Guild Wars 2

I used to play GW2 a fair amount and did some of my levelling through wvw I was there when all the guilds abandoned Deso last year and left us guildless scrubs to battle through – it was fun if a tad disorganised, no one was EVER turned away. In all honesty I don’t even think Deso would be near the top of the wvw if it wernt for the large numbers PUG’s keeping it going through that time.

So I really disappointed to discover things have changed – a friend staying for the weekend asked if she could try out GW2 before she bought – as I don’t really play now I signed in to a lowish level character she wanted to try whilst I played something else and we chatted – she went to wvw – it was 4 am in the morning with very little action apart from a couple of groups, wanting to heal mainly she tagged along with a group to take down a garrison – she was summarily told by someone from TEQ to ‘stop following our group around with her crap uplevelled character’ she pointed out she was actually just following the action and learning how to heal.

Im sorry but I don’t think Guilds have any right to demand ownership of a game area like wvw – she wasn’t doing any harm and is now saying she is put off the game for the unfriendly attitude.

I don’t blame her, I think its a shame.

"Please show me on this doll where the mean wvw’ers touched your friend."

She’d face the same treatment no matter what server she was on. Up levels are a liability to the players around them. Easy target for easy rallies.

It’s a two way street. You can say that guilds don’t have the right to demand ownership of a game area (which I agree with) but what gives her the right to devalue the gameplay experience of others?

There are many ways to level up your character. I suggest you tell your friend to focus on getting to lvl 80 and getting a good build before venturing into WvW. Not only will WvW be infinitely more fun for her but she’ll also be useful to the players around her.

Up levels were in Deso ALL the time when I was there – she was careful only died twice in a couple of hours so no I don’t really buy the argument that she was a liability – she was healing for the love of god and staying out of trouble – that is not ‘devaluing the game’ for others atall.

Things have changed here a lot if that is the general consensus

All I can say is, “Welcome to MMO’s.” I’ve never observed more hostile, unforgivable communities in any other area of life.

Nonetheless, there are amazing people around if you can find them. I’m not, “Amazing” but if you and your friend want someone else friendly to chill with, hit me up! I certainly won’t go dissing up levels or new players or anything like that. I just like hanging with cool people and having fun.

It’s unfortunate that this happened to your friend, however no matter what game you play there will always be some people who act like that, and its not that its localized to just your server. I love this game and I love most aspects of it, but the unfortunate reality of an mmo is that we play with lots of other people, some of which can act rudely. I for one have leveled 7 of my 8 toons doing mostly wvw because its alot of fun. When there is someone i don’t care to listen (read) to, they go right to my ignore list.
If your friend wants to play this game she should because it can provides alot for no monthly sub fee. Also as for the guild player telling her to go away, your right they can’t stop someone from fallowing them.

Yeah – I was going to say – its not always like this but because its been so long since I played I was unsure if that was the case! I remember the craziness of gearscore in wow when it kicked it…

Thanks for the invite Mighty – if she buys the game I will let her know

The good news is not everybody playing WvW is a complete kitten who think he is the next best thing since slice bread. You simply have to learn who they are and play with them while learning to use your middle fingers for those who can only understand this level of interaction. Don’t let these bad experiences deter you from the game. Anyway, even if the poor imbecile who told you and your friend to not follow them was to shout non-stop at you fact is he can’T do squat about it save wp and hope to be be left alone. These people don’t belong in WvW, they belong in GW1 GvG. They forget that it is a server effort, not a guild only effort. The moment you want to exclude someone on your server you should seriously think about quitting yourself.

You are bang on Sir I really wish though that guild leaders would pull members to the kerb who harass like this – the TEQ group was pretty much the only action last night – a few scrubs hanging back wasn’t going to be a game breaker.

They all forget that Deso was built on PUG scrubs…lol

You have to remember we have had a lot of people come and go on Deso. Nothing stays the same.

Always happy to explain and show the ropes to new players.

Mentality changed, since edge of the mist got out. Many send uplevels there to level up.
But if she was following a guild – and not a pug group – I understand their reaction, and find it’s been mellower than what would happen on my server if an uplevel took to sticking a guild group…

If a guild group of 7 people down a zerg of 45 people, your upleveled friend could rez the entire zerg by getting herself killed. Uplevels do not belong tagging along with guilds, that’s incredibly disrespectful to what they’re trying to do. She was basically griefing them.

Don’t blame Deso for it. It’s same everywhere, uplevels in critical blob vs blob always get criticized and bashed no matter what. Uplevels can be used during karma trains. Since Deso is back in T1 again, it’s always blob vs blob thus fights, they can be liabilities on such situations. Say Deso facing servers from our tier, she can run the upscaled all around off peak hours. Oh and never ever run one alongside a guild group !

It is indeed the same on all servers, but it doesn’t make it any more ok. The “rallybot” excuse to “justify” the exclusion of someone is just pathetic to me. The reality of the matter is, you can’t choose who is in your team like you could in PvP. Live with it or go away yourselves instead of trying to repel all others when you can’t do such a thing anyway.

At least he understand stay in normal www. These upscaled who won’t stay in normal www ruin EotM. Level max level in normal www, buy berserker gear and then come eat some meteors in EotM. PVT lamers can stay normal www too because i like to see big crits.

I pretty much leveled up my alt warrior commanding against Deso. If I can fight and command on upleveled warrior and kill Deso blobs then yea, Deso will find any excuse for their losses. Haha

Deli.1302:

You can say that guilds don’t have the right to demand ownership of a game area (which I agree with) but what gives her the right to devalue the gameplay experience of others?

ArenaNet.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

It is indeed the same on all servers, but it doesn’t make it any more ok. The “rallybot” excuse to “justify” the exclusion of someone is just pathetic to me. The reality of the matter is, you can’t choose who is in your team like you could in PvP. Live with it or go away yourselves instead of trying to repel all others when you can’t do such a thing anyway.

You can choose who’s on your team in sPvP now?! Last time I checked, a majority of the matches where randoms being played.

Anyway, the “reality of the matter” is that anyone that isnt 80 in full exotic (or better) is a serious liability to an organized group. It doesnt matter what server you play on. Upscaling in GW2 is not good enough to allow sub 80 to be played in any kind of competetive manner. Sure you can pug zerg – anyone can pug zerg. Hell you can even roam and hope to face equal upscales (or just very bad players of course). If you want that, go to EB and join the chaos. Borders are often where guilds raid and want to stay organized. Not that having pug zerg too hurt, its just that its always in EB but not always in borders due to coverage.

If you ask a guild group and they say “no, we dont want you following us” then kitten respect that. If you still follow them then YOU are being unfriendly, not them. You are literally trolling them. They do not owe you any kind of “help”. You can cry all you want about the big mean boys not letting you play with them, it wont change the fact that organized raiding happen in this game and they generally dont want pugs following them. With the way the downed system works, the difference between victory and defeat in a 20vs20 slugfest can be a single player going down at the wrong time. The age old quote that a chain is no stronger than the weakest link apply to GW2 as well.

Its not even a WvW thing. If you got 4 Warriors asking for a 5th member in mapchat to run CoF with them and a level 60 Ranger goes “Me me me me I want to learn this Cough thing!!”… uh… no.

Just to clarify – the group consisted of some TEQ and some freelancers/other guilds , at 4 am I don’t think you are likely to JUST have a guild group with all others unwelcome its the graveyard shift- I reffered to it as a TEQ group as that was where the crappy attitude came from rather than some other random….

and fluffball your example would require 45 people all in downed state at the same time which your group of 7 would not be able to take down anyway – with her running to the front to die. At least do me the favour of not making up ridiculous examples to justify telling a healer to kitten off at 4 am…

Ignore the haters. Block them and enjoy the game. Have fun and laugh at those who try to tell you how to play.

She was in EB…..

Rococo.8347:

At least do me the favour of not making up ridiculous examples to justify telling a healer to kitten off at 4 am…

But that would require responding to the ridiculous claim that there are healers in GW2 :/

Hell, maybe the guild just thought oh this upscaled ele want to play with us… but uh, we already got 5 good guild eles which is more than needed for our water fields. So no thanks.

Meh. I’m not on this server, but..It’s sad to see players turned away from the game because of negative attitudes. In my guild when we’re doing WvW together, a lot of the time it is asked that you don’t bring uplevels-unless we are specifically karma training- but if you do not have any 80s, then that’s fine. I mean this is a game, and WvW is for everyone to enjoy. If you just want to try it out, or play with your friends who are in WvW, you should be able to even if you haven’t made it to 80 yet. Maybe you are a bit of a liability, but whatever. You’re almost never going to have a “perfect” zerg anyways, I mean pugs will join you, some players may be new to WvW and not quite sure what they’re doing or have the best builds yet…Whatever.

If you have problems with how someone is playing in WvW, there are more polite and productive ways to tell them how to get better or ask them to run with another group. Being a kitten will only end like this, making players not join your guild, not help your server, or leave the game entirely. There is no reason to be mean-everyone is just here to have fun. And I know my server atleast tends to have number problems, so making people feel unwelcome and not want to help us in WvW is just not good for us. Because an uplevel or a bad player may be a bit of a liability now, but the thing is, that doesn’t last forever. Uplevels DO eventually reach 80 and get good gear, a bad player can be helped and taught how to be better. And when that happens? They go from being a liability to an asset. But if you scare them away? They go from being a future asset to a loss to your server.

Sorry to hear about this, but this does not represent the mindset for the whole of Desolation.Generally we welcome everyone to join no matter the class or level, unless we’re going up against the SFR blob that requires a bit more cohesion and balance of classes.

At night we are the biggest and strongest Server in the EU against most Servers, so I don’t see a problem with her tagging along unless TEQ were running a closed raid.
Whether it’s for PPT or for fights, I don’t think anyone should be excluded from WvW even Rangers or Engineers who have niche roles compared to many others.

Remember it’s still just a game at the of the day, there’s no need to bring Ethics into this.

You can choose who’s on your team in sPvP now?! Last time I checked, a majority of the matches where randoms being played.

I play at least once or twice in tournament mode each week and we choose our 5 team members…

You must not live a good life if you can’t do the same.

Anyway, the “reality of the matter” is that anyone that isnt 80 in full exotic (or better) is a serious liability to an organized group. It doesnt matter what server you play on. Upscaling in GW2 is not good enough to allow sub 80 to be played in any kind of competetive manner. Sure you can pug zerg – anyone can pug zerg. Hell you can even roam and hope to face equal upscales (or just very bad players of course). If you want that, go to EB and join the chaos. Borders are often where guilds raid and want to stay organized. Not that having pug zerg too hurt, its just that its always in EB but not always in borders due to coverage.

Yes, not everybody are equal. It’s to be expected and it is the same reality for all servers. It is part of WvW reality and the game permit it. There is even a mechanic to “adapt” characters below 80. They could have prevent anybody not lvl 80 to participate, yet, they chose the other option. Why do you think? The uplevel is legitimate, you not wanting him in that setting is not.

If you ask a guild group and they say “no, we dont want you following us” then kitten respect that. If you still follow them then YOU are being unfriendly, not them. You are literally trolling them. They do not owe you any kind of “help”. You can cry all you want about the big mean boys not letting you play with them, it wont change the fact that organized raiding happen in this game and they generally dont want pugs following them. With the way the downed system works, the difference between victory and defeat in a 20vs20 slugfest can be a single player going down at the wrong time. The age old quote that a chain is no stronger than the weakest link apply to GW2 as well.

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

Its not even a WvW thing. If you got 4 Warriors asking for a 5th member in mapchat to run CoF with them and a level 60 Ranger goes “Me me me me I want to learn this Cough thing!!”… uh… no.

Well, the party search tool let you the option to be picky, the WvW offers you no such thing. That is about all you have to know… Beside, I’m among those who feel it’s their responsibility to play the role of teacher some times. How often did I accompany a pure PUG group in all 4 paths of Arah just to give them a chance to do it once. You of course don’t have to do such a thing, but don’T assume everybody is a kitten.

Ins.7139:

I pretty much leveled up my alt warrior commanding against Deso. If I can fight and command on upleveled warrior and kill Deso blobs then yea, Deso will find any excuse for their losses. Haha

Mud slinging against your former server already? Class.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

Was it an untagged guild group? If so then yeah…

If you feel someone is negatively impacting your gameplay you absolutely have the right to let them know this and ask them to stop, whether or not it is being done intentionally. It is then that player’s right to decide, with this new information, whether they want to continue to do what they are doing.

It is a player’s right to play as they like. However, it is not a player’s right to be sheltered from being told that their gameplay is negatively impacting those of others.

People are idiots. “Uplevels are a liability”, kitten . Genuine lunacy. They’re a ranged asset, and they’re certainly not going to get to the point where they can get more involved after this sort of toxicity. I do understand an untagged guild group being worried about a sub-60 being targeted and rallying any downed, but as above “they better be kittening polite about it”.

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

I think you have quite a loaded answer here. Nobody forces you to be best buddies and take them in your party. However, yes, they sure as hell can run where they want the same way you also can. The way WvW matches are done are based on servers, not pre-selections. Anyway, just think about it for one whole second. What can you do to prevent someone from following you? You can try to loose them by using wp, but it’s nothing like a guarantee of anything even in the short run. It’s the same reality as when you go to the public swimming pool. You can go there with friends, but you won’t be alone and you can’t say to others what to do as long as they behave within the frame of the context they are. It’s the same for them. Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying. Again, you team is the server, not your guild.

BTW for the one above saying that being tagless or not is relevant, well, it’s not. It doesn’t change a kitten thing about all that I’ve said above.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying.

And now we’re just kittening.

If that swimming pool happen to be the scene of a swimming competition, would you still just go “Cannonball!!!” and jump in?

I dont know what the guild was doing, nor do I care. A raid is a raid and pugging is pugging. The two only mix if the raidleader want them to. You can disagree all you want. There’s trolls in every game. GW2 is no exception.

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying.

And now we’re just kittening.

If that swimming pool happen to be the scene of a swimming competition, would you still just go “Cannonball!!!” and jump in?

I dont know what the guild was doing, nor do I care. A raid is a raid and pugging is pugging. The two only mix if the raidleader want them to.

I think you just don’t want to accept the fact that WvW is a competition that is opened to ALL. This isn’t the Olympic were there was pre-selection by your kitten raidleader. You are at war with 2 other servers, and just like in the army you didn’t chose the huge majority of your fellow soldiers. You fight beside them and you die beside them. Nothing prevent you from being a lot closer to your buddies though. What is this control freak mentality anyway. Go do SPvP if it annoys you so much! You can chose who you want to fight with there. Yeah, I know you are limited to teams of 5 but that still doesn’t make it legitimate to behave like a kitten to others and try to hijack the game.

Linghy.2031:

People are idiots. “Uplevels are a liability”, kitten . Genuine lunacy. They’re a ranged asset, and they’re certainly not going to get to the point where they can get more involved after this sort of toxicity. I do understand an untagged guild group being worried about a sub-60 being targeted and rallying any downed, but as above “they better be kittening polite about it”.

Sadly, quite a few are not polite at all when they “ask”, if we can even call it that. Too often it sounds more like: “go away”.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

I think you have quite a loaded answer here. Nobody forces you to be best buddies and take them in your party. However, yes, they sure as hell can run where they want the same way you also can. The way WvW matches are done are based on servers, not pre-selections. Anyway, just think about it for one whole second. What can you do to prevent someone from following you? You can try to loose them by using wp, but it’s nothing like a guarantee of anything even in the short run. It’s the same reality as when you go to the public swimming pool. You can go there with friends, but you won’t be alone and you can’t say to others what to do as long as they behave within the frame of the context they are. It’s the same for them. Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying. Again, you team is the server, not your guild.

BTW for the one above saying that being tagless or not is relevant, well, it’s not. It doesn’t change a kitten thing about all that I’ve said above.

Imagine you go to a public swimming pool, and someone you don’t know follows right behind you the entire time. Like, 2ft/50cm away, almost on top of you. For over an hour. You don’t know them. They’re just staring at you. Its really quite creepy.

Can you still not ask them to respect your space?

But they have just as much right to be in the swimming pool yeah?

And they’re allowed to go where they want in the swimming pool right?

So why can’t they follow right behind you for hours and hours?

Just because something is “allowed” doesn’t make it socially acceptable.

Or do you think it’s socially acceptable to latch on to people you don’t know, and follow them around, join in their conversations etc? If you went to the pool with your friends, would you be totally fine with some random person inserting themself into your group, and then they refuse to go away when you ask?

Because I don’t find that sort of behaviour acceptable. Illegal? No. Socially unacceptable? Yes.

Ragnar.4257:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

I think you have quite a loaded answer here. Nobody forces you to be best buddies and take them in your party. However, yes, they sure as hell can run where they want the same way you also can. The way WvW matches are done are based on servers, not pre-selections. Anyway, just think about it for one whole second. What can you do to prevent someone from following you? You can try to loose them by using wp, but it’s nothing like a guarantee of anything even in the short run. It’s the same reality as when you go to the public swimming pool. You can go there with friends, but you won’t be alone and you can’t say to others what to do as long as they behave within the frame of the context they are. It’s the same for them. Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying. Again, you team is the server, not your guild.

BTW for the one above saying that being tagless or not is relevant, well, it’s not. It doesn’t change a kitten thing about all that I’ve said above.

Imagine you go to a public swimming pool, and someone you don’t know follows right behind you the entire time. Like, 2ft/50cm away, almost on top of you. For over an hour. You don’t know them. They’re just staring at you. Its really quite creepy.

Can you still not ask them to respect your space?

But they have just as much right to be in the swimming pool yeah?

And they’re allowed to go where they want in the swimming pool right?

So why can’t they follow right behind you for hours and hours?

Just because something is “allowed” doesn’t make it socially acceptable.

The problem is you are ridding the analogy beyond it’s capability to be used in this context. At the public swimming pool you aren’t in the same team, riding toward a common goal and in a hostile environment where numbers = safety. Specially when you are an uplevel might I add.

I totally agree that something allowed is not necessary acceptable. However, I STRONGLY question, based on several past experiences, who is socially unacceptable most of the time. Let’s be honest here. A lot of wannabe “elitist” guilds who are in love with their own hype are less than friendly, polite and/or respectful toward those they perceive as lower then them and think they can do WTF they want specially because it isn’t formally interdicted. So, from my perspective at least, there is a reversal of role here.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Ragnar.4257:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

I think you have quite a loaded answer here. Nobody forces you to be best buddies and take them in your party. However, yes, they sure as hell can run where they want the same way you also can. The way WvW matches are done are based on servers, not pre-selections. Anyway, just think about it for one whole second. What can you do to prevent someone from following you? You can try to loose them by using wp, but it’s nothing like a guarantee of anything even in the short run. It’s the same reality as when you go to the public swimming pool. You can go there with friends, but you won’t be alone and you can’t say to others what to do as long as they behave within the frame of the context they are. It’s the same for them. Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying. Again, you team is the server, not your guild.

BTW for the one above saying that being tagless or not is relevant, well, it’s not. It doesn’t change a kitten thing about all that I’ve said above.

Imagine you go to a public swimming pool, and someone you don’t know follows right behind you the entire time. Like, 2ft/50cm away, almost on top of you. For over an hour. You don’t know them. They’re just staring at you. Its really quite creepy.

Can you still not ask them to respect your space?

But they have just as much right to be in the swimming pool yeah?

And they’re allowed to go where they want in the swimming pool right?

So why can’t they follow right behind you for hours and hours?

Just because something is “allowed” doesn’t make it socially acceptable.

The problem is you are ridding the analogy beyond it’s capability to be used in this context. At the public swimming pool you aren’t in the same team, riding toward a common goal and in a hostile environment where numbers = safety. Specially when you are an uplevel might I add.

I totally agree that something allowed is not necessary acceptable. However, I STRONGLY question, based on several past experiences, who is socially unacceptable most of the time. Let’s be honest here. A lot of wannabe “elitist” guilds who are in love with their own hype are less than friendly, polite and/or respectful toward those they perceive as lower then them and think they can do WTF they want specially because it isn’t formally interdicted. So, from my perspective at least, there is a reversal of role here.

This is where your problem is. You are assuming everyone in WvW has a common goal, a unified target.

This simply isn’t the case. Some want fights, some want PPT, some want karma, some want map-completion, some want socializing, some want roleplay.

If you assume everyone on the map is 100% focused on the score, then what you’re saying makes sense.

But they aren’t.

I think ‘public swimming pool’ is actually a very good comparison for WvW.

Ragnar.4257:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Ragnar.4257:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

I think you have quite a loaded answer here. Nobody forces you to be best buddies and take them in your party. However, yes, they sure as hell can run where they want the same way you also can. The way WvW matches are done are based on servers, not pre-selections. Anyway, just think about it for one whole second. What can you do to prevent someone from following you? You can try to loose them by using wp, but it’s nothing like a guarantee of anything even in the short run. It’s the same reality as when you go to the public swimming pool. You can go there with friends, but you won’t be alone and you can’t say to others what to do as long as they behave within the frame of the context they are. It’s the same for them. Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying. Again, you team is the server, not your guild.

BTW for the one above saying that being tagless or not is relevant, well, it’s not. It doesn’t change a kitten thing about all that I’ve said above.

Imagine you go to a public swimming pool, and someone you don’t know follows right behind you the entire time. Like, 2ft/50cm away, almost on top of you. For over an hour. You don’t know them. They’re just staring at you. Its really quite creepy.

Can you still not ask them to respect your space?

But they have just as much right to be in the swimming pool yeah?

And they’re allowed to go where they want in the swimming pool right?

So why can’t they follow right behind you for hours and hours?

Just because something is “allowed” doesn’t make it socially acceptable.

The problem is you are ridding the analogy beyond it’s capability to be used in this context. At the public swimming pool you aren’t in the same team, riding toward a common goal and in a hostile environment where numbers = safety. Specially when you are an uplevel might I add.

I totally agree that something allowed is not necessary acceptable. However, I STRONGLY question, based on several past experiences, who is socially unacceptable most of the time. Let’s be honest here. A lot of wannabe “elitist” guilds who are in love with their own hype are less than friendly, polite and/or respectful toward those they perceive as lower then them and think they can do WTF they want specially because it isn’t formally interdicted. So, from my perspective at least, there is a reversal of role here.

This is where your problem is. You are assuming everyone in WvW has a common goal, a unified target.

This simply isn’t the case. Some want fights, some want PPT, some want karma, some want map-completion, some want socializing, some want roleplay.

If you assume everyone on the map is 100% focused on the score, then what you’re saying makes sense.

But they aren’t.

I think ‘public swimming pool’ is actually a very good comparison for WvW.

It is not MY problem. The game has included a common goal whether you like it or not. It is built in the game. That you decided to play hockey while ignoring the puck is your choice, but the goal is there nonetheless. I will also add that if you are not playing the puck and the uplevel is, the problem isn’t the uplevel but you. No wonder ANet doesn’t seem to like GvG people… I can well see why by reading a lot of comments.

As for the swimming pool being a good analogy it is. Heck, “I” used/made it. However, like a lot of analogies they have limits that you must respect otherwise it becomes a complete joke.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Ragnar.4257:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Ragnar.4257:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

I think you have quite a loaded answer here. Nobody forces you to be best buddies and take them in your party. However, yes, they sure as hell can run where they want the same way you also can. The way WvW matches are done are based on servers, not pre-selections. Anyway, just think about it for one whole second. What can you do to prevent someone from following you? You can try to loose them by using wp, but it’s nothing like a guarantee of anything even in the short run. It’s the same reality as when you go to the public swimming pool. You can go there with friends, but you won’t be alone and you can’t say to others what to do as long as they behave within the frame of the context they are. It’s the same for them. Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying. Again, you team is the server, not your guild.

BTW for the one above saying that being tagless or not is relevant, well, it’s not. It doesn’t change a kitten thing about all that I’ve said above.

Imagine you go to a public swimming pool, and someone you don’t know follows right behind you the entire time. Like, 2ft/50cm away, almost on top of you. For over an hour. You don’t know them. They’re just staring at you. Its really quite creepy.

Can you still not ask them to respect your space?

But they have just as much right to be in the swimming pool yeah?

And they’re allowed to go where they want in the swimming pool right?

So why can’t they follow right behind you for hours and hours?

Just because something is “allowed” doesn’t make it socially acceptable.

The problem is you are ridding the analogy beyond it’s capability to be used in this context. At the public swimming pool you aren’t in the same team, riding toward a common goal and in a hostile environment where numbers = safety. Specially when you are an uplevel might I add.

I totally agree that something allowed is not necessary acceptable. However, I STRONGLY question, based on several past experiences, who is socially unacceptable most of the time. Let’s be honest here. A lot of wannabe “elitist” guilds who are in love with their own hype are less than friendly, polite and/or respectful toward those they perceive as lower then them and think they can do WTF they want specially because it isn’t formally interdicted. So, from my perspective at least, there is a reversal of role here.

This is where your problem is. You are assuming everyone in WvW has a common goal, a unified target.

This simply isn’t the case. Some want fights, some want PPT, some want karma, some want map-completion, some want socializing, some want roleplay.

If you assume everyone on the map is 100% focused on the score, then what you’re saying makes sense.

But they aren’t.

I think ‘public swimming pool’ is actually a very good comparison for WvW.

It is not MY problem. The game has included a common goal whether you like it or not. It is built in the game. That you decided to play hockey while ignoring the puck is your choice, but the goal is there nonetheless. I will also add that if you are not playing the puck and the uplevel is, the problem isn’t the uplevel but you. No wonder ANet doesn’t seem to like GvG people… I can well see why by reading a lot of comments.

As for the swimming pool being a good analogy it is. Heck, “I” used/made it. However, like a lot of analogies they have limits that you must respect otherwise it becomes a complete joke.

Is that why there are jumping puzzles and crafting stations in WvW? Because there is only 1 goal built into the game?

Is that why the Grub is there?

Are these all accidents?

Oh Ragnar, I’ll give you about 3 or so more posts before you realize what you got sucked into lol.

I never said there was ONE goal only. I said there sure as hell was a common one. That being said, Anet realized the JP puzzle could be a problem and they moved the long one on EBG away. You also can’t stay iddle more than 10 min before being kicked. Crafting and access to storage is a necessary part of a war as it provides the equimement you might need. Only the Grub and the likes remains aberrations that have fallen into a joke almost nobody ever does anyway. I wouldn’t be surprised if they eventually got removed in time.

Let’s be clear here. Nothing prevents anyone from adding more goals on top of the main and common one. However, making do without the common goal is a bad joke. If it’s your goal to do that, go play elsewhere. Enrolling on a hockey team while not wanting to play the puck is despicable.

IF they were running tagged she is free to follow, otherwise I wouldn’t advise anyone who doesn’t know what they’re doing or has a lvl 80 at the very least, no matter if it’s socially acceptable or not.

Anyway many of our Guilds run Open Tagged Raids on here, you are free to tag along and learn, or you could ask any one of our Guilds if you could follow them.

Again though I don’t think many of you guys from other servers are qualified to comment on this unless you take part in a Community that functions in a similar way which is not always going to be the case for every Server, especially Piken which I know little of, but I imagine you have a completely different Philosophy compared to Desolation.

I’ve been on Deso since 2012, yet it’s stayed a highly populated pug Server despite so many Guilds moving in/out.

What about Blobbing?
Many people dislike blobbing, yet you have Servers wanting to move up the rankings to the EU Gold League, as that is where most of the action is whether it’s Guilds or to find fights most of the day.

Rallybots? Blame the system because us the players are given the freedom to see what WvW is all about, we were all once like that remember, now most of us play WvW almost everyday for hours no matter the changes we want Anet to make to it.

CrimsonNeonite.1048:

IF they were running tagged she is free to follow otherwise I wouldn’t advise anyone who doesn’t know what they’re doing or has a lvl 80 at the very least, no matter if it’s socially acceptable or not.

Anyway many of Guilds run Open Tagged Raids on here, you are free to tag along and learn, or you could ask any one of our Guilds if you could follow them.

Plenty of people follow me anywhere just because they feel they can accomplish more than if they are alone. There can be plenty of legitimate reasons why someone decide to follow you tag or no tag. There isn’t always a tag somewhere and even if there is, the fact is it’s their choice and not yours. You have no power over who can follow you other than removing yourself from the server… it’s your choice to do so. Of course, I never ever saw anyone refusing a nicely asked request instead of a quite mean spirited “go away”.

I’m a wee bit surprised that she didn’t find a public tag at 4AM in Deso .. especially if you were on home BL .. usually Art or Jace would be running a public tag (tho either would probably have been less than polite – tho, saying that, only if you tried to party up with them ).

The fact that op is saying she got kicked out from the zerg by being told “stop following our group around with her crap uplevelled character” as opposed to being told politely. This is solely my opinion, but there may be more rude people in wvw and pvp than pve environment. This isn’t about desolation, but wvw in general. I’ve seen a similar case in my server too. What if the developers see this thread (they probably did) and find out they just lost one customer. They’ll probably abandon wvw even more.

Deso is made up of like, 70% pugs, and even some of the guilds on deso are just pugs with the same guild tag. I’m surprised and not surprised at the same time. Considering it was 4am and that’s when deso PVDoors the enemy, having an upleveled really isn’t an issue, considering that’s what the majority of players do when it’s just PVD, it’s good experience. If it was a closed guild raid then that would be something different, but again, it was 4am and it was just morning capping the enemy, having a lowbie doesn’t really make a difference.. =p

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

It is not MY problem. The game has included a common goal whether you like it or not. It is built in the game. That you decided to play hockey while ignoring the puck is your choice, but the goal is there nonetheless. I will also add that if you are not playing the puck and the uplevel is, the problem isn’t the uplevel but you. No wonder ANet doesn’t seem to like GvG people… I can well see why by reading a lot of comments.

As for the swimming pool being a good analogy it is. Heck, “I” used/made it. However, like a lot of analogies they have limits that you must respect otherwise it becomes a complete joke.

Using lvl 80 character serves that common goal a lot more than playing with a lowbie. Just saying.

knkasa.2608:

The fact that op is saying she got kicked out from the zerg by being told “stop following our group around with her crap uplevelled character” as opposed to being told politely. This is solely my opinion, but there may be more rude people in wvw and pvp than pve environment. This isn’t about desolation, but wvw in general. I’ve seen a similar case in my server too. What if the developers see this thread (they probably did) and find out they just lost one customer. They’ll probably abandon wvw even more.

If devs see this thread, maybe they could actually fix the reason why people are told not to play upscales in wvw, the amazing rally system which brings huge numbers of players back to life whenever one person dies.

Using lvl 80 character serves that common goal a lot more than playing with a lowbie. Just saying.

Yes, but what if you are new and you still want to play? The game not only not prohibit that but it actually took that situation in consideration.

Almost everyone who damaged a person who dies gets rallied. Uplvls are easier to kill, often by a huge margin due to lower stats and less access to needed traits. Uplvls feed the enemy group and can lead to your team getting wiped because the enemy kept getting up.

In short, no one likes losing/failing because someone else kittened up and especially not when said kitten up was entirely avoidable.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

I think you just don’t want to accept the fact that WvW is a competition that is opened to ALL. This isn’t the Olympic were there was pre-selection by your kitten raidleader.

Strange, I thought a raid was a preselected party of guild/alliance members.

If only there was some sort of system that allowed anyone to become… lets call it a “leader”… a focus point for random people to form some kind of blob around and join or follow at will instead of just having these closed raids.

But surely such a thing does not exist in GW2?!