerserker, that’s a ranged skill you don’t have to put yourself in harms way to use and unless it’s killed it will continue to do damage on its own. Ranged does less damage than melee because it’s safer and easier to use. Not saying whether or not that was necessary but it does indicate proper balance reasoning.

I can’t believe a thief is calling for nerfs, lol. You have perma stealth god mode and the highest dps in game.

My next alt to go to 80 and get retired will probably longbow warrior thanks to these changes. She was pretty kitteny before and I don’t like the other weapon choices except rifle, which would be my offhand but then I’d have to sacrifice my runspeed or carry a darn banner around.

If you think warriors are OP, then roll one. Thats what I did. I still prefer my engineer for underwater and some defensive DEs. I ran yesterdays special events with my warrior. Today I am considering running with my turret build engineer. I don’t PvP but I realize what a can of balance worms that opens. By the way, the 2 classes that give the my warrior the most problems in PvE are thief (Inquest assassin) and engineer (Inquest grenade thrower, especially underwater).

Rukia.4802:

Oh by the way, they didn’t even nerf the problem with thief burst (mug + steal + C&D + backstab combo). I know, makes no sense but apparently they felt nerfing balanced builds was more appropriate. Dancing dagger down by 50% damage and C&D gets a 33% damage nerf. Lol

That’s actually one of their more decently-thought-out changes though, I was impressed. Backstab is designed to do damage, it literally does nothing else, it was the whole combo’s damage that was out of hand. You can nerf that particular combo without gutting one of the thief’s major damage moves, by nerfing the damage of the setup skill (which still provides every bit of utility it did before, I should note).

Can you imagine the outcry if the thief’s biggest burst move got nerfed EVERYWHERE as opposed to a single burst combo getting nerfed?

I’m glad ANET don’t do knee jerk reactions on class balance. Warriors are fine as is. Easy to avoid that cookie spec. I don’t play one.. so not defending my own class here.

Warriors weren’t nerfed because they were too busy nerfing mesmers because lazy noobs in siege towers cba to kill a phantasm. Have a look over at the mesmer forum- it’s like an exodus of that class.

Can’t remember any game in the history of the earth nerfing warriors. it’s something you don’t do. I play one because I know this from 15 years of mmo exp.

The fact that you highlighted dual shot of all things makes me think you’re joking or misplaced a *

Funky.4861:

Warriors weren’t nerfed because they were too busy nerfing mesmers because lazy noobs in siege towers cba to kill a phantasm. Have a look over at the mesmer forum- it’s like an exodus of that class.

While I don’t really think they deserve to be able to cast them through walls, I have to admit, it beggars belief the way people ignore those things. They take a swing or two and then he’s lost a source of DPS – hit them!

@ lamefox- i completely agree abt the phant appearing inside the wall, but they could have just made it spawn beside teh player instead of the target. I might actually roll a warr to see how it plays (generally not my style tho) or maybe a guardy. When i compare the warr’s traitlines to necro, warriors makes a lot of sense- decent numbers, durations, traits in useful, synergistic lines, a bit jelly tbh ^^

I still don’t understand the complaints about Hundred Blades.

A warrior who uses bola or bull rushes you is automatically down a utility just to set up the kill. They then have to pop Frenzy, which is another utility AND they take 50% extra damage over its duration. It is trivially easy to dodge, use a stun break, or pop condition removal upon seeing the setup move and then counter attack. Hell, if they’re just using the bola you can probably kill them while they’re trying to attack you because they’re both a glass cannon AND taking 50% extra damage from all attacks!

I used that combo for three matches before realizing how utterly terrible it is outside of situations where your opponent doesn’t know you’re there.

And I’m sick and tired of people bringing up pistol whip. Pistol whip is a stun-locking ability! That’s what it’s MADE for! If you’re not using it to disable people YOU’RE DOING IT WRONG!

Instead of breaking warrior they should just fix the classes that need it, using warrior as a kind of standard measure. Perhaps that’s what they’re actually doing, little by little.

I know that’s not as much fun as raging about whoever owned you most recently in pvp but c’est la vie.

Jasher.6580:

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

I’d gladly accept a 20% reduction to dmg if they give us the stun that comes with pistol whip. I don’t think you’d like that either though.

Noobs still complaining about being killed by a thief without stealth. The glass cannon warrior is killed 10x easier than a thief. It’s not hard to miss the big goof wailing his greatsword around.

Thanks Lensar, for crushing all possible credibility of this troll.

Also, I’ll accept a nerf to warrior greatsword when they buff half of our other weapons.

Jasher.6580:

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

If you’re getting 19k’d by HB then you either:

1.) Need to L2P as a Mesmer or Thief
2.) Find a better Engi/Ele/Ranger build
3.) HB them back obviously. That’s if you believe you’re the better Warrior and you should be winning. Other than that.. Rifle glass cannon > GS glass cannon in duels.
4.) How the hell do you get hit by HB as a 30/30/10/0/0 Necro with Spectral walk anyways?

Hundred blades gets dodged by the A.I half the time by them simply walking behind me in certain areas. If you can’t dodge it.. you seriously need to use the dodge mechanic or.. WASD a little more. We are rooted in place the entire duration, and can’t turn.

Jasher.6580:

As a matter of fact, all they got were buffs. I genuinely would like to know.

Warrior

Dual Shot: This skill’s damage has been increased by 10%.
Bull’s Charge: This skill’s range fact now properly reflects the actual range of the skill.
Reviver’s Might: This trait now uses the correct icon.
Stick and Move: This trait now uses the correct icon.
Forceful Shot: This skill is now a projectile combo finisher.
Brutal Shot: This skill is now a projectile combo finisher.
Split Shot: This skill is now a small projectile combo finisher.
Knot Shot: This skill is now a projectile combo finisher.
Repeating Shot: This skill is now a small projectile combo finisher.
Triple Chop: This skill’s responsiveness has been improved.

Yeah..cuz how often do you run into a warrior who uses longbow? Maybe 1 in 50 do. most warriors tend to prefer rifle to longbow for their ranged damage.

Jasher.6580:

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

lets forget that a glass cannon warrior has far less ways to avoid attacks and run away than a glass cannon thief.

Let’s forget how a thiefs quickness skill doesn’t increase damage taken by 50%.

let’s forget how S/P thief’s opening moves, either mug or the sword #2, are both instant and impossible to dodge unless you predict it. Compared to bull rush which is incredibly easy to dodge.

Let’s forget how a S/P thief can do his stun quickness combo without needing 2 utility slots.

HB
Roots the player
does high damage

pistol whip
provides an interrupt
roots the player
does medium damage
the player auto-evades while attacking.

So funny seeing all the classes that actually have a viable position in PvP (besides rangers) complaining about the class that is complete garbage in competitive PvP.

Yup, warriors smear noobs into paste in non competitive PvP.

Yup, warriors are pointless in the PvP that matters.

Ya’ll are all funny.

I this issue is coming from a 1 vs 1 point of view and since that’s the case…get more higher defense. However sometimes having high defense isn’t the best case because some burst damage can burst through that easily sometimes. So maybe defense should be reworked so for those who spec for high defense should not have to worry about burst damage?

here is an example of something a thief does that no other class can do:

i do not understand how a class who can do that feels they can legitimately complain about another class. I read posts in this thread such as a warrior can travel the field faster than a thief… i suggest you watch that video and retract your statement.

Jasher.6580:

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

Hundred blades does not root the target. It always needs to be preceded by a stun/disable. This is usually bull’s charge in most GS roaming builds.

Seriously I just don’t know any more, weather i just laugh or cry at people calling for warrior nerfs, especially if they do it based on HB… You should just quit the game if that crap is giving you problems… Any class I play, no more than 1/10 HB attacks on me are successful, and that’s when they really catch me off guard, out of stun breaker skills. A fair trade of, if you ask me… Oh and the damage Jasher mentioned? 19-25?! wtf lol, where did you get those numbers?! Multiplied by 2.5.

Jasher.6580:

I’m sorry I have to disagree. Even if it’s situational where someone snuck up on you. Giving a profession the ability to “global” you from full health to zero is unacceptable.

It really baffles me that people still think HB is op and needs to be nerfed, then I realize that they are bad players who don’t know to dodge, stun, knockdown, knockback, teleport, etc. There are so many ways to not get killed by HB it’s not even funny.